I don't want to be swimmermom3 anymore.

[swimmermom3]

I don't want to be swimmermom3 anymore. In fact, I don't think I want to be a swim mom at all.

 

Today I received a call from a good friend, another swim mom, that their family will no longer be swimming with our club. They are the family that every good club dreams of having as members: 5 swimmers, 4 of which have set numerous state records, two with Top 16 times, and one participating in the Olympic Trials. My friend does all meet entry and works as an ET and her dh is one of our best and most active referees. He also serves on our board. It's a major loss for our team and for our family.

 

For five years, they have been good friends. Our boys have had a great time hanging out at the pool together, traveling together and spending up to a week at a time at each others' houses. I trust the care of my children to them and I would take their kids anywhere. Nearly everything we do at the pool and meets involves them.

 

They are quitting because 2 of their children have severe shoulder injuries. The youngest child is only 10 but is is on the elite squad and now trains the same 14 hours my ds (11) does. He's not injured yet, but it all is just too much.

 

My ds has a shoulder injury too that is on the mend. I just don't want to do it anymore. Any of it. Anybody else been there?

Edited September 22, 2009 by swimmermom3
bad math

[Lovedtodeath]

wow :grouphug: I had no idea swimming was hazardous.

[Ibbygirl]

I'm so sorry. :grouphug: It is hard when you have hills and valleys. Sometimes those valleys can seem so low. :( Maybe you can become guitarmom3?? ;) :p Just a thought. :rolleyes: ;) :D hehe

[MamaT]

I honestly have had the same thoughts this week about gymnastics. My dd is only 10 and is spending almost 20 hours a week in the gym. Her gym is great, her coach is great, the gym families are our family, but I am TIRED. I keep thinking that it will be too much for her and she will choose not to keep going, but she shows no signs of that.

 

We also had gym upheaval a few months ago and really considered quitting the whole deal, but changed gyms instead - with all of the gym families that we were really close to.

 

My other daughter is just as involved in dance and spends just as much time at the studio, which happens to be 45 minutes west of town. Gym is 45 minutes south of town, and we live 45 minutes north of town. Some days it just seems too much.

[EmilyK]

Lisa, I'm so sorry to hear this. You must be so understandably discouraged.

 

I meant to respond in your other thread about swim season starting up. We were that same weekend deciding not to keep DS 10 doing CYO swimming (I realize, not the same thing at all with the club level swimming you're involved with). I don't want to hijack your thread, and our issues were totally different. My son loves learning and practicing the technique of the strokes, but really doesn't like meets. Enjoys his summer team, but winter CYO (especially meets) was becoming a dreaded chore. Our struggle is how to find physical activity for 2 boys who don't like competition and team sports.

 

Sometimes I wish there were more obvious answers. I'll be thinking of you.

[EthiopianFood]

What do your kids say about it? Is there any way you can carpool?

[Sugarfoot]

:grouphug: to you. We went through this last year with gymnastics. My DD decided to "take a break," which was great for all of us. She ended up stopping completely. Just the other day, she said, "Mommy, isn't it weird that I don't miss gymnastics AT ALL?"

 

Good luck, and feel better!

[sunshine]

shoulder injuries? I thought swimming was a non hazardous sport. My dd9 just started on the swim team, 3 days a week practice, and she is loving it. My ds18, dd6 and I swim laps for an hour while she practices. Clue me in if this is going to cause injuries.

[swimmermom3]

shoulder injuries? I thought swimming was a non hazardous sport. My dd9 just started on the swim team, 3 days a week practice, and she is loving it. My ds18, dd6 and I swim laps for an hour while she practices. Clue me in if this is going to cause injuries.

 

Sunshine, I would never want to discourage anyone from the sport of swimming. It has been so good to us as a family. Obviously, we have formed strong friendships and we have thoroughly enjoyed the ride.

 

Swimming isn't hazardous. However, the more advanced the swimmer, the longer the training sessions. My youngest has been on a USA swim team since he was 7. For the last year and half he has trained 6 days a week for a minimum of 2 hours a day. Older kids can train upwards 25+ hours a week. If you start when you are 6-7, you have a lot of wear and tear on your body by the time you are 15-16. Kids get tired and lose their form, making them more susceptible to injury. There are a lot of different factors. You and your family will be fine. Have fun! I wish your dd all the best.

[camibami]

Right there with ya, with rhythmic gymnastics. The gym is an hours drive in traffic, then only 20 minutes home (no traffic). Practice ends at 10 pm some nights. There is zero fun in the gym here in Korea, she is the only student with her coach so no gym friends (couldn't speak to them if there were), stretching is quite beyond the pale and I have to leave the gym when it is being done, no AC, hard floor that makes me worry so about injuries.

