Fruit of the Womb ...... not to be confused with Fruit of the Loom or Fruit Loops!(cc

[CalicoKat]

Fruit of the womb = children are a gift from the Lord = reward from God.

 

Sooooooo..... and I know I'm thinking waay to much today cuz I'm feeling better but hey, it's a good day to look stoopid....if you have not received personal "fruit from your womb" are you being punished? The opposite of reward is punishment, right?

 

My personal devotions paused on a Psalms today, 127 I believe. And it was all about children being a gift from God: the fruit of the womb is a reward from God..... And in my dark mind today I thought about my personal situation, infertility. What in the heck am I being punished for? Apart from being born into sin like everyone else in the world, I was a model child, teen, and pre-marriage adult.

 

If the punishment is supposed to fit the crime then what the heck did I do.

 

Yes, I have many gifts--our family was built by way of adoption. And it's very very very good. See God's blessing in many ways here.

 

But as a student of the Bible this verse has the potential to skip me out of christianity altogether. I can't argue with God. I can't even find out what the heck it is. And if it's truly the opposite of a reward (look it up in the dictionary) then I'm never never never going to be able to reconcile this in my heart.

 

There's more but I'm not sure how to put it into coherent paragraphs, if even the above makes sense is beyond me right now.

 

-- changes the way I view God the Father

-- if it is just random because of sin in general it changes theology on how God answer prayers and other verses in the NT.

--personally it changes the whole sovereignty thing too if this was a random because of sin in the world.

 

Waay to much thinking. Waay tooo much for to handle while trying to keep house, teach my gifts, and cook for all.

 

:auto:

[Heather in Neverland]

:lurk5:

 

And just to add fuel to the fire.....

 

If it IS a punishment then that has all kinds of implications for those who choose to undergo fertility treatments, IVF, etc. (adoption is sanctioned in the Bible, though). This is not my PERSONAL opinion but it does go along with this line of thinking.

[Aunty Social]

Just off the top of my head...

 

You are NOT being punished, you did nothing to cause God to deny you bearing your own children. Fruit of the womb is simply an expression meaning children - just like baker's dozen means thirteen. The children you've been blessed with are the ones meant for you, and God just had a different plan for them to be given to you. He doesn't make mistakes, we just can't comprehend even a tiny portion of His reasoning.

 

Imagine what might have happened to those children of yours if you hadn't adopted. God has a parent in mind for every child. Just because you didn't physically bear your children doesn't mean they weren't meant for you, and you for them.

 

Hope this helps.

 

ETA - in fact, with children being a gift from God, I would think adoption would tend to make one value that gift more than those who are able to have bio children. And aren't they a reward for all the years of wonder, heartache, and doubts people with infertility go through?

Edited March 24, 2009 by Aunty Social

[Sophia]

I'm sorry.

 

My first thought is that children are indeed a gift/reward, but they're not the only gift God gives, hence the absence of children doesn't mean one is being punished.

 

I hesitate to continue, because as you can see by my sig. I have 6 blessings, but the fact is I wanted more and the spaces between them are by His design, not mine.

His grace is sufficient is what I clung to when questioning what He was or wasn't doing in my life.

His grace is the biggest gift of all.

[jolley]

No. You're not being punished. In fact, if you think about it, you've been blessed. You were blessed with children via adoption. I have two "birth" children, two in heaven, and two "adopted" children. I have the exact number of children God wanted me to have. He is in control after all. Not all of us can have 12+ children. We are all different. God is a creative creator. Satan is just trying to turn you from Him.

 

No. You can't argue with God but you can talk to Him (prayer). The Spirit gives wisdom in understanding of His Word and sometimes when we are in a fog we don't understand. He is a loving Father but a perfect God must also be just.

 

You're questions don't change anything. He is God and has greater understanding then we do. No one can know the ways of God completely or there wouldn't be any point in God, would there. I hope I answered some of your questions. I'm short on time.

[CalicoKat]

:lurk5:

 

And just to add fuel to the fire.....

