One Valedictorian Survives the Soul-Destroying Classroom

[KJB]

I think it's more fair to assess PS instilling a love of learning against those who are currently public schooling, not those of us who have "deschooled" for years and re-found our love of learning, because, as you said and I agree, humans inherently love to learn.

 

Most high school graduates, regardless of where they are educated, are excited to start their lives which usually includes job training or college. Both experiences require a desire/quest/thirst for information. You might even call it a love....

 

And if it's true that public school doesn't drown the thirsty, which is proven by the "deschooled" home school moms, then inspiring the love is not unique to home schooling, but rather it is merely a shared human trait.

 

We all love to learn when it's necessary and in our self-interest. Public school doesn't alter that love. Bored/disinterested isn't something someone else does do you, but rather a condition/excuse you (general you, of course) allow yourself.

[Nakia]

She sounds to me like a whiney 18 year old who thought high school was so boooooooring and has taken this opportunity to tell the world. Well good for her, she did it. High school IS boring. So is 90% of the rest of your life, no matter what you do. We live for that other 10%.

 

Now she needs to get over herself and get a job doing something productive--wait tables, clean offices, pressure wash a house, chop wood, plant a garden, wipe snot off of a kid's face or, heaven forbid, try to teach history to a bunch of high schoolers.

 

Terri

 

Wow, I can't believe we read the same speech. I think that young lady is the kind of person who changes the world, for the better! It took a lot of guts for her to stand up and deliver that speech. Going against the grain is never easy, as we all know, since we homeschool. It's that road less traveled thing, ya know.

[KJB]

Wow, I can't believe we read the same speech. I think that young lady is the kind of person who changes the world, for the better! It took a lot of guts for her to stand up and deliver that speech. Going against the grain is never easy, as we all know, since we homeschool. It's that road less traveled thing, ya know.

 

Her speech is excellent and fun to read. It is fairly well reasoned, and it shows a sophisticated mastery of language for a 12th grader.

 

However, just because she can articulate a well thought out idea, doesn't make her right.

 

IMO, it's tough for the valedictorian who is able to construct and deliver such a well thought out speech filled with sophisticated language and thought, to claim that her education and/or the system has failed her. I think she lacks perspective, through no fault of her own, that maturity will deliver over time.

[KJB]

"The goods." Interesting. What does it mean? Whose "goods" is she? According to her, not her own.

 

Again, the fact that she seems bright and well taught does not prove that the system works, it just proves that she is bright and well taught. How she got that way has not been established.

 

She clearly states in her own words her disappointment in the system, but you disregard that. Again, why don't you believe her?

 

 

 

She is a well educated young lady who not only survived public school, but achieved the highest academic honor possible for her graduating class. Her speech speaks for itself in terms of her education.

 

Her disappointment in a system which will propel her to most likely a college scholarship is suspect and immature, imo. If she wants/wanted more, the library is open. Students must take responsibility for their own education at some point. A high school student able to articulate as well as she could have found other mentors and opportunities for deeper learning. Off the top of my head, she could have volunteered, started a business, been a foreign exchange student, etc.

 

It is not the public school's job, imo, to be the ending point for education. If one attends public high school, it should be with the knowledge that the school is there to be provide foundational fundamental knowledge. You can take that as far as you'd like.....

 

The school did it's job for her as her excellent speech demonstrates.

[Nakia]

She is a well educated young lady who not only survived public school, but achieved the highest academic honor possible for her graduating class. Her speech speaks for itself in terms of her education.

 

Her disappointment in a system which will propel her to most likely a college scholarship is suspect and immature, imo. If she wants/wanted more, the library is open. Students must take responsibility for their own education at some point. A high school student able to articulate as well as she could have found other mentors and opportunities for deeper learning. Off the top of my head, she could have volunteered, started a business, been a foreign exchange student, etc.

 

It is not the public school's job, imo, to be the ending point for education. If one attends public high school, it should be with the knowledge that the school is there to be provide foundational fundamental knowledge. You can take that as far as you'd like.....

