Hypothyroid - Synthroid, Armour, Nature-throid

[scbusf]

I have taken generic Synthroid for years and finally asked my doctor about Armour. I was still feeling tired. So tired. So he agreed to let me try Armour. I feel a little better on it, but it's WAY more expensive. And my lab numbers are about the same.

 

What about Nature-throid? Is it worth trying that one? My doctor would let me try it, and it's a lot cheaper than the Armour.

[scholastica]

I had to switch to name brand Synthroid because the generic was affecting my liver. I couldn't believe the difference. I feel so much better on the name brand, even at the same dose and all my numbers were even better. I would try switching to the name brand. Luckily, I now have a medical reason to never be on generic again.

[scbusf]

I had to switch to name brand Synthroid because the generic was affecting my liver. I couldn't believe the difference. I feel so much better on the name brand, even at the same dose and all my numbers were even better. I would try switching to the name brand. Luckily, I now have a medical reason to never be on generic again.

 

Interesting. I hadn't considered that option. Thank you for sharing!

[umsami]

Yes, my endocrinologist actually brought up the difference in brand-name vs. generic Synthroid.  He said it's one of the few meds he's seen a difference with.

[Spryte]

I'm fascinated by the difference between name brand and generic. I went from generic to Amour, and still feel exhausted.

[scholastica]

I'm fascinated by the difference between name brand and generic. I went from generic to Amour, and still feel exhausted.

The only thing a generic has to have in common with the original name brand is the same amount of the "active ingredient". Everything else can be different. So, if the original has ingredients that contribute to its ability to be used by the body, those can be missing from the generic. Some people's bodies can handle the difference, some can't.

[gardenmom5]

stopthethyroidmadness has an excellent page that gives the differences between armour and other brands of ndt.

 

my dr put me on wp-thyroid. the pharmacy I use doens't stock it, so they filled it with naturthroid. (they are made by the same company).  that is cheaper than the wp thyroid she wants me on.  (wp has fewer fillers.)  they are able to special order it, so I'm currently taking wp.  I'm not noticing much difference between them, and may switch back to naturthroid becasue is cheaper.  both are cheaper than armour.  (it's interesting, as she has a dc on armour).

 

ndt has a MUCH shorter lifespan than synthetic (hours as opposed to days), so a split dose works better than all at once.  also - because it has fillers - it works best if you chew it before swallowing.  still no food within an hour afterwards or two hours before.  no calcium can be  up to four hours.

 

one thing to always remember about NDT - it can reveal underlying iron deficiencies or adrenal dysfunction.   I started a low dose of iron last winter, but was still exhausted with the ndt. late june, I added in adrenal and it has made a big difference.  (gaia herbs adrenal support with 90mg of holy basil leaf. I started lower, but have increased the dose to 3x am and 1x pm with my ndt. I've e-mailed with my ND, and she was happy with the brand.  she'd planned on adding adrenal support, but I couldn't wait.  I have a life and need to be able to function, not have to sleep all the time.)  I do bloodwork in 10 days, before my next appointment.  I'm sure we'll tweak doses.

interestingly - I tried taking an adrenal support when I was on levo . . it wasn't helpful, and had odd effects.  so I stopped.

 

I'm still having some hypo symptoms (aside from fatigue, which is now reduced) - but I've noticed an increase in cognitive function as well as energy levels.

 

oh - and what I read that has made me most excited about adding the adrenal support . . . it can cause weakness/cramping in five different muscle groups in the legs and pelvis and destabilize the pelvis.  I've had different chiropractors complain about how unstable mine is/was.  I won't go into the gory details of the problems that's caused me over the last 2 1/2 years, but things are FINALLY resolving.

[Soror]

The formulation changed w/ Armour last year or so and along w/ the crazy price increase many report that it doesn't work nearly as well. I would try Naturethroid in a heartbeat it is what I use. The problem w/ Synthroid, generic or namebrand,is that it only provides you w/ T4 and not T3 (which means your body has to convert and not everyone can do that) besides the other thyroid hormones that it doesn't provide at all. Also, hypo is often linked w/ low iron so it would be good to get a full iron panel done to make sure that is not causing any of your fatigue. Vit D and B levels would be good too.

[gardenmom5]

about name-brands vs generic.  generics can have up to 20 fillers.

 

and I will never, ever, go back to a synthetic t4 (levo, synthroid, etc.).   I was doing an OTC desiccated thryoid,  (low dose) before starting rx thyroid, and I felt far far far better than I did on just t4, because I was getting the whole thyroid. 

 

also be sure you are doing the "right" thyroid function tests.

free t3

free t4

reverse t3 (lets you know if you're pooling or not.)

