Your thoughts on make-up work - 3rd grade.

[SKL]

I would like your ideas on how to address an issue with make-up work after an illness.

 

Last week my kids caught a virus that was going around at school.  Miss E missed 3.5 days and Miss A missed 2 days.  They both went back to school yesterday (Monday) and came home with a pile of make-up work.  Today (Tuesday) they were told that they only have until tomorrow morning (Wednesday) to turn it all in.  The teacher says the school rule is that they get 1 make-up day for each sick day.  I checked the student handbook, and it states that the time for making up work is determined on a case by case basis by the teacher/student.

 

Monday night, my kids had to complete their regular math homework and study for 2 tests (including science, which took Miss A a long time.)  They made only a small dent in their make-up work, because I felt the test study was more important.  (I also thought the normal rule was 2 make-up days for each sick day.)

 

Tonight (Tuesday), they had 4 pages of challenging math homework.  Because they had play practice after school, they went to aftercare, where they got stumped on the homework and left most of it for later.  Miss A worked on it for 2 hours before & after dinner.  Miss E was tired as she is still recovering from her illness, so I let her go to bed at 9:30 after she finished her math.  Tomorrow morning I will wake the girls up at 6am to work on a writing assignment which is apparently time-sensitive.  But they will still not be done with all of their make-up work.

 

I also just discovered that part of the make-up work requires a book that we don't have at home.  :/

 

So ... am I irresponsible to think my kids should have more than 2 school nights to catch up?  If you were I, would you send the teacher an email negotiating for a couple more days?  Do you think I have a legitimate beef if she docks my kids' grades for not being done tomorrow morning?

 

FTR I had them study / practice for hours on the weekend - especially math - whatever we could do without having their assignments or most of their textbooks.  I should also note that Miss A brought Miss E's work home last Wednesday, which she completed, so both girls were only 2 days behind as of Monday morning.

 

Another thing - in the interest of full disclosure - my kids did their normal sports activities Monday and Tuesday.  They told the teacher this.  She could be thinking we should not have done that with all the make-up work they have to do, but I think it was right to do the exercise.  Besides, I was working late Monday and didn't have the ability to sit with them all afternoon in any case.

[Acorn]

Our school is one day per absence day. We are encouraged to pick up their work or have a neighbor drop it off if the absence will be more than a day.

[OneStepAtATime]

Sadly, while I think that is a pathetic situation and unhealthy in every respect both mentally and physically, our school also encouraged people to come by after school and pick up material on  a daily basis and only allowed one make up day for each day absent.  Obviously not everyone can go out with sick kids to pick up make-up work or have someone else who can do it.  Doesn't matter in the long run.

 

Personally?  I would at least try to get an extension.  Explain the circumstances and ask for a little extra time.  See if she will work with you.  If not, at least you tried, KWIM?

[SKL]

Seems kind of crazy to expect kids to make up the work from a 6 hour school day in one evening, after doing that day's regular homework.  I am surprised this is the norm.

 

As a single working mom with puking kids, driving to pick up the work would have been difficult.  But, had I known the "one day" rule before 6pm today, I might have done things differently.

[Tsuga]

Our school e-mails the homework when you're sick. Most people have printers or can go to the library, or worst case scenario, just write the answers on plain lined paper.

 

As for make-up homework in 3rd grade, it doesn't matter that much. Only projects are made up. Grades are given qualitatively, more or less.

 

Like at work, if there's a deadline and you're puking, others help make it up for you.

 

Our school was somewhere in the top ten in the state (diversity included, though diversity score was low, test scores were high) so I guess the fact that they don't treat the students like crap isn't hurting their performance any.

[regentrude]

I would contact the teacher and let her know that my kids were not able to complete the work and that it will be turned in when they are finished. Period. I would not ask for permission, just tell her that it's not going to happen.

If she decides to give a bad grade, I would explain to my kids that this is a stupid policy and leave it at that. I would certainly not pile work on recovering 3rd graders just because of  grades.

I mean, what can the school do if they don't turn it in?

 

ETA: the timeline does not make sense. If one kid was sick for 3+ days, expecting her to turn in work Wed does not even meet their own rules.