 

Yet, my kid loves it, so-? If she is willing to do it, with all of this, who am I to stop her? Or am I irresponsible to NOT stop her? Where is the line, exactly, how much of this I am feeling is the product of my culture (US sloth :tongue_smilie:) versus Korean culture?

 

I have no answers, for you or me. Only that I understand how hard it is!

:grouphug:

[swimmermom3]

I'm so sorry. :grouphug: It is hard when you have hills and valleys. Sometimes those valleys can seem so low. Maybe you can become guitarmom3?? Just a thought. :rolleyes: ;) :D hehe

 

Guitarmom3? Hmmm, Jen. That sounds way more glamorous (better wardrobe too) than swimmermom3.:lol: I would have to practice a whole lot more than I do to honestly claim that title.

 

I honestly have had the same thoughts this week about gymnastics. My dd is only 10 and is spending almost 20 hours a week in the gym. Her gym is great, her coach is great, the gym families are our family, but I am TIRED. I keep thinking that it will be too much for her and she will choose not to keep going, but she shows no signs of that.

 

We also had gym upheaval a few months ago and really considered quitting the whole deal, but changed gyms instead - with all of the gym families that we were really close to.

 

My other daughter is just as involved in dance and spends just as much time at the studio, which happens to be 45 minutes west of town. Gym is 45 minutes south of town, and we live 45 minutes north of town. Some days it just seems too much.

 

What do your kids say about it? Is there any way you can carpool?

 

It's not that I am tired in the physical sense. We live 10 minutes from the pool and up until last year, all of my kids swam. It's the emotional aspect. Our friends' middle child is one of the most gifted young swimmers I have seen, perhaps even better than her older sister. At 15, she reached a point where she could no longer reach her hands over her head. Her younger brother has told me what it feels like for him to no longer be able to do what he loves. He's 12. I've watched the discouragement on my son's face to have to sit out a whole season. It's like a billion kick sets, if you can't use your arms.

 

I have been rethinking the whole elite sport thing and our friends' exit just raised more questions for me. Okay, I might also be a tiny bit irked at the team for only just starting to take the rise in shoulder injuries seriously.

 

Lisa, I'm so sorry to hear this. You must be so understandably discouraged.

 

I meant to respond in your other thread about swim season starting up. We were that same weekend deciding not to keep DS 10 doing CYO swimming (I realize, not the same thing at all with the club level swimming you're involved with). I don't want to hijack your thread, and our issues were totally different. My son loves learning and practicing the technique of the strokes, but really doesn't like meets. Enjoys his summer team, but winter CYO (especially meets) was becoming a dreaded chore. Our struggle is how to find physical activity for 2 boys who don't like competition and team sports.

 

Sometimes I wish there were more obvious answers. I'll be thinking of you.

 

Emily, what about bouldering? My nephew does it and it's very cool. Rather unique too. We live in a good area for it. My older kids don't love the competition anymore. When my dd switched to track, she made every practice and none of the meets. I felt sorry for the coach.

 

:grouphug: to you. We went through this last year with gymnastics. My DD decided to "take a break," which was great for all of us. She ended up stopping completely. Just the other day, she said, "Mommy, isn't it weird that I don't miss gymnastics AT ALL?"

 

Good luck, and feel better!

 

Thank you. Did your dd feel at a loss at all about her identity? I mean at our house, Swimmerdude has always been a swimmer dude. I'm not sure his own family would recognize him without jammers, goggles, and hair standing on end. It's what he does and it's who he is.

 

Thanks everyone. Hopefully my pity party is over.:tongue_smilie: Did I mention that the friend who is leaving the team is the one who started me on the home school path. Yes, it's all her fault. They live 45 minutes from the pool and we will see a lot less of them. Who will I discuss the Odyssey with?:nopity:

[SwimmyKids]

No big surprise: Emailed you.

[Ibbygirl]

Guitarmom3? Hmmm, Jen. That sounds way more glamorous (better wardrobe too) than swimmermom3.:lol: I would have to practice a whole lot more than I do to honestly claim that title.

 

Do we get better clothes really? Hmmm. I need to tell dh that one. :) hehe But seriously speaking. I am sorry. I can hear your heart through your words and I understand your dilemma and although it's all fine and good to joke to make you heart lighter, I know it's no laughing matter. It is difficult weighing the costs and choosing what is best. I hope that you can come to a solution that gives you peace in your heart and mind and that benefits your whole family. :grouphug: :grouphug:

[Danestress]

"why are we doing this?"