 

optimum thyroid levels:

 

 

 

worthless numbers:

tsh (the only number MOST drs will look at.)

total t3

total t4

 

totals do not tell you how much you are actually using.

Edited July 22, 2016 by gardenmom5

[Ann.without.an.e]

My girls and I were all on Armour but then they were bought out by a different company and the price kept climbing.  It was getting crazy, especially with three of us on it.  We switched to Nature-throid about 6 months ago and it is much cheaper. 

[J-rap]

On a very different note, but something to consider as a last resort.  If you have Hashimoto's as the cause of your thyroid problem -- that is an autoimmune disease that can sometimes occur with other autoimmune diseases.  For example, it is possible to have Hashimoto's and Chronic Fatigue Syndrome at the same time.

 

I'm just saying to please don't rule out the possibility that your fatigue is caused by something else, or even something like iron deficiency or lack of vitamin D.

 

I hope you find some help fast!!

 

 

[scbusf]

Thanks, everyone! I do NOT have Hashimoto's. I just sent a message to my doctor to see if I can try Nature-throid.

[Soror]

Thanks, everyone! I do NOT have Hashimoto's. I just sent a message to my doctor to see if I can try Nature-throid.

FYI 90% of hypothyroid sufferers have Hashi's, quite often dr's don't even test antibodies which diagnose Hashi's and even the absence of antibodies doesn't entirely rule it out, some Hashi's sufferers don't have any and are diagnosed by biopsy.

[Janeway]

Brand name Synthroid is considered way better than generic.

 

I would be happy to try this other stuff..want to tell me more about it?

[gardenmom5]

Brand name Synthroid is considered way better than generic.

 

I would be happy to try this other stuff..want to tell me more about it?

I don't understand your question.

 

are you asking about natural desiccated thyroid (whole thyroid) vs. synthroid (which is 1) synthetic, and 2) t4 only.)

 

stopthethyroidmadness.com is an excellent resource.  unfortunately, it's not very well organized, but searches within the site tend to bring up a lot of information.  there's also a pull down menu, with links embedded within the articles.

[scbusf]

FYI 90% of hypothyroid sufferers have Hashi's, quite often dr's don't even test antibodies which diagnose Hashi's and even the absence of antibodies doesn't entirely rule it out, some Hashi's sufferers don't have any and are diagnosed by biopsy.

 

I have had thyroid antibodies tested several times over the past 20-something years and it is always negative. I have an underlying pituitary condition, which contributes to the Hypothyroid. Also, my sister has had thyroid cancer, as well as some other relatives, so my doctors keep a close eye on my thyroid and I've never had any nodules or anything else to be concerned about.

Edited July 22, 2016 by scbusf

[Mosaicmind]

I'm not sure what you guys are paying for Armour but it's only $38 out of pocket for 30/90mcg tablets. I pay $7.60 now that we are only paying 20% since we met our first deductible. I used to take 100mcg of Levothyroxine and my Dr switched because she hates the synthetic stuff. I just checked my thyroid bottle and I guess this last script I got the generic Armour called, NP Thyroid, but still it was cheap.

 

My hubby had thyroid cancer and had always taken brand name synthroid . A year ago his tsh went to 84, yes, 84! His endocrinologist had no idea what was going on so she increased his synthroid to 325mcg. She's big on name brand. But, 4 months later and his tsh was still 64 so she switched him to Levothyroxine and a separate t3 med, so he's now down to 25 as of his last test in May. He's on the highest dose she's ever had to put anyone on. He wants to try Armour but she's very much against it so he's taking another brand (can't remember the name) and he's taking 350mcg daily. We are hoping that it's still going down because she doesn't know what else to do. He's had two tumor marker tests this year too, to see if the cancer was back and causing the numbers to go up.

 

I go in for my yearly blood work on Monday and unless things have changed I will remain on Armour. I've heard that one of the brand names, Cytomel maybe, started putting in a gluten based filler and many people have had bad reactions, which included tsh numbers going up. Celiac who are taking this particular med have had their numbers go up and started having stomach reactions.

 

Edited to add: I had to have my thyroid out in 2 different surgeries, the first in 2003 and the second in 2005. I had huge nodules on mine and the last lobe had grown around my neck. My Dr said last year that she believes that my thyroid has started to grow back because she can feel something. Apparently, if they don't remove everything it can grow back much like your liver can if it has had a piece cut off. I may have to go into have a scan done this year.