 

If it IS a punishment then that has all kinds of implications for those who choose to undergo fertility treatments, IVF, etc. (adoption is sanctioned in the Bible, though). This is not my PERSONAL opinion but it does go along with this line of thinking.

Thank you for adding that log to the fire -- I was too afraid to add that in there. :iagree: It all has to be considered.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Just a few thoughts to go with yours.

 

Some of the 'being barren equals shame' stuff mentioned in the Bible is a matter of recording what the culture at that time felt on the subject.

 

At the Fall, all of creation fell. This includes the functions of the human body. Many of the things that can go wrong with our bodies is because of this general consequence of sin being in the world - not necessarily a function of the personal sin of the person. This can include our reproductive health.

 

Children are one kind of gift from God. The Bible also points out that giving birth to a fool is a shame to a mother so there is a balance here. I don't believe that children are a reward in the sense that it is a prize given to those that did something especially good. God doesn't operate that way because that is not how grace works. It can be a reward in the sense that it is one of many, many blessings that God can give to people. The Bible talks about good health being a reward. I am chronically ill. I do not believe that God is punishing me. I believe that He simply did not give me that particular blessing.

 

I don't know why God chose to allow you to not bear children. I don't know why God chose to let me bear children when I had originally been told that I couldn't have them. God is sovereign but He does allow many different circumstances in our life - for me He allowed me to be chronically ill for the last 16 years.

 

God answers prayers out of His omniscience as well as His very deep love and grace for us. I don't know why He has not answered my prayers for complete health. I do know that He has sustained me through it and that He has taught me through it. I also know that having a "no" or "not now" answer to my prayer does not mean that He is not loving and gracious.

 

I am praying for peace for you. :grouphug:

[CalicoKat]

No. You're not being punished. In fact, if you think about it, you've been blessed. You were blessed with children via adoption. I have two "birth" children, two in heaven, and two "adopted" children. I have the exact number of children God wanted me to have. He is in control after all. Not all of us can have 12+ children. We are all different. God is a creative creator. Satan is just trying to turn you from Him. (Him or the hormones ..... Ha!)

 

No. You can't argue with God but you can talk to Him (prayer). The Spirit gives wisdom in understanding of His Word and sometimes when we are in a fog we don't understand. He is a loving Father but a perfect God must also be just.

 

You're questions don't change anything. He is God and has greater understanding then we do. No one can know the ways of God completely or there wouldn't be any point in God, would there. I hope I answered some of your questions. I'm short on time.

Thanks for thoughts to think. It's just a subject that keeps coming up in my studies and also there's one person (family) in my dh's family that keeps harping on this subject. It's frustrating when it's obvious God's blessing is in our family, our families growth, and life path. It's hard because I don't have a cut a dried response to give/or snappy come back. It's something I'm not sure I'll ever have a "bean dip" response for. But I know God's blessings. We experience them every day.

[Quiver0f10]

Fruit of the womb = children are a gift from the Lord = reward from God.

 

Sooooooo..... and I know I'm thinking waay to much today cuz I'm feeling better but hey, it's a good day to look stoopid....if you have not received personal "fruit from your womb" are you being punished? The opposite of reward is punishment, right?

 

My personal devotions paused on a Psalms today, 127 I believe. And it was all about children being a gift from God: the fruit of the womb is a reward from God..... And in my dark mind today I thought about my personal situation, infertility. What in the heck am I being punished for? Apart from being born into sin like everyone else in the world, I was a model child, teen, and pre-marriage adult.

 

If the punishment is supposed to fit the crime then what the heck did I do.

 

Yes, I have many gifts--our family was built by way of adoption. And it's very very very good. See God's blessing in many ways here.

 

But as a student of the Bible this verse has the potential to skip me out of christianity altogether. I can't argue with God. I can't even find out what the heck it is. And if it's truly the opposite of a reward (look it up in the dictionary) then I'm never never never going to be able to reconcile this in my heart.

