kristinannie Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 (edited) There are a couple of problem kids in my son's pre-K class this year. It is a private Christian preschool. They have been a problem all year, but things have really been escalating. One of the kids in the class is being bullied really badly. He was hit in the head earlier this week. My son has been bullied a little (but he is really confident and it doesn't really bother him too much). The one kid was crying in the parking lot and wouldn't go into school even though my son tried to convince him (my son is one of his best friends). When I was dropping off today, I saw one of the bad kids take a toy from my son (violently grabbed the toy). The teacher was watching and didn't do anything. I told the kid to give it back to him and he did. I would have expected a teacher to deal with that. I guess this same kid kicked his blocks over yesterday and the teacher just told him to build his castle again. A little girl in the class yesterday had a kid put a finger to her head and said, "I am going to shoot you in the head. Bang. Now you're dead." I mean...these are 4 and 5 year olds!!!! My son has picked up some REALLY bad behaviours from this class. Honestly, I think that the teachers have just given up on this class due to the bad apples. This week, during art class they have just been playing with toys, during singing they have been watching a movie. I mean, what in the heck am I paying for here? A part of me just wants to yank my son out of there. There are only about 2 months left and the best stuff is coming up (graduation, the spring concert, etc). My daughter also goes there and I was planning on sending her next year because I absolutely love the teacher she will have next year. Sorry to have such a long post. I am just so frustrated right now. This is making me so happy about my decision to homeschool. If they can't even control bullying in a private preschool, how could they possibly handle it in public school? I just don't know why they don't kick these kids out of school. Edited March 11, 2011 by kristinannie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EJCMom Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 I'm so sorry your son is having a bad experience in preschool. From what I have seen, private school isn't really any better than public school in terms of having bad apples and how they're dealt with. It surprised me because being a private school they have more control over who attends. I've just never seen a private school exercise that control for behavior issues. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angela in ohio Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 Would you willingly go into an environment where you were bullied each day? I wouldn't! I would address it firmly with the school, and if it were not very serioously, quickly, and apologetically addressed, I would pull him out and not look back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymonkeybug Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 Well, this just goes to prove a point, children are a product of what/who raises them. I would stay the course for the remainder of the year but make it very clear that this will not be tolerated or you will get your state board involved since I am assuming as a licensed pre-school, they are mandated and otherwise controlled by the state board of ed. It is this school's duty to provide an education for your child, you are paying for it anyway. Sometimes all it takes is a little swift kick in the toosh by a serious parent to get them to realize you mean business. God forbid one of these children being bullied wind up harmed or hurt somehow at the hands of the bully. Should that happen then the pre-school has a lawsuit on their hands and so do the parents of the bully. This type of stuff just boils my britches. When my two were in ps prior to being pulled for hs'ing 3 years ago, I was in the office weekly due to issues with my ds11. He is one of those kids that is a lover not a fighter and prefers to solve matters with words even when he really needs to physically defend himself. He got suspended once for finally physically defending himself and I went ape**** on the school, the principal, and the county board of ed. Needless to say he was allowed back and the bully was suspended instead and my son's record was wiped clean. These bullies are the ones that grow up getting killed by the ones they bullied that take guns into schools to finally resolve their woes because no one ever helped them earlier on. These bullied kids are also the ones who unfortunately feel their last ditch effort is suicide. Sorry, not suggesting any of this will happen in your situation, just got a little passionate. :rant: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kristinannie Posted March 11, 2011 Author Share Posted March 11, 2011 Well, this just goes to prove a point, children are a product of what/who raises them. I would stay the course for the remainder of the year but make it very clear that this will not be tolerated or you will get your state board involved since I am assuming as a licensed pre-school, they are mandated and otherwise controlled by the state board of ed. It is this school's duty to provide an education for your child, you are paying for it anyway. Sometimes all it takes is a little swift kick in the toosh by a serious parent to get them to realize you mean business. God forbid one of these children being bullied wind up harmed or hurt somehow at the hands of the bully. Should that happen then the pre-school has a lawsuit on their hands and so do the parents of the bully. This