Laura Corin Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 mostly it's been speech - but descriptions people have encountered have been brought up. and there are a lot of descriptions . . . . Speech I completely understand - I've had the inverse experience with US writers trying to write British speech. But if it's descriptions in the author's voice, it would seem odd to change idiom when a character got on a plane: from describing a pair of sweet pink trainers at Heathrow to a pair of cute pink sneakers at JFK. Surely the descriptions have to remain in the author's idiom? Otherwise it's could end up a real mess. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 (edited) Speech I completely understand - I've had the inverse experience with US writers trying to write British speech. But if it's descriptions in the author's voice, it would seem odd to change idiom when a character got on a plane: from describing a pair of sweet pink trainers at Heathrow to a pair of cute pink sneakers at JFK. Surely the descriptions have to remain in the author's idiom? Otherwise it's could end up a real mess. that depends if the character is an american or a brit. if it was a brit - i'd agree they were wearing trainers whether in the UK or the US. an american in the UK is not likely to refer to their sneakers/athletic-shoes/etc as "trainers". even if they were in the UK. that is not about the author's "voice" - but about the identity of their character. and what really ticks me off is when it's an american character in the US the *entire* time - and using british idiom. most americans in the UK wouldn't be using much in the way of british idiom unless they lived there a long time. I'm beginning to get annoyed with rucksack (backpack) - which isn't even british - it's german. just as I've encountered brits who get irked by american authors using american idiom for a british character in britain. (which is completely fair.) Edited July 31, 2017 by gardenmom5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xahm Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 Based on the reaction from my Scottish co-worker, British editors would do well to change a description of an American's "fanny pack" to something else. He turned so red... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean in Newcastle Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 Speech I completely understand - I've had the inverse experience with US writers trying to write British speech. But if it's descriptions in the author's voice, it would seem odd to change idiom when a character got on a plane: from describing a pair of sweet pink trainers at Heathrow to a pair of cute pink sneakers at JFK. Surely the descriptions have to remain in the author's idiom? Otherwise it's could end up a real mess. I agree but want to say that it depends on voice as well. If you are righting first person then even descriptions need to match the kind of English spoken and thought by the narrating character. If it is 3rd person then it should match the author and probably the main setting and nationality of the characters. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 I agree but want to say that it depends on voice as well. If you are righting first person then even descriptions need to match the kind of English spoken and thought by the narrating character. If it is 3rd person then it should match the author and probably the main setting and nationality of the characters. and what if a brit is the author - but the main setting is the US, and the majority of characters are US? should the brit continue as usual, using british idom and vocabulary? or learn what an american would use? another example is someone from a city who predominantly uses mass transit - writing someone who lives in a suburb (or worse, a rural area) - as though they are *easily* using mass transit? in the american west! (away from major metro areas.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean in Newcastle Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 and what if a brit is the author - but the main setting is the US, and the majority of characters are US? should the brit continue as usual, using british idom and vocabulary? or learn what an american would use? another example is someone from a city who predominantly uses mass transit - writing someone who lives in a suburb (or worse, a rural area) - as though they are *easily* using mass transit? in the american west! (away from major metro areas.) I suspect this is why there is the old adage "write what you know". Which I realize can apply to more than one thing in writing and isn't a hardfast rule. But I do think definitely applies to these kinds of details. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heartlikealion Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 (edited) Recently I went out of my way to get the "American" (or so I thought) version of an Usborne book. Book Depository did not have this version. It's a compilation of books. One of the stories is called Llamas in Pyjamas or Llamas in Pajamas depending on which version you get. I ordered the one with the American spelling. I ended up ordering from a homeschool mom that had invited me to her Usborne party. I had not physically seen the book. When it arrived I came across something that threw me off. They used "row" to rhyme with "now." First of all, I thought "row" pronounced that way meant argument, but they were using it more like, "chaos" or "noise." I think of "row" pronounced that way as a British word, too. Next, this one stumped me. "Stoat." Is that a British term? Or is that just a word I'm not familiar with? It's describing an animal that either is or is like a weasel? Dh is not familiar with this word, either. I ordered the second book in the series from Book Depository without giving it too much thought and I have no idea what I'm going to come across. Oh well Lol. Edited August 11, 2017 by heartlikealion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawthorne44 Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Yes, a Stoat is like a weasel only larger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Corin Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Stoat Row can be an argument or, as you say, a commotion. 'Stop making such a row!' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heartlikealion Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Lol well Stoat is in both the American and British version of the books I ordered. They are supposed to be phonics books for my youngest so I was a bit turned off by use of words we don't normally use. So can someone tell me if this is commonly used in some parts of America and I just live under a rock? Is it regional? Or is it British? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Corin Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Lol well Stoat is in both the American and British version of the books I ordered. They are supposed to be phonics books for my youngest so I was a bit turned off by use of words we don't normally use. So can someone tell me if this is commonly used in some parts of America and I just live under a rock? Is it regional? Or is it British? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoat#Range_and_population They have stoats in N America. And Merriam Webster has that meaning for row and that pronunciation https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/row Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heartlikealion Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 (edited) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoat#Range_and_population They have stoats in N America. And Merriam Webster has that meaning for row and that pronunciation https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/row I'm less concerned with whether it's in the dictionary and whether people actually use it in general. I never hear Americans say row. They say spat, fight, debate, or some other term to describe a disagreement. Where do you live? (Scotland if your blog is current I guess) I'm just trying to find out if any Americans actually say stoat. Edited August 31, 2017 by heartlikealion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Corin Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 (edited) I'm less concerned with whether it's in the dictionary and whether people actually use it in general. I never hear Americans say row. They say spat, fight, debate, or some other term to describe a disagreement. Where do you live? (Scotland if your blog is current I guess) I'm just trying to find out if any Americans actually say stoat. Yes, I'm in Scotland. I guess if you have stoats you must say stoat though. Or is there another word for them? ETA I found a reference to stoats being called short tailed weasels. Does that ring a bell? Edited August 31, 2017 by Laura Corin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 (edited) I'm less concerned with whether it's in the dictionary and whether people actually use it in general. I never hear Americans say row. They say spat, fight, debate, or some other term to describe a disagreement. Where do you live? (Scotland if your blog is current I guess) I'm just trying to find out if any Americans actually say stoat. American. Never use stoat. We call them a weasel. Never use row for anything that doesn't require an oar. Eta, ah typing on a phone. . . . Edited August 31, 2017 by gardenmom5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 I should add, we don't say putting in your oar, when referring to someone sticking their: nose, neck, foot, etc into something where they need to stay out of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wintermom Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 (edited) American. Never use stoat. We call them a weasel. Never use row for anything that doesn't require an oar. Eta, ah typing on a phone. . . . What about rows of items, like "having all your ducks in a row." Or tables with rows and columns. And the British "row" (argument) rhymes with "Ow!" as in "ouch!" and not with "no." Edited August 31, 2017 by wintermom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 What about rows of items, like "having all your ducks in a row." Or tables with rows and columns. I don't use the first one (though I've certainly heard it), and you have a point about the second, especially in math or finance.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mbelle Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 I just thought about this thread. I was just reading a book by an Aussie author (Bill Bennett) who walked the Camino. The words were no problem, but he kept posting all the km he walked or was planning to walk. It was almost on every single page. I was constantly doing math in my head. Sure, technically I know km, but really how far that actually feels to my body I don't know, so I had to turn it into miles. It felt slightly neurotic. LOL 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heartlikealion Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 We do use the word spelled r-o-w that rhymes with crow. In the story they want row to rhyme with the word now. It just throws the whole story off for me. Yes, I do say things like ducks in a row, a row of items, or the front row (directing someone where to sit). As I said up thread, I know that stoat loosely translates to weasel, but didn't know if it was literally the same animal or just similar (I had seen confusion when I googled it). I don't know if anyone bothers to specify the tail length. And I didn't know if any Americans actually know/use the word stoat. Every time I see it I want to say "stout" for some reason. It's just such a foreign word to me I don't immediately associate it with anything and I guess my brain goes to the nearest word I know that looks similar Lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MommyLiberty5013 Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Colour v colour, -ise v -ize, etc. Btw, grey looks classier than gray. :001_tt2: I agree. I like grey better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean in Newcastle Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 If I actually saw a stoat, I would look it up and would call it a stoat. But first I would probably call it "some kind of a weasel". 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoggirl Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 No, but we lived in the UK for two years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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