 

The school did it's job for her as her excellent speech demonstrates.

 

Do you homeschool? I am not trying to be snarky, just curious.

 

A lot of her points are valid and the reason that many of us homeschool.

[KJB]

Do you homeschool? I am not trying to be snarky, just curious.

 

A lot of her points are valid and the reason that many of us homeschool.

 

I have home schooled (and posted on this board) for nine years. I start teaching my oldest high school in the fall. My kids (all five) have never been to public school (with the exception of taking foreign language and PE last year for my older two).

 

I realize she is using lots of home school rah rah rhetoric that home schoolers like and are comfortable with. The problem, imo, is that these arguments don't apply to her or her experience. A girl like her needs to take responsibility for her own deeper and broader and not whine that the school (which has allowed her an opportunity to be awarded a scholarship most likely) has failed her. If she senses a failure in not getting a better education, it is her own, imo.

 

How can anyone read her speech and question her excellent education?

[Nakia]

I have home schooled (and posted on this board) for nine years. I start teaching my oldest high school in the fall. My kids (all five) have never been to public school (with the exception of taking foreign language and PE last year for my older two).

 

I realize she is using lots of home school rah rah rhetoric that home schoolers like and are comfortable with. The problem, imo, is that these arguments don't apply to her or her experience. A girl like her needs to take responsibility for her own deeper and broader and not whine that the school (which has allowed her an opportunity to be awarded a scholarship most likely) has failed her. If she senses a failure in not getting a better education, it is her own, imo.

 

How can anyone read her speech and question her excellent education?

 

I really was just curious about you homeschooling; I find it difficult to remember people's screen names and easier to remember them by their signatures. And since you don't have a sig, I couldn't remember anything about you.

 

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree. I am not going to debate it with you. I just didn't think she came across as whiney or "poor me" or anything like that. I think she is inspiring!

[Tea Time]

Her speech is excellent and fun to read. It is fairly well reasoned, and it shows a sophisticated mastery of language for a 12th grader.

 

However, just because she can articulate a well thought out idea, doesn't make her right.

 

IMO, it's tough for the valedictorian who is able to construct and deliver such a well thought out speech filled with sophisticated language and thought, to claim that her education and/or the system has failed her. I think she lacks perspective, through no fault of her own, that maturity will deliver over time.

 

Can you prove her excellent speech is the direct result of compulsory schooling in its behemoth form?

 

To say that her perspective is immature has no foundation given that several of us have relayed how we matured into a very similar perspective. Clearly maturity is not the issue. Unless you want to argue that John Taylor Gatto and many of the middle aged folks on this board still need to mature. Possibly, I suppose.

 

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree.

[KJB]

Can you prove her excellent speech is the direct result of compulsory schooling in its behemoth form?

 

To say that her perspective is immature has no foundation given that several of us have relayed how we matured into a very similar perspective. Clearly maturity is not the issue. Unless you want to argue that John Taylor Gatto and many of the middle aged folks on this board still need to mature. Possibly, I suppose.

 

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree.

 

The problem is, this girl is not JT Gatto. She is regurgitating many of his thoughts, but she's not him. She hasn't taught in the public school system for years and years and seen the problems first hand. She's not an award winning teacher who has studied and experienced educational shortcomings for years.

 

She's a kid. She's the valedictorian. She's giving a provocative speech about educational failure, but I don't think her actual life is reflected in her words. Her education didn't fail her. She can read and write, quite well actually.

 

She claims she's suffered through her "period of indoctrination" and yet here she is giving this contrary speech to cap off her public education, after being exposed to these counter-cultural ideas by her public school english teacher. It is ironic that a system that has so squashed her individuality and free thought has given her a public platform to reflect however she chooses on her experiences.

 

Anyway, I understand the appeal to home schoolers, but just because she is using "our" battle cry doesn't mean she's qualified to lead the troops or frankly that she's really even on our side. She's a teenager, and they tend to like rebellion....:D:lol:

Edited July 26, 2010 by KJB

[Firefly]

How can anyone read her speech and question her excellent education?

