Does anyone else want to poke their eyes out over copywork with their boy?

[Haiku]

The worst part of our day is copywork. My son is seven and in first grade. I have worked with him ALL YEAR on correct letter formation, but he still gets at least a quarter of the letters wrong. He doesn't leave a space between words unless I remind him every. single. time. He can't focus on what he is doing, so halfway through a word he gets confused and starts copying another word. He can't even consistently write on the correct part of the line. He writes on first-grade paper, and he still tries to start letters on the upper half of the line.

 

I want to poke my eyes out and scream while I am doing copywork with him. I have to prompt or correct every word, and we are on week 23 of WWE 1. Today I could feel my body struggling not to scream or jump up and down in frustration.

 

Gaaaah!

 

Tara

[Poke Salad Annie]

Tara, my little guy had the same problems with copywork at that age. Flash-forward to two years later, and he is doing so much better with letter formation, spacing, and other things. My best advice is to keep it simple at just a sentence at a time. Let him work hard to do his very best at that one sentence. Praise him for his work as he progresses, even if it just for one or two letters which are *perfect* or acceptable. I think little boys need praise for their efforts, and patience to deal with the times they veer from the plan.

[johnandtinagilbert]

Have you tried tracing? Maybe he could trace the copywork once or twice and then do the copy work?

[MelanieM]

It sounds like he's just not ready for this right now. You could keep pushing and eventually it will click, or you could take a break and eventually it will click. Maybe think about what approach will support your sanity? :grouphug:

 

Also, you might just switch things up. You could do copywork somewhere other than on paper. In chalk on the road, with fingers in pie plates full of flour, with finger paint in the bathtub...

 

You could ditch the primary lined paper and let him write on blank sheets and not worry about keeping things straight for now.

[johnandtinagilbert]

nt ooops I replied instead of a new post...sorry Tara.

[MelanieM]

Also, I really like Charlotte Mason's approach to copywork... only as much as the child can do perfectly, even if that's just one letter.

[Guest]

Handwriting Without Tears paper arranges the lines differently; the little letters fit entirely inside the lines, with tails of g's, j's, and y's going beneath them and the long lines of l's, h's, etc. going up beyond them. There is also paper with raised lines you can feel, so that helps in a very tactile way.

 

Another thing to consider: your son might very well outgrow this stage with no problems. Or, like my daughter, his difficulties with copywork may stem from vision problems -- not acuity or focus necessarily, but getting the eyes to work together. If this continues by the time he's eight, I'd suggest an evaluation by a vision therapist or developmental optometrist (not a regular optometrist, as they only check for 20/20 vision).

[maryanne]

When my ds was in K and 1st, I felt like I had to literally drag him every letter of the way through anything that involved making letters/numbers on paper with a pencil. We did a lot of work orally in those grades. We did spelling with plastic magnetic letters. I also second the recommendation for tracing. I had my ds do a lot of tracing in K and 1st instead of copywork. He is now in 4th and still does not like handwriting, but works very independently, gets his school work done, and doesn't whine much if the handwriting practice isn't too long. It does get better with time.

[NoPlaceLikeHome]

Have you tried tracing? Maybe he could trace the copywork once or twice and then do the copy work?

 

:iagree: I would try tracing copywork for quite sometime and ease off on the regular copywork. Have you tried HWT? I am sorry if I am redundant. I think tracing helped my son as well as HWT. I especially liked using the 5 inch by 8 inch chalk board for practice with HWT letter formation:D

 

I also did tracing on a chalkboard with pre-made handwriting lines on it with different colored chalks.

[MerryAtHope]

It sounds like the level of copywork is way above what he's ready for right now. I'd ease up or drop it completely. Have him work on letters, and a few simple words in a list format rather than having to worry about sentences. When letter formation gets easier, then try some phrases and short sentences.

 

When my son was in K, all we did for handwriting was trace 3 of one number and 3 of one letter per day--that was all he was up to. We gradually worked up from there.

 

I have seen copywork that is above a student's level actually be detrimental. It can encourage bad habits, such as relying on letter-by-letter transcription as if spelling is nothing more than a string of meaningless letters, rather than focusing on sounds, chunks of sounds, syllables, and words.

 

Think about copying a language you don't know with letters or characters you are not familiar with--such as Greek or Chinese. Until you really understand how to form those letters or characters and what they mean, copying words is fairly meaningless.

 

It might be worth checking whether he has some vision processing issues as well. Take a look at www.covd and see what you think.

 

Hang in there! Merry :-)

[rdolphingirl]

Sure sound like he is not ready, maybe he is having trouble with motor skills?