Oh, and another ETA: 2 hours of math homework in 3rd grade is ridiculous. I would not have made my kid finish that, but would have stopped her after 45 minutes and sent a note to the teacher that the student was unable to complete the homework in a reasonable time without my help. There is absolutely no way I would tolerate this much homework in elementary school. It is inappropriate for the age.

[Gil]

I would like your ideas on how to address an issue with make-up work after an illness.

 

Last week my kids caught a virus that was going around at school.  Miss E missed 3.5 days and Miss A missed 2 days.  They both went back to school yesterday (Monday) and came home with a pile of make-up work.  Today (Tuesday) they were told that they only have until tomorrow morning (Wednesday) to turn it all in.  The teacher says the school rule is that they get 1 make-up day for each sick day.  I checked the student handbook, and it states that the time for making up work is determined on a case by case basis by the teacher/student.

 

Monday night, my kids had to complete their regular math homework and study for 2 tests (including science, which took Miss A a long time.)  They made only a small dent in their make-up work, because I felt the test study was more important.  (I also thought the normal rule was 2 make-up days for each sick day.)

 

Tonight (Tuesday), they had 4 pages of challenging math homework.  Because they had play practice after school, they went to aftercare, where they got stumped on the homework and left most of it for later.  Miss A worked on it for 2 hours before & after dinner.  Miss E was tired as she is still recovering from her illness, so I let her go to bed at 9:30 after she finished her math.  Tomorrow morning I will wake the girls up at 6am to work on a writing assignment which is apparently time-sensitive.  But they will still not be done with all of their make-up work.

 

I also just discovered that part of the make-up work requires a book that we don't have at home.  :/

 

So ... am I irresponsible to think my kids should have more than 2 school nights to catch up?  If you were I, would you send the teacher an email negotiating for a couple more days?  Do you think I have a legitimate beef if she docks my kids' grades for not being done tomorrow morning?

 

FTR I had them study / practice for hours on the weekend - especially math - whatever we could do without having their assignments or most of their textbooks.  I should also note that Miss A brought Miss E's work home last Wednesday, which she completed, so both girls were only 2 days behind as of Monday morning.

 

Another thing - in the interest of full disclosure - my kids did their normal sports activities Monday and Tuesday.  They told the teacher this.  She could be thinking we should not have done that with all the make-up work they have to do, but I think it was right to do the exercise.  Besides, I was working late Monday and didn't have the ability to sit with them all afternoon in any case.

I fell asleep while reading the OP so it seems appropriate to reply now. but my general feeling is one of eye-rolling sneer or "scorn"

because. In my neck of the woods, we use the term "foolishness and fu--ery" to describe this type of situation. OP, do not take this homework and late work drama to heart. Whatever.

1st) There is clearly something wrong with the home work load if your 3rd grader has 2+ hours of one subject after missing just a few days.

2nd) This is elementary school. The school doesn't have the authority or reach or impact to do anything to the kids future placement in school at the grades that matter. Keep that in mind. I would NOT be piling work on to my kids plates, I would not make them skip playtime, sports of drama club because of worksheets.

3rd) I would e-mail the teacher and let her know that the kids will turn in the work when it is completed. I wouldn't ask for her blessing, permission, opinion or anything else. I would just inform her, as one mature adult to another, of what was going to happen in this relatively unimportant situation. You are the parent, you have the final say in how your kids will spend their time and energy.

4th) I'm not sure that the time line makes sense...If you're sick for 3 days, then you have 3days to make up the work, don't you?

5th) IF my kids grades were docked for this foolishness, I'd use it as a teachable moment about hills to die on and bureaucracy and how sometimes thoughtless people make stupid policies that are able to reach non-stupid people and sometimes make their lives a little uncomfortable, but we just brush it off and keep going because this is not a hill to die on and their lives are NOT determined by the HomeWork Grade they get in the 3rd grade.

 

[Library Momma]

I think the bottom line is that this is a private parochial school.  They can do what ever they want and you're paying for that privilege.  My real concern would be the 2 hours of math homework.  I would first want to determine if it is just my child spending that amount of time on the homework or most students in the class are.

[OneStepAtATime]

Honestly the whole situation sounds terribly developmentally inappropriate, unhealthy and frankly short sighted. But not unexpected, sadly, since our school had similar rules. Good luck SKL.

