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Wedding Pictures Debacle!


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You have my total sympathy. We had a similar experience when we had a tennant like your photographer. We were three hours away by car. She would call and tell us some terrible problem about the house and some astronomically expensive work it needed and then we'd call the repair person and get a totally different story. It took us about a year to figure out we couldn't believe her. The last month she was in the house she didn't pay the rent. I emailed her and she responded that I had said the deposit could be the last month's rent! I emailed back, with a copy to her military husband at work, that I most certainly had not, that I would never release the deposit until after we had walked through the house!

 

We wanted to show the house to sell while the tennant was in it, but HER friend, a realtor, advised us against it because we wouldn't want her speaking to potential buyers! I was SOOO relieved when she moved out.

 

I think she had some sort of personality disorder. I don't think she realized her view of things was not the way it was. It was just so pervasive it was scary. I don't think she could have held down a job.

 

Mary

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It sounds like she doesn't know what she's doing - both as a business person and as a photographer.

 

I've studied photography, taught photography at the HS level, been self-employed as a photographer for many years, and I am confident in my abilities, but I almost always turned away weddings because if the slightest thing goes wrong, you can't redo the shoot. No amount of Photoshop can fix an improperly shot image. And this is where a large problem lies. With the advent of DLSRs, people think the ability to buy a camera gives them the ability to take a good image and open up a business. It's just not so.

 

If I were in your shoes, I would ask her point-blank - did the images just not come out? If so, I'd still want to see them to find out what, if any, is salvageable. If she admits she messed up, I'd ask for her RAW files (hopefully she shot RAW and not JPEG) and see if another (experienced/qualified) photographer can make any improvements.

 

Hopefully she's just really slow on her post-processing and the images are ok. If not, I'd check with professional organizations to see if she's a member, and if so, report her.

http://www.ppa.com/

http://www.wppionline.com/

google Professional Photographers of (your state)

Edited by aliya
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Thank you all for asking! We met at Starbucks, very brief meeting. . .so brief we didn't sit down, but she brought the CD of photos and a written plan to complete the process from selection to wedding book, so hopefully all will go smooth from here on out.

 

What gets me is that this woman SEEMS very normal and honest when you talk to her, the problem is that she lies so sincerely that I truly believe she thinks she telling the truth. My dd said she "almost" felt sorry for her. :glare: I nipped that in the bud :lol:

 

It's just bizarre.

 

AND. . she lies when the truth can be validated, such as when she gave us the disc she stated there were 500 pictures on it, well when I got home and opened it, it only took me a single minute to figure out that there were 319.

 

I could also tell the disc had been put together in the past couple days, all you have to do is click on it, and look at the properties.

 

DD is not happy with the "shortage" of engagement shots, as the photographer had only put 14 on the disc and they spent 3 hours on this session.

 

So anywho, we are going to email about the difference between 319 and 500 along with the shortage of engagement shots to see if she made a mistake or didn't have time to finish adding them.

 

This disc contains untouched photos, a handful or so are very off-center, so she didn't put anytime into editing them as she was suppose to and I can transfer every picture on my SD card to a disc in minutes, ya know?

 

The thing is, beyond the lies and delays for us, we know at least two other brides she's done the same thing to. So it's not isolated or the result of some catastrophe in her life, however, it's way beyond my thinking to even fathon WHY on earth this has gone on like this.

 

Have you ever known someone who lies and makes up stories when it would be just as easy to tell the truth or do the right thing? Just SO weird. Not something I can comprehend.

 

She stood there looking at us lying about things we have documentation of otherwise, to the point of basically calling my daughter a liar, but she didn't bat an eye in doing it. :001_huh:

 

 

 

 

I'm completely baffled myself. :001_huh::001_huh: Geesh!

 

 

HOLD UP! She gave you a CD of 319 UNEDITED images? Oh my heck. That is unbelievable. I would never give clients unedited images. NEVER. And she has had time to fully edit them. There is no excuse for that crap.

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It sounds like she doesn't know what she's doing - both as a business person and as a photographer.

 

I've studied photography, taught photography at the HS level, been self-employed as a photographer for many years, and I am confident in my abilities, but I almost always turned away weddings because if the slightest thing goes wrong, you can't redo the shoot. No amount of Photoshop can fix an improperly shot image. And this is where a large problem lies. With the advent of DLSRs, people think the ability to buy a camera gives them the ability to take a good image and open up a business. It's just not so.

