Had a meeting with dd's dr today

[swellmomma]

This morning I had a meeting with dd's dr at the hospital. He stated that dd was an angel in the program and does not seem to be the same child the multiple reports he got from other sources indicate. He did say if he could have chosen when to admit her it would have been during the school year as many of the reports have to do with her defiance to that. She passed her sleep deprived EEG yesterday. Between today and next Friday they are still going to do the psychoeducational testing and further screening to see if there is mixed learning disabilities that we have not previously known about that could be causing her behaviour in the classroom. He is going to talk to the person in charge of the rehab hospital, he doesn't think they will accept her but he is going to talk to them anyway.

 

He says she is "salvageable" if I keep her away from my oldest son. HE wants 1 of the 2 to go to ps. He says he supports homeschooling but with these 2 he wants them separated. The notion is fine but school starts in 1 week, I let him know 1 week is not enough time to research all teh options, tour schools, get testing done etc and then decided. They will be homeschooling for this year as planned.

 

He does think that she has an opportunity at a fairly normal future without medication if we do therapy for her.

 

Now when it comes to my son things got weird, He is not in the program at this time, however he was when he was 5. This dr, asked me what on the earth the dr's then thought they were doing taking a 5 year old in and then not readmitting him a couple years later. At 5 you can't get a proper eval done. He had requested my son's files from our regular shrink and ped(that is 1 huge file let me tell you), to get a better feel of the family dynamics. After reading his file he said that my son has NO FUTURE, if the shrinks etc we have dealt with keep medicating him only. He is the type that currently fill the jails. It is in his files that I have been asking for therapy etc not just meds since he was 3 and have been told that it is not done at those ages. This dr wants us to bypass the normal process and have ds put straight into the rehab hospital as an inpatient for 6-8 months coming home only on weekends for intensive behaviour modification treatment. That is something I have to talk to our ped about(he is the only consistent med prof. in our lives in regards to the kids). He asked me if ds showed signs of being different from teh time he was a small infant. We knew from the time he was 3 months old something was wrong with him and started testing way back then. It was the first time a dr didn't sweep that under the rug kwim. FOr years I was told that ds and dd were who they were behaviour wise because of environment, bad parenting etc. This dr looked me straight in the eye and said "They are hard wired this way, you did not do this and no one should have blamed you. If they listened 10 years ago to what you were telling them you would not be here now. We should give you a medal of valour for fighting for these kids for so long all by yourself" It took every ounce of strength not to jump up and hug the man for saying that. To have a "professional" tell you that after years of being told the opposite is so up lifting. Of course the news on my son didn't help keep that uplifted spirit for long, but it definitely helepd to realize that he was truely seeing the whole picture not just snippets kwim.

 

Tonight is family night. I did spend some time with her this morning after meeting with the dr, but am looking forward to seeing her again tonight. Hopefully tonight goes better than last week when I brought the boys.

 

So that is the current update. I will be in touch with our ped tomorrow to schedule an appt. I know he has the name of a very good private psychiatrist he has wanted us to see for years, but I could not afford teh $150/hour he charges. However now that we are getting that big lump sum disability payment next month I will have the money to pay for it. Perhaps that person can do behaviour modification with ds rather than institutionalizing him for the year.

[Ottakee]

Sounds like you do have your hands full. Could a lot of dd's issues be due to her brother's behaviors and how that affects the family dynamics (coming in late here and not knowing the whole story)?

 

I am NOT saying this is true in your house but a friend of mine has a son that needed to be in a therapeutic setting for over a year and then another daughter started acting out and told her friends that she did it for the attention as the parents were so focused on the other child. Again, NOT blaming you but they might not be seeing her behaviors at the hospital as it is very different dynamics than at home.

 

While I am very pro homeschooling, the idea of sending one of them to school does have some merit. Even if they had to start 1-2 weeks late or even a month late, it would be OK. A great deal would depend on what options you have available but it is certainly something to consider.

 

I would also be asking this doctor about respite services in your area. In our area, all 3 of mine qualify for various levels. They pay a friend of mine to watch my kids about 4 hours a week. It is WONDERFUL as I can run errands, take a nap, go out with dh, etc. and get a break.

[Rosie_0801]

Wow. Ouch. :grouphug:

 

Can't think of anything more eloquent to say.

 

:grouphug:

Rosie

[Unicorn.]

It sounds like things are finally on the right path. Thanks for updating, and I'm glad you have a doc that will listen to you!

[chpiper]

Wow...:grouphug: to you and your family...

[4kiddies]

:grouphug:----hang in there!

[unsinkable]

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

 

You all are on a hard road, Brandy. You have my prayers!

[Chris in VA]

As a person who's son needed residential treatment (and there were behavior issues involved, as well as sb), I know how scary it can be to hear that recommendation. We didn't listen as first, thinking it rather impossible that he could need that level of service, but now I know they do not go around recommending it unless it's needed (not around here, anyway).

