Not saying something vs lying

[creekland]

Bored today - so starting a thread (spin off thread) on this topic mainly because my brain has been playing with it in its boredom.  Now it wants playmates.   ;)

 

On this thread:

 

http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/539476-why-not-to-lie-about-not-wanting-to-go-somewhere/

 

the idea came up that not saying something (or giving a reason, etc) is a form of lying about the subject (any subject - not just that one).

 

Is it?

 

I know I'm often "guilty" at not saying something in various settings.  The vast majority of the time I don't see it as lying.  It might not be telling the whole truth, but it's not the same as lying.

 

It'd be lying in certain situations - like not declaring all of your income for taxes or if you answer "yes" to the question of "is that all you know" about an incident or situation when it's not.

 

But if you don't answer the question?  Or if others involved aren't even aware of something?  Is one lying if they don't share all they know?

 

"Do you know why Sally doesn't want to go to the party?" (and you do know, of course).  Is "redirecting" by totally changing the train of thought lying?  "I know the party is on Friday night and Susie, Jennifer, Frida, Claudia, and Amber are really looking forward to going.  They were talking about it... etc, etc, etc"

 

You didn't answer the original question one way or another (on purpose) - the conversation moved on (you directed it that way).  Is that the same as lying?

 

What about "Don't ask, don't tell? (not meaning military).  If there are policies on paper that you don't follow to the letter, but don't tell anyone, is that lying?  It is if they ask and you claim to follow things, of course, but what if the topic never comes up?  Is one supposed to tell in order to avoid lying?  (Whether one should be doing the things in question or not is a different topic.)

 

It's been an interesting brain exercise with oodles of possibilities/situations to think about, but my brain is getting tired of playing alone.

 

Wanna add thoughts?

 

 

[bettyandbob]

Sometimes it is better to be kind than honest.

 

I do believe omission can be a form of lying. I don't believe it always wrong.

 

It is not wrong to tell someone you like the tulips when commenting on her flower arrangement, but leave out that the arrangement itself is awful. It is wrong for my dc to leave out an essential fact about an activity, knowing that I would not give permission if I knew the fact.

[Night Elf]

There are probably things my DH doesn't know that I did/said in the 26 years before I met him. I don't purposefully keep secrets but am I lying if I just don't reveal something? I don't think so. Now, if he asked me outright and I gave the wrong answer, that's lying. But if he asks outright and I don't want to talk about it, I would just say so and I don't think that's lying either. That's just not telling everything I know. So I don't see not saying something as always lying.

 

I tried smoking when I was 12 years old. My mom doesn't know about that. She's never asked and I've never told. That's not lying. That's just not divulging everything I know.

 

Not declaring income for taxes is definitely lying. You're asked specifically to list all income. When you knowingly list only part of it, that's not holding back info that is no one's business, that's outright lying, IMHO.

[DawnM]

I think there are always ways out that aren't lying, but sometimes I don't think of them in the moment.

 

Last thread......child (or parent) doesn't want to see a play put on by a child she doesn't know.  "Sara  had really hoped to spend time playing directly with June.  Could we reschedule so that time can be more quality?"

 

Given your situation, "I know some of the reason Sally doesn't want to go, but I am not sure of all the details, to get an accurate picture, you really need to ask her directly."

 

However, given the above scenarios, NEITHER person should have put you in that position in the first place and I stand firmly by that....

 

But I still wouldn't be very direct because I think it is rude.  And I wouldn't lie because I think it is rude.  So it is a non-win either way.

[Catherine]

I think you could probably spend hours coming up with situations to consider, Creekland! 

 

I think lies of omission ARE lies, but I think they don't always "matter" and are not always wrong.  For instance, in social situations, neglecting to say the real reason you are declining an invite is not always wrong.  Though to be honest I try to always be as honest and courageous as possible in social situations-I don't always succeed.

