Just realizing ds is Aspie -- can you tell me where to begin?

[8filltheheart]

Lecka,

 

I am not sure how they collected the data.   But, it is consistent with what we have been told by all the specialists we have seen since ds has become an adult as well as by case workers in 2 different states in regards to services from the different DRS.   Multiple degrees but unemployable.   Severe underemployment.   Perpetual student and no employment.   Those are all scenarios that have been described.     I wish I had heeded the remark that was made when ds was about 14 or 15......it really doesn't matter what he knows if he can't hold down a job.   That one line is probably the most pointed one we ever received and the one that I dismissed b/c he was so intelligent.   But employability is a serious issue that undermines success for Aspies and why the stats are probably fairly accurate.   The number of fully employed is probably higher if you include undiagnosed underemployed.  But, no, I do not believe that there are large percentages of undiagnosed highly employed Aspies out there.

 

My ds's generation are no longer children.   They are young adults.   Statistically speaking, it is true amg the young adults that we know.   I don't think that the issues that are impacting this generation are any different than the issues that impact the older generation.   Is this generation somehow "more unemployable" than previous generations? (if anything I would think that the stigmas would be worse in older generation making employment more difficult.)  Until the current young children with intensive interventions grow up (which my ds's generation did not receive) it is doubtful that the stats will change.     I hope that CW is correct and that the kids receiving intensive therapies today will be more successful.

 

I have probably over-reacted to the entire issue.  It is very possible that the OP's dh does have Aspergers.   But, posting on a thread where the mother was pointing out serious deficits that her ds has (and I definitely see the exact same issues in my ds and why employability is a serious problem) and stating definitively that her dh is an Aspie with a six figure income and that she doesn't need to seek an evaluation for her ds b/c she knows all about Aspies......it was like salt in an open wound b/c we are confronted with the attitude all the time with our ds.   He looks normal.   He is articulate.   He is smart.   Aspergers is not a serious problem.   We need to just do x,y,z and make him grow up and move out.   Or we need to send him to college away from home so that he can grow up in the college atmosphere and learn to fend for himself, etc, etc.   Their comments are 99% of the time preceded by some comment like "I suspect that several of my colleagues are Aspies, and they are very successful employees."     It is what you can't see....the low processing speeds, the executive function deficits, the poor judgment skills, etc that impact them.   Far more than any awkward social or communication skills.   I think most people focus on the latter and don't really understand the former.  

 

 

 

 

[Lecka]

Maybe my aunt and uncle get that attitude, or got that attitude 15 years ago.... I was away at college myself, and no one liked to tell me "oh your cousin is having struggles" b/c it would have been gossipy.  

 

I am very aware.  

 

But I do think -- it doesn't mean that there are not plenty of Aspergers people who are doing well, and only finding out when they are older.  I make an assumption that OP and her husband are my age or older -- meaning he probably had very little chance of ever being diagnosed when he was younger.  

 

I make my own conclusion though -- the stereotype where "well my husband is doing so well" and then maybe the child is not doing as well, but that is what people will say to be in denial.  I have seen that.  But it is not always like that!  Just once in a while.  I think -- substitute ADHD and it seems the same.  

 

Most of the conversations I have about autism are with people who would never dream of making those garbage comments, I am sorry that is what you are having to deal with.  It is just ignorance and maybe willful ignorance, maybe wanting to have a tidy box where you just blame people for their problems instead of helping them and having compassion for others in the world.

 

Since I grew up with my cousin, even though he was not diagnosed with Aspergers, he was held back a year in school for social immaturity and he had a lot of motor coordination problems all through his childhood.  So for my entire life -- I have been taught to not act judgmental towards him.  I think I just pass over a lot of things, or automatically go "well if they knew any better."  

 

But that is not a pain that I have.  

 

It has been a while since anyone has thought my little son has just been wild for his age.  And for my cousin -- he is 36 and I don't think people still say some things to my aunt and uncle they may have said longer ago.  But also my aunt and uncle do not cover up as much, they don't hide as much, they don't keep things from their friends, and then wonder why their friends are not understanding. But they also have changed their friends a lot.  I do not know who dropped who, but they quit being friends with a lot of people.  My impression is that they got tired of seeing their friends' children moving along in life -- partly b/c my aunt had a "thing" against me for 2-3 years around that time, that I was doing things my cousin was not doing.  But that has been more than 10 years ago, too.  I don't know.

 

I think I just do not have the same experience.  

 

I am really sorry for those insensitive comments, though.  I think some people are just blind, some people may realize in a few years, and some people ---- maybe are just random people and it doesn't really matter.  

 

We have a person in our family who just continues to not understand that my cousin has a disability in some areas.  He is always saying "he did this again."  "He didn't do that again."  He has griped that he looked too slouchy sitting in a chair (this is very typical of my cousin -- he doesn't realize how he is sitting).  He has griped he can't follow directions.

 

Well -- he is also a big supporter of my cousin and one of my cousin's favorite people.

 

But my Mom and I are always having to tell him ----- he is not doing it on purpose, cut him some slack, etc.  I have tried to explain his issues and failed.  This person also adores my son -- never, ever a negative word about him.  

 

But I have made my peace with that person not getting it?  He is my step-dad and I love him a lot.  

 

But that is for my *cousin,*  B/c my cousin ----- I get only support from my family, no backbiting comments.  My ILs try ---- my MIL has finally admitted that my son could have autism since "he likes hugs and I thought autistic children didn't like to be touched."  She had been saying he would grow out of it prior to this Christmas.  But I had a very nice conversation with her at Christmas.  But -- it is not the first time I have had to ignore a view of hers, it hurt me much more when she thought my older son should have more speech therapy after he was exiting private speech therapy and said she didn't like how he talked and we would regret it when he was older and still talked "that way" like "one of FIL's cousins."  But since then I just blow her off - -she is not worth getting upset over.  And -- my older son talks fine.  

[Alicia64]

8FillTheHeart -- A million trillion times over. . . I truly didn't mean to put salt in the wounds. Please accept my apologies, I was merely trying to offer hope to people with Aspie kids. (My DH is someone who very easily could have lived a life without being married. He and I clicked initially. Then I became his special project. And finally we had kids: and, even when times are really rough, I won't leave him given the kids.)

 

I'm a little stunned at this moment that I've figured out a few things that work with him to make things better. But it's definitely a "managing" kind of thing. Our life has been easier lately. But, honestly, I wasn't trying to brag, but just offer hope. (It was my mil who came to me wondering about his Aspergers years ago.)

 

I'm from a state where it's fashionable to say that most of the workers in a certain field have Aspergers. I honestly didn't realize there was such a gamut to the spectrum. I should have, but I didn't.

 

I really am so sorry.

 

Alley

[8filltheheart]

I am sorry that your son is not currently experiencing the life you had envisioned for him. I am extremely grateful you've been transparent about your son's struggles because I have many years to go before I can stop taking a closer look at my son's behavior and not just take it for granted that moving forward is enough progress to make it to our end goal. I hope and pray that my son will be able to live the life we have in mind for him.