 

I have a competitive swimmer and a competitive tennis player. I try to tell parents not to do it for the college scholarship (it's pretty tenuous in any sport, really, because of injuries). But some days it's hard to know why we do it. I do it because I love watching my boys move and I love watching them do something that THEY love. If your son doesn't love 2 hours of practice a day (that's a lot for an 11 year old) then would he love less?

 

We switched from a team that was really focused on "who are our elite swimmers?" because I felt it wasn't good for the advanced swimmers or the less talented ones. Swimming is HARD emotionally (tennis is worse, lol) and I think you have to either love it or not do it at some point - or do much less of it. But the kids simply can't love it every single day. It's hard work, and it can be boring to practice.

 

We went to meet Olympic gold medal winner Mark Gangloff recently and he told the kids that he had several years in his late teens/early 20's of not having a best time in his best stroke. I think it was four years. He said it required a lot of soul searching to figure out why he was still trying and it took a lot of encouragement from his parents to stay in it. Of course, that ultimately paid off, but I think it's a totally legitimate decision to do something else instead.

 

Would your children consider cutting way way back on their swim schedules (possibly with a lower-key team) and consider doing a different sport like soccer or track for just one season? It might be a nice break for all of you.

[ciyates]

It is tough leaving a team. We took this season off. It has been a little odd to hug my DS and he doesn't smell like chlorine. LOL!

[Lolly]

I can't tell you how many times I've tried to talk my girls into stopping. Actually, I tried this year. They will not. Short of me being the bad guy and forcing the issue, it isn't going to happen. I just couldn't do that to them.

[Scarlett]

Lisa, I'm so sorry to hear this. You must be so understandably discouraged.

 

I meant to respond in your other thread about swim season starting up. We were that same weekend deciding not to keep DS 10 doing CYO swimming (I realize, not the same thing at all with the club level swimming you're involved with). I don't want to hijack your thread, and our issues were totally different. My son loves learning and practicing the technique of the strokes, but really doesn't like meets. Enjoys his summer team, but winter CYO (especially meets) was becoming a dreaded chore. Our struggle is how to find physical activity for 2 boys who don't like competition and team sports.

 

Sometimes I wish there were more obvious answers. I'll be thinking of you.

 

My son's swim team allows him to just swim and not compete. He is 9 1/2 and on the second level up of 4 levels. He goes about 3 hours a week right now. I think that is a great amount of exercise and swimming is great for you. However, like anything else it can become an obession (for the kids, or parents or coach if your child is good) ....the Senior level swims A LOT. 5 and 6 days a week,morning and night, for 1 1/2 hours....that is just.....ridiculous IMO.

 

To original poster.....what does your son want to do?

[Mommyfaithe]

I don't want to be swimmermom3 anymore. In fact, I don't think I want to be a swim mom at all.

 

Today I received a call from a good friend, another swim mom, that their family will no longer be swimming with our club. They are the family that every good club dreams of having as members: 5 swimmers, 4 of which have set numerous state records, two with Top 16 times, and one participating in the Olympic Trials. My friend does all meet entry and works as an ET and her dh is one of our best and most active referees. He also serves on our board. It's a major loss for our team and for our family.

 

For five years, they have been good friends. Our boys have had a great time hanging out at the pool together, traveling together and spending up to a week at a time at each others' houses. I trust the care of my children to them and I would take their kids anywhere. Nearly everything we do at the pool and meets involves them.

 

They are quitting because 2 of their children have severe shoulder injuries. The youngest child is only 10 but is is on the elite squad and now trains the same 14 hours my ds (11) does. He's not injured yet, but it all is just too much.

 

My ds has a shoulder injury too that is on the mend. I just don't want to do it anymore. Any of it. Anybody else been there?

 

It is called burn out.....and your ds is too young for that....

The team you described is really excessive.

I have seen kids go to national levels without nearly so much practice...

I have seen kids blow shoulders in 12tyh grade and lose their scholarships....1...2...3... GONE. Then where are they?? in depression....

 

I am a swim Mom....but NOT in the usual sense. i refuse to be illogical...

I need to look at my child's future and see how hard.....and when....we push.

DD NEVER earned a single point for her team. She started competing at 14. She was never going to catch up and be the super-star....BUT I encouraged her on because there was a bigger picture. She LOVED the sport. She loves the pool. She LOVES the smell of chlorine in her hair. She has the heart of a swimmer....SO....she did all her certs and now she coaches the 8 and unders on her team. If I would have pushed and pushed and over - trained her....Hmmmmmm

 

All of my younger kids are swimmers too. They have earned points...lotsa points, BUT I would never consider the amount of training your ds is expected to do. They need other interests and some time to develope as a person. They need time for MATH. LOL

 

If the only reason you are on this team is because of your close family ties with this other family, please reconsider the price you are paying. You may have this family set as an example on how you would like your family to be. That is ok. We all need role models...BUT take a breath and pray...and ask what your move should be.

