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My husband 'courted' me before we were engaged - I did not know that was what it was called...someone else told me. We were never alone -- my mom or my sister and her husband were always with us. At the time, 16 years ago, my two daughters were teenagers and my future DH was very sensitive to the example that I had to set for them as young Christian women. My mom accompanied us everywhere....and she loved it as my dad had recently passed away and this was companionship for her.

 

I guess that 'dating' is what 'courting' isn't...two people out alone (which dh and I NEVER get to do today with three kiddos! :glare:) without an adult chaperone. I found courting to be incredibly appropriate, very comfortable, and quite chivalrous.

 

Why would I choose this over 'dating?' I had made a conscious decision NOT to date, and I didn't. My two daughters introduced me to my future DH - he was their youth pastor at our Church. We spoke with each other alot at public gatherings about youth group activities, and we became good friends. My sister even tried to fix him up with single female friends of hers. He began showing up at my mom's or at my sister's with 'goodies' from the Bakery and my mom or my sister would call me and my girls and ask us to come over for coffee and he would be there -- sometimes with HIS mother! I am laughing now as I remember this! It was excellent for my daughters to see me treated with respect and consideration, and they felt respected as well by the treatment of me. That is why I would choose this over dating --I know that he and I were a good example for my daughters and my nieces who were pre-teen age.

 

Hope this helps.

Hope this helps!

Edited by MariannNOVA
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Some people don't make a distinction. In our religion, it's still called dating but never would a male and female be alone together unless they were married to one another (I wouldn't be in a house, car, restaurant, etc with a friend's hubby, for example). Anyway, so the words are used interchangeably in my home since I think more along the line of courting and all discussion/literature mentions dating.

 

But regardless, people are encouraged to:

 

1) wait past the bloom of youth

2) "look away" until they are ready to consider marriage

3) guard their hearts (and be kind towards the heart of any other person)

4) courting and dating are for people ready to consider marriage

5) you would have some idea about the person, their qualities, reputation, etc.

 

Anyway, so my kids understand that it's when you're in a position to be a proper wife/hubby. And they know that that is probably after 20, possibly well after 20 yrs of age (most young 20's in our congregation are not married or looking for marriage). They understand it will include chaperones along the way.

 

Well, my daughter isn't interested in the least. My son thinks that some people may be younger (not 14, but...) and could get to know someone in a way to get married in a few years.

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Last time I will write on this topic - I promise!

 

 

I do remember reading P and P by Elizabeth Elliot - and then having my daughters read it. I have gifted young women with copies of it, and I cringed when one of them commented, 'You don't really think anyone does this stuff today, do you? People will think I'm crazy.'

Two things I remember distinctly from her book...the phrase: 'Don't marry a girl unless you want to kiss her, and don't kiss her unless you want to marry her.' AND, a poem by Christina Rosetti which begins with the line: 'I love, as you would have me, G-d the most. Would lose not Him but you, should one be lost.' The poem continues -- I selected it to read to DH as part of our vows and he selected something equally beautiful to read to me.

Thanks for posting your question -- you've made me remember SO many wonderful things about our courtship -- our 14th wedding anniversary is at the end of this month! :001_smile:

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You can't be positive that the one you court is a good match for marriage. That is the purpose of courting, to find out. However, you certainly can be careful about who you choose to court, guarding your heart as well as the hearts of others.

 

Generally, you wouldn't just court anyone off the street. Instead, you meet him in the congregation or the homeschool group or college or neighborhood or whatever. People you know know him or know of him. He is active in the ministry work or he's helpful to an elderly member of the congregation or he teaches 3rd grade Latin or or or or. So if you're in a position that you might be ready to consider marriage, you might ask about him. You might discuss various things such as "you're great with Jumping Johnny! You planning on children one day?" or whatever...Things just come up in life, ya know? And so as you find out that he has this great reputation and some acheivable responsible goals and a sweet disposition and such, you decide maybe....and he's doing all this also, of course. And so at 20something, you might start courting. And you'll start slowly as you still don't have all the information necessary. And one day you tie the knot. Or find out it isn't best and are glad you didn't overdo any aspect of the relationship.

 

Assuming you don't lock your kids in the closet, they'll meet people of the opposite sex and sometime by 30 or so, they'll find one they want to be with.

