Does your teen work for pay and driver's insurance question

[JanetC]

So, DH threw a new one at me the other night -- he does not want DD (15) to start driver's ed until she has a job that at least contributes towards the cost of insurance.

 

I'm trying to figure out --

 

1. I'd like some examples of what teens out there are doing for pay.

 

2. How does your working teen get to work? I don't want DD's job to turn into a job FOR ME (we live in the car-dependent suburbs, not many places where she might work close by, though there is a small strip mall that is close enough she could try businesses there).

 

3. How does a job fit into a busy high school schedule? (Do I make her choose between continuing in dance 4 days a week, or the job and driver's ed?)

 

4. Is this a reasonable rule to have? Am I being "too soft" to think that junior or senior year rathe than sophomore year is fine to start working? DD has not expressed any particular interest in a job, and sees driving as a "good life skill to have" rather than something she needs to do right away, so we could just not start the learner's permit at the usual time as a sophomore.

 

--Janet

[swellmomma]

Ds14 works at A&W. I drive him to and from since he works in the next town over, he pays me $20 a week for gas. This year it has created a big issue because he often works 11-1 right in the middle of the day. He by law can only work 2 hours a day m-f at this point due to his age to they usually have him do lunch rush since it is generally over by 1. Next year dd13 will be 14 and plans to apply to same location. The difference is like your dd she dances a lot, that means something has to give. If she can not keep her school work done and still dance and work etc then she will have to quit the job. I worked right through middle and high school 15 hours a week so I know they can do it too, the biggest difference is that I am helping my kids (as far as transportation) and my folks left me up to my own devices to figure it out.

 

Money earned pays for ds's snake and salamander food, the gas $ to me, canteen at cadets, and the extras he wants (like a ticket to a youth concert, his dsi, video games like crazy etc) not for something like insurance at this time.

 

Out here you can get your learner's permit at 14 which means he could drive with me in the passenger seat but no one else in the car until he is eligible for his license at 16 (and even that is a graduated system). He does not have his learners permit yet because he lacks the maturity I require before he can take the test (simple online multiple choice one done at the DMV), when he is ready maturity wise he has to pay for it himself (for him that also goes with the maturity thing), but dd13 may not need to pay for it herself because she already has an abundance of maturity and responsibility and can understand the importance of the permit without being the one to pay for it. Insurance he may have to start helping with depending on how much it jumps adding a young male onto the policy once he gets his real license. I would not require the license before the job, nor the job before the license. I expect that if working it does not interfer with school. In ds's case he really needed to get out there and work, he doesn't put any effort into his academics, and with his learning issues they are a huge struggle, but he is getting real world experience at work. His job combined with his cadets are what is preparing him for his future career. Whereas dd is more likely to go to college and has the ability and maturity to focus on school and the desire to put her spare hours into dance rather than working.

 

All that to say there really is no set rule about insurance/license/job, it is all based on the kid and what the cost/benefit ratio is for each one individually.

[regentrude]

My DD works as a peer instructor at the physics learning center of the university. If she were a full time student, the school would pay her. Since she is a part time student, she gets to participate in training and has the honor of offering her services on a volunteer basis - so we parents have decided to pay her what she would earn if the school paid. She learns a lot in this job, but it does take time out of her schedule she could put towards a paying job otherwise - so we feel it is beneficial if she does this instead.

Both kids have worked assembling computers for their father. If he had a private business, he could actually employ them; since he pays from his grants, he will not, to avoid any appearance of nepotism. He pays them out of his own pocket for their work.

 

I do not expect my kids to contribute towards gas and insurance. Their job is school, and I expect them to work hard there. I am glad that DD is driving because it means I do not have to drive to take her and pick her up; it saves me a lot of time (and gas).

Btw, I come from a culture where high school students typically do not work paying jobs during the school year. I have not observed this to create a sense of entitlement or financial irresponsibility.