 

I really think your sons team is totally excessive. He could still swim competitively....at a nicely high level (US swimming clubs offer great competition) without all the extra pressure. 3 nights a week for 2 hours is PLENTY for a growing body. Let him cross train by riding his bike or running...or gardening...or stick a pull up bar in the coat closet.

 

You asked about this at the beginning of the season and it is a really hard decision. Leaving a team can feel like a divorce...but really, it is ok to do what is right for you and your son. We have kids come on to our team and leave for others fairly frequently. Maybe there is some underlying animosity...but I have never seen it in action. Mostly the kids are happy to see one another at meets and once everything is a week or 2 old...no sweat.

 

I hope you get peace in this decision. I know it is a hard one. I for one am making the decision this year whether to have my 10th grader continue or persue other avenues of interest. He is a good swimmer...not great...but very good...and could possibly get a nice sum from colleges....but what we are doing is weighing the cost to see if the pay-off is sufficient.

 

Good luck,

Faithe

[Lolly]

shoulder injuries? I thought swimming was a non hazardous sport. My dd9 just started on the swim team, 3 days a week practice, and she is loving it. My ds18, dd6 and I swim laps for an hour while she practices. Clue me in if this is going to cause injuries.

 

No such thing as a nonhazardous sport! Shoulder injuries are a major part of the swim world. Almost all the elite swimmers have suffered from them at some point. Many, many have required surgery for correction. It is caused by overuse and hyperextension of the joint. A lot of the time it is because very young, very good athletes are put into practices that their young bodies are not ready for. They are too good to swim with the kids their age. They literally swim laps around them. So, they are put into upper groups where they are doing extremely long sets and practices. Their undeveloped bodies and joints just cannot handle that stress.

 

One key to helping to keep injuries down is to not go to too many practices a week while the kids are young. For example, most of the 10-12 yos on our team are practicing 5-6 times a week for 2 hours a practice. 3-4 days a week is a healthier schedule for that age. Problem? the kids WANT to go to practice. The kids who do not usually don't make the fast progress that the others do. Plus, practice is fun.

 

Another way to prevent these injuries is to make sure they are cross training. Do swim practice 3-4 days a week and have another sport. You just need to make sure it isn't a sport that uses the same muscles in the same motions. Baseball, tennis, and volleyball, for example, tend to use the same shoulder motions that cause swimmers problems. Any cross training is better than none though!

 

Also, don't push to have your swimmer moved up groups. Swimming at the lower levels is not a bad thing. Many of these kids are moved because the parents are frustrated because Johnny isn't getting the level of practice he needs. And, they are right. Johnny is having way too easy a time at practice. The thing is, it is what his age of body should be doing. Yes, Johnny can do the practices at the next level. Johnny can beat the pants off of the older kids. Johnny will perform better if he is in the next group up. But, at what cost down the line?

 

Our swim team got a new coach last year. He is instituting age guidelines for the different groups to go along with the performances ones that have been being used. If you are not at least 14, you do not move out of the age group levels. If you are not 9, you must be in the lowest group. The middle age group they are trying to keep as ages 9-11 or 12. Of course, that doesn't mean that you can't be older than that and be in those groups. There are 13 yo's in the middle age group because their technique isn't up to moving up. Many parents are up in arms about these limits.

 

Also, one thing we have done is to take a serious year, and then back off the next year. When they are at the top of their age group, we go at it harder. Bottom of the age group, back off. This is our back off year. Our last one. I won't be driving but one early morning practice this year. Don't really care what the coach things.:tongue_smilie:

Edited September 22, 2009 by Lolly

[Mommyfaithe]

shoulder injuries? I thought swimming was a non hazardous sport. My dd9 just started on the swim team, 3 days a week practice, and she is loving it. My ds18, dd6 and I swim laps for an hour while she practices. Clue me in if this is going to cause injuries.

 

non-hazardous????? LOL!!!

 

Nope...shoulder injuries...blown knees...broken hand (dd hit the wall wrong) Chlorine related asthma, pulled tendons, banged heads and worst of all...broken necks. Yes, broken necks....one weird dive off a block...

 

Swimming has Mono associated with it, plantar warts, all types of skin issues.. not to mention being in a hot steamy room for 4 or 5 hours with 200 other swimmers who are so competitive they just have to swim even when they have a fever and strep throats...ugh!

 

Swimming is not hazard - free...nope...

