We don't vaccinate and I don't know what to expect regarding summer camp?

[yarrow]

I'm signing my 14 yos up for a camp this summer but we stopped vaxing when he was 5. He got most of them but he's not up-to-date. I'm a little worried that his application will be rejected and he won't be able to attend.

 

Anyone have any experience with this?

 

Thanks!

[Samiam]

I have never had a summer camp ask for vaccinations records, even the week long over-night camp son has went to twice.

 

As far as that goes though, I would just give the non-vacc exempt form that we have on file just in case we are ever asked about vac's. The one we would show the school if we ever went there.

 

Do you have that option where you live? Here in FL, we can fill out a form at our county health that says we choose to be exempt from vac's. It supposed to be for "religious reasons", but since they can not ask ANY questions about those religious reasons, anyone can use the form even if their non-vac choice is not because of religious reasons..

[Pam Wilhelm]

We are Christian Scientists and don't vaccinate our kids........ when the girls wanted to stay at girl scout camp I called the person running the camp and she had me fill out a form and send it in with the paperwork.

 

Perhaps you could call the camp and find out........

[Paz]

My ds had to fill out a physical form to work at a summer camp last year. They didn't require many vaccines. Even with his college immunization form there are a few that he could opt out of and just a few that he was required to have, a few recommended. I would think there is a form you could fill out for religious or some other type of exemption.

[HeatherLynn]

When all else fails, don't ask, don't tell. Call and act like someone other than yourself to get info, just to make sure you won't be against something big.

 

I have been known to fudge. It is none of their business as far as I am concerned. I am not interested in lectures from those who do not share my views on vaccinations.

[HiddenJewel]

A tetanus shot date is the only thing I have ever been asked for, which makes sense.

[Ria]

When all else fails, don't ask, don't tell. Call and act like someone other than yourself to get info, just to make sure you won't be against something big.

 

I have been known to fudge. It is none of their business as far as I am concerned. I am not interested in lectures from those who do not share my views on vaccinations.

 

NOt a lecture at all, but a warning. If you knowingly withheld or outright lied about vaccinations for a camp, and if your child got sick, and if another child contracted that illness and got sick and died, you would be prosecuted.

 

It really IS their business, whether you like it or not. It's not unheard of for a child to catch something for which they've been vaccinated. If I had an immuno-compromised child who had been vaxed, sent him to a camp, your kid was there and came down with measles and my kid caught it and died, and if I found out you'd lied or "fudged," I'd sue you for every single cent you were worth, and I'd hope for prison for you. There is simply NO excuse to endanger other children, no matter what your personal views. If a camp requires something and you lie, you are breaking the law.

 

If the same scenerio happened and the camp allowed unvaxed kids to go, that would be my risk. But if they require it and you don't comply....well....

 

Ria (BTW, my kids spend their summers wilderness canoe camping in Canada. Vaccinations are required and asked for each and every year. Emergency evacuations in the wilderness are done by float plane, cost thousands, and are not something anyone wants for their children; thus, we take those medical records very seriously.)

Edited May 19, 2009 by Ria

[KidsHappen]

My kids went to summer camp that was owned by a homeschool family (several generations) and they accepted our exemption forms no problem. I think most camps will.

[yarrow]

for Civil Air Patrol and it does specifically ask for vaccinations.

 

Our doctor's office has never asked us to fill out an exemption form. They were part of the discussion when we decided to discontinue so they know our reasons. Would I get an exemption form from them or online?

 

I asked by email today and was told that they would have to "look into it". Now I'm really stressed. If he can't go to encampment, he can't be promoted any further!

[HeatherLynn]

NOt a lecture at all, but a warning. If you knowingly withheld or outright lied about vaccinations for a camp, and if your child got sick, and if another child contracted that illness and got sick and died, you would be prosecuted.

 

It really IS their business, whether you like it or not. It's not unheard of for a child to catch something for which they've been vaccinated. If I had an immuno-compromised child who had been vaxed, sent him to a camp, your kid was there and came down with measles and my kid caught it and died, and if I found out you'd lied or "fudged," I'd sue you for every single cent you were worth, and I'd hope for prison for you. There is simply NO excuse to endanger other children, no matter what your personal views. If a camp requires something and you lie, you are breaking the law.

 

If the same scenerio happened and the camp allowed unvaxed kids to go, that would be my risk. But if they require it and you don't comply....well....