 

There's more but I'm not sure how to put it into coherent paragraphs, if even the above makes sense is beyond me right now.

 

-- changes the way I view God the Father

-- if it is just random because of sin in general it changes theology on how God answer prayers and other verses in the NT.

--personally it changes the whole sovereignty thing too if this was a random because of sin in the world.

 

Waay to much thinking. Waay tooo much for to handle while trying to keep house, teach my gifts, and cook for all.

 

:auto:

 

 

My brother and his wife are infertile, yet God blessed them through Adoption. That little boy is just as much their child as if she had given birth to him. God is in control and we are to trust Him.

[Aubrey]

Job felt the same way, you know. He did have children & lost them all. His friends told him he *must* have sinned, & that he was a liar to say that he was suffering so much loss but blameless.

 

It turns out, God's answer was sovereignty. He is who he is. Of course children are a blessing--I'm not sure about the term "reward"--I know it's in the Bible, but that's a translator's choice, so I try not to hang too much on shades of meaning in a translated language, kwim?

 

Anyway, my point is...he has different plans for different people. Different blessings, different struggles. Remember when he foretells Peter's death & Peter points to John & says, "Yeah? What about him?" Jesus answer was, "What is it to you if he remains until I come back?"

 

:grouphug: I don't know the struggles of infertility, but I do know God's character. I'd say he's not punishing you AT ALL but rewarding your dear children who needed the love & patience of a tender heart.

[CalicoKat]

Just a few thoughts to go with yours.

 

Some of the 'being barren equals shame' stuff mentioned in the Bible is a matter of recording what the culture at that time felt on the subject.

 

At the Fall, all of creation fell. This includes the functions of the human body. Many of the things that can go wrong with our bodies is because of this general consequence of sin being in the world - not necessarily a function of the personal sin of the person. This can include our reproductive health.

 

Children are one kind of gift from God. The Bible also points out that giving birth to a fool is a shame to a mother so there is a balance here. I don't believe that children are a reward in the sense that it is a prize given to those that did something especially good. God doesn't operate that way because that is not how grace works. It can be a reward in the sense that it is one of many, many blessings that God can give to people. The Bible talks about good health being a reward. I am chronically ill. I do not believe that God is punishing me. I believe that He simply did not give me that particular blessing.

 

I don't know why God chose to allow you to not bear children. I don't know why God chose to let me bear children when I had originally been told that I couldn't have them. God is sovereign but He does allow many different circumstances in our life - for me He allowed me to be chronically ill for the last 16 years.

 

God answers prayers out of His omniscience as well as His very deep love and grace for us. I don't know why He has not answered my prayers for complete health. I do know that He has sustained me through it and that He has taught me through it. I also know that having a "no" or "not now" answer to my prayer does not mean that He is not loving and gracious.

 

I am praying for peace for you. :grouphug:

 

Thank you for your response. From another chronically ill person, :grouphug:.

 

Ironically my infertility is a consequence of my parent's decision to be missionaries in Africa. Medically speaking, if they'd not decided to be missionaries then the illness I contracted there wouldn't have had time to fester and start this cascade of auto-immune crap in my body. Hard to justify on many levels. On a spiritual level, God is sovereign. Impossible to predict the "what might have beens." The irony is not lost on my family though.

[CalicoKat]

Job felt the same way, you know. He did have children & lost them all. His friends told him he *must* have sinned, & that he was a liar to say that he was suffering so much loss but blameless.

 

It turns out, God's answer was sovereignty. He is who he is. Of course children are a blessing--I'm not sure about the term "reward"--I know it's in the Bible, but that's a translator's choice, so I try not to hang too much on shades of meaning in a translated language, kwim?

 

Anyway, my point is...he has different plans for different people. Different blessings, different struggles. Remember when he foretells Peter's death & Peter points to John & says, "Yeah? What about him?" Jesus answer was, "What is it to you if he remains until I come back?"

