You know all that child tax credit they gave you early?

[Sneezyone]

Just now, Clarita said:

There is no mail for this. It is up to the filer to figure out and estimate.

There were MULTIPLE letters to filers about the child tax credits.

[frogger]

I can bitch as much as I want to bitch. You can get off the thread if you don't like it.

 

Our tax system is obscene by any countries standards. They already have all your info. They should just send you a bill but lobbyist make sure that doesn't happen. 

 

And you are just wrong. You don't need to sell a thing. If you don't make sure you with hold enough they will tack on a penalty. 

[frogger]

3 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

There were MULTIPLE letters to filers about the child tax credits.

Actually, I didn't get mine. Only my husband did and I had to go seek mine out. 

But she wasn't talking about child tax credits. 

[Sneezyone]

3 minutes ago, frogger said:

I can bitch as much as I want to bitch. You can get off the thread if you don't like it.

 

Our tax system is obscene by any countries standards. They already have all your info. They should just send you a bill but lobbyist make sure that doesn't happen. 

 

And you are just wrong. You don't need to sell a thing. If you don't make sure you with hold enough they will tack on a penalty. 

Are you kidding me right now? The last POTUS REQUIRED us to accept the tax 'holiday' he and his minions devised.  We had, literally, no choice and had to pay it back in 52 monthly installments. Pls. don't tell me how messed up the system is. I'm 150% positive you approved of those shenanigans. *I* stayed on top of it and adjusted accordingly, no one else.

Edited March 22, 2022 by Sneezyone

[Sneezyone]

3 minutes ago, frogger said:

I can bitch as much as I want to bitch. You can get off the thread if you don't like it.

 

Our tax system is obscene by any countries standards. They already have all your info. They should just send you a bill but lobbyist make sure that doesn't happen. 

And you are just wrong. You don't need to sell a thing. If you don't make sure you with hold enough they will tack on a penalty. 

This thread is about the child tax credits. There were multiple notices.

[Sneezyone]

2 minutes ago, frogger said:

Actually, I didn't get mine. Only my husband did and I had to go seek mine out. 

But she wasn't talking about child tax credits. 

So, your HOUSEHOLD received at least one notice?

[frogger]

1 minute ago, Sneezyone said:

Are you kidding me right now? The last POTUS REQUIRED us to accept the tax 'holiday' he and his minions devised.  We had, literally, no choice and had to pay it back in 52 monthly installments. Pls. don't tell me how messed up the system is. I'm 150% positive you approved of those shenanigans.

That is what this is all about. You protecting Biden's every move. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

I've been complaining about taxes long before Biden was president or even VP. 

 

[AnotherNewName]

10 minutes ago, Clarita said:

That's not true. There are certain things that you have to pay estimated taxes for quarterly and will be penalized if you don't. One example would be when you" sell a valuable asset", which includes things like stock. Stocks are a potential area where it can get complicated in terms of a sale or earning is counted against you even when in some cases you did not actually receive an "actual" payout. An easy example is when companies give their employees discounted stocks, that discount counts toward you "making money" even though there was not an actual cash payout.

 

The discount is compensation and should be taxed accordingly.  And if you happen to sell the stock below the discount price you do get to claim the loss. We have to pay quarterly taxes and it isn't that difficult to find software to help handle it.

[Bootsie]

3 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

AGAIN...ppl who are at the UPPER end of the tax bracket eligible for the credits who should be paying attention anyway. If you sell a valuable asset (as we are) and don't shield the proceeds in a trust or LLC or pay taxes on the gains, that's on *you* not the IRS.

So annoyed with the bitching. Open your damn mail. Read it. Save it. Research it. Problem solved.

There are many reasons why ordinary people can find themselves in a situation that they owe more taxes than they thought they would and have not paid enough in quarterly withholding.  My mother only receives a state retirement pension and has a very small IRA from which she take the minimum distribution.  A few years ago the state messed up and paid January's pension the last day in December because of a holiday; that resulted in her taxable income be larger than expected and created headaches.  Every year I have her small minimum distribution 100% withheld so that she does not run into a penalty problem for not having enough holding, but in 2020 there was no minimum distribution required; so, she didn't have that money in withholding (and her only additional income was US govt stimulus checks) and she owed more in taxes than expected and almost ran into a penalty situation.  DH tried to begin drawing Social Security several years ago.  There was over a year delay in getting the paperwork processed (he had to get our Congressman to intervene--which his office says they do all the time, which does not give me great trust in the SS system), when Social Security finally paid, they send one large check for the past 15 months of SS payments--that really messed up our withholding and income for the year.  These are not things we could shield in a trust or LLC.  

