"Should I Make My 13-Year-Old Get a Job?"

[Lan]

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB128121678189825407.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_MIDDLENexttoWhatsNewsForth

 

I found this article thoght provoking.

 

In my case, my father had paid all my expenses until I finally got a job after grad school. He had even paid off my credit card before I got married because he wanted me to marry debt free. As much as I'm grateful to my dad's generosity, I wish he would have taught me financial responsibilites since it took me years to become frugal. Dh and I eventually became financially responsible after I got pregnant.

 

How do you teach you kids value of money and work?

Edited August 8, 2010 by Lan

[StephanieZ]

I think it is vital for kids to have a sense of responsibility and to contribute financially. Exactly how/when/what varies from kid to kid and family to family. . . But, in general, I think it is really important. Both my 11 & 13 yos already have paying jobs (music) and both have long known that they will be expected to finance their own electronics/phones/super expensive whatevers. . .

 

Dh & I are getting them educated, housed, dressed, etc. . . and cover all those basic expenses (including plenty of non basics). . . but they know they won't get X,Y,Z coolio electronico gadgetos from us except for the annual holiday gifts (modest). . . and they know they'll have to have serious $$ contributions when they are allowed to get a driver's license. . .

 

I have met too many entitled young adults who are failing at life b/c their parents just did too much and didn't expect enough. I refuse to fall into that trap! Just b/c you *can* give it to them, doesn't mean you *should*!!!!!!!

 

ETA: I realize 11 & 13 are young for regular paying jobs. My dc are lucky that way and earn a LOT for one hour performances a few times a month. But, I do think that all kids should be working regularly, at least summers, by 16. I babysat a LOT from age 11 and up and worked FT every summer from 14, despite the fact that my folks had plenty of $$ that did not make any of that a financial necessity. (Frankly, all the driving my mom did to get me to jobs was surely not "worth it" financially to her for what I was earning. . . But, I was *learning* more than *earning* and those life lessons were far more valuable than the dollars I earned.

Edited August 8, 2010 by StephanieZ

[Tap]

I don't know. I hadn't wanted ds to get a job in highschool because I didn't want the lure of money to pull him away from his school responsibilities. I was worried about him working every weekend, dealing with putz teenage supervisors, and giving up the few passions he has to have a job and to be forced into an adult role too fast. I didn't want him to spend time in a dead end job, learning nothing that he will benefit in, in life (like fast food) beyond basic job responsibilities (show up on time, do your job, get paid). He carries a heavy academic load and has several hours of homework a night.

 

That being said....he got the chance to work for a learning company as a grading assistant/entry level tutor. The offer pretty much fell into his lap. It is only 2 days a week from 3-6:30. Still plenty of time for non-competitive sports (he won't swim competitively due to the job) and homework. They aren't open on other days....so, I am certain he won't miss out on family time. It is within walking/biking distance of the house, so I am not obligated to drive him everywhere. It is not food service....I don't want him sucked into the fast food world (he eats very healthy and I don't want the lure for quick-free food to ruin that). He works for the owner, an adult who runs a legit business, but she often hires teens so she knows what to expect from him. He is gaining skills that he can turn into lucrative tutoring jobs while in college.

 

We have a deal in our home, that while in high school (he is dual enrolled so he will be attending college this year instead) I will pay for the car, insurance and nec gas for work/school. Running around, spending money, gas for personal use comes from their own cash. It is worth it to me, to not have to drive them everywhere once they are 16. I think, this rule is part of his reason for taking the job. He is excited at the freedom a car will bring him...but he knows he has to pay for it too.

[Rosy]

I think it's very important for kids to learn to work for money. My kids have gotten money for jobs completed (as opposed to an allowance) since they were little, they know that if they want something, they have to work for it. At 8, I give them a raise and let them know they are expected to pay for b-day presents and clothes as well. They love being able to give a gift and know that they worked hard to give something nice to a friend. They get enough hand-me-downs that they don't *have* to buy clothes unless they decide to be picky about what they're given, and I'll get things like tennis shoes and swimsuits (and undies and socks), I think they're really grateful when they get hand-me-downs (DD9 in particular) and don't just expect stylish, well-fitting clothes to always be there. They buy their own backpacks too. We'll add responsibilities as they get older, as well as money-making opportunities. I expect that they'll be paying for social activities when they're older, saving up to help buy a car, etc.