 

Because she seems to be saying that she succeeded in spite of her public school education, not because of it.

[Impish]

Personally, as much as her speech was well written, I think that it was unfair to her fellow graduates and their families. They were there to celebrate an accomplishment, and she put it all down.

 

There's a time and place for everything, and it wasn't just her graduation, but other's as well. You don't stand up to give a speech at a wedding, and condemn it as a useless institution with a 50% failure rate.

 

Other students worked hard to graduate. That should have been respected. While I obviously don't agree that ps is the best choice for my kids, it is for other families...and a public celebration of completion isn't the place for putting it down, imo.

[KJB]

Personally, as much as her speech was well written, I think that it was unfair to her fellow graduates and their families. They were there to celebrate an accomplishment, and she put it all down.

 

There's a time and place for everything, and it wasn't just her graduation, but other's as well. You don't stand up to give a speech at a wedding, and condemn it as a useless institution with a 50% failure rate.

 

Other students worked hard to graduate. That should have been respected. While I obviously don't agree that ps is the best choice for my kids, it is for other families...and a public celebration of completion isn't the place for putting it down, imo.

 

Thanks for writing this, because I have the exact same thoughts. I just figured I had bit off enough already....:lol:

[mrbmom77]

Wow! Finally someone else said it!!!!!!!!!!!! THANK YOU.

 

I am only speaking of my own experience, so no on get insulted here, but the academic/intelligence/discipline of my college classmates that were pursuing 'public education' as a career was, well, uhm, let's say 'sub-par.' Like bottom-Quintile...

 

Tea-Time, bless you for saving me some typing...well put.

 

Exactly! I'm in college right now, and most of my peers who are going to teach are the same ones who tell me they don't like to read and have no interests besides movies and video games. One guy told me just a few weeks ago that he's never read anything not assigned by a teacher and only read half of those. And he wants to teach kids history? I find that disturbing. I can think of one exception and I'll be surprised if she doesn't eventually move on.

[KJB]

Because she seems to be saying that she succeeded in spite of her public school education, not because of it.

 

How did the school stop her or get in her way? Or did she just get in her own way because she wanted to be the valedictorian?

 

It sounds like her 10th grade english teacher introduced her to JT Gatto, for heaven's sake. What more did she want? :lol:

 

Honestly, school (public, private, home, etc.) can only do so much. At some point, high school students have to take personal responsibility for their own educations. This girl was old enough and clearly talented enough to pursue her own *more*.

[mrbmom77]

Personally, as much as her speech was well written, I think that it was unfair to her fellow graduates and their families. They were there to celebrate an accomplishment, and she put it all down.

 

There's a time and place for everything, and it wasn't just her graduation, but other's as well. You don't stand up to give a speech at a wedding, and condemn it as a useless institution with a 50% failure rate.

 

Other students worked hard to graduate. That should have been respected. While I obviously don't agree that ps is the best choice for my kids, it is for other families...and a public celebration of completion isn't the place for putting it down, imo.

 

 

I do agree with this. This speech at my graduation would have ticked me off, not inspired me. I like it, but it could have been a blog, an article somewhere, whatever. Many of her classmates probably felt denigrated.

[Rosy]

Personally, as much as her speech was well written, I think that it was unfair to her fellow graduates and their families. They were there to celebrate an accomplishment, and she put it all down.

 

There's a time and place for everything, and it wasn't just her graduation, but other's as well. You don't stand up to give a speech at a wedding, and condemn it as a useless institution with a 50% failure rate.

 

Other students worked hard to graduate. That should have been respected. While I obviously don't agree that ps is the best choice for my kids, it is for other families...and a public celebration of completion isn't the place for putting it down, imo.

EXACTLY. I thought the speech showed a lack of gratitude to the school, however imperfect, and a lack of consideration to those in attendance. There are times and places to make these types of statements. HS Grad isn't one of them.

[Firefly]

How did the school stop her or get in her way?