[Sneezyone]

2 minutes ago, Bootsie said:

There are many reasons why ordinary people can find themselves in a situation that they owe more taxes than they thought they would and have not paid enough in quarterly withholding.  My mother only receives a state retirement pension and has a very small IRA from which she take the minimum distribution.  A few years ago the state messed up and paid January's pension the last day in December because of a holiday; that resulted in her taxable income be larger than expected and created headaches.  Every year I have her small minimum distribution 100% withheld so that she does not run into a penalty problem for not having enough holding, but in 2020 there was no minimum distribution required; so, she didn't have that money in withholding (and her only additional income was US govt stimulus checks) and she owed more in taxes than expected and almost ran into a penalty situation.  DH tried to begin drawing Social Security several years ago.  There was over a year delay in getting the paperwork processed (he had to get our Congressman to intervene--which his office says they do all the time, which does not give me great trust in the SS system), when Social Security finally paid, they send one large check for the past 15 months of SS payments--that really messed up our withholding and income for the year.  These are not things we could shield in a trust or LLC.  

What does this have to do with national tax policy? Mistakes will happen, delays will happen. I don't see anyone denying that. This is about the suggestion of systematic unfairness when tax payments are due. SS is another issue.

Edited March 22, 2022 by Sneezyone

[Bootsie]

1 minute ago, Sneezyone said:

What does this have to do with national tax policy? Mistakes will happen, delays will happen. I don't see anyone denying that. This is about the suggestion of systematic unfairness when tax payments are due. SS is another issue.

The SS mistake caused issues with federal income taxes.  The point is that people can find themselves in a penalty situation, not having paid enough in quarterly taxes or withholding, fairly easily.  Yes, mistakes happen.  I do have a problem with a federal tax code that penalizes taxpayers when someone else makes a mistake and it causes a taxpayer to be in a penalty situation.  It is especially aggravating when it is part of the federal government (social security) that makes the mistake and cause a tax penalty for taxpayer.  

[Sneezyone]

38 minutes ago, Bootsie said:

The SS mistake caused issues with federal income taxes.  The point is that people can find themselves in a penalty situation, not having paid enough in quarterly taxes or withholding, fairly easily.  Yes, mistakes happen.  I do have a problem with a federal tax code that penalizes taxpayers when someone else makes a mistake and it causes a taxpayer to be in a penalty situation.  It is especially aggravating when it is part of the federal government (social security) that makes the mistake and cause a tax penalty for taxpayer.  

The child tax credit wasn't a 'MISTAKE' it was an announced, publicized, change. Failure to pay attention to that is on the taxpayer. I will say that I disagree with the tax gimmicks employed that hurt our ability to plan. I just didn't see a huge hue and cry when we were forced to accept those gimmicks and PAY THEM BACK against our will. Goose==gander.

Edited March 22, 2022 by Sneezyone

[frogger]

3 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

What does this have to do with national tax policy? Mistakes will happen, delays will happen. I don't see anyone denying that. This is about the suggestion of systematic unfairness when tax payments are due. SS is another issue.

Because threads never wander from the OP whatsoever. Therefore we are not allowed to mention a tax penalty for not withholding enough. We are supposed to check our taxes constantly and spend many man hours on it because that makes the USA a better place to live and above all "Quit bitching." Lol

And it must be the last president's fault because it can't be this. Certainly someone can't believe the IRS has become a ridiculous tangled mess over decades.

[Sneezyone]

Just now, frogger said:

Because threads never wander from the OP whatsoever. Therefore we are not allowed to mention a tax penalty for not withholding enough. We are supposed to check our taxes constantly and spend many man hours on it because that makes the USA a better place to live and above all "Quit bitching." Lol

And it must be the last president's fault because it can't be this. Certainly someone can't believe the IRS has become a ridiculous tangled mess over decades.

LOL. Lady, you don't pay enough attention to your finances and national fiscal policy and so you're blaming others. Gotcha.

[frogger]

1 minute ago, Sneezyone said:

LOL. Lady, you don't pay enough attention to your finances and national fiscal policy and so you're blaming others. Gotcha.

I had no problems with the child tax thing but you really should stick to the original topic. 

[Sneezyone]

Just now, frogger said:

I had no problems with the child tax thing but you really should stick to the original topic. 

*YOU* deviated. Not me. Keep trying.

[frogger]

1 minute ago, Sneezyone said:

*YOU* deviated. Not me. Keep trying.

