When will you feel safe going out again?

[JennyD]

1 hour ago, happypamama said:

I think I will feel safe when the number of new cases is dropping/has dropped, and when the doctors and hospitals are back to their normal routines of appointments, visitors, etc., or when they decide that things are back to normal and that they like the general precautions and are sticking to them. (If they all decide that stricter limits on visitors and more telemedicine is a good thing, then fine.)  

 

This is pretty much where I am, too.  

1 hour ago, SKL said:

Not today, but once this disease passes its peak and there are no shortages like today, it won't be different from how this country was before Coronavirus this year.  Lots of kids spreading flu, strep, and other things at a higher rate than normal.  Some schools even temporarily closed because of it.  Flu kills tens of thousands (including vaccinated people) even in a good year.  And we will have and have had other bad viruses worse than the average flu, and for which there were no vaccines.  So I am trying to get a feel for what is triggering this zero tolerance attitude for this particular virus.

Panic is triggering a lot of it.  I have zero intention of running out to get some rushed to market vaccine for covid.   We need more regulation/consumer protection in that area, not less.  I will feel comfortable going out with reasonable precautions (keeping space, avoiding big crowds, washing hands, staying home when sick) once the hospitals get their equipment and things taper down a bit.  I am comfortable with my husband going back to work.  He doesn’t have a ton of contact with others.  I hope that virtual meetings will continue to be the norm when this dies down as it just makes sense...Same with telemedicine.  I hate going to doctor visits in the winter with the kids because someone *always* ends up sick.  I also hope public peer pressure to stay home when sick will stick around even though covid spread isn’t driven by visible symptoms.  I remember sitting next to a middle school principal and a couple of teachers/school secretaries at a scrapbooking weekend and being absolutely appalled at the cavalier way they talked about sending their kids to school even when sick and giving them Tylenol to bring their fever down before school like it was no big deal.  I will probably drop our homeschool choir next year as that place is filled with people who bring the whole family for the afternoon regardless of how they are feeling. They also have this massive bring finger food reception after concerts that is just a cesspool of germs with kids grabbing food with grubby fingers. I have been sick more frequently because of that place this winter than ever in my lifetime. 

[SKL]

1 hour ago, Happymomof1 said:

 It has nothing to do with news that I do not watch.  But my husband is in healthcare and healthcare was not concerned about those things.  The risks were manageable.  The risks ARE NOT manageable right now.  I already said that i would be ok if there is treatment, testing to see if you have antibodies or a vaccine.   That makes it maneagable.  Maybe, I'm just lucky but in our area flu is not a big deal other than missing work.  Again, my husband is in healthcare.  Not a big deal to him.  This virus is a big deal because of contagion and the much higher seriousness of getting it.  Our friends are docs and nurses.  They are concerned about this virus.  THAT is what makes it different in my world.  They are NOT concerned about the flu. For example, our good friend and our family doc treats people with the flu all the time.  Doesn't scare him.  This virus does. 

Well if you are OK without a vax, then you are not answering the question I asked.

Also ... I think what I'm hearing here is that you are scared because you are getting an unusual scared vibe from others whose opinion you respect.  Does your husband think this will still be horrifying after the peak?  Or is his scared vibe more just about this moment in time?  I can understand that btw.

[Penguin]

Never?

For reference, I am an extrovert who adores big city life, and I am a fairly fearless traveler.   At the moment, I hope I don't develop agoraphobia. 

I sincerely hope that I can find my way back to myself at some point. I think I will even though I can't yet see the path. Life has knocked me down pretty hard before. 

[SKL]

Yeah, on one hand I think some of these "careful when sick" practices are good for the long term, and on the other hand I worry that that will chip away at natural immunity building that most of us need to do.  Guess the community could use a refresher in how to build up immunity without making things worse.

[SKL]

1 minute ago, Happymomof1 said:

He isn't sure right now.  That is why this question is hard for me to answer.  I will feel safe when it is safe to treat, not dangerous to get, or I have proof that I am immune or can get a vacc.  Flu is treatable in my opinion.  I do not worry about dying from it.  There are so many unanswered questions for him.  I think he and everyone else will be wary until we relax some of the requirements and then we DO NOT get another spike.  If we do, then I still say  we will not feel safe until we know if we are immune, have a way to treat it, and/or get a vaccine.  

I don't worry about the flu for me or my kids, but I do worry about my parents being exposed to it.  I'm not saying there should be a general community panic about it, but it is interesting to me that so many people consider the flu basically a nothing as long as there are hospital beds.

[Pawz4me]

1 hour ago, SKL said:

The reason you "don't know" about these things is because they are not considered a big deal in the USA i.e. the news does not report them.  The news doesn't report on any of the biggest causes of death in the USA.  When was the last time you heard the news report daily death statistics on cancer, heart attack, pneumonia, flu, car accidents, or suicide?

 

One of our local TV stations reports on flu deaths regularly during flu season. Always has. Ditto the local newspapers. I'm puzzled that you think no one does. I suspect you just haven't been paying attention. Likewise, I regularly see and read reports about cancer deaths, auto accidents, deaths from heart disease and gun related deaths, etc.

I've posted this before but I'll post it again--I truly wonder where some of y'all get your news.

[Innisfree]

1 hour ago, SKL said:

Yes I know this virus is different, but it will peak and the overwhelm will be a thing of the past.

The reasons this particular virus is dangerous, apart from the overwhelmed hospitals, are the same reasons it has become a pandemic.

1. It is quite contagious.

2. It is novel, so none of us has immunity, which reinforces the contagion.

And, of course, it is deadly to a significant, though presently not exactly certain, percentage of the population. Many of us fall within these groups, or at a minimum care about others who do.

These seem like excellent reasons for anyone to be sensibly, rationally, intelligently concerned about contracting the virus, even after the peak of infection passes in their area.

