WWYD? Younger child passing my older child in math?

[Mom0012]

I've got 2 kids, who are both using CLE Math. My 7th grader will finish up CLE 7 soon and my 5th grader has started CLE 6.

 

My gut is telling me to put my son in Jann in TX's class, if possible, and have him do either Lial's BCM or PreAlgebra for 8th grade. If he did well, I'd have him continue with Jann throughout the high school years. He's a good math student, but he's had to work hard and I don't want to rush him.

 

I have the entire Saxon sequence for my dd. I think she will be ready for Algebra 1/2 partway through next year. I have also been toying with switching her to TT after CLE 6 instead of Saxon because she's used that in the past and enjoyed it. (I'm caring more and more about enjoyment in my kids' educational experience and seeing that may be even more important than "rigorous" -- at least to an extent.)

 

Anyway, my problem is that my dd is going to pass my son in math. If we start with TT next year, I believe she'd go straight into algebra. If we do Saxon, she will start algebra at the same time as him but begin algebra 2 while he is doing geometry. My son has expressed how important it is to him to stay ahead of my dd in math.

 

I have not rushed my dd. In fact, I have slowed her down by adding in extra programs every year. She's did TT for two years alongside of CLE and she has done hands-on equations, Beast Academy and this year she is doing RS Geometry 2 days a week.

 

WWYD? I'd love to hear any solutions/suggestions. It's hard enough to find the right math sequence for each child, but then this problem of the younger passing the older is a real issue. I don't want to hurt my son's self-esteem. He is a very hard worker.

[regentrude]

If your younger student likes math, I would switch her to a more challenging program. This way, the direct competition is not that much of an issue. Of course she will progress faster and your son's wish that his sister stay behind him is unrealistic (and unfair!)- but it won't quite look as obvious.

Have you looked into Art of Problem Solving? They start with prealgebra. It is a great curriculum for strong and interested math students. Their Introduction to Algebra covers a rigorous algebra 1 in the first 13 chapters and algebra 2 material in chapters 14-22. You could take anywhere from 1 to 2 years to complete the book, and it would still be their "first algebra book" . Their geometry is more in depth than a traditional course and covers more topics as well

[Murphy101]

I wouldn't switch programs. If what you are using is working, I wouldn't want to mess with that.

 

Older child is just going to have to get over himself. I have 2 sets of siblings like this. Such is life. The older kid gets to do all kinds of things before their younger sibling. I just tell them to get over it if a younger sibling is moving faster. I do explain that everyone finds some things easier or harder than other people and it has nothing to intelligence. Mostly how it affects them seems to be a reflection of how I handle it. As long as I don't focus on it, usually they don't either.

 

 

[dereksurfs]

I don't quite get why you feel your dd would be ready to jump right into Algebra 1 from CLE 7 next year, but your son will only go into BCM or Pre-A? Are you holding him back or accelerating her differently for some reason? I've heard some jump right from CLE 7 to Algebra 1, though some use CLE 8 as well beforehand.

 

If DS is motivated to 'stay ahead' I'd recommend adding a Pre-A supplimental now. For example include BCM or something else once a week. I had ds11 do that before finishing elementary math using MUS Pre-A once a week. It got him thinking about more abstract math concepts and added a degree of challenge for him. Another suppliment he may like is Real World Algebra by Zaccaro which is mostly Pre-A level. You could extend this into the Summer as a possibilty. Then he will be ready to go right to Algebra 1 next year.

[Crimson Wife]

I would have them in different math programs to make direct comparisons harder, but if your DD winds up ahead of your DS in terms of the course title, he's going to have to deal with it. Different kids have different strengths. My DS is zooming through the math sequence faster than his sister did, even with adding in BA to slow him down. She's older enough that he most likely won't get ahead of her in the sequence but he could very well end up only a year behind.

[Luckymama]

I agree with Regentrude---switch programs for your daughter. Don't hold her back.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

I've got 2 kids, who are both using CLE Math. My 7th grader will finish up CLE 7 soon and my 5th grader has started CLE 6.

 

My gut is telling me to put my son in Jann in TX's class, if possible, and have him do either Lial's BCM or PreAlgebra for 8th grade. If he did well, I'd have him continue with Jann throughout the high school years. He's a good math student, but he's had to work hard and I don't want to rush him.

