Joanne Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 My husband is heartbroken today. He called yesterday "the second most awful day" of his life (I haven't asked what the first was). He had promised his Mom (who is now dead) and his Dad to never put his Dad in a nursing home. And now, he has to put his Dad in a nursing home. It was an unfair and completely unrealistic promise. His Dad has been in a wheelchair for 30+ years with some kind of MS-like progressive disease. He had a stroke, failed the swallow test and needs a feeding tube (hopefully temporary). He can't go back to his assisted living. We toured nursing homes yesterday. We are chosing the one with the highest ratings, but they are all fairly dismal, discouraging and have "that smell". DH feels he never should have "left" his parents home after he moved back to TX to assist with Hurricane Rita issues (his parents lived in East Texas, and were severely hit). After he got them somewhat together, he moved out and moved back to Houston (where he loves it). He feels he should have not made that self centered move, stayed with his parents during his Mom's death and taken care of his Dad after. I can't make him feel better. There are no words. But, don't ever make or put someone in the position of having to respond to the request to "never put me in a nursing home". :confused::confused: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrianne Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 :grouphug: Prayers for you and dh. It is an terrible decision to have to make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleepy Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 Aw, Joanne, I can only imagine how hard this has to be for your dh. :grouphug: My mother always tells us not to have a second thought about putting her into a nursing home if she ever needs it. She doesn't want to ever be a burden. Such a sad thing to consider... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jen500 Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 I'm sorry you are all going through this. It sounds like you're doing the best you can with the situation.:grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beansprouts Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 Joanne :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brindee Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 I am sooo sorry! It IS a terrible decision to have to make! The thing is, he is finding the very best one, and he is doing this FOR his dad, not to "get rid" of his dad! He wants what's best for his dad, and at this time, this is what IS BEST! You're right, at this point there are no words. I am lifting him and you up in prayer! :grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farmgirlinwv Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 :hugs: that is a completely unfair request. Taking care of an aging parent who is in poor health is a 24/7 job. It is a JOB. No matter that they're your parents. It is very draining on everyone involved, spouses, children, everyone. You have to do the best you can in the situation you are in. Personall, I NEVER want my dd to feel obligated to care for me. If I can't care for myself, Put me in a home! I think it's too much to ask. It is so draining on the family. I know that there are beautiful exceptions to this rule, but they are exceptions especially when the parent is in poor health. BTW, I'm a nurse who works in nursing homes. Many people love it there because they have so many people their own age to talk to and things to do. In my experience as a nurse the best nursing homes are private or affiliated w/ a religious group. Obviously, exceptions to that rule to. Let's hope that your fil will enjoy his new home and that will help your dh. Lisa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather in the Kootenays Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 We're facing a similar issue - and without even the promise, it's painful. And I'd strengthen your caution - don't wring any kind of promise out of friends and family. I've heard some other horrible stories along these lines lately. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdWTMer Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 Joanne, I'm sorry that you've your dh is going through this! We had to look into putting my dad into a nursing home there in Katy around March. Could you tell me what nursing home y'all have decided on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3lilreds in NC Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 I've seen both sides of this issue. With my family, we've been blessed to be able to care for our elderly at home, for the most part. One grandfather died at home of cancer; the other grandfather did die in the hospital but he went in for a heart attack so it was not a prolonged stay; one grandmother died at home of cancer with my mom and aunt as her nurses and her sons also there to help out. My parents live with my other grandmother now so that she can continue to live in her home. With dh's family, though, his grandmother had Alzheimer's disease. These grandparents did not want to leave their hometown, so when the grandfather was diagnosed with cancer, they moved into an assisted living facility. After the grandfather passed away, though, the grandmother could no longer stay in assisted living; she needed full time care. My MIL and her sister decided to put her in a Lutheran (key detail, that) nursing home near where the sister lived; Grandma said lovely things like "I can't believe my children would do this to their mother" for the whole drive there. It was so hard for them to do that, I know, and yet, it's just not safe to have an Alzheimer's patient in your home - no one is capable of 24-hour care without help. She lived several years there, and it was awful to see her in a nursing home (even though this was a good one), but dh's aunt visited her every day at least once and I think more than that. That's the key - family *has* to be involved so that the care remains good. I was a nurse's aide for several years to make money for college, and everyone knew the patients whose family visited. It was top priority to make them the happiest. Sad that not everyone receives the same standard of care, but a fact of life, I'm afraid. :grouphug: to you and your dh, Joanne, as you're dealing with this tough, tough situation. It's never easy or fun to have to make these decisions. And, your dh may feel like he should have made different decisions in hindsight, but he *knows* he did what was right at the time. He needs to give himself the grace to remember that. He is not a cold-hearted meanie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joanne Posted August 7, 2008 Author Share Posted August 7, 2008 Joanne, I'm sorry that you've your dh is going through this! We had to look into putting my dad into a nursing home there in Katy around March. Could you tell me what nursing home y'all have decided on? Oakmont. http://www.ucomparehealthcare.com/nhs/texas/oakmont_nursing__rehabilitation_center_of_katy.html They have the best ratings, are 10 minutes from my house and we have friends who have recommended it as the best of awful choices. :confused: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laylamcb Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 But, don't ever make or put someone in the position of having to respond to the request to "never put me in a nursing home". :confused::confused: :grouphug: You are so right. Your poor DH must be in turmoil. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doran Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 Only a week ago today my father was admitted to a nursing home. While none of us family ever promised him that we would not have to make that choice at some point, my father still insists it is premature, that we could have continued to care for him at home "if we would only try" (and I use "we" loosely because I am out of state and the task has really fallen to my aging mother and one of my two brothers). He is bitter and sick at heart. It is a terrible thing to witness, and a terrible thing to have to decide. Staying at home was only an option if we were willing to let my mother's health decline alongside his as she struggled to care for him. Here are some of the thoughts I have had, or which have been offered to me, which are helping me cope: * There are people who are trained and called in life to do this kind of work. They are so much better equipped to attend to your FIL's needs because they don't have the emotional attachments that we family have. It seems like that would be a disadvantage, but when you look at the kind of damage that is done to a soul who is trying, but failing, to provide adequate care at home, it makes some sense. * It is short sighted at best and selfish at worst for anyone to evoke such a promise from a loved one. It is not realistic for every family. Yes, there are some who take on that responsibility, but it is not one to be forced upon a person. It must be done with willingness and a feeling of ability or the person in the role of caregiver soon becomes consumed with bitterness. To watch a parent decline and feel that our own lives are being usurped in the process is not healthy for either patient or caregiver. How many people die with that white elephant still in the living room? * If your husband had followed his current line of thinking -- stayed with his father, etc. -- he would likely not be married to you. Life is full of mystery and we never know how one monumental decision will prevent or determine another. But, many take comfort in the knowledge that there is a larger plan unfolding, one which requires our ultimate trust that all things work together for good. * Your husband needs to focus on what is, not what should or could have been. His job now is to support your FIL into this transition. It will not be easy, and there may be a lot of anger (as is the case with my father), but your dh cannot control his father's health. He can only control how he loves him through all phases of his decline. This is an act of necessity encased in love. It has nothing to do with selfishness. I do understand. I really do. And, I'm so sorry. My husband is heartbroken today. He called yesterday "the second most awful day" of his life (I haven't asked what the first was). He had promised his Mom (who is now dead) and his Dad to never put his Dad in a nursing home. And now, he has to put his Dad in a nursing home. It was an unfair and completely unrealistic promise. His Dad has been in a wheelchair for 30+ years with some kind of MS-like progressive disease. He had a stroke, failed the swallow test and needs a feeding tube (hopefully temporary). He can't go back to his assisted living. We toured nursing homes yesterday. We are chosing the one with the highest ratings, but they are all fairly dismal, discouraging and have "that smell". DH feels he never should have "left" his parents home after he moved back to TX to assist with Hurricane Rita issues (his parents lived in East Texas, and were severely hit). After he got them somewhat together, he moved out and moved back to Houston (where he loves it). He feels he should have not made that self centered move, stayed with his parents during his Mom's death and taken care of his Dad after. I can't make him feel better. There are no words. But, don't ever make or put someone in the position of having to respond to the request to "never put me in a nursing home". :confused::confused: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharon H in IL Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 It's hard to mourn what used to be, what we wish we still had. The transition of the family patriarch from a figure of power to one of dependency is truly painful. I hope your DH can find solace in his loving family. Hugs to you all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G5052 Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 I hang out on several Ahlzeimer's boards because both my parents have mid-stage dementia from different causes and are so very close to not being able to take care of themselves. I had to intervene to get my mom off the road this last year, and now I'm wondering how close they are to needing supervised care. Over and over, I hear of stories who had to put a loved one in a nursing home after promising not to. I think that's a promise that should never be made frankly, and one that no one should feel guilty about breaking. Most of us don't have the ability to provide 24/7 care, and we shouldn't frankly. In the days of large extended families, it may have been possible, but it's not doable by a small family unless you can hire help in. If there's dementia involved, even an extended family may not be able to do it. Either way, it's a sad situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