 

That said, my son doesn't present with as many difficulties as a lot of other children on the spectrum. He is growing into some traits more fully while also not growing out of other behaviors, but he can pass for neurotypical much of the time. Just as you do not like hearing people say that they've diagnosed someone by reading a book, I cringe when I hear that people dismiss the idea that their child might have a spectrum disorder because they compare their child to someone who is more obviously and stereotypically on the spectrum. We were those parents at first, until we heard a seminar on 2e kids that listed how Asperger's can look in kids with high IQs. My son may or may not have as much trouble functioning in the day-to-day world, but believe me, he struggles profoundly with his difficulties. He knows he is different, but he doesn't understand others. He knows he has problems while having no idea what question to ask or what to do about it. It's terribly hard for him to realize that won't be like others, no matter how hard he tries. (He has been told about his diagnosis, but his level of self-awareness is one reason that we dismissed the idea of this diagnosis at first. However, his self-awareness is very DIFFERENT than the kind most people have.)

 

There are people whose children present with symptoms in late childhood or early teenage years, and the parents had shrugged off "little" red flags all along thinking that they would be dismissed by a psychologist (this happened to me, and it kept us from getting help for a long time). Does that make him these individuals less spectrum-ish somehow? I think Lecka's point about wives vs. parents is important--there are books on Asperger's that bring up her point exactly (Tony Attwood comes to mind). Some people can hold it together in certain environments, and they let it all hang out at home. That's still impairment. My son held it together in school most of the time, but he was a train wreck at home. We found out recently that he was extremely motivated to not get into trouble ("trouble" being a generic word for disruptive, having meltdowns, etc.--he was undiagnosed when he attended school). He was afraid (we now know) that the principal would expel him, and he greatly admired the principal.

 

Your experience with your ds actually sounds a lot like ours with our ds. He was extremely ADHD when he was little and has always had muscle strength/coordination issues, but he played well with other kids, but mostly kids younger than him. Pre-teen and teenage yrs with him are what were far from normal and everything mushroomed. I think it would have been a serious problem younger in a school environment. It was just that at home it didn't hit critical mass until that pt.

 

I always encourage parents to seek evaluations bc we missed critical interventions. I wish our ds had the therapies that today's younger kids are receiving.

 

I apologize if I have come across at all not encouraging evaluations. Bc it exactly the opposite that I believe. But, I was definitely emotional when I posted earlier. For that I am sorry.

[FairProspects]

I only read the first few posts, but I wanted to say that not all individuals who come off as having Asperger-ish symptoms actually have the condition. I took my 2nd child for an evaluation by our family's pediatric neurologist after his little sister was diagnosed with High-Functioning Autism. The pediatric neurologist said that she could understand why we were concerned, but she felt very strongly that DS was *NOT* "on the spectrum". She previously worked at the same developmental clinic as the developmental pediatrician who diagnosed youngest DD with HFA, so she is very familiar with ASD.

 

The neurologist felt that DS' symptoms actually were due to a combination of giftedness + ADHD + anxiety. The anxiety makes him slow-to-warm-up and a bit shy. The attention difficulties can lead to missing non-verbal cues and other subtleties necessary for appropriate social interaction. The giftedness can lead to unusual interests and a "little professor" mannerism. But while he has some traits in common with Aspies, there were other things that ruled out Asperger's or PDD.

 

Now we had a subsequent evaluation at a binocular vision clinic that revealed borderline-low visual processing (just slightly too high to qualify for VT through our health insurance unfortunately). So it is possible he may have Non-Verbal Learning Disorder in addition to the ADHD & anxiety. We need to get a full neuropsych eval and were on the waiting list for the Eides for a while but sadly that is not in the budget right now.

 

Yes, this exactly. I had several professionals tell me they suspected ASD for one of my boys and I thought I saw some symptoms too, but a full eval revealed he did does not fit the diagnostic criteria. These diagnoses can be tricky to tease apart and really need to be done by professionals.

[8filltheheart]

8FillTheHeart -- A million trillion times over. . . I truly didn't mean to put salt in the wounds. Please accept my apologies, I was merely trying to offer hope to people with Aspie kids. (My DH is someone who very easily could have lived a life without being married. He and I clicked initially. Then I became his special project. And finally we had kids: and, even when times are really rough, I won't leave him given the kids.)

 

I'm a little stunned at this moment that I've figured out a few things that work with him to make things better. But it's definitely a "managing" kind of thing. Our life has been easier lately. But, honestly, I wasn't trying to brag, but just offer hope. (It was my mil who came to me wondering about his Aspergers years ago.)

 

I'm from a state where it's fashionable to say that most of the workers in a certain field have Aspergers. I honestly didn't realize there was such a gamut to the spectrum. I should have, but I didn't.

 

I really am so sorry.

 

Alley

Alley,

 

I never thought you meant to cause any problems at all. :) But, your last paragraph is very true in many places. It is fashionable to say it. And that pretty much sums it up.

 

I really hope you seek evaluations for your ds bc the earlier the interventions, the more likely the success.

[Lecka]

I am sorry  -- I just haven't heard the comments like that.

 

I am seeing now -- that it would be hard to hear that all the time.  

 

I am in a small town and some things I just don't hear.  

 

[kbutton]

I apologize if I have come across at all not encouraging evaluations. Bc it exactly the opposite that I believe. But, I was definitely emotional when I posted earlier. For that I am sorry.

 

I think I read it more as being against parent hunches because a hunch is not enough or definitive (sort of). From my perspective, that might lead someone to avoid getting a diagnosis because their child is "not severely affected enough." We were stunned by the Asperger's diagnosis simply because our son wasn't like a lot of other kids that had a diagnosis (that we know). It's a little hard to articulate exactly what impression I was getting from the conversation, but I am glad you were able to come back and clarify. Thanks. I think our concerns fall into many of the same categories.

 

I do think diagnosis for any exceptionality is really the best idea, Asperger's or not.

[EndOfOrdinary]

A child the age of yours is beginning to learn very complex social dynamics. The level of information he is being asked to assimilate and connect is massive. There could be glitches in any number of places. Assumptions can be very dangerous.

 

As I have posted before, I am not technically on spectrum, but I was raised around family who are (one severely, one moderately). I have a stack of learned behaviors that look very much like Aspergers. Growing up in a family is like growing up in a micro culture. My micro culture only had people who weren't "normal" (for lack of a better term). Thus, I learned the idea of normal incorrectly. As far as I was concerned, my family was normal. If your child is mimicking behavior or translating learned behavior inappropriately, then he might appear to have something going on that isn't even there. My brother needed heavy intervention. I needed occupational therapy for maybe two intensive years to show me what real normalcy was and give me some basic skills as a jumping off point. These two situations are very different.

 

Secondly, I had a giant stack of therapy from the age of 8 onward till 16. None of them really addressed the real problems occurring for me because I was unable to give the the right information to help. I was depressed, because of my messed up family situation. I was having trouble in school, because of my lack of social skills due to my family situation. I had anxiety, because I really didn't want any one to know how embarrassed I was of my home life. Treating the depression, social skills, and anxiety didn't do much other than make me feel like a basket case. It wasn't the real problem. Therapy is not all the same. You have to know what is going on so that help can be given and when you are dealing with children who often times cannot adequately explain themselves it is even more complicated.