 

I have the entire Saxon sequence for my dd. I think she will be ready for Algebra 1/2 partway through next year. I have also been toying with switching her to TT after CLE 6 instead of Saxon because she's used that in the past and enjoyed it. (I'm caring more and more about enjoyment in my kids' educational experience and seeing that may be even more important than "rigorous" -- at least to an extent.)

 

Anyway, my problem is that my dd is going to pass my son in math. If we start with TT next year, I believe she'd go straight into algebra. If we do Saxon, she will start algebra at the same time as him but begin algebra 2 while he is doing geometry. My son has expressed how important it is to him to stay ahead of my dd in math.

 

I have not rushed my dd. In fact, I have slowed her down by adding in extra programs every year. She's did TT for two years alongside of CLE and she has done hands-on equations, Beast Academy and this year she is doing RS Geometry 2 days a week.

 

WWYD? I'd love to hear any solutions/suggestions. It's hard enough to find the right math sequence for each child, but then this problem of the younger passing the older is a real issue. I don't want to hurt my son's self-esteem. He is a very hard worker.

 

Nobody has that right. He doesn't have the right to make himself feel taller by pulling her down. Are you not concerned about the effect on your dd? How is her self-esteem, if she is forced to stay in her brother's shadow academically?

 

Please allow your daughter to learn, and deal with your son's self-esteem as a separate issue.

[Mom0012]

I don't quite get why you feel your dd would be ready to jump right into Algebra 1 from CLE 7 next year, but your son will only go into BCM or Pre-A? Are you holding him back or accelerating her differently for some reason? I've heard some jump right from CLE 7 to Algebra 1, though some use CLE 8 as well beforehand.

 

If DS is motivated to 'stay ahead' I'd recommend adding a Pre-A supplimental now. For example include BCM or something else once a week. I had ds11 do that before finishing elementary math using MUS Pre-A once a week. It got him thinking about more abstract math concepts and added a degree of challenge for him. Another suppliment he may like is Real World Algebra by Zaccaro which is mostly Pre-A level. You could extend this into the Summer as a possibilty. Then he will be ready to go right to Algebra 1 next year.

 

 

Well, my dd would only go straight into Algebra 1 if she moves into TT. She did TT 7 last year when she was doing CLE 4 and it was easy for her, so I'm pretty sure we'd skip TT pre-alg. If she used Saxon, she'd go into Algebra 1/2. But, Saxon integrates geometry, and the program I'm planning for my son doesn't, so by the time my son hits geometry, she'll already be starting algebra 2. My dd just picks up everything easily.

 

My son is a late bloomer and, I could be wrong, but my feeling is that getting his feet wet with the format of Lial's BCM would be a good idea before he starts algebra 1. I've never wanted him to start algebra before 9th because I think he will do well, but not if I start him too early. CLE 7 actualy is pre-algebra, but so is CLE 8. It's spread over 2 years. I was thinking about skipping CLE 8 and moving him into Lial's BCM for a final year of pre-alg before 9th. Honestly, I think CLE 7 will have prepared him to go into Lial's algebra, I just feel waiting with him is the right thing.

 

My kids both already do math over the summer and my son would probably be willing to do math on the weekends if it meant staying ahead, but what I really think he needs is time. Maybe I'm wrong and should let him try algebra?

 

Thanks!

[Mom0012]

Nobody has that right. He doesn't have the right to make himself feel taller by pulling her down. Are you not concerned about the effect on your dd? How is her self-esteem, if she is forced to stay in her brother's shadow academically?

 

Please allow your daughter to learn, and deal with your son's self-esteem as a separate issue.

 

 

 

Oh gosh, my son is a sweet boy with some learning disabilities. He's not trying to push my dd down. He wants to work harder to stay ahead. He also has some friends that are very accelerated in a number of areas (one of them being my dd's age) and after speaking with these boys one day, he told me he was afraid of academic failure because he did not understand some math concept they were talking about.

 

He'll probably be in the same writing class as my dd next year because it's for 6th-8th grades and my dd will blow him out of the water in that class. My dd is also taking high school Spanish and Latin (which my son is not taking) and excelling there. He's never expressed any concerns about those things, but I can understand where it would be a blow to him for her to pass him in math as well. As far as dd, she's definitely not being kept in his shadow and her self-esteem is far from suffering.