 

Ria (BTW, my kids spend their summers wilderness canoe camping in Canada. Vaccinations are required and asked for each and every year. Emergency evacuations in the wilderness are done by float plane, cost thousands, and are not something anyone wants for their children; thus, we take those medical records very seriously.)

 

By "fudging" I meant just not telling the whole story. If someone asks if my kids are current on vaxing I say "we are behind but working on it". In addition, it is legal in the US NOT to vax your child. You are exposed to unvaxed children EVERYWHERE you go, you just don't know it. For your information, I almost lost a child due to a vaccination so that is where my concern lies. My friend DID lose her child after vaccinations. So, by what your saying is I should expose my children to those dangers just because someone says I should? We do give some shots, on a VERY delayed schedule when their immune system is strong enough to handle it. So, I may fudge and not tell that we are 4 years delayed, but I will not say the kids have all their shots.

 

I had a long reply typed after this and decided to not post it. It is not fair to the OP.

[Samiam]

That's laughable, at best.

If you want to sue someone, sue the drug company who promised you that you were doing something to ensure your child did not get the disease. Apparently their promise was lie.

Sue the government who pushed that propoganda on you in the first place, making you think that by vaccination your child, you were safe.

 

Please, more than likely, if you participate in ANY Homeschooling activities, a good many of those children are not vaccinated...plus countless others you encounter in life.

 

Prosecution....laughable.

 

NOt a lecture at all, but a warning. If you knowingly withheld or outright lied about vaccinations for a camp, and if your child got sick, and if another child contracted that illness and got sick and died, you would be prosecuted.

[Ria]

So, by what your saying is I should expose my children to those dangers just because someone says I should? We do give some shots, on a VERY delayed schedule when their immune system is strong enough to handle it. So, I may fudge and not tell that we are 4 years delayed, but I will not say the kids have all their shots.

 

I had a long reply typed after this and decided to not post it. It is not fair to the OP.

 

No, you are misinterpreting what I wrote. What I am saying is that IF a camp *requires* that campers be vaccinated, and you do not disclose that your children are not fully vaccinated, or lie by omission about what shots they have had, you are lying (and, as such, could be held accountable). I rather doubt this would happen, though; the camps that want kids to be vaccinated will ask for a copy of the shot record from the doctor (ask me how I know, lol).

 

Please understand that by no means am I suggesting that you expose your children to what you feel is dangerous. As I said before, that is your choice, and one that you, as the parent, have the right to make for your children. As far as camp selection goes, however, the obvious choice for you in such a situation would be to find another camp - a camp that has rules with which you can truthfully comply.

 

Ria

Edited May 20, 2009 by Ria

[Ria]

That's laughable, at best.

If you want to sue someone, sue the drug company who promised you that you were doing something to ensure your child did not get the disease. Apparently their promise was lie.

Sue the government who pushed that propoganda on you in the first place, making you think that by vaccination your child, you were safe.

 

 

To my knowledge, none of the makers of vaccines guarantee 100% immunization. However, a parent who deliberately lies about a health record can be held accountable. Big difference.

 

Ria

[SilverMoon]

.

Edited September 8, 2023 by SilverMoon

[Stacy in NJ]

Every summer activity/camp my dss have participated in have requested (and received) doctor signed vaccination records.

 

I'd probably feel uncomfortable with a camp that didn't require the records. I'd wonder what else they were being sloppy with.

[HeatherLynn]

Girl Scouts once had a box to tick if dd was current. I ticked it, she's as current as she's ever going to get.

 

 

Never thought about it that way! I guess I can use that one now! "Yes, we are current"...LOL

[HeatherLynn]

Every summer activity/camp my dss have participated in have requested (and received) doctor signed vaccination records.

 

I'd probably feel uncomfortable with a camp that didn't require the records. I'd wonder what else they were being sloppy with.

 

The camp our children go to does not require vaccinations. They are the most organized and best run camp that we have had experience dealing with. (Including the girl scout camps DD went to last year). The lack of a vaccination requirement in no way implicates sloppiness.

[Stacy in NJ]

The camp our children go to does not require vaccinations. They are the most organized and best run camp that we have had experience dealing with. (Including the girl scout camps DD went to last year). The lack of a vaccination requirement in no way implicates sloppiness.

 

Well, it may relate to state law, but in NJ records, whether vaccinated or not, are required for insurance and liability purposes.