 

You offended people because many individuals are going through - or have been through - situations with massive complexity level which you appeared to blow off. If either your child or your husband is an Aspie, it gets messy. Like tear your house apart messy. It is downright debilitating to not understand general culture. Moreover it is beyond frustrating for both parties to try and communicate culture. My brother is a 32 year old hermit who has never lived anywhere but home and can't hold a job. My husband and I have gotten so close to divorce that my son had a bag permanently packed. My mother and I are still fragile after not speaking to each other for quite some time because she literally doesn't know how to love me (or anyone). That is being Aspergers. That is Autism. It is not something that you just sort of can tell or that an Internet resource and the library can talk you through. It is worth so much more than that. This undermines the legitimacy of your claim that you know much of anything about the disorder (and I hate calling it that because it is prejudicial.)

[geodob]

I've read this sentence over and over trying to understand it.  So you're saying people will receive disability payments from the gov't if their kids get a particular label??  So then unscrupulous souls are seeking out light labels and spinning their presentation,  hoping to net $$?  

 

Though their is another unscrupulous activity that is occurring, of getting a fake diagnosis?

It is usually done when a student is in their final year of high school, where the whole aim is to get accommodations such as 'extra test time, etc' for final exams.

Which can add a few points to grades and make it a bit easier to get scholarships and admission to preferred colleges and courses.

Where students are coached on the neuro-psych tests, and how to fail the right tests, to get the desired accommodations.

 

Though this is why their is now a greater concern with demonstrating a history of accommodations,  as a way to address this.

[kbutton]

Maybe I'm reading between the lines, but the OP has mentioned that things have been very stressful with her husband because of his potential diagnosis (Post #54). I could have written two or three of those sentences verbatim. In my case, my DH doesn't have Asperger's, but like EndofOrdinary, he lived with at least two family members who have undiagnosed issues (one has since been diagnosed), and he has major trouble in certain realms. What is hiding behind such a benign statement in my case is ***personal circumstances I decided to remove from the post***. Sometimes people in these circumstances need to leave it at "I think they have Asperger's" if they know the spouse is isn't likely to change or be willing to seek help. They have to put a toe in the water and figure out something "small" first that feel capable of investigating even without the support of the spouse (especially if the spouse isn't going to be able to help). In some cases the person living with this questions their own judgment about everything daily--normal is slowly being recalibrated for them as well, like a frog in a warming pan of water.

 

I'm not trying to defend how anything has come across by others, but the OP may very well be dealing with "situations with massive complexity level" that are "tear your house apart messy." I have, and I RARELY would ever tell anyone just how bad it has been at my house. When I've trusted people with this kind of information, they've betrayed me in very personal, humiliating, and potentially life-altering ways. A few have offered potential help ("biblical counseling")--NEVER ONCE did anyone ever suggest that I get my son evaluated for a potential developmental issue, learning problem, giftedness, etc. In fact, I was frequently discouraged from it. Once in a while, I would totally crack, open my mouth, and suffer endlessly for it. I was considered the unstable one by people outside the family, quite frankly. (And please don't think any of this is a character issue on my husband's part--he really has been handed a different scale for measuring normal and how to live daily life, but his character is impeccable.) It's much easier to say, "I think my husband and child have Asperger's, and I would like to see if a social skills class would help."

 

Getting help pinpoints exactly what is wrong. We know that because we've been there. But if you aren't sure you are going to be able to get help, you might read books, play your cards close to your chest, and do your best to put together an action plan for what you think might be the diagnosis. You might even open your mouth on a forum and stick your foot right in it.

 

Again, I don't know the OP, but I could have been her and said things similar to what she's said. In my case, the result would have been that I would have cried for days after reading the first few posts in the thread, not even bother to defend myself or explain/apologize, stop asking questions, and probably never get my child evaluated because I would be sure my situation was difficult only in my own mind and "not real enough" to warrant a diagnosis. I would have probably left a forum like this if I was new to it. Especially if the culture around me tends to blow off the idea of a real diagnosis (and the culture around me does, though not because it's "popular" around here to say that someone has Asperger's). I would not have made it past the first hint that I was offending someone or that I was arguing. I would have been too discouraged and humiliated for accidentally offending someone. It has been implied (again, just how I am reading things) that because her husband makes good money and functions well outside the home that her situation must not be that bad. Please do not make that assumption. Everyone has worked hard to get back on the same page and move the thread forward, but I feel that something needs to be said about the subjective nature of judging another person's home life by statements that were perceived as inflammatory or ignorant. I have been on the receiving end of that way too much. I do not intend this as a lecture or an argument--just another perspective on this thread could be viewed (overall tone, not individual comments necessarily). I really appreciate that everyone has chimed back in to clarify their thoughts. I should be clear that I am not offended--I feel like this conversation was a personal trigger for me (a traumatic one), and this response has been marinating in my mind for a while. It may not be my place to do so, but others have responded out of emotion too, so I hope this is a safe place to do just that, and I've spent a lot of time in thought and in writing trying to think how to respond.

[Alicia64]

Maybe I'm reading between the lines, but the OP has mentioned that things have been very stressful with her husband because of his potential diagnosis (Post #54). I could have written two or three of those sentences verbatim. In my case, my DH doesn't have Asperger's, but like EndofOrdinary, he lived with at least two family members who have undiagnosed issues (one has since been diagnosed), and he has major trouble in certain realms. What is hiding behind such a benign statement in my case is ***personal circumstances I decided to remove from the post***. Sometimes people in these circumstances need to leave it at "I think they have Asperger's" if they know the spouse is isn't likely to change or be willing to seek help. They have to put a toe in the water and figure out something "small" first that feel capable of investigating even without the support of the spouse (especially if the spouse isn't going to be able to help). In some cases the person living with this questions their own judgment about everything daily--normal is slowly being recalibrated for them as well, like a frog in a warming pan of water.

 

I'm not trying to defend how anything has come across by others, but the OP may very well be dealing with "situations with massive complexity level" that are "tear your house apart messy." I have, and I RARELY would ever tell anyone just how bad it has been at my house. When I've trusted people with this kind of information, they've betrayed me in very personal, humiliating, and potentially life-altering ways. A few have offered potential help ("biblical counseling")--NEVER ONCE did anyone ever suggest that I get my son evaluated for a potential developmental issue, learning problem, giftedness, etc. In fact, I was frequently discouraged from it. Once in a while, I would totally crack, open my mouth, and suffer endlessly for it. I was considered the unstable one by people outside the family, quite frankly. (And please don't think any of this is a character issue on my husband's part--he really has been handed a different scale for measuring normal and how to live daily life, but his character is impeccable.) It's much easier to say, "I think my husband and child have Asperger's, and I would like to see if a social skills class would help."

 

Getting help pinpoints exactly what is wrong. We know that because we've been there. But if you aren't sure you are going to be able to get help, you might read books, play your cards close to your chest, and do your best to put together an action plan for what you think might be the diagnosis. You might even open your mouth on a forum and stick your foot right in it.