Edited July 23, 2016 by Mosaicmind

[Soror]

 

My hubby had thyroid cancer and had always taken brand name synthroid . A year ago his tsh went to 84, yes, 84! His endocrinologist had no idea what was going on so she increased his synthroid to 325mcg. She's big on name brand. But, 4 months later and his tsh was still 64 so she switched him to Levothyroxine and a separate t3 med, so he's now down to 25 as of his last test in May. He's on the highest dose she's ever had to put anyone on. He wants to try Armour but she's very much against it so he's taking another brand (can't remember the name) and he's taking 350mcg daily. We are hoping that it's still going down because she doesn't know what else to do. He's had two tumor marker tests this year too, to see if the cancer was back and causing the numbers to go up.

 

I go in for my yearly blood work on Monday and unless things have changed I will remain on Armour. I've heard that one of the brand names, Cytomel maybe, started putting in a gluten based filler and many people have had bad reactions, which included tsh numbers going up. Celiac who are taking this particular med have had their numbers go up and started having stomach reactions.

 

 

You husband is likely not converting, which is why adding T3 helped him, it is negligent that he went a year w/ his TSH that high and his dr. clinging to the ideology that T4 is the answer. Sounds like he needs another endo if she doesn't know what to do, that is mind blowing to me. 

[Mosaicmind]

You husband is likely not converting, which is why adding T3 helped him, it is negligent that he went a year w/ his TSH that high and his dr. clinging to the ideology that T4 is the answer. Sounds like he needs another endo if she doesn't know what to do, that is mind blowing to me.

The thyroid cancer though and his recent diabetes diagnosis can have affected his tsh numbers. She ABSOLUTELY won't put him on generic and the fact that his tsh has been going down means they are headed in the right direction. This clinic specialises in endocrine issues and he's not being helped by just one endocrinologist. If he weren't getting better then I would urge him to ask her about the t3. He has blood work done every 2 months to keep an eye on all of his numbers (tsh, t3, t4, iron, and more). I'm glad they are being so proactive but they've always been cautious with him since the thyroid cancer, which was located in both lobes and was 2 different kind of cancers. Hoping it doesn't show up somewhere else but thyroid cancers usually do migrate to other parts of the body and don't show up for years.

[gardenmom5]

The thyroid cancer though and his recent diabetes diagnosis can have affected his tsh numbers. She ABSOLUTELY won't put him on generic and the fact that his tsh has been going down means they are headed in the right direction. This clinic specialises in endocrine issues and he's not being helped by just one endocrinologist. If he weren't getting better then I would urge him to ask her about the t3. He has blood work done every 2 months to keep an eye on all of his numbers (tsh, t3, t4, iron, and more). I'm glad they are being so proactive but they've always been cautious with him since the thyroid cancer, which was located in both lobes and was 2 different kind of cancers. Hoping it doesn't show up somewhere else but thyroid cancers usually do migrate to other parts of the body and don't show up for years.

 

are the t3 & t4 numbers *total*?  or *free*?

 

you *want* free numbers.  totals are completely worthless.

 

eta: I've never seen an endo - but I've heard many many complaints about them from thyroid patients.  I'm now seeing a naturopath, and finally being treated adequately.  (we're still early.)

 

have they looked at his adrenal function at all?  blood tests - no. 24 hr saliva test - yes.

Edited July 24, 2016 by gardenmom5

[TranquilMind]

I'm not sure what you guys are paying for Armour but it's only $38 out of pocket for 30/90mcg tablets. I pay $7.60 now that we are only paying 20% since we met our first deductible. I used to take 100mcg of Levothyroxine and my Dr switched because she hates the synthetic stuff. I just checked my thyroid bottle and I guess this last script I got the generic Armour called, NP Thyroid, but still it was cheap.

 

My hubby had thyroid cancer and had always taken brand name synthroid . A year ago his tsh went to 84, yes, 84! His endocrinologist had no idea what was going on so she increased his synthroid to 325mcg. She's big on name brand. But, 4 months later and his tsh was still 64 so she switched him to Levothyroxine and a separate t3 med, so he's now down to 25 as of his last test in May. He's on the highest dose she's ever had to put anyone on. He wants to try Armour but she's very much against it so he's taking another brand (can't remember the name) and he's taking 350mcg daily. We are hoping that it's still going down because she doesn't know what else to do. He's had two tumor marker tests this year too, to see if the cancer was back and causing the numbers to go up.

 

I go in for my yearly blood work on Monday and unless things have changed I will remain on Armour. I've heard that one of the brand names, Cytomel maybe, started putting in a gluten based filler and many people have had bad reactions, which included tsh numbers going up. Celiac who are taking this particular med have had their numbers go up and started having stomach reactions.