 

In my opinion, if a 13-year-old is passing up the opportunity to work for $15-25 and hour, he/she needs to have most extras cut out of his/her life. Refereeing is a great opportunity for a kid that age. Kids who pass up that kind of money probably don't understand the value of what has been handed to them.

[Aggie]

I think it's very important for kids to learn to work for money. My kids have gotten money for jobs completed (as opposed to an allowance) since they were little, they know that if they want something, they have to work for it. At 8, I give them a raise and let them know they are expected to pay for b-day presents and clothes as well. They love being able to give a gift and know that they worked hard to give something nice to a friend. They get enough hand-me-downs that they don't *have* to buy clothes unless they decide to be picky about what they're given, and I'll get things like tennis shoes and swimsuits (and undies and socks), I think they're really grateful when they get hand-me-downs (DD9 in particular) and don't just expect stylish, well-fitting clothes to always be there. They buy their own backpacks too. We'll add responsibilities as they get older, as well as money-making opportunities. I expect that they'll be paying for social activities when they're older, saving up to help buy a car, etc.

 

In my opinion, if a 13-year-old is passing up the opportunity to work for $15-25 and hour, he/she needs to have most extras cut out of his/her life. Refereeing is a great opportunity for a kid that age. Kids who pass up that kind of money probably don't understand the value of what has been handed to them.

 

No joke. If my 13yo had that opportunity and passed it up, there would be nothing in this house for her to do except school, read and clean toilets. You don't want to work at a pretty cush job for $15/hr? I'll show you what it's like to work your arse off for room and board.

 

The dad is "hoping" the son will be at the next training? :lol: After the first summer of not working that job, my kids would be begging to go!

Edited August 8, 2010 by Aggie

[Peela]

My dd16 has been getting $20 an hour doing accounting/bookwork, since she was 14- 5 hours a week. She now needs a higher income...so is about to start some cleaning work- $20 an hour, maybe more. This is a mature kid, working for friends, and doing an adult job, getting an adult basic wage.

Ds14 is working one day a week with friends who run a gardening and reticulation business. They started him on $10 an hour- half the adult wage yet more than he would get at McDonalds- and they have just raised his pay to $12 an hour.

Both also get money for babysitting and for helping me do my cooking job. (I dont pay them that well though!). And some pocket money from their dad.

 

They are lucky, we realise, and they realise. It has been good for them. The 14yo has matured so much since working with adult men- good quality, mature, caring adult men.

 

However I am doing the Dave Ramsey program myself- loosely anyway- and I got them to sit down and work out a budget for themselves. We played with compound interest calculators and ds14 was very interested in how much money he could save by age 21 if he started putting away a decent amount of his paycheck now. Dd16 realised she wasn't going to be able to support her new car, get overseas and so other things she wants to do, on her present income. So she looked for, and found, more work within our immediate family and friends.

Just doing a very simple budget has been a great incentive for my kids. Instead of vague ideas, and spending teh money in their wallets jsut because it is their..they have a plan.

 

They have also both opened ING savings accounts in order to save for their long term goals. This has all happened this last week.

 

If a kid has an incentive to save for something...something they want...you can structure a basic financial education around it. I was wondering how I was going to teach them what I am learning, because earning money does not equal having money- I have been talking to them about how I am no longer using my credit card, and I am working to a budget now. They are curious. So, it has all unfolded from their natural incentive to learn more about money and how to make it work for them.

 

I dont think it is rocket science. There are some very basic fundamentals.

[JustGin]

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB128121678189825407.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_MIDDLENexttoWhatsNewsForth

 

I found this article thoght provoking.

 

In my case, my father had paid all my expenses until I finally got a job after grad school. He had even paid off my credit card before I got married because he wanted me to marry debt free. As much as I'm grateful to my dad's generocity, I wish he would have taught me financial responsibilites since it took me years to become frugal. Dh and I eventually became financially responsible after I got pregnant.

 

How do you teach you kids value of money and work?