 

Again, I don't know the OP, but I could have been her and said things similar to what she's said. In my case, the result would have been that I would have cried for days after reading the first few posts in the thread, not even bother to defend myself or explain/apologize, stop asking questions, and probably never get my child evaluated because I would be sure my situation was difficult only in my own mind and "not real enough" to warrant a diagnosis. I would have probably left a forum like this if I was new to it. Especially if the culture around me tends to blow off the idea of a real diagnosis (and the culture around me does, though not because it's "popular" around here to say that someone has Asperger's). I would not have made it past the first hint that I was offending someone or that I was arguing. I would have been too discouraged and humiliated for accidentally offending someone. It has been implied (again, just how I am reading things) that because her husband makes good money and functions well outside the home that her situation must not be that bad. Please do not make that assumption. Everyone has worked hard to get back on the same page and move the thread forward, but I feel that something needs to be said about the subjective nature of judging another person's home life by statements that were perceived as inflammatory or ignorant. I have been on the receiving end of that way too much. I do not intend this as a lecture or an argument--just another perspective on this thread could be viewed (overall tone, not individual comments necessarily). I really appreciate that everyone has chimed back in to clarify their thoughts. I should be clear that I am not offended--I feel like this conversation was a personal trigger for me (a traumatic one), and this response has been marinating in my mind for a while. It may not be my place to do so, but others have responded out of emotion too, so I hope this is a safe place to do just that, and I've spent a lot of time in thought and in writing trying to think how to respond.

 

That you took the time to write this means the world to me. You just won't ever know how much this means. Thank you so much.

 

You hit it right on the head: I was writing in a kind of short hand and thought I'd be understood here. Living with a man with Aspergers -- that he doesn't want to acknowledge -- has been monstrously hard. I'll be honest, I've had some pretty black moments where I've wondered how much longer I could last. (I'm not talking divorce either.)

 

We're doing better for the moment, but I have no delusions: hard moments, days, weekends or weeks are in my future. Vacations are one of his favorite places to be constantly criticizing me.

 

But, all that said, he's a fantastic man in many, many ways. I just have to focus on how he's awesome.

 

Thank you, though. I think that people at the beginning of the learning-road need to find a place of welcome and not a feeling like I've had these last days: that people are coming at me with baseball bats. I just think that's totally wrong and isn't going to help anyone learn and grow.

 

It's ironic that posters on this thread imply that people are ignorant and keeping myths about Aspergers alive and well, but instead of creating an atmosphere of teaching and learning and developing -- an angry "get her" vibe boiled up.

 

I was raised with extremely abusive parents and this was a tough thread for me too.

 

Kbutton: thank you so much. I really appreciate you and your help and your willingness to come forward.

 

Alley

 

 

[8filltheheart]

Kbutton,

 

I'm sorry that my posts came across that way bc that was not my intent at all. My response was a knee jerk reaction to 2 posts on the other thread, both of which have now been deleted.

 

I did not in any way intend to suggest things are hunky-dory and therefore it is not possible that her dh has Asperger's. But, I will maintain that it is wrong to post definitively that he represents an incredibly positive adult outcome bc it is not known if he does have Asperger's. Her post that she deleted was a beautiful testament to her dh and her commitment to him. But, whether or not her testimony reflects Asperger's is unknown, regardless to the definitive statements otherwise. That was my only pt. That and that she should not label her ds as having Asperger's and only seek social skills training when she doesn't know whether or not that is the underlying cause.

 

I regret having gotten involved in the discussion at all. This is a very touchy subject for me and I should have known better than to respond. Accept my apologies.

[Tiramisu]

I'm rather late jumping in here, and I see how things could get very emotional. I was holding back tears as the various posts brought back a lot of painful memories about the two people I know/knew who were undiagnosed though by all appearances very much on the spectrum. I'm realizing that I have my own grief over this that I haven't quite faced. 

 

I agree with 8Fill about the processing issues being a very big deal. When I think of one person in particular it's near impossible to tease apart what's a social impairment and what's disordered processing because the processing can make people look uncaring, rude, mean, and the processing can also make them behave that way, though it's not intentional. This is one reason why the full neuropsych evaluation can be very helpful to figure out the processing difficulties.

 

Can I just share that my uncle lived in his own home for perhaps fifteen years and never took the wrapping off the stove? And it's not as though he was busy with his job, because he could never hold one. I don't know if I remember him eating anything other than cheeseburgers, grilled cheese, two eggs over easy, and he could not make one of those things by himself even though he had at least one MA degree. He loved cruises and only went alone. I remember hearing he was given a table to sit at and then the other people at the table requested to be moved. My grandfather is still puzzled over what went wrong in his son's life. And my grandmother just blames my grandfather, who is in fact very normal and was a very good father. I'll never forget the amazement in my grandfather's face when he heard there's probably a name for my uncle's problems and it wasn't something they caused.   

 

In any case, I wanted to post to encourage the OP to see what services are available in her state. We have services in our state that will come to the home of a child up to age 18 or so suspected to be on the spectrum. They will help parents coordinate different evaluations and make sure they have coverage for them through their private insurance or through state programs if necessary. The same for any recommended therapies.

 

I'm also hearing about kids where we live getting disability which is not necessary to receive the state services for minors as far as I've heard.

[Alicia64]

I'm rather late jumping in here, and I see how things could get very emotional. I was holding back tears as the various posts brought back a lot of painful memories about the two people I know/knew who were undiagnosed though by all appearances very much on the spectrum. I'm realizing that I have my own grief over this that I haven't quite faced. 

 

I agree with 8Fill about the processing issues being a very big deal. When I think of one person in particular it's near impossible to tease apart what's a social impairment and what's disordered processing because the processing can make people look uncaring, rude, mean, and the processing can also make them behave that way, though it's not intentional. This is one reason why the full neuropsych evaluation can be very helpful to figure out the processing difficulties.

 

Can I just share that my uncle lived in his own home for perhaps fifteen years and never took the wrapping off the stove? And it's not as though he was busy with his job, because he could never hold one. I don't know if I remember him eating anything other than cheeseburgers, grilled cheese, two eggs over easy, and he could not make one of those things by himself even though he had at least one MA degree. He loved cruises and only went alone. I remember hearing he was given a table to sit at and then the other people at the table requested to be moved. My grandfather is still puzzled over what went wrong in his son's life. And my grandmother just blames my grandfather, who is in fact very normal and was a very good father. I'll never forget the amazement in my grandfather's face when he heard there's probably a name for my uncle's problems and it wasn't something they caused.   

 

In any case, I wanted to post to encourage the OP to see what services are available in her state. We have services in our state that will come to the home of a child up to age 18 or so suspected to be on the spectrum. They will help parents coordinate different evaluations and make sure they have coverage for them through their private insurance or through state programs if necessary. The same for any recommended therapies.

 

I'm also hearing about kids where we live getting disability which is not necessary to receive the state services for minors as far as I've heard.

 

Thank you, Tiramisu, I have made an nuero eval appoint. The earliest I could get in is May but I'm really excited about moving forward.

 

That's a great story about your grandfather. It must have meant so much to him to find it wasn't something he'd caused.

 

Alley

 

[kbutton]

Kbutton,

 

I'm sorry that my posts came across that way bc that was not my intent at all. My response was a knee jerk reaction to 2 posts on the other thread, both of which have now been deleted.

 

I did not in any way intend to suggest things are hunky-dory and therefore it is not possible that her dh has Asperger's. But, I will maintain that it is wrong to post definitively that he represents an incredibly positive adult outcome bc it is not known if he does have Asperger's. Her post that she deleted was a beautiful testament to her dh and her commitment to him. But, whether or not her testimony reflects Asperger's is unknown, regardless to the definitive statements otherwise. That was my only pt. That and that she should not label her ds as having Asperger's and only seek social skills training when she doesn't know whether or not that is the underlying cause.

 

I regret having gotten involved in the discussion at all. This is a very touchy subject for me and I should have known better than to respond. Accept my apologies.