But I'm not the topic Nazi. 😁

[Sneezyone]

2 minutes ago, frogger said:

But I'm not the topic Nazi. 😁

From 'Pitch Perfect', not a good enough reason to employ the word 'Nazi'. At the end of the day, each of us is responsible for our finances, for reading the correspondence we receive and acting accordingly.  The last admin did a serious number on my family and we had to repay, every month, the 'gift' we were given. No one gave a damn. The idea that folks are now up in arms over a credit they were informed about, in detail, several times, here and elsewhere in national media is just...cray.

Edited March 22, 2022 by Sneezyone

[frogger]

2 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

From 'Pitch Perfect', not a good enough reason to employ the word 'Nazi'.

Enforcer. The topic enforcer. 

 

Oh dang. You are really off topic now. 

[Sneezyone]

1 minute ago, frogger said:

Enforcer. The topic enforcer. 

 

Oh dang. You are really off topic now. 

Not helping yourself.

[frogger]

To everyone else, sorry to derail your thread. This is not the best side of me.

 

Sneezyone probably doesn't even realize I wasn't the original person she attacked. After a year of anti mask, disrespecting private property and employees, crazies at the assembly meeting and all the other garbage I saw, I'm just fed up with bullies. I used to have more patience but when she got on and started attacking everyone I gave in and let myself attack. 

Just so tired of bullies. I will not disrupt your thread again though. 

Edited March 22, 2022 by frogger

[Sneezyone]

1 minute ago, frogger said:

To everyone else, sorry to derail your thread. This is not the best side of me.

 

Sneezyone probably doesn't even realize I wasn't the original person she attacked. After a year of anti mask anti-vax, disrespecting employees and all the other garbage I saw, I'm just fed up with bullies. I used to have more patience but when she got on and started attacking everyone I gave in and let myself attack. 

Just so tired of bullies. I will not disrupt your thread again though. 

PUH-lease. I am not your bully or tormentor or 'nazi'. I offered a critique of your SUPREMELY limited perspective. Your household received a notice that you ignored/discounted or didn't understand. You suffered as a result. That sucks. The message should have been clarified so you'd understand it. That's not an attack from a 'bully'. You really need to get out more.

[Frances]

1 hour ago, Bootsie said:

The SS mistake caused issues with federal income taxes.  The point is that people can find themselves in a penalty situation, not having paid enough in quarterly taxes or withholding, fairly easily.  Yes, mistakes happen.  I do have a problem with a federal tax code that penalizes taxpayers when someone else makes a mistake and it causes a taxpayer to be in a penalty situation.  It is especially aggravating when it is part of the federal government (social security) that makes the mistake and cause a tax penalty for taxpayer.  

I would encourage anyone in this situation to apply for a penalty waiver.

[Frances]

1 hour ago, frogger said:

Because threads never wander from the OP whatsoever. Therefore we are not allowed to mention a tax penalty for not withholding enough. We are supposed to check our taxes constantly and spend many man hours on it because that makes the USA a better place to live and above all "Quit bitching." Lol

And it must be the last president's fault because it can't be this. Certainly someone can't believe the IRS has become a ridiculous tangled mess over decades.

The IRS does not set tax policy, legislatures do, highly influenced by lobbyists. They are also the ones that have chronically underfunded it. 

[TechWife]

2 hours ago, frogger said:

There is a penalty for not with holding enough regardless of child tax credits.

Only if you don’t pay what you owe before the April 15 filing deadline. If you did not have enough withheld from your paycheck in 2021 and any credits due you do not pay the taxes in full, then you will owe the balance on your taxes, which you must pay by April 15, the due date. If you do not pay by April 15, then you will be penalized. You will get a separate letter from the IRS with the amount due for taxes and the penalty amount you have to pay. 

if you complete and file your tax return and there is an error in return and you owe more money than you thought you did, then you will get a letter from the IRS with the details and you will be expected to pay both the remaining tax amount owed and a late payment penalty. 

If you are self employed and pay quarterly, then your deadline is each quarter. 

Basically, if you do something wrong you pay a penalty. If you didn’t, then you don’t. Paying taxes  in addition what was withheld from your paycheck is not a penalty. It’s just paying your taxes.

Bear with me for a soapbox moment, and addressed to no one in particular,  (clears throat)…

Folks, taxes are good things. They pay for a lot of stuff that benefits everyone. Things like the military, air traffic control, the federal court system, USDA meat inspectors and much more. These are things that affect our every day lives. Are there inefficiencies in government? Absolutely.  is our tax system sometimes overly complicated? Sure thing. Get involved on a local level and work your way up. Advocate for tax changes that are important to you. At the same time, keep in mind that paying taxes isn’t about individuals, it’s about all of us, so we don’t always get what we want. 

