Please tell me more about your experience with the Robinson Curriculum.

[stripe]

I've never understood why I am supposed to not like someone's method of teaching or curriculum because of their beliefs. Opinions are not facts, and I see no fact-based reasons as to why this curriculum should not be used simply because he holds xyz belief. His actual CD's have old published resources that were written by others long before he was born-it isn't a curriculum written by him, it's a METHOD of teaching with the resources on this CD. It's what I said earlier...take what you want, leave the rest-it's THAT EASY. You don't have to agree with or believe everything you hear about any side. The parents I know that do use this do not use it like he says it should be used, not by a long shot!

 

Hunter, you make my thoughts so much clearer than I could!

 

I seriously have no opinion about Art Robinson. Finding those links was the most time I'd ever spent on him. But.

 

Hunter is always emphasizing that we need to know what a curriculum is doing, where it is taking us. It is possible that RC takes people places they might not want to go.

[lotsofpumpkins]

Has it been mentioned yet that Robinson came up with this method because he had to? He lost his wife quite suddenly, and did not have time for teacher-intensive curriculum for 6 children while still continuing to work. Most of us are not in that situation, and do have time to spend more time teaching. I do lead my dc to more independence in their schoolwork; I have a large family and I have to prioritize. My younger children will never learn to read if I'm spending all day long teaching my 4th and 5th graders! They are able to look at their checklist and do their 3R's without much help from me (though I am right there willing to help when needed). We are learning the content subjects all together as a family; I'm not ready to give up that time together reading good books aloud.

 

I did look at RC a while back and was intrigued, but ultimately decided that it's not for us. I want them to learn some independence, but I'm not turning them completely loose.

 

I agreed with Hunter- glean what you want from the method. Lots of people tweak it, just like any other program or method.

[Supertechmom]

After homeschooling for 15 years, I am interested in a more student-led, guided program for my children that are still learning at home (6 yob, 9 yob, 11 yog).

 

The Robinson Curriculum intrigues me, and I have checked out the website. I love the idea of a literature-based program and the use of Saxon math.

 

My 9yob is a struggling/dyslexic reader and I am wondering if the reading selections would be too difficult for him. I am also curious about how much time is required of me daily to supervise my children in their work. Also, how much time does this student invest daily to complete their work?

 

I love the price of this program but need more info.

 

 

Thanks!

 

Camy

 

 

I'll answer this for you and then I am :auto:

 

For a struggling reader, the material will be hard. I had one. We're not sure his exact issue, (dyslexic or visual perception issue) but it took along time to overcome. I didn't give up with the material though. the books are oldie goldies like Tom Swift by Appleton, The Five little Peppers and others of that time period. I really always thought the reading list was more suited for 3rd grade and up unless you had a really strong reader. However, we worked through each book with my struggling reader until now in 5th grade, he can read them with no trouble. but they are not fluff and he will need to have figured out his unique reading issues and how to over come it. The books are similar to Thornton Burgess books, Andrew Lang etc. I just had to sit with my reader and let him read some, then I would read , and then he would read, using whatever techniques we needed to to get him to read ( strip of paper under the line, a cut out box to focus on only one word at time, different colored filter paper etc as was needed ) You could get a similar reading list by using a kindle and downloading the free classics they have. A struggling reader is going to have trouble with anything really until they overcome.

 

Time wise is hinged upon your child's discipline. If your child is used to you telling him what book to use and turn to this page everyday then you will need to spend a lot more time on this until he can follow a check list and do the work listed there. If your children are used to taking a list and completing x,y,x, while mom works with other kids or does the laundry then your time will be much less. My kids are 2-15 so I spend probably an hour-2 in direct one to one with teaching, explaining, or training among them with most of that on the youngers. Then some more time in going over the papers they write. More than Art R did but he started this with only one child who wasn't already well on the path of well prepared and beyond the basics. Preschoolers and those who need to learn to do the work take more time than those who have learned to read, do basic math and just need accountability and discussion time. YMMV

[Spy Car]

you are wrong. He clearly states multiple times that he teaches the child the concept with manipulates, showing them how to work it out until the child gains understanding. Then instead of showing him ever single math fact and every type of problem, he has the child repeat what he has learned with a different problem. Very much like Singapore that expects a child to jump from two digit multiplication to three with no instruction. The concepts are in place, the child has to learn to apply it in different situations.

 

the controlled environment is no different than many a school room by many parents here. A place where the child has a desk, limited distractions and a mom near by expecting them to finish their work. The rigorous education is the fact the fluff is left off and the child actually learns material at an early age because there is no distracting fluff. Every year, we have the topics of "how do i set up a school room" "how do i keep my child from being distracted" How do I get my kid to do his work" what is the best planner and check list"

 

Is the RC way really any different? The child knows what to except, what he needs to do, and does it. If he doesn't, he doesn't do anything else until he does. is that really any different than the advise given by so many here when moms ask what to do to the child that won't do his homework?

 

I'm sorry, but you are misrepresenting Robinson. And yes, his method is drastically different that what you've laid out.

 

I don't have all day for this, but he are the sort of things Robinson says:

 

 

Learning is an activity that involves solely the student and the knowledge. Everything or everyone else that may become involved in this process is essentially superfluous—and is potentially harmful as a distraction from the fundamental process.

 

So parents (or anyone else for that matter) "teaching" children is either "superfluous" or "harmful." This is not teaching them concepts and then letting them go. This is a radical pedagogical view that asserts teaching is either unnecessary or damaging. That is something very different that giving independent work.

 

 

Many homeschools use Saxon Math. Although produced with teachers and classrooms in mind, this series of math books is so well—written that it can be mastered by most students entirely on their own without any teacher intervention whatever. This self—mastery usually does not happen automatically, but it can be learned by almost any student with correct study rules and a good study environment.

 

Again, this is Art Robinson's math teaching advise. He doesn't say "teach them the concepts with manipulatives and after they have achieved mastery let them do independent work like a child might do using Singapore math. No. He says let them learn math entirely on their own without any teacher intervention. This includes 6 year olds.

 

Bill

[boscopup]

A family at my church uses RC and has from the beginning. She has graduated 2 and has 2 more in high school. They appear to be well educated children (without tin foil hats). :) Both graduates went/are-going to college (one just graduated this year).

 

RC wouldn't be a good fit for my family (I'd die of boredom reading so many old books and doing Saxon), but I've seen it work just fine for my friends' kids.

[kalanamak]

FWIW - the death mentioned above was that of Lydia Schatz. Her parents, Kevin and Elizabeth, used the Pearls ministry to justify abhorrent, abusive behavior. IMHO the Pearls do not teach anything close to the atrocity that was committed against this child. The violence lies squarely upon the Schatz.