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Pamela's answer is PERFECT! THAT is how I met DH - I should mention though that neither one of us was 'looking'...I do think that our others were looking, and I know that my daughters were looking.

 

In fact, one morning I asked my dds as I drove them to school if they had youth group plans for that night. They said that Mariano (my now DH) was going to plan something for the group. I commented that they were going to be lost as a group when he met someone and settled down and got married. My then 13 y/o dd responded (and I remember her words like they were yesterday) 'Mariano says he is not getting married till the Lord sends him the right woman to marry' and I commented: 'SHEESH -- with a plan like that, he is going to be single for a long time.' :lol: I was still in my 'cynical' stage. As he and I began to talk and get to know each other, we were both constantly in awe of just how much we had in common. He was also committed to 'not dating' and coming from a very proper family (and he had a younger sister), he did know the courting procedure.

 

OK -- enough now -- I know I have made light of some of this, but it is very serious, and G-d does have a plan for us and He will see to it that we meet the person He has planned for us.

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And so at 20something, you might start courting. And you'll start slowly as you still don't have all the information necessary. And one day you tie the knot. Or find out it isn't best and are glad you didn't overdo any aspect of the relationship.

 

Assuming you don't lock your kids in the closet, they'll meet people of the opposite sex and sometime by 30 or so, they'll find one they want to be with.

 

Wow! Getting married around 30! Courting sounds great and I do love the way you explain it because I don't know much about it. But I can't imagine getting married so late in my life! I was married at 21 with my high school sweetheart (we dated through high school and college), and we had talked about getting married even younger!!

 

So I imagine that courting encourages late marriage (OK...sorry if many think 30 is not considered "late marriage"!!)?? Or is it OK for teens to court (I'm talking older teens (16 or 17 and up)??

 

Liz in NC

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Liz, please notice I said BY 30 or so. I know many people that court DO start courting as older teens and are married by 19 or 21. I don't think courting usually means considerably later. In fact, I've seen evidence that suggests it actually encourages earlier marriages.

 

But *I* would like people to wait at least til 20 if not closer to 24 or so. It is definitely discussed that way in our home. And our religion does encourage people be "past the bloom of youth," spiritually mature, able to fulfill the duties of the title of wife/husband, understanding that sometimes children happen earlier than you plan, etc. I don't know, worldwide, how many do wait til later (after 25?) but in our local congregation, most young 20's are waiting.

 

ETA: my own children are not allowed to court/date as minors for sure (this is a non-issue as my children just aren't interested yet though my son can see being interested one day where my daughter has no intention on dating, marrying, etc). And I can't control their choices as young adults other than to set broad guidelines (people who practice immoral behavior choose not to live under our roof, for example).

Edited by 2J5M9K
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It seems to me that discovering whether you can be best friends FIRST is what courtship is really about. Yes, whether you want to spend the rest of your life with them comes into play but friendship should come first. In my opinion, dating is more casual than courtship and can be more hurtful. If you are going into a courtship, both are agreeing to test the waters for marriage. You are seeking friendship before a "chaperoned-date" actually occurs. I think the "hurt" factor is much less in a courtship also. I have had friends that have done this and it made me wish I had. My dh and I dated for 4 years but still didn't have the "friendship" going into marriage that my friends had who were courted before marriage.

 

My ds is wanting to court when it is time (he is only 12, almost 13). He has seen friends from church succeed and he also LOVES to watch the Duggars and thinks Josh is COOL. Alright by me!!!!!

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Here are some other threads you might want to read through; this has been discussed before.

 

Courtship?

 

Question for those with courtship experience

 

I need opinions on courting

 

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here's what I wrote previously on this topic:

 

I chose a courtship type lifestyle for myself. It was more about the attitude of my heart than a list of rules. It was simply me walking out my beliefs.

 

I didn't do a Bible study on it, or read a book, or even get counseled to do things this way. Those things are great, and I like that they are helping people to look at dating from another perspective, but I just didn't have any of that. Courtship is certainly not a tennet of my denomination.

 

My reasoning seemed straightforward enough to me. I believed God created me. I believed God knew the beginning from the end. I believed God wanted me to ask Him about anything and everything I wanted to do with my life. I believed He had a plan for my life. I believed His choices for my life would always be better than mine. Where He led, I would follow.