 

If some type of epidemic were to break out having reliable records for the CDC would be pretty handy. I've read recently about several measles outbreaks where the vaccination records helped local heath authorities track the illness.

[elizabeth]

 

http://www.michiganlawreview.org/firstimpressions/vol107/diekema.htm A cogent discussion ,articles in law review both pro and con liability of parents who do not vaccinate . A law review is not a statement on the law in any particular case but rather a descriptive method of contemplating on what the law ought to be/might be given certain facts. Ria is absolutely correct in saying there have been cases where parents were held accountable for harm to others vis a vis contact with an ill unvaccinated child. As a lawyer I often tell clients that" your rights end where anothers begin." I cannot imagine withholding information that could have life threatening consequences for another person. Furthermore, to not have tetanus/DPT at minimum before going to camp seems hazardous. It seems you want to have your cake and eat it too . It is your business whether and when to vaccinate but you have no right to expose others to disease particularly without their knowledge of unvaccinated status. I think it is perfectly fine to do as you wish with your own children but you are making choices for other people and their children without their knowledge or consent when you put many people together in a small group where sharing glasses , silverware etc is likely to happen . That coupled with close sleeping quarters makes illness likely to spread .

[HiddenJewel]

I'll preface my post by saying I am not anti-vaccine even though I have concerns. I also do not agree with intimating a child is fully vaccinated when he/she is not.

 

The statement that non-vaccinated children put vaccinated children at risk does not make sense. If vaccines work as well as they are supposed to, there should be no concern.

 

As far as the position of the OP, I would be up front with the camp and if he can't go, he can't go. I would think that disclosure would be the main issue here.

[MommyJo]

I do vaccinate my children. Do I think individuals who do not vaccinate...surely NOT! We just recently began homeschooling and honestly we are looking into stopping vaccinations which is why I chose to look this post over.

First things first, to sue for all the persons money because your child passed is saying that your child's life has a price that someone can pay to "replace" him/her. I always said that if my child was hit by a drunken driver I would not take any money...my child's life is worth more than $2 mil. Would I want them to rot in prison? Heck no, that's all my tax dollars so they get a free ride and don't have to pay for meals or board.

Secondly, everything that was said in that post was just wrong. It was rude and wow! I have seen a lot of posters here lately get too carried away by their opinions and that seemed to be one of the cases. It would have been nice if instead of saying it directly to the poster such as "I would sue you for every penny and hope you went to jail", if you learned to talk in generalizations.

To the one who had the *fudging post*. I think all mothers have stretched the truth to get out of repremanding situations. As long as it's the truth in the end, everyone else can get over it. So you say, their behind...it's the truth and then they know.

Lastly, ria you say that if your child caught something and died. Did you know that NO parent is required by law to report if their child has HIV, AIDS, and the like? These are fully transmittable diseases and if by chance your child caught them, you would never have anyone to point a finger at as it's based in the privacy laws. Parents are not even required to tell their doctors, schools, etc. (although most doctors do know) and it's not illegal. That's why they tell teachers (I know this because I went to college for special education and have worked in schools) to treat every little vomit mess, cut & scrape, and blood spill with universal precautions.

[phathui5]

I've read recently about several measles outbreaks where the vaccination records helped local heath authorities track the illness.

 

That seems odd, since most of the people who catch it are vaccinated.

[Cindyg]

I'm in the exact same situation as the OP: My son was fully vaccinated to age 5 and none after that. Our summer camp (and our enrichment program) does ask for vaccination records, and I send the one I have -- showing all the shots to age 5.

 

So far (age 11), I've had no one comment on that or say it wasn't enough.

 

My guess is that they file it away without reading it. ??

 

Personally, I would not fudge on this. If a camp or a school says we have to have xxx more shots before proceeding, I'll deal with that when it comes up. (By deal with it, I mean I'll discuss the specific shot needed with our doctor. If I have to choose between the camp and the shot, I'll make an informed decision on a case-by-case basis.)

[dtb1999]

That's laughable, at best.

If you want to sue someone, sue the drug company who promised you that you were doing something to ensure your child did not get the disease. Apparently their promise was lie.

Sue the government who pushed that propoganda on you in the first place, making you think that by vaccination your child, you were safe.

 

Please, more than likely, if you participate in ANY Homeschooling activities, a good many of those children are not vaccinated...plus countless others you encounter in life.