 

I didn't mention a specific death. ;)

 

1) there are three I have heard of

2) for a third post, this might be a doozy, but I'm thinking most will ignore you, as this is not what the thread it about. A look through Pearls and this board and you will find a very strong anti-Pearl feeling voiced, with many quotes that are sickening to many of us.

[kalanamak]

I've never understood why I am supposed to not like someone's method of teaching or curriculum because of their beliefs. Opinions are not facts, and I see no fact-based reasons as to why this curriculum should not be used simply because he holds xyz belief.

 

I vote with my dollar. I think it THE most effective vote we have. There are materials I won't buy new, to not pay the people, or used, to bump up their resale value. Not many, but a few.

[Amy Jo]

PS is not the default plan when mom gets tired. It is ONE option for SOME families. For others it is not even one of the options.

 

I too am not a fan of the booklist. The booklist is made up of the books that the Robinson's had easily available to THEM. Many more books have become available since then, and better technology has developed.

 

I like the METHOD of LCC, not the curriculum suggestions. I like the METHOD of Robinson, not the booklist.

 

Spy Car, I too would like to see some proof and DATES. There are some comments made by people during the 80's when AIDs was brand new, and during Y2K when people were scared, and all sorts of other times in the PAST that need to be viewed in context.

 

I think Art Robinson did the best he could with what he had to work with, like we all do. What people do when SQUEEZED, is so often an excellent example for us of what we might want to try, and what we might not want to try. I think what I failed at, is often a better teaching example for others than what I succeeded at. Art Robinson is human. I am human. Everyone here is human. Sometimes watching others both succeed and fail, can help us succeed more often. They key is to GLEAN, not copy.

 

OP, if you start with the METHOD, and ANY books, I think things will settle down where you will have the energy to PICK books. I suggest giving yourself 2 months with the method and if you still feel the need to have someone else pick the books for better or worse, than order the CDs.

 

Does anyone know of any decent literature study guides, that might be a good plan for the OP in place of the Robinson book list, and flash cards? Something with vocabulary lists, tests, and history and science background?

 

Excellent post Hunter! How much money would I save if I just tried new methods for 2 months using the books I already had on the shelves? :lol:

 

OP - have you seen this schedule from the Great Books Academy? It might give you some good ideas for simplifying.

[Supertechmom]

I'm sorry, but you are misrepresenting Robinson. And yes, his method is drastically different that what you've laid out.

 

I don't have all day for this, but he are the sort of things Robinson says:

 

 

Learning is an activity that involves solely the student and the knowledge. Everything or everyone else that may become involved in this process is essentially superfluous—and is potentially harmful as a distraction from the fundamental process.

 

So parents (or anyone else for that matter) "teaching" children is either "superfluous" or "harmful." This is not teaching them concepts and then letting them go. This is a radical pedagogical view that asserts teaching is either unnecessary or damaging. That is something very different that giving independent work.

 

 

Many homeschools use Saxon Math. Although produced with teachers and classrooms in mind, this series of math books is so well—written that it can be mastered by most students entirely on their own without any teacher intervention whatever. This self—mastery usually does not happen automatically, but it can be learned by almost any student with correct study rules and a good study environment.

 

Again, this is Art Robinson's math teaching advise. He doesn't say "teach them the concepts with manipulatives and after they have achieved mastery let them do independent work like a child might do using Singapore math. No. He says let them learn math entirely on their own without any teacher intervention. This includes 6 year olds.

 

Bill

 

strange because I learned that technique from the Robinson curriculum. But perhaps that comes from actually using it and not from reading a website, eh? I've used it, tweaked it as I saw fit, and have been pleased with the results. I do far less teaching than anyone I know and my kids are voracious learners and tackle whatever strikes their fancy. And do it well with little input from me. (though we've had our ups and downs with the kiddo and his learning disabilities) His math teaching advice doesn't bother me as my kids worked their way through Singapore math with nothing more than my overseeing their reading comprehension(once I knew they understood math facts), NEM 1 and 1 as well as Doliciani (SP?)algebra books 1 and 2, Jacob's geometry, and now Larson's calculus book.And we still have 2 years of high school after Larson is done. Kids two, three, and four are on target for the same type of math education.

 

I just think you should be upfront and admit that you have a deep seated dislike of the man and that your opinions are slanted to reflect just how much you dislike him. You are contemptuous of him, consider him a fool, and have the utmost disdain for him to the ninth degree. If not, your posts portray that attitude. And like all such attitudes, makes it hard to conduct a conversation.

 

To clarify as I just realized Spycar thinks i teach concepts daily and send them off for independent work. NO! the only concepts I teach in math are basic math facts and all the normal preschool things like colors and shapes and time and such. Once they can read and I know they can follow directions and can understand what they read, they do actually pick up a math book, do a lesson and bring it to me for correction. I do not teach them say two step multiplication. or long division or anything else. I let them read it themselves and figure it out. Sometimes they have trouble iwth it and then they read it out loud to me. And explain out loud what they just read. IF it is still a mystery, they get the counters and work it out according to the lesson. IF that still leaves them in the dark, we get another book to see if a different approach dawns the light. I rarely ever have to go that far. Normally, reading it out loud immediately corrects the misunderstanding and they go back to work. I do not teach math beyond those first initial basics. And no one can say it has stopped my children's math education. Their test scores are too high to say it would never work. So,no, I am not radically different from RC's explanation of how to teach math.

[stripe]

So how is that different from unschooling? Or is it that you tell them what to do but don't teach them?

 

I am suspicious of this method (expecting children to teach themselves) because I had relatives homeschooled in this way for several years in middle school who ended up very behind, and eventually were put in private school.

[thefragile7393]

:iagree: None of this has to do with the materials, it's all about the man himself and how he chooses to use the resources he put on DVD's (not what I call a curriculum per se but that's just me). That wasn't the OP's question, she wanted to know about the materials and how people use them. Period. Instead it turns into an attack on the guy and his beliefs and character and what have you-which have no bearing on the original question. This wasn't the opinion she was asking for at all.

[Spy Car]

strange because I learned that technique from the Robinson curriculum. But perhaps that comes from actually using it and not from reading a website, eh?

 

Not from reading a website, but from reading Art Robinson's website.

 

I've used it, tweaked it as I saw fit, and have been pleased with the results. I do far less teaching than anyone I know and my kids are voracious learners and tackle whatever strikes their fancy. And do it well with little input from me. (though we've had our ups and downs with the kiddo and his learning disabilities) His math teaching advice doesn't bother me as my kids worked their way through Singapore math with nothing more than my overseeing their reading comprehension(once I knew they understood math facts), NEM 1 and 1 as well as Doliciani (SP?)algebra books 1 and 2, Jacob's geometry, and now Larson's calculus book.And we still have 2 years of high school after Larson is done. Kids two, three, and four are on target for the same type of math education.