Can he color neatly and in the lines?

Can he use scissors well?

If these are an issue also it could be he just needs time and work on developing the control needed. Playing with playdough, coloring, using small pieces like legos to build ... etc

However it sounds like he could use some more practice in letter formation also.

There are a TON of free sheets online you can use for that, and also a lot of inexpensive workbooks available. One thing I have done with my boys who are delayed in motor skills is print off some good formation sheets, stick um in page protectors, and put them in a binder for wipe-off use. My boys love using (washable) markers to do their binders.

My oldest also had some trouble at 7, I tried HWT and while it worked to a point he ended up making letters SOOO tall that I had to quit it.

His handwriting now is very good, and he no longer forms letters so out of proportion.

One thing I have really enjoyed using with him is the handwriting books from Lighthouse Pub. (sold on CurrClick as PDF files)

http://www.currclick.com/index.php?cPath=866_1201

They range from beginning printing all the way up through Highschool level cursive.

 

HTH,

[Halcyon]

Hey Tara:

My son is 7, same age as yours, and there are definitely days when copywork is DRAGGING. We are working on WWE2 right now, and his issue is "holding" the phrase in his head while he is writing it. He is working on cursive, which is slower than print, and by the time he gets down a few words, he's forgotten the rest of the phrase to be copied.

 

For your son, it sounds like he would benefit from more straightforward letter formation practice than copywork. Or you could do copy work of a sort, where he's just 'copying' a word that's in front of him. Sometimes it really helps my son to see the phrase as opposed to simply hearing it. I didn't do WWE1 so I am not familiar with it, but is he looking at the copy work as he writes it, or is he just writing it as you read it?

 

We did HWT for 3 years before beginning WWE2, and I really think it helped, particularly in the confidence area.

[AnneGabe]

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Edited September 6, 2023 by AnneGabe
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[pageta]

My ds is like that. You could say he isn't ready for so much writing but he spends hours with his DoodlePro writing lists and drawing pictures and such. I just have him do it, and I have him decide what letter or word he did best and circle it. When I write out what he is to copy (which I do in front of him right before he copies it) I point out things that I'm doing like space between words, etc. I also have him do copywork immediately before our break - it gives him incentive to get on with it and get it done. But I know how you feel - copywork can be a real drag.

[johnandtinagilbert]

M&M's would work well for spacing....the green ones play leap frog and when they get to the end of the copywork...they get to leap into his mouth! Just thought of that...hope it helps :)

[Haiku]

Thanks, everyone, for all the ideas you've given me. I think maybe I will try using shorter copywork sentences and unlined paper. We use Phonics Pathways for phonics, and the student is supposed to write the words from dictation. We do that on a whiteboard, and my son does that pretty easily.

 

Tara

[scrapbookbuzz]

REMINDER: He's SEVEN. Relax, Mom. He WILL get there. And if he continues to have difficulty at 8.5 or 9, he might be struggling with dysgraphia. My dd has struggled with this. But, regardless, he WILL learn to write. Maybe right now, instead of having him write with pencil/pen, have him 'write' his letters in sand, shaving cream, cornmeal, or something like that. :^)

[m0mmaBuck]

I've actually started using CLE's Penmanship workbook instead of WWE. The first part of the book goes through formation of letters, letter combinations, etc... and the second part has a paragraph to read (about an animal that begins with the letter for the page) and a sentence to copy. He seems to do much better with this than with WWE.

[Ravin]

I actually just gave up on copywork and penmanship with DD for the year. I'm still seeing gradual improvement in what she willingly (when she wants to) writes on the board during phonics. We'll pick up handwriting/copywork again in 2nd grade.

[Osaubi]

I had this problem with my ds 7 earlier in the year. I had him do a couple of HWOT workbooks and he is 100 times better.

 

I bought the paper that goes with it. I print the sentence on the paper with a blank line underneath each one. I make him sit with me while I write, and I stay with him to remind him if he makes a mistake. I only have him write the short sentences.

 

I have noticed that if he uses blank paper he will make letters backwards, but not if it is lined.

[nansk]

I bought the paper that goes with it. I print the sentence on the paper with a blank line underneath each one.

 

Hi,

 

When you say 'print', do you mean that you write the letters by hand? Or do you take a computer printout of the HWoT font onto pre-lined paper?

 

If its the second way, I am interested to know how you align the text in HWoT font with the lines on the paper.

 

TIA

~ Nandini

[nansk]

Hi Tara,

 

FWIW, here is what we do.

 

I have worked with him ALL YEAR on correct letter formation, but he still gets at least a quarter of the letters wrong.