 

For instance: we recently visited my parents, all 5 of us (I have YA kids) and decided at the last minute for my hubby and kids not to stay at their house as they always have.  Two of them were sick with respiratory infections, and my mother is frail medically right now-long story-she has a tracheostomy and is on oxygen.  Really, the last thing she needs is to catch a cold.  So they visited daily, avoided touching Mom, and stayed elsewhere.  The whole truth is that my parents' house is small and very cluttered and there are not beds for everyone so the kids have to sleep on the couch or floor.  So they were happy to be able to go to a hotel with a real bed at night.  But my mom was very angry and sad that we "rejected" them in this way.  Would it have been better, more honest, for me to confirm to her that the rest of my family does not love to sleep on their cold floor?  Or to simply say that we were trying to avoid infecting them?  In fact the latter is the real and true reason they did not stay there.  I just don't see how complete honesty serves any higher good in this case. 

 

Then again, lies of omission really can be wrong.  At work, I oversee the admissions to the hospital and tally and assign them to the oncoming docs in the morning.  There are a limited number of patients per doc and we have both a large written board and electronic lists (backup) of which patients are assigned to which doc.  More than once, I've discovered that docs have failed, for more than one day, to remove people from their lists when they are actually gone from the hospital. Lazy, dishonest, yes.  But the far bigger issue is that when the hospital is very busy and full, a filled slot may mean grandma spends 3 more hours in the emergency room awaiting a bed.  Not to mention the shift of work off oneself onto others who are similarly tired and busy. So IMO such a lie of omission as real consequences that can cause real harm to others. 

 

At the end of the day I think it's important to consider every situation independently.  Adults should be capable of thinking about all the gray areas of a given situation, not just following simple rules of behavior.  Of course avoiding lies is usually best for any number of reasons, but there are definitely social situations, and even real life situations, where complete honesty serves no higher purpose and can be harmful. 

 

As an aside, I recently listened to a funny book while driving called the Guinea Pig Diaries, renamed My Life as an Experiment, by A. J. Jacobs, who also wrote The Year of Living Biblically.  One of the experiments Jacobs does is to embrace "radical honesty" for a few months and report on the result.  He turns down invites for the real, honest, insulting reasons, and the results are hilarious. 

[DawnM]

 

 

Then again, lies of omission really can be wrong.  At work, I oversee the admissions to the hospital and tally and assign them to the oncoming docs in the morning.  There are a limited number of patients per doc and we have both a large written board and electronic lists (backup) of which patients are assigned to which doc.  More than once, I've discovered that docs have failed, for more than one day, to remove people from their lists when they are actually gone from the hospital. Lazy, dishonest, yes.  But the far bigger issue is that when the hospital is very busy and full, a filled slot may mean grandma spends 3 more hours in the emergency room awaiting a bed.  Not to mention the shift of work off oneself onto others who are similarly tired and busy. So IMO such a lie of omission as real consequences that can cause real harm to others. 

 

 

Definitely in a work situation, my answers would be different.  I was only answering for personal situations.

[creekland]

I think you could probably spend hours coming up with situations to consider, Creekland! 

 

 

That's my plan for the day!  Tomorrow life returns to normal and should move at the more rapid pace (or at least multiple other distractions) I'm used to for a bit thereafter.

 

I still don't see your mom's situation as lying.  Not telling the whole truth isn't the same as lying to me.  What you did say was truth.  I don't think one needs ALL the details to be truth.

 

The work situation would be lying I think.  There are different assumptions to that one.  By leaving names up it's pretty akin to a statement made.  It's just written rather than spoken with the ongoing question being "Is the room/bed occupied?"

[creekland]

Definitely in a work situation, my answers would be different.  I was only answering for personal situations.

 

Work situations differ too.  I wrote my thoughts about the hospital deal, but for a more mundane example from the school where I work...

 

We're supposed to say the Pledge of Allegiance every single morning.  Most mornings, we do.  It's part of life.  But there are days where I KNOW (or seriously think) I'm going to be rushed for time, so purposely skip it even though we get a verbal reminder every single morning to do it (via the PA system).  There's no forgetting involved.  It's a purposeful decision based upon the day.