 

Therefore, God already knew who I was supposed to marry. He knew, and I was confident He would let me know when I had met that someone. I didn't have to worry about somehow missing them, so long as I stayed close to the Lord. I didn't have to worry about shopping around. It was about simply trusting the Lord.

 

Also, I believed sex was a beautiful thing intended exclusively for marriage. I believed that many things other than intercourse itself qualify as fornication. I believed you shouldn't be trying to turn someone on - or get turned on by them - unless their name is on your marriage certificate.

 

Therefore I certainly wasn't going to put myself in situations where physical contact would go too far. Along those same lines, I thought it would be disrespectful for me to get deeply emotionally involved with someone I didn't think the Lord was leading me to marry. He would be married to someone else one day. I didn't feel it was right to get romantically entangled with someone else's husband.

 

I believed marriage was an honorable institution, worthy of respect. I believed God loved marriage and that He placed the desire for lifelong intimacy with another person in almost all of us.

 

Therefore I was confident that God wanted me to get married. (If He didn't I was confident He would take the overwhelming desire away.) If He did, then He would make it happen in His good time.

 

Furthermore, I believed marriage was a weighty decision with life-long implications for myself, my family, and my community.

 

Therefore I was not going to marry someone my parents did not approve of. I was going to listen to the multitude of godly counselors I had in my life with regard to any man I was interested in.

 

This also meant, for me, that my job up until I was lead to the person I should marry was to grow and mature. I didn't put my life on hold while I ran around looking, hoping, longing, and waiting for my future husband to be revealed to me. I continued to live life, to grow in the Word, to put aside more of the old man.

 

All these decisions of mine add up to what courtship often looks like. I didn't have specific rules about not going out alone with a man, but I can see why others do. There were no specific injunctions against kissing or hand-holding, but I can see why some choose these. I had my own "rules" that were borne out of my knowledge of my weaknesses.

 

And I'm so glad I did things the way I did. I will certainly encourage my children to do the same.

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It all sounds charming and as a parent, I'm starting to imagine the benefits of an arranged marriage. Surely I can choose better than they can. ;)

 

But speaking personally, I'm glad I got the chance to date a lot, without supervision, to have girlfriends, kiss girls, and the like. It was through the course of dating that I began to clarify what I was and wasn't looking for in a spouse, so that when I met Melinda, I knew right away that she was the one for me.

 

In fact, I stopped by my parents house on the exact day that I met her and said to my mother, "I met the girl I'm going to marry today." That stopped my mom in her tracks, I'll tell you. :001_smile:

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Last time I will write on this topic - I promise!

 

 

I do remember reading P and P by Elizabeth Elliot - and then having my daughters read it. I have gifted young women with copies of it, and I cringed when one of them commented, 'You don't really think anyone does this stuff today, do you? People will think I'm crazy.'

Two things I remember distinctly from her book...the phrase: 'Don't marry a girl unless you want to kiss her, and don't kiss her unless you want to marry her.' AND, a poem by Christina Rosetti which begins with the line: 'I love, as you would have me, G-d the most. Would lose not Him but you, should one be lost.' The poem continues -- I selected it to read to DH as part of our vows and he selected something equally beautiful to read to me.

Thanks for posting your question -- you've made me remember SO many wonderful things about our courtship -- our 14th wedding anniversary is at the end of this month! :001_smile:

 

And never say "I love you" unless the next sentence is "Will you marry me?"

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CookieMonster :)

 

I did make it seem, esp in my first post, more like "rules." I certainly don't feel that we LIVE that way though. It's much more natural in real life. You wait til you're ready, someone just right comes along or has been there all along (seems like it's the latter quite a bit which is often hilarious), it works out.

 

King, that is sweet about you and your wife :) Thankfully, it definitely can work out when people are a bit more "out there" than I prefer for my kids. And just because someone is to some degree doesn't mean they have to be the way so many people these days are. And though many people disagree, I do believe that doing like the majority of people is dangerous and problematic (and possibly evidenced by the divorce rate).