 

One additional thought: putting time towards school and truly excelling may translate into far greater amounts of money through scholarships than they could ever earn in teen job. I would be very careful to keep the balance and weigh short term financial gains against possible long term losses if the job detracts the student from a rigorous course of schoolwork and excellent test performance.

[bugs]

My daughter wanted her learner's permit so badly;she had to pay half the tuition for the required class. We do not have her pay insurance at this point but she is required to be eligible for good student discounts. If she is no longer eligible she will pay the difference. We do believe that school is her job and have discouraged her from seeking permanent work (she does earn money through catering, etc. at times). She also must work to fund a mission trip she wanted to participate in - so that takes time.

[Luckymama]

I do not expect my kids to contribute towards gas and insurance. Their job is school, and I expect them to work hard there. I am glad that DD is driving because it means I do not have to drive to take her and pick her up; it saves me a lot of time (and gas).

Btw, I come from a culture where high school students typically do not work paying jobs during the school year. I have not observed this to create a sense of entitlement or financial irresponsibility.

 

One additional thought: putting time towards school and truly excelling may translate into far greater amounts of money through scholarships than they could ever earn in teen job. I would be very careful to keep the balance and weigh short term financial gains against possible long term losses if the job detracts the student from a rigorous course of schoolwork and excellent test performance.

 

 

This is our philosophy, exactly. Besides the odd yardwork, tutoring, or babysitting job our older kids did not work during high school. It has paid off in scholarship money and college options :)

[Pawz4me]

You might want to check with your insurance agent. Here in NC the teen doesn't need his/her own insurance until they obtain a driver's license. During driver's ed and while driving with a learner's permit they're covered under the parents' insurance.

 

We're of the opinion that our kids' work is school, plus participating in extracurricular/volunteer activities that will look good on college apps (thereby hopefully translating into good merit aid).

[Jen in NY]

So, DH threw a new one at me the other night -- he does not want DD (15) to start driver's ed until she has a job that at least contributes towards the cost of insurance.

 

I'm trying to figure out --

 

1. I'd like some examples of what teens out there are doing for pay.

 

Freshman-Junior years my dd#1 taught private piano lessons to 5 students a week. Junior and Senior years she has had a part time job (~10hours/week) at the public library. Summer before senior year she had a full time paid internship at a lab, stayed on during the school year (~4hours/week) and will be going back to full time once school is out. She will keep her job a the library as well, because she likes it and it will be good to have someplace to work when she comes home for short vacations during her time at college. DD#2 will be interviewing at the library shortly. : )

 

2. How does your working teen get to work? I don't want DD's job to turn into a job FOR ME (we live in the car-dependent suburbs, not many places where she might work close by, though there is a small strip mall that is close enough she could try businesses there).

 

This has been an issue for us: My husband and I have shared driving responsibilities for her jobs (and will do the same for the other kids), because we thought her jobs were forward looking enough to make them worthwhile. They have all been excellent in their own way - as training for how to be a good employee, employer, and scientist. She has saved enough to pay for her first year in college, and probably got into her school due in large part to the recommendations and experiences she gained along the way. If there had been problems... like the management not respecting her time (showing up for a shift and getting sent home quickly because they realize they don't actually need you) .... I bet we all would have decided that the job wasn't worth all of our time and effort.

 

3. How does a job fit into a busy high school schedule? (Do I make her choose between continuing in dance 4 days a week, or the job and driver's ed?)

 

This was an issue for us, too. (see post #4 here: http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/421237-dropping-much-loved-activities/ )

 

4. Is this a reasonable rule to have? Am I being "too soft" to think that junior or senior year rathe than sophomore year is fine to start working? DD has not expressed any particular interest in a job, and sees driving as a "good life skill to have" rather than something she needs to do right away, so we could just not start the learner's permit at the usual time as a sophomore.

 

Are you sure she needs to be on your insurance to get a permit? Maybe it is just because our dd didn't do driver's ed, but she didn't have to be on our insurance until she became a fully licenced driver.