 

We got poor. :)

Seriously, before January of this year we had a steady and decent income, then dh's job went away and we opened up a small business, I went to work very part time, we are stretched to the limit and though blessed in many ways, we definitely don't have the extra financial room we used to have. Even though it's been a challenge this turn of life has turned out to be a good things for my children. They have really grown in their understanding of and appreciation for work, budgeting, making ends meet, saving and all of that. All three of them worked in one way or another to earn every penny of their youth camp costs. I guess that's one way to teach kids about money, not having it to give them LOL

[Tap]

My dd16 has been getting $20 an hour doing accounting/bookwork, since she was 14- 5 hours a week. She now needs a higher income...so is about to start some cleaning work- $20 an hour, maybe more. This is a mature kid, working for friends, and doing an adult job, getting an adult basic wage.

Ds14 is working one day a week with friends who run a gardening and reticulation business. They started him on $10 an hour- half the adult wage yet more than he would get at McDonalds- and they have just raised his pay to $12 an hour.

 

 

 

Wow, $20 is a pretty good adult wage in our area for someone who doesn't have an education to back it. An "adult basic wage" would be more like $15 here. House cleaners do sometimes make more because they are independent contractors and file their own taxes/insurance. I know people with a 4 year degree, who don't make $20hr.

[JFSinIL]

Ds #1 did not work while in high school. His job was to get the highest GPA and most AP classes he could to earn scholarship money.. He is starting college with $21,500 per year in scholarships. He could never had made that kind of money working p/t in high school.

 

DD1 is as smart as ds, but NOT studious. She got a job at Sears in May and is saving a lot - she will also work 10 - 15 hours a week through the school year. Since she most likely is NOT going to get the honors/scholarships of her older nerd, er, brother, working for her makes sense.

 

It depends on the kid. Also on whether or not a job is available. DD was lucky to get hired at her first job interview. Most kids can not find a job that easily.

[Renee in NC]

My 12yo already earns all his own spending money. He cuts grass and does other outside work mostly.

 

My 17yo works for my father mostly, but he is going to find a regular job ASAP as he needs money for a trip to Scotland next summer and he wants a new laptop for college.

[regentrude]

I am coming from a different perspective and culture. I did not work a job while in school (nobody did) and still managed to turn out a financially responsible adult. So I do not think having a job is an absolute necessity.

 

My children's job is to do well on their school work. They are expected to work hard and focus on their education. They get an allowance as their share of the family income and can use that to learn budgeting, saving and responsible financial habits. They are expected to do chores without compensation, just because they are members of this family (nobody pays me to do housework either). I find it important that they learn to fulfill these duties without a monetary reward.

I pay them for work that goes above and beyond their normal duties. Any work they do to help me with my outside job gets paid.

 

As for older students, in some cases I am doubtful whether it is in their best interest to require a college student to have a job if it is not financially necessary. As a college instructor I see what happens when students can not focus all their energy on their studies. With a typical course load of 16 credit hours, the diligent student should be working for 50 hours on their class work (2 hours outside class for every hour of class). That's a lot. Failing classes or prolonging college because the outside job takes away too much time is in most cases not a cost effective measure.

I understand that often financial circumstances force a student to work in order to finance their education. OTOH, I also see the material wants (not needs) of many students these days- this has me wondering if those are really the values I want to instill. As a student, I worked 60+ hour weeks on my studies and did not have a lot of money - but in that time in my life my education was the priority. Spending time working a job in order to finance spring break trips, gadgets etc would have detracted from this ultimate goal.

 

Lastly, I believe that children learn a lot about financial responsibility through their parents' role model. We discuss finances with the kids. They know we that are debt free except for the mortgage, that we save before me make a big purchase, that we do not carry a credit cards balance - and they know the reasons for that. Watching their parents for 18 years make responsible decisions goes a long way to instill good habits.

 

Agnes

[6packofun]

The article kinda lost me at "But his money needs are increasing, especially when it comes to electronics." Um, these are not "needs" at our house, other than internet access for school. So, I think it's up to mom and dad to teach kids what is truly important and that you don't get something for nothing, but that does not automatically mean getting a job at age 13 or even 15, IMO. We don't have any transportation right now for my 16yo and we just moved to a new community so he hasn't been able to work. Both my 15 and 16yo teens *volunteer* because that lesson is more important to us than earning money and dh just happens to work at a great place for them to volunteer. We teach money management, but we are very low-income right now and it's taught without doling out money OR having jobs. Just not feasible for us and I refuse to feel like a crummy parent because we can't do more right now. My kids will turn out fine. :)

[AngieW in Texas]

My 12yo and 14yo have a joint job taking care of a neighbor's dogs. They get what I still think is a rather exorbitant amount of pay ($4/day) for taking care of the dogs for 30 minutes at lunchtime each day. They remove the dogs' diapers, take them outside, make sure they all use the bathroom, and make sure to keep them pretty active. The neighbor started off wanting to pay them $10/day, but I talked her way down from that. They both love dogs and also volunteer at the animal shelter. They both plan to look for kennel jobs when they're old enough.