 

JFE, I would never tell my kids not to hold hands, kiss, hug, etc. My daughter believes those things are better left for after the wedding, and I think young people should be careful, but I think these are personal choices. Like I said, the only FIRM lines I draw are "dating isn't for minors" and "you live by our morals under this roof" (which simply means that we won't tolerate intentional gross sin) Outside of that, they will be adults and will have to make their own choices.

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It all sounds charming and as a parent, I'm starting to imagine the benefits of an arranged marriage. Surely I can choose better than they can. ;)

 

But speaking personally, I'm glad I got the chance to date a lot, without supervision, to have girlfriends, kiss girls, and the like. It was through the course of dating that I began to clarify what I was and wasn't looking for in a spouse, ...

 

:iagree:

 

I made some poor choices and I think lots of those were due to not having a parent at home at all. My mom was a single mom all my life and she worked. While she worked, I made adult decisions at very young ages and many of those were bad ones! I hope to be able to be here for my kids...to lead, guide, and direct them, but I will NOT keep them from dating, kissing, etc. girls when they are old enough to do these things. Until they are 16 or so, I will be there for any time they spend with a girl. However, by age 17 or so, I will not be involved that much. I want them to experience these things at an older, more mature age than I was when I experienced them. For instance, I should have NEVER been parked in a secluded area with an 18 year old boy in his truck when I was 13. This situation will happen OVER MY DEAD BODY to my kids!

 

I am surely not criticizing people who choose courtship (I have a good friend who has chosen this for her dd and her dd is totally on board!) - it is just not the approach I plan to take with my kids.

 

ETA: My older son will be 10 in August and he is starting to express interest in kissing girls. (OMG! NO!) I think 10 is much, much, much too young for this and I have often told him that kissing is reserved for when you meet a girl that you think you could one day marry. Maybe I am a bit different than "just date and have fun"...but I am not all the way in the courtship arena either.

Edited by Tree House Academy
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King, that is sweet about you and your wife :) Thankfully, it definitely can work out when people are a bit more "out there" than I prefer for my kids. And just because someone is to some degree doesn't mean they have to be the way so many people these days are. And though many people disagree, I do believe that doing like the majority of people is dangerous and problematic (and possibly evidenced by the divorce rate).

 

 

I do think that my marriage has succeeded in part because of luck. I married a good person who is very patient with my quirks and weaknesses, and our disagreements have almost always been minor. Being young and in love and wanting to wait until we got married before having sex, we didn't wait long before we tied the knot. It's hard to make wise long-term decisions under those kinds of circumstances.

 

I have other family members who married in a rush without thinking of some of these issues and marriage has been a struggle for them.

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It all sounds charming and as a parent, I'm starting to imagine the benefits of an arranged marriage. Surely I can choose better than they can. ;)

 

 

 

 

:iagree:I'm already trying to figure out how I can arrange my sons' marraiges. ;)

 

Actually, while I was in college I hung out with a girl from a culture that still arranges marriages. My academic advisor was also from the same culture. I had many interesting discussions with them about arranged marriages. My advisor's marriage had been arranged, and she was in a completely happy marriage for over 25 years and going strong. My friend, who was in her early 20's, was very glad that her parents were arranging her marriage. She said it took all the stress and pressure off of her of trying to find a spouse. She said dating sounded so stressful. She didn't want to worry about meeting someone, and trying to find out if he was good for her. She told me she didn't feel qualified to know what to look for in a spouse. She said she had complete confidence and trust in her parents to find her a spouse that would be everything she needed and wanted. She made the comment to me saying that her parents are experienced in marriage, whereas she was inexperienced, so therefore she did not have the judgement her parents had. She said, "My parents want to see me happy. I know they will choose well."

 

I am still so amazed by what I learned from them. Arranged marriages are not always bad as we are led to believe in our culture. Of course, we all know that there are many arranged marriages that ignore the rights of a person....usually the woman/girl. It was just nice to hear the good side of arranged marriages for once.