 

As for contributing to the cost of insurance... I can see both sides. If my dd was a very responsible-with-money kind of kid but didn't have a way to earn money yet, I would probably pay for the insurance to make a job possible. But if my kid was irresponsible with money, and spent hers and mine inconsiderately, I would probably find myself charging for the insurance - and gas, too!

~Jen

 

--Janet

 

[lisabees]

Ds16 works at Giant (grocery store). Before he had his license and car, I drove him or he walked. He chose Giant because it is walkable - there's a path between our neighborhood and the shopping center. We pay his insurance, but he usually pays for his own gas. He is a very social kid. He plays baseball most days of the week. And he likes nice clothes. He needed a job to pay for his lifestyle! It can be difficult to balance with school work and sports. But Giant is very flexible with high schoolers and their busy seasons. Because of school ball, he currently only works on weekends. Once that ends, his other team will play tournaments every weekend. Thus, he will work only on weekdays. I recommend finding a job that is flexible like this. Ask around.

 

College ds, at this age, always designed websites at that age. He had his own business. We paid for his insurance. He never had his own car, but was more of a homebody. He never used much gas!

 

I wouldn't force a kid to get a job before driver's ed. But I like a teen to have a job eventually. Can your dd do anything for the dance studio? Just finding a job doing what you love makes all the difference. Babysitting, summer camps, tutoring, etc.

 

Best of luck!

[Julie in MN]

Their job is school, and I expect them to work hard there. I am glad that DD is driving because it means I do not have to drive to take her and pick her up; it saves me a lot of time (and gas).

Btw, I come from a culture where high school students typically do not work paying jobs during the school year. I have not observed this to create a sense of entitlement or financial irresponsibility.

 

I also agree.

 

My preference was that my kids just do school, but my dh's preference, and the kids' preference, was to work. So we compromised and they have all worked but known our schedule comes first and their jobs are expendable.

 

I didn't start my kids in driver's ed until age 16 (rather than the usual 15) and let them get their license at 17 or almost. I did this for safety reasons, but it's another compromise you could consider.

 

I agree on no-cost insurance with a permit -- never heard of having to pay for that, since an adult is always responsible.

 

Once they got their license, I've paid my kids' car insurance through college or for dd who never went to college, until she bought her own car. I haven't given them a car. Our gas rules are not set in stone -- I always want my tank more than 1/4 full, and if they're using it a lot they pay, or if just a little then I'll pay but they'll go and fill the tank.

 

I think it's good to set limits on what mom & pop will provide financially, but there doesn't have to be "nothing" provided.

 

Julie

[Gwen in VA]

I am glad that DD is driving because it means I do not have to drive to take her and pick her up; it saves me a lot of time (and gas).

 

:iagree: When my kids got their licenses, it freed me up significantly -- and it reduced the amount of gas consumed because much of the time I would drive there and back to drop them off and then there and back to pick them up, while the kid just drives there and back once.

 

We pay for the insurance -- driving is a life skill that we want our kids to have. Not all of our kids have had paying jobs their junior year of high school, and I would not want to postpone them getting their license because of a lack of a job. (And we don't want to require kid A to pay for it but not require kid B to do the same.....)

 

We pay for gas as long as almost all of the driving is related to non-social activities. If a kid is racking up a lot of miles driving to "fun" things, he needs to fill the tank occasionally!

 

Working during the year will most likely impact academics, so our kids only worked during the school year if the job was career-related in some way and would look REALLY good on a resume. (Our future naval architect worked at a sail loft; our future musician does regular paid gigs.)

 

Unfortunately, the amount of money a kid can earn is peanuts compared with the cost of college, so on a cost basis, the benefits of improved academic performance will most likely outweigh any monetary benefit of working, UNLESS there is a specific benefit related to the job -- kid sanity (reality check or gotta-get-out-of-the-house-itis) or relevant experience or whatever.

[SkateLeft]

I don't make my kids pay for their auto insurance, and I don't tie driver's ed or getting a license to having a job. Driving is a life skill as well as a safety issue. I don't ever want my girls to be in a position where they're dependent on someone else to get them out of an uncomfortable situation, should the need arise.