type of stuff just boils my britches. When my two were in ps prior to being pulled for hs'ing 3 years ago, I was in the office weekly due to issues with my ds11. He is one of those kids that is a lover not a fighter and prefers to solve matters with words even when he really needs to physically defend himself. He got suspended once for finally physically defending himself and I went ape**** on the school, the principal, and the county board of ed. Needless to say he was allowed back and the bully was suspended instead and my son's record was wiped clean. These bullies are the ones that grow up getting killed by the ones they bullied that take guns into schools to finally resolve their woes because no one ever helped them earlier on. These bullied kids are also the ones who unfortunately feel their last ditch effort is suicide. Sorry, not suggesting any of this will happen in your situation, just got a little passionate. :rant: I totally understand your rant. I am just so frustrated with the situation there. His class last year was amazing! The teacher was wonderful and everything went so smoothly. The teacher this year just doesn't enforce anything. She doesn't even enforce the snack rules. Yesterday, their snack was cupcakes and PEPSI. My son was given a juice box when he told the teacher that he wasn't allowed to drink pop (clearly written on his application). I don't want to be one of those mom's that just rushes in there and yanks my kids out, but I just don't think this should be tolerated in school. Thank God I am planning on HSing for the long haul. I just really wanted them to have preschool to meet friends and have fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jewel7123 Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 I just really wanted them to have preschool to meet friends and have fun. Is there a local homeschool group that you could get involved with for the social interaction/fun? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockermom Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 It just gets worse as they get older. My nephew had his clavicle broken Tuesday for trying to stick up for a friend of his who was being bullied. He's in 4th grade. I hate to hear that it's starting in preschool. :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linders Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 When DS was in our church preschool, a little girl (already in Queen Bee mode) somehow convinced all the other girls that to play with her, to sit next to her, was special. You can't imagine the tears and angst as little girls vied to be the "special friend" of the day. Whenever she could, the teacher stepped in to stop it, but sometimes it was so subtle and the Queen B lied so charmingly about it. The mother's response when this was discussed with her (first by the teacher, then the director)? "Well, she can hardly help it if she is popular!" And of course denied that it was a problem and refused to discuss it with her daughter as such. Said mom was rather similar, of course. During dropoff and pickup times, there were only a select few other moms with whom she would talk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flaura Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 It just gets worse as they get older. My nephew had his clavicle broken Tuesday for trying to stick up for a friend of his who was being bullied. He's in 4th grade. I hate to hear that it's starting in preschool. :( :eek: I sympathize. I tried school with my oldest. When they started teaching the kids to hide under their desks with their hands over their heads when one of the students went into a rage I was done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest momk2000 Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 When my dd was in preschool (small Christian ps), she was bullied by 2 boys there. Teachers did nothing about it, so we pulled her out. She is now 10 and we have been HSing ever since. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boscopup Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 I just really wanted them to have preschool to meet friends and have fun. At that age, siblings still make really great playmates. In fact, when I pulled my son out of private school first grade (which thankfully there weren't any bully problems in his class, though he was learning some bad attitude stuff), he hasn't missed his friends at all. He LOVES playing with his brothers at home. They're all 2.5 years apart, and they all have the greatest time playing! In fact, it was after I pulled him out of school that their relationships got so much better. I'd rather my kids have good friends at HOME rather than rely on outside friendships and ditch the sibling friendships, kwim? They'll have their siblings to rely on the rest of their lives. That doesn't mean my kids don't have friends outside of the home (I'm not an extreme shelterer or anything like that), but my son is fine with not seeing outside friends everyday. He still sees kids at church, hockey, and cub scouts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harriet Vane Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 You really only have two options. Pull your son from this toxic environment or raise a big loud stink about it. When I say raise a stink I mean complain to the principle and get other parents to complain as well--really sweetly, but persistently and citing specific incidents and specific policy. Doing nothing and trying to just get through it helps no-one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirty ethel rackham Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 Wow, this is