 

 

As for dating vs courtship. I barely dated DH before we married. We met, and pretty much knew we wanted to get married almost immediately, and we did. We became engaged 5 months after meeting, and married the next month. Everyone thought was were nuts. :lol: We hadn't even met each other's families. In hindsight maybe that was a good thing! :tongue_smilie:

 

We're in our 11th year of marriage, and loving it. :D

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As a teenager I had never heard of courting. I dated. And dated and dated. I would be embarrassed to talk about some of the things I did while dating. :blushing: Now I hear kids at church talk about dating, and I see things the way they treat each other and guess what? I really want my kids to be set apart from that. I want better fro them. I don't want them to break their hand because they punched a wall because the girl that has been toying their emotions broke their heart(again). I don't want them breaking some girl's heart and leading her to believe that she is not pretty enough, or not thin enough or not (whatever you fill in the blank) enough. You can click here to hear Paul Washer talk about the subject much more in depth than I. Scroll down to Dating to click on the right one.

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I like the notion of courting, but will likely allow my kids to date. For all I know ds5 really will marry the little girl next like they have already planned. He is 5 she is 4, they have laready planned out the wedding, how many kids, and he has chosen his career so he "Can take care of L and she can stay home with our kids". Based on all of that added with the fact they are never without an adult, one could say they are already courting lol (For the record both myself and the little girls parents tell them on a daily basis you do not chose your future spouse in preK/K, we also do not allow them to call each other boyfriend/girlfriend like they want to, nor do we allow kissing).

 

My oldest is just turning 11, he is interested in girls but I have told them for years that dating is for when they are ready to start looking for a spouse. SO I will not limit them to courting, but the idea behind it, of waiting until they are mature enough to be looking for a spouse is still there. I went on my first date at age 7, The boy I was with was my "boyfriend" for 2 years. His mom would drop us off at the beach and go sit somewhere else so we could be alone, we used to hide under the kiddie pool and in the chicken coop and kiss. I starting dating boys at school at age 12, like dropped off at the movies, pick you up when it is done type dates. Everyone thought it was so cute, it was so cute alright when I was 16 dating a 20 yr old, or sleeping around from age 16 on etc. :glare:

 

I do not want my kids to make the same mistakes, so I am putting rules on dating BUT I still think that dating has it's place so I will not enforce a courtship only rule.

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It had quotes by professors and some college women (at Bible colleges) who were frustrated/worried about it. Not the group dating part. But that there was such an emphasis on "not showing any interest, unless marriage was a distinct possibility" that it was hard to get to know someone to even know if they were even marriage material.

 

That men who followed courting were doing less of the "do you want to go grab coffee after class?" and that they were worried about more and more leaving college without having met a spouse. And that it is, statistically speaking, MUCH easier to meet someone with comparable ideas while going to school at a Bible college. That, in fact, that is a strong reason that many people pick a Bible college. Because it ups the chance they will find a spouse who has the same religious values while they are going to school.

 

I just thought it was an interesting perspective.

 

ETA: I do agree about the Lord having someone intended for you. But, I also think it's possible to miss or overlook that person for various reasons.

Edited by snickelfritz
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I think the biggest thing to remeber here is that those in courtship are not ever alone. My younger sister lived with us as a teen and we insisted she bring boys into our home to get to know them. I remember her being so frustrated because 1/2 of them wouldn't come. I was,and still am of the firm opinion if a teen age boy/girl doesn't want what he is doing to be observed even casually then he/they up to no good. (we left the room and went about our business) One of our biggest rules was that she couldn't ride alone in a car with a boy...the only time she broke it the boy came on way to strong and she left the car and walked.

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It had quotes by professors and some college women (at Bible colleges) who were frustrated/worried about it. Not the group dating part. But that there was such an emphasis on "not showing any interest, unless marriage was a distinct possibility" that it was hard to get to know someone to even know if they were even marriage material.

 

That men who followed courting were doing less of the "do you want to go grab coffee after class?" and that they were worried about more and more leaving college without having met a spouse. And that it is, statistically speaking, MUCH easier to meet someone with comparable ideas while going to school at a Bible college. That, in fact, that is a strong reason that many people pick a Bible college. Because it ups the chance they will find a spouse who has the same religious values while they are going to school.

 

I just thought it was an interesting perspective.

 

ETA: I do agree about the Lord having someone intended for you. But, I also think it's possible to miss or overlook that person for various reasons.

 

I knew boys like this at the religious university I attended. They pretty much wanted an angel to appear and tell them someone was the wife for them before they would even ask a girl out.