 

If I were in your shoes, I would ask her point-blank - did the images just not come out? If so, I'd still want to see them to find out what, if any, is salvageable. If she admits she messed up, I'd ask for her RAW files (hopefully she shot RAW and not JPEG) and see if another (experienced/qualified) photographer can make any improvements.

 

Hopefully she's just really slow on her post-processing and the images are ok. If not, I'd check with professional organizations to see if she's a member, and if so, report her.

http://www.ppa.com/

http://www.wppionline.com/

google Professional Photographers of (your state)

 

:iagree:ITA with everything you said.

 

HOLD UP! She gave you a CD of 319 UNEDITED images? Oh my heck. That is unbelievable. I would never give clients unedited images. NEVER. And she has had time to fully edit them. There is no excuse for that crap.

 

At the very least, I would crop & color balance proofs before handing them over.

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I have known a pathological liar and the scary part is that she lied so convincing and about things that it was so easy to find out that she was lying about. We ended up cutting her out of our life since we just got tired of all the stupid and often silly lies but also some hurtful lies that damaged our family. Sorry you are having to deal with this woman and her lies.

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I have a habitual liar in my family- by marriage. I've watched this for two decades now, and it is really something. I think he just has to do it, has to be dramatic, has to be exciting...I don't get it. Our liar has offered up that he works with Dr.'s without borders in the same breath as his "patients" making a group of people believe he must be a Dr. um, no- never went to college. Also at a football party he announced to a roomful of people that he was recruited by a big college and played a bit but quit, couldn't handle the politics there or something like that. He never went to college period. Most people in the room know this, have known him most of his life...and yet out this pops. I don't get it. Another family member close to me is embarrassed by him, but I look at it as entertainment, and I never ever, ever believe anything he tells me. But, he is very convincing. Lying is like breathing to him, it seems.

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It sounds like she doesn't know what she's doing - both as a business person and as a photographer.

 

If I were in your shoes, I would ask her point-blank - did the images just not come out? If so, I'd still want to see them to find out what, if any, is salvageable. If she admits she messed up, I'd ask for her RAW files (hopefully she shot RAW and not JPEG) and see if another (experienced/qualified) photographer can make any improvements.

 

Hopefully she's just really slow on her post-processing and the images are ok. If not, I'd check with professional organizations to see if she's a member, and if so, report her.

http://www.ppa.com/

http://www.wppionline.com/

google Professional Photographers of (your state)

 

Thanks for the links, I checked, she's not on either. I'm not surprised by that at this point though :glare:

 

What are RAW files? What could I do with these?

 

I think if I get some updated photo editing software, I can make a few good ones for dd. Is there something you'd recommend?

 

Honestly, I think the only saving grace here is that they were taken with a good camera, but even that only goes so far.

 

I think she had some sort of personality disorder. I don't think she realized her view of things was not the way it was. It was just so pervasive it was scary. I don't think she could have held down a job.

 

Mary

 

Hear! Hear! Must be why this lady is an independent photographer. When you have limited interaction with someone it's easier to fool them into believing your okay :D

 

HOLD UP! She gave you a CD of 319 UNEDITED images? Oh my heck. That is unbelievable. I would never give clients unedited images. NEVER. And she has had time to fully edit them. There is no excuse for that crap.

 

Yep. Unbelievable. :iagree:

 

What do you do as part of the editing process?

 

 

I have known a pathological liar and the scary part is that she lied so convincing and about things that it was so easy to find out that she was lying about. We ended up cutting her out of our life since we just got tired of all the stupid and often silly lies but also some hurtful lies that damaged our family. Sorry you are having to deal with this woman and her lies.

 

It's been a headache for sure, and my daughter has been in tears more than once. I wish there was a way to warn others about her. I hate to think of another young unsuspecting bride having to endure this too.

 

If I hadn't gotten involved, my dd would still have nothing. The woman wasn't even responding to contacts my dd initiated - 3 in the past month with NO response whatsoever. Not to mention the prior months. And then to have the audacity to outright lie AND insuate my dd was lying. ARGH!! Talk about maddening!

 

I'm just glad she has "something" now. :tongue_smilie:

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What are RAW files? What could I do with these?