terrible. I can't imagine any benefits of a preschool that would make this treatment worth it. I wouldn't have any hesitation about pulling a child from this environment. I would also have a major discussion with the head of the school because this is unacceptable. I can't believe people would pay money to have their little ones treated like this knowing that the teachers are making absolutely no attempt to deal with the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jec3113 Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 Having taught for several years in a private church preschool, I can tell you why the school doesn't deal with these kids. $$$$$$$$$$$ Budgets are tight and they don't want to rock the boat so the teachers are told to ignore it to keep the parents happy. Let's face it most of the parents who would like to complain never will b/c it's a church, or it's just preschool, or my favorite... this is how they learn to cope in the real world. My advice is to pull your kids, homeschool and be sure to tell the church why. Not just the preschool director but the church. I guarantee you the church has no idea what is going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockermom Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 Having taught for several years in a private church preschool, I can tell you why the school doesn't deal with these kids. $$$$$$$$$$$ Budgets are tight and they don't want to rock the boat so the teachers are told to ignore it to keep the parents happy. Let's face it most of the parents who would like to complain never will b/c it's a church, or it's just preschool, or my favorite... this is how they learn to cope in the real world. My advice is to pull your kids, homeschool and be sure to tell the church why. Not just the preschool director but the church. I guarantee you the church has no idea what is going on. The part I bolded is what most members of my family said before the broken bone. It always infuriated me. I think that attitude is ridiculous. Personally, I don't want my child to grow up thinking that kind of behavior is anywhere near "normal" or "acceptable". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mom2denj Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 Would you willingly go into an environment where you were bullied each day? I wouldn't! I would address it firmly with the school, and if it were not very serioously, quickly, and apologetically addressed, I would pull him out and not look back. :iagree:Totally!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeganW Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 We had a situation with a bully in the 3s at our small church preschool. I knew my kids didn't like this kid, but their verbal skills were very limited at that age and I didn't realize the extent of the problems. One day, I was the guest reader, and the kid tried to push a bookshelf over on another child. A TALL bookshelf. Instinctively, I thrust my hand out to steady the bookshelf, and the kid dropped to a crouch, arms protectively covering his head. (He didn't realize I was reaching for the shelf - he thought I was going to punch him.) That reflex should NOT be the instinct at that age, and it broke my heart. Here I was so angry at this kid for being such a pain, and then that happened. Of course I went straight to the director's office, and explained what had happened. Apparently all the parents were complaining about this kid being a bully, but they didn't want to kick him out until social services had stepped in, and that was taking forever as it was only suspicions as opposed to proof of abuse so it wasn't "high priority". School was the only wholesome, positive, loving place that kid had. The school finally decided to provide more teacher support. There was already a teacher and an assistant in the classroom (12 kids), but they ended up trying to have another adult in the room at all times. Either the director, a parent volunteer, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mert Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 When I worked in a more expensive preschool, the director would remind us that some parents have their children in an expensive school b/c all the cheaper versions can't handle their kid. We were kind of the last resort so to speak. She really encouraged us to work with these families and children. Of course, the parents didn't usually have any answers for us. Either they weren't open to discussing or they had no idea how to help their child (or they would have fixed the problem and stayed in public school). What does the director have to say about all this? Sometimes those in charge truly do not know what's going on. It doesn't sound like the teachers are trying to find an answer so they probably haven't discussed it or asked for help. As far as the $ issue goes, losing the tuition of several unhappy families is worse than losing the tuition of 1 bully. That one goes both ways. Do you think that the family of the bullied child would be willing to speak up or others in the class? Hearing it from several people would probably be more convincing as someone mentioned. I'm so sorry that you and your son are having to deal with this. Especially in these early years, "school experiences" are supposed to help them know that learning and reading are fun, positive activities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holly Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 You mentioned keeping him there to make friends. I've heard (and so far experienced as well) that kids in PS are friends with kids in PS. It makes sense since they are together everyday while they'd only spend