 

Lots and lots of hugs to you. And if I had a medal, you'd get that, too.:grouphug::grouphug:

[chiguirre]

:grouphug:

 

I hope you get everything sorted out. It's so hard to deal with mental health issues in your kids and you've done an excellent job!

[Elizabeth Conley]

This morning I had a meeting with dd's dr at the hospital....

 

...Now when it comes to my son things got weird, He is not in the program at this time, however he was when he was 5. This dr, asked me what on the earth the dr's then thought they were doing taking a 5 year old in and then not readmitting him a couple years later. At 5 you can't get a proper eval done. He had requested my son's files from our regular shrink and ped(that is 1 huge file let me tell you), to get a better feel of the family dynamics. After reading his file he said that my son has NO FUTURE, if the shrinks etc we have dealt with keep medicating him only. He is the type that currently fill the jails. It is in his files that I have been asking for therapy etc not just meds since he was 3 and have been told that it is not done at those ages. This dr wants us to bypass the normal process and have ds put straight into the rehab hospital as an inpatient for 6-8 months coming home only on weekends for intensive behaviour modification treatment. That is something I have to talk to our ped about(he is the only consistent med prof. in our lives in regards to the kids)...

 

...I will be in touch with our ped tomorrow to schedule an appt. I know he has the name of a very good private psychiatrist he has wanted us to see for years, but I could not afford teh $150/hour he charges. However now that we are getting that big lump sum disability payment next month I will have the money to pay for it. Perhaps that person can do behaviour modification with ds rather than institutionalizing him for the year.

 

 

Dear Swellmamma,

 

I am so glad you have a psychiatrist who is willing to do intensive inpatient behavior modification for your son. This is a very, very rare opportunity to change the course of his life, and perhaps his sister's. It is also very, very valuable to have a psychiatrist who understands that you are not the cause of your children's problems. His insight is rare, and another like him will be very hard to come by.

 

You may never get an opportunity like this again. You certainly will not get a chance at intensive behavior modification after after your son reaches the age of 18.

 

Intensive behavior modification therapy simply doesn't work in an outpatient setting. The two are practically mutual exclusives. Please don't let this opportunity slip through your fingers without a lot of careful consideration.

 

My heart goes out to you. I am very, very impressed by your fortitude, and I admire you very much. Few people can persevere in the face of the problems you cope with from day to day. It seems mean to suggest Inpatient Therapy, but right now it is the very best treatment option available. Remember, you will still be able to have him home on weekends.

 

While your son is in inpatient treatment during the week, you can focus your attention on socializing and home schooling your daughter. This could turn out to be a win/win for everyone.

 

I am not an expert in this field, but I have seen what happens when people don't get the treatment they need in childhood. As another poster said, they absolutely don't recommend inpatient treatment unless it's necessary. I'd add to that: they generally don't offer it even when it is necessary. You are so lucky your son is being offered this chance.

[MariannNOVA]

He says she is "salvageable" if I keep her away from my oldest son. HE wants 1 of the 2 to go to ps. He says he supports homeschooling but with these 2 he wants them separated. The notion is fine but school starts in 1 week, I let him know 1 week is not enough time to research all teh options, tour schools, get testing done etc and then decided. They will be homeschooling for this year as planned.

 

I am not trying to be difficult here, but if the doctor has said that he thinks the two children should be separated, and you do say that this doctor seems to have shared insight with you that no one else has, why would you go against his suggestion and do just what he is saying not to do?

 

DH and I went through something somewhat similar with one of my daughters when she was a teen -- when we finally found a doctor who was able to identify what was going on, we followed his protocol. I read your post the night before you were bringing your DD to this facility and you sounded so heartbroken -- please, listen to the doctor regarding these two being separated as far as schooling and figure out a way to do what he is advising you to do.

 

Personally, I have to remind myself many many times that I should not expect to get a different result by doing the same thing I have been doing in the past. I am passing on that advice to you -- your doctor is telling you to do something different than you have done in the past. Please do it.

 

Forgive me if I have spoken out of turn - and please know that what I have written I have written with the utmost in compassion (I have been there) - you have been given a plan that sounds like it has a likelihood for a positive outcome for everyone. Please take steps to follow that plan. Even if it means DD in ps till you get DS squared away and then you bring her home.

 

I think that your doctor has given you a ray of hope, and do-able (not easy, but do-able) suggestions. I pray that you will have continued strength to do what is best for your family. I know that you have been through so much already.

Edited August 20, 2009 by MariannNOVA
typo

[SnowWhite]

I would take this year to concentrate on your ds's psychological/behavioral needs, getting him into the inpatient therapy as soon as possible, and sending him to any school you feel will not send him into a tailspin ASAP.

[swellmomma]

Thanks everyone. To answer a few questions, no my dd's behaviours not the result of ds's, they are her own. SHe has other issues that were previously Dx like ADHD. Yes in the hosp. she has been good, BUT that is because she is queen bee there, everyone bows down to her. In other settings (churhc, school, home, community etc) it is not that way and you see the bad behaviours then. As for schooling. Both kids spent time in ps in the past, separated, the behaviour was worse then. Dd had daily detention, suspensions, 5-6 hours of homework a night(due to not doing anything all day in school other than harrass the teachers and students) etc. I am not prepared to go through that again with her, like I said it has taken us 3 years to get her back on track and mostly doing her school work.