 

It did neither. :lol: It simply failed to give her what she felt it was supposed to.

[Mommyfaithe]

Loved it! Hope her grades were completely final... :lol:

 

I am so proud of this kid...and she comes from my neck of the woods. Sending this to my kids to read...

Faithe

Edited July 27, 2010 by Mommyfaithe

[Jean in Newcastle]

Personally, as much as her speech was well written, I think that it was unfair to her fellow graduates and their families. They were there to celebrate an accomplishment, and she put it all down.

 

There's a time and place for everything, and it wasn't just her graduation, but other's as well. You don't stand up to give a speech at a wedding, and condemn it as a useless institution with a 50% failure rate.

 

Other students worked hard to graduate. That should have been respected. While I obviously don't agree that ps is the best choice for my kids, it is for other families...and a public celebration of completion isn't the place for putting it down, imo.

 

Bravo!

[Perry]

The irony is that in every single school my kids have attended (5 so far), they have gone to great lengths to try to make everything "fun". It's all about teaching the kids to love learning. In K/1, it was all about teaching them to love reading. They weren't terribly concerned with actually teaching them to read.

 

They wanted to teach my kids to love to learn.

I wanted them to teach my kids content. That's ultimately why we started hsing.

[plansrme]

And your words sound like the whining of someone a wee bit older who is well established and satisfied with the system that she decries.

 

Wow, that's quite a stretch. Your yoga teacher must be very proud.;)

 

Terri

[plansrme]

The irony is that in every single school my kids have attended (5 so far), they have gone to great lengths to try to make everything "fun". It's all about teaching the kids to love learning. In K/1, it was all about teaching them to love reading. They weren't terribly concerned with actually teaching them to read.

 

They wanted to teach my kids to love to learn.

I wanted them to teach my kids content. That's ultimately why we started hsing.

 

Now your kids are going to stand up at their graduation and throw it all in your face, and complain that it was boring!

 

I agree with you, however, and this is one of the main reasons we homeschool as well. I prize actual learning over a love of learning, while recognizing that the two are not mutually exclusive, in most children, anyway.

 

Terri

[Tea Time]

Personally, as much as her speech was well written, I think that it was unfair to her fellow graduates and their families. They were there to celebrate an accomplishment, and she put it all down.

 

There's a time and place for everything, and it wasn't just her graduation, but other's as well. You don't stand up to give a speech at a wedding, and condemn it as a useless institution with a 50% failure rate.

 

Other students worked hard to graduate. That should have been respected. While I obviously don't agree that ps is the best choice for my kids, it is for other families...and a public celebration of completion isn't the place for putting it down, imo.

 

You do have a point. There is a time and place for everything. But let's be clear, that doesn't say anything about the actual message, just the time and place it was given. Two different issues. And to be honest with you, I am not sure that that young lady was every going to get any time or place to deliver that message. Some people, as you can see, never want to hear it.

[the4Rs]

I love the speech....but.... I have a hard time reading it and thinking for someone who apparently started "waking up" in 10th grade...she purposefully lived the lie just to be the valedictorian. She was having this awakening for years and stayed the status quo....

 

Now if she had had an epiphany while writing her speech...then bravo. But she had been researching this for awhile all while putting on a front for her teachers, family, and classmates. She wanted to live the lie... a true believer would have stopped caring about being valedictorian even at the expense of mama and papa's anger. They would have truly been liberated.

 

It's easy to be bold when you already did all the work required by the system and you are now free. Reality is she is drinking the same kool-aid she is trying to dump out.

 

She is articulate and wrote a great speech...no denying that. She reeks of arrogance to me though. An arrogance that says "hey, i knew better but I did it anyway...but don't any of you do it!" Actions speak louder than words. Her actions showed way more than her speech in my opinion.

[Jean in Newcastle]

There are a couple of false dichotomies - being respectful and taking notes and actually listening to the teacher does not mean that you can never be an artist or a musician. Being responsible and doing her homework does not mean that she can never pursue books on her own interests. It does mean that unless she throws out all the discipline that she's learned in school, that she will be able to be a success at anything she chooses to do from here on out.