 

His program requires Saxon math, you are obviously not following directions :D

 

I just think you should be upfront and admit that you have a deep seated dislike of the man and that your opinions are slanted to reflect just how much you dislike him.

 

I don't know the man. His "scientific" ideas are outlandishly wrong-headed. And I think his educational ideology is dangerous. My opinions of his positions are based on reason and not on a personal dislike of Art Robinson (someone I do not know).

 

You are contemptuous of him, consider him a fool, and have the utmost disdain for him to the ninth degree. If not, your posts portray that attitude. And like all such attitudes, makes it hard to conduct a conversation.

 

I do not respect the professional judgments of people who don't believe HIV causes AIDS, believe nuclear waste in good for us (and ought to be added to our home insulations, who promote wacky cancer "cures", or who deny climate change (to name a few of Art Robinson's beliefs).

 

He seems an odd mix of someone who is (in some sense) highly intelligent but also has supremely bad judgement.

 

And I disagree with his ideas about education, which is the salient point of this discussion.

 

To clarify as I just realized Spycar thinks i teach concepts daily and send them off for independent work. NO! the only concepts I teach in math are basic math facts and all the normal preschool things like colors and shapes and time and such. Once they can read and I know they can follow directions and can understand what they read, they do actually pick up a math book, do a lesson and bring it to me for correction. I do not teach them say two step multiplication. or long division or anything else. I let them read it themselves and figure it out. Sometimes they have trouble iwth it and then they read it out loud to me. And explain out loud what they just read. IF it is still a mystery, they get the counters and work it out according to the lesson. IF that still leaves them in the dark, we get another book to see if a different approach dawns the light. I rarely ever have to go that far. Normally, reading it out loud immediately corrects the misunderstanding and they go back to work. I do not teach math beyond those first initial basics. And no one can say it has stopped my children's math education. Their test scores are too high to say it would never work. So,no, I am not radically different from RC's explanation of how to teach math.

 

Your approach is radically different that Art Robinson's. You help your kids. Art Robinson would call this "help" potentially harmful to your children who (in his mind) ought to be doing it all by themselves.

 

Fortunately you don't follow his model.

 

Bill

Edited June 8, 2012 by Spy Car

[Spy Car]

:iagree: None of this has to do with the materials, it's all about the man himself and how he chooses to use the resources he put on DVD's (not what I call a curriculum per se but that's just me). That wasn't the OP's question, she wanted to know about the materials and how people use them. Period. Instead it turns into an attack on the guy and his beliefs and character and what have you-which have no bearing on the original question. This wasn't the opinion she was asking for at all.

 

Wrong. The criticism is of Art Robinson's educational ideology, which is to make children teach themselves with almost no parental involvement as an "ideal."

 

Bill

[Heidi]

I'm sorry, but you are misrepresenting Robinson. And yes, his method is drastically different that what you've laid out.

 

I don't have all day for this, but he are the sort of things Robinson says:

 

 

Learning is an activity that involves solely the student and the knowledge. Everything or everyone else that may become involved in this process is essentially superfluous—and is potentially harmful as a distraction from the fundamental process.

 

So parents (or anyone else for that matter) "teaching" children is either "superfluous" or "harmful." This is not teaching them concepts and then letting them go. This is a radical pedagogical view that asserts teaching is either unnecessary or damaging. That is something very different that giving independent work.

 

 

Many homeschools use Saxon Math. Although produced with teachers and classrooms in mind, this series of math books is so well—written that it can be mastered by most students entirely on their own without any teacher intervention whatever. This self—mastery usually does not happen automatically, but it can be learned by almost any student with correct study rules and a good study environment.

 

Again, this is Art Robinson's math teaching advise. He doesn't say "teach them the concepts with manipulatives and after they have achieved mastery let them do independent work like a child might do using Singapore math. No. He says let them learn math entirely on their own without any teacher intervention. This includes 6 year olds.

 

Bill

:chillpill: Bill.

 

Servin has described the curriculum perfectly. I bought and looked at RC for a while and spent a lot of time on the RC yahoo groups figuring it all out. My kids were too young to use it at the time and I eventually moved to other things. Specifically for math, they learn the math facts first (with mom, not on their own). When they have the math facts down cold and can read really well, they can start with Saxon 5/4.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

I don't think Bill sounds hysterical. I don't think he needs a chill pill.

 

We'll be in a pretty fix if we can only find fault with educational methods if the authors are of sound mind and good sense.

 

Mr. Robinson is not in a protected class because of his nutty ideas or because his method worked for his own family. It's reasonable for a reasonable person to reject his notions and his educational method.

[Supertechmom]

Your approach is radically different that Art Robinson's. You help your kids. Art Robinson would call this "help" potentially harmful to your children who (in his mind) ought to be doing it all by themselves.

 

Fortunately you don't follow his model.

 

Bill

 

But I do follow his model other than dropping Saxon which was pretty much the only math around when he was educating... I'm not helping my child anymore than he does. He follows the same pattern. If they have a question, he turns it back to them. he doesn't give them an answer. He promotes the idea that if a child doesn't understand have them do it out loud. That came directly from him. He promotes teach them how to find the material and has several essays, lectures, answers whatever form they may be in on how to show a child to reach for another resource when they don't understand. I took what I described directly from one of his links on his website on how to have a child understand the material without doing it for them. He, I believe or used to back in the early days, even has a download on how he taught one of his kids to master some concept using this approach above. Or maybe that stuff is on the cds. My material may be different but my approach is what he himself said he used with his kids. We are implementing the same way.

[LivingHope]

We don't use Saxon, but we do math the same as metioned above by servin. When I bought the DVD lectures to go with Foerster's Algebra, I wasn't surprised that my children preferred to read the text and work it out themselves...the DVD's were never used. We have since moved on to AoPS which really challenges my children...and they have to help ME.

[Spy Car]

But I do follow his model other than dropping Saxon which was pretty much the only math around when he was educating... I'm not helping my child anymore than he does. He follows the same pattern. If they have a question, he turns it back to them. he doesn't give them an answer. He promotes the idea that if a child doesn't understand have them do it out loud. That came directly from him. He promotes teach them how to find the material and has several essays, lectures, answers whatever form they may be in on how to show a child to reach for another resource when they don't understand. I took what I described directly from one of his links on his website on how to have a child understand the material without doing it for them. He, I believe or used to back in the early days, even has a download on how he taught one of his kids to master some concept using this approach above. Or maybe that stuff is on the cds. My material may be different but my approach is what he himself said he used with his kids. We are implementing the same way.