 

I think if I get some updated photo editing software, I can make a few good ones for dd. Is there something you'd recommend?

 

Honestly, I think the only saving grace here is that they were taken with a good camera, but even that only goes so far.

 

RAW files are the native format file that a camera shoots. For Nikon files, you would need either Nikon's software or Adobe Bridge or Lightroom. For Canon files - you'd need Canon or Adobe software. RAW files contain more data than a JPEG file, which is compressed. Essentially, a RAW file captures a broader range of values (light to dark) per pixel than a JPEG file, which captures minimal info. Raw files are also easier for correcting or fine tuning white balance. I've always compared RAW files with digital to negatives with film. It's the best "original" you can get.

 

At this point, I wouldn't recommend getting anything to correct the files (if they do need correcting). I'd wait and see what you really end up with.

 

How were the files that she gave you? I noticed you said you transferred them really quickly. Were they even full resolution or were they screen resolution? I'd be curious to see some.

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If you have a moment to pray over this situation, I'd appreciate it!

 

It's going on six months since my daughter's wedding and we are in a predicament with the photographer. :glare: She has not provided proofs, or anything else for that matter, (CD's, Wedding Album, etc.) and is not responding to phone calls, emails or texts.

 

This photographer was recommend by a reputable bridal shop, so we had no idea this would happen, but I did send her a strongly worded letter yesterday, contacted the bridal shop, and have every intention of filing suit if she does not come through and fulfill her end of the contract in 30 days.

 

Two other friends of my dd used this same person - one married in August 2010, one in April 2010 - neither of them have all of their contracted items, my daughter has none!

 

 

It's just sad to see these young girls taken advantage of and of course, they are all scared to say too much of anything to her because they want their wedding pictures.

 

Please pray this woman comes through and makes good on her end. Nobody wants to go down the hard road here, these precious gals just want their wedding memories preserved and delivered as promised!

 

I am so sorry, how awful Same thing happened to my sil, all she had were the ones I took. I hope and pray for a miracle for your dd.

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This is the image information from one shot, does this mean anything to anyone? :)

 

Image Size,4288x2848

Shutter Speed,1/60

F-Stop,5.6

ISO Speed,200

Flash,Yes

Exposure Program,Aperture Priority

Exposure Bias,0.0

Resolution (DPI),240

Exposure Metering,Spot

White Balance,Auto White Balance

Contrast,Low

Saturation,Normal

Sharpness,Normal

Lens Focal Length,66.0

Lens Focal Length in 35mm,99

Digital Zoom Ratio,1/1

Date and Time Created,10/2/2010 2:36:39 PM

Manufacturer,NIKON CORPORATION

Model,NIKON D2Xs

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You may want to send something with delivery confirmation and a signature requirement.

 

I sure hope it works out.:grouphug:

 

I sent her an email yesterday telling her she had 30 days to fulfil her end or I'd help all of the girls take her to court. I followed that up with a phone call (she never answers, so I left a message) then I also sent a text.

 

No response as of yet.

 

I cc'd the bridal shop on the email I sent and I think the district manager of the bridal shop was going to try and contact her as well. (but obviously, they are not doing business with her or recommending her anymore).

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RAW files are the native format file that a camera shoots. For Nikon files, you would need either Nikon's software or Adobe Bridge or Lightroom. For Canon files - you'd need Canon or Adobe software. RAW files contain more data than a JPEG file, which is compressed. Essentially, a RAW file captures a broader range of values (light to dark) per pixel than a JPEG file, which captures minimal info. Raw files are also easier for correcting or fine tuning white balance. I've always compared RAW files with digital to negatives with film. It's the best "original" you can get.

 

At this point, I wouldn't recommend getting anything to correct the files (if they do need correcting). I'd wait and see what you really end up with.

 

How were the files that she gave you? I noticed you said you transferred them really quickly. Were they even full resolution or were they screen resolution? I'd be curious to see some.

 

I posted some image information, does that help answer your questions?

The CD we have in hand is what she gets. She gets these copyright free to make the prints of her choice.

 

From this disc she also gets to pick out a handful (5-10) that the photographer is suppose to retouch and make a wedding album with, but then I think that's it. So what we have in hand now is hers to keep for whatever printing options she chooses on her own.