Stepping down, now. Thank you for coming to my TED talk. 

Edited March 22, 2022 by TechWife

[frogger]

4 minutes ago, TechWife said:

Only if you don’t pay what you owe before the April 15 filing deadline. If you did not have enough withheld from your paycheck in 2021 and any credits due you do not pay the taxes in full, then you will owe the balance on your taxes, which you must pay by April 15, the due date. If you do not pay by April 15, then you will be penalized. You will get a separate letter from the IRS with the amount due for taxes and the penalty amount you have to pay. 

if you complete and file your tax return and there is an error in return and you owe more money than you thought you did, then you will get a letter from the IRS with the details and you will be expected to pay both the remaining tax amount owed and a late payment penalty. 

If you are self employed and pay quarterly, then your deadline is each quarter. 

Basically, if you do something wrong you pay a penalty. If you didn’t, then you don’t. Paying taxes  in addition what was withheld from your paycheck is not a penalty. It’s just paying your taxes.

Bear with me for a soapbox moment, and addressed to no one in particular,  (clears throat)…

Folks, taxes are good things. They pay for a lot of stuff that benefits everyone. Things like the military, air traffic control, the federal court system, USDA meat inspectors and much more. These are things that affect our every day lives. Are there inefficiencies in government? Absolutely.  is our tax system sometimes overly complicated? Sure thing. Get involved on a local level and work your way up. Advocate for tax changes that are important to you. At the same time, keep in mind that paying taxes isn’t about individuals, it’s about all of us, so we don’t always get what we want. 

Stepping down, now. Thank you for coming to my TED talk. 

Well, about 5 years ago we discovered the hard way that you can get a penalty for not withholding enough. We always do taxes in February and always pay in full right away. 

 

[Sneezyone]

Just now, frogger said:

Well, about 5 years ago we discovered the hard way that you can get a penalty for not withholding enough. We always do taxes in February and always pay in full right away. 

 

JUST SAY IT. You make too much as an EMPLOYER and underestimate...regularly. That's fixable. Hire someone.

[frogger]

Just now, Sneezyone said:

JUST SAY IT. You make too much as an EMPLOYER and underestimate...regularly. That's fixable. Hire someone.

I probably should ignore you but I will say we just had a plain old W-2. We have never owned a business. 

[Sneezyone]

2 minutes ago, frogger said:

I probably should ignore you but I will say we just had a plain old W-2. We have never owned a business. 

HIRE SOMEONE. It's not that hard. We have never had anything other than 1099 or w-2 income and *NEVER* owed in 24 years.

Edited March 22, 2022 by Sneezyone

[frogger]

Just now, Sneezyone said:

HIRE SOMEONE. It's not that hard. 

Well, now that we KNOW that you have to make sure to withhold enough, we simply don't let it happen. We are actually getting a refund this year. So we gave the Fed's a free loan off our single income. 🤨

I don't understand why you are making so many assumptions.

 

[Bootsie]

7 minutes ago, TechWife said:

Only if you don’t pay what you owe before the April 15 filing deadline. If you did not have enough withheld from your paycheck in 2021 and any credits due you do not pay the taxes in full, then you will owe the balance on your taxes, which you must pay by April 15, the due date. If you do not pay by April 15, then you will be penalized. You will get a separate letter from the IRS with the amount due for taxes and the penalty amount you have to pay. 

if you complete and file your tax return and there is an error in return and you owe more money than you thought you did, then you will get a letter from the IRS with the details and you will be expected to pay both the remaining tax amount owed and a late payment penalty. 

If you are self employed and pay quarterly, then your deadline is each quarter. 

Basically, if you do something wrong you pay a penalty. If you didn’t, then you don’t. Paying taxes  in addition what was withheld from your paycheck is not a penalty. It’s just paying your taxes.

Bear with me for a soapbox moment, and addressed to no one in particular,  (clears throat)…

Folks, taxes are good things. They pay for a lot of stuff that benefits everyone. Things like the military, air traffic control, the federal court system, USDA meat inspectors and much more. These are things that affect our every day lives. Are there inefficiencies in government? Absolutely.  is our tax system sometimes overly complicated? Sure thing. Get involved on a local level and work your way up. Advocate for tax changes that are important to you. At the same time, keep in mind that paying taxes isn’t about individuals, it’s about all of us, so we don’t always get what we want. 