 

He says starting at 6 that children should sit down with Saxon math and a stack flash-cards and educate themselves. So you are giving your children a lot more help/harm (depending injure perspective) than Robinson claims he gave his children, or that he promotes as the "ideal" upon which his educational ideology is based.

 

Bill

[Supertechmom]

So how is that different from unschooling? Or is it that you tell them what to do but don't teach them?

 

I am suspicious of this method (expecting children to teach themselves) because I had relatives homeschooled in this way for several years in middle school who ended up very behind, and eventually were put in private school.

 

 

Unschooling from my understanding is child led and such. This is allowing a child once you have taught basic math and reading to follow a prescribed course of study on their own. They work up to 2 hours of math, 2 hours of reading( a rather serious list of books and classics) and 1 hour on writing everyday from about 10 12 years of age to graduation. The elementary years are spent slowly working from a few minutes every day( i believe they start with 10 minute increments and start advancing the time from there as the child matures) to the prescribed amount of time above. A child could easily get behind if the parents are not on top of it. You do everyday checks, you lead the way by making sure the child is working on school work and doing it. They don't get to slack off. But for all the ones that I know IRL and online using it,the kids are usually advanced. Really and truly if they can read well and understand what they read, they can learn whatever they want with little involvement beyond stay on task and resource locating.

[Spy Car]

I don't think Bill sounds hysterical. I don't think he needs a chill pill.

 

We'll be in a pretty fix if we can only find fault with educational methods if the authors are of sound mind and good sense.

 

Mr. Robinson is not in a protected class because of his nutty ideas or because his method worked for his own family. It's reasonable for a reasonable person to reject his notions and his educational method.

 

:lol: :lol: :lol:

 

This made me laugh so hard I almost hurt myself! :D

 

Bill

[Hunter]

I have just always figured he was a bit of an aspie, and just don't get wound up about stuff. As I said earlier I'm impossible to shock in general, so...whatever :-0

 

Too many Robinson Curriculum kids have gone to college and done well, to say the program doesn't work.

 

My oldest was pretty much a product of educational neglect. He was taught to disdain me, and wouldn't let me teach him anything. Other than Morning Worship time which was a hill I would have died on, and he knew it, he taught himself for about 2 hours a day, and then went to work.

 

I poured my heart and soul into the younger one, who learned all sorts of fancy subjects and produced test scores that were the highest in the town.

 

Guess who is did better in college and in adult life? The one who taught himself, and spent his teen years working in a seafood restaurant with mostly seasonal workers from Nepal and Thailand, because the working conditions were too horrendous to suit most Americans. It was the only place a 14 year old could work almost full time, and get away with it. The boss didn't speak enough English to know American child labor laws.

 

When my son got stuck in a textbook, sometimes at 2:00 in the morning, he went online, to homework help sites, and got help from someone other than me. Learning to be independent was why he was able to start paying his own way through college at 16, and graduate debt free at 19 and move across the country on his own.

 

Now I think my son grew up way too fast, and shouldn't have had the worries he did, that led him to seek early independence, but from an EDUCATIONAL stance only, people could point to him and say that "helping" isn't always helping.

 

This is a BIG country. People are mucking their way through all sorts of trials and tribulations, the only way they know how. When they get squeezed, they try things. Sometimes it works in at least one way. People want a piece of that success. You can bet people have asked my son about his education! Some yell child abuse. Some want to copy it. I just sigh and say it was what it was, and let people learn what they can from a more unusual story.

 

Art had an audience. He spoke to that audience. He wishes he could take some it back. He responded to the moment, but is judged by today's standards. He's just human. He caught the attention of people. He...on occasion spoke a little...I don't know what to call it. They guy doesn't have the best socials skills as is the NORM among scientists. The NORM!

 

I'm a mess myself so I'm not throwing stones. I just know the messiest among us can sometimes be GLEANED from. I gleaned from him. People have gleaned from my colossal mess, often by NOT doing what I did. And so the torch is passed on, from one mess to another.

 

Spy Car, if you don't want to glean any pieces from this man and want to throw the baby out with the bathwater, go right ahead. But some of the rest of us want to take a closer look. Yes, Art thinks the world is black and white with little grey. I think he's wrong. I think the world is so very grey. That's why I watch him :-) He's not black or white. He's just a human who is probably an aspie, whose wife died and left him with kids. I can only hope MY aspie kid does half as well with his own kids, because...I'm worried, truly worried about what that will look like. And if his wife dies, G-d help us all, never mind the kids.

Edited June 8, 2012 by Hunter

[Hunter]

He says starting at 6 that children should sit down with Saxon math and a stack flash-cards and educate themselves. So you are giving your children a lot more help/harm (depending injure perspective) than Robinson claims he gave his children, or that he promotes as the "ideal" upon which his educational ideology is based.

 

Bill

 

I think 7 at the earliest, and AFTER they have learned the basics. And when they are stuck they are GUIDED to finding the answer, and TAUGHT to self-educate. The focus isn't on ignoring them when they get stuck, but instead to use it as a LESSON in learning to problem solve.

Edited June 8, 2012 by Hunter

[Supertechmom]

He says starting at 6 that children should sit down with Saxon math and a stack flash-cards and educate themselves. So you are giving your children a lot more help/harm (depending injure perspective) than Robinson claims he gave his children, or that he promotes as the "ideal" upon which his educational ideology is based.

 

Bill

 

So not true Bill. Here's a direct quote to a question from the website.

 

And we as parents must be willing to let them solve problems without being their 'teacher'. Point them to where it is taught in the textbook (and it has been), fine, have them read the instructions and work it out orally (for a beginning student to the parent), fine. Education is learning, and learning is hard work. they must solve the problems.

 

 

And he started his kid at 5 or 6 because he was able to demonstrate the concept of addition with manipulatives or I think he calls them concrete objects. :001_smile: He advocates starting children on those flash cards after they master those concepts and then starting 54. He doesn't advocate starting a child in 54 until after they have learned the math facts.

[Hunter]

Point them to where it is taught in the textbook (and it has been), fine, have them read the instructions and work it out orally (for a beginning student to the parent), fine. Education is learning, and learning is hard work. they must solve the problems.

 

This. That IS teaching.

[Spy Car]

Point them to where it is taught in the textbook (and it has been), fine, have them read the instructions and work it out orally (for a beginning student to the parent), fine. Education is learning, and learning is hard work. they must solve the problems.