time with HSed friends on weekends. My DD has had friends in PS, but they are definitely closer to other PS kids. I try to find opportunities for them to make friends with other HSed kids. We dealt with my then-3yo getting bullied at gymnastics. There was a play area for kids to play in while waiting. I used to let her play somewhat by herself. Then there was a girl that kept pinching her...hard enough to leave marks! I had to watch her like a hawk...she knew exactly when I was watching. One day I turned away for 2 seconds and she pinched DD! I finally confronted her mom (and kept my eyes on both the girl and my DC). It didn't happen again. Of course, this only works if the mom is going to step in...some parents just don't care. :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennynd Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 When My boy was in PreK in a private school. I had same problem. I saw the kid pushing my son and teacher at the playground didn't do anything. I went directly to the teacher and ask her why she didn't do anything. The teacher just ah.. hmmm me. Then I went to talk to my son's teacher and I made a appointment talk to the headmaster. (after 2nd time my son got pushed ) I take bully serious, It is not allowed and it shouldn't take lightly. After talking to the headmaster. I had no more problem. I also told me son that if someone bully him. Talk to the teacher and talk to me. If the kid still won't let go and situation not improved. PUSH BACK really hard. Not I want my son to be a bully, but I want him stand out for himself and I made that Cristal clear to my son's teacher and headmaster that my son WILL fight back if they don't solve the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JenneinCA Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 My older son was being bullied at a church Mom Time Out Program many years ago. Nothing was done because the other little boy was the son of the teacher in a different room. It didn't matter that he bit other kids or pushed them, he got to stay because otherwise the whole program would have to shut down. We left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elinnea Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 She doesn't even enforce the snack rules. Yesterday, their snack was cupcakes and PEPSI. :blink: Whoa, is that the norm? My kids have never been to preschool so I'm out of the loop. From my own preschool days I just remember carrots sticks, cheese and cracker, juice. NEVER pop and cupcakes only for birthdays! Doesn't seem too smart for the teacher to be giving a roomful of kids that much sugar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buram Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 I am so sorry you are in this situation. I know you said you don't want to be one of those complaining parents but it may help to say something to the director or person in charge - not the teacher. I worked in preschool for 18 years and sometimes nothing would be done about a situation until a parent or two voiced thier concern. It could be that the teacher has asked for help and nothing is being done to help her or maybe the teacher is partly the issue. The last place I worked we were so limited by what we could do but if a parent complained, especially about a dangerous situation, more could be done. I hope you find a solution that works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAutumnOak Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 Having taught for several years in a private church preschool, I can tell you why the school doesn't deal with these kids. $$$$$$$$$$$ Budgets are tight and they don't want to rock the boat so the teachers are told to ignore it to keep the parents happy. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mommy4ever Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 I am sorry this is happening :( It actually doesn't get any better. I wouldn't stand for it. I speak from experience. There is something about being bullied. Once bullied, always bullied. I've spoken to adults who were bullied as kids, and it doesn't get better until adulthood, unless they really work on their self esteem. We pulled my 10yo girl from school almost a year ago after she was cornered and fondled by 3 male classmates, lewd comments and threats. She returned to the school for 1/2 day after that, and then I said forget it, and pulled her and her little sister out. She told us about it that day after school. My husband was at the school that morning, and by 11 am I was picking the kids up. She was also being physically attacked by another student, thrown to the ground by her hair, we'd addressed that situation several times. And the teachers did nothing. When the principal accused me of lying to her, I handed her the agenda where I recorded messages to the teacher, and got the responses, and said, try again. They'll never set foot here again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mom2bee Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 I'm so sorry you're even going through this! Your son and his poor victimized friend also. :grouphug: I'm glad that your son is confident and resistant to the pressure. I don't want to encourage violence, but I think I'd have told my son to fight back if someone was harrassing him day to day, so you have admirable restraint and class. (I know that sounds bad, but its true.) Also, I'd have had a few confrences with the teachers and principals by now concerning these children and the non-class times classtimes (the watching a movie instead of singing and such) You are paying for your child to recieve a great education. Not harrassment and