 

 

:iagree:

[dtb1999]

The camp our children go to does not require vaccinations. They are the most organized and best run camp that we have had experience dealing with. (Including the girl scout camps DD went to last year). The lack of a vaccination requirement in no way implicates sloppiness.

 

And legally, even if there were a requirement, there are always exemptions.

[kalanamak]

In addition, it is legal in the US NOT to vax your child.

 

The crux is: does a private camp have the legal right to require, or even just ask? If they do, it does not matter at all if it is legal in the US to not vax.

 

Does their insurance company have the right to cover them only for vaxed kids?

 

I would suspect that many who are pleased it is legal to not vax in the US are also fans of the right of private businesses to run their own shows. But this is only a guess.

 

Even if they don't require, it would sensible to "know" in case of exposure, or a deep wound, etc.

[dtb1999]

That seems odd, since most of the people who catch it are vaccinated.

 

...And catch it from the vaccine itself quite often.

[SonshineLearner]

I always thought that some of the reason you're asked if your children are vaccinated, was so that they can contact you if there's a measles outbreak...or whatever else. I've always been asked if my children are or not...and then answered. Of course, I'm more worried about my child who's allergic to peanuts and such.... About Tetanus, I've always figured that between my child's ability and the nurses, that any sores will be cleaned out well.

Carrie:-)

[Vida Winter]

To my knowledge, none of the makers of vaccines guarantee 100% immunization. However, a parent who deliberately lies about a health record can be held accountable. Big difference.

 

Ria

 

I agree. If you are wobbly on this, please do not send this child to camp. Other parents do not want this child at camp.

[swimmermom3]

Karen in NH,

 

If I have this right, your son is going to Civil Air Encampment this summer? Civil Air Patrol is a volunteer organization but attached to the Air Force? Does the encampment take place on a military base? Just curious because that may make the difference in what's required.

[Samiam]

Originally Posted by Ria

To my knowledge, none of the makers of vaccines guarantee 100% immunization. However, a parent who deliberately lies about a health record can be held accountable. Big difference.

 

Ria

 

 

Oh, really?? Is there a specific case or law that you are referring to in which a parent who falsified a vaccination record was sued because another child came down with a disease, ie measles or something similiar, and lost the case? Just wondering, cuz I was thinking how odd it would have been that this happened, what did the authorities do? Go through all of the records to determine which was was falsified and then press charges against that parent? How did they know which parent to confront? You seem so knowledgeable in your statement as if you are fully aware of this being the truth, not a scare tactic, so I was just wondering if you would share your info so those of us who are not as informed can become so.

thanks

K:bigear:

Edited May 20, 2009 by Samiam
spelling

[Mommyof4ks]

NOt a lecture at all, but a warning. If you knowingly withheld or outright lied about vaccinations for a camp, and if your child got sick, and if another child contracted that illness and got sick and died, you would be prosecuted.

 

It really IS their business, whether you like it or not. It's not unheard of for a child to catch something for which they've been vaccinated. If I had an immuno-compromised child who had been vaxed, sent him to a camp, your kid was there and came down with measles and my kid caught it and died, and if I found out you'd lied or "fudged," I'd sue you for every single cent you were worth, and I'd hope for prison for you. There is simply NO excuse to endanger other children, no matter what your personal views. If a camp requires something and you lie, you are breaking the law.

 

If the same scenerio happened and the camp allowed unvaxed kids to go, that would be my risk. But if they require it and you don't comply....well....

 

Ria (BTW, my kids spend their summers wilderness canoe camping in Canada. Vaccinations are required and asked for each and every year. Emergency evacuations in the wilderness are done by float plane, cost thousands, and are not something anyone wants for their children; thus, we take those medical records very seriously.)

 

Yes, please don't fudge! As the mother of an immune compromised child I rely on the camps and activities that require vax of all kids to help my son stay safe. Measles are an itchy rash for most kids, but kids like mine end up in the PICU on ventilators.

 

If the camp requires it and you don't want to vax that is fine that is certainly your choice and your right, there are many other camps. This issue is no different than others that come up with camps. We send the kids to camps that we feel promote our faith or skills that our child needs, and we would not send them to camps that went against our beliefs KWIM?.

 

If the camp requires vax records they will ask in the information packet that you send a copy of the vax record.

[HeatherLynn]

Originally Posted by Ria

To my knowledge, none of the makers of vaccines guarantee 100% immunization. However, a parent who deliberately lies about a health record can be held accountable. Big difference.