 

First one has to believe that pointing at a textbook and saying "figure it out yourself" is a good educational model with young children (6 or 7 year olds).

 

Second it presupposes knows exactly where in a book the concept is taught that the child might be having trouble. On this point, even if one had a photographic memory and familiarity with the text, knowing where any "concept" is taught in the recommended (by Robinson) Saxon math is a virtual impossibility. The instruction so incremental (and I'd say piece-meal) that it is often that there is no one place one could point to and say, "here is where you are going wrong." It is just not reasonable.

 

Bill

 

And he started his kid at 5 or 6 because he was able to demonstrate the concept of addition with manipulatives or I think he calls them concrete objects. :001_smile: He advocates starting children on those flash cards after they master those concepts and then starting 54. He doesn't advocate starting a child in 54 until after they have learned the math facts.

[Supertechmom]

First one has to believe that pointing at a textbook and saying "figure it out yourself" is a good educational model with young children (6 or 7 year olds).

 

Second it presupposes knows exactly where in a book the concept is taught that the child might be having trouble. On this point, even if one had a photographic memory and familiarity with the text, knowing where any "concept" is taught in the recommended (by Robinson) Saxon math is a virtual impossibility. The instruction so incremental (and I'd say piece-meal) that it is often that there is no one place one could point to and say, "here is where you are going wrong." It is just not reasonable.

 

Bill

 

And he started his kid at 5 or 6 because he was able to demonstrate the concept of addition with manipulatives or I think he calls them concrete objects. :001_smile: He advocates starting children on those flash cards after they master those concepts and then starting 54. He doesn't advocate starting a child in 54 until after they have learned the math facts.

 

 

Well maybe there's the disjoint. I do think it's a good educational model. I don't say figure it out yourself. But we most certainly guide the child in how to understand the words they just read. I don't see anything wrong with that. And now that i am back in school and having to do that for my classmates who can't understand a sentence they read and wait for interpretation, I believe even more firmly that the most crucial skill i can give my child is the ability to read and to understand what they read as early as possible.

 

And yea, I did use Saxon for a couple of years with Singapore and it is entirely possible to do so. It's not like you let your child go along until they are missing every problem. Evey single math problem must be right before they progress to the next lesson. Doesn't take long to find the sentence they misunderstood that way. But we are pretty hard core on math around here.

[Hunter]

First one has to believe that pointing at a textbook and saying "figure it out yourself" is a good educational model with young children (6 or 7 year olds).

 

Second it presupposes knows exactly where in a book the concept is taught that the child might be having trouble. On this point, even if one had a photographic memory and familiarity with the text, knowing where any "concept" is taught in the recommended (by Robinson) Saxon math is a virtual impossibility. The instruction so incremental (and I'd say piece-meal) that it is often that there is no one place one could point to and say, "here is where you are going wrong." It is just not reasonable.

 

Bill

 

And he started his kid at 5 or 6 because he was able to demonstrate the concept of addition with manipulatives or I think he calls them concrete objects. :001_smile: He advocates starting children on those flash cards after they master those concepts and then starting 54. He doesn't advocate starting a child in 54 until after they have learned the math facts.

 

Not point at the textbook. Point at WHERE in the textbook. Many Saxon books now have a number lesson after EVERY problem listing where the concept is taught.

 

When my son and I were working through and old Saxon calculus that did NOT have the numbers, we wrote our own math personal dictionaries, as we went along, and that really helped. Saxon Calculus was the ONLY calculus I was able to self-educate myself with. I used other books for reference. As a person who had to self-educate several years of math past where she was taught, Saxon and Aufmann were the easiest to use. My older son also self-taught best with Saxon and Aufmann.

[redsquirrel]

I've never understood why I am supposed to not like someone's method of teaching or curriculum because of their beliefs. Opinions are not facts, and I see no fact-based reasons as to why this curriculum should not be used simply because he holds xyz belief.

 

Well, after listening to this man's words it is pretty clear to me that he is an idiot. Why would I take educational advice from an idiot? His children may have succeeded scholastically by some measure, but there is always that monkey with a typewriter who reproduces Shakespeare.

[stripe]

So not true Bill. Here's a direct quote to a question from the website.

 

And we as parents must be willing to let them solve problems without being their 'teacher'. Point them to where it is taught in the textbook (and it has been), fine, have them read the instructions and work it out orally (for a beginning student to the parent), fine. Education is learning, and learning is hard work. they must solve the problems.

.

 

I guess I don't think that books are better than people. Why is it okay to read a book about calculus, when you could figure it aaaaall out on your own. I put a high value on transmitting knowledge. I put in person higher than book reading. To me, pointing at a page and expecting a child to puzzle it out is not teaching.

[thefragile7393]

Well, after listening to this man's words it is pretty clear to me that he is an idiot. Why would I take educational advice from an idiot? His children may have succeeded scholastically by some measure, but there is always that monkey with a typewriter who reproduces Shakespeare.

I'm not talking about listening to his views. You don't have to buy into his philosophy. You'll notice he hasn't written any curricula. He used these resources and put an idea together, but what you get when you order is pretty much resources. In other words, it's not a curriculum. No lesson plans written by him, nada, just an overview of how he thinks it should work. So, you can easily throw out his ideas of how it should work and use these resources how you see fit. That is the big big difference here. He didn't write ANYTHING. You aren't using his ideas by having the CD's. That's my point. The materials are still credible and valuable and can be used without his philosophy of how they should be used. So I could honestly care less what his views are as long as what he offers is solid and workable with different types of philosophies.

 

I use some actual written curriculum from a small company that has beliefs I definitely don't agree with and I think are somewhat nutty in a lot of ways, but they have some good stuff and I buy from them anyway even if I don't agree with the beliefs of the publishers. Why? The pieces I use are easily adaptable and the stuff I don't agree with does not come through into the specific books I buy. Again, just because you don't agree with someone's philosophy and views does not mean that they don't have anything valid to offer.

Edited June 8, 2012 by thefragile7393

[Hunter]

I'm not talking about listening to his views. You don't have to buy into his philosophy. You'll notice he hasn't written any curricula. He used these resources and put an idea together, but what you get when you order is pretty much resources. In other words, it's not a curriculum. No lesson plans written by him, nada, just an overview of how he thinks it should work. So, you can easily throw out his ideas of how it should work and use these resources how you see fit. That is the big big difference here. He didn't write ANYTHING. You aren't using his ideas by having the CD's. That's my point. The materials are still credible and valuable and can be used without his philosophy of how they should be used. So I could honestly care less what his views are as long as what he offers is solid and workable with different types of philosophies.