[SKL]

I am a wimp.  I asked for and got grace for one more day.

 

Honestly, I would rather get it done ASAP so we can get back to normal.  We may have to skip swim team today, but I think we can get done and put it behind us.

 

Then Thursday we can focus on studying for the Friday math test.  ;)

[Gil]

I am a wimp.  I asked for and got grace for one more day.

 

Honestly, I would rather get it done ASAP so we can get back to normal.  We may have to skip swim team today, but I think we can get done and put it behind us.

 

Then Thursday we can focus on studying for the Friday math test.  ;)

So long as YOU do not feel jaded/bitter/remorse/upset about the situation, then don't let us sway you toward those feelings. I'm glad that you got the extra time that you felt you needed and good luck on getting it all done.

[Nart]

This is something that does not happen in most public schools, at least the ones that I have worked at in California. When my second grader was sick this year and missed three days in a row he wasn't given any make up work. He also didn't turn in homework that week.

Is there anyway you can get ahead of the game this summer. Does your kids' school use Math in Focus: Singapore Approach? I would order the books for fourth grade and have them study it over the summer. It is readily available on Rainbow Resource-textbook, practice book, extra practice, enrichment book, teacher's guide. Is the homework from the Extra Practice book? If they could at least get a bit ahead in math then maybe you all wouldn't have to stress out if you have to work late or they get sick. 

[Tsuga]

I would contact the teacher and let her know that my kids were not able to complete the work and that it will be turned in when they are finished. Period. I would not ask for permission, just tell her that it's not going to happen.

If she decides to give a bad grade, I would explain to my kids that this is a stupid policy and leave it at that. I would certainly not pile work on recovering 3rd graders just because of  grades.

I mean, what can the school do if they don't turn it in?

 

ETA: the timeline does not make sense. If one kid was sick for 3+ days, expecting her to turn in work Wed does not even meet their own rules.

Oh, and another ETA: 2 hours of math homework in 3rd grade is ridiculous. I would not have made my kid finish that, but would have stopped her after 45 minutes and sent a note to the teacher that the student was unable to complete the homework in a reasonable time without my help. There is absolutely no way I would tolerate this much homework in elementary school. It is inappropriate for the age.

 

If you read all of her posts, you will see that this school has what sound like insane requirements. It's a private school.

[SKL]

Got all the work done tonight, whew!  Today alone, before and after school, they did 10 pages of challenging math, wrote and rewrote a letter to their Flat Stanley helpers, did about 10 worksheets for social studies & language arts, and read a chapter book.  I am glad we are caught up.  Thursday will be for studying for their math test, mainly.  That can easily take all evening.  :P

 

And tomorrow is the state reading assessment.  Yes, my kids are sleep deprived but I am determined not to worry about that.

 

I don't think my kids will ever want to take another day off school.  :P

 

Oh, regarding Tuesday's 2-hour math homework, I was wondering whether it was only my kid who found it challenging.  Today the teacher told the class that she'd heard some of the kids had been crying over the math homework last night.  So I guess it was really hard stuff.  I know I didn't do that level of math in 3rd grade.

[regentrude]

If you read all of her posts, you will see that this school has what sound like insane requirements. It's a private school.

 

I have followed her posts and am aware of that.

I still would not make my 3rd grader do 2 hours of math homework or make them scramble to do the makeup work.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Seems unreasonable, but at least now that's behind you!

[Caroline]

I have followed her posts and am aware of that.

I still would not make my 3rd grader do 2 hours of math homework or make them scramble to do the makeup work.

 

Me, too. Nor would I expect it of the high school seniors I teach.

[vonfirmath]

This is something that does not happen in most public schools, at least the ones that I have worked at in California. When my second grader was sick this year and missed three days in a row he wasn't given any make up work. He also didn't turn in homework that week.

Is there anyway you can get ahead of the game this summer. Does your kids' school use Math in Focus: Singapore Approach? I would order the books for fourth grade and have them study it over the summer. It is readily available on Rainbow Resource-textbook, practice book, extra practice, enrichment book, teacher's guide. Is the homework from the Extra Practice book? If they could at least get a bit ahead in math then maybe you all wouldn't have to stress out if you have to work late or they get sick. 