 

Ria

 

 

Oh, really?? Is there a specific case or law that you are referring to in which a parent who falsified a vaccination record was sued because another child came down with a disease, ie measles or something similiar, and lost the case? Just wondering, cuz I was thinking how odd it would have been that this happened, what did the authorities do? Go through all of the records to determine which was was falsified and then press charges against that parent? How did they know which parent to confront? You seem so knowledgeable in your statement as if you are fully aware of this being the truth, not a scare tactic, so I was just wondering if you would share your info so those of us who are not as informed can become so.

thanks

K:bigear:

:lurk5:

 

Also, if this was the case, what about the person who the first child got the disease from? Wouldn't they also be liable? And the person before them, and before them? It seems to me there would be more recourse against the pharmaceutical company when their immunization failed.

 

I saw a Law and Order SVU that showcased a mother being tried for not vaccinating because her son got the measles and then a little girl at the playground got them and died. Even on the TV show, the charges didn't stick. A person would have heck proving that the child got the disease from one specific child unless that was the ONLY interaction they had with another human outside of their home.

[KJB]

:lurk5:

 

Also, if this was the case, what about the person who the first child got the disease from? Wouldn't they also be liable? And the person before them, and before them? It seems to me there would be more recourse against the pharmaceutical company when their immunization failed.

 

I saw a Law and Order SVU that showcased a mother being tried for not vaccinating because her son got the measles and then a little girl at the playground got them and died. Even on the TV show, the charges didn't stick. A person would have heck proving that the child got the disease from one specific child unless that was the ONLY interaction they had with another human outside of their home.

 

An outbreak at a camp would be different than picking something up at a playground. Camps are small numbers of kids in confined, often shared, quarters. Like cruise ships, disease at a camp could spread quickly. It wouldn't take rocket science to comb the vaccination records for clues about the origin of the disease. A timeline for incubation could be established. Possibly unlikely but not unthinkable....

 

Also, vaccinations don't guarantee that an individual won't contract the disease. They work because large numbers of people will become immune not because an individual is definitely protected. There are no guarantees when you get vaccinated. No one (pharm companies, doctors, "the government", etc.) suggests otherwise.

 

The key issue here is the *LIE* or "fudge" in order to gain admission. Someone misrepresenting their child's health records ought to be held accountable, regardless of how you feel about vaccination.

[Frankie]

It's called perjury. Perjury can land you in jail and have civil implications.

 

I do not know case law, as I am not a lawyer and I no longer have access to the books.

 

You can bet your bottom dollar that if a child died in an instance Ria has mentioned, there most certainly *would* be a thorough investigation.

 

Face it, you're either honest or you're not. How selfish to not be honest. It's one thing to stand on your principles...for that, I completely agree. I understand why people don't vaccinate or delay it. It's another thing to outright lie about it. And if you fudge, it's a lie.

 

If you're strong enough to choose the uncommon path, be strong enough to be forthright and honest about it.

 

Originally Posted by Ria

To my knowledge, none of the makers of vaccines guarantee 100% immunization. However, a parent who deliberately lies about a health record can be held accountable. Big difference.

 

Ria

 

 

Oh, really?? Is there a specific case or law that you are referring to in which a parent who falsified a vaccination record was sued because another child came down with a disease, ie measles or something similiar, and lost the case? Just wondering, cuz I was thinking how odd it would have been that this happened, what did the authorities do? Go through all of the records to determine which was was falsified and then press charges against that parent? How did they know which parent to confront? You seem so knowledgeable in your statement as if you are fully aware of this being the truth, not a scare tactic, so I was just wondering if you would share your info so those of us who are not as informed can become so.

thanks

K:bigear:

[Stacy in NJ]

And legally, even if there were a requirement, there are always exemptions.

 

And the proper paper work for the exemption would be on file with the camp, so if a serious illness, like measles or menengitis, were to break out, they'd have information about who was the likely carrier.

[Frankie]

There's one difference here. Charges may not stick because there may not be proof of how the child that died contracted the disease, but in the investigation if they find a form that a parent signed stating that the child was up to date on vaccinations and they weren't, that parent WOULD be held accountable for lying. That's the difference.

 

My whole point is why lie? Why fudge? Be honest, tell the truth. If you don't vaccinate, state it. It's the right thing to do.

 

I completely understand why people don't vaccinate or delay it. I just don't understand their need to lie about it.

