WWYD: Domestic Violence

[shinyhappypeople]

My 25 yo niece has been with her boyfriend for about 5 years. They have a 4 year old daughter together. She also has a 6 year old son from a previous relationship.

 

Her current boyfriend is a complete jerk. When she was pregnant with their daughter, he carjacked her vehicle, beat her up and he ended up in jail.

 

I guess he said he was sorry, and got a little bit of "anger management" counseling or some such BS, because they got back together and stayed together for years. However, nothing much has changed.

 

Her son told my mom a year or two ago that J is scary and said something about he (my nephew) was going to call the cops and have J "put in a cage" (meaning jail). She showed up to Thanksgiving 1-1/2 years ago with a black eye. There have been other unexplained bruises, but nothing as blatant as the black eye, kwim?

 

This is all stuff that we know about. I can't begin to imagine what happens behind closed doors.

 

So finally, finally, finally a few weeks ago she KICKED HIM TO THE CURB! Yeah!! We were all doing happy dances.

 

Today on her facebook status I see that she's "in a relationship" and posted that she's "eating with my babe" (then a link to HIS profile).

 

YOU HAVE GOT TO BE F-------G KIDDING ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

She is allowing herself to be abused (awful!) But she's also allowing her children to be abused by proxy, because when THEY see her being screamed at and hit, it wounds them, too! She's raising her beautiful son to be an abuser and her sweet daughter to be a victim.

 

I feel bad for saying this, but I am *so* fed up with it! In my mind, she's gone from being a victim to a martyr. She has been told repeatedly by our family that we love her, we're here for her, will help her in any way possible. She has us (extended family) as a soft place to fall!

 

But, instead she CHOOSES to go back with her abusive boyfriend and expose herself and her babies to violence and God only knows what else. Meanwhile, I feel like we (her family) get dragged along on this roller coaster ride of loving her and watching helplessly while she self-destructs.

 

My mom wisely pointed out they we do NOT need to ride this roller coaster with her. Sounds wise, eh? But not sure how it works in the real world. How on earth do I just let go completely, knowing that her and her kids might DIE at the hands of this guy? How can I love her AND let her go at the same time?

 

I'm mad at her, but I feel like I'm not supposed to be angry. Everything in me wants to comment on her fb post, "Are you out of your F---g mind??" Of course, I won't, but... dang! It's so hard to keep my mouth shut!

 

Stopping here... nothing else relevant to say. Just a lot of anger and frustration at both J and my niece.

Please pray. And if you've BTDT (or know someone who has), I'm open to hearing your advice.

 

Thanks for reading all this.

 

ETA: She's in Texas and I'm in California. :(

[SonshineLearner]

Sorry for you! Mostly sorry for her kids... and sorry for this situation she can't/won't get herself out of... SHE may be ok going through it, but her kids have no choice ;(

 

Sorry!! :(

[C_l_e_0..Q_c]

and we're having daily updates in the newspaper about a doctor who killed his two children.

 

Why or why do women (or even some men) accept such a situation??? The OP doesn't have a choice to accept it, but the niece does. Sigh.

[Pink Fairy]

I've never understood this either, but I've always assumed there were some significant mental health issues with any woman who stays with/goes back to an abuser if she has support and other choices.

 

Has anyone reported the situation to CPS? Poor her, and poor children!!!

[Starr]

If the children talk about it, it should be reported.

[Jean in Newcastle]

You can't do anything directly for your niece. But you can call CPS for the children. I know it sounds like that would be being mean to your niece but it isn't. It would be protecting her children and hopefully would give her a wake-up call to the danger she's putting them in.

[amo_mea_filiis.]

If the children talk about it, it should be reported.

 

You can't do anything directly for your niece. But you can call CPS for the children. I know it sounds like that would be being mean to your niece but it isn't. It would be protecting her children and hopefully would give her a wake-up call to the danger she's putting them in.

 

:iagree:

[ktgrok]

I'd tell her I was very afraid for her children. And that living in an abusive home is reason enough for the kids to be removed from the home. That if she wants to keep her kids she needs to make different choices. That she can do whatever she wants, but the kids are innocent and have to be protected.