 

Perhaps my action is wrong due to school policy, but that doesn't bother me.  Rules/laws I disagree with I don't always follow.  We say the Pledge most mornings because I feel if I made the choice to work in the school I will follow their policies in general.  But on days where I think there's a conflict - always a time issue - I skip it.

 

If anyone were to ask, I'd be honest.  No one asks.  Am I "lying" because I don't report it to someone?  Even if I were to report it, I seriously doubt anyone would care.  It's too minor.

[DawnM]

Work situations differ too.  I wrote my thoughts about the hospital deal, but for a more mundane example from the school where I work...

 

We're supposed to say the Pledge of Allegiance every single morning.  Most mornings, we do.  It's part of life.  But there are days where I KNOW (or seriously think) I'm going to be rushed for time, so purposely skip it even though we get a verbal reminder every single morning to do it (via the PA system).  There's no forgetting involved.  It's a purposeful decision based upon the day.

 

Perhaps my action is wrong due to school policy, but that doesn't bother me.  Rules/laws I disagree with I don't always follow.  We say the Pledge most mornings because I feel if I made the choice to work in the school I will follow their policies in general.  But on days where I think there's a conflict - always a time issue - I skip it.

 

If anyone were to ask, I'd be honest.  No one asks.  Am I "lying" because I don't report it to someone?  Even if I were to report it, I seriously doubt anyone would care.  It's too minor.

 

 

Our school did the pledge OVER the PA during homeroom, no getting out of it.   

 

Yeah, I see your point.  We did our fair share of that sort of "lying" but honestly, some of it was encouraged.  We had 10 "sick" days per year.  We had no personal days offered.  The administration knew this and told us to call it a "mental health" day, aka: sick day.  They were fine with it.  Was it technically a lie?  Yeah, probably.

 

There were also teacher work days that were just ridiculous.  We were in a year round school, so when I was a teacher, we had no access to our rooms yet.  There was not much we could do.  So we signed in, went to the am 2 hour meeting, and bolted out the back door and drove home.  The admin even said, "Now you need to go to your ROOMS" with a huge wink, wink, and a hearty laugh because they knew we had no room to go to.

 

Once I became a counselor, my office was free, so I had to stay, but that was fine, counselors actually worked a few weeks longer per track to get things done, and we got paid extra for it.

[Chris in VA]

CC

 

I agree that sometimes, divulging all the reasons for something is not necessary. I don't think that is a lie by omission.

 

BUT

 

If my intention is to be disingenuous, then the Holy Spirit usually convicts me. There's usually a kind way to state something that is not a lie, and not an omission. When faced with a situation where something difficult would be the truth, it sometimes points to a deeper discussion that should happen. That's the rough part of relationship. I believe God often wants us to go deep with each other, and live in the light; sometimes we need to discuss hard things and be real and not "surface-y," which may involve character development on our part (not being as sensitive, for example, or not wanting to be liked by others as our highest value).

 

Not always, just throwing that out there.

[JFSinIL]

Well, when my BIL is over for a holiday meal, no one here except hubby can sit next to him.  The (now adult) kids and I can not stand to hear him chew loudly with his mouth open - all of my in-laws EXCEPT hubby did/do this.  We have told BIL that since he is the oldest he gets head of the table (FIL has passed on, hubby is one of the middle "kids").  This way no one is right next to him except hubby.

 

Now, BIL confided in me that he did not feel right taking head of the table in his brother's house.  I countered that the seating was all done to accommodate my adult son with autism, who if hubby was at head of table would not even come out of his room (true).

 

Should I have instead told the real truth, that his eating habits are very gross and most of us can not stand to be near him? He is almost 60 years old, he isn't going to change, and it would only make him feel bad (or insulted).  Sometimes white lies or avoiding the truth is the better course of action!

[DawnM]

CC

 

I agree that sometimes, divulging all the reasons for something is not necessary. I don't think that is a lie by omission.