 

My oldest daughter did not work during high school. Between sail racing and academics, she was quite busy. She wouldn't have had the time for a job.

 

School is the primary job for all of my kids. I'm not a fan of menial work for teens, just for the sake of having them work.

 

However, my younger daughter has been working for the past year, She's a WSA and teaches swim lessons for our city Parks and Rec. They're paying for her to get her lifeguard certification this summer. She's also an athlete who spends long hours training, but she thrives on being very active and busy. She gets bored and cranky if she has to remain indoors or inactive for too long,

 

Right now, I drive her to work on the weekends. During the summer, aquatics sessions run every day for two weeks at a time. Yes, it's a hassle and means that I have to get up early on a Saturday morning, but it's part of the phase of life that I'm in. She starts driver's ed in a couple of weeks, but won't be able to get her license until next June, when she turns 16.

[Punks in Ontario]

Around here farm jobs are available. Ds 16 works in a dairy barn and ds15 works in a chicken barn sorting eggs. In the winter/bad weather and early in the morning (5 and 7 a.m.),I drive them 4 and 6 kms. In better weather they bike.

 

We paid for driver's ed. believing that it's a general part of education to become an independent adult. When ds 16 gets his license, he'll pay for his insurance. We're still up in the air as to who will buy a second vehicle since we could really use one with everyone's schedules. I suspect we'll buy a beater. Ds15 will contribute when he's driving.

[Lori D.]

As far as driving / working to pay for driver's insurance, we tend to pretty much do the sam as Julie in MN. We also totally agree with the several previous posters about making sure the student gets a good driver's ed first (whether has a job or not). Also, no need for insurance here until the student gets a license. And, the student can usually repeatedly renew the learner's permit. (Both our DSs had learner's permits for 2 years before getting the license. Again, like Julie, we preferred our DSs to be older for the additional physical/mental maturity before having a license.)

 

Below are some ideas for jobs. BEST of luck in the driving and working adventures! :) Warmest regards, Lori D.

 

 

re: Jobs

Since you are in a suburb, your DD may need to be rather entrepreneurial about earning money.

 

Jobs in the neighborhood:

- housecleaning

- yardwork

- mow lawns

- pool cleaning

- cleaning up pet litter

- walking dogs

- babysitting

- "mother's helper"

 

Some jobs could be done at home:

- make a product/sell via craft fairs, local stores, website (ex.: jewelry-making -- NOTE: however, any food-based product has expensive Health Dept. regulations)

- computer / web-based business (a friend's son offered computer manipulated images as a service)

 

Some jobs, the customer could come to you:

- academic tutoring of younger students

- offering music, art, or dance lessons to younger students

 

Work/commute:

(hopefully, within walking/biking/bus distance of home, but also think about possible carpooling)

- strip mall businesses

- fast food restaurants

- bussing / dishwashing at a regular restaurant

- part time office work help at a small business

- know a family with a small business? they may love a motivated teen's part time help

- church that offers Mom's day out child care

- full time summer job at a seasonal business, summer camp for younger kids, lifeguarding at a pool, etc.

[Gwen in VA]

BTW, if your kid graduates high school without a driver's license, it may have some interesting results.

 

Ds did an internship this winter as part of his winter work requirement. The college likes to pair freshman together, so ds was paired with another freshman for his winter work time in a rather remote part of Maine. The other kid did NOT have a driver's license, so my ds was THE driver. The other kid couldn't get to work, go to the grocery, or even drive to a hospital if the need arose without my son doing the driving. (We normally don't want other teens driving our car, but in this situation we would have allowed the kid to drive the car -- if only the kid had a license!)

 

If possible, please do not put your child in the position of the other kid. Being completely dependent on someone else for basic transportation is not good for anyone!

 

Due to amazing internship offers your child may NOT live at home after freshman year! So please equip your kid with a driver's license!

[regentrude]

. Driving is a life skill as well as a safety issue. I don't ever want my girls to be in a position where they're dependent on someone else to get them out of an uncomfortable situation, should the need arise.

 

 

Excellent point which played a definite role in our decision to have DD get her license as early as possible. I much rather have her drive than get rides from other teens about whose driving instruction and skills I know nothing, and I don't want her ever to be in a position to have to get in the car with an unsafe driver.

[JanetC]

Thanks for all the different perspectives!

 

DH worked a lot, through high school and through college, so he's coming from a different place than I am. I worked for pocket-money, but not for real expenses, through high school and college.

 

--Janet

[Rebel Yell]

Diamond has a part-time job, 2-3 days/week, 4 hours Mon or Weds, or 7 if she works Saturdays. It is in a dance retail store, so it is related to her future plans. It does not cut into her school time.

 

We do not require her to pay for gas or insurance. (If she does somethign foolish and the rates go up, that will be different.) A paid driver-ed course is not required here.

 

Having her drive herself to things- work, dance, rehearsals, friend's houses, chiropractor- has SAVED me a tremendous amount of time AND money. We are in a car-dependent suburb of a major city. NOTHING is within walking distance. To go 9 miles to the chiropractor cost me: 20mins driving, 10-20mins waiting, 15 mins appointment, drive-through at Chick-fil-A for a quick snack, and 20 minutes home. So almost an hour and a half is gained for me to work with younger girls. Driving to dance was maddening- too far to come home during class, not really enough time to run an errand. And her nights when she has class until 10pm?

 

Visiting friends was the worst- since homeschool friends don;t usually live in the same neighborhood like public-school friends do- it was usually a 30-minute drive, drop off (we're WAY past the age of parents visiting and all siblings playing while the two friends hang out...) so then another 30 minute drive home, and then repeat to pick-up. I could spend $10 in gas just for ONE visit with her friend! Now that is cut in half AND I have more free time!

 

Oh how I love the glorious days now when I send my Diamond off to the Chiropractor with the grocery list and my debit card. I have saved a ton of money by not doing expensive "briwsing" at stores while I'm waiting for her. So again, the money is even, at least.

 

Oh yeah- in our state a Junior license holder can only drive 1 under-18 un-related passenger. (Diamond could drive 20 minor siblings if she had them, but only 1 friend under 18.) So if a group of friends wants to go somewhere, they can't all go in the same car, so it;s good for Diamond to be able to drive.

[AngieW in Texas]

I am so very happy that my 17yo has her license. I no longer have to drive her to classes because she can drive herself. She can also drive her 14yo sister to places she needs to go, so I don't have to. This weekend I was sick and she drove our dog to the dog park for me twice. It has been a huge benefit to ME for my kids to have their licenses.

 

I'm starting up driver ed with my youngest because she will be 15yo next week. It will be a tremendous burden lifted from me when she is able to drive herself around because my middle dd will be gone to school next year and will no longer be able to help me that way.

 

I haven't needed to pay for insurance until my kids have actually gotten their licenses (be sure to call the very day they do get their licenses though).

 

Also, I haven't had my kids pay for gas either. Like the others, we have used LESS gas by having the kids drive themselves to the things that I was already driving them to.

[J-rap]

My kids have all worked, starting at about 15, or even earlier. During the school year, school and other activities come first, but they still work. They've all worked at the same place, at a local espresso cafe downtown. Downtown is only 8 block away though, so they've always been able to walk. They've gotten to know the owners very well over the years, and the owners allow them to set their own schedule completely. So if they can work 3 lunch hours/week, they will. Or if they can work 1 Saturday/month, that's okay too. They try to put in a lot of hours in the summer.

 

We don't require our kids to help pay for gas or insurance, or anything necessary. During the school year, they use their job money for little extras: movie tickets, concerts, pizza out with friends, a new shirt that they really don't need at all, etc.

 

Also during the summer, our family runs a booth at the State Fair. We've done this for over 25 years now. All the kids work there if they're around, and they make quite good money.

 

They use their summer earnings for bigger things: a choir tour trip, a new guitar, a new racing bike, etc.