Pre-Algebra or Algebra for my rising 7th grader?

[J&JMom]

I have some time before we start in August as we just finished last week, but I am waffling on my math decision which impacts what we do this summer.  While we are not 'year round' homeschoolers, we do a little bit of review over the season so as not to lose too much by the fall. 

The decision:  Pre-Algebra or Algebra 1 for 7th grade

Background:

 Homeschooled since 5th grade.

Took regular 5th grade math (Pearson Envision) and did well.  ITBS math total 82%ile.  Took a publisher placement test and scored for 7th grade.

This past year worked through Glencoe Mathematics Course 2 with little trouble.  ITBS math total 88%  [concepts 95%ile problem solving 92%ile, computation 80%ile]. Took publisher placement test and scored for Algebra 1 by a good margin.

Concern:  He still has issues with long division, remembering how to divide fractions, and has had limited exposure to exponents (operations with).  I don't know if these are big enough gaps to warrant a complete pre-algebra review, or rather, should he solidify these concepts over the summer and press on with Algebra.

My husband is all for Algebra, but I don't want to stress my son out if he struggles. He is up for the challenge, and I told him there is nothing wrong with switching to pre-algebra if it gets too much (though looking at the first few chapters of the Algebra 1 book, I shouldn't be).

Thanks in advance for reading and helping me out.

 

[Farrar]

I think I'd do pre-algebra in that case. You could also accelerate him through if it was easy. Or, alternately, you could do a program that's going to be more in depth and difficult like AoPS. Or you could do a program that will be potentially less time consuming so you could move to algebra sooner like Jousting Armadillos.

[wapiti]

:iagree:

 

I would not move on to algebra without shoring up any weaknesses in long division, exponents and especially fractions, first.  It makes no sense to rush into algebra in 7th (7th is relatively early) until fractions are rock solid.

 

There are many ways to do this.  From what you've described, I'd probably want to go through a prealgebra text, using chapter reviews in areas that he already knows and whole chapters in weak spots.  It wouldn't necessarily have to take a whole school year and might even be fairly quick.  It depends on how it goes.

[OneStepAtATime]

Agree with the above posts.  Do Pre-Algebra. 

[Julie of KY]

Agree. Make sure fractions are rock solid. Exponents are often taught early in algebra so he can finish learning there. I'm a little more split on whether or not long division should be solid - if it's a matter of just needing more practice, do it and then you're good to go. On the other hand, my dyslexic daughter has major trouble with the procedures of long division though she certainly understands it. She will start algebra without being able to do  formal long division as well as most, but can manipulate numbers well.

[jennynd]

He needs to be very solid on basic operation before algebra. Or you will see sloppy mistake all over tha places. I will say pre A also

[SebastianCat]

Pre-Algebra for sure.   I found that parenting a hormonal 7th grade boy and being his math teacher for pre-Algebra was hard enough this past year.   Trying to push math just a little bit beyond his level of mastery would have been too much.

[SilverMoon]

Prealg.

 

DD/10th and I have been tutoring a friend's DC who was failing algebra in public school. We spotted his inability to work with fractions the first week. He had to go back to square one with just fractions and move forward from there. You want fractions to be as automatic as adding before you throw them into algebra.

[Mandylubug]

I would do pre-algebra. That is where my boys are at now. I have always heard to just make sure you can be at Algebra 1 by 9th year. Am I misinformed on the ideal time/schedule?

[ondreeuh]

Another vote for pre-algebra. My son did course 2 last year and will do course 3 next year (in 8th). He is pretty solid in computation including fractions and decimals, but he is a little weak in remembering how to find the rate of change, find percent off, calculate simple interest, use scale models, and other types of application problems where he has to remember how to set up the problems. I am in no hurry to rush to Algebra 1.

[go_go_gadget]

I think I'd do pre-algebra in that case. You could also accelerate him through if it was easy. Or, alternately, you could do a program that's going to be more in depth and difficult like AoPS. Or you could do a program that will be potentially less time consuming so you could move to algebra sooner like Jousting Armadillos.

This is what I was going to say. AoPS covers topics not covered in all Pre-A programs, and covers typical topics in much greater depth, so it wouldn't be a waste of time. He would get quite a bit of long division in the third chapter, and rock-solid fractions in the fourth.

[dereksurfs]

I agree with doing a Pre-A that is more challenging that also contains a wider scope than most.  TabletClass Pre-A is a good one which covers many algebraic topics early on, similar to AoPS.  ds13 wasn't ready for AoPS at that stage.  But TC prepared him well for AoPS Intro to Algebra.  I would look for something along these lines. 