 

I have no questions at all about your intents--you are very right to insist on evaluations to clarify things. I am not singling you out at all, especially since you have looped back to clarify what you've said several times and done it graciously.

 

I simply wanted to squeeze in another point of view about how people process things and that another point of view can emerge from equally trying but different circumstances. I hope that you will continue to share your perspective. I share the same conviction about getting a diagnosis, but not from the same direction. When I hear someone throw around a diagnosis and ask for help, I hope that the person will seek a confirmed diagnosis, but I'm giddy that they recognize something, anything at all is off because my husband lived in a family that DID NOT do that and still won't. I see one of his family members in particular use horrible strategies to deal with life that make people angry and make them avoid her. That hurts in a different way than having someone take your diagnosis lightly. When I hear someone ask why they should bother, I paint them an overly vivid picture of how this person functions. So, I understand emotion and hope you will continue putting your perspective out there.

 

[kbutton]

 

Thank you, though. I think that people at the beginning of the learning-road need to find a place of welcome and not a feeling like I've had these last days: that people are coming at me with baseball bats. I just think that's totally wrong and isn't going to help anyone learn and grow.

 

It's ironic that posters on this thread imply that people are ignorant and keeping myths about Aspergers alive and well, but instead of creating an atmosphere of teaching and learning and developing -- an angry "get her" vibe boiled up.

 

 

 

Alley,

 

I am glad you feel heard. I would encourage you not to view the folks who've contributed to the thread as being aggressive or trying to beat down someone who is honestly asking questions. They are not really like that. There are a few threads once in a while that just strike a nerve, and we all have to give each other grace on that. These are wise, experienced folks who really care deeply, and caring deeply brings those nerves closer to the surface.

[kbutton]

Alley,

 

I would also encourage you to find someone you can talk to while you go through this process, preferably a psychologist who works with families that have special needs. Our psychologist has done this for us--the poor woman is kind of in the middle of the emotions of all family members, but it's helping us a lot.

 

 

[Tiramisu]

Thank you, Tiramisu, I have made an nuero eval appoint. The earliest I could get in is May but I'm really excited about moving forward.

 

That's a great story about your grandfather. It must have meant so much to him to find it wasn't something he'd caused.

 

Alley

 

 

Alley, even though you didn't go into to much detail about your dh. I understand. I was in a serious relationship for many years with someone who is likely on the spectrum. I was walked out on and left in restaurants or wherever, left alone or humiliated in front of friends, without any warning or explanation just because he felt like it (over-stimulated or CAPD misunderstandings??). I've received insults and strange comments that were intended to be compliments. Then I had to listen to what others said about him. When a PP said something about living with people who "don't know how to love," I get that. He was never intentionally cruel, just clueless. It still hurts to remember. You have my sympathy. Here's a hug.  :grouphug:

[PeterPan]

You hit it right on the head: I was writing in a kind of short hand and thought I'd be understood here. Living with a man with Aspergers -- that he doesn't want to acknowledge -- has been monstrously hard. I'll be honest, I've had some pretty black moments where I've wondered how much longer I could last. (I'm not talking divorce either.)

 

We're doing better for the moment, but I have no delusions: hard moments, days, weekends or weeks are in my future. Vacations are one of his favorite places to be constantly criticizing me.

Alley, my mother used to say that about my father, and the label wasn't aspergers.  It was bipolar (later with schizophr added on, I think).  I'm sorry it's that hard for you and what sounds like could be dangerous or combative or extremely unpleasant.  It's a good reason at least to get the right evals for your ds, so he has the right words and right treatment.  Oh, my dad is on meds now (a huge cocktail) and much more stable.  My mom could have lived with him as he is now, on the meds, and she couldn't the way he was.  Like kbutton, I'm from a community that offers christian counseling and thinks everything else is leading you astray.  Frankly, at this stage of my life, I wish my dad had been on the meds and my parents had been able to stay together more than some theoretical idea of how things should be done.  Your statement though about how he doesn't want to acknowledge it, that's what she used to say about my dad.  He had to live homeless on the streets for a couple years before he could accept help.  There can be a spectrum disorder *and* some things requiring meds.  It's not necessarily just a one or the other situation.  Anyways, that's a little more in the same boat kind of thing for you.  People do care and I hope you can solve what you can as safely and peacefully as you can.

[PeterPan]

Thank you, Tiramisu, I have made an nuero eval appoint. The earliest I could get in is May but I'm really excited about moving forward.

 

That's a great story about your grandfather. It must have meant so much to him to find it wasn't something he'd caused.

 

Alley

 

I missed this.  That's awesome!  Well good.  That's going to be a good step forward.  One thing at a time...

[PeterPan]

I have no questions at all about your intents--you are very right to insist on evaluations to clarify things. I am not singling you out at all, especially since you have looped back to clarify what you've said several times and done it graciously.

 

I simply wanted to squeeze in another point of view about how people process things and that another point of view can emerge from equally trying but different circumstances. I hope that you will continue to share your perspective. I share the same conviction about getting a diagnosis, but not from the same direction. When I hear someone throw around a diagnosis and ask for help, I hope that the person will seek a confirmed diagnosis, but I'm giddy that they recognize something, anything at all is off because my husband lived in a family that DID NOT do that and still won't. I see one of his family members in particular use horrible strategies to deal with life that make people angry and make them avoid her. That hurts in a different way than having someone take your diagnosis lightly. When I hear someone ask why they should bother, I paint them an overly vivid picture of how this person functions. So, I understand emotion and hope you will continue putting your perspective out there.

KButton, doesn't that make you one of the few entirely NT people on this board if you can see another POV?  Isn't that what's warped in half of us, our Theory of Mind and lack of ability to stand in someone else's moccasins?   :lol:   

 

Oh dear, someone will jump on that and say it's not statistically accurate.  Whatever.  Point is, you're on a SN board where a fair chunk of the ladies with kids with whatever label also say they too probably have some label.  It's not logical to assume that everyone here is going to be perfectly frictionless and observant socially and all that, because people KNOW they're missing stuff.  Nice people apologize when they're told they missed it.  I sorta have to put myself on timeout sometimes or slap my wrists, hehe.  So you just keep on being so blazing NT and pointing it out.   :)

[Crimson Wife]

LOL! Sometimes I wish it were possible to swap maybe 10% of the ASD "I don't care in the slightest what others think" with 10% of my own personal "oh my goodness, what will others think?" We'd both be better off that way.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Really your best first step is to talk with your doctor.

 

Could I just say, thank you for saying something so basic and helpful?  I have been asking questions on this sub-forum for months and months trying to figure out how to get (and afford) testing for my kids.  Everyone kept telling me to have a neuropsych evaluation.  I've googled, I've asked friends and perhaps it is just this area, but I was getting NO WHERE.  I felt like it was just so overwhelming to try and tease out a name of a doctor that takes our insurance and would do what I need for my dc.  Within days of you posting this basic thing, I have called the pediatrician and got referrals to local neuropsychologists that do the tests I want and use our insurance.  That has given me something manageable so that I could check out this small list and have narrowed it down to one that I have contacted.  Alicia, thank you for being persistent in asking your initial question "can you tell me where to begin" over and over again when you were misunderstood.  And thank you, Jennifer for actually answering the question for those of us who are overwhelmed and needed to know the very first basic step to take.  (And yes, I realize that this basic step might work for everyone in all areas but it sure has worked for me.)