Stepping down, now. Thank you for coming to my TED talk. 

This is an oversimplification.  You CAN file and pay your taxes before April 15 and owe a penalty.  You do not have to be self-employed for this to happen.  You do not have to have done anything wrong for this to happen.  In fact, someone else can do something wrong and throw you into this category.  And it is not limited to high income people or people with highly complicated tax situations.  Losing a job and receiving unemployment benefits, having a death in the family, a mid-year tax law change, and other events can trigger this type of situation.  Many of the people I have known who have had this happen are elderly and not affluent.  

[frogger]

16 minutes ago, TechWife said:

Only if you don’t pay what you owe before the April 15 filing deadline. If you did not have enough withheld from your paycheck in 2021 and any credits due you do not pay the taxes in full, then you will owe the balance on your taxes, which you must pay by April 15, the due date. If you do not pay by April 15, then you will be penalized. You will get a separate letter from the IRS with the amount due for taxes and the penalty amount you have to pay. 

if you complete and file your tax return and there is an error in return and you owe more money than you thought you did, then you will get a letter from the IRS with the details and you will be expected to pay both the remaining tax amount owed and a late payment penalty. 

If you are self employed and pay quarterly, then your deadline is each quarter. 

Basically, if you do something wrong you pay a penalty. If you didn’t, then you don’t. Paying taxes  in addition what was withheld from your paycheck is not a penalty. It’s just paying your taxes.

Bear with me for a soapbox moment, and addressed to no one in particular,  (clears throat)…

Folks, taxes are good things. They pay for a lot of stuff that benefits everyone. Things like the military, air traffic control, the federal court system, USDA meat inspectors and much more. These are things that affect our every day lives. Are there inefficiencies in government? Absolutely.  is our tax system sometimes overly complicated? Sure thing. Get involved on a local level and work your way up. Advocate for tax changes that are important to you. At the same time, keep in mind that paying taxes isn’t about individuals, it’s about all of us, so we don’t always get what we want. 

Stepping down, now. Thank you for coming to my TED talk. 

Taxes are overly complicated for two reasons.

A) lobbyists from tax preparers

B) It helps the wealthy find loopholes

I never said I didn't believe in taxes at all. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 22, 2022 by frogger

[Sneezyone]

1 minute ago, frogger said:

Well, now that we KNOW that you have to make sure to withhold enough, we simply don't let it happen. We are actually getting a refund this year. So we gave the Fed's a free loan off our single income. 🤨

I don't understand why you are making so many assumptions.

 

Maybe because you posited that a) the feds didn't adequately notify filers of the child tax credit changes, b) it was no fault f the filers (who had ZERO idea of changes) and c) it was all a Biden scam?

 

Just now, Bootsie said:

This is an oversimplification.  You CAN file and pay your taxes before April 15 and owe a penalty.  You do not have to be self-employed for this to happen.  You do not have to have done anything wrong for this to happen.  In fact, someone else can do something wrong and throw you into this category.  And it is not limited to high income people or people with highly complicated tax situations.  Losing a job and receiving unemployment benefits, having a death in the family, a mid-year tax law change, and other events can trigger this type of situation.  Many of the people I have known who have had this happen are elderly and not affluent.  

OF COURSE. These are still more complicated situations than the typical poster here is dealing with.

[frogger]

1 minute ago, Sneezyone said:

Maybe because you posited that a) the feds didn't adequately notify filers of the child tax credit changes, b) it was no fault f the filers (who had ZERO idea of changes) and c) it was all a Biden scam?

 

OF COURSE. These are still more complicated situations than the typical poster here is dealing with.

Can you quote me where I said all these things please. 

[Clarita]

1 hour ago, Sneezyone said:

There were MULTIPLE letters to filers about the child tax credits.

For the record I was just trying to state that there are instances where the IRS does levy penalties on taxes you didn't pay prior to April 15. 

 

1 hour ago, AnotherNewName said:

And if you happen to sell the stock below the discount price you do get to claim the loss.

I am not OK with forcing people to take a loss on potential investment just to make their tax bill. Mostly because this affects the middle class way more than it does the rich, because even without loophole that they can employ at the very least they can cover this with cash and hold out until the stocks are profitable again.

[Sneezyone]

I said" Maybe because you posited that a) the feds didn't adequately notify filers of the child tax credit changes, b) it was no fault of the filers (who had ZERO idea of changes) and c) it was all a Biden scam?"

29 minutes ago, frogger said:

Can you quote me where I said all these things please. 

YEP. Sure thing.