 

BUT

 

If my intention is to be disingenuous, then the Holy Spirit usually convicts me. There's usually a kind way to state something that is not a lie, and not an omission. When faced with a situation where something difficult would be the truth, it sometimes points to a deeper discussion that should happen. That's the rough part of relationship. I believe God often wants us to go deep with each other, and live in the light; sometimes we need to discuss hard things and be real and not "surface-y," which may involve character development on our part (not being as sensitive, for example, or not wanting to be liked by others as our highest value).

 

Not always, just throwing that out there.

 

 

I think that depends greatly on the relationship you have with the person and how receptive that person is to hearing it.

 

There are some people (I am thinking of a personal situation here) who think it is THEIR job to "fix" everyone else when the log is glaring in their own eyes.  They firmly believe God is telling them to fix everyone else and that God has already fixed all of their issues.  

 

It is a nightmare to deal with.

[Ellie]

Well, when my BIL is over for a holiday meal, no one here except hubby can sit next to him.  The (now adult) kids and I can not stand to hear him chew loudly with his mouth open - all of my in-laws EXCEPT hubby did/do this.  We have told BIL that since he is the oldest he gets head of the table (FIL has passed on, hubby is one of the middle "kids").  This way no one is right next to him except hubby.

 

Now, BIL confided in me that he did not feel right taking head of the table in his brother's house.  I countered that the seating was all done to accommodate my adult son with autism, who if hubby was at head of table would not even come out of his room (true).

 

Should I have instead told the real truth, that his eating habits are very gross and most of us can not stand to be near him? He is almost 60 years old, he isn't going to change, and it would only make him feel bad (or insulted).  Sometimes white lies or avoiding the truth is the better course of action!

 

I wouldn't fault you. :-) You came up with a perfectly good solution to a problem I *totally* agree with you about!

[Ellie]

Work situations differ too.  I wrote my thoughts about the hospital deal, but for a more mundane example from the school where I work...

 

We're supposed to say the Pledge of Allegiance every single morning.  Most mornings, we do.  It's part of life.  But there are days where I KNOW (or seriously think) I'm going to be rushed for time, so purposely skip it even though we get a verbal reminder every single morning to do it (via the PA system).  There's no forgetting involved.  It's a purposeful decision based upon the day.

 

Perhaps my action is wrong due to school policy, but that doesn't bother me.  Rules/laws I disagree with I don't always follow.  We say the Pledge most mornings because I feel if I made the choice to work in the school I will follow their policies in general.  But on days where I think there's a conflict - always a time issue - I skip it.

 

If anyone were to ask, I'd be honest.  No one asks.  Am I "lying" because I don't report it to someone?  Even if I were to report it, I seriously doubt anyone would care.  It's too minor.

 

*I* would feel compelled to say the Pledge, knowing that it is a requirement, not a suggestion, especially since it's something that I was supposed to do with the children, who probably (depending on their ages) know that it's a rule. If nothing else, I'm setting an example. Suppose the children decide they don't need to follow some of *my* classroom rules? Then what happens?

[DawnM]

*I* would feel compelled to say the Pledge, knowing that it is a requirement, not a suggestion, especially since it's something that I was supposed to do with the children, who probably (depending on their ages) know that it's a rule. If nothing else, I'm setting an example. Suppose the children decide they don't need to follow some of *my* classroom rules? Then what happens?

 

 

I hear what you are saying.  However, in the classroom, about 8 hours of work is a requirement with this Common Core stuff, and you are meant to fit it in to 5.5 hours.  It is darn near impossible, so you have to figure out which requirement you will not do.  It is a lose-lose any way you look at it.

[Ellie]

Bored today - so starting a thread (spin off thread) on this topic mainly because my brain has been playing with it in its boredom.  Now it wants playmates.   ;)

 

On this thread:

 

http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/539476-why-not-to-lie-about-not-wanting-to-go-somewhere/

 

the idea came up that not saying something (or giving a reason, etc) is a form of lying about the subject (any subject - not just that one).

 

Is it?