 

Agreed. The few days my son has been sick, I've tried to get make up work and there isn't any. Even missing a test once, he was not required to make it up.  The teacher knew he was a good student and just averaged his grades without that test and went on.

[mathnerd]

I have followed her posts and am aware of that.

I still would not make my 3rd grader do 2 hours of math homework or make them scramble to do the makeup work.

I agree with regentrude. My child is in an extremely "rigorous" private school with insane work requirement (ours possibly takes "rigor" to the extreme). When homework is picked up for missed days, it has to be returned on the Friday of the week that the child goes back to school even if the child returned on the Wednesday of that week. This is in addition to the daily workload (tests, reports, homework etc). I have a 45 minute rule in our house - if my son does not finish his math under 45 minutes, I just do it for him (makeup and regular math) - because he is a very good student, he is ahead in math and the homework does not make or break his math achievement levels. 

 

2-3 hours of any subject after school is impossible for most 3rd graders. Mine is a 2nd grader and he has worked 2-3 hours after school on a single subject exactly twice in his life - once when he was going to a music audition at his music school and he had to polish up a lot of his techniques on the night before and once when he had goofed off and did not write his book report that was due the next day. After the first 25 minutes, getting more work done on the same topic at 6 pm after a full day of school and PE is like pulling teeth.

[mom2bee]

SKL, I'm curious. What is exactly is this challenging math work? Can you please share an example of the problems that the kids were doing?

[OneStepAtATime]

JMHO, but this is too much work for a child.  This is unhealthy.  The school's expectations are developmentally inappropriate.  

[FairProspects]

JMHO, but this is too much work for a child.  This is unhealthy.  The school's expectations are developmentally inappropriate.  

 

This. It is 3rd grade, for crying out loud. I went through a school system where a significant percentage went Ivy League or attended other top tier schools. We never had any homework other than reading prior to 6th grade (and even then we only had occasional book reports, a few projects, and some pre-algebra worksheets). It is just not necessary or healthy to pile on the homework at these ages. There is virtually no long term benefit and there are huge potential detriments.

[OneStepAtATime]

This. It is 3rd grade, for crying out loud. I went through a school system where a significant percentage went Ivy League or attended other top tier schools. We never had any homework other than reading prior to 6th grade (and even then we only had occasional book reports, a few projects, and some pre-algebra worksheets). It is just not necessary or healthy to pile on the homework at these ages. There is virtually no long term benefit and there are huge potential detriments.

Including the potential for severe academic burn out by High School or sooner, along with stress related health issues.

[SKL]

Agreed. The few days my son has been sick, I've tried to get make up work and there isn't any. Even missing a test once, he was not required to make it up.  The teacher knew he was a good student and just averaged his grades without that test and went on.

 

Wow!  My kids would just get zeros on all the work for those days.

 

Last time they missed school, there was a math test, and it took my kid several days to finish it at school, doing a little here and there during breaks / missed recess.  The teacher complained to me about how long it was taking her to finish it.

[SKL]

I agree with regentrude. My child is in an extremely "rigorous" private school with insane work requirement (ours possibly takes "rigor" to the extreme). When homework is picked up for missed days, it has to be returned on the Friday of the week that the child goes back to school even if the child returned on the Wednesday of that week. This is in addition to the daily workload (tests, reports, homework etc). I have a 45 minute rule in our house - if my son does not finish his math under 45 minutes, I just do it for him (makeup and regular math) - because he is a very good student, he is ahead in math and the homework does not make or break his math achievement levels. 

 

2-3 hours of any subject after school is impossible for most 3rd graders. Mine is a 2nd grader and he has worked 2-3 hours after school on a single subject exactly twice in his life - once when he was going to a music audition at his music school and he had to polish up a lot of his techniques on the night before and once when he had goofed off and did not write his book report that was due the next day. After the first 25 minutes, getting more work done on the same topic at 6 pm after a full day of school and PE is like pulling teeth.

 

It is definitely luck that my slower kid is a real work-horse.  Otherwise she might not survive in this school.

 

[SKL]

SKL, I'm curious. What is exactly is this challenging math work? Can you please share an example of the problems that the kids were doing?

 

I don't have the worksheets here now, but this is the type of problem.  They are supposed to draw bar models as well as solve the problems.