2 hours ago, frogger said:

Actually, I didn't get mine. Only my husband did and I had to go seek mine out. 

Unless you are in separate households and never communicate, you (plural) received notice.

2 hours ago, frogger said:

That is what this is all about. You protecting Biden's every move. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Not sure how Biden played in, at all, but that was your statement. At the end of the day, the penalties that affected me preceded him and the ones that benefitted me did not. Again, the changes were accompanied by lots of notice as you, yourself, acknowledged. Perhaps we have very different notions of what it means to be 'middle class'.

Edited March 22, 2022 by Sneezyone

[Sneezyone]

22 minutes ago, Clarita said:

For the record I was just trying to state that there are instances where the IRS does levy penalties on taxes you didn't pay prior to April 15. 

 

I am not OK with forcing people to take a loss on potential investment just to make their tax bill. Mostly because this affects the middle class way more than it does the rich, because even without loophole that they can employ at the very least they can cover this with cash and hold out until the stocks are profitable again.

Gotcha. The circumstances for which individual and married household filers owe are limited tho and, perhaps, overrepresented here.

[Sneezyone]

45 minutes ago, Bootsie said:

This is an oversimplification.  You CAN file and pay your taxes before April 15 and owe a penalty.  You do not have to be self-employed for this to happen.  You do not have to have done anything wrong for this to happen.  In fact, someone else can do something wrong and throw you into this category.  And it is not limited to high income people or people with highly complicated tax situations.  Losing a job and receiving unemployment benefits, having a death in the family, a mid-year tax law change, and other events can trigger this type of situation.  Many of the people I have known who have had this happen are elderly and not affluent.  

Do *any* of these situations apply to the complaints you see here? Are any of these complaints related to unannounced or unpublicized issues? This  thread was about wholly the child tax credit that was widely publicized and discussed here and in mainstream media coverage/publications. It goes without saying that other situations may complicate matters.

Edited March 22, 2022 by Sneezyone

[frogger]

2 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

I said" Maybe because you posited that a) the feds didn't adequately notify filers of the child tax credit changes, b) it was no fault of the filers (who had ZERO idea of changes) and c) it was all a Biden scam?"

YEP. Sure thing.

Unless you are in separate households and never communicate, you (plural) received notice.

Not sure how Biden played in, at all, but that was your statement. At the end of the day, the penalties that affected me preceded him and the ones that benefitted me did not. Again, the changes were accompanied by lots of notice as you, yourself, acknowledged.

That doesn't say Biden was to blame at all.  I was laughing at your protecting him. You just started protecting him for no reason so I thought it was funny and responded. I couldn't figure out why you'd say that. So no, that had nothing to do with blaming Biden.

The penalty I paid was years ago. I was simply stating that it is wrong in general to have to pay a penalty even if you pay your bill before it is due. I was sympathizing with someone else. Someone who may have been busy with life rather than constantly monitoring their tax withholding. 

I did state that my letter didn't come. I didn't say I didn't go find mine. If a single parent working all the time missed the letter they would have not been notified by mail. I get ticked that some low wage worker (not me) has to hire someone to make sure their taxes are right throughout the year to not get penalized. It is simply wrong. 

People always assume I am talking about myself when I say something is wrong. maybe because that is all they do. Just like so many assumed I wore a mask because I was scared of getting COVID. Really I was trying to protect hospital capacity and those at risk. 

Complicated taxes only benefit the wealthy. There is zero benefit to wanting complicated taxes if you aren't looking for loopholes. 

Penalizing people for not monitoring their with holdings all year long is also wrong. Dad died. What is the first thing we have to do? Check our with holdings. 🙄 Yeah, I'm sure that is the first thing people think of. 

 

 

 

[frogger]

Why did I start replying? 

What a sucker I am. 

Goodnight

[Bootsie]

7 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

Do *any* of these situations apply to the complaints you see here? Are any of them unannounced or unpublicized? This  thread was about wholly the child tax credit that was widely publicized and discussed here and in mainstream media coverage/publications. It goes without saying that other situations may complicate matters.

I was responding to a particular post that was part of this conversation.  In particular I was responding to "Basically, if you do something wrong you pay a penalty. If you didn’t, then you don’t."  This, and comments that people have made that if you pay your 2021 taxes by April 15 you cannot owe a penalty, are not correct.  People can be in a situation of having to pay a penalty, not because they did anything careless or wrong, but simply because they were guilty of not correctly predicting their future.  