 

I know I'm often "guilty" at not saying something in various settings.  The vast majority of the time I don't see it as lying.  It might not be telling the whole truth, but it's not the same as lying.

 

It'd be lying in certain situations - like not declaring all of your income for taxes or if you answer "yes" to the question of "is that all you know" about an incident or situation when it's not.

 

But if you don't answer the question?  Or if others involved aren't even aware of something?  Is one lying if they don't share all they know?

 

"Do you know why Sally doesn't want to go to the party?" (and you do know, of course).  Is "redirecting" by totally changing the train of thought lying?  "I know the party is on Friday night and Susie, Jennifer, Frida, Claudia, and Amber are really looking forward to going.  They were talking about it... etc, etc, etc"

 

You didn't answer the original question one way or another (on purpose) - the conversation moved on (you directed it that way).  Is that the same as lying?

 

What about "Don't ask, don't tell? (not meaning military).  If there are policies on paper that you don't follow to the letter, but don't tell anyone, is that lying?  It is if they ask and you claim to follow things, of course, but what if the topic never comes up?  Is one supposed to tell in order to avoid lying?  (Whether one should be doing the things in question or not is a different topic.)

 

It's been an interesting brain exercise with oodles of possibilities/situations to think about, but my brain is getting tired of playing alone.

 

Wanna add thoughts?

 

I would probably say something pretty direct, such as "Yes, but you'd have to talk to Sally about that." But only if I knew for certain, as in Sally had told me herself, not if I were guessing.

 

OTOH, I once had a friend who walked with one foot in a mud pie. Her life was a mess, and most of it was her own fault. Once she called me (as she was wont to do, and tell me her latest saga), and said, "Do you think I'm too sensitive?" Frankly, yes I did, but I said, "Why? Did someone say that to you?" And off she went on her story (20 minutes probably, nonstop). She didn't really want to know; she just wanted to tell her story, so I let her. She was not capable of changing.

 

If I don't want to accept an invitation to go somewhere or do something, I can say, "Oh, thank you so much, but I cannot. Have a wonderful time!" I don't have to tell the invitee that I would rather dip snuff than attend that event.

[creekland]

Well, when my BIL is over for a holiday meal, no one here except hubby can sit next to him.  The (now adult) kids and I can not stand to hear him chew loudly with his mouth open - all of my in-laws EXCEPT hubby did/do this.  We have told BIL that since he is the oldest he gets head of the table (FIL has passed on, hubby is one of the middle "kids").  This way no one is right next to him except hubby.

 

Now, BIL confided in me that he did not feel right taking head of the table in his brother's house.  I countered that the seating was all done to accommodate my adult son with autism, who if hubby was at head of table would not even come out of his room (true).

 

Should I have instead told the real truth, that his eating habits are very gross and most of us can not stand to be near him? He is almost 60 years old, he isn't going to change, and it would only make him feel bad (or insulted).  Sometimes white lies or avoiding the truth is the better course of action!

 

I think you've come up with a great solution - and I don't think you are lying as long as what you are saying is true.

 

FWIW, my dad is the same way with eating... and none of us like being across from him either.  Since we rarely see him, we just deal with it.  It's been a great reminder to my guys over the years as to why typical table manners are taught, so there has been some "good" we've gleaned from it.

[creekland]

*I* would feel compelled to say the Pledge, knowing that it is a requirement, not a suggestion, especially since it's something that I was supposed to do with the children, who probably (depending on their ages) know that it's a rule. If nothing else, I'm setting an example. Suppose the children decide they don't need to follow some of *my* classroom rules? Then what happens?

 

I work solely with high school kids.  They do know it's a rule, and I always tell them why we're skipping it.  Actually, I tend to address it with a question, "Is anyone going to get offended if we skip the Pledge today?  Because I've looked at the test and I think it might take you the whole period, so I'd like to get it started as quickly as possible..." (or whatever the reason is).  I've never had a student object.