 

My 17yo has been looking for a job for over one year. She isn't good with kids or animals. She's had 6 interviews this summer and has been required to submit at least 10 applications each week. I really want her to have a job. She wants to have a job. Unfortunately, there are so many adults applying for these same jobs that teens who've never had a job just aren't getting hired. She's been applying at retail stores, fast food, ice cream/yogurt shops, ...

 

The local excursion train runs on just Saturdays and Sundays and is completely run by volunteers. I'm going to have her go to the next volunteer training session. I want her to volunteer at least 2x/month until she actually gets a job. She needs to be doing something out of the house. If I'd realized that she'd go the whole summer without a job, I would have had her sign up for two summer classes at the cc rather than just one.

[hornblower]

I think it is a false dichotomy. I did not have a job until very late teens but I was & am frugal & understand budgeting & saving. Always did. I'm the annoying person who has never failed to pay off a credit card in full & only got them to build up a credit rating - because that's what my parents taught me.

 

My parents believed strongly that my time was to be spent on my education. I babysat a bit in highschool but never so much that it would affect my learning & if it was getting excessive, my parents would tell me so.

 

In university, I worked summers. Only one semester did I work throughout school & it did affect my grades, so I quit & rearrranged the budget so I could live on my summer earnings. My parents also assisted me financially.

 

My children's 'job' is to learn.

 

They can learn about money without actually having to 'have a job'. My kids are not being encouraged to go and earn money, though ds is talking about a paper route (he has expensive hobbies :)). I'm consdering allowing that.

[Guest janainaz]

We use Christmas and birthdays to provide some wants for our kids, but if they want to buy something at other times during the year we make them earn money for it. Ds10 wanted a cell phone, and I told him he had to buy the phone and buy the minutes for it. He wanted a TV in his room and he saved his money and bought one. Pretty much anything he really wants he has to pay for. Even when we disagree with something he wants to buy, we still let him. We offer our opinion and let him make the choice. He is learning by making mistakes.

 

Both of my kids earn an allowance every week and they only receive it if they do their chores willingly and without complaining. Contributing to the household is something they have to do, but paying them is something we do just to be nice, and not out of 'owing' them. Both of my kids have that understanding. I see a lot of kids these days that carry an attitude of expectation and a sense that the world owes them. I can't see how this is beneficial at all. Not only is it a selfish and unattractive character trait, but it certainly does not prepare them for the reality of life.

 

I had a job the second I turned 15 1/2, but I had to provide for all of my own needs. Because of that, I would rather my kids be able to focus on school (high school and college) when that time comes. But if I sense that they aren't taking full advantage of that opportunity, I would want them to work. I think that you lay the foundation when they are young, but each child is going to grow up with their own personality.

 

I do think one of the best ways to teach your kids about being responsible is to show them what it looks like to be content.

[RoughCollie]

I agree with that article. Not now, but in the past we lived in a place where everyone hired landscaping companies to do their yard work, including snow plowing. There were plenty of bored teens around who had plenty of free time, but the work was beneath them -- too hard, for too little money. This includes my kids, who complain when they have to mow our 2-acre lawn every week.

 

Regarding the socioeconomic class we used to be accustomed to: The kids receive everything they could ever want from their parents. By age 10, they have schedules to consult before they know whether they have time to play. As they get older, they get new electronics every year, which cost a fortune. By age 16, they get their first car. They rarely get jobs. Both parents work full-time. This is completely normal to everyone involved.

 

Personally, it is a relief to live in a different environment, even if we are here because we are poor. My kids don't feel deprived here. My jaw dropped when DS1 told me that some of his townie friends made a lot of money last winter shoveling snow. Actual teens doing real physical labor. What a concept!