 

Edited to add: I had to have my thyroid out in 2 different surgeries, the first in 2003 and the second in 2005. I had huge nodules on mine and the last lobe had grown around my neck. My Dr said last year that she believes that my thyroid has started to grow back because she can feel something. Apparently, if they don't remove everything it can grow back much like your liver can if it has had a piece cut off. I may have to go into have a scan done this year.

84? 64? 25?

 

I have a family member who was barely conscious at 11.

 

I agree with the othe poster that he likely has a conversion problem and there is no way I would not try Armour or Westhroid or Naturethroid. Desiccated thyroid has been in constant use for over 100 years without side effects (unless allergic to pork).

 

It is USP certified and no, the levels don't wildly vary as those unfamiliar believe.

 

Personally, I would find someone else before I would live at 25, 64, or 85! TSH need to be in the one range.

Edited July 24, 2016 by TranquilMind

[Mosaicmind]

84? 64? 25?

 

I have a family member who was barely conscious at 11.

 

I agree with the othe poster that he likely has a conversion problem and there is no way I would not try Armour or Westhroid or Naturethroid. Desiccated thyroid has been in constant use for over 100 years without side effects (unless allergic to pork).

 

It is USP certified and no, the levels don't wildly vary as those unfamiliar believe.

 

Personally, I would find someone else before I would live at 25, 64, or 85! TSH need to be in the one range.

 

All free numbers and she's tested for several other things that I can't remember that would be affecting it. But, he's way down from last year and still going down. He had the thyroid cancer in 2012 and had his thyroid out right then. His numbers were great until May of last year when e n all of a sudden they went up and that was after just being tested in February because his endocrinologist tests every 3 months for a long time after thyroid cancer. When he got that first test back with it saying 84, she had him tested 3 times to make sure it was right and then had him tested at another facility and still got 84.

 

He's feeling much better but again I will say that there's still the diagnosis of diabetes and it can screw with your thyroid numbers. Since getting his glucose under control his tsh has dropped much faster since May. If it weren't dropping, he wasn't losing weight finally, and feeling better his endocrinologist would do the Armour, which is what I'm on.

 

We've heard many stories of people whose tsh was higher than his who didn't know anything was wrong so this isn't that rare. We've been dealing with thyroid issues since mine started in 2003 when I got one lobe removed and then had to have the rest removed in 2005. My husband is also a chemist and has a background in pre-Med and pharmacology so he's pretty up to date on the tests and such. I've told him to see if she would do Armour or another form of desiccated hormone but he's fine with taking name brand Synthroid and the other thyroid drug he's on.

 

He's not living like this but doing something about it. You can't get it from 84 to within HIS normal range quickly because it doesn't work like that. I go to a naturopathic doctor and she agrees with the endocrinologist that's treating him. She's also said that stress plays a huge role and considering the great amount of stress he and us are under she's surprised that it didn't happen sooner and that his diabetes didn't show up sooner, which is directly affected by stress. He's been doing things to relieve stress to which have helped in bringing it down. He finally did his blood work Friday and it had been more than 3 months so we are hopeful that it's down even farther.

[Soror]

Thyroid Cancer is scary and not to be messed around with!

 

 fwiw my TSH went from 39 to 2 within 2 months on NDT and T3. I had a friend who shot up to the 50s before treatment and was down in range within 3 months- yet again on NDT and T3. At 39 my bp was bottoming out and I told my husband if I didn't wake up make sure to let them know I had thyroid disease. Thyroid coma is freakin' scary

[Mosaicmind]

Thyroid Cancer is scary and not to be messed around with!

 

 fwiw my TSH went from 39 to 2 within 2 months on NDT and T3. I had a friend who shot up to the 50s before treatment and was down in range within 3 months- yet again on NDT and T3. At 39 my bp was bottoming out and I told my husband if I didn't wake up make sure to let them know I had thyroid disease. Thyroid coma is freakin' scary

 

Everyone is different.  My friend was on Armour when hers went up to 61 so her naturopath switched to another NDT and still no movement of the level.  Finally, after 6 months her naturopath relented and put her on brand name Synthroid and she was down within several months.  My husband's bp has not changed one bit and despite being almost 300 pounds his bp is better than mine and so is his complete cholesterol panel. He was never near a coma because of how much he weighed and how his body was reacting. He really never knew that his tsh was as high as it was. Because of several different factors like his newly diagnosed diabetes and his weight is why his went up so high and he never had any truly life threatening situations.  He did feel tired but he wasn't using his CPap and that's why he was feeling that way. Even now with his tsh being over 20, he's using his CPap consistently and feeling much better but he's also on insulin and other drugs to tackle his A1C. If he was reacting differently and his tsh wasn't coming down he would ask for NDT but he hasn't needed to.