 

Otherwise, it's a classroom.  There are often students who don't want to do what they are supposed to do.  ;)  How I handle it depends totally upon the student and the infraction.  There aren't different rules for different students (in general), but whether I've handled that problem (or similar) with that student before makes a difference.  What the infraction is makes a bit of difference.  A paper airplane isn't as bad as racial comments.  Kids learn VERY quickly that I'm not keen on lying and will treat that harsher than their merely telling the truth.  But in general, I work to get kids wanting to comply rather than enforcing anything by "law."  It works far, far better.

 

With "laws" there's this natural (human?) response to want to break them (for some kids).  With "common sense" but no set in stone "rule" except for "bad" stuff, compliance comes naturally (almost always).  I rarely have problems in my classrooms and when I do it's almost always with students I haven't seen before.  I deal with those issues (usually with explanations and choices for them).  They get on board quickly and life resumes.  ;)

 

To ensure they are lying with issues I'm very careful with what I ask and I make sure they answer rather than redirecting.   :coolgleamA:

 

"When you took the bathroom pass and were gone for 15 minutes, are you sure you just went to the closest bathroom by the quickest path?  Did you stop and talk with ANYONE along the way there or back?"

 

"You were on this same math problem last time I came around this table.  Are you stuck on parts of it or did the mind start wandering?"

 

"Homework isn't done.  Why?  And did you actually go to xyz?  Or how long were you at work/sporting event?"

 

"Flying objects aren't part of today's lesson.  If you prefer to keep tossing things, you're welcome to head down to the office and explain why you'd rather do that than work on math in math class.  They might be open to your reasoning."

[Elisabet1]

Omitting can be a form of lying, but not Omitting can be a form of gossip.

[creekland]

I would probably say something pretty direct, such as "Yes, but you'd have to talk to Sally about that." But only if I knew for certain, as in Sally had told me herself, not if I were guessing.

 

OTOH, I once had a friend who walked with one foot in a mud pie. Her life was a mess, and most of it was her own fault. Once she called me (as she was wont to do, and tell me her latest saga), and said, "Do you think I'm too sensitive?" Frankly, yes I did, but I said, "Why? Did someone say that to you?" And off she went on her story (20 minutes probably, nonstop). She didn't really want to know; she just wanted to tell her story, so I let her. She was not capable of changing.

 

If I don't want to accept an invitation to go somewhere or do something, I can say, "Oh, thank you so much, but I cannot. Have a wonderful time!" I don't have to tell the invitee that I would rather dip snuff than attend that event.

 

But saying you "cannot" is wrong, correct?  You COULD.  You just don't want to.

 

Your middle example would be one I would do.  The last might be too, but with actual words chosen, I can see where that would be lying.  

[J-rap]

It all depends.  If you know a person is open to hearing the truth, I'd tell them.  If you know they really aren't, or they wouldn't want to hear it, then I probably would keep it to myself.  So, I'm not lying, I'm just keeping it to myself because I know it's pointless (or hurtful) to say it.

 

Of course leaving out information that is really required, such as tax return info, would be a lie.

 

Another example.  If my child at age 5 asked me what I thought of his drawing and I thought it was really bad compared to other 5 year-olds, I'd leave out that information and instead try and find something positive to say.  "Wow, you worked hard on that!  I love those colors!"  (I might offer some suggestions too, but I wouldn't be negative.)  But if my 20-year-old art student child asked me what I thought of his drawing and it was really bad, I'd probably be mostly honest, because if his livelihood is dependent on it and he's not good at it, well, someone should really tell him.  :)   Not being forthright in those circumstances would definitely feel more like lying.

 

And then of course there are all those white lies that fall somewhere in-between, like when you're invited out and you really don't feel like going, so you blame it on your child who is just a little bit sick but doesn't really need you around.  If the intentions are to not offend someone and there are no long-term consequences of it, it somehow seems okay to do that.

 

 

[SKL]

When I was younger, I was militant about telling the truth.  As I grew older, I realized there was a lot more gray area and that not telling the "whole truth" is not the same as lying.  Besides, most people really don't expect the "whole truth" or necessarily want it.

