Can pre-algebra be taken in 6th?

[butterfly113]

If you have a child working a grade level ahead in the elementary years... how does this all work out? :glare:

For example:

DS9 currently in 3rd grade working on Horizons 4

4th grade Horizons 5

5th grade Horizons 6

6th grade :confused:

 

if pre algebra starts in 6th, then in 7th he would take Algebra I. How does this work for high school and credits? :001_huh:

 

Any experience with this? Please share! TIA! :D

[yslek]

I took Algebra I in 7th grade in PS. It didn't show up on my transcript, but the math courses that I did take in High School were listed there. I think college admissions officers aren't going to wonder where Algebra I and Geometry are if they see Alg. II, Precalc & Calc listed, KWIM?

 

Another option (that I saw on a handout from a HS transcript lecture my friend attended) is to have a section on your transcript entitled something like "early high-school level work" and list all of the hight-school level classes taken before 9th grade. Then admissions officers can decided whether or not they "count", but at least they see the courses.)

[DarlaS]

How old will be be in 6th grade? My almost 12 year old is halfway through pre-algebra now.

 

Do you live in a state where those high school math credits will be an issue? Is dual enrollment or early college admission an option? He could theoretically work through 2 years of calculus in high school--but you're likely to need help. Very likely unless you're a math major.

 

No wonder you're thinking about this now. Horizons is rather advanced so he should be very ready for prealgebra after doing gr 6 (if not algebra).

 

 

Darla

[Heather in VA]

Pre-algebra is just a fancy term for more decimals, percents, fractions and some basic algebra concepts. There is no reason a child who has covered these concepts can't move into pre-algebra. My soon to be 5th grader is about to start pre-algebra.

 

As far as high school credit, its common here in public schools for Algebra to be in 7th and 8th. There are lots of options as to how to approach it. You can just start in 7th and then move on to Geometry etc or you can take 2 years (7th and 8th). Either way you can give credit for it but most colleges I've talked to still expect 4 years of math taken during the 9th - 12th grade years. They also expect Algebra I not to be done during that time. In other words, just because you start Algebra in 6th or 7th doesn't mean you can hurrry and finish all math by 9th grade.

 

Heather

[Dobela]

WhenI was in public school I did preAlgebra in 6th grade then went on to Algebra I in 7th. Since Algebra I is considered a high school subject, you can count it as such no matter which grade it is completed in. (That sounds confusing-I mean to say you can give high school credit for it even though the child is not technically in high school because Algebra I is considered to be high school math).

[Jann in TX]

Just because a student is 'ahead' in elementary math does NOT mean that they are mature enough to progress to the abstract thinking (logic) required in the Algebras.

 

I say this because I have witnessed (too many times) the frustrations of students who feel 'dumb' because they 'cannot do' Algebra...they were just forced into it a bit young--the second time around they flourished! In some cases the students were in 10th or 11th grades before they were READY for Algebra... many of these students were 'gifted' in elementary maths...

 

I personally prefer Algebra 1 to be taken in 9th grade--but since it is the current trend to PUSH students (PUSH does not always equate success...) more and more schools are offering Algebra in 7th and 8th grades. The percentage of students who can successfully complete Algebra 1 and Geometry in 7th and 8th grades is VERY LOW. It has nothing to do with how well or how 'advanced' they were with arithmetic...Percentage wise--only the top 10% of 8th graders are successful in learning/understanding Algebra 1... there are LOTS of schools who water down Algebra for younger students...(sigh).

 

There are always exceptions--I personally completed Algebra 1 and Algebra 2 in 8th grade...then I had to wait until 10th grade for Geometry--but that is another long story....

[SonshineLearner]

SO, I just ordered the Lial's for my will be 11 yr old. I figured that it'll be like teaching reading. We'll do it till one of us wants to stop, and then something else. I have her read lots of living math books to her little brother. I am looking at things that are "real life" math and I'm hoping to learn how to use an Abacus this year...so....I hope that we'll be moving at a pace which will make her feel smart but challenged. I'm hoping that as I do math this time, I'll be the one to feel smart the second time around.

 

Carrie:-)

[plansrme]

There are a lot of threads on putting pre-9th grade work on a HS transcript. As I think I saw it put recently, the consensus is that there is no consensus. Real helpful, isn't it??

 

Terri

[Patricia in WA]

My son was done with SM6 in 5th grade and moved into algebra in 6th grade. He is moving along fine (except for still not wanting to write things out, but we are working on it). We will continue into Algebra 2 and then go onto Geometry (he is not a fan of this so I thought I would let his brain mature a bit more). The "plan" is to start trig in grade 9. At some point I will have to outsource Math for him, probably at a CC.

 

For us part of the high school transcript will also include SAT IIs and most likely CC classes. If they score well on SAT and SAT II tests, I don't think any school will question whether they really did algebra in 6th/7th.

HTHs,

[Patricia in WA]

I couldn't agree more! My "plan" is to follow his pace. At any point I see him faltering I will slow it down. Currently we are working slowly because he is able to solve quadratic equations in his head and will only write down the solution set. I think he should write the solutions all out. He refuses. This is our daily battle.