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  • 2 months later...
I knew boys like this at the religious university I attended. They pretty much wanted an angel to appear and tell them someone was the wife for them before they would even ask a girl out.

 

Oh dear... this reminds me of the private Christian college I went to. The little joke was that most of the incoming freshman gals would never finish their degree... but instead get an "M-R-S. degree". That really made me mad. LOL I did marry at the age of 20, but finished my degree, thank you velly much! ;)

 

P.S. For the record, I dated and dated. Had a great time! Loved to meet different people and decide if they were the one. Finally met hubby on a blind date via friends and on the second date... I knew he was the one! Go figure. LOL

Edited by tex-mex
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Since we are active duty military, we didn't set rules for courting with our children. Kind of hard to require us to supervise anything when we are a continent away. That said, my oldest went out to meals a few times with a few girls, and then he had a girlfriend he was serious about. We didn't think it was a good match for him although we had no problems with her morals, her religion, etc. It was just that we thought it wasn't a good match personality wise and intellectually. He was younger than her. They dated for a year or so and then ds broke it off. Too much drama for him. He hasn't dated anyone in almost a year and a half.

 

Next up is dd16. She is not yet interested in any boys except as an eventual thing maybe in college. We have no need for any rules right now since she has no interest.

 

DD12 is also not interested and has been told that no form of dating is allowed before 16. She may turn out an earlier bloomer than her siblings because she is an extrovert. Then again, she isn't interested yet in boys at almost 13.

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We're in this process right now. Ours is a sad tale. My oldest courted--she waited; they'd known each other for 5 years. She stayed with his family many times. He lived with us last summer and part of this summer. They both waited to give their hearts to each other. He waited to give her the ring until dh had given him permission. They were waiting for marriage until she'd finished the Master's and he had a good start on medical school. It truly was ordained of God. And then, on her birthday, he was killed a month ago. What the future holds for her, I do not know.

 

My next just started deepening a relationship with a friend that she's known 3 years. Their road is going to look very different than her sister's because they are both at the Naval Academy. Their plans will involve time with our families, but it's not possible to have him for the length of time that her sister's fiance was. But, they are taking it slowly and we are praying.

 

 

Oh Margaret!! That is so sad. I'm so sorry that this happened to the young man and to your poor dd. My heart just broke reading those words. :crying: :( :grouphug:

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when people are attempting to bring import their native cultural practices into the USA (or any other culture) and practice them on their American-raised children, it may not always work. I have two close friends, first generation Americans, who agreed to arranged marriages, one with disastrous results, the other, with a loveless, but tolerable marriage. It is NOT a recipe for bliss in every case. I learned from my friends, though, that people who grow up in cultures where arranged marriages are the norm have different expectations of marriage; they don't expect love, though it often happens, they expect more of a working relationship.

 

That said, I truly understand where the appeal of arranged marriages comes from and in fact agree with the idea in principle. So much depends on the parents. I know my dh and I would never have found each other, or recognized the value in each other, had we not "kissed some frogs". Like KingM, we both knew immediately we had found "the one".

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This is a great thread. It gives a lot to think about. I'm encouraging my dc towards this path. My thoughts also have been that my dc can trust the God who made them to help them in finding the right person.

 

I don't really see courting as an "arranged marriage". I'm seeing that referred to here. Why the comparison? I would think an arranged marriage would be one where dh and I knew some parents with a child we wanted one of our dc to marry and we set that up with that family. That isn't what courting is at all. What am I missing?

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With our dc, we've always encouraged not dating until you're ready to marry. That is the purpose, not just a free (or expensive) meal. I blush to remember my dating history & wouldn't want that baggage for my dc. Once they've left the house, either for college, work or service we obviously don't have the physical presence that we have while they're here, but we hope that we've instilled the values that will keep them on the right path.

 

Yes, one of the reasons dd#1 is at a Christian college is the possibility of meeting a nice, Christian man. She's not actively looking, but it's just puts the odds in your favor. My cousin had a friend that wanted to marry a doctor, so she hung out in the Med. Library. Yep, she married a dr. :D

 

We Americans seem to be much more cavalier regarding finding a spouse than choosing a college, buying a house or business. We'll do all sorts of research, knowing exactly what we're looking for on the latter, but rely on our fickle emotions for the former. :glare:

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