[PeterPan]

Not to be hyper-picky, but I think a bunch of people DID say it.  Sometimes it just gets lost or people need to hear it again.  In any case, the ped is the starting point for most people, unless they are going to self-pay.  Glad you found the help you needed.   :)

 

...Really your best first step is to talk with your doctor.
 

 

 

... If you want to know a *basic* first step?  Go to the ped and ask for screenings for EF and spectrum.  They have the tools.  They're fallible, but it's a really simple first step if you want one... 

 

 

...Go to your pediatrician, get the screening, then get the referral for the further testing at a neuropsych.

 

 

...

Take your kid to your ped and get the process going NOW. 

 

 

I would get a workup from a psychologist or developmental pediatrician...

 

 

...For a child, a child psychologist or the child's pediatrician would be the appropriate starting point...

[Jean in Newcastle]

Well, there is proof that it takes a lot to get through to me!  

[PeterPan]

Well, there is proof that it takes a lot to get through to me!  

Me too!   :lol: 

[Jennifer-72]

Not to be hyper-picky, but I think a bunch of people DID say it. Sometimes it just gets lost or people need to hear it again. In any case, the ped is the starting point for most people, unless they are going to self-pay. Glad you found the help you needed. :)

Just couldn't let me have my 15 minutes eh? Lol!

[Jennifer-72]

Jean, so glad to hear you are finding some success in getting the help you need. Hope the process keeps proceeding smoothly for you.

 

J

[PeterPan]

Just couldn't let me have my 15 minutes eh? Lol!

Yeah, and I would have put you in the quotes clips too, but all the others were on page 1 and I had already clicked 'em all in before I realized my error!!!     :lol:    So consider yourself in there too!   :)

 

Adding: I went back and found you!  You're IN!  :D

[Jean in Newcastle]

Elizabeth, can I just say that I must have had "deer in the headlight" blinders on because even today when I went back to quote Jennifer, I skimmed through the entire thread twice and didn't see a single one of the other pediatrician suggestions when I did!  So color me clueless or perhaps just distracted by other things.  

[Jean in Newcastle]

Thanks to this thread, we now have an appointment.  I had a lovely talk with the neuropsych today.  And the cost was something we can manage.  

[Tiramisu]

Thanks to this thread, we now have an appointment.  I had a lovely talk with the neuropsych today.  And the cost was something we can manage.  

 

Yay!!!!!

[PeterPan]

Thanks to this thread, we now have an appointment.  I had a lovely talk with the neuropsych today.  And the cost was something we can manage.  

That's exciting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  

[8filltheheart]

May I ask some questions? I'm increasingly thinking that I could possibly have Asperger's. It is possible that I don't have that, but I am certainly not normal. I do have some diagnoses — gifted and dyscalculia. The online checklists for Asperger's are mostly from a NT perspective, which makes it hard to get much further. I do think, for instance, that I have empathy. I am not a psychopath, and I don't that is what the diagnostic lists mean by a lack of empathy either.

 

So, I'm weird. I personally think I am quite social, but making friends was a big problem when I was a child. Others sometimes (no, often) call me argumentative or critical, particularly at times when I am simply enthusiastically discussing things. I can't do small talk, or at least not very well since it does not come naturally. I prefer talking about ideas than about feelings and stuff.

 

I'm forever told keep my voice down. Eye contact was a huge issue when I was younger. I am not bothered by labels in clothes, or loud noises though. I do find it very hard to focus on things that are not interesting to me, and I did have the obsessions when I was younger — though not the same one forever. I speak five languages fluently and a few more less fluently, and I have dyscalculia, so there is the weakness in one area while having a talent in another area. I work from home. I'd say I am a good team player but more so when the team stuff is not in person but online.

 

This thread discussed the importance of getting a diagnosis. Whatever I have, my kids might well have too. I would say that whatever I have has impaired me. Could it "just" be giftedness and general weirdness? The thing is that we live in a country where mental health services are not readily accessible at all and mental health issues or neurological differences (or even physical disabilities) come with a huge stigma. So, I'd be content with a general self-diagnosis as long as that means we derive some benefit from that.

In addition to the "visible" deficits that my ds has,he has many non-visible deficits (by visible I mean seen in social behaviors). He has serious executive function deficits. He also has extremely low processing speeds. (In 2different IQ testing scenarios he had 1st and 3rd percentile scores for audio/visual and 5 yrs later 2nd and 18th percentile scores.). He has poor motor control with generalized weakness in his hand grip and his walking and running gaits do not appear natural.

 

I'm not sure what the actual criteria are for diagnosis.....though Asperger's is no longer a diagnosis unless you already had it.....but it is more than the surface social skills.

[Lecka]

You might check out wrongplanet.net 

 

They have a forum there, it is really focused on Aspergers.

 

It is not useful for me, personally, but I have got a good impression, the person who told me about it found it useful. 

 

I think a lot of people -- have taken an on-line test and just know they fit, but have not gotten a formal diagnosis.  I think it depends on the situation, but a lot of people just like the information and the community, and don't need a professional evaluation for their own purposes. 

[OneStepAtATime]

May I ask some questions? I'm increasingly thinking that I could possibly have Asperger's. It is possible that I don't have that, but I am certainly not normal. I do have some diagnoses — gifted and dyscalculia. The online checklists for Asperger's are mostly from a NT perspective, which makes it hard to get much further. I do think, for instance, that I have empathy. I am not a psychopath, and I don't that is what the diagnostic lists mean by a lack of empathy either. 

 

So, I'm weird. I personally think I am quite social, but making friends was a big problem when I was a child. Others sometimes (no, often) call me argumentative or critical, particularly at times when I am simply enthusiastically discussing things. I can't do small talk, or at least not very well since it does not come naturally. I prefer talking about ideas than about feelings and stuff.  

 

I'm forever told keep my voice down. Eye contact was a huge issue when I was younger. I am not bothered by labels in clothes, or loud noises though. I do find it very hard to focus on things that are not interesting to me, and I did have the obsessions when I was younger — though not the same one forever. I speak five languages fluently and a few more less fluently, and I have dyscalculia, so there is the weakness in one area while having a talent in another area. I work from home. I'd say I am a good team player but more so when the team stuff is not in person but online. 

 

This thread discussed the importance of getting a diagnosis. Whatever I have, my kids might well have too. I would say that whatever I have has impaired me. Could it "just" be giftedness and general weirdness? The thing is that we live in a country where mental health services are not readily accessible at all and mental health issues or neurological differences (or even physical disabilities) come with a huge stigma. So, I'd be content with a general self-diagnosis as long as that means we derive some benefit from that. 

Don't you also have a serious difficulty with your hip that you cannot easily take care of where you are currently located?  Not medically related, I realize, and I may be completely mis-remembering.  I was just thinking though, that if you are having health issues that cannot easily be addressed where you are currently living and you are thinking that a proper diagnosis for learning differences and functionality are not easily addressed where you are living, then maybe a sort of temporary relocation to somewhere you could have health issues and diagnosis possibilities addressed for you and your children might really help you all out in the long run?  Would that even be an option?  Any family or friends living somewhere with really good medical options that you could stay with, get a work visa, possibly health coverage and maybe seek some concrete help?  Then, at some later point, return home when your health issues and good, solid evaluations for the other stuff have been taken care of?  Probably a total impossibility, I realize.  I just thought I would throw it out there...