 

Our problem is that one roundtrip to town costs $6 in gas, and there are no jobs available. So my kids will get an allowance, starting today, and out of it they will pay all of their personal expenses (school supplies, fees, lunches, clothing, shoes, entertainment, personal supplies, and the like). They will learn to manage money, and they will earn it by having good grades and doing chores at home. They have to comply with my standards 100% or they won't get paid that week. It's the best I can do, since where we live no one pays anyone to do work they can do themselves.

 

RC

Edited August 8, 2010 by RoughCollie

[Ester Maria]

Another one that does not, and will not, require her children to work while being schooled. Both mine and my husband's family background is along the philosophy "while you study, you seriously STUDY - and AFTER, backed up by that education, you make a solid living out of being an expert". I was instructed at quite a young age that previous generations in my family have sacrificed a lot for me to be where I was and be able to ONLY study - and that I should appreciate it by taking advantage of it in the best way possible. Such was the attitude towards any child with a potential and willing to study - back him/her up maximally, YOU bear the sacrifices if needed, but do everything you can possibly do to back up the child that can and is willing to learn, so that s/he does not have to do other things along the way.

 

I have good children, not entitled brats. I see no reason to withdraw opportunities from them "to teach them a lesson" - if they WERE do-nothing couch potatoes with an entitled attitude and poor academic record, then I might have a different strategy to teach them some values and work ethics and provide them with opportunities to seek out a serious job (supposing they decided an academic path is not for them)... but they aren't. I see nothing wrong in fully financing them - especially if they're minors - and in giving them modest allowances (big enough to be truly useful to them, small enough to make sure they'll be in situations in which they'll have to learn to give up on something to get something else), as well as making some rather expensive investments into their education and travel "just because I can" and because they want it. So while I'm quite insensitive to their whims about clothes or gadgets, and draw a firm line there even if I could buy it all for them (to repeat what Stephanie said earlier: just because you CAN, it doesn't always mean you SHOULD), I am not willing to make them "earn" things at this point in life other than by being good children, contributing with their own work and helping us and doing the only serious duty they have - their schooling - properly.

 

I have very academically-inclined children. They take from their free time to study more. Regarding the modest downtime they allow themselves... No, I'm definitely NOT willing to take that away from them by making them work for little sums of money. Nor I'm willing to take their summers/winters and deliberately decide that I will deprive them of the experiences that other children from approximately the same socio-econiomic background go through (namely, using holidays for travels, skiing, language learning, other informal learning, meeting people and seeing the world), just to teach them a lesson... as long as things are functioning, their life is on the right course and no lesson of the kind is seriously needed. If I saw serious character or entitlement issues, depreciation of work and effort, or similar symptoms of a brat-in-making, then I might consider some work experience and real life shock therapy to prevent the potential outcome. Until then, I don't intend to make my children go through what they don't have to go through and to deliberately reduce the comfort of their lives.

 

Of course, if financial situation were different, they would have to grow up more quickly and accept some more real life responsibilities at a younger age - but then that would be a normal consequence of such a life, not a punishment or me making it tougher for them than it has to be. I cannot say that I don't understand some of the reasoning behind some parents' choice to still do that, but I personally prefer not to.

 

So, if everything goes smoothly and as planned, they should not work until working as experts after their university formations. Of course, should the opportunity arise to earn some money as a "side-effect" of your interests (such as children who are into music, or really good at something and enjoying teaching it, etc.), we wouldn't discourage it, nor would we explicitly forbid our children to get a regular work experience should they wish so at some point, if it doesn't affect their schooling - but they won't be required to and they won't be complained to about living on our account while they're being schooled.

[gingersmom]

I was just like you. My parents paid for everything (including my rent) till I got married. Then they even helped out then. :001_huh:

 

It has been a long struggle for me to learn to live within my means without any outside support. Definitely a worthwhile struggle though.

 

I have been having conversations with my children about money and working since they were small (and looked at me like I was crazy).

 

Now that they are almost 11 and 14 we are having more meaningful conversations. My daughter this week is feeding a neighbors cat/collecting mail/watering plants while they are away. I expect she will make about $10/day.

 

Next summer she can get a job at our town pool.

 

When she is 15/16 she can get a job at our skating rink teaching lessons (which is really what she wants to do).