 

I don't want to know that a person IRL dislikes me or thinks my interests are stupid or thinks my kid is a holy terror.  I would rather we treat each other cordially and go our separate ways.  To protect the sensitivities of both parties, I know not to keep trying to engage a person who isn't engaging.

 

It is an art to always try to say something that is kind but not a lie.  But usually it's not impossible.  Usually it's possible to convey "that really isn't my thing but I'm happy for you" without saying it.  Well, assuming the hearer understands social cues.

[SKL]

Of course the closer the person is, the more honesty is appropriate.  I have very close friends whom I can tell what I "really think" of their unattractive clothing choices etc. :P  And I don't mind them telling me.  And I hope they would tell me something that is likely to cause a problem in my life if I don't fix it.

 

Someone came onto a fb group and asked, how do you tell a bf that her breath really stinks?  I didn't answer, but unless it was a really really good friend, the kind who knows most all my secrets, I would not tell (unless they asked).  Perhaps that makes me a bad friend.

[creekland]

Omitting can be a form of lying, but not Omitting can be a form of gossip.

 

:iagree:  Just adding a like to your post was not enough.  This is a VERY good point.

 

When not omitting is gossip I really don't think omitting is lying.  Making up something else is, but not merely leaving details out - or redirecting.

[creekland]

Of course the closer the person is, the more honesty is appropriate.  I have very close friends whom I can tell what I "really think" of their unattractive clothing choices etc. :p  And I don't mind them telling me.  And I hope they would tell me something that is likely to cause a problem in my life if I don't fix it.

 

 

I love the friends I have who are in this category - quite willing to tell the truth (as they see it, when they see it) - and still quite willing to accept differences too (agreeing to disagree when it happens).  They are a special group.

 

Bad breath?  They'd be likely to offer a mint for an occasional happening - and mention something only if it were a regular occurrence that concerned them otherwise.

[Ellie]

But saying you "cannot" is wrong, correct?  You COULD.  You just don't want to.

 

Your middle example would be one I would do.  The last might be too, but with actual words chosen, I can see where that would be lying.  

 

I guess you could interpret it that way. The point is that you don't have to give a reason for declining a social invitation.

[elegantlion]

I've struggled with this and some of it has to do with personal boundaries. I think honesty is one of the most important traits of a relationship, but kindness is also important. On the playdate issue, I would probably default to kindness and not say I'm not interested in having my child go to your child's performance because my child wants to play. I'm also very blunt IRL and try to soften that because it can hurt feelings and I hate doing that or having that done to me. I also hate being placated. One time, no biggie, over a period of time, just be honest people. I'm also a very sensitive person, but I'd prefer the truth, let me lick my wounds and deal with it. 

 

Omission is also a protective thing. I post here a lot, some of you are friends off of this page, I trust many of you here. But I have not disclosed details to everyone about my divorce. It's long and complicated and moves into that gossip category for me because of the personal boundary for me and ex and even ds to a point. I am not lying, I am being selective about what I disclose. If I went to a dear friend in real life and was vague while trying to ask for help, it would be a little different. 

 

There are also things that fall under the category of no longer relevant. My parents still don't know some of the crap I did in high school and my early adult years. I'm 47 and most of it is no longer relevant. There is no purpose in telling them how many times I was drunk before age 21 when my friends dropped me off at home. 

With acquaintances I think it can be harder. You can't come out and say I don't like your kids and I don't want to spend a hour at your kitchen table discussing x because I think it's boring. You have to be more tactful than that. There is an art to be tactful while being honest and still get invites to people's homes. It's even beyond etiquette, although that may be where it starts. Rosie called it public manners, I think it would fall under that category.  

[Liz CA]

All depends on relationship level and intentions among other things.

I would not say to anyone I work with: "This haircut is not the best fit for you." I may say it to a close family member or friend if I know the person relies on my opinion.

 

If you are being deposed by an attorney and you omit parts of a testimony, it is lying by omission or withholding facts.

 

Not everyone needs to know my every opinion on every subject.