[Abigail4476]

Something I've never been able to understand, but I've seen it play out several times. My sister's first husband was horribly abusive, and she finally left him after about 5 years of marriage or so...only to go back a year later when he promised he had reformed. THAT time he nearly killed her and she finally left him for good.

 

My FIL abused my MIL and their four kids (including my husband) the whole time they were growing up. He continued to be verbally and physically abusive to my MIL after all the kids were grown and out of the house. A couple of summers ago, she finally moved out with the help of her kids. And 6 months later she was back.

 

I don't get it. If my husband raised a hand to me, I'd probably kick him in the shins and then call in the posse. And if he touched our kids, it would be over my dead body. What goes haywire with the maternal or survival instinct that leads women to allow themselves or their kids to be abused? I know it's complicated and there are mental issues that go along with being a victim of abuse, but I really can't wrap my head around it. :confused:

 

I agree with your Mom that you don't have to ride this roller coaster with her, but at the same time, I wouldn't remove myself from her life completely because I would want to keep an eye on those kids, even if I had to do it from a distance.

[kchara]

I agree with calling CPS. There's no reason those children should have to be exposed to that sort of violence.

[abbeyej]

I've never understood this either, but I've always assumed there were some significant mental health issues with any woman who stays with/goes back to an abuser if she has support and other choices.

 

There aren't. I mean, besides the obvious insanity of returning, there aren't necessarily *additional* mental health issues for these women. It's shocking and totally unfathomable, but they aren't (as a group) more likely to have prior mental illness or instability or a particular pattern of childhood trauma, etc, etc. All of the nice explanations we'd like to come up with.

 

They just don't seem to apply.

 

And I agree with all of those who've said before that it's totally incomprehensible. Why on *earth* would an otherwise intelligent woman stay with a man who abuses her? Especially when she has friends and family that would *love* to help her out of the situation. If she has no children that she fears losing or being unable to support, what on earth could keep her there? If her children are suffering, what on earth could keep her there?

 

Why do these women return on average seven times before leaving for good?!?

 

It's a total mystery to me. And yet it seems to happen over and over again. ... Before I had a female close to me go through this, I always assumed there were outside "reasons". The more I know, the more non-sensical it all seems.

[Jean in Newcastle]

There aren't. I mean, besides the obvious insanity of returning, there aren't necessarily *additional* mental health issues for these women. It's shocking and totally unfathomable, but they aren't (as a group) more likely to have prior mental illness or instability or a particular pattern of childhood trauma, etc, etc. All of the nice explanations we'd like to come up with.

 

 

 

They return because they really do love the man and confuse what they are being shown in the "good times" (ie. the times when he is remorseful) as love. They return because if they have kids, they know that this is their baby's daddy and he loves them and the kids love him. They return because often the man is the one who controls all the money and it is extremely scary to step out without any. They return because there are late night death threats and other threats to find them if they do leave. They return because their self esteem has been worn away and they are so tired and on one level they really feel like this is as good as it gets. Except for the children (who blessedly I didn't have until I was with my very stable, loving dh), I've lived it.

[EJCMom]

No helpful advice as we are in the exact same situation with my SIL. It truly makes no sense. But, I will say that what your mother said is correct. We finally had to distance ourselves from my SIL because of the upheaval it was causing our family. And I couldn't deal with the stress that everytime she would show up with some mysterious bruise that my DH would decide to deal with it and have him end up in jail for asault. We will always be here for her if she ever decides that she does want help, but the sad fact is that you can't help someone who doesn't want to be helped. :grouphug:

[jenL]

They return because they really do love the man and confuse what they are being shown in the "good times" (ie. the times when he is remorseful) as love. They return because if they have kids, they know that this is their baby's daddy and he loves them and the kids love him. They return because often the man is the one who controls all the money and it is extremely scary to step out without any. They return because there are late night death threats and other threats to find them if they do leave. They return because their self esteem has been worn away and they are so tired and on one level they really feel like this is as good as it gets. Except for the children (who blessedly I didn't have until I was with my very stable, loving dh), I've lived it.

 

 

:grouphug: I'm so glad you were able to get out of it.

[idnib]

I agree with calling CPS. Also set aside the money she might need when she does decide to run. Many women have finally left for good and found out that friends and family were saving money to help in the final escape. Give her the name and number of a shelter in her area.