 

 

 

I had a friend this happened to. How did you pay the photographer? They disputed the old charges on their credit card and got alot of their money back.

 

She paid via cash and check. . has receipt and check for her records. So no option for credit card dispute. Ugh too bad, that would have been a nice option!

 

I am so sorry, how awful Same thing happened to my sil, all she had were the ones I took. I hope and pray for a miracle for your dd.

 

I can't imagine. That would be so heartbreaking.

 

I know my dd was getting very concerned that she wasn't going to get anything, so we are so grateful that we at least have the CD now!

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I posted some image information, does that help answer your questions?

The CD we have in hand is what she gets. She gets these copyright free to make the prints of her choice.

 

From this disc she also gets to pick out a handful (5-10) that the photographer is suppose to retouch and make a wedding album with, but then I think that's it. So what we have in hand now is hers to keep for whatever printing options she chooses on her own.

 

 

 

 

 

She paid via cash and check. . has receipt and check for her records. So no option for credit card dispute. Ugh too bad, that would have been a nice option!

 

 

 

I can't imagine. That would be so heartbreaking.

 

I know my dd was getting very concerned that she wasn't going to get anything, so we are so grateful that we at least have the CD now!

 

PM'd you.

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Does this mean that you finally got the proofs?

 

We got the disc from her Wednesday evening. This is image information from one of the photos on the disc we got from her.

 

I saved them to my computer and opened it in HP Photosmart Premier to see the information - most of which reads like foreign language to me ;)

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The CD we have in hand is what she gets. She gets these copyright free to make the prints of her choice.

 

 

 

Please make sure you have something in writing on this. Many places will not make prints without proof of copyright release if something appears to be professionally done.

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This is the image information from one shot, does this mean anything to anyone? :)

 

Image Size,4288x2848

Shutter Speed,1/60

F-Stop,5.6

ISO Speed,200

Flash,Yes

Exposure Program,Aperture Priority

Exposure Bias,0.0

Resolution (DPI),240

Exposure Metering,Spot

White Balance,Auto White Balance

Contrast,Low

Saturation,Normal

Sharpness,Normal

Lens Focal Length,66.0

Lens Focal Length in 35mm,99

Digital Zoom Ratio,1/1

Date and Time Created,10/2/2010 2:36:39 PM

Manufacturer,NIKON CORPORATION

Model,NIKON D2Xs

 

I'm not a professional, but I can at least tell you that the resolution of this picture is high enough that you should be able to get large prints made with no program. That is very good news! What file format are these, JPG? NEF (nikon's raw format) would have been nice, but then you wouldn't have been able to open them without the right software. Since they are unedited, maybe you could get another professional to help you edit them (maybe a photographer on this board even?).

 

I'm glad you got the cd, I would maybe try and get a signed release for the pictures. Many photo places won't print professional pictures without a release form saying you have permission from the photographer.

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This is the image information from one shot, does this mean anything to anyone? :)

 

Image Size,4288x2848

Shutter Speed,1/60

F-Stop,5.6

ISO Speed,200

Flash,Yes

Exposure Program,Aperture Priority

Exposure Bias,0.0

Resolution (DPI),240

Exposure Metering,Spot

White Balance,Auto White Balance

Contrast,Low

Saturation,Normal

Sharpness,Normal

Lens Focal Length,66.0

Lens Focal Length in 35mm,99

Digital Zoom Ratio,1/1

Date and Time Created,10/2/2010 2:36:39 PM

Manufacturer,NIKON CORPORATION

Model,NIKON D2Xs

 

The resolution and image size are good....you can make large prints with that. The shutter speed is a little slow for shooting people. Is that particular photo blurry at all? I try to stay near 90 or 100 for shooting people....definitely not below 80. It gets a little hard to hand hold with a shutter speed that slow. Unless she was using a tripod....which would be difficult at a wedding with all the moving around a photographer needs to do.

 

Maybe she's not really a professional and the photos didn't turn out as well as what she would have liked, therefore she was hoping you guys would just "forget" about them? Crazy, yes, but I wonder if the shots weren't up to par.

 

I CANNOT BELIEVE that she gave you UN-EDITED proofs! How tacky!!! A photographer should NEVER give unedited proofs. Yeah, definitely wouldn't be recommending her to anyone!