 

I use some actual written curriculum from a small company that has beliefs I definitely don't agree with and I think are somewhat nutty in a lot of ways, but they have some good stuff and I buy from them anyway even if I don't agree with the beliefs of the publishers. Why? The pieces I use are easily adaptable and the stuff I don't agree with does not come through into the specific books I buy. Again, just because you don't agree with someone's philosophy and views does not mean that they don't have anything valid to offer.

 

There are a lot of people here that don't believe in shunning, and that second marriages are adultery, but still use Pathway and R&S.

[WIS0320]

I guess I don't think that books are better than people.

 

First I know nothing about Robinson Curriculum but I've been following this thread with interest.

 

I found your statement above interesting because I personally don't find that to be true at all. There are some subjects that I am interested in that I seem to find very accessible learning by book/internet/video and would find a "teacher" to be superfluous and maybe even annoying.

 

However, there are other subjects that I have a harder time mastering that really require a teacher to explain or expand on what I've read and tried to learn on my own. Sometimes an expert in a field is just what you need to really get the hang of a subject or material that is not a strength area. For instance, I have tried learning to knit via books and video but I've bitten the bullet and found someone to give me lessons as I just need someone to show me in person and correct me when I am making mistakes!

 

The real question here is whether very young children are capable of differentiating between when they can absolutely learn something on their own with materials and resources provided them and when they do actually need a teacher. I think most kids trying to learn the basics need a teacher because they have no frame of reference or background knowledge for even mastering basic material. I would say that this is true for possibly K-5/6.

 

I do like the idea of cultivating independent learning skills but not to the point that I would say that children can learn everything they need to know without having access to "teaching". I don't think most adults can say that they could learn anything that they needed to know just by reading some books. I couldn't fly a space shuttle into outer space without a lot of teaching, book learning AND practice in a simulator. For a small child, just trying to get through Mr. Popper's Penguins and trying to find the big idea, narrate back or do spelling or grammar from the book, etc. can feel like trying to learn how to fly a space shuttle. My point is that a combo of both approaches seems to be the most reasonable based on my own anecdotal experiences, hence most educational approaches blend book/independent learning with access to a teacher.

Edited June 9, 2012 by drexel
spelling

[nmoira]

I do like the idea of cultivating independent learning skills but not to the point that I would say that children can learn everything they need to know without having access to "teaching". I don't think most adults can say that they could learn anything that they needed to know just by reading some books. I couldn't fly a space shuttle into outer space without a lot of teaching, book learning AND practice in a simulator. For a small child, just trying to get through Mr. Popper's Penguins and trying to find the big idea, narrate back or do spelling or grammar from the book, etc. can feel like trying to learn how to fly a space shuttle. My point is that a combo of both approaches seems to be the most reasonable based on my own anecdotal experiences, hence most educational approaches blend book/independent learning with access to a teacher.

I don't know about the Robinsons, but some of our biggest breakthroughs have been the result of a, "But, but, but..." I would be concerned that these won't get explored, and likewise that more authority is placed in the materials provided than is warranted. I'm wary of taking anything on authority and of training my child to. Also, regardless of what Mr. Robinson contends, much has been discovered in the last 100 years; and attitudes have shifted on matters such as race, and knowledge refined. I find it interesting that materials deemed worthwhile by Robinson (with the exception of math) just happen to be public domain. What are the odds? ;)

 

Older students may have the wherewithal to see out their own answers, but less so younger ones.

[Hunter]

I want to clarify my earlier use of "controlled environment". What I meant was a home where children had no access to TV and sugar and pop literature. I've found that to make a difference in what curricula are effective for children, and Art Robinson talks about that on his website.

 

Parent education, expectation of manual labor, number of children, neighborhood lived in, etc all play a part in a child's "education" oftentimes in more significant ways than the curricula used.

[Medieval Mom]

There are a lot of people here that don't believe in shunning, and that second marriages are adultery, but still use Pathway and R&S.

 

:lol: So true!

 

I just wanted to point out the 1000 Good Books List for anyone considering this, or a similar approach, or just a good booklist, but don't want to buy RC. :D

Edited June 9, 2012 by Medieval Mom

[black_midori]

My FIL used the RC with a nephew for a year quite awhile ago now, and I think it was a reasonable fit for that situation at that time. He kept the program for me to use with my kids, but I ended up going a different route for a large variety of reasons.

 

The main things that I remember from when he was doing it are:

-He always sat at a table in the room with N. He did not do anything else distracting (TV, phone, moving around, etc - I don't remember if he read). He was available immediately should any questions arise. As I recall, this was right out of Robinson's description of his own homeschool setup (where all the kids where in the same room with him while he worked).

 

-They did very intensive work, much more so than I currently do with my own kids. It was math, reading & writing (I don't remember exact times, but an hour or two of each?). The math has been discussed in full above, but as I recall he read the literature (some out loud, maybe? not sure) and then proceeded to write detailed summaries about the literature, which my FIL then corrected in red ink & gave back to him.

 

-They stayed away from sugar and somewhat from TV and computers (although not to the draconian extent that RC says to stay away from it). I think that has got to be a huge benefit to most kids, homeschooled or not. I wish in some ways I were up to being as hard & strict about this (although obviously I'm not, or I would just do it).

 

- My nephew did well. He had been doing poorly at school, which is why his dad pulled him & asked my FIL to educate him for awhile. He was already 12 or so at the time, so past a lot of the issues discussed. I think a lot of his success was truly due to just being away from harmful peers, a low-quality school, sugar and TV/Computers (some). He also had someone who truly CARED about how well he did sitting right there caring. Overall, I think it was a benefit for him.

 

- My FIL wouldn't have been interested in teaching most other methods (as I can say from current knowledge!). The "read, write, do the math textbook" method worked well for him, as a teacher. I have tried to get him to participate in schooling now with my younger kids, and he easily gets frustrated & doesn't make progress with them. If they were willing to calmly sit & read & write & do the work without drama, as my nephew was willing to do with RC, things might go better! lol.

 

That said, RC is not *MY* teaching style at all. I didn't truly take the knowledge in the spirit it was written, either - Robinson truly IS very hard-core about a lot of the things in there that he absolutely thinks you should or shouldn't do (from reading his own informational items). Many times while reading through it, I would comment sarcastically to my husband about various things he said (about homeschooling philosophy & his method). I still did plan to actually implement, in my own way, a lot of the "general gist" that I got out of it though. It just turned out... that's not my style! lol. We are actually moving more literature based this year, although it will be teacher-led discussions & short copywork / dictation / narration work, such as that done in WWE.