[Hockey Mom]

I love the speech....but.... I have a hard time reading it and thinking for someone who apparently started "waking up" in 10th grade...she purposefully lived the lie just to be the valedictorian. She was having this awakening for years and stayed the status quo....

 

Now if she had had an epiphany while writing her speech...then bravo. But she had been researching this for awhile all while putting on a front for her teachers, family, and classmates. She wanted to live the lie... a true believer would have stopped caring about being valedictorian even at the expense of mama and papa's anger. They would have truly been liberated.

 

It's easy to be bold when you already did all the work required by the system and you are now free. Reality is she is drinking the same kool-aid she is trying to dump out.

 

She is articulate and wrote a great speech...no denying that. She reeks of arrogance to me though. An arrogance that says "hey, i knew better but I did it anyway...but don't any of you do it!" Actions speak louder than words. Her actions showed way more than her speech in my opinion.

 

:iagree:

[teamturner]

Here we are writing on a message board filled with mainly public school graduated women who are all willing to mummify chickens and learn Latin and hatch butterflies and round up road kill to study....

 

It's not logical to think that public schooled home school moms love learning, but public school kills instead of kindles this love. Everyone likes to think this backwards thought because it justifies opting out.

 

IMO, public school can be and often is excellent, and even in cases where it's not so excellent, the opportunity to meet a teacher/mentor or read a book or be exposed to a thought you didn't have before is enough to spark a passion.

 

 

I don't think it's accurate to state that all of us homeschool moms are teaching our children because we love learning. Rather, I think we homeschool because we love our KIDS and want them to have something better. I recognize that my public school education and including college were merely an end to a means. I wanted to become independent and have money to live and I knew I needed a college degree to accomplish my goal. I didn't continue to college because I loved learning! The poster that stated that those who finish college are those that can persevere had it correct, imo. I was not inspired by any teacher in all of my public schooling. What I learned in high school was how to get by and get out!!

 

Now I do enjoy learning with my kids, especially since I remember very little from my own education, but I doubt I'd spend this much time (if any) on learning this stuff if I wasn't homeschooling. And I am mostly homeschooling so that my kids will have a Classical education since I don't want them to have an education that is remotely similar to mine.

[Barry Goldwater]

She is a well educated young lady who not only survived public school, but achieved the highest academic honor possible for her graduating class. Her speech speaks for itself in terms of her education.

 

Her disappointment in a system which will propel her to most likely a college scholarship is suspect and immature, imo. If she wants/wanted more, the library is open. Students must take responsibility for their own education at some point. A high school student able to articulate as well as she could have found other mentors and opportunities for deeper learning. Off the top of my head, she could have volunteered, started a business, been a foreign exchange student, etc.

 

It is not the public school's job, imo, to be the ending point for education. If one attends public high school, it should be with the knowledge that the school is there to be provide foundational fundamental knowledge. You can take that as far as you'd like.....

 

The school did it's job for her as her excellent speech demonstrates.

 

Interesting that you used the expression 'survived public school.' Were those her words or your own? (I don't remember).

 

Regarding the bold, yes, but if 75% of your waking hours are consumed in a prison, it's tough to find time to carry out that extra enrichment on your own. The colossal WASTE OF TIME that occurs in the PS is extra-ordinarily objectionable to me...she didn't explicitly mention it, but I think she alluded to it.

 

I think I get your points, but I still like the speech, and that she played the system so effectively while not losing her individuality. She did not have the option, apparently, not to 'play,' and so she made the most of it. When it was over, she declared victory, which took a lot of guts.

[Mimm]

"We are not enlivened by an educational system that clandestinely sets us up for jobs that could be automated, for work that need not be done, for enslavement without fervency for meaningful achievement. We have no choices in life when money is our motivational force. Our motivational force ought to be passion, but this is lost from the moment we step into a system that trains us, rather than inspires us."