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And about getting a copyright release....if the photos are not very good then no one is going to think they are professional. So you wouldn't have to worry about a release. But if they do look decent, you should get one. Even WalGreens has stopped me from printing MY OWN photos there because they said I needed a copyright release. I said I AM the photographer! LOL

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Even WalGreens has stopped me from printing MY OWN photos there because they said I needed a copyright release. I said I AM the photographer! LOL

 

My dh had this happen at Walmart. He has a very good camera for an amateur. And he takes excellent photos. People always want him to bring his camera places.

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Shutter speed isn't an issue when you use flash. Flash freezes motion. The file details look fine.

 

The question is - do you like the pictures? Can you work with them? If yes, then it sounds like you are lucky to have them at all after working with such a flake. Cropping really should be done when ordering anyway, because you would crop differently depending on size (e.g. 5x7 crops differently than 8x10).

 

I'd recommend printing with mpix.com - you can probably move the image around in their software (I've never used them specifically since I use a pro lab) but you should be able to select each picture, pick a size and THEN use their tools to make sure it's cropping in a nice way.

 

Hope that helps a bit.

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Shutter speed isn't an issue when you use flash. Flash freezes motion. The file details look fine.

 

The question is - do you like the pictures? Can you work with them? If yes, then it sounds like you are lucky to have them at all after working with such a flake. Cropping really should be done when ordering anyway, because you would crop differently depending on size (e.g. 5x7 crops differently than 8x10).

 

I'd recommend printing with mpix.com - you can probably move the image around in their software (I've never used them specifically since I use a pro lab) but you should be able to select each picture, pick a size and THEN use their tools to make sure it's cropping in a nice way.

 

Hope that helps a bit.

 

I like mpix.com-- I've never used their software, but my website auto orders through them, and I've always been happy with the end result.

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This is the image information from one shot, does this mean anything to anyone? :)

 

Image Size,4288x2848

Shutter Speed,1/60

F-Stop,5.6

ISO Speed,200

Flash,Yes

Exposure Program,Aperture Priority

Exposure Bias,0.0

Resolution (DPI),240

Exposure Metering,Spot

White Balance,Auto White Balance

Contrast,Low

Saturation,Normal

Sharpness,Normal

Lens Focal Length,66.0

Lens Focal Length in 35mm,99

Digital Zoom Ratio,1/1

Date and Time Created,10/2/2010 2:36:39 PM

Manufacturer,NIKON CORPORATION

Model,NIKON D2Xs

 

Technically speaking, without having seen the actual image, you should be fine to print this type of file even in a large size.

 

I believe you asked me what I do as part of the editing process. Well...that's a complicated question. I use Photoshop. Like Kristina said, the very least is color correction and cropping. Sometimes I adjust the exposure, work on skin flaws, black and white conversions, etc. It can be very complicated.

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I CANNOT BELIEVE that she gave you UN-EDITED proofs! How tacky!!! A photographer should NEVER give unedited proofs. Yeah, definitely wouldn't be recommending her to anyone!

 

Sometimes I will release a disc of unedited proofs because that is what the bride can afford. If my bride has photo editing skills they tend to not want to pay for editing or if they really want a professional photographer but can't afford the proofs at this point in their young lives. I have never thought of it as being tacky, just thought of it as helping out budget conscience bride. :001_smile:

 

I am not saying that is what happen here, this is just makes me sick. I am truely sorry for what is happening and cannot imagine how your dd must feel.

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Sometimes I will release a disc of unedited proofs because that is what the bride can afford. If my bride has photo editing skills they tend to not want to pay for editing or if they really want a professional photographer but can't afford the proofs at this point in their young lives. I have never thought of it as being tacky, just thought of it as helping out budget conscience bride. :001_smile:

 

I am not saying that is what happen here, this is just makes me sick. I am truely sorry for what is happening and cannot imagine how your dd must feel.

 

I understand your reasoning, but personally I would rather offer 50 fully edited images than hundreds of unedited images. I am coming from a totally different perspective, I guess, because I also do not ever give full editing rights. I don't want someone to edit a photo badly that was taken by me.

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OMGoodness, you know what I just realized?? Some of the pictures are the exact same picture just cropped closer, closer, closer!

 

So the 14 engagement shots. . .is actually only 4-5 different photos!

 

Then there's one of my daughter alone at the front of the church that is on there about 4-5 times, just cropped closer, closer, closer!

 

ACK!! :tongue_smilie:

 

I know we are going to have to take this person to court, I wonder if we should wait until she has the wedding book done or go forth with what we have. I think my daughter wants to get her wedding book first.

 

Geez!

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OMGoodness, you know what I just realized?? Some of the pictures are the exact same picture just cropped closer, closer, closer!

 

So the 14 engagement shots. . .is actually only 4-5 different photos!

 

Then there's one of my daughter alone at the front of the church that is on there about 4-5 times, just cropped closer, closer, closer!

QUOTE]

 

I miscounted, it was actually 8 shots made into 14. I emailed her to see how many shots she had taken all together, she estimated 30 for the engagement, but said she didn't know how many for the wedding.

 

I think I could probably get more than 8 good photos out of 30 shots. I get better odds taking pictures of my infant and she doesn't sit still ;)

 

She also said 300 photos was a lot for a wedding. I guess maybe it would be, if it was 300 good photos, but some are not, i.e. there's a shot of the wine cork :001_huh: one of my dd's foot (intended to showcase the shoe perhaps?), and a few other curious ones, plus a few duplicates as mentioned above.

 

On editing, this was her response. .

 

"Yes, each photo is edited for exposure, contrast, color correctness, brightness, saturation, levels, and a few other things."

 

I honestly don't believe these photos were edited in this way. If you've looked at the shots I took that I posted on my blog, the *professional ones* look no different to me. Better resolution maybe, but nothing that would dazzle you by any means.

 

Thanks for the link to mpix. I'll send that to my daughter.

 

I appreciate all of the help and advice! This group is amazing!

 

We noticed last night that our 7 week old's belly button was protruding and I called the pediatrician then sat down to google the suspected cause - umbilical hernia. . .when my 8 yo came up behind me and said "hey, why don't you ask the homeschool Moms? they know a lot!"

 

Isn't she wise?? That shows you how often I've referred to the knowledge of this group. . .when you come before the basic google search, you've got something going for ya! :D

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OMGoodness, you know what I just realized?? Some of the pictures are the exact same picture just cropped closer, closer, closer!

 

So the 14 engagement shots. . .is actually only 4-5 different photos!

 

Then there's one of my daughter alone at the front of the church that is on there about 4-5 times, just cropped closer, closer, closer!

QUOTE]

 

I miscounted, it was actually 8 shots made into 14. I emailed her to see how many shots she had taken all together, she estimated 30 for the engagement, but said she didn't know how many for the wedding.

 

I think I could probably get more than 8 good photos out of 30 shots. I get better odds taking pictures of my infant and she doesn't sit still ;)

 

She also said 300 photos was a lot for a wedding. I guess maybe it would be, if it was 300 good photos, but some are not, i.e. there's a shot of the wine cork :001_huh: one of my dd's foot (intended to showcase the shoe perhaps?), and a few other curious ones, plus a few duplicates as mentioned above.

 

On editing, this was her response. .

 

"Yes, each photo is edited for exposure, contrast, color correctness, brightness, saturation, levels, and a few other things."

 

I honestly don't believe these photos were edited in this way. If you've looked at the shots I took that I posted on my blog, the *professional ones* look no different to me. Better resolution maybe, but nothing that would dazzle you by any means.

 

Thanks for the link to mpix. I'll send that to my daughter.

 

I appreciate all of the help and advice! This group is amazing!

 

We noticed last night that our 7 week old's belly button was protruding and I called the pediatrician then sat down to google the suspected cause - umbilical hernia. . .when my 8 yo came up behind me and said "hey, why don't you ask the homeschool Moms? they know a lot!"

 

Isn't she wise?? That shows you how often I've referred to the knowledge of this group. . .when you come before the basic google search, you've got something going for ya! :D

 

I average 600-1000 shots for a wedding. My college advisor told us in a seminar once that he shoots about 2000 shots. I'm sorry you got saddled with a flake.:grouphug:

 

And for the bolded... Isn't the group great!?

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  • 1 month later...

Sorry. This happened to a friend of mine. The photographer somehow messed up the pictures and didn't want to admit it, so she just dropped off the face of the earth. They finally tracked her down and she admitted what had happened and returned their deposit. Of course, they were still without professional pictures. Hope you get some resolution.

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