readwithem Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 Oakmont. http://www.ucomparehealthcare.com/nhs/texas/oakmont_nursing__rehabilitation_center_of_katy.html They have the best ratings, are 10 minutes from my house This in and of itself is a huge plus. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bambam Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 I know this is tough, very tough. I've read that it is good idea to call your local Emergency services (EMTs) to see if they have any recommendations about where they would send their parents. They see the nursing homes from the 'other side' at all times of the day and night. I've never had to go through this, so I do not know for sure if this is acceptable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tammyla Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 I'm just so sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fourmother Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 :grouphug: Joanne :grouphug: Joanne, I've been where your dh is. What a painful position to be in! He's doing the best he can, and somehow he has to reconcile himself to that fact. Otherwise, the guilt will eat him alive. In the days of large extended families, it may have been possible, but it's not doable by a small family unless you can hire help in. If there's dementia involved, even an extended family may not be able to do it. This is so true. My paternal grandmother was diagnosed with dementia about 4 years after my father died. Daddy was her only child. When she left her apartment, she went to stay with one of her nephews who lived in the same city. He and his wife worked very hard to take care of her, even though his wife was being treated for cancer at the time. Then my grandmother started saying that she was being mistreated. I didn't know what to believe from 3000 miles away, so I brought her to live with me. I discovered that Granny's accusations were completely unfounded, which unfortunately didn't prevent my cousin's wife from having to answer them in court. It took her months to get the mess straightened out. Although she was (thankfully) not convicted of elder abuse, the suspicion alone did leave its ugly stain on her reputation. After caring for my grandmother for 6 months, I found that I could not keep up with her health care needs. She was constantly in and out of the hospital. She became so paranoid that she didn't want to take her essential medications, and she started hallucinating about my dh. At this point, I knew I couldn't allow her dementia to destroy my family like it had my cousin's. I had to find a way to care for Granny and protect myself as well. The only way I could do this was to place her in a nursing home. It was one of the most difficult decisions I've ever made in my life. She lived there for more than 2 years and hated every second of it. I visited her frequently and she begged me to take her home every time I saw her. It was so hard. Actually, hard doesn't begin to describe it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joanne Posted August 7, 2008 Author Share Posted August 7, 2008 I've read that it is good idea to call your local Emergency services (EMTs) to see if they have any recommendations about where they would send their parents. They see the nursing homes from the 'other side' at all times of the day and night. I've never had to go through this, so I do not know for sure if this is acceptable. The mom of 2 of my additional students is an advanced EMT for a local service. As is a guy we've become aquaintances with who rents a room from her and her DH. In fact, my DH ran into that guy while touring homes. The friend was transporting a resident back. (And it was not a home on the "A" list). They have offered valuable info that did contribute to our decision, so your post was spot on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tina Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 My great aunt's fear was to end up in a nursing home. So we tried to avoid it when her dh died. She lived 500 miles from us, but we found her in-home care. We later found out they were probably abusing her and stealing from her. Her step-sister and her dh moved her to an apartment (she gave them control since they lived closer), and then finally to a nursing home. They were too old to take care of her. Things get out of your hands. My ex-mil lived with us for several years back when I was in my 20s. We did our best for her, but finally the doctor said she had to go in the nursing home, and her dh went in with her (for health and mental reasons). I felt so guilty that I was there every night for at least a week. It is NOT an easy thing to do to those you love! But--it becomes necessary. There were people later who asked why we didn't get help, but I felt it was supposed to be our job to take care of them; I would have felt guilty/bad for not doing 'my job'. It is definitely wearing. 28 years later, we have my mil in the nursing home. It is not easier, especially since she's also starting to imagine things/be fearful at night. She no longer wants to stay there, but since she's falling regularly from her wheelchair (they're fastening her in now), there's no way we could possibly take her in! I know your dh feels guilty, but it would have happened anyway. Probably a doctor said he needed the nursing home? It gets out of our hands. I am so sorry you are being forced to this. Guilt as the child is always great. We can always look back and wish we had done better. We just do the best we can at the time. All you can do is be there for fil, let him know you haven't forgotten him. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraceinMD Posted August 7, 2008 Share Posted August 7, 2008 I've seen both sides of this issue. That's the key - family *has* to be involved so that the care remains good. everyone knew the patients whose family visited. It was top priority to make them the happiest. BTW, I'm a nurse who works in nursing homes. Many people love it there because they have so many people their own age to talk to and things to do. In my experience as a nurse the best nursing homes are private or affiliated w/ a religious group. Obviously, exceptions to that rule to. I'm so sorry, Joanne. I quoted the two posters above (and agree with Doran, too, of course!), just to underscore their comments: As a doctor who works exclusively in long-term care, I strongly agree that we are all aware of which residents have family who visit (although I don't think anyone's trying 'harder' to make those folks happier - it's just normal human nature to be aware of whose family is most involved) --- so the fact that your dh's father will be 10 minutes away is a blessing! (I also LOVE it