 

This is just a small sampling of what I found to be utter foolishness. If we turn schools into places that only inspire us, rather than train us, we're going to produce a generation of graduates who can compose lovely poetry but are incapable of actually oh, I don't know, running the world.

 

I fear for the future of our country when we are applauding a speech that so openly ridicules hard work.

 

Terri

 

Why do you assume that if students are inspired, they will only be inspired to write poetry? Each person is different and each person has something they can be good at and passionate about. You CAN inspire each student and turn them into scientists and doctors and teachers and architects and writers and engineers and programmers and politicians. And nowhere in her speech did I notice her ridiculing hard work. How strange that you got that out of the speech.

[Rosie_0801]

Now if she had had an epiphany while writing her speech...then bravo. But she had been researching this for awhile all while putting on a front for her teachers, family, and classmates. She wanted to live the lie... a true believer would have stopped caring about being valedictorian even at the expense of mama and papa's anger. They would have truly been liberated.

 

Liberated? If I'd been in her shoes, taking this course of action would have been nothing short of stupid. Of course I've not met her parents, but I knew mine quite well. Not that I was ever valedictorian material, but I was supposed to be doing my best. Staying on the good side of the people who pay your bills is a very sensible thing to do, we could call that a game to be played too, but it's a good idea to play that one.

 

Rosie

[Nakia]

Liberated? If I'd been in her shoes, taking this course of action would have been nothing short of stupid. Of course I've not met her parents, but I knew mine quite well. Not that I was ever valedictorian material, but I was supposed to be doing my best. Staying on the good side of the people who pay your bills is a very sensible thing to do, we could call that a game to be played too, but it's a good idea to play that one.

 

Rosie

 

Exactly! We are talking about a high school student, not an adult with the freedom (and money) to balk at tradition.

[DarlaS]

How can I change that without sacrificing knowledge?

 

I've had that thought too. Maybe we need to change our definition of knowledge? What good is it to know things if they don't matter to you?

[Rosie_0801]

I've had that thought too. Maybe we need to change our definition of knowledge? What good is it to know things if they don't matter to you?

 

I think there are a few things we need to learn that we won't come to appreciate until we have the benefit of hindsight.

 

I do, however, remember plenty of situations in my school classroom of boys yelling "But Miss/Sir, what's the point?" I remember thinking "it's on the exam" to be a most pathetic answer, but it was better than "shut up and do your work." I am only in the planning stages, of course, since my kids are small, but I'm making an effort to be sure I know what the point is, because one of them is bound to ask.

 

I remember another of my teachers (a neighbour actually) harping on about a certain kind of butterfly. I was fond of this lady, but really, it was just a butterfly! I listened because it was the polite thing to do, and was very quickly convinced that this particular butterfly was indeed very cool, as far as butterflies went :D

 

It's certainly a good thing if the teacher is enthusiastic about a subject, but the time should come where the student takes on the responsibility of finding an answer to the question, "why should I care about this?" It doesn't take much imagination to find a reason why you should, even if you still *don't* care. I know why I should care about learning to fix my own car, but I still don't care to learn how :tongue_smilie:

 

Rosie

[cathmom]

High school IS boring. So is 90% of the rest of your life, no matter what you do. We live for that other 10%.

 

Terri

 

Yes, some people live that way. Others have set up their lives so the percentages are the other way around.

 

If she wants/wanted more, the library is open. Students must take responsibility for their own education at some point. A high school student able to articulate as well as she could have found other mentors and opportunities for deeper learning. Off the top of my head, she could have volunteered, started a business, been a foreign exchange student, etc.

 

It is not the public school's job, imo, to be the ending point for education. If one attends public high school, it should be with the knowledge that the school is there to be provide foundational fundamental knowledge. You can take that as far as you'd like.....

 

 

 

If she spent 7-8 hours a day in school and on the way to/from school, and then 3-4 hours per night doing the homework required to get valedictorian status, that leaves precious little time or energy for any of the things that you mention.

 

I disagree that high schools are there to provide foundational fundamental knowledge. I think they are mainly there to contain teenagers.