 

:grouphug: I don't know the struggles of infertility, but I do know God's character. I'd say he's not punishing you AT ALL but rewarding your dear children who needed the love & patience of a tender heart.

so perhaps my response to the individual who keeps telling me that it's some hidden sin I've committed is to give her the reference to the verses about Peter & John--and omit a translation and let God do the talking?

 

thank you for your response.

[Kanga]

I had two children and then was infertile for 14 years before I had Rew. During that time I lost several babies and had a failed adoption (crossing state lines can be harder than crossing national borders sometimes:confused:). There were times when I felt that I was being punished and times when others suggested that I was :angry:. During those times I reminded myself that God used a lot of barren women: Sarah, Elizabeth, Hannah, Rachel... Yes, he eventually "opened their womb", but that did not mean that during the time that they were barren that He did not love them and have a plan for their lives. When people made comments about my dh and I stopping after having 2 children I would say, "I'll have more children when God opens my womb" - it quite effectively shut people up and started them quietly praying for me! :lol: I had completely reconciled myself to my infertility when Rew came along (I was so old I thought it was menopause and seriously considered naming him Isaac!) I would love more children, but I doubt that I will be able to have any more, so we will probably try to adopt. I will go into the adoption knowing that a failed adoption is as emotionally painful as a miscarriage. If we are able to adopt I believe that my adopted child will be as much a blessing and gift from God as my birth children. I will pray for God's guidance and will, and if he says no, I will know that it is because he loves me and has a different plan, not because he is punishing me.

[Peek a Boo]

so perhaps my response to the individual who keeps telling me that it's some hidden sin I've committed is to give her the reference to the verses about Peter & John--and omit a translation and let God do the talking?

 

it's hard to NOT find a snarky come back when you're trying to witness to a fellow Christian!!

 

however, in your situation, I would probably advise you to reply "well, we ALL have our crosses to bear and thorns in our sides. Like Paul, I will rejoice in mine, learn from it, and focus on Him."

 

and as someone whose personal burden[s!] is NOT infertility, I will say that there are probably some Christian gals who would trade burdens w/ you in a heartbeat.....

 

{{{CalicoKat}}}

:grouphug:

 

 

eta: another thought that came up in Sunday School:

the age old Q of "why do bad things happen to good people?"

 

The question is faulty from the get-go: define good.

Now define good as God defines it.

I have to remind myself that we should be grateful that we aren't getting what we REALLY deserve.

Many people --even Christians-- tend to forget that our sufferings here on earth are temporary, and we need to keep our eyes and hearts on eternity.

Edited March 24, 2009 by Peek a Boo

[Tutor]

When I was reading your post, my mind jumped immediately to John 9: 1-3 :

 

As He passed by, He saw a man blind from birth. And His disciples asked Him, "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents that he would be born blind?" Jesus answered, "It was neither that this man sinned, not his parents; but it was so that the works of God might be displayed in Him."

 

The Fall in the garden resulted in a disharmony of sorts between Creator and creation. One evidence of that disharmony is that a man can choose to act against God; the consequences of that act, that sin, result in separation from God and can also have more immediate, temporal effects. however, the willful sin of men is not the only cause of these effects. The fact that the world is a place out of harmony from God's original declaration of goodness means that there are evidences of that disharmony all the time and in all places - infertility, infidelity, hatred, death, etc. Could infertility be the direct result of an individual's sinful act? Sure, and it would be right to examine possible sinful acts that could have led to it and repent of them. But not all infertility is. Often, it is just the result of being an imperfect creature in an imperfect world. There is also nothing wrong with asking to be delivered from infertility, adopting children into your family, or transferring your motherly affections on those around you who need a mother but who have been denied that loving relationship because of this imperfect world.

 

This is such an excellent question to ponder. Thank you for bringing it up and allowing us a window into your thoughts and struggles. I have struggled with what I guess would be the mirror of this which is a fear of having more children. I know that they are a blessing, and who would deny a blessing, right? But I have become progressively sicker with each pregnancy and we have become increasingly less prosperous, so I don't know how I could possibly care for more children. I would love to have more children (I have been especially burdened to adopt), but we have not been given the resources to do so, and I am having a difficult time reconciling the passion I have been given for more children and our lack of ability to afford more children.