 

~~Faithe

[Nan in Mass]

I've wanted to quit being a gymnastics family SO many times. I want to eat dinner as a family, not throw hard boiled eggs at my children with their grips as I hurry them into the car. I want them to have time to make things. Two of the three are makers and need time to do that. I think my children hurt all the time. Except for a few years here and there, they've hated competing. I just watched my middle one struggle through the transition to a college with no gymnastics. Why on earth do we keep doing it?

 

And yet... my children have a strength that their friends don't have. Gymnastics gave two of mine the strength to peacewalk, and one the strength to drive a crazy commute into Boston and survive the hazing of a plumbing apprenticeship. It came in handy when he fell off a second story ladder, too (it collapsed). It has been nice to have coaches to help with the parenting. It gave them the self-discipline to achieve whatever they want to achieve (want being the operative word GRIN). Many things are easier for them because of gymnastics. So we keep doing it. We have tried to compromise and take light years, years when they hardly compete at all, months when they are absent to peacewalk or sail, years with coaches who don't push as hard. We try to help them apply it to other things, like bouldering. It isn't as fun, though, if you don't do it at a higher level. I still worry about the wear and tear on their bodies.

 

Ambivalent - that about describes my feelings towards it.

 

-Nan

[BMW]

Just chiming in here... We are a tennis family. Our coach asked us for 2 more afternoons a week yesterday. So, we'll be at the courts Sun. afternoon (at which time I am to volunteer), Mon., Tues., Wed., Thurs., afternoons. When there are tournaments, we are sure to be there Fri. and Sat. Phew. Each afternoon I get stuck in what I call my perpetual circle... home to the high school (next to the courts), back home, back tot he courts, back home, to the high school (tennis team going on there, too), over to the courts, back home and back to the courts for a last pick up and home... round and round, from 3pm until 6pm...I am blessed because the courts are 1-1/2 miles down the road.

[MariannNOVA]

If we had stayed on vacation for another week (at which time our house would have floated away), I could be SWIMMERMOM for awhile and you could be someone else. :lol::lol::lol:

 

You will always be swimmermom in my heart -- keep the name -- the dynamics will change, but that is who you are.

 

I think :confused:.....suffice to say I am not thinking clearly these days.

 

Shoulder injuries BITE! I landed on my shoulder when I was run off the road during a run -- they BITE! :grouphug: --virtual only! :lol:

[swimmermom3]

A huge thank you to everyone for your support, advice, and yes, the "hard truths" as well. My apologies that I have not responded earlier. We have had some family business to take care of this week.

 

To include all of the quotes would make a very long reply even longer so bear with me, please.

 

Faithe, our friendship with the other family is far from the only reason we are on the team. It's an added bonus. My friend and I seldom talk about swimming and never about pool politics. She is one of the few women IRL that I can have a deep conversation or a lively debate with. She keeps my mind from disappearing into the black abyss of routine. I have no desire to emulate her family (okay, her kids are cool) with regards to swimming. In fact, my ds has a very clear idea of what it takes to make Nationals and Olympic Trial cuts and knows that his chances are slim. We have few illusions when it comes to swimming.

 

Our team is a silver medal level USA Swim team with about 200 swimmers. My son is on the 10-12 Top Age Group squad where the majority of swimmers have sectional cuts. The 50m facility is 10 minutes from our house. Ds cross-trains for 40 minutes per session except Wednesday. We were clueless when we chose the team primarily on proximity. There are other clubs that are a hefty drive away. I would consider one of them, but they are primarily a sprint club and my ds is a distance swimmer.

 

Lolly, it sounds like our team has roughly the same schedule as your team's 10-12 yos. I agree that 3-4 weeks times per week would be healthier. We had a different squad set-up when my dd was that age. There was a squad that allowed the kids to choose to come between 4-6 times a week. It was saner and the kids still progressed. You are right about practice. My ds wants to go to practice. It's where his friends are.

 

My dh and I talked about your (Lolly) idea of backing off this year since ds is at the bottom of the 11-14 age group. Brilliant plan. Don't know why we didn't think of it, especially after sectionals last year.:D My ds ages up the week of sectionals. He was one of the youngest swimmers there. What's the point? We are now skipping Wednesday practices since it is 2 hours of straight swimming without cross-training.

 

Danestress, my ds loves swimming. I also enjoy watching him swim. You're right. Swimming is hard emotionally and even more so after an injury. DS is working his way back up the ranks. He's used to leading and has had to adjust.

 

Ds is not willing to look at another team at this point but is kind of intrigued with your (Danestress) suggestion to try another sport. He loves the running part of dryland and would like to try some races with his dad and sister as well. Also a team friend of his disappears during baseball season but still manages to swim well enough at state.