[Chris in VA]

Ds is a server at a local restaurant (like a Friday's) and makes under $2.50 an hour, plus tips (he once worked 7 hours and only made $20 in tips). He has to pay for his own gas, his own insurance (once he gets a car--he has some $ from an aunt for the car purchase), and his own CC tuition/books.

He is definitely learning how to manage $, and why Mom never has enough gas in her car ('cause it's too darn expensive!).

 

But he's 18. It's time.

 

I think it's good for a kid to do some "little" stuff, like occasionally mowing lawns or babysitting, when they are under 16, but I usually think of Junior Year in High School as the time to get a summer job. I don't really want my dd to work when she's in school, except for on the occasional Friday night for babysitting, or being a mom's helper some days after school, or something like that. To me, her job is going to school.

 

I do hope she learns to manage $ better than I did. I racked up 20K of debt on credit cards, and am just now paying off the final one. It affected every area of my life. Paying for things myself as a younger teen might have helped.

[Danestress]

My parents always expected my sisters and I to do well in school. We had hobbies too - music, sports (not me!), drama. I did get a job in high school, but my parents did not like it and would have made me quit if I couldn't keep my grades up.

 

I am not wild about the idea that a 13 year old needs a job so that he can buy more electronic "stuff," and I find it sort of sad that this man and his wife are trouble shooting how their son could find a way to make money, and meanwhile the child is (according to the Dad) playing xbox and watching tv. How about turning off the tv, selling the xbox, and letting the kid figure out how he wants to spend his time? If he has no "stuff" he can either learn to deal with that because he likes free time, or he can start sniffing around himself for a job. But it sort of bothers me that the Dad is the one who is actually thinking about this, and the kid is sitting on the sofa.

 

I don't know. We are upper middle class. My 12 year olds have a daily dog walking gig. I am not opposed to kids making some money. And I am not opposed to kids wanting some "stuff." But this just seemed sort of like, "how to groom a consumer."

 

My husband is a hard working, goal oriented man. He never had a job one day in his life before he graduated from college. But he's never had a lazy bone. His mother's rule was always, "If I am standing, there is no reason you should be sitting." They did the family work together, and I think in some ways, that was probably more useful training than a pay check. Your Mom is not your maid. She doesn't really care if you have "stuff." Your parents can afford to provide for all of your needs and a modest few of your wants, and learning to have fewer wants is a reasonable choice weighed against having more income.

[elegantlion]

My son has had paid chores since he was little to learn how to manage money. My dh has been self-employed and ds has gone to work with him a number of times. Ds knows how to handle money better than dh or I did at that age. Ds even negotiates deals with stores for his electronics. He traded in two game systems and games to upgrade to an Xbox 360. He spent $5.00 out of his pocket.

 

But a job? IDK. I'm of the firm belief that at this age and through the rest of his schooling academics is his job. If my dh stays self-employed (up in the air at the moment) he'll work with him during the summers.

 

My dh fell into the "lure of easy money" before he was out of high school. At 18 what he was making in carpentry was a lot of money. He opted not to finish college and still regrets it. He was easily sucked into the "I'm already making enough money, I don't need a degree." He's a talented carpenter, but he would have been a great attorney or a brilliant architect (two of his other career desires).

 

DS has the same personality as dh and we don't want him to fall into the same trap. Dh and I have discussed this frequently and we want him to be well-educated first, then worry about the job.

[Audrey]

My son is only 10 (11 later this month), but he knows money doesn't grow on trees! LOL!

 

For now, he saves most money he gets from birthday or such in his piggy bank until he gets enough to make a decent deposit in his savings account. He uses a bit of it for things, but he's very picky about what to spend it on because he doesn't want to use it on something "stupid." He doesn't get paid for regular chores because that's just a part of our family's life, but we have started paying him to do work that we might otherwise hire out (age appropriate to him, of course!)

 

He also has a calf every year for 4-H and the money he earns selling that goes into a savings bond. He puts a lot of work into that calf and has come to understand that the livestock market can sometimes be hit and miss. He has come to be pretty savvy on that, actually.

Edited August 8, 2010 by Audrey

[tiffijo1]

My dad gave us allowances and check book registers and if we wanted anything, we would have to subtract it from our register. Unless it was a special occasion, extra things we bought ourselves, essentials our parents covered.