 

Again, thanks for sharing your thoughts and questions. I've benefited from reading the responses and look forward to reading more.

[Colleen in NS]

Fruit of the womb = children are a gift from the Lord = reward from God.

 

Sooooooo..... and I know I'm thinking waay to much today cuz I'm feeling better but hey, it's a good day to look stoopid....if you have not received personal "fruit from your womb" are you being punished? The opposite of reward is punishment, right?

 

My personal devotions paused on a Psalms today, 127 I believe. And it was all about children being a gift from God: the fruit of the womb is a reward from God.

 

Psalm 127 doesn't say anything (at least in my NIV) about children having to be born from "my" womb in order to be a reward/gift. I take that to mean children in general, not just children from my womb. I see adoption as another way that God rewards people with the gift of children.

 

I just think that God is probably more concerned with getting orphans into families than He is with "punishing" us with a lack of children from our womb.

 

These thoughts from one who has off and on thought of adopting over the last 15 years, esp. after finding out I really shouldn't try to birth another baby, and finding out my sister is dealing with infertility.

[coralloyd]

God was not punishing Sarah by waiting till she was in her 90's to give her Isaac. He waited because he had an AMAZING plan for her life.

 

We are never told that Esther had children, yet look at how God used her life.

 

The Lord closed Hannah's womb, and not Peninnah's; even though Hannah was clearly the one who sought after and loved God, and Peninnah was a bitter irritating woman. Again He had a plan.

 

Elizabeth was barren till she had John, and she was Mary's mentor (a very Godly woman).

 

Deborah a judge over Israel was married, but we are never told she had children. She had a very important and time consuming job, with not much time to be a mother.

 

God has a different plan for all of us.

[Geo]

so perhaps my response to the individual who keeps telling me that it's some hidden sin I've committed is to give her the reference to the verses about Peter & John--and omit a translation and let God do the talking?

 

Absolutely. I am sure you've heard of being "a Job's comforter" You know, his "friends" who told him "you must have done something wrong or God wouldn't be doing this to you". Yeah. God's wrath was kindled against them because they did not speak right of Him;

God wouldn't even hear their prayers and told them to have Job pray for them, for the Lord accepted Job.

 

It then goes on to say "And the Lord restored Job's losses when he prayed for his friends. Indeed the Lord gave Job twice as much as he had before."

 

I think it's important here that you be sure you have forgiven these person (and pray for him/her) who has spoken these things.

 

May God bless you,

Geo

[OnTheBrink]

I don't believe that infertility is a punishment. God blesses and rewards in many ways, not just with children.

 

I can't back this up, really, but I believe any "punishments" from God are a natural consequence for something done wrong. Meaning, if you drive drunk, you go to jail--that sort of thing. I don't believe God hands out arbitrary punishments and leaves us wondering what we did to deserve it. Sometimes bad things happen and we don't know why; sometimes they happen due to the sins of others. Sometimes they happen due to our own sins, but I don't believe all bad things that happen are punishments and while I do believe in God's wrath, I don't believe infertility is the result of His wrath.

 

JMO, YMMV, etc.

[Geo]

Just one more thing...it ain't over 'til it's over. I have a friend married for 20 years and infertile. She was 40 years old and became pregnant. Randomly...just like that. Perfect pregnancy, perfect birth, beautiful child.

I am not suggesting that it will be that way for you...it's just that God knows the has plans He has for you, plans to prosper you and not to harm you, to give you a hope and a future. He is faithful. You can look to Him face to face without shame, and know He loves you and that you can trust Him with ALL of it.

 

My heart and prayers are with you,

Geo

 

P.S.

I know the cup tastes bitter right now, but don't refuse to drink from it...He has a plan!