[Sneezyone]

20 minutes ago, frogger said:

That doesn't say Biden was to blame at all.  I was laughing at your protecting him. You just started protecting him for no reason so I thought it was funny and responded. I couldn't figure out why you'd say that. So no, that had nothing to do with blaming Biden.

The penalty I paid was years ago. I was simply stating that it is wrong in general to have to pay a penalty even if you pay your bill before it is due. I was sympathizing with someone else. Someone who may have been busy with life rather than constantly monitoring their tax withholding. 

I did state that my letter didn't come. I didn't say I didn't go find mine. If a single parent working all the time missed the letter they would have not been notified by mail. I get ticked that some low wage worker (not me) has to hire someone to make sure their taxes are right throughout the year to not get penalized. It is simply wrong. 

People always assume I am talking about myself when I say something is wrong. maybe because that is all they do. Just like so many assumed I wore a mask because I was scared of getting COVID. Really I was trying to protect hospital capacity and those at risk. 

Complicated taxes only benefit the wealthy. There is zero benefit to wanting complicated taxes if you aren't looking for loopholes. 

Penalizing people for not monitoring their with holdings all year long is also wrong. Dad died. What is the first thing we have to do? Check our with holdings. 🙄 Yeah, I'm sure that is the first thing people think of. 

 

 

 

Ma’am, I know a single Mom who pays far more attention to her IRS mail than you did. Why? Because it matters to that individual. Nowhere, in ANY post I made did I mention the name BIDEN, you did. You’re projecting. I can assure you that when my relatives die, the last thing I do is check their withholdings but those aren’t the people at issue here, dads with zero dependent children. Stop moving the goalposts. I agree that the tax code benefits the wealthy. I do not think we agree on what wealthy means. Wealthy is not paying a bit of attention to tax policy/mail until you have to pay.

Edited March 22, 2022 by Sneezyone

[Sneezyone]

1 minute ago, Bootsie said:

I was responding to a particular post that was part of this conversation.  In particular I was responding to "Basically, if you do something wrong you pay a penalty. If you didn’t, then you don’t."  This, and comments that people have made that if you pay your 2021 taxes by April 15 you cannot owe a penalty, are not correct.  People can be in a situation of having to pay a penalty, not because they did anything careless or wrong, but simply because they were guilty of not correctly predicting their future.  

Well, with those SPECIFIC points I agree. They were, however made WRT THE CHILD TAX CREDIT and not every possible tax scenario in the US.

[Clarita]

1 hour ago, Sneezyone said:

This thread was about wholly the child tax credit that was widely publicized and discussed here and in mainstream media coverage/publications.

Well on the child credit front, they shouldn't have sent it to as many people as they did. If they knew it was going to be so complicated that they sent multiple letters about it, why do it. Doesn't make a lick of sense why my family got one, because we are nowhere near being qualified for the program. I absolutely feel for the families that are closer to the limit for which the money made a difference for them and are now realizing they have to pay it back.

42 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

I know a single Mom who oays far more attention to her IRS mail than you did.

My issue is she shouldn't have to. 

I am not livid on my own behalf but on those who are less fortunate. I do hire someone for my taxes, who helps us assess our taxes on a quarterly basis. 

The way too complicated taxes have been around for many decades so, I don't blame any particular recent presidents on it. 

42 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

I can assure you that when my relatives die, the last thing I do is check their withholdings but those aren’t the people cobcjectibv here, dad had zero dependent children.

If someone close to you dies there is a lot of paperwork and things, you have to do in the following days and months. Usually all that falls on the spouse and/or the executor of the estate (I don't know what happens if neither of those exists). I have witnessed more than one spouse having to make phone calls and deal with these logistics through their tears. You are really lucky to not have been in a position to have to make sure all the ducks are in a row during your grief. It is not a choice people get to make, especially in an unexpected death. 

[Frances]

1 hour ago, Bootsie said:

I was responding to a particular post that was part of this conversation.  In particular I was responding to "Basically, if you do something wrong you pay a penalty. If you didn’t, then you don’t."  This, and comments that people have made that if you pay your 2021 taxes by April 15 you cannot owe a penalty, are not correct.  People can be in a situation of having to pay a penalty, not because they did anything careless or wrong, but simply because they were guilty of not correctly predicting their future.  

But also quite likely to qualify for a penalty waiver, unless they have unpredictable things happening regularly.

[Frances]

1 hour ago, Clarita said:

Well on the child credit front, they shouldn't have sent it to as many people as they did. If they knew it was going to be so complicated that they sent multiple letters about it, why do it. Doesn't make a lick of sense why my family got one, because we are nowhere near being qualified for the program. I absolutely feel for the families that are closer to the limit for which the money made a difference for them and are now realizing they have to pay it back.