 

• A table and four chairs cost $495 dollars.  If the table cost $298, how much did each of the chairs cost?

• Molly has 128 marbles.  June has four times as many marbles as Molly.  Sarah has 296 fewer marbles than June.  How many marbles does Sarah have?

• A bat costs 7x as much as a glove.  If a bat costs $175, how much do 4 gloves cost?

 

Each page of the math worksheets has two of these problems on them.  So 10 pages of worksheets means 20 of the above type of problem.

 

This is 3rd grade.  So for my kid, who is no longer terrible at math but not brilliant either, this takes a long time.  She can do it, but she takes time to decide how to structure each problem.

[vonfirmath]

Wow!  My kids would just get zeros on all the work for those days.

 

Last time they missed school, there was a math test, and it took my kid several days to finish it at school, doing a little here and there during breaks / missed recess.  The teacher complained to me about how long it was taking her to finish it.

 

I'm a little amazed they allowed your child to work on a test over multiple days!

[SKL]

I'm a little amazed they allowed your child to work on a test over multiple days!

 

Yeah, when I was a kid it wasn't done that way.  They let us miss something else and just sit and take the test.

 

Not that there is any danger of my kid cheating on a math test like that.  (They didn't let her hold onto the test.)

 

[Tsuga]

I have followed her posts and am aware of that.

I still would not make my 3rd grader do 2 hours of math homework or make them scramble to do the makeup work.

I was explaining, not in any way trying to suggest that this was okay.

 

I agree with you.

 

SKL are your kids on academic scholarship that they aren't allowed zeros?

 

Our kids don't even get grades until 6th. Do it or don't.

[SKL]

No, they aren't on scholarship, they just don't want to get poor grades.

 

Plus, when it comes to the math, they need to keep up with the practice or it will just keep getting harder.

 

We are very glad tomorrow is Friday.  :)

[kiwik]

when my kids miss school they miss everything on those days. ds8 got to to sit his test for the extension class on another day but I don't think they would bother otherwise. Tests are only to assess learning and any decent teacher should have a pretty good idea of where the student is. We don't do actual grades anyway.

 

If the teacher is sick they get a substitute. I have never heard of the teacher having to do an extra 6 hours teaching to make up the time.

[Bluegoat]

I wouldn't have my kids do the work.  If there was some overwhelming reason I needed to kiss the butt of the school, I might cheat and do it for them.  That is probably evil but I just can't picture submitting to that for anything other than utilitarian reasons.

 

Also - I would not put up with math class at home.  If I am paying a school to teach my kids math it should happen in school.

 

Those that mentioned they send work home daily - I find the idea of sending work home to sick kids really weird.  If they are well enough to work they would normally be in school, wouldn't they?

[Tsuga]

 

 

Also - I would not put up with math class at home.  If I am paying a school to teach my kids math it should happen in school.

 

Even in public school, they explicitly and repeatedly told us, "Homework should be able to be done by the child. We already taught the material. Never do it for them or help them. If they can't do it, we didn't meet their needs in school and we will work on a different plan with your child."

[SKL]

I don't mind working with my kid on math at home.  I started doing that in 1st grade when it became clear that she wasn't going to learn in school, because the teacher refused to help her.  At that point I just decided we are going to do this pretty much every day as long as we need to.  Now in 3rd grade we don't do a lot of math together, because she is doing a good job of keeping up, but I am happy to help as needed.

 

They give her some help at school, but I don't want her to always be the kid who struggles.

 

I think the math they were doing a couple weeks ago was just poorly designed for the level the kids were at.  It isn't the first time I've felt that way about Singapore / Math in Focus (at least, the way it is implemented in our school).

 

Last week I encouraged her to get through all of the math without too much "help," because they were being tested on it that Friday and needed the practice anyway.

 

Now this past week Miss A got sick again and missed school on Tuesday.  Again with the pile of make-up work on top of homework.  This time I just sat with her and talked her through stuff to the point of almost giving her the answers on some of it.  It was still too much.  She was exhausted all week.  If she gets sick again, I'm going to tell the teacher that making her work so long is just making her stay sick longer.  I'm done.  I wonder what other parents in the class think of this.  Maybe their kids are so brilliant they get the work done twice as fast.