 

I made sandpaper letters and had dd trace over them with her index finger. I also had her practice letter formation on the black board first and then write on paper. I also traced each letter on her left palm with my index finger and then had her write on paper. I also gave verbal clues while she was forming each letter, such as "half circle, go up, come down and stop!".

 

He doesn't leave a space between words unless I remind him every. single. time.

 

You have got good suggestions for this. I have her trace over the model sentence and then re-write the same sentence below on her own.

 

He can't focus on what he is doing, so halfway through a word he gets confused and starts copying another word.

 

Start with really small sentences like "A dog barks." or "Mary runs." etc. Or start with just a single word.

 

He can't even consistently write on the correct part of the line. He writes on first-grade paper, and he still tries to start letters on the upper half of the line.

 

You may use unline paper if you just want to focus on word spacing. We use coloured guidelines (pink and blue). Or you can make the baseline pink and the midline and topline gray.

 

HTH

~ Nandini

[HootyTooty]

Thanks, everyone, for all the ideas you've given me. I think maybe I will try using shorter copywork sentences and unlined paper. We use Phonics Pathways for phonics, and the student is supposed to write the words from dictation. We do that on a whiteboard, and my son does that pretty easily.

 

Tara

Everyone has given you great suggestions. Maybe he can write his copywork on the whiteboard and then when you see progress move him back to paper?

[Tracy]

You can make your own copywork that he can trace at: http://www.worksheetworks.com/english/writing/handwriting.html

 

Tracy

[hsbaby]

Oh yes...I can relate! My son is also seven and copywork (any writing for that matter) is a nightmare. No matter how much we work on proper letter formation he always writes his letters from the bottom up!!! Now, if i'm watching he will do it properly, but the minute he thinks i'm not looking he goes right back to it...ugh! Oh, and forget about spaces. Once again, despite numerous reminders, his copywork always looks like one big word. Oh, and I have to mention how much I just love the enormous size of his letters:001_huh:

[Haiku]

ONo matter how much we work on proper letter formation he always writes his letters from the bottom up!!!

 

YUP!

 

Tara

[EKS]

Yes.

 

Lately, copywork has become something my 8yo son does with his father. From my perspective at least, problem solved.

[ChicoryChick]

Also, I really like Charlotte Mason's approach to copywork... only as much as the child can do perfectly, even if that's just one letter.

 

 

:iagree: I was also thinking about just giving him a word or two to copy.

[Abbeygurl4]

If my son could do copy work with a sword he'd probably do copy work all day! Giving him a pencil and telling him he has to write something is one of the few things that produces tears in my son.

 

My daughter, on the other hand, has a pencil in her hand ALL day long! She loves writing things down.

[pryde55]

How about giving him just one or two or three words on an index card, following up with the next word/words? Pretty soon, he'll copy a sentence or even. Maybe a few little victories along the way will not make the uphill battle seem so uphill.

[Haiku]

Well, the problem seems to have been solved by a very simple change in how we do things. A few weeks ago, I bought the New American Cursive StartWrite program. I started printing off his copywork using the manuscript font on the NAC software.

 

Late last week and this week I started writing out his copywork on first grade paper, like I used to, and I went back to leaving an empty line under every line to be copied instead of having him copy the entire passage under the entire passage (if that makes sense).

 

He's doing fine now.

 

Tara

[Halcyon]

glad you found something that works!!!

 

Can I ask-do you do narration with your son (ie. you read a passage and he writes it down after hearing it?)

[Haiku]

Do you mean dictation? No, we just do copywork.

 

Tara

[Halcyon]

yes, i mean dictation-thanks.

[Embassy]

Well, the problem seems to have been solved by a very simple change in how we do things. A few weeks ago, I bought the New American Cursive StartWrite program. I started printing off his copywork using the manuscript font on the NAC software.

 

Late last week and this week I started writing out his copywork on first grade paper, like I used to, and I went back to leaving an empty line under every line to be copied instead of having him copy the entire passage under the entire passage (if that makes sense).

 

He's doing fine now.

 

Tara

 

Yay! My six year old needs to have me write one line for him to copy. If I get two lines together it is much harder.

[EmeraldGirl]

We actually found that teaching Cursive First has solved the issue of not leaving spaces between words. And yes, the kids can read both manuscript and cursive b/c I use both sets of letters while quizzing on the sounds for them to write. I just explain that we read manuscript but we are going to write in cursive. It is working well for my 3 elementary-aged children. We don't do copywork yet; only original dictated sentences from spelling words in SWR.

 

Hope you find something that works for your child. It took 2 of my sons until they were 7.5 to finally be able to hold and control a pencil.