 

I don't really know details about Aspergers so hopefully someone else can post on here to address your specific questions.

 

Best wishes!

[Lecka]

I have not read it, but heard about it -- there was a book last year, The Journal of Best Practices by David Finch.  It is about a man who finds out he has Aspergers as an adult. 

 

My younger son has autism, and a lot of blogs and stuff that I like, include people who have learned that they have Aspergers or some tendencies of Aspergers, as an adult, after their child is diagnosed and they find out more about it. 

 

So -- it is a thing, for sure. 

 

Of course -- it is not official without an official diagnosis!  

 

I, personally, give people a pass when they have a child who has autism, though..... that is just how I am.

 

I do agree with others ---- that it is very frustrating when people self-diagnose just for the hell of it or for random reasons. Like it is a trendy thing.

 

But in my personal experience -- I have not heard anyone say it, who does not have a formal diagnosis or a child with a formal diagnosis.  I think.  I think that just comes from where I live (a small town).  Also, we don't have cable, so I am vaguely aware there are tv shows now with characters who have Aspergers, and that it is really not like how it is for my cousin (the main person I know who has an official diagnosis), but I have only seen those shows once or twice. 

 

But I do understand why many people do not like people to take a questionnaire on the Internet and then say they have Aspergers.  I do see that side also! 

 

But I do think -- if it is helpful to people to have some information, but they don't feel like they would benefit from a formal diagnosis, that is fine with me.  I think it can depend on a lot of things. 

 

It is a new diagnosis -- so many adults are not officially diagnosed, many are going off of on-line questionnaires or just have a sense that they recognize themselves. 

[OneStepAtATime]

Yes, that was me as well. And you might have read about my friend who is in her third trimester of pregnancy with placenta previa and cannot find a doctor to do a c-section (obviously absolutely necessary for previa) without offering serious bribes on the chat board. Oh, the joys of living in a transitional economy. But that is a topic that probably belongs on the Manifesto thread. :)

 

I think the possibility of getting an Asperger's diagnosis probably varies from country to country? I know it isn't in the DSM-5, but that doesn't mean other countries are not still offering it. My DD, too, walks strangely. Though she has amazing handwriting, she cannot cut stuff, tie laces, or similar things. We all also have trouble telling time from an analog clock, though that could fall under dyscalculia. 

 

Whatever I have goes beyond surface social issues. I was thinking giftedness, being multicultural, and past trauma might explain everything. Of course my mom took an online test for Asperger's and is now convinced she has that. Before that, she self-diagnosed ADHD. Online self-diagnoses could possibly be dangerous, but as long as I'm not able to get an official diagnosis nor mentally prepared, reading more about the topic seems like a sane thing to do. 

Love the Manifesto thread...:)

 

I wish your medical situation was a LOT more stable.  Without proper evals through a trained professional you will really just be shooting in the dark.  Wouldn't hurt to read up on everything, though.  I know that reading books and responses on WTM, as well as talking to people has actually given me a LOT of information, much more than I ever got while talking to our pediatrician or my primary care doctor.  And that information gave me the words and concepts I needed to make more informed inquiries, which led to better and more accurate evaluations and understanding....

 

Best wishes...

[Lecka]

It is not that Aspergers doesn't exist with DSM V ---- I think I have read that nearly everyone previously diagnosed with Aspergers, does qualify as having Autism Spectrum Disorder now.  I think some people are left out, but many people just have a different thing in DSM V, not nothing.

 

But I think Aspergers is still a legitimate thing, it is just not called that in DSM V, but I don't think that people thinking of their kids as fitting into Aspergers is going away, whether it is the official diagnosis or not.  I think it is still useful and helpful.

 

So I think that Aspergers not being included in DSM V is not too much of an issue ---- and who knows, maybe it will come back in a later version.  Dyslexia is not in DSM V, either! 

 

To be honest -- I think it is very possible that an official diagnosis would not make much difference for *you.*  But I would encourage you to consider finding out for your daughter.  Maybe you would realize that some things could help her as she grows up.  Or -- maybe you can do that without taking her to get diagnosed.  But personally -- I think it is likely it does matter a lot for your daughter. 

 

I think a lot of parents would like things to be easier for their kids, I think that it may be an avenue for helping that happen.   

[PeterPan]

May I ask some questions? I'm increasingly thinking that I could possibly have Asperger's. It is possible that I don't have that, but I am certainly not normal. I do have some diagnoses — gifted and dyscalculia. The online checklists for Asperger's are mostly from a NT perspective, which makes it hard to get much further. I do think, for instance, that I have empathy. I am not a psychopath, and I don't that is what the diagnostic lists mean by a lack of empathy either. 

 

So, I'm weird. I personally think I am quite social, but making friends was a big problem when I was a child. Others sometimes (no, often) call me argumentative or critical, particularly at times when I am simply enthusiastically discussing things. I can't do small talk, or at least not very well since it does not come naturally. I prefer talking about ideas than about feelings and stuff.  

 

I'm forever told keep my voice down. Eye contact was a huge issue when I was younger. I am not bothered by labels in clothes, or loud noises though. I do find it very hard to focus on things that are not interesting to me, and I did have the obsessions when I was younger — though not the same one forever. I speak five languages fluently and a few more less fluently, and I have dyscalculia, so there is the weakness in one area while having a talent in another area. I work from home. I'd say I am a good team player but more so when the team stuff is not in person but online. 

 

This thread discussed the importance of getting a diagnosis. Whatever I have, my kids might well have too. I would say that whatever I have has impaired me. Could it "just" be giftedness and general weirdness? The thing is that we live in a country where mental health services are not readily accessible at all and mental health issues or neurological differences (or even physical disabilities) come with a huge stigma. So, I'd be content with a general self-diagnosis as long as that means we derive some benefit from that. 

There's a long form adult asperger's survey you can take online that will kick out a number.  Aspie-quiz - RDOS  I have no clue if it is actually reliable.  If you complete it, it suggests a range of labels that might apply.  

 

It is possible, according to what I've been told, to be an extrovert aspie.  People sometimes confuse their introversion with spectrum, when these are not always linked.  

 

I think, and I mean this really politely, that it would be really odd to expect that a person would figure out their aspie-ness on their own.  They would, by definition, need someone to point out to them they're missing things, and even then they may not realize they're missing things or doing things.  (speaking in monotone, missing social cues, etc.)  

 

I would not compare yourself to someone else's story, because it seems there's a broad variety of mixes and presentation that end up with spectrum labels.  You can have anxiety, no anxiety, yes adhd (of a variety of types), no hyperactivity but yes impulsivity, etc. etc.  

 

Because it represents a spectrum, there are a number of other less socially acceptable labels (less acceptable in christian circles, blah blah) that can apply even if you do have issues.  You can certainly pursue an eval with a psych who does adult spectrum (they can be found by googling) or a therapist for an informal diagnosis.  You just might end up with another label that didn't occur to you.  

 

Gifted children with Asperger's Syndrome - Davidson Institute  This link has a chart comparing gifted and gifted plus aspie symptoms.  If you were labeled as gifted, you might find it helpful.

 

AANE - Is it Asperger's or ADHD?