 

One more thing to keep in mind.  There is absolutely nothing wrong with using more than 'one' curriculum at a time when homeschooling.  You have full freedom to tailor the program to his unique skills and abilities as well as areas which need strengthening.  So you could potentially do a challenging Pre-A or Algebra course, for example, 4 days a week.  Then spend one day a week working on fractions review and practice.  It could be split any way which works best (3 days/2days, etc...).  We actually finished elementary math 4 days a week while starting Pre-A once a week.  That gave my very curious son something a bit more interesting to sink his teeth into while completing the drudgery of primary mathematics.  It worked very well for his learning style and personality which is always interested in what's next.

[J&JMom]

Thanks to everyone who replied.  Pre-Algebra is the way to go. My son is disappointed though. His best friend, a G&T private schooler going into the sixth grade, is taking pre-algebra next year. I think my son feels a little left behind, no matter how much I tell him he is ahead of the game as it is. His younger brother is on track for 9th-grade algebra which, as I understand it, is the norm.  Plus, he wants to get into programming (he already does some), but we think he should hold off on Java, etc al. until algebra.  So, we will work on some holes over the summer and dive into Pre-algebra in the fall.

Now, the next question is - which program? AoPS looks interesting because it can cover the topics with more depth. His textbook this past year, did lots of hands-on, discovery math stuff which he loved. But I like the support my current program gives me, not to mention the cost - $15 for both TE & Student used editions, with free online videos, testing, workbooks, etc. Decisions, decisions. :)

Thanks again!

[Saddlemomma]

Our DD has been homeschooled since day 1 and is going into 7th grade.  Although we don't homeschool year round, she does have a reading list to get through, a summer project, and we have her continue with math on a more relaxed basis. 

 

While I think DD could go right into Algebra next fall, I know it wouldn't be the right decision for her. DD absolutely hates math.  She gets good grades, A's and B's , but really doesn't enjoy it.  Actually, to hear her explain it--it's the bane of her existence!  So many times she tries to rush through it and, consequently, makes some really silly mistakes.  She knows this and gets really upset when she does it. 

 

Therefore, over each summer, we review the concepts learned over the year, practice them, and dip our toes into the next year's work.  For this summer, I purchased Math Essentials Pre-Algebra from the Build Your Bundle Sale that was held recently. (I also got the Geometry for next summer!)  DD will start working in that workbook next week. (We like to give her the first two weeks off after finishing the year.) Math Essentials concentrates on cementing those concepts necessary for a successful understanding of Algebra. 

 

Right now, we have planned for DD to do Pre-Algebra through Tablet Class next fall.  She has been doing Horizons Math (a spiral math) since K.  I have Horizons Pre-Algebra ready to go, but DH and I felt it's time for her to begin getting instruction from a real math teacher.  The one weakness with Horizons is that as you get into the higher levels, the teacher's manuals are not as good, making it extremely difficult for a parent to teach.  I got straight A's in Algebra, but that was over 34 years ago -- a long time.  As an engineer, DH (who usually teaches DD math) works more with Geometry, decimals, and fractions. With Tablet Class, she'll be able to review each lesson as many times as she needs, plus she'll have a different instructor for a change (a real math instructor).  We can supplement with Horizons if necessary.

 

So, in our case, we want DD to have an extremely firm foundation in the fundamentals before moving her into the more challenging maths because she becomes frustrated easily and really doesn't enjoy it.   It all depends upon how your son handles math, whether he likes it or not, and how adept he is with it.  Each child is different.

 

 

[go_go_gadget]

Plus, he wants to get into programming (he already does some), but we think he should hold off on Java, etc al. until algebra.  

 

My husband and I have many years of coding between us, and neither of us can think of a reason to make algebra a pre or co-requisite for Java, unless his Pre-A didn't do any work with variables.

[SilverMoon]

My rising 5th and 7th graders have both been going nutters on learning Python this spring/summer. The older one is using AoPS prealg and the younger one will start it this fall. Their math level hasn't affected their ability to be addicted to programming games one iota. LOL

[mom31257]

Pre-algebra. As a person with a math degree and a tutor, I would never recommend Algebra 1 that young except for the most truly gifted math students. A girl I tutored last fall was struggling in Precalclus. Her parents had sent her to a private school and insisted she start algebra 1 early. I was appalled at her math skills.

 

My own dd scored higher than yours on standardized tests, but I covered prealgebra thoroughly in 7th and 8th grades. She did algebra 1, geometry, and algebra 2 before taking the ACT. She scored high enough to be exempt from all core math requirements at her college.