[Rosie_0801]

Why do these women return on average seven times before leaving for good?!?

 

In addition to what Jean said, there's a trend of raising females to take responsibility for more than they ought, for things that really ought to be other people's responsibilities. It's not really that surprising that women in domestic abuse situations feel that it would all be ok if they were better people. If they were more pleasing to the eye, better tempered, if they denied themselves anything that costs money, if they baked apple pies like his work colleagues' wives...

 

Rosie

[thowell]

I have BTDT with my ex-dh for 4 years. Let me see if I can help explain a few things. When you enter a relationship with an abuser he doesn't just start out by knocking the crap out of you. In my case it was quite the opposite. I had a daughter who was seven, a home of our own, a good job, etc. He was a great guy (so I thought). When we decided to move in together things were fine for awhile, then it started slowly with mental abuse. You have to remember that most abuser know exactly what they are doing. They start by tearing you down after they have built your trust. You honestly begin thinking you aren't doing things right. Once they get you emotionally beat down the physical abuse starts. I left several times and always went back, sometimes out of fear, but more often than not I honestly thought it was me that had the problem. I didn't keep the house clean enough, cook good enough, make enough money etc. Then I became pregnant because he threw out my pills. The mental abuse continue although he didn't hit me while I was pregnant. Once the baby was born anything that went wrong with her was my fault. I was a bad mother (so he told me). It just goes on and on. And the physical abuse got worse. I can assure you the bruises you see are just a small part. Again they are smart they know how to torture and inflict pain in areas where you can't see the marks. You have to realize a woman in an abusive situation has been slowly beat down mentally. How did things change you may want to know? For me it was God and hitting the bottom of the barrel. Some woman get out earlier and some never get out. All you can do is love her and continue to let her know you are there. Encourage her in any positive way you can for her skills in life. Before my marriage to the ex I always said the same thing many of you have said,"I would never take that crap", "How can woman allow that?", "If my husband ever hit me I would...". Abuser are manipulative and very good con-men. If there is anything I can tell you please don't hesitate to ask. This is my testimony and I hope it helps someone. An I will pray for her and her children and you family.

[thowell]

In addition to what Jean said, there's a trend of raising females to take responsibility for more than they ought, for things that really ought to be other people's responsibilities. It's not really that surprising that women in domestic abuse situations feel that it would all be ok if they were better people. If they were more pleasing to the eye, better tempered, if they denied themselves anything that costs money, if they baked apple pies like his work colleagues' wives...

 

Rosie

 

 

Well said!

[ThatCyndiGirl]

I understand your frustration.

 

First of all, if you bad-mouth him to her or to anyone else and it gets back to her she willl likely feel the need to defend him.

 

IF YOU DO NOT HONOUR THE ATTACHMENT THAT SHE HAS TO HIM THEN YOU WILL COME OFF AS SOMEONE WHO DOESN'T UNDERSTAND. And, let's be truthful, you DON'T understand. (None of us do!)

 

It IS hard to understand what she sees in him and to understand why she stays. He has probably made her feel like such trash/garbage/useless/worthless that she believes that no man willl ever love her. He may have said those exact words.

[amey311]

Statistically, that 6 year old is in a dangerous situation. He's living with a violent step-father. That boy is low man on the totem pole, and I'd be especially concerned for him. I don't know if his father is a safer environment, but please keep him in mind and ask after him.

 

And I know there are discussions here all the time about how rude it is for family members to segregate step children. In this case, with this man, it very well WILL make a HUGE difference. He's caring for another man's child and he's already been violent. Statistically, that boy is more at risk than the biological daughter.

[kolamum]

I'm sorry. We had family that this was happening with and until the wife made up her mind there was little anyone could do. However, one of her determining factors in making up her mind was when a family member told her if she didn't do something NOW they'd sue for rights to the children. I don't think she understood, fully, how much harm was happening to her kids because of it.

 

I will say, though, that she'll need a mega support system to stay away. The friend I know didn't have one and after a year ended up back where she started. The problem is no more, but the repercussions from it are still being fought some 5 years later. It's so sad..