 

As for Ds if we really can bypass the normal procedures for the residential program I will consider it seriously. They are full for the fall so it would be after christmas that he could get in if they accept him. So that is why I was going to call the ped about the private shrink he knew to get him help in the meantim while we see if we can get him in.

 

I am not willing to gamble with my dd's schooling while waiting to hear about his possible placement. If not registered before Sept 30 most school will not take her as they would not get any funding. I will not know until the end of next week what the person from teh rehab hosp school says and the results of her educational testing to know if we are looking at special ed type setting or regular(the dr mentioned special ed might be recommended). That means I can not even begin to research schools until Sept 2 and have only a couple weeks to decide etc. Then hope that it doesn't set us back the 3 years that it has taken us to get to this point. It is not that I am discounting the Dr's suggestion, BUT he has known my dd for 8 days and never met my son. Yes he has incrediable insight, but he also does not know how hard I have worked to repair the damage their former public school experience caused. Neither one is suited for ps. If I was going to send any of my kids it would be my 1st grader, not these 2 who need the constant intervention, supervisiona dn one-on-one teaching. A residential program is a different ball of wax and that option I will consider seriously.

[elfgivas]

Dear Swellmamma,

 

I am so glad you have a psychiatrist who is willing to do intensive inpatient behavior modification for your son. This is a very, very rare opportunity to change the course of his life, and perhaps his sister's.

You may never get an opportunity like this again. You certainly will not get a chance at intensive behavior modification after after your son reaches the age of 18.

 

Intensive behavior modification therapy simply doesn't work in an outpatient setting. The two are practically mutual exclusives. Please don't let this opportunity slip through your fingers without a lot of careful consideration.

 

While your son is in inpatient treatment during the week, you can focus your attention on socializing and home schooling your daughter. This could turn out to be a win/win for everyone.

 

:iagree:

elizabeth said it so well. this way, no one goes to public school this year. your son gets a chance that may be his last best chance. your dd gets a chance to do therapy without having to deal with her brother at the same time.

 

it really could be eight months to a new life for all of you. (not that it will all be over, but its a little like turning a ship; a small course correction now can make a huge difference later on)

 

its a gift. you are such a strong person. i'd take it with both hands, and say thank you. (and then cry myself to sleep at night.... but i can't imagine that you'll get a better chance to get them help like this and like it sounds they need)

 

:grouphug:

ann

[Ottakee]

Sounds like you have a good handle on your kids. Hope you weren't offended by my questions/suggestions. It is hard to know given the info over the forums.

 

You do need to decide what is best for your kids, year by year, and child by child.

 

After homeschooling my girls from K-7th, I am sending 13dd (will be 14 in 4 weeks) to public school this fall. She will be in a full time special ed room with 10 kids, a teacher, 2 aides, and a nursing assistant next door. She will only be going from 9-12 to start. My oldest was in this program and did very well so I am hoping it will be a good fit for her.

 

I am keeping 12dd here at home for this year. It will be good for her to have the 1:1 time and she is the "fall through the cracks" type kid that can't keep up with reg. ed. but doesn't really qualify for enough special ed.

 

Hopefully you can get the best setting for each of your kids.

 

Can the hospital start putting more pressure on your dd, increase their expectations, etc? You really want them to see what goes on day to day.

[momofkhm]

This dr looked me straight in the eye and said "They are hard wired this way, you did not do this and no one should have blamed you. If they listened 10 years ago to what you were telling them you would not be here now. We should give you a medal of valour for fighting for these kids for so long all by yourself"

 

I think I love this doctor for you! Wow what an encouragement to hear from a professional! I hope this all works out for you and your kids. It sounds like this doc is going to bat for you guys!

[Elizabeth Conley]

As for Ds if we really can bypass the normal procedures for the residential program I will consider it seriously. They are full for the fall so it would be after christmas that he could get in if they accept him. So that is why I was going to call the ped about the private shrink he knew to get him help in the meantim while we see if we can get him in.

 

 

 

Understood. Thanks for the deeper insight. I guess it all goes back to "nothing's easy".

 

Maybe putting the first grader in school is a good option. Only you know that.

 

I have two unusually compliant, mild-mannered kids. (Please don't hate me!) Nonetheless, I don't let them do their more tedious lessons in the same room. They do so love to drive each other bat-stuff-bonzo, taking me with them in the process! (Apparently driving a sibling berserk is one of life's purest joys. Go figure!) I can't afford to put them in public school either. They get ignored in school, and they really do need personal attention in order to thrive academically. It's taken quite a bit of remediation to correct the deficiencies they brought home with them from their years of public school.

 

Putting a kid in public school is a very hard decision. You've got a lot of options to weigh. Choosing the lesser of many evils is frightening. You must have nerves of steel.