 

Nan, you stated beautifully in part, why we still do it. So far, what we have gained as a family and as individules far outweighs what we have given up. The key is really to keep the scales from tipping in the other direction.

 

So, as of today, I am still "swimmermom3" but with fewer hours at the pool and a couple of numbers to call to see about some other sports. Personally, I'm hoping for baseball. We've done dance, football, soccer, basketball, and lots of track, but never baseball.:001_smile:

 

:grouphug: back to all of you. May your children have a great season in whatever sport they pursue. If you too hit the wall and need someone to hold your hand, you know where to find me. I owe you.

Edited September 25, 2009 by swimmermom3

[mcconnellboys]

Been there! So sorry! I just saw a doctor speak about shoulder injuries in kids under 21. He said that in 2000-2001 he did something like 13 shoulder surgeries. In 2004-2006, he did something like 281. This is a surgery that was only ever really intended to be for professional athletes. They don't really know how kids will do in the long run, as adults, when they've had to have it so early in life.

 

He attributed most sports going to year-round as the main culprit. Kids who are still growing and developing simply can not stand that much wear and tear on their young joints. He said that with baseball pitchers, for instance, if they *ever* play with fatigue (not necessarily fatigue from over-pitching, but any type of fatigue, such as too little sleep the night before, etc.), then they are several times more susceptible to injury than if they are playing fully rested.

 

My older son was out all summer before last with both shoulders injured. Because we stopped everything but the light, summer neighborhood swim team - and stopped it immediately when his problems began - he seems to have pretty much recovered, at least for now. He didn't swim long-course heavily this past summer, either. If he does decide to continue swimming in college, he's only going to swim for a Division III team. None of us are interested in what's involved at the Division I level.

 

Moderation is key! Single sport athletes can be easily taxed to the limit with all sports going to year-round status now. Those athletes who try to participate in multiple sports (like my nephew) are sure to have injuries before they get out of high school. I think 8-10 hours a week for teens who swim is ample, especially if they're doing something like 5000 yds. per practice.

[swimmermom3]

Thanks, Regena. I can't imagine having both shoulders injured. I hope your son gets to continue swimming for a collegiate team where he can have some fun. The year after my dd quit the team, 2 of her team mates had shoulder surgeries at the ripe old age of 15. Part of the issue is that most of these swimmers, my ds included, would rather eat gravel than tell a coach something hurts. Sometimes it's too late when the coach and even the parents find out.

 

Our ds was very aware of shoulder injuries due to his friend and his sister, so we were able to catch his injury early when it happened. He kicked all summer, ran, did PT and gradually began to swim stroke by stroke. We'll know more soon as he starts a limited amount of butterfly today.

 

With my oldest I thought about the big meets and college swimming all the time. Now, as Nan so accurately put it - I am ambivalent.

[SwimmyKids]

Pm'ed you. Can't find my original email though.

[Nicole M]

Well, we're a music family, and we suffer lots of long hours and missed dinners, but not at the level you're talkin'. But I wanted to offer sympathy anyway, even though I don't rilly, rilly know what you're talking about. But I can imagine. And it sounds sucky.

 

:grouphug:

[Impish]

Our friends' middle child is one of the most gifted young swimmers I have seen, perhaps even better than her older sister. At 15, she reached a point where she could no longer reach her hands over her head. Her younger brother has told me what it feels like for him to no longer be able to do what he loves. He's 12. I've watched the discouragement on my son's face to have to sit out a whole season. It's like a billion kick sets, if you can't use your arms.

 

I have been rethinking the whole elite sport thing and our friends' exit just raised more questions for me. Okay, I might also be a tiny bit irked at the team for only just starting to take the rise in shoulder injuries seriously.

 

Thank you. Did your dd feel at a loss at all about her identity? I mean at our house, Swimmerdude has always been a swimmer dude. I'm not sure his own family would recognize him without jammers, goggles, and hair standing on end. It's what he does and it's who he is.

 

 

First of all, and I am saying this seriously, not to be an alarmist, but if I didn't speak up, I'd regret it.

 

I have RSD, caused by (short version) a strain sprain of my shoulder through fingertips. An MRI showed a partially torn tendon.

 

Children can and most certainly DO develop RSD. There is no age, gender, fitness factor involved, and it absolutely can come from a trivial injury as mine did.

 

I'm so relieved to hear that you're dropping a practice. I would be devastated to hear that one of your kids developed RSD as a result of swimming. Mine was a work incident, grabbed by a resident. To have RSD because of a sport injury....ack.