[laughing lioness]

Couple of thoughts:

 

Children are a reward. I guess I wonder why it's spelled out. Not as an indictment for those who don't bear and birth children but because we are getting messages that they aren't a reward. During the time this was written the worship of Molech and Chemosh was in full swing. Live babies were put into the stone arms of the statues of these gods and burned alive. Sounds a bit like abortion to me, but I digress.

In much the same way that God commands men to LOVE their wives and women to RESPECT their husbands. Men do not naturally love like women do, and women do not naturally respect like men do. It's not that men don't love their wives (hopefully), it's that it is their nature to respect first, where perhaps women need love first. Women are inclined to love first and respsect later (hopefully), whereas most men crave and need respect more than love.

So, I don't read this text as an indictment against but rather as an admonishment to all of us to see and believe that children are a REWARD, not a burden, not a blob of tissue, not an expense, not an inconvenience. Children are a gift. ALL children are a gift, they are reward. It doesn't say, my child is a gift because I carried him or her for 9mths and yours isn't. It says my child is a gift, your child is a gift, her child is a gift. And frankly, the fact that you did not ignore the orphans but gave them a home and a name and a place and LOVE says to me that they are blessed beyond measure.

 

Secondly, Jerimiah 29:11. God knows the plans He has for us and they are plans for good and not for evil!

[Amber in SJ]

I hope you have received some comfort from the replies here. Along with the second verse in John 9, where Jesus is asked if the man was born blind because of his own sin or the sin of his parents, is the answer in verse 3;

"Jesus answered, Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him." (KJV)

 

Not having children of your own womb (as it were) is not a punishment, rather your family and they way that your children have come to you are a testimony and a manifestation of the good works of God.

 

Illness or physical limitations are not punishments but rather symptoms of our mortality. Take comfort in the fact that not only did the Savior take on the sins of the world, but also the afflictions of mankind so that he would know how to succor his people.

 

Of course this is just my .02, but it is offered with a big hug.

 

Amber in SJ

[SnowWhite]

so perhaps my response to the individual who keeps telling me that it's some hidden sin I've committed is to give her the reference to the verses about Peter & John--and omit a translation and let God do the talking?

 

thank you for your response.

 

I cannot BELIEVE someone is telling you this. Job's comforter indeed!

 

((hugs)) to you, and I pray that God will give you peace.

 

I believe infertility is as any other illness, an instrument of Satan which God allows to bring about some eternal good... which might be even the very adoption of your children. To believe you are being punished by God, I would have to believe that my MIL (kidney transplant recipient, miraculously surviving decades of lupus) is being punished, which I very much reject. Her life is a testimony to God's grace and healing power, even though she daily struggles to overcome the "fiery darts of the enemy" in her body. Was the flu my family suffered with last week a punishment from God? I cannot believe it was, but instead it was a trial to bring us closer to our Saviour.

[Nestof3]

I honestly think this verse has been blown way of out of proportion, and it seems much doctrine has been built around it. I think it's just a general statement saying it's a good thing God gives us -- the ability to procreate. Procreation in all of nature is a gift.

 

We are in a fallen world, and sometimes things don't work exactly as the model design, but no, I don't see it as a punishment. I also don't see a child being born without something most people have as a punishment.

 

I actually don't believe God opens and closes each womb specifically. I believe He can, but I believe it is a general statement about Him designing the ability to procreate. I don't believe He would open up a 12 year old's womb to bring forth a baby out of fornication anymore than I believe He would close yours to punish you.

[CalicoKat]

Just one more thing...it ain't over 'til it's over. I have a friend married for 20 years and infertile. She was 40 years old and became pregnant. Randomly...just like that. Perfect pregnancy, perfect birth, beautiful child.

I am not suggesting that it will be that way for you...it's just that God knows the has plans He has for you, plans to prosper you and not to harm you, to give you a hope and a future. He is faithful. You can look to Him face to face without shame, and know He loves you and that you can trust Him with ALL of it.

 

My heart and prayers are with you,

Geo

 

P.S.

I know the cup tastes bitter right now, but don't refuse to drink from it...He has a plan!

It's over. Surgery ended that possiblilty last year.

[Harriet Vane]

so perhaps my response to the individual who keeps telling me that it's some hidden sin I've committed is to give her the reference to the verses about Peter & John--and omit a translation and let God do the talking?

 

thank you for your response.

 

Okay, my blood is boiling when I think that someone would be that colossally intrusive, insensitive, and mean to you!!! I am so very, very sorry that you have to cope with this.

 

The others have given some wonderful perspective biblically. Take it to heart.

 

This relative needs some strong boundaries, pronto. I honestly doubt there will ever be an answer that will compel this person to change her mind. My own experience with people like this is that they really do not listen. Perhaps it's time to decree the subject off-limits?

 

In the meantime, please know that if your boundary-challenged relative ever said any such thing in MY presence I would spring to your defense and teach her some manners.

[Brigitte]

Psalm 127 doesn't say anything (at least in my NIV) about children having to be born from "my" womb in order to be a reward/gift. I take that to mean children in general, not just children from my womb. I see adoption as another way that God rewards people with the gift of children.

 

I just think that God is probably more concerned with getting orphans into families than He is with "punishing" us with a lack of children from our womb.

 

These thoughts from one who has off and on thought of adopting over the last 15 years, esp. after finding out I really shouldn't try to birth another baby, and finding out my sister is dealing with infertility.[/QUOTe]

 

That was my reaction too. It says "fruit of THE womb," not "fruit of MY womb."

[Colleen in NS]

That was my reaction too. It says "fruit of THE womb," not "fruit of MY womb."

 

EXACTLY what first popped into my head.

[MamaSheep]

Infertility is one of my struggles too. Here's a verse you could maybe quote back when someone tosses the other one at you. It's one of my personal favorites.

 

Psalm 113:9 He maketh the barren woman to keep house, and to be a joyful mother of children. Praise ye the Lord.

 

HTH

 

 

******

ETA: I just saw your response to my TMI post about my son over on the other thread. Knowing you've read that I just wanted to add here that I fully believe that children ARE a blessing, but not the ONLY blessing God has for us as someone else pointed out, and we shouldn't whine (though I definitely do at times) because we have been given one blessing instead of another. And as I said before, I believe infertility is just a circumstance, not a punishment and like other painful life circumstances I believe God can use it for our good. Strangely, in hind sight, the fertility issues that put 5.5 years between my two children have turned out to be an incredible blessing. It didn't seem that way at the time because I have always wanted a big family, but those years gave me time to focus on my son in ways I would not have been able to with a baby and a toddler in tow. His developmental issues have been less than they would have been because of the intense one-on-one attention I was able to give him, and the work I was able to do with him even before he was diagnosed just because it seemed like the right way to manage this child. The infertility was a blessing in our family's life during that time. I have a harder time reconciling the 6.5 years since dd joined our family, though several of those years also necessitated intense focus on ds that would've been difficult with more children. At this point I know that God's plan was better than mine the first time around, and I trust that is the case now as well. And I am also convinced that God takes our desires into consideration in the final weighing-up of things, and that whether in this life or in the next, He will make up for any blessings He had to hold back from us in this life in order to fulfill other plans. Along those lines I also find this verse interesting:

 

Isaiah 54:1 Sing, O barren, thou that didst not bear; break forth into singing, and cry aloud, thou that didst not travail with child: for more are the children of the desolate than the children of the married wife, saith the Lord. 1 Sing, O barren, thou that didst not bear; break forth into singing, and cry aloud, thou that didst not travail with child: for more are the children of the desolate than the children of the married wife, saith the Lord.

Edited March 25, 2009 by MamaSheep

[TXMomof4]

This makes me think of 2 verses - Romans 8:28 28And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.

 

and this one -

 

James 1:27 Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.

 

eta: Sorry, my computer automatically shuts down at 10:00 (thank you dh) and I wasn't quite done yet! All things are working for our good, even when it doesn't seem like it's a logical thing. If you hadn't had the fertility problems, would you have adopted? Like many of us, it may not have really been an option if you had had a brood from your own womb. But you are practicing pure and faultless religion by caring for your sweet babies. God put you in a position to be completely serving Him, and experiencing joy at the same time. What sweeter service is there?

While my problems with infertility were relatively short lived, it didn't seem like it in the middle of it. About 3 months after we had begun treatments, my sil called to tell me she was pg with #2. 2 months later she called to tell me it was twins. That pain is uncomparable to anything else, I truly believe.

Edited March 25, 2009 by TXMomof4

[CalicoKat]

Okay, my blood is boiling when I think that someone would be that colossally intrusive, insensitive, and mean to you!!! I am so very, very sorry that you have to cope with this.

 

The others have given some wonderful perspective biblically. Take it to heart.

 

This relative needs some strong boundaries, pronto. I honestly doubt there will ever be an answer that will compel this person to change her mind. My own experience with people like this is that they really do not listen. Perhaps it's time to decree the subject off-limits?

 

In the meantime, please know that if your boundary-challenged relative ever said any such thing in MY presence I would spring to your defense and teach her some manners.

Thank you for your words. There are big boundaries but dh is after me (at every family gathering) to "let it go." It's his fav. brother's wife. Many issues here but dh has been respectful it's just hard because his relationship with his brother is nil because of this.

[CalicoKat]

Infertility is one of my struggles too. Here's a verse you could maybe quote back when someone tosses the other one at you. It's one of my personal favorites.

 

 

 

HTH

Thanks. :001_smile:

[Paintedlady]

My kids are adopted as well, and I've been IF for over 15 years. I know SO WELL your struggle. I have peace and I don't. It's no longer the raw emotion it used to be, but a sort of dull ache that I get more used to with time.

 

I fully believe my children are a gift from God, and I believe God allowed me to be IF so I could be their mom. I do not feel punished, but just the opposite. I feel blessed beyond measure and most days I forget that we're different. And on the days I remember, I think what a miracle that God made us all so different and all from different families of origin, but he made us a family anyway. And I think that's pretty cool!

 

I also believe that when I go to heaven I will receive full healing in my soul and this wound will be closed forever. :grouphug:

[Lovedtodeath]

so perhaps my response to the individual who keeps telling me that it's some hidden sin I've committed is to give her the reference to the verses about Peter & John--and omit a translation and let God do the talking?

 

thank you for your response.

 

Job certainly had no hidden sin. Matter of fact, he was targeting for suffering because he was upright and blameless.

 

Hannah, Sarah, and Rachel were all barren for a long time, and had few children, but they were all women that He dearly loved and blessed. I think you could benefit from reading the account about Hannah. Her story really touched me.

[CalicoKat]

My kids are adopted as well, and I've been IF for over 15 years. I know SO WELL your struggle. I have peace and I don't. It's no longer the raw emotion it used to be, but a sort of dull ache that I get more used to with time.

 

I fully believe my children are a gift from God, and I believe God allowed me to be IF so I could be their mom. I do not feel punished, but just the opposite. I feel blessed beyond measure and most days I forget that we're different. And on the days I remember, I think what a miracle that God made us all so different and all from different families of origin, but he made us a family anyway. And I think that's pretty cool!

 

I also believe that when I go to heaven I will receive full healing in my soul and this wound will be closed forever. :grouphug:

Thanks for sharing. It's nice to meet to know that I'm normal. You're absolutly right--it's not as painful as it was in the beginning. My children are such a huge blessing to me. I

[Geo]

It's over. Surgery ended that possiblilty last year.

 

Oh, so sorry. My heart feels for you. I have suffered miscarriages and can touch your pain in a small way.

You are a grieving mom, be patient with yourself and those who mean to comfort you but only end up hurting

you in some way (unintentionally). The bible says "Weep with those who weep". True wisdom. I found that the

people who cried with me were my greatest comfort in those times.

 

May peace come to you,

geo

Edited March 26, 2009 by Geo