I am perplexed by the minimizing.

[Wheres Toto]

At this point, I trust my local politicians to not release lock-downs until it is safe to do so and the hospitals aren't likely to be overwhelmed anymore.   So, that's probably when I would feel okay resuming most normal activities.    I run a business that teaches live classes to homeschoolers so that is what resuming my normal activities would look like.   My classes are small and a ton of handwashing and cleaning goes on because they are messy.   If schools open up again in September, it's likely I will open up again as well. 

[BlsdMama]

I really wonder this same thing and have no answers....

The email went out today that said they were still hoping to hold a graduation celebration.  They said it normally has approximately 800 people there.  I can't imagine missing! (I have a senior.) On the other hand? I can't imagine going.

[mathnerd]

58 minutes ago, SKL said:

Yeah, on one hand I think some of these "careful when sick" practices are good for the long term, and on the other hand I worry that that will chip away at natural immunity building that most of us need to do.  Guess the community could use a refresher in how to build up immunity without making things worse.

This virus is called "Novel Coronavirus" because this virus is "novel" to the human immune system. Unpredictable deaths of people (healthy & young) who have contracted it are happening. All the hand washing and not touching face and using distancing is only going to minimize the spread of this virus and not stop it because it is extremely contagious (far more contagious than the normal flu). Since this is an unprecedented virus, the old refresher courses on how to build up immunity might actually not fit. Public health officials are asking us to wash hands, stay at home and not touch our faces because those are the things that can be done by us at this point. 

You are being optimistic about deaths peaking when you repeatedly say it on this thread. The deaths have peaked in Wuhan so far - but, china lies all the time and is unreliable and they are a communist country who could easily lock down a province without political consequences. Try that with Americans who think that they should be on Spring Break and that Covid-19 is just the flu and we can kick it off in 2 days (I have some elderly people in my life who literally say that).

[Frances]

3 hours ago, SKL said:

You don't know of the flu being very widespread, but 10-50% of the population get symptomatic cases every year, and that doesn't include people who aren't considered sick but are either asymptomatic or carriers.  You don't know of health care workers getting it, but they certainly do.

The reason you "don't know" about these things is because they are not considered a big deal in the USA i.e. the news does not report them.  The news doesn't report on any of the biggest causes of death in the USA.  When was the last time you heard the news report daily death statistics on cancer, heart attack, pneumonia, flu, car accidents, or suicide?

Yes I know this virus is different, but it will peak and the overwhelm will be a thing of the past.

Unknowns can be scary, yes.  Maybe this incident is reminding people about unknowns that they had taught themselves to ignore up until now.

I would disagree about these other things not being reported.  During flu season, especially a bad one, I regularly see news stories about cases, deaths, etc., the strains, how good of a match the vaccine is, encouraging vaccination, etc. Ditto other causes of death, especially state comparisons. For example, my state ranks high on suicide and overdoses, so I fairly regularly see news stories about this.

[SKL]

40 minutes ago, mathnerd said:

This virus is called "Novel Coronavirus" because this virus is "novel" to the human immune system. Unpredictable deaths of people (healthy & young) who have contracted it are happening. All the hand washing and not touching face and using distancing is only going to minimize the spread of this virus and not stop it because it is extremely contagious (far more contagious than the normal flu). Since this is an unprecedented virus, the old refresher courses on how to build up immunity might actually not fit. Public health officials are asking us to wash hands, stay at home and not touch our faces because those are the things that can be done by us at this point. 

You are being optimistic about deaths peaking when you repeatedly say it on this thread. The deaths have peaked in Wuhan so far - but, china lies all the time and is unreliable and they are a communist country who could easily lock down a province without political consequences. Try that with Americans who think that they should be on Spring Break and that Covid-19 is just the flu and we can kick it off in 2 days (I have some elderly people in my life who literally say that).

1) My comment about building up immunity was in general outside of the coronavirus.  It was in relation to people saying they hope this crisis will teach people to be extra careful around germs going forward.

2) Do you not think the current situation will peak?

[J-rap]

3 hours ago, Joker said:

But our hospitals don't become completely overwhelmed with every new virus, and not even with the flu during bad years. This one is different.

I absolutely agree with this.  But at some point, when enough people have had it and it has mostly moved on, there still might not be a vaccination.  Of course there's a good chance that it will come back around again, but hopefully it'll have a harder time finding people because of herd immunity.  It will still find people.  By then though, hospitals will hopefully be back to normal and the number of people needing to be hospitalized due to coronavirus will probably (hopefully) be much, much smaller.  

 

Edited March 27, 2020 by J-rap

[mathnerd]

24 minutes ago, SKL said:

1) My comment about building up immunity was in general outside of the coronavirus.  It was in relation to people saying they hope this crisis will teach people to be extra careful around germs going forward.

2) Do you not think the current situation will peak?

For your #1 comment, I agree that people are already practicing more personal hygiene than before due to this virus.

As for #2: the mathematical models of this situation show explosive increases in number of cases on a day-to-day basis. The current situation will peak only if we all sit indoors for 3 months and never venture out. After that, if we go back to normal ways, there will be another massive wave of infection in the Fall and this whole situation will repeat. Without solutions, this infection is going to repeat in cyclical waves and there are going to be waves of deaths. Right now, I am unable to visualize all schoolrooms modified to allow kids to sit 6 feet apart, huge companies with workers sitting 6 ft away (silicon valley companies have open floor plans as a way to enhance team work where everyone is in the same open space), public transportation incorporating social distancing, people ridesharing and not getting infected etc. What we need is a reliable vaccine and reliable medication and billions of dollars worth of medical infrastructure to support our society so that we can get a grip on this virus. Until then, my personal belief is that the situation will not go away completely.