 

I didn't like his book list as much as I thought I would. I LOVED some of the books (favorites of mine, or classics), but a lot of the ones in the younger years I genuinely didn't like - they were long, hard to read & hard to follow, even for me (an avid reader).

 

SO...

 

All that said, I must add - based on comments here, I looked up Robinson on google on a whim. I found this link to his 2010 interview (obviously COMPLETELY not related to original topic of his methods!!). I must say that I respect him much less after seeing this video, and would be double-checking every book on his book list to make sure no crazy stuff leaked through... :( VERY bizarre!

 

http://thepoliticalcarnival.net/2010/10/07/video-rachel-maddowart-robinson-showdown/

[Hunter]

My FIL used the RC with a nephew for a year quite awhile ago now, and I think it was a reasonable fit for that situation at that time. He kept the program for me to use with my kids, but I ended up going a different route for a large variety of reasons.

 

The main things that I remember from when he was doing it are:

-He always sat at a table in the room with N. He did not do anything else distracting (TV, phone, moving around, etc - I don't remember if he read). He was available immediately should any questions arise. As I recall, this was right out of Robinson's description of his own homeschool setup (where all the kids where in the same room with him while he worked).

 

-They did very intensive work, much more so than I currently do with my own kids. It was math, reading & writing (I don't remember exact times, but an hour or two of each?). The math has been discussed in full above, but as I recall he read the literature (some out loud, maybe? not sure) and then proceeded to write detailed summaries about the literature, which my FIL then corrected in red ink & gave back to him.

 

-They stayed away from sugar and somewhat from TV and computers (although not to the draconian extent that RC says to stay away from it). I think that has got to be a huge benefit to most kids, homeschooled or not. I wish in some ways I were up to being as hard & strict about this (although obviously I'm not, or I would just do it).

 

- My nephew did well. He had been doing poorly at school, which is why his dad pulled him & asked my FIL to educate him for awhile. He was already 12 or so at the time, so past a lot of the issues discussed. I think a lot of his success was truly due to just being away from harmful peers, a low-quality school, sugar and TV/Computers (some). He also had someone who truly CARED about how well he did sitting right there caring. Overall, I think it was a benefit for him.

 

- My FIL wouldn't have been interested in teaching most other methods (as I can say from current knowledge!). The "read, write, do the math textbook" method worked well for him, as a teacher. I have tried to get him to participate in schooling now with my younger kids, and he easily gets frustrated & doesn't make progress with them. If they were willing to calmly sit & read & write & do the work without drama, as my nephew was willing to do with RC, things might go better! lol.

 

That said, RC is not *MY* teaching style at all. I didn't truly take the knowledge in the spirit it was written, either - Robinson truly IS very hard-core about a lot of the things in there that he absolutely thinks you should or shouldn't do (from reading his own informational items). Many times while reading through it, I would comment sarcastically to my husband about various things he said (about homeschooling philosophy & his method). I still did plan to actually implement, in my own way, a lot of the "general gist" that I got out of it though. It just turned out... that's not my style! lol. We are actually moving more literature based this year, although it will be teacher-led discussions & short copywork / dictation / narration work, such as that done in WWE.

 

I didn't like his book list as much as I thought I would. I LOVED some of the books (favorites of mine, or classics), but a lot of the ones in the younger years I genuinely didn't like - they were long, hard to read & hard to follow, even for me (an avid reader).

 

SO...

 

All that said, I must add - based on comments here, I looked up Robinson on google on a whim. I found this link to his 2010 interview (obviously COMPLETELY not related to original topic of his methods!!). I must say that I respect him much less after seeing this video, and would be double-checking every book on his book list to make sure no crazy stuff leaked through... :( VERY bizarre!

 

http://thepoliticalcarnival.net/2010/10/07/video-rachel-maddowart-robinson-showdown/

 

Thanks so much for the review of you FIL and nephew. It is very interesting and I think useful to some people.

 

As for the POLITICAL video, that is a political video where a homeschool figure is being tested in a way that I have never seen another publisher/author being tested. I think you would be SHOCKED to see what people you otherwise admire do when TESTED. That is one thing about my eventful past. I have been tested and I have seen others tested. I never compare the behavior of an untested person to a person who IS being tested. It's not fair. It's just not.

 

The most bizarre thing for me, in watching all this, is to see an old school homeschooler whose educational philosophy was based on the reality of the death of his wife, now in the political arena :-0 Truth really is stranger than fiction :lol: I mean really :lol: Think of some of our other old schoolers and picture them in the political arena. I'm not naming names, but... :lol::lol::lol:

[HappyGrace]

In the following thread, A.Balaban has put Medieval Mom's excellent booklist, which is separated by grade, into pdf format!

 

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=345347

 

You could use this list and/or the 1000 Good Books list that MedMom mentioned up list and easily do your own RC method. I think several of the books on MedMom's pdf list are also listed in AO, which is a bonus!

 

I feel her list is well-balanced and "updated", yet still rigorous.

 

It would be easy to just look on the RC site and see how he does the math, writing, etc. (he states it right on there) and use this book list and your library or free online books for the older books.

 

Notice I am biting my tongue and not jumping into the fray about Robinson himself. I think we can separate him personally from his curriculum-he did what he had to do at the time to educate his children in difficult circumstances and it worked great for his family and could work for others, depending on the children's/family's needs.

[nmoira]

The most bizarre thing for me, in watching all this, is to see an old school homeschooler whose educational philosophy was based on the reality of the death of his wife, now in the political arena :-0 Truth really is stranger than fiction :lol: I mean really :lol: Think of some of our other old schoolers and picture them in the political arena. I'm not naming names, but... :lol::lol::lol:

I think that you are gentling and romanticizing Robinson more than even he'd approve. The man is a wingnut. Really, he is. That doesn't make him good or evil or what-have-you. I don't care one way or another except that as an Oregonian, I will do what I can to make sure he doesn't become one of our congressional Representatives; and as a homeschooler I would not look to him for curriculum materials advice.

[kalanamak]

I think that you are gentling and romanticizing Robinson more than even he'd approve. The man is a wingnut. Really, he is. That doesn't make him good or evil or what-have-you. I don't care one way or another except that as an Oregonian, I will do what I can to make sure he doesn't become one of our congressional Representatives; and as a homeschooler I would not look to him for curriculum materials advice.

 

I don't mind wingnuts, even wingnuts who run for office, and I don't mind people who try to sell curriculum I wouldn't touch, but getting "fellow homeschoolers" to put pressure on his kid's university is going too far. I don't want the label "difficult and unreasonable" applied to homeschoolers, for fear it'll blow back on those of us innocent of such an agenda.