 

And for what it's worth, I wouldn't use a television program like Law and Order to teach me about the law. I sat in a courtroom for 11 years, and while the shows may be close, they're still TV shows and not always accurate.

 

 

 

:lurk5:

 

Also, if this was the case, what about the person who the first child got the disease from? Wouldn't they also be liable? And the person before them, and before them? It seems to me there would be more recourse against the pharmaceutical company when their immunization failed.

 

I saw a Law and Order SVU that showcased a mother being tried for not vaccinating because her son got the measles and then a little girl at the playground got them and died. Even on the TV show, the charges didn't stick. A person would have heck proving that the child got the disease from one specific child unless that was the ONLY interaction they had with another human outside of their home.

[mommyrooch]

It really IS their business, whether you like it or not. It's not unheard of for a child to catch something for which they've been vaccinated. If I had an immuno-compromised child who had been vaxed, sent him to a camp, your kid was there and came down with measles and my kid caught it and died, and if I found out you'd lied or "fudged," I'd sue you for every single cent you were worth, and I'd hope for prison for you. There is simply NO excuse to endanger other children, no matter what your personal views. If a camp requires something and you lie, you are breaking the law.

 

:iagree:It is COMPLETELY their business.

 

My son is a Leukemia survivor. He was on chemotherapy for three years and lived with a severly compromised immune system during that time as a result of the chemo. He wasn't allowed to have much of a life for 3 years. I had to keep him in a bubble because I knew there were parents out there like HeatherLynn that either didn't understand the possible ramifications their choices on vaccinations could have on kids like my son or they simply didn't care. Not exactly fair to my son.

 

Where something like chicken pox might be a mild irratant to many parents it was literally life or death for my son. He lost two of his very good friends (also cancer patients) during that time. They died from secondary infections. Not from the cancer.

 

Statistically, more cancer patients die from secondary infections because of lowered immune systems than they do from the cancers. Isn't it a shame that these kids and others like them should have to worry about losing their lives as a result of trying to save them. Forgive me if I get pretty upset when parents make careless decisions that could and often do have such devastating effects on others.

 

This is why I also believe that camps and organizations like this have EVERY right to require vaccinations. I would also sue someone for every penny they had if they knowingly put my child at risk by sending their kid to a camp without vaccinations and my kid caught something from their kid and died.

 

I can't tell you to get vaccinations. That's your choice but I can (and do) support organizations that don't allow your kid to participate as a result of that choice. You don't know who else might want to attend but can't because of your choices. You had the choice to not vaccinate so it should be you that should have to bend as a result. My son didn't have a choice about his immune system being destroyed as a result of trying to save his life so why should he be the one to suffer for your choices.

 

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you just might not have thought about the possible risk to other kids your ommiting vaccination information might have but next time you think about sending your kids to a socialized event, remember the kids like my son and his two friends that died and ask yourself if that's really an ethical decision to make.

[msjones]

Never thought about it that way! I guess I can use that one now! "Yes, we are current"...LOL

 

I haven't read the whole thread yet, but am stunned that you would do this. I'm sure you understand the true meaning of "current" on these forms.

[Karen sn]

Here in FL, we can fill out a form at our county health that says we choose to be exempt from vac's. It supposed to be for "religious reasons", but since they can not ask ANY questions about those religious reasons, anyone can use the form even if their non-vac choice is not because of religious reasons..

 

Before we left Florida I got my son's exemption.

Literally took 5 minutes.

OP should get one for all her kids.

[Karen sn]

By "fudging" I meant just not telling the whole story. If someone asks if my kids are current on vaxing I say "we are behind but working on it". In addition, it is legal in the US NOT to vax your child. You are exposed to unvaxed children EVERYWHERE you go, you just don't know it. For your information, I almost lost a child due to a vaccination so that is where my concern lies. My friend DID lose her child after vaccinations. So, by what your saying is I should expose my children to those dangers just because someone says I should? We do give some shots, on a VERY delayed schedule when their immune system is strong enough to handle it. So, I may fudge and not tell that we are 4 years delayed, but I will not say the kids have all their shots.

 

I had a long reply typed after this and decided to not post it. It is not fair to the OP.

 

Heather - go get a religious exemption.

Then you are legal.

Very easy to get in most states.

Research yours and get them.

(In FL it's EASY).

 

THAT WAY your kids NEVER have to deal with the issue...think college and beyond.

Get them while you can.

Cover your butt and their's.