My issue is she shouldn't have to. 

It seems like you are confusing the people who made the policy with those charged with carrying out the policy in the middle of a pandemic with limited resources and reduced staffing.

Plus, many people’s financial situation changed pretty drastically, at least for a period of time, during the pandemic. There were likely people who wouldn’t have qualified before the pandemic, but then did qualify.
Also, the rules for who qualifies as a dependent for various reasons (child tax credit, EITC, etc.) are not uniform and so even under normal circumstances, result in many of these returns getting reviewed. And again, this is due to how the laws were written, not due to the IRS purposely making things complicated.

I think people need to stop and think about all of the extra work the IRS was asked to take on during the pandemic while dealing with their own staffing disruptions. They also went into the pandemic very underfunded. When you need to turn things around on a dime and get lots of checks and notices out the door in a hurry is when old, outdated computer systems and low staffing are especially problematic. We saw the same thing with many state’s unemployment systems during the pandemic.

https://time.com/6076654/irs-struggles-child-tax-credit/

 

 

Edited March 22, 2022 by Frances

[Carrie12345]

2 hours ago, Clarita said:

Well on the child credit front, they shouldn't have sent it to as many people as they did. If they knew it was going to be so complicated that they sent multiple letters about it, why do it. Doesn't make a lick of sense why my family got one, because we are nowhere near being qualified for the program. I absolutely feel for the families that are closer to the limit for which the money made a difference for them and are now realizing they have to pay it back

I mean… I guess I feel for them in a “this sucks” kinda way, but the numbers were available everywhere. I ran the math multiple times. We were in the $-50/1,000 zone based on 2019 taxes, knowing our 2020 income was lower, and expecting our 2021 to look like 2020. And then we found out about a large sum of money, but didn’t know whether it would come in 2021 or 2022. It wound up being the last few days of November. 😑 

So it was a hassle. But we knew what the qualifying income limits were, knew what our income was, knew that we were technically in a phase out that could be reversed when filing 2021, THEN knew we had a timing issue that could re-reverse that, and then we did.

The phase out began at $75/112.5/150k and the top out was at 200/400k. I really don’t see how the hypothetical “families that are closer to the limit”, with 400k+, are being thought of in terms of “the money made a difference for them”. If a family making over $33k/mo was depending on that $250/mo, they’ve got problems.
If they were making under $150k and received an unexpected windfall to hit the limit, they’ve got the money to put back.  If they just inched over the $150k, they don’t owe the whole thing.
Just mail the check.

Even if you want to take a single mom of 3 making $112,500 who got a surprise $5k holiday bonus at the end of the year, she owes $750 out of the 5 grand. It’s much more “this sucks” than heartbreaking, imo.

YTD income is on every pay stub. I would imagine that people who don’t receive a scheduled paycheck would pay even closer attention to their finances.

[SKL]

Well anyways.  I do agree that everyone old enough to have a child and a job is old enough to know that tax planning is his/her responsibility.

I didn't get any of the fun money, but if I did, I would be freaked out enough to find out how this is gonna impact my tax liability.

There are multiple ways to make payments prior to the deadline if that's what you need to do.  And if you aren't sure, you can pay more withholding and get more back after filing (not my preferred way, but lots of people choose that rather than worry).

I do think our tax system is too complicated, in many ways, and it isn't one political party or the other that causes this.  Both parties (and politicians in other countries) use short-term tax policy to pander for votes.  It's surprising people don't recognize it for what it is.

[Faith-manor]

1 hour ago, SKL said:

Well anyways.  I do agree that everyone old enough to have a child and a job is old enough to know that tax planning is his/her responsibility.

I didn't get any of the fun money, but if I did, I would be freaked out enough to find out how this is gonna impact my tax liability.

There are multiple ways to make payments prior to the deadline if that's what you need to do.  And if you aren't sure, you can pay more withholding and get more back after filing (not my preferred way, but lots of people choose that rather than worry).

I do think our tax system is too complicated, in many ways, and it isn't one political party or the other that causes this.  Both parties (and politicians in other countries) use short-term tax policy to pander for votes.  It's surprising people don't recognize it for what it is.

Agreed. Our tax code is rather ridiculous in its complexity, and heavily manipulated. It really should be much simpler.

I am sorry some of you are experiencing tax shock. 

[ScoutTN]

We couldn’t get the opt out to work - webpage kept crashing - so we just saved it til after we did our taxes to be safe. Easy enough.