 

Jann, if you don't mind, what are your thoughts on thisage old problem? He is 10....11 at the end of July. Thank you.

[Laura R (FL)]

I think it also depends on your state and your hs status.

 

For instance, here in FL students are required to have 4 hs math credits for graduation. Since we are in an umbrella school and considered private school students, we have to follow those guidelines. Taking Alg I in 7th grade might be a bit tricky for future planning (not that I would let it be the sole determiner).

 

If your child is academically/mentally ready for Alg I, then I would go ahead with it. Since you are writing your own transcript, you have more freedom. If it shows that geomtery or Alg II was taken in 9th grade, it will be assumed that Alg I was already taken, but may not count as hs credit. Here, only courses taken in 8th grade, and only Alg I and freign language, can count as hs credit.

[Perry]

Sure. My 6th grader did pre-algebra last year and is doing fine with Algebra this year. We just plan to keep working through math at a pace comfortable for her. I expect to slow down quite a bit when she does Geometry and Algebra 2. I don't know what we'll do for high school yet. She plans to go to ps starting in 9th grade. I really hate the ps math curriculum, so will probably have her dual enroll and take math through correspondence.

[tmkclscroggins]

Here's what we did:

 

we did Horizons 5- 4th

Lial's Basic College Math - 5th

R&S grade 8 ( didn't want to start Algebra in 6th grade) - 6th

Foerser's Algebra 1 - 7th

 

As far as high school credits, this is my math whiz so he'll probably go one to AP calculus. His high school credits will start with Algebra 2.

 

melissa

[tajott]

Have you looked at Hands-on Equations? it would be a nice intro to Algebra, as would the Key to Algebra series.

 

Pre-Algebra is just more decimals, percents, ratios and negative numbers. I believe pre-Algebra is a made up thing so that kids can have review in the middle grades, and is meant as filler while their little bodies, emotions and spirits grow during those early teen years.

[elise1mds]

I did Pre-Algebra in PS 7th grade when I was going through, and Algebra I in 8th. I had to have 3 math credits to graduate high school - one had to be algebra, one had to be geometry, and one could be anything else. I wound up taking Geometry in 9th, Advanced Algebra II/Pre-Calc in 10th (considered advanced because algebra II and pre-calculus were stuck in one year), and AP Statistics in 11th. I could have taken AP Calc in either my junior or senior year, but I chose not to. I'm not a mathy person. I just wanted the honors credits.

[Jann in TX]

My own dd refused to show her work when factoring quadratics--that is until she hit Algebra 2! Once she started making pesky sign errors I told her to start showing her work--I have a 'method' for factoring them and she refused to use it... now she uses it ALL the time (because she found that she was not making those pesky errors anymore!).

 

Much of upper Math is proof. Showing a reasonable amount of work is necessary to prove your answer. When dd is reducing complex fractions (quadratics in numerator and denominator) she does not have to show her factoring work--she uses scrap paper for that... when she is just working with a quadratic--or solving one she does. I give partial credit to my online students--but ONLY if they show their work.

 

For young students I like what Lori M (from high school board) did with her dds. She had them progress a bit then go back and repeat a level or 2, using a different program. There are also LOTS of little tangents you could go on if you want to slow him down a bit--while still 'rounding him out'...maybe play around with Geometry (not necessarily proofs--more hands-on) or computer programming...

[Patricia in WA]

It is not so much what you need to graduate as to what you need for the college/univeristy and major you want. I went to a science and engineering college. They required 4 years of math. I had to take Calc and score very high on the math section of the SAT to be even considered and I was not even an engineering major.:willy_nilly:

 

HTHs,

[Patricia in WA]

Jann,

Thanks for your reply. You have given me much to think about. ;) Back up in another program you say.......hmmmm.....

[mktkcb]

Always do math at the pace of your child, making sure they are really getting it. In my hs isp, everything through 8th grade is just "math 7" or "math 8", no matter what we are doing. LOL, I sure *hope* its ok for 6th graders to do pre alg seeing as my 6th grader is doing regular algebra. I agree with the others who said to be ready to slow down, back up & review occasionally, and the like with younger kids. My son is doing the Kinetic books program online, which is pretty thorough, but doesn't require quite the amount of writing that a text based program would (they type a lot of it). I foresee some moments ahead of solidifying, working on the physical writing more, etc., but thats ok. I'm having him do the Daily Math review workbook (6+ level) as a supplement, to keep all the aritmetic/statistics/probability/geometry etc. stuff in his head. All this to say that you will be fine. Wherever he is when he get to HS is what will go on the transcript. No worries.

[Laura Corin]

Just because a student is 'ahead' in elementary math does NOT mean that they are mature enough to progress to the abstract thinking (logic) required in the Algebras.

 

It depends so much on the child. I was in the top stream in maths at school - I found arithmetic fairly easy. By the time I was sixteen, I was floundering: I got my only C ever for an exam I took at that age. I suspect I was just too young; all kinds of things are making much more sense now as I teach them to Calvin.

 

I observed something similar with reading: Calvin knew all his letter sounds before he was two, but wasn't able to blend for another couple of years.

 

Laura

[RootAnn]

It is not so much what you need to graduate as to what you need for the college/univeristy and major you want.

 

My mom "pushed" me ahead in math in PS by having me do Geometry in summer school. I ended up in Calculus (honors) as a Junior. I took Calc III & Diff. Equations at the local university my senior year.

 

I agree this can be tricky with colleges. I applied for the engineering college of one university. They sent me a form letter telling me I wouldn't be able to get in because I was difficient in math and/or science. I'd met every one of their listed minimums before my senior year, but they must have looked only at my list of classes I was taking senior year (which didn't include the college math ones) and not my transcript.

 

When necessary, I'm a fan of listing more than one math class in a year on the transcript. One can be under a pseudo "summer school" area.

 

I also agree on "readiness" issues. If your child is ready, forge ahead. I wouldn't make him show his work unless he is messing up. I have a pencil-phobic child who doesn't like to write much of anything. As long as she gets stuff right orally, I don't require her to write (except on tests). (Obviously, she is at a much lower level than your ds.) This is motivation for her to spell & compute correctly the first time. :tongue_smilie:

[Carmen_and_Company]

We're currently doing pre-algebra in 6th grade after not doing any math for two months. DD finished SM 6B the summer before 6th grade. We tried TT, but the product did not work for dd. So we just played around with How Math Works & used the supplementary SM books until last month.

 

Here's our tentative math sequence for Storm through 12th grade:

 

6th-- Chalk Dust pre-algebra--select chapters (currently doing)

7th-- Chalk Dust Algebra

8th-- Chalk Dust Geometry or the DVD set that goes w/Jacob's Geometry

9th-- Chalk Dust Algebra & Trig--1st half of text

10th--Chalk Dust Algebra & Trig--2nd half of text

11th--Calculus at community college or CD Calculus or CD precalculus

12th--same as above or Multi-variable calculus at community college

 

HTH

[Jenny in Florida]

However, my son did the Florida Virtual School math sequence. We were told by his instructor that the 8th grade class was essentially "pre-algebra." My son did the class last year, when he was 4th grade age. He took the advanced track and did very well.

 

He's now doing the Algebra 1 course at the University of California Open Access site. It's going well. He's running a mid-range A, although the lessons on completing squares and parabolas and such that we hit this week are causing some stress. As others have said, it's a constant fight to get him to show his work. Today, when he had blown several questions in a row, I finally told him I could not help him until I could see his work on paper and understand what he was doing.

 

He grumbled, but did it. Today. We'll see how tomorrow goes.

 

I'm not terribly worried about the transcript issue. We just have no idea what this one will want to do about college. His big sister knew from early on that she wanted to go to college early and just about as soon as we could swing it. So, I started keeping transcripts and getting really picky about it as soon as she was doing high school level work. My son is much less sure when he wants to go to college, so I'm just keeping records of what he's doing and planning to worry later about making the transcripts look tidy.

 

Oh, one thing I will say about transcripts is that my daughter took most of her high school math through the virtual school, which meant she had a record that was verified by an outside agency. I plan to try and do the same thing for my son.

[Beth in SW WA]

Both my dc have done CD Pre Alg in 6th-7th. We take it at the pace that works well for retention.

[ga girl]

My dd is in 7th grade this year and completing Algebra 1. I don't want to have to work out what she would be required to take for hs years ( assuming 4 years of math, this would be Geometry, Trig, Calc. and ???). So, I am having her repeat Algebra 1 using a different program next year to give her a good, solid foundation to work off of. Goood luck!

[HiddenJewel]

It can be taken if the student is ready. My dd was not ready for the abstract concepts in 6th grade. We hit a complete stone wall.

[Reya]

Here's what I'm doing:

 

Algebra counts for high school NO MATTER when it's done. I count it for credit, but I am not going to count it in the GPA at this point. I'll start counting things later--whenever I decide he's mature enough.

 

There are multiple ways of doing this. Some states, in public school, require that all classes taken before high school that are high school level be given credit AND count in the GPA. Other states require that NO credit of any type be given, in public school, for classes completed before high school and that all math requirements for graduation be completed in high school. This, to me, is stupid.

 

If she's only one grade ahead, I'd count both grade and credit for high school, if she's mature enough. If she isn't, then I'd do just credit but would make sure she got 4 credits of math with GPA counted for high school.

 

Even if I granted no credit at all, I'd list it on the transcript, just to be extra sure the admissions officers knew about it.

[Reya]

Just because a student is 'ahead' in elementary math does NOT mean that they are mature enough to progress to the abstract thinking (logic) required in the Algebras.

 

Trying not to be tacky, BUT...

 

If the elementary program is halfway decent, a child will be well prepared for algebra no matter what their age by the time they reach algebra because they would have been doing algebraic thinking for a LONG time but haven't put a name to it. If they couldn't do it, they would have gotten bogged down long before.

 

The "leap" to algebra occurs only in very poor curricula.