 

The other thing is, *gently* you need to help him find his identity away from the pool. If something were to occur, and swimming was suddenly off the table, he'd be at serious risk for depression. It may be, for now, what he does, but not who he is, kwim? He'd still be him if he never swam another lap.

 

I wish you and your kids all the best :grouphug:

[In The Great White North]

Been there! So sorry! I just saw a doctor speak about shoulder injuries in kids under 21. He said that in 2000-2001 he did something like 13 shoulder surgeries. In 2004-2006, he did something like 281. This is a surgery that was only ever really intended to be for professional athletes. They don't really know how kids will do in the long run, as adults, when they've had to have it so early in life.

 

He attributed most sports going to year-round as the main culprit.

 

This might make sense for baseball but doesn't for swimming. Swimming has been year round for at least 40 years. Standard yardages were much higher when I was a kid, with everyone doing the two a day plus weights Michael Phelps thing. But I never even heard of a shoulder injury, let alone a surgery.

 

I've talked to a couple of PTs, who get the swimmers referred to them for rehabilitation, who put the blame on posture. They said none of those kids stand up straight, shoulders back, etc and no one ever corrects them. Thirty years ago, your mom, teacher, neighbor, etc ALL were constantly reminding us to stand up straight. Hunching over computers has exacerbated the problem, leading to unbalanced muscles in the shoulder and back that allow the shoulder joint to move incorrectly.

 

I would really like to see someone do some serious research on this.

[mcconnellboys]

Was the yardage the same back then? I know several adults here who are closer to my age who used to swim and they didn't do nearly the amount of yardage our kids do now. The number of practices and the dryland/weights were similar in terms of number of practices per week, but the yardage was much less. I don't know that many adults who swam, though, so I can't really make a productive comparison.

[Lovedtodeath]

This might make sense for baseball but doesn't for swimming. Swimming has been year round for at least 40 years. Standard yardages were much higher when I was a kid, with everyone doing the two a day plus weights Michael Phelps thing. But I never even heard of a shoulder injury, let alone a surgery.

 

I've talked to a couple of PTs, who get the swimmers referred to them for rehabilitation, who put the blame on posture. They said none of those kids stand up straight, shoulders back, etc and no one ever corrects them. Thirty years ago, your mom, teacher, neighbor, etc ALL were constantly reminding us to stand up straight. Hunching over computers has exacerbated the problem, leading to unbalanced muscles in the shoulder and back that allow the shoulder joint to move incorrectly.

 

I would really like to see someone do some serious research on this.

This sounds like the theory put forth by the creator of "egoscuesize" physical therapy postures. http://www.egoscue.com/

[In The Great White North]

Was the yardage the same back then? I know several adults here who are closer to my age who used to swim and they didn't do nearly the amount of yardage our kids do now. The number of practices and the dryland/weights were similar in terms of number of practices per week, but the yardage was much less. I don't know that many adults who swam, though, so I can't really make a productive comparison.

__________________

 

We did 10,000 plus or minus a day, had morning and evening practices and lifted weights (Nautilus). This was not "Olympic potential," just run of the mill swimming. The team my dc swim on maxes out around 6,000 and never has morning practices, due to pool time constraints. The team around here that does get occasional mornings does do more but only has a handful of high schoolers show up for two a day.

[mcconnellboys]

Well I guess swimming is not at all the same in my area of the country, then. I don't know of any high school age teams that do more than about 5000 a day - and that's a max. There are many that are non-USA teams that do less than that.

 

The orthopedists I've talked to worry about even that much for kids who are still growing.

 

Most who go on to Division I schools and who have to immediately start in on something closer to 10,000 a day are completely drained at least their entire freshmen year. If they hold out and make it to the second year free of injury, they may be able to swim the entire time. Many don't make it past the first year.

 

So maybe the problem is that not all areas of the country are doing the same sort of level of swimming. The 5000 a day that high school age (mostly) kids do around here is a big step up from the level they are at just the year before they move to the senior age group, which is more like 3000 a day.

 

We are seeing large numbers of injuries in our area with just this level of swimming. I can't imagine how many injuries there might be if large areas of the country are trying to swim kids at the same level that they will swim in a Division I college practice. I can't imagine high school age kids even having the time to swim 10,000 a day.

 

Perhaps you mean in two practices, rather than per practice? During the short course competition season, we do swim closer to 10,000 two days per week. That's mega tough on the kids and only the strongest can do it.

 

If lots of kids used to do this *daily*, what could be happening to our kids? Are they less strong, physically? less able to tolerate activity? I wonder if our crappy, pre-packaged convenience food diets could be contributing.....?