[Osmosis Mom]

We've been through this a number of times. The first camp was for Boy Scout camp. Couldn't get any help but finally found someone on a hs list that pointed us towards an exemption form that BS would accept. It's common enough now that the BS have the exemption right on the form! We also went through this with dd#1 and college--we were contacted asking why we hadn't sent in her dorm request???? I explained that we were waiting for her vax exemption form. The fellow exclaimed, "Oh, just send in the dorm papers. 40% of our students aren't vaxed!" In both MI and CO, we can claim a personal exemption. While I feel for those that are concerned about being exposed to my unvaxed kids, I also feel concern for forcing us to vax--as that is life-threatening for 4 out of my 5 kids. My children didn't have the choice to be allergic to the vax.

 

Do they have egg-allergies?

 

Ds had potentially fatal egg-allergies and still received all his shots. I found out about teh egg-component when he was perhaps 8 years old. He had gone into anaphylaxic shock when he was 9 months old due to egg.....On the other hand then he almost died at 5 weeks of age from pertussis. An ill child had infected him when I took him to the playground at age 2 weeks. Thus, it never occurred to me not to vaccinate him.

[Samiam]

It's called perjury. Perjury can land you in jail and have civil implications.

 

I do not know case law, as I am not a lawyer and I no longer have access to the books.

 

You can bet your bottom dollar that if a child died in an instance Ria has mentioned, there most certainly *would* be a thorough investigation.

 

 

 

Actually, it's NOT called Perjury. This is Pejury: The deliberate, willful giving of false, misleading, or incomplete testimony under oath.

 

 

Also, it would seem to me for those who said that they personally or know of families, whose children already have comprised immune systems (of which I do have empathy for that situation), the best thing to do is keep that child with the comprised system out of environments like summer camps anyway. Most facilities, ie camps, schools, daycares, DO have to take a non-vacc child, as long as a exemption form or otherwise legal form,is offered by the family, OR the facilities runs the risk of being sued for discrimination. You, as a parent, do NOT have the right to look at the rest of the children's records to see who and how many, are in fact vaccinated or not, so you will never, ever know that what type of situation you are putting your child into, as far as health/germs/vaccinations risks.

 

I am willing to bet that anyone who posts here that is saying that their child went to a camp that HAD TO, NO DOUBT ABOUT IT, REQUIRED vaccinations and the form to prove them, just did not care/know to ask about exemptions for that rule. Of course, the camp/facility rarely is going to post the fact that they accept the exemptions, but since a exemption form is just as "legal" as the vaccination record, in the aspect that is required for public schools and similiar facilities. Since many families do in fact choose to non-vac for religious specific reasons, turning a child away for non-vac can very well be turned into a discrimination case....how's that for "sueing".

K

[mommyrooch]

Also, it would seem to me for those who said that they personally or know of families, whose children already have comprised immune systems (of which I do have empathy for that situation), the best thing to do is keep that child with the comprised system out of environments like summer camps anyway. Most facilities, ie camps, schools, daycares, DO have to take a non-vacc child, as long as a exemption form or otherwise legal form,is offered by the family, OR the facilities runs the risk of being sued for discrimination. You, as a parent, do NOT have the right to look at the rest of the children's records to see who and how many, are in fact vaccinated or not, so you will never, ever know that what type of situation you are putting your child into, as far as health/germs/vaccinations risks.

 

:iagree:Having had a son with Leukemia I didn't take any chances. His immune system stayed in the basement while he was on therapy and during that time as I said in my earlier post, I kept him in a bubble.

 

What really got my hackles up was not the issue of vaccination versus non vaccination. That is a personal choice that every parent has the right to make on a case by case basis. My problem was the post that suggested lying or "fudging" about their kids being vaccinated. Having been the parent of an immuno-compromised child I needed all the help I could get when it came to keeping my son safe.

 

It would be better to say that your child didn't have the vaccinations at all and get an exemption form than to lie and say your child had them or was just behind schedule. At least then those of us parents with immuno-compromised kids could make an informed decision. If I knew there would be kids present that didn't have vaccinations I would just err on the side of caution and not come. However, the scenerio I mentioned was that if your child DIDN'T have the vaccines and you lied or "fudged" about it just so your kid could go. How would I then have the important information I would need to protect my child? If all people were honest about issues like this then perhaps immuno-compromised kids like mine could have more options because parents of those kids would know whether an event was safe or not.