aggressive attacks on his person and sense of self. I think I'd have signed my kid up for karate by now :glare: I know, I know thats a horrible thing to say, but I was one of those kids who got beaten up on alot. I mean I'd get bloody nose, crooked teeth and black eyes every few months, I was picked on doubly so every time I went some where alone. Kids made slurs about my gender, race and religion. It didn't effect me in that I felt I really was a black monkey, but it still hurt a lot. I regret not taking action against them more all the time (my siblings always told me to fight back, but I was too timid.) A girl once threw a small brick rock that hit me in the stomach, she laughed and ran off. I have absolutely NO tolerance for bullies. I'd just take it day by day for the moment and talk with the teachers and principals (and parents too!) about those bad apples. Keep a close watch on your son and hope for the best. Don't feel bad if you have to go ahead and pull him, but also explain that in no uncertain terms who is and isn't an acceptable role model. (I don't care if Timmy showed you how to pee on the wall/spit/hit/name call/etc... It isn't something we do in this home. It isn't civilized. So stop it.) Is it possible to pull your son after this year but allow your daughter to attend? Are you planning to homeschool both your DC? A little girl in the class yesterday had a kid put a finger to her head and said, "I am going to shoot you in the head. Bang. Now you're dead." I mean...these are 4 and 5 year olds!!!! My son has picked up some REALLY bad behaviours from this class. Oddly, I think this is pretty common. I think all the 3-5yos I've known (including myself) said something like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalanamak Posted March 12, 2011 Share Posted March 12, 2011 Well, I'm on the other end. When kiddo was late 3 we tried a little preschool time to let Daddy work on the roof. My son was the aggressive one. Since he had been "the medic" in the preschool co-op earlier that year, I was surprised, and pulled him out after the third incident. Something there was not right for him. I'm sure they were glad to see him go. He never did that at the Y classes, and I don't see it on the playground. I felt there was just something too unsupervised or loud or something, and I took his shoving and grabbing to mean he was not ready for that environment. If he was just sad or something, I would have stuck with it, but I didn't want him being mean to other kids. When I asked him why he did it, he said "the kid deserved it". That was not a phrase I had ever used with him, and have not heard since. Perhaps the other kids were just sneakier, or something, but I did not want my son to be mean, so that was that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kristinannie Posted March 12, 2011 Author Share Posted March 12, 2011 I'm so sorry you're even going through this! Your son and his poor victimized friend also. :grouphug: I'm glad that your son is confident and resistant to the pressure. I don't want to encourage violence, but I think I'd have told my son to fight back if someone was harrassing him day to day, so you have admirable restraint and class. (I know that sounds bad, but its true.) Also, I'd have had a few confrences with the teachers and principals by now concerning these children and the non-class times classtimes (the watching a movie instead of singing and such) You are paying for your child to recieve a great education. Not harrassment and aggressive attacks on his person and sense of self. I think I'd have signed my kid up for karate by now :glare: I know, I know thats a horrible thing to say, but I was one of those kids who got beaten up on alot. I mean I'd get bloody nose, crooked teeth and black eyes every few months, I was picked on doubly so every time I went some where alone. Kids made slurs about my gender, race and religion. It didn't effect me in that I felt I really was a black monkey, but it still hurt a lot. I regret not taking action against them more all the time (my siblings always told me to fight back, but I was too timid.) A girl once threw a small brick rock that hit me in the stomach, she laughed and ran off. I have absolutely NO tolerance for bullies. I'd just take it day by day for the moment and talk with the teachers and principals (and parents too!) about those bad apples. Keep a close watch on your son and hope for the best. Don't feel bad if you have to go ahead and pull him, but also explain that in no uncertain terms who is and isn't an acceptable role model. (I don't care if Timmy showed you how to pee on the wall/spit/hit/name call/etc... It isn't something we do in this home. It isn't civilized. So stop it.) Is it possible to pull your son after this year but allow your daughter to attend? Are you planning to homeschool both your DC? Oddly, I think this is pretty common. I think all the 3-5yos I've known (including myself) said something like that. I had to laugh because my son is in karate. He is definitely capable of defending himself, if it comes to that. He actually did hit the kid back once and got sent to the principal of the school, but she didn't tell him he did anything wrong since the other kid had been hitting him all week. I was mostly mad because they didn't tell me that the other kid had been hitting him all week. As far as I know, he has never been hit again. Yes, I am planning on HSing all of my kids. I just wanted them to go to preschool to meet friends. I am not putting my other kids in pre-K...only preschool (3 years old). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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