[Camy-7 boybarians 1 lady]

I have appreciated this discussion with the exception of the character assassination. I wanted to hear people's experiences with this curriculum, not how crazy, loony, or perfectly sane the curriculum originator is. These are things that as a wife of a human services worker, I can see and read between the lines. I also know that there are opinions about certain individuals expressed by some board members here, that are completely contrary to my experience and family value system.

 

Thanks for the practical advice...like what is done daily and of what the RC consists. Having all the material on disc also raises a red flag for me. I still like good old fashioned hardcopy books. We are still a family who likes to study history together, so this is another item of discussion that may be contrary to RC.

 

So though I may not choose to purchase this program in particular, my search for literature-based materials will continue. Maybe in another thread :o).

 

Blessings,

 

Camy

[Hunter]

I have appreciated this discussion with the exception of the character assassination. I wanted to hear people's experiences with this curriculum, not how crazy, loony, or perfectly sane the curriculum originator is. These are things that as a wife of a human services worker, I can see and read between the lines. I also know that there are opinions about certain individuals expressed by some board members here, that are completely contrary to my experience and family value system.

 

Thanks for the practical advice...like what is done daily and of what the RC consists. Having all the material on disc also raises a red flag for me. I still like good old fashioned hardcopy books. We are still a family who likes to study history together, so this is another item of discussion that may be contrary to RC.

 

So though I may not choose to purchase this program in particular, my search for literature-based materials will continue. Maybe in another thread :o).

 

Blessings,

 

Camy

 

Camy I am interested in that topic too. You set me off onto a whole new search of literature programs. I haven't yet seen a k-12 literature program with the goals that Art's does. An ungraded complete literature list with vocabulary and quizzes, that has been top-down written to systematically prepare for the SATs. I wasn't impressed with his list, until I tried to "better" it, and in it's most important parts, I can't.

 

I will no longer be so quick to dismiss this list, or purchasing the CDs. I was wrong.

 

And it's funny, but the attacks on the math, made me remember and think about what went right and what went wrong with my boys. While emphasizing READING textbooks has always been something I have done with my boys and then my students, I hadn't stopped to realize the importance of requiring students to be RESPONSIBLE to understand that reading.

 

I have never been a strong advocate of the need to stick with one math publisher all the way through. But with Saxon, the student the student does get used to the author's way of writing and the math vocabulary he chooses to use. I have to say, there is a valid reason for using Saxon 54 on up to Calculus.

 

I can't tell you how many times, people's attacks on a curriculum showed me how much I would like it. Thanks Spy Car! You converted me to now recommend Robinson FULLY to SOME people, rather than to just glean small pieces :lol:

[Hunter]

I think that you are gentling and romanticizing Robinson more than even he'd approve. The man is a wingnut. Really, he is. That doesn't make him good or evil or what-have-you. I don't care one way or another except that as an Oregonian, I will do what I can to make sure he doesn't become one of our congressional Representatives; and as a homeschooler I would not look to him for curriculum materials advice.

 

Am I romanticizing Art, or the idea of ANY of the old-schoolers entering politics? The cross over is funny to me, and I can't help it. :lol:

 

It's a tragedy that his wife died. If she had lived, how different this all would be. This is just one of those moments in history, where paths crossed that were never meant to cross. A man from his social group just does not usually end out with an office/lab full of children to school every day while still needing to work enough to keep food--with no sugar in it--on the table.

 

Camy, I'm sorry this thread got off topic, and for any part I played in that. But, I've been having myself :lol: after :lol: and have learned SO much. And by the responses here and in my PM box, I think others have been learning and growing too.

[tuzor]

AA

Does anyone know of any decent literature study guides, that might be a good plan for the OP in place of the Robinson book list, and flash cards? Something with vocabulary lists, tests, and history and science background?

 

I am really interested in this can anyone point us in this direction?

[Hunter]

Tuzor, for middle and high school, I stumbled upon the Glencoe Reader's Choice Literature textbooks. You can get the early 2000 editions for pennies. Teacher's manuals are unnecessary if you are using the Robinson method with these texts.

 

Supplements for the textbooks.

Reading lists

Study Guides

[ncmomof5]

OP and Tuzor,

 

I have recently been looking at heritage history. They may have what your are looking for.

 

www.heritage-history.com

 

HTH,

 

RuthAnn

[sewingmama]

I looked at his website a little while ago - I'm always intrigued when I hear of "big lists of literature" :drool5:

 

I lost interest when he mentioned sitting them down to do all the work on their own - I homeschool because I want to TEACH -as in - interact with my kids - not to send them off to a desk to sit quietly and have them read all day so I can get on with my own stuff.

 

The method wouldn't work for my kids - they tend to stare at the wall and out the window if left on their own.

 

Plus it seems most (all) of his children went into science/math fields when they graduated. What happens if you have a child not interested in those fields. I hated math and science as a kid - that kind of education would have been torture to me. Also there seemed to be no room for things like Art. It seems I am one of the few who thinks Art is very important for kids and considering my DD wants to be an Art teacher when she grows up I feel it would be neglegent of me to tell her "No we aren't going to do any Art you have to do all math and science subjects". Who am I to pick out their future careers KWIM.

 

Plus

The rigorous education is the fact the fluff is left off and the child actually learns material at an early age because there is no distracting fluff.

 

My kids LOVE the fluff and I don't mind it either. If we want to waste an hour or two mummifieying a chicken I don't see it as being "non-rigerous". There are other skills they are learning here that are just as important as gathering "facts" - working together, having fun, following through on a project till the end. I recently discovered my kids SUCK at group work when I got them to work on a lapbook together. Previously we have always made an individual one for each child - this time I just wanted one copy :laugh: My kids fought over who did what and didn't get the concept of working together at all. I realised I need to make a concentrated effort on getting them to work together in groups more often - after all most careers are built on working together in groups and sharing the tasks. In the RC curriculum - working alone all the time -I don't see how they can attain these skills very easily.

 

My DD is way too social to be able to handle a curriculum like this - she just doesn't like to work without interaction from other people.

 

I've never been a big believer that reading books and doing math work with little else required is going to make someone educated. Sure they will gather a lot of facts in their head -but I would rather take my kids out to vist a real zoo then have them read about it in a book KWIM.

[Reya]

I don't homeschool to make myself a martyr or to stroke my ego. I homeschool for the benefit of my children. In my opinion, the #1 thing I can teach my kids is how to learn independently. My son has been increasingly independent since 7 and is now 90% independent.

 

You can most certainly have happy, well-balanced, well-educated children while spending no more than half an hour per day per kid in direct instruction and correction, once they are old enough.

 

That said, RC is NOT my favorite way of doing this!