when families bring in mementos and pictures of earlier times - it helps me to 'see' the resident as a vital person, even if they're now frail and disabled.) Also, although the transition will probably be difficult, your dh's husband may very well really enjoy being with others, especially as he is (I assume) grieving the loss of his wife - even if that was a few yrs ago. It usually takes several weeks for folks to settle in a bit, so I hope your husband can give himself grace while his dad is adjusting. If he can anticipate that his dad might react strongly (getting angry or accusatory), maybe he'll be able to let it roll off his back, rather than reacting back at his dad - and they may end up with a stronger relationship at the end of this. Bless you, Joanne, as you try to help your dh with this. Oh, (not to hijack, Joanne - please forgive me in advance!) for those who have not yet had to select a NH, I hope you never do. But *if* you do, farmgirlinwv is correct (confirmed by surveyors that I've spoken to over the years): the highest quality NHs are the ones that are not-for-profit or have a religious affiliation. (Sometimes the "nursing home compare" website is a little misleading, because the comparisons are generated from self-reported info - so the lower quality NHs have been known to fudge numbers (e.g., making it look as though they have more staff)). Some factors to look at: 1) the smell test (good NHs shdn't smell like human waste) 2) infection rates 3) pressure ulcer rates (some are unavoidable, but many are definitely preventable) 4) restraint usage (ask what their policy on physical and chemical restraint usage is - and how often they monitor that) 5) how involved the medical director is 6) what the local ER staff says (I used to work as an ER doc, and was appalled at some pts who were sent in from other facilities - and everyone knew which facilities they were.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harriet Vane Posted August 8, 2008 Share Posted August 8, 2008 :grouphug: Joanne :grouphug: Joanne, I've been where your dh is. What a painful position to be in! He's doing the best he can, and somehow he has to reconcile himself to that fact. Otherwise, the guilt will eat him alive. This is so true. My paternal grandmother was diagnosed with dementia about 4 years after my father died. Daddy was her only child. When she left her apartment, she went to stay with one of her nephews who lived in the same city. He and his wife worked very hard to take care of her, even though his wife was being treated for cancer at the time. Then my grandmother started saying that she was being mistreated. I didn't know what to believe from 3000 miles away, so I brought her to live with me. I discovered that Granny's accusations were completely unfounded, which unfortunately didn't prevent my cousin's wife from having to answer them in court. It took her months to get the mess straightened out. Although she was (thankfully) not convicted of elder abuse, the suspicion alone did leave its ugly stain on her reputation. After caring for my grandmother for 6 months, I found that I could not keep up with her health care needs. She was constantly in and out of the hospital. She became so paranoid that she didn't want to take her essential medications, and she started hallucinating about my dh. At this point, I knew I couldn't allow her dementia to destroy my family like it had my cousin's. I had to find a way to care for Granny and protect myself as well. The only way I could do this was to place her in a nursing home. It was one of the most difficult decisions I've ever made in my life. She lived there for more than 2 years and hated every second of it. I visited her frequently and she begged me to take her home every time I saw her. It was so hard. Actually, hard doesn't begin to describe it. My aunt is also delusional. Her husband was willing to keep her and care for her himself, but when her delusions and paranoia extended to allegations of terrible abuse, this put their children in jeopardy. We know for certain that what she has imagined absolutely did NOT happen (witnesses at the times at which my aunt claimed abuse, plus the fact that there was absolutely no evidence ever of trauma like bruises or whatever). She really hates being in a nursing home, and there is nothing we can do about it. It's awful. It's been terribly painful for her husband and for the family in general, but we at least know that she cannot help it, that her brain tumor is the cause. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harriet Vane Posted August 8, 2008 Share Posted August 8, 2008 I have twice been in a position of having to break a promise like that, and both times it has eaten me alive. I have since learned how hard it is to predict what will be an appropriate choice in an uncertain future. The promise that was wrested from your dh was terribly unfair and short-sighted. A better promise would have been to not abandon his father, or to always care for his father. A promise like that allows for many different options and applications. Perhaps your dh can find comfort in rephrasing the commitment he made? :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starr Posted August 8, 2008 Share Posted August 8, 2008 :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug: You are all in my prayers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eaglei Posted August 8, 2008 Share Posted August 8, 2008 I am so sorry for you, Joanne. We have been and currently are in a similar situation. Four years ago it was my MIL who ended up in a nursing home for recovery following a heart attack - and never was released. Long story - difficult situation. She has since passed away. My mom has always asked me not to put her in a nursing home - thankfully she did not ask me to promise. She is in her right mind - thank the Lord - and she made the decision to go into a nursing home because of physical issues. The hardest part is that we live so far apart and because we have a medical situation with ds (relapse leukemia) we are unable to travel much to see her. Trying to arrange to bring her to a nursing home closer to where we live has proven to be an impossible nightmare. This is such a sad-sad time. Sadder still, I think, because she is totally cognizant of everything. Of course, if she wasn't, that would be hard in a different way . . . My heart goes out to you and your husband, and my prayers go up for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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