 

Of course, I will continue to move my dd along, but I was hoping more for some ideas on how to do it without hurting my son. I know using different programs can help, but it's going to be pretty obvious if she's taking algebra at the same time or ahead of him. This has only really become an issue recently as my dd has matured and really come into her own academically.

[Mom0012]

I wouldn't switch programs. If what you are using is working, I wouldn't want to mess with that.

 

Older child is just going to have to get over himself. I have 2 sets of siblings like this. Such is life. The older kid gets to do all kinds of things before their younger sibling. I just tell them to get over it if a younger sibling is moving faster. I do explain that everyone finds some things easier or harder than other people and it has nothing to intelligence. Mostly how it affects them seems to be a reflection of how I handle it. As long as I don't focus on it, usually they don't either.

 

 

We've talked about people having different strengths and weaknesses and he has been very accepting of my dd's many academic strengths. It's just that this is the first time she is going to pass him in a subject that he feels he is good at. I am going to focus on the fact that I think he's going to do well in math but that I think he's just on a different timetable than his sister. The whole thing came up when I mentioned him taking pre-algebra next year instead of algebra. That kind of alarmed him.

 

If she does pass him, I am sure he will accept it. I just want to do what I can in the way of damage control. He's had a tough time and had to work so hard, but he's overcome so much. I don't want him to feel badly about his accomplishments, when he is doing well.

[Mom0012]

If your younger student likes math, I would switch her to a more challenging program. This way, the direct competition is not that much of an issue. Of course she will progress faster and your son's wish that his sister stay behind him is unrealistic (and unfair!)- but it won't quite look as obvious.

Have you looked into Art of Problem Solving? They start with prealgebra. It is a great curriculum for strong and interested math students. Their Introduction to Algebra covers a rigorous algebra 1 in the first 13 chapters and algebra 2 material in chapters 14-22. You could take anywhere from 1 to 2 years to complete the book, and it would still be their "first algebra book" . Their geometry is more in depth than a traditional course and covers more topics as well

 

 

I will take a look at AOPS. I have looked at it in the past and I didn't feel comfortable with it, but I will take another look.

 

I had been considering Singapore's Discovering Mathematics. Maybe I'll revisit that as well. I am concerned about being able to help my dd with both of these programs, though. That's why I had finally decided to settle on Saxon or TT.

 

Any thoughts on Discovering Mathematics? She loves geometry and is really good at it, so I like the idea of an program that integrates geometry and I think she'd really like the Geometer's Sketchpad (not sure that's the right name) that's used with the program.

[Mom0012]

And I should add that I have added extra programs for my dd and tried to slow her down because I didn't want to get into upper level math with her in 6th grade. It had nothing to do with my son. I just don't see the benefit of doing upper level math at such a young age. She already has a very heavy workload since she's taking two languages on top of many other things and I felt higher math could wait.

[regentrude]

And I should add that I have added extra programs for my dd and tried to slow her down because I didn't want to get into upper level math with her in 6th grade. It had nothing to do with my son. I just don't see the benefit of doing upper level math at such a young age.

 

A few thoughts on this:

1. What they call "upper level math" is taught much earlier elsewhere in the world. It is a US idiosyncrasy to package math in neatly labeled boxes called "algebra" and "calculus" and start doling them out in complete parcels in 9th grade. In my home country, it is "math". geometric proofs in 6th grade, linear equations in 7th, quadratic equations in 9th. there is no such thing as "higher math".

 

2. You do not see any benefit in starting higher math early. There are several if a student is ready:

a)f it will give your student time to work through a richer program than TT that covers more concepts in more depth.

b ) It allows your student to take detours into interesting math not usually covered in the traditional sequence: probability theory, number theory.

c) It allows your student to complete calculus before 12th grade, thus making it possible to cover calculus based physics in high school

d) It keeps math exciting and fun.

 

3. You mentioned that she has a heavy work load. I do not see how advancing in math instead of doing math without advancing would have to be any more time consuming. If you do any math, you might as well do new math.

 

My son began AoPS Algebra in 6th grade. He spent the first year working through the algebra 1 portion. In 7th grade we took a break and did some probability theory, a fun subject not usually taught. Now in 8th he is finishing up the algebra 2 portion of the book.

 

I do not believe in forcibly slowing down students just because of their age; often this is the surest way to kill excitement about a subject. Your DD is obviously a gifted math student - let her run with it. If you feel you have to hold her back because you are not comfortable teaching, please look for a way to outsource math. AoPS has online classes.

