Update on pitbull attack...

[Mejane]

Our cat gets along great with our lab. I don't think I'd be as comfortable leaving her alone with a pit. YMMV.

Edited February 27, 2011 by Mejane

[LittleIzumi]

This pitbull is NOT a hunting dog. It is a "family pet"...a family pet that has killed once and now that it has will more than likely kill the next thing that runs from it. A dog, cat, goat, or a CHILD!

 

They are bred to have strong prey drive & hunting characteristics naturally, family pet or not. And no one can ever be 100% sure that ANY animal (or person) will never attack a person. It's not possible to know that about any creature 100%. We do know this particular pit was vicious towards animals & people so here the answer is clear. :grouphug:

Edited February 27, 2011 by LittleIzumi

[Love2Smile]

They are bred to have strong prey drive & hinting characteristics naturally, family pet or not. And no one can ever be 100% sure that ANY animal (or person) will never attack a person. It's not possible to know that about any creature 100%. We do know this particular pit was vicious towards animals & people so here the answer is clear. :grouphug:

Thank you!

[kalanamak]

 

FTR - The cat is head animal around here and the dogs bow to his royal kittyness. :lol:

 

I remember how kitty (a small non-fighter) used to slowly back an adversary near our house, and give out a certain "call". That was the signal for me to open the door and for the dog to go bounding out, sounding like murder in 4 paw drive, and chase the bully off. She would always stop exactly at our (unfenced) property line and come wagging back. It was all a show.

 

And oh, how I loved it when my rescue Dane, many, many years ago, would bow his head down and flop his big black ears back and forth so that the kitten, on her back, would swat at them.

 

That they have such potential makes each wild beast of a pet all the more awful. :grouphug:

[gardening momma]

Do I think that a dog chasing down and attacking a cat predisposes it to attacking a human? Even a small human? No. Remember, there are many, many hunting dogs bred even to this day for this purpose. It was the original purpose of man using dogs. My DH owns several hunting dogs, and our kids are right there when they go hunting. (Not something I do, but DH's thing).

Hunting dogs are trained to find, not necessarily kill, particular animals. Not usually cats. Or does your perspective come from the animals your dh's dogs hunt?

[jazzyfizzle]

Would you be willing to bet your life that this dog would not attack a human because it was "only a cat"??? Come on! How can you even say that and how could anyone be willing to chance it not being a person next time. To me that is totally irresponsible behavior

 

 

Sorry, maybe I wasn't too clear. I wasn't trying to cause you more pain, in fact, my heart goes out to you. I never would say it was only a cat.

 

:grouphug:

 

I said I felt the dog should put be down and was a danger.

Edited February 27, 2011 by jazzyfizzle

[jazzyfizzle]

Hunting dogs are trained to find, not necessarily kill, particular animals. Not usually cats. Or does your perspective come from the animals your dh's dogs hunt?

 

Yes it does. I do know that hunting dogs often view cats as potential prey animals. Hope that clarifies.

 

ETA: Our experiences are with coonhounds. They will view cats as prey as well as racoons and unfortunately, act accordingly. :(

Edited February 27, 2011 by jazzyfizzle

[jazzyfizzle]

They are bred to have strong prey drive & hunting characteristics naturally, family pet or not. And no one can ever be 100% sure that ANY animal (or person) will never attack a person. It's not possible to know that about any creature 100%. We do know this particular pit was vicious towards animals & people so here the answer is clear. :grouphug:

 

Thank you, you said it much better than I!

[goldberry]

You can never be 100% certain that a dog will not attack a human, even if the dog has never attacked another animal.

 

Cats kill birds, rodents, etc, but they are not considered vicious. Dogs will also at times kill birds or rodents, squirrels, etc. and are not considered vicious. Some dogs have a stronger prey drive, whether from breeding or training. I don't agree that makes them automatically more inclined to attack a human.

 

However, in the case of a dog attacking a cat, and in addition to showing aggression to humans, that obviously indicates a problem. I agree the dog should be put down. I just don't agree with the generalization about killing a cat equalling automatic threat to human. Dogs are animals with instincts like any other, even cats.

[justamouse]

What I am saying is that you are grieving, upset and angry and you are making very broad brush statements in your anger.

 

Okay, so you are saying it's a normal behavior and is okay and acceptable?

 

Kinda like "oh well, it's just a cat, dogs will kill cats" Is that what you are saying? And you are 100 % confidant any dog that kills a cat will NEVER attack a person? Just wondering...

 

My pitbull got along great with my three cats and lab. Matter of fact, my cats owned my pitbull. Now, another person's cats didn't get the same affection.

 

Now my doberman and my lab give my cat wide berth.

 

My lab runs after every cat that comes in our yard and the Golden Retriever next door chewed half my cat's face off a few months ago.

 

I didn't come on the board and say that all Golden Retrievers were horrible animals and that it might kill one of my kids.

 

Your own cats are one thing. Another person's cat is something all together different. It's not a part of that dog's 'pack'.

 

Do I think the dog is aggressive? Yes. If it pinned an old woman in a car, then yes, it has socialization issues. But it could have been *any* dog. just the fact that it was a pitbull does not mean any other dog wouldn't have done the same.

Edited February 27, 2011 by justamouse

[Joker]

What I am saying is that you are grieving, upset and angry and you are making very broad brush statements in your anger.

 

 

 

My pitbull got along great with my three cats and lab. Matter of fact, my cats owned my pitbull. Now, another person's cats didn't get the same affection.

 

Now my doberman and my lab give my cat wide berth.

 

My lab runs after every cat that comes in our yard and the Golden Retriever next door chewed half my cat's face off a few months ago.

 

I didn't come on the board and say that all Golden Retrievers were horrible animals.

 

Your own cats are one thing. Another person's cat is something all together different. It's not a part of that dog's 'pack'.

 

Do I think the dog is aggressive? Yes. If it pinned an old woman in a car, then yes, it has socialization issues. But it could have been *any* dog. just the fact that it was a pitbull does not mean any other dog wouldn't have done the same.

 

:iagree: I posted several months ago about a pit bull attacking (and killing) our neighbor's cat in our front yard. My dh ended up beating the dog to make it let go of the cat. I grew up with a pit bull that never harmed a fly and don't think they're all bad. What we witnessed was horrible but the dog wasn't put down ~ he belonged to a family with kids and had never harmed anything else. I was very angry at first but thought about how cats roam our neighborhood and I don't really know what our dog would do if he got loose. I would hate to tell my dds he had to be put down because we were negligent and he got away and harmed a cat. I feel so bad for the OP and hope you all start feeling better.:grouphug: If the dog was also hostile to adults something should be done but I don't feel a dog going after a cat automatically means it must be put down.

[clarkacademy]

My mothers dog would kill a cat in a heart beat. I would swear on a bible she would never hurt my kid though. BUT>>>>>this dog has bad owners ones who do not properly care for him so sadly he should be put down. They are responsible not the dog but the dog will pay. I truly think you should take out a claim for them to pay your childrens counseling bills as well as sue them for mental anguish. Their dog should have been contained and they should pay for their lack of responsibility.

[Lolly]

Clearly this particular dog was aggressive to both animals and people.

 

But is a dog who chases a cat or a duck (but is not agressive to people) necessarily a vicious dog? It's just that I see a difference between a dog attacking a prey animal (to them) and a dog attacking a person.

 

If the dog was aggressive to people, that's one thing. But if the dog was only aggressive to prey animals, I would consider it more the fault of the owner for not keeping the dog confined rather than the dog being inherently vicious.

 

BTW - I am a long-time cat owner and would be devastated as well. I'm just wondering why a dog would be considered NECESSARILY vicious to people because it attacked a cat.

:iagree:

If a dog chases down and kills a 18 pound cat does that mean it will NEVER chase down a small child who is also running from it? Does a dog know that it is not "supposed" to do that to a child? NO! Dogs are unpredictable and once they show this behavior on an animal it should not be trusted at.all. Sorry, if I were the owner, I would not have this liabiltiy.

 

Also, why is it if a human kills an animal for sport such as a cat or dog theyare looking at jail time. A human can reason right from wrong, but a dog cannot! So the dog is more undpredicatable. Why should the dog be given a second chance?? If it displays these tendancies to chase and kill in an UNPROVOCTED manner, what on earth would stop it from doing the same thing to a toddler???

 

I would say that most dogs would chase a cat. In fact, most dogs who are not raised with cats and not taught otherwise would kill the cat given the opportunity. Pretty much the same as a cat with a bird.

 

It is considered "VICIOUS" because by mauling and killing a cat it is VICIOUS! What would YOU call it??? "overly playful"???????

 

No, it is natural instinct. Vicious with dogs is used when the behavior is towards humans. You do have evidence of this. Make sure your neighbors testify.

 

Would you be willing to bet your life that this dog would not attack a human because it was "only a cat"??? Come on! How can you even say that and how could anyone be willing to chance it not being a person next time. To me that is totally irresponsible behavior

 

Any dog has the possibility of attacking a human, especially a small child, at any moment. A dog who kills a cat is no different than a cat who kills a bird. Dogs must be specifically taught not to harm cats. Yes, they can differentiate between small humans and cats. A dog who has shown aggression to humans is in a totally different category. This is what you need to prove. A dog whose owners do not keep them under control (as is legally required in most places) is a different category. This is also what you need to show.

 

btw..you are WRONG. Many cats and dogs get along fine. My cat got along great with my dog. He got along great with the neighbors dog too, so your statement is untrue

 

Yes, many cats and dogs do get along. They have most likely been taught by humans to do so. Certain breeds of dogs have a tremendously difficult time accepting cats. It is usually recommended that they do not attempt to live together. I have a hound. She came into a home with cats. She leaves our cats alone. She would not leave a cat she didn't know alone. I don't trust her to leave ours alone if we are not in the room. Her instincts are too strong.

 

Yes it does. I do know that hunting dogs often view cats as potential prey animals. Hope that clarifies.

 

ETA: Our experiences are with coonhounds. They will view cats as prey as well as racoons and unfortunately, act accordingly. :(

 

yep. Coons, rabbits, squirrels, cats. They are pretty much the same thing as far as my dog is concerned. She can definitely tell the difference in those things and small children. She lets the human ones crawl all over her. As docile as she is, I still would not leave her alone with a little human. I wouldn't leave any little ones alone with a dog. It is not wise. You can't tell what those little ones will do. A dog can only take so much sometimes.

 

I hope you are able to get your neighbors to go with you to the hearing. They are really your best chance to prove that this dog is often unsupervised and dangerous. I am actually responding because at the hearing, you are going to need to know what is going to go over well. A dog who kills a cat, as traumatic as it is for your family, is not going to be proven vicious for the one incident no matter how horrific it was. Dogs kill cats. Unless it is a multiple time event that is likely not going to be enough to prove the dog a nuisance. You need to focus on the fact that they dog is not well supervised on a regular basis and has gone after (scared) humans.

Edited February 27, 2011 by Lolly

[Love2Smile]

:iagree:

 

 

 

Lolly said:

 

 

No, it is natural instinct. Vicious with dogs is used when the behavior is towards humans. You do have evidence of this. Make sure your neighbors testify.

 

 

 

My response...sorry I cant figure out how to quote!

 

Well according to the laws in the San Francisco Bay Area. If an animal attack or kills a person or an ANIMAL it will be termed "vicious" That is the law around here. That is why it will be very difficult for the owner to get his dog back, but he is going to try.

Each county has its own laws and terms. Guess where you live if a dog kills a cat they term it "natural instinct" but not around here. Our county takes these things very seriously! Considering the surge in pittbull attacks. It's just the thought and possibility that I not only have to go to a hearing and fight our case, it's up to one person if he gets his dog back

[Jennifer3141]

I hate to see animals euthanized for what is so obviously a bad owner. Someone else's dog should NOT have been on your porch. YOUR cat had the right to be there.

 

Cat chasing is common. Heck, from the joy my kids get chasing chickens, I can see why it would be fun and innate behavior.

 

But this owner has proven he cannot handle a dog. Frankly, I'd like to see him injured bodily in some way at the same time they euthanize the dog. Maybe a tattoo on his forehead that says, "Too stupid for a dog!"

 

I love my dog. I've got 10 acres for her to roam with us. But I have a fenced in back acre for her because I don't trust any animal 100%. Heck, there are very few humans I trust 100%!!!

[Love2Smile]

I hate to see animals euthanized for what is so obviously a bad owner. Someone else's dog should NOT have been on your porch. YOUR cat had the right to be there.

 

Cat chasing is common. Heck, from the joy my kids get chasing chickens, I can see why it would be fun and innate behavior.

 

But this owner has proven he cannot handle a dog. Frankly, I'd like to see him injured bodily in some way at the same time they euthanize the dog. Maybe a tattoo on his forehead that says, "Too stupid for a dog!"

 

I love my dog. I've got 10 acres for her to roam with us. But I have a fenced in back acre for her because I don't trust any animal 100%. Heck, there are very few humans I trust 100%!!!

LOL..thanks I needed this! It made me chuckle this morning!

[Jennifer3141]

LOL..thanks I needed this! It made me chuckle this morning!

 

You're so welcome. I went out and hugged my cats because of you today. So thank you too.

 

And I hope you find it in your heart to rescue another cat someday soon. And maybe even a dog because YOU would be a good companion for a dog. :grouphug:

[Joanne]

Dogs will chase cats...fact. Not all dogs will kill the cat after it chases it.

 

The vet said my cat faught for his life. He had the dogs fur under all his claws. The pitt had bleeding scratches all over its muzzle. My cat died from bites, punctures and a broken neck. This sounds "vicious" to me.

 

I have seen some dogs chase cats, run up to them, sniff them and be on thier way. There is a HUGE difference here. This pitbull is so obviously vicious. It's a slam dunk!

 

I'm not fond of pitt bulls. I agree that THIS dog is a danger.

 

However, your perspective on dogs in general in relation to cats is not accurate. It's also simply not true that a dog who has killed a small animal is more likely to kill (or hurt) a child/human.

 

Dogs can be socialized to leave cats alone. Some dogs are not prone/predisposed to put cats in the "kill" category. Some dogs simply are.

 

I have labs. They RUN. They find any reason, any way, any mechanism to escape. I've always had fences. I've frequently had those fences wired and a shock collar on the dogs. They escaped at times anyway. I'd spend HOURS finding them.

 

My labs, like most labs are "family dogs". They were fully approved by the licensing agent when I had a daycare. They were great during the daycare and have been fine around my kids from birth to teens.

 

However, they act like animals towards squirrels, birds, rats and cats. (That I've seen). They killed a pet bird. :angry:

 

I'm sorry your family's pet has died. I hope that you are able to keep the dog in question away from your neighborhood.

[dancer67]

First, I am sorry about your cat. That is horrible.

 

As some other posters said, I hate to see dogs euthanized because of the irresponsibility of the owners.

 

I am a huge dog lover. I do hate to see people making generalized statements of Pit Bulls. That would be like saying that German Shepherds are dangerous because they have been bred to protect. ANY dog can be vicious. Actually, the smaller breeds are the ones that are generally more dangerous then the larger ones.

 

My dog gets along fine with our cat. And with our past cats as well. BUT, if he sees a cat outside, he will think nothing of trying to chase it down. He is a Lab. This because those cats are not part of his "pack". Would he maul it or kill it? I don't think so, but dogs are dogs.

 

And because a dog attacks a cat, doesn't mean they will attack a human.

 

Again, I am sorry this happened to your kitty.

[dancer67]

I have labs. They RUN. They find any reason, any way, any mechanism to escape. I've always had fences. I've frequently had those fences wired and a shock collar on the dogs. They escaped at times anyway. I'd spend HOURS finding them.

 

 

 

:iagree:

 

Yep. My lab does the same. And boy does he like chasing squirrels.:tongue_smilie:

[Jennifer3141]

:iagree:

 

Yep. My lab does the same. And boy does he like chasing squirrels.:tongue_smilie:

 

I get that dogs need to run. Heck, "space for dog to run with kids" was number 3 on our list before we got a house with 10 acres.

 

But this dog killed a cat on the OP's own porch.

 

If I found a dog on my deck attacking my cat, I wouldn't hesitate in the least in shooting it.

 

When you have a dog, it's your responsibility to make sure that your dog remains on your poperty or that you have permission to be somewhere else. Otherwise, be prepared for all the consequences for that behavior.

[Joanne]

I get that dogs need to run. Heck, "space for dog to run with kids" was number 3 on our list before we got a house with 10 acres.

 

But this dog killed a cat on the OP's own porch.

 

If I found a dog on my deck attacking my cat, I wouldn't hesitate in the least in shooting it.

 

When you have a dog, it's your responsibility to make sure that your dog remains on your poperty or that you have permission to be somewhere else. Otherwise, be prepared for all the consequences for that behavior.

 

I don't disagree. My point was that killing a cat does not have a linear connection to threat to humans. If my dog is on your property, I'd expect you to do what you have to do.

 

I agree it is my responsibility to keep my dogs on my property. It's my experience in the neighborhoods I've lived that the rules are the same for cats, but that *way* does not happen. My further point is that, even with appropriate measures, dogs (especially some breeds) escape.

[LittleIzumi]

I don't disagree. My point was that killing a cat does not have a linear connection to threat to humans. If my dog is on your property, I'd expect you to do what you have to do.

 

I agree it is my responsibility to keep my dogs on my property. It's my experience in the neighborhoods I've lived that the rules are the same for cats, but that *way* does not happen. My further point is that, even with appropriate measures, dogs (especially some breeds) escape.

 

Yup. Here the leash law applies equally to dogs and cats, but cats are everywhere. One cat who wanders our neighborhood (has a collar) bit dd & broke the skin last week :glare:

[MyBlueLobsters]

This is a side note, but I was reading through the state manual for our foster care licensing process and you are not allowed to own a pit and foster a child. You aren't even allowed to let a pit on your property (knowingly) while you have a foster child. Any other domesticated dog/cat is fine.

Edited February 27, 2011 by MyBlueLobsters

[MyBlueLobsters]

Oh, and I am so very sorry about your cat. I wouldn't want that dog on my street! I'd be very worried about my children.....:grouphug:

[Dobela]

This is a side note, but I was reading through the state manual for our foster care licensing process and you are not allowed to own a pit and foster a child. You aren't even allowed to let a pit on your property (knowingly) while you have a foster child. Any other domesticated dog/cat is fine.

Not only that, but many insurance companies will not insure your home and property if they discover you have a pit on our property. There are other dogs included as well, but pit bulls are #1. The companies have apparently paid too many lawsuits concerning the dogs already.

[Love2Smile]

Here is the latest update:

 

The pitbull owners came over to our house yesterday to bring me flowers and apologize. My dh had a long, calm talk with him regarding liability, the possibility that it could happen again etc... However they "love" their dog and want it back.

 

They are renters with NO insurance.

 

I took the advice of one of the responders here! Sorry forgot who suggested it, to contact the property owners. My dh went there today and the property owner does not want this dog back on his property and is going to contact the dog owner who is renting his house.

 

My dh has contacted the City Mayor, Counsel Members, our State Senator and various other people. We heard back from the Mayor already and he is very concerned and will be discussing this at his next meeting with whoever is in charge of this whole thing.

 

I also plan on contacting the San Francisco Chronicle and every news channel if this goes to a hearing. Hopefully not since now the actual property owner is aware!~

 

So thank you for all your support. I will give you another update when I have any more!

[MyBlueLobsters]

Here is the latest update:

 

The pitbull owners came over to our house yesterday to bring me flowers and apologize. My dh had a long, calm talk with him regarding liability, the possibility that it could happen again etc... However they "love" their dog and want it back.

 

They are renters with NO insurance.

 

I took the advice of one of the responders here! Sorry forgot who suggested it, to contact the property owners. My dh went there today and the property owner does not want this dog back on his property and is going to contact the dog owner who is renting his house.

 

My dh has contacted the City Mayor, Counsel Members, our State Senator and various other people. We heard back from the Mayor already and he is very concerned and will be discussing this at his next meeting with whoever is in charge of this whole thing.

 

I also plan on contacting the San Francisco Chronicle and every news channel if this goes to a hearing. Hopefully not since now the actual property owner is aware!~

 

So thank you for all your support. I will give you another update when I have any more!

 

 

Wow! Sounds promising that they will not be getting this dog back! :grouphug: I'm glad they apologized to you.

[Jennifer3141]

Hey if the house owner says no dog, I think you're going to be ok. If these dopes love their dog so much, they can move. :D

[Harriet Vane]

Here is the latest update:

 

The pitbull owners came over to our house yesterday to bring me flowers and apologize. My dh had a long, calm talk with him regarding liability, the possibility that it could happen again etc... However they "love" their dog and want it back.

 

They are renters with NO insurance.

 

I took the advice of one of the responders here! Sorry forgot who suggested it, to contact the property owners. My dh went there today and the property owner does not want this dog back on his property and is going to contact the dog owner who is renting his house.

 

My dh has contacted the City Mayor, Counsel Members, our State Senator and various other people. We heard back from the Mayor already and he is very concerned and will be discussing this at his next meeting with whoever is in charge of this whole thing.

 

I also plan on contacting the San Francisco Chronicle and every news channel if this goes to a hearing. Hopefully not since now the actual property owner is aware!~

 

So thank you for all your support. I will give you another update when I have any more!

 

Sounds like you've got this in the bag. Keep us posted.