[In The Great White North]

Perhaps you mean in two practices, rather than per practice? During the short course competition season, we do swim closer to 10,000 two days per week. That's mega tough on the kids and only the strongest can do it.

 

Yes, in two practices. 3000-4000 in the morning (one hour) and 7000-8000 in the afternoon (two hours). This was the norm in the 1970's and 1980's (right after goggles became widely available.)

 

Well I guess swimming is not at all the same in my area of the country, then. I don't know of any high school age teams that do more than about 5000 a day - and that's a max. There are many that are non-USA teams that do less than that

 

This is why the connection between yardage and shoulder injury increases doesn't hold up. Our club team maxes out at 6000 a day and our high school teams (no high schools around here have their own pools) only get three days a week.

 

There must be something else adding to the shoulder problem.

[swimmermom3]

This discussion piqued my interest and I did a little research. I was curious about Great White North's proposal. The 10,000 yards seemed to be about average and was mentioned in several articles from this time frame and even the early 1990s. However, I did find the yardage mentioned in shoulder injury prevention articles so I don't feel like I found anything conclusive either way.

 

Our pt did tell ds to work continually on his posture and that the computer and gaming can be a factor. So, I think there is definitely something to consider here. Also, the sheer increase in numbers may be in part due to the overall increase in the numbers participating in competitive swimming.

 

Several years ago there was an article in Men's Fitness featuring the biomechanics guy that works with Phelps. This man was swimming close to what he swam in high school /college and was at least 50. I was excited that the idea of what he had learned could mean a change in how swimmers approached training - smarter work, less of it. I haven't seen anything since then.

 

I have known 2 elite swimmers whose parents have initiated changes to their strength training that included considerably more pilates and almost no weight training. They weigh less than their team mates, have better posture, and fewer injuries. I would love to see more work in this area.

Edited September 27, 2009 by swimmermom3
numerous errors

[jamnkats]

Was the yardage the same back then? I know several adults here who are closer to my age who used to swim and they didn't do nearly the amount of yardage our kids do now. The number of practices and the dryland/weights were similar in terms of number of practices per week, but the yardage was much less. I don't know that many adults who swam, though, so I can't really make a productive comparison.

 

I swam competitively as a kid (you know, back when dinosaurs roamed the earth AAU swimming - some 40 years ago) and we did dry land, weights, 2x practices a day and IIRC, our yardage was around 4-5000yd/practice.

Edited September 28, 2009 by jamnkats

[In The Great White North]

I have known 2 elite swimmers whose parents have initiated changes to their strength training that included considerably more pilates and almost no weight training. They weigh less than their team mates, have better posture, and fewer injuries. I would love to see more work in this area.

 

Now this has piqued my interest. Did they use a regular pilates program (like at the Y) or something individually tailored to swimming? Do you have any more details? I'm going to have to look into pilates.

[Elizabeth Conley]

...and there is life after leaving the sport you lived and breathed. We were all very serious about martial arts, then the pressures placed on the kids got unbearable. We were getting injured with increasing frequency. Furthermore, the relationships between the people at the top of our organization were outright repulsive to us, and we didn't want to become part of their depravity.

 

It was crushing to the kids and I, but in the end we walked away. We still work out together on a semi-weekly basis, and we still love martial arts. We just don't live and breath it any more.

 

As a 47 year old matron lady, I must say that I'm very grateful to be able to take better care of my increasingly fragile arthritic joints. The kids are very grateful to be free of their sensei's explosive rages, which were increasingly directed at them as they rose in rank. We're all very glad to be free of the near constant sports injuries that seemed to plague our lives.

 

My husband is over the moon to have us home again most evenings. It's done wonders for our family. We now have an unprecedented amount of free time, which we revel in.

 

I now question my judgment in placing so much emphasis on one activity. I think I made a mistake that could have been quite costly. I am working to be certain my children's educations and social lives are well rounded. Athletics are a part of it, but I now encourage them to join in a variety of sports. I encourage their interest in the arts, and I'm in the process of finding music instruction for both of them.

 

Luckily, we changed course at a good time. My daughter is 13, and my son is 10. I'm glad I've got time left to help them build well rounded educations and lots of great childhood memories.

 

I think excellence in one sport or activity can be a great for many people, but there are serious detractors to a narrow focus so early in life.

 

One of the things that kept me hanging in there, long after it had ceased to be fun, was the fear of being a quitter, or teaching the kids to be quitters. We really slogged it out, long after anyone with a grain of sense would have cut their losses. Don't make my mistake. If it's not fun anymore, then at least take a break. You can figure out if you want to go back after you've gotten some distance and a bit of perspective.

 

Blessings,

 

Elizabeth

Edited September 28, 2009 by Elizabeth Conley