 

It's best to go into algebra 1 very well grounded in basic mathematics.

[Alte Veste Academy]

Thanks to everyone who replied. Pre-Algebra is the way to go. My son is disappointed though. His best friend, a G&T private schooler going into the sixth grade, is taking pre-algebra next year. I think my son feels a little left behind, no matter how much I tell him he is ahead of the game as it is. His younger brother is on track for 9th-grade algebra which, as I understand it, is the norm. Plus, he wants to get into programming (he already does some), but we think he should hold off on Java, etc al. until algebra. So, we will work on some holes over the summer and dive into Pre-algebra in the fall.

 

Now, the next question is - which program? AoPS looks interesting because it can cover the topics with more depth. His textbook this past year, did lots of hands-on, discovery math stuff which he loved. But I like the support my current program gives me, not to mention the cost - $15 for both TE & Student used editions, with free online videos, testing, workbooks, etc. Decisions, decisions. :)

Thanks again!

I agree with the other posters about letting him start programming, including Java, now. No reason to wait.

 

Based on his high problem solving scores, I would definitely recommend AoPS. It will nurture that in him (as will programming!), and I bet dollars to donuts that it is a superior prealgebra to the one his younger friend will be using, so it can help salve that injury to his pride, maybe. It's not $15, LOL, but I think AoPS is incredibly reasonably well priced for what you get. You can use your current program to supplement since it's such a bargain and you already know you like it.

[Julie of KY]

Thanks to everyone who replied.  Pre-Algebra is the way to go. My son is disappointed though. His best friend, a G&T private schooler going into the sixth grade, is taking pre-algebra next year. I think my son feels a little left behind...

 

There is nothing that says one "year" of math needs to be done in one schoolyear. I'd tell him if he works hard, that he can finish prealgebra quickly and then move on to algebra. There are kids that can move through multiple "years" of math in one schoolyear if motivated. Just make sure the understanding is there before moving on.

[FairProspects]

I have a kid working on Java that is still also reviewing fraction operations. I agree that you don't need to wait.

[BusyMom5]

I have been in the same spot, a PS until 5th grade child, always top student, pulled to HS and she placed in Pre-Al in 6th grade.  We did it, and she is doing great, but the maturity to work longer problems is not there.  I do not want math to be a contention point, she's already ahead, so waiting won't put her behind.  After a lot of thought, we are doing another year of Pre-Algebra, hoping to gain fluency.  She's all for it when I explained that in Algebra 1, the problems just get longer and longer.  Math should take an hour+ per day, and she isn't ready for that commitment yet.  I told her that the purpose isn't to necessarily learn how to do new things, which may make it a bit boring, but to gain fluency, just like when she learned to read.  Gaining fluency NOW will help with speed later. 

 

PS, I am glad to hear so many others agree w/ sticking w/ PreAlgebra!  I've felt sort of bad for making the decision, like I may be holding my child back, but I know it's the right choice.  Best of luck!

[J&JMom]

OP here.  Thanks for the replies!  

1) Caved and received AoPS Pre Algebra in the mail today.  It appears to have great resale value so I'll see if we can make it work.

2) The thought of spending an hour+ on math is frightening as our classes to date have been 20 -40 minutes - tops.  Daily lessons is review quiz (5 problems), teach new concept by working several problems together, a few problems on his own for me to check, and if he "gets it",  no homework. He gets concepts quickly and that works for me as I need to spend more time with younger son. I guess I'll prepare myself as AoPS looks to be time-consuming...

3) We are looking at Youth Digital Minecraft Mod class to satisfy his programming needs. Is this a good course?  HSBC offers it for $150 often. 

[JadeOrchidSong]

Ds used AOPS Prealgebra for two chapters and we gave up. We went with Dolciani Prealgebra followed by Jacobs Elementary algebra. Now 2/3 done with Jacobs, we are starting Teaching Textbook Algebra 1 for him to understand better and build a good foundation.

Both ds liked Youth Digital and dh worked with them.

[linders]

If he is struggling a bit with basics like long division and operations with fractions, I would do pre-algebra. Basic math should be solid before starting Algebra, and he might not be quite ready for it. You can always accelerate through those parts of pre-A that are easy for him.

[...................]

Sounds to me like he should do pre-algebra, because those concepts are pretty important. However, you can choose a pre-algebra that's really strong and incorporates a lot of Algebra early on.  Saxon Alg 1/2 is what I used for just that purpose.