[Parrothead]

I have BTDT with my ex-dh for 4 years. Let me see if I can help explain a few things. When you enter a relationship with an abuser he doesn't just start out by knocking the crap out of you. In my case it was quite the opposite. I had a daughter who was seven, a home of our own, a good job, etc. He was a great guy (so I thought). When we decided to move in together things were fine for awhile, then it started slowly with mental abuse. You have to remember that most abuser know exactly what they are doing. They start by tearing you down after they have built your trust. You honestly begin thinking you aren't doing things right. Once they get you emotionally beat down the physical abuse starts. I left several times and always went back, sometimes out of fear, but more often than not I honestly thought it was me that had the problem. I didn't keep the house clean enough, cook good enough, make enough money etc. Then I became pregnant because he threw out my pills. The mental abuse continue although he didn't hit me while I was pregnant. Once the baby was born anything that went wrong with her was my fault. I was a bad mother (so he told me). It just goes on and on. And the physical abuse got worse. I can assure you the bruises you see are just a small part. Again they are smart they know how to torture and inflict pain in areas where you can't see the marks. You have to realize a woman in an abusive situation has been slowly beat down mentally. How did things change you may want to know? For me it was God and hitting the bottom of the barrel. Some woman get out earlier and some never get out. All you can do is love her and continue to let her know you are there. Encourage her in any positive way you can for her skills in life. Before my marriage to the ex I always said the same thing many of you have said,"I would never take that crap", "How can woman allow that?", "If my husband ever hit me I would...". Abuser are manipulative and very good con-men. If there is anything I can tell you please don't hesitate to ask. This is my testimony and I hope it helps someone. An I will pray for her and her children and you family.

:grouphug:

 

Just to reiterate, women who are in these relationships really truly are brainwashed by the men.

 

One of the saddest cases I worked was when I arrested him, he had been beating his very pregnant wife. He was in jail for a year and part of his sentence was he could not step foot in ______ County for 5 years.

 

The woman had the baby, worked in her parent's business seemed to be getting her act together over the course of his incarceration only to move to the adjacent county where he was living 6 months after he got out of jail.

[rlugbill]

Very tough issue. I feel for her and the children. I wish you or any of us could wave a magic wand and make it better.

 

Although many people have said to call CPS, I disagree. First of all, you would need to know some specific facts of something that happened. You didn't witness anything. I don't think you have enough information to make a specific report about child abuse or neglect.

 

Second, and more importantly, she could lose her children. They could be placed in foster care. And I know that everyone thinks that would keep the children safe, but it's not true. Foster care is dangerous for children.

 

It disrupts their entire world- no stability. To them, it's like their parents died or something. And children in foster care are frequently abused in foster care.

 

In some places CPS is more enlightened, but in my exerience with CPS, they often make a bad situation worse.

 

The best you can do is to make sure she has some support system. People who are being abused are often cut off from friends and family. Part of the abuse is to isolate the person socially so they don't have any significant social contacts other than the abuser.

 

Keep reaching out and encourage others to do so also. Not in an attempt to convince her to take any specific action, but to just be a friend- to be of support. And possibly to encourage her to get some support from a counselor, and from family and friends.

 

Sorry but sometimes you can't fix the whole world. If it were easy, it would be all fixed by now.

[shinyhappypeople]

I just wanted to say thank you to everyone who took the time to reply. I'm still thinking things through. It does help me understand (somewhat) when I think of her as being brainwashed. I know a fair bit about abusive cults and so if I think of this as being a very, very tiny cult it makes more sense. Not sure if it's a fair comparison or not.

 

One thing I did recently was I looked up her local domestic violence organization. They were participating in the Chase Community of Caring thing on facebook, so I voted for them and then made sure my vote posted to my profile and to the newsfeed so she'd see it and know that there was somewhere close to her that was ready to help. She "liked" that post, so... ??? I guess I'm somewhat comforted that at least she knows how to find help. And she can always find the link on my profile.

 

The poster who mentioned the danger my great-nephew is in being the "stepson" and low man on the totem pole in the boyfriend's eyes ... that just scares that living crap out of me. I hadn't thought of it like that before.

 

Anyway, thanks. Prayers for her and her kids' safety are appreciated.

 

(I almost didn't post this. I swear I'm not a crazy munchausen (sp?) troll.)