 

However, it's mindsets such as "fudging vaccination information" that caused my son to not have any type of normal childhood for three years. I knew I couldn't trust others to make right choices regarding protecting my son so I just had to force him to not attend anything. :crying: Not too many happy memories during that time.

 

Anyway, I don't care who vaccinates or who doesn't vaccinate. Just don't lie about whether or not you have or haven't. Help the rest of us out by at least being truthful about you decision. Then we'll know what steps we need to take or not take.

 

To the original poster. You can send your child to the camp in question if you just go through the appropriate steps and get an exemption form. I would say this route would be fine. That way your child can participate and have a wonderful time and those few parents like us won't be given inaccurate information

 

Blessings :001_smile:

[Johanna]

I just wanted to say I totally agree with you on this. I vaccinate, but honestly I think it should be the parent's call (whatever their reasoning is).

 

Many places have ridiculous policies. For example, at a state university they must require vaccinations for any full time student. For a part time student or a student taking a hobby course they often don't require it. Sorry, but where is the logic in that? Someone who spends 2 hours a week on campus is less of a threat than someone who spends 4 hours? That absolutely makes no sense.

 

I think that people forget that it is these "sort of policies" that have kept "outbreaks" at bay. Seriously, does anyone remember from history lessons when children and people of all ages were dying left and right from outbreaks of diphtheria, Pertussis, or whooping cough, polio,measelsm ,mumps and rubella...etc.

Yes, I do think that vaccinations are a "choice" but, I still believe that because most parents vaccinate....its the reason that those who dont vaccinate dont get sick. What if noone vaccinated.....all these diseases would come back....would they not?

 

You can't fault an institution or camp for trying to protect!

Edited May 20, 2009 by Johanna
typo

[Sputterduck]

I think that people forget that it is these "sort of policies" that have kept "outbreaks" at bay. Seriously, does anyone remember from history lessons when children and people of all ages were dying left and right from outbreaks of diphtheria, Pertussis, or whooping cough, polio,measelsm ,mumps and rubella...etc.

Yes, I do think that vaccinations are a "choice" but, I still believe that because most parents vaccinate....its the reason that those who dont vaccinate dont get sick. What if noone vaccinated.....all these diseases would come back....would they not?

 

You can't fault an institution or camp for trying to protect!

 

The thing is, with modern medicine those diseases rarely have a terrible outcome. They aren't as scary as they once were.

[yarrow]

Civil Air Patrol is Air Force auxiliary but the camp will not take place on a military base.

 

Just for the record, we haven't nor did we plan on "fudging". I was just looking for advice on what to expect from other parents who had experience.

[Karen sn]

I agree. If you are wobbly on this, please do not send this child to camp. Other parents do not want this child at camp.

 

 

I am another parent.....I could care less if the kid is vaccinated or not and at camp or not.

 

Except in recent cases, in which case your vaccinated child could possibly give something to my kids. Dd who is 11 - OK - don't care if she gts exposed, my ds (baby) want to keep him away from recent vacc'd kids when possible, but I don't freak out with worry. Of course, whatever dd gets, I am sure ds will as well. Soooooooo...... What can ya do?

 

How many vacc'd kids get sick with what they are vacc'd for?

Several outbreaks in this country were with kids who were fully vacc'd.

 

I suppose they are called childhood diseases for a reason.

Just my 2 cents.

[Karen sn]

I think that people forget that it is these "sort of policies" that have kept "outbreaks" at bay. Seriously, does anyone remember from history lessons when children and people of all ages were dying left and right from outbreaks of diphtheria, Pertussis, or whooping cough, polio,measelsm ,mumps and rubella...etc.

Yes, I do think that vaccinations are a "choice" but, I still believe that because most parents vaccinate....its the reason that those who dont vaccinate dont get sick. What if noone vaccinated.....all these diseases would come back....would they not?

 

You can't fault an institution or camp for trying to protect!

 

Ok, so lots of people died.

But......

Was there running water for washing hands?

How about a sewer system?

Were they malnourished?

So many factors go into whether or not a kid gets sick at all, and then if they do get sick, there are factors involved for recovery.

[HiddenJewel]

And the proper paper work for the exemption would be on file with the camp, so if a serious illness, like measles or menengitis, were to break out, they'd have information about who was the likely carrier.

 

I agree that full disclosure is important. However, just because a child is not vaccinated does not mean he/she would be the likely carrier.

Edited May 20, 2009 by HiddenJewel