 

Adult ASD: Self-diagnosis or Professional Diagnosis? | Musings of ...  And here's a blog from a lady who pursued evals as an adult.

[Lecka]

Ideally -- the value of a therapist, is that they truly do know more and are more experienced, past what it is possible to get from reading on the Internet.  They have the first-hand experience, they have worked with many kids, they have seen kids over periods of time and seen how they develop -- so can have some perspective for things that might be maturity and may not be such a concern for that reason. 

 

But if the therapists are not going to be nice, I don't think there is a point. 

 

It sounds like -- if you just look at information about Aspergers, it might be able to do all that.  I am hearing a lot of good things about products from thinksocial.com although I have not used any.  But I am planning to use them in the future. 

 

If you would not be able to get something constructive -- I don't think there is a point in getting a diagnosis.  That is why I think a lot of adults don't need to do it -- what would change?   What would be the point? 

 

I think there is a danger, sometimes, too, for parents to over-generalize from their own experiences.  I think it is something to watch out for.  I think that is something where an outside person can help a lot.  But I think that with some vigilance a parent can strive to do that, also.  But it can be hard! 

[PeterPan]

I took that test and it said it was very likely I was an aspie. My mom found it linked on a British site, recommended by people who do have the diagnosis. She took it first and was also said to be likely to be an aspie. And... believe me that it is possible to know you're not conventional. For me for sure, but many of the stories I was reading online include accounts of being bullied throughout life. Society lets you know you are not one of them. I'd be interested to know if a person's self-awareness might be different if they are gifted as well as aspie or "just" aspie. But again, I am obviously just speculating and you're right that there could be other things that could apply. 

 

I had an eval with a psych in a European country a long time ago, which identified giftedness and dyscalculia. I believe this was before the Asperger's diagnosis was available. Wouldn't it have detected autistic issues if they were present even then? Since they weren't, does that mean that they are not present, or merely that they weren't looked for and therefore not identified? Even so, teachers and others told my mom there was "something" wrong with me throughout my school career. That should mean something, though it also made me feel incredibly bad. 

 

I'm familiar with the Davidson site, but thanks for reminding me that it exists. I already looked on SENG today and didn't find that much.

Ok, here's my problem.  That quiz pops out numbers and then a range of labels that could go with it.  (OCD, bipolar, aspie, etc.)  People latch onto it and go yeah, the aspie quiz said I'm aspie.  Then those people go take a face quiz like the one that was floating around on FB recently and they have perfect (or almost perfect) scores for reading expressions.  This doesn't seem reasonable to me, kwim?

 

I think it's much more telling if you ask your *spouse* to fill out the online quiz.  (unless obviously your spouse misses social cues, then that won't work, lol)

[PeterPan]

And reading this, it appears that giftedness with some aspie traits is more likely than full-on Asperger's. 

Have you ever been in with a group of gifted people to know if you are unusual in a pool of your peers?  

[Lecka]

No -- if your exam was in the past -- it would not have identified autistic issues.  My cousin is very effected, and he was taken to numerous specialists and evaluations, and never had any mention of any autistic symptoms prior to the time he was diagnosed with autism.  He always had them, though, if he were a child now he would certainly be identified.  He is 36 now. 

 

I mean -- maybe it would have.  But it would not be surprising at all, if someone did have them, for them not to be identified. 

 

No one was looking for them, if that makes sense.  There is a book called Unstrange Minds --- I think it is a little controversial, but I like it.  The author makes a point that we can't know if there is an epidemic of autism, when no one was looking for it before. 

 

I also have an impression, but just an impression, that a fair number of gifted people also have characteristics of Aspergers ----- enough that I would not be comfortable with saying "well I am similar to some other gifted individuals who are over 25 years old" and just assume ---- that none of them had any signs of Aspergers, either.  I think I am extreme in my view that way ---- it is just a personal opinion I have.  I realize it is a stretch in a lot of ways. 

[PeterPan]

No -- if your exam was in the past -- it would not have identified autistic issues.  My cousin is very effected, and he was taken to numerous specialists and evaluations, and never had any mention of any autistic symptoms prior to the time he was diagnosed with autism.  He always had them, though, if he were a child now he would certainly be identified.  He is 36 now. 

 

I mean -- maybe it would have.  But it would not be surprising at all, if someone did have them, for them not to be identified. 

 

No one was looking for them, if that makes sense.  There is a book called Unstrange Minds --- I think it is a little controversial, but I like it.  The author makes a point that we can't know if there is an epidemic of autism, when no one was looking for it before. 

 

I also have an impression, but just an impression, that a fair number of gifted people also have characteristics of Aspergers ----- enough that I would not be comfortable with saying "well I am similar to some other gifted individuals who are over 25 years old" and just assume ---- that none of them had any signs of Aspergers, either.  I think I am extreme in my view that way ---- it is just a personal opinion I have.  I realize it is a stretch in a lot of ways. 

Ok, I want to disagree with that last part a bit.  I went to a school for the gifted (residential, 300 kids, 2 years), and I think that list at the link I gave you comparing aspie gifted vs. regular gifted is pretty reasonable.  

[texasmama]

I have known many extroverted people with Aspergers.   In fact, most of the people I know to have Aspergers are extroverted, which would match the stats in the general population.  I do not see a relationship between introversion/extroversion and Aspergers at all - and I am very interested in and knowledgeable about both of these.

[PeterPan]

Yes I have, but giftedness is also obviously a spectrum. That makes it hard to determine how unusual or usual you are. I'd certainly say that I am less unusual in a group of gifted people than in society at large. I am also multicultural, which definitely adds to the feeling and fact of being unusual. All in all, it is very hard to see what causes different personality traits, behaviors, etc. 

 

My spouse is dead, so he can't fill out any quizzes. He was, however, as unusual as I am. Thinking back to the way he was, I am also wondering if he might have been an aspie. But he had mental health evaluations regularly, as he was in law enforcement. Even in this country, I would assume something might have been picked up. 

Does Sherlock in the new BBC series seem normal to you?

[8filltheheart]

My 2 obviously gifted children have zero characteristics in common with their high IQ Aspie brother.   People sitting behind us at church not knowing anything about our family at all can tell that our ds is not normal.   Not so when he was younger, but the behaviors now as an adult are just plain odd. He picks at himself constantly.   He sticks his hands up in his face as if examining them for some detail.   He tries to pick up his little sister when she is obviously telling him no.

 

Conversely, if you were just introduced to him sight unseen and only talked with him for a few minutes, you would probably not be able to tell.   He likes to talk.  He will make eye contact for brief periods of time.   He is very friendly.

 

But, he is also crippled by anxiety.   He can be very socially inappropriate and has zero sense of personal space.   He cannot tell the difference between kindness and mocking.   He can think someone is being a great friend when it is very apparent that they are using him.   He has no sense of "compatibility."   You know how most people tend to seek out relationships with people fairly similar to themselves.   Not him.   He will go for the most gorgeous female present completely unphased by the fact that they are not in the same "playing field" and that she is staring at him with disdain.

 

Anyway, gifted people can be on the spectrum.   But being gifted does not mean you are.   Being on the spectrum equally does not mean you are gifted.   (We are acquainted with many adult Aspies that do not have extremely high IQs)  

[PeterPan]

I also know of aspies who *aren't* to that extreme, who do hold jobs, etc. etc., so there is variety.