[8filltheheart]

I have younger students that have surpassed older siblings. I personally cannot imagine allowing the self-esteem of one child inhibit the natural progression of another. I treat my children as individuals and respect them for who they are and I expect them to do the same for others.

 

If your ds was struggling with reading, would you prevent your dd from reading appropriate level books? If he was struggling with writing paragraphs, would you make your dd stay writing only sentences even if she was a strong writer? Why not the equivalent philosophy with math?

 

I guess my oldest ds and my dh's egos could take a hit because our 11th grader is taking the highest college level math they both took in earning their engineering degrees. Better that than having forced a very capable math student to churn wheels accomplishing nothing from 4th grade until 9th. Fwiw, 11 th grade ds has an 8 th grade sister who surpassed him in writing, French, and her understanding of complex literature a couple of yrs ago.

 

Everyone has their own strengths and weaknesses. That is just life. Preventing a real truth from occurring seems like two negatives that are not making a real positive for either child.

 

 

 

[Murphy101]

We've talked about people having different strengths and weaknesses and he has been very accepting of my dd's many academic strengths. It's just that this is the first time she is going to pass him in a subject that he feels he is good at. I am going to focus on the fact that I think he's going to do well in math but that I think he's just on a different timetable than his sister. The whole thing came up when I mentioned him taking pre-algebra next year instead of algebra. That kind of alarmed him.

If she does pass him, I am sure he will accept it. I just want to do what I can in the way of damage control. He's had a tough time and had to work so hard, but he's overcome so much. I don't want him to feel badly about his accomplishments, when he is doing well.

 

There is a placement test in the front of both Lials BCM and Lials introductory algebra. I would give him the algebra one and if he didn't pass it, I'd give him the BCM one. If whichever one he places in is a struggle or you are worried he will, you can always slow down to progress at whatever pace he needs.

[dereksurfs]

Well, my dd would only go straight into Algebra 1 if she moves into TT. She did TT 7 last year when she was doing CLE 4 and it was easy for her, so I'm pretty sure we'd skip TT pre-alg. If she used Saxon, she'd go into Algebra 1/2. But, Saxon integrates geometry, and the program I'm planning for my son doesn't, so by the time my son hits geometry, she'll already be starting algebra 2. My dd just picks up everything easily.

 

My son is a late bloomer and, I could be wrong, but my feeling is that getting his feet wet with the format of Lial's BCM would be a good idea before he starts algebra 1. I've never wanted him to start algebra before 9th because I think he will do well, but not if I start him too early. CLE 7 actualy is pre-algebra, but so is CLE 8. It's spread over 2 years. I was thinking about skipping CLE 8 and moving him into Lial's BCM for a final year of pre-alg before 9th. Honestly, I think CLE 7 will have prepared him to go into Lial's algebra, I just feel waiting with him is the right thing.

 

My kids both already do math over the summer and my son would probably be willing to do math on the weekends if it meant staying ahead, but what I really think he needs is time. Maybe I'm wrong and should let him try algebra?

 

Thanks!

 

This makes more sense now. At least I understand the different approaches taken.

 

For ds I would consider two years of Algebra over two years of Pre-Algebra and basic math. As a minimim if you decide for another year of Pre-A I recommend introducing algebraic topics vs. simply more arithmetic (decimals, percents, etc...). This does two important things:

1. It helps build a mental bridge to more difficult and challenging abstract algebraic problems to come.

2. It allows him to build his confidence gradually while not feel so far behind his peers and siblings.

Many recommend two years of Algebra 1 anyway as it really is the foundation for all higher level math. I think this is especially true if a child has some learning disabilities. There are a number of ways to go about this. Many start with an easier Algebra 1 such as MUS or TT. Then take something more standards based and challenging the second year. If this were my son that is what I would do. Give him more breathing room where he really will need it - in Algebra. If still uncertain for him then at least introduce Algebraic concepts one day a week for example. It doesn't have to be all or nothing. This can provide motivation to finish up basic primary math and learn the 'big kid' stuff. You can build up his self-esteem this way, gradually, slowing down where needed.

 

For dd I would not place her in TT. While a fine program for some it is not the greatest for someone who is gifted and gets things easily. If a math program is 'easy' for a child that is typically not a good thing. They need to be mentally challenged to grow and learn - that just right challenge. For her I would look for something more rigorous as was mentioned by regentrude. Think college prep or honors math. TT and AoPS opposite ends of the spectrum from challenging to easy math. There are a lot of options in between. If AoPS wasn't the best fit for whatever reason I would also look at these:

Foerster Algebra 1 with Math w/o Borders DVDs

TabletClass - we are using Pre-A now and really like it

Derek Owens Algebra 1 honors

BJU Algebra 1

SM would probably be fine as well. Though I haven't researched it. I just like the other options available.

[Crimson Wife]

I had been considering Singapore's Discovering Mathematics. Maybe I'll revisit that as well. I am concerned about being able to help my dd with both of these programs, though. That's why I had finally decided to settle on Saxon or TT.

 

Any thoughts on Discovering Mathematics? She loves geometry and is really good at it, so I like the idea of an program that integrates geometry and I think she'd really like the Geometer's Sketchpad (not sure that's the right name) that's used with the program.

 

My DD is using DM 1 (now renamed DM 7) this year and we really like it. If you are concerned about course titles, it might be a really good choice since it labels by the grade rather than specifying the content. DM 1 covers pre-algebra and the easier concepts of algebra 1 & geometry. DM 2 (now DM 8) covers the rest of algebra 1, some of algebra 2, and more geometry. DM 3 covers algebra 2, more geometry, and some trig. DM 4 covers some advanced algebra topics, probability & statistics, and reviews topics covered in earlier volumes.

 

Unfortunately, the TM for the DM series is basically just a solutions manual. I haven't had any problems so far with teaching the material in DM 1, but it remains TBD how far I'll be able to take DD. At some point, I may need to outsource. Cybershala offers tutoring using Singapore's NEM series, so that's an option. I'm taking things one year at a time.

[Mom0012]

This makes more sense now. At least I understand the different approaches taken.

 

For ds I would consider two years of Algebra over two years of Pre-Algebra and basic math. As a minimim if you decide for another year of Pre-A I recommend introducing algebraic topics vs. simply more arithmetic (decimals, percents, etc...). This does two important things:

1. It helps build a mental bridge to more difficult and challenging abstract algebraic problems to come.

2. It allows him to build his confidence gradually while not feel so far behind his peers and siblings.

Many recommend two years of Algebra 1 anyway as it really is the foundation for all higher level math. I think this is especially true if a child has some learning disabilities. There are a number of ways to go about this. Many start with an easier Algebra 1 such as MUS or TT. Then take something more standards based and challenging the second year. If this were my son that is what I would do. Give him more breathing room where he really will need it - in Algebra. If still uncertain for him then at least introduce Algebraic concepts one day a week for example. It doesn't have to be all or nothing. This can provide motivation to finish up basic primary math and learn the 'big kid' stuff. You can build up his self-esteem this way, gradually, slowing down where needed.

 

For dd I would not place her in TT. While a fine program for some it is not the greatest for someone who is gifted and gets things easily. If a math program is 'easy' for a child that is typically not a good thing. They need to be mentally challenged to grow and learn - that just right challenge. For her I would look for something more rigorous as was mentioned by regentrude. Think college prep or honors math. TT and AoPS opposite ends of the spectrum from challenging to easy math. There are a lot of options in between. If AoPS wasn't the best fit for whatever reason I would also look at these:

Foerster Algebra 1 with Math w/o Borders DVDs

TabletClass - we are using Pre-A now and really like it

Derek Owens Algebra 1 honors

BJU Algebra 1

SM would probably be fine as well. Though I haven't researched it. I just like the other options available.

 

 

I really like the idea of 2 years of algebra for my son. This is something I have thought of many times myself, but he's done so well with CLE, I have been reluctant to break away from it. I do see there are a lot of algebra and geometry concepts gently introduced in CLE 7 and 8, so I have felt pretty good about what he is doing. My intention had been to have him repeat algebra the year he does geometry, or, at least go through one review section of Lial's each week while we're doing geometry, but maybe I need to rethink that.

 

Thanks so much for giving me an idea for helping me son feel successful!

 

I will look into the math programs you've got listed for my dd.

[Mom0012]

 

My DD is using DM 1 (now renamed DM 7) this year and we really like it. If you are concerned about course titles, it might be a really good choice since it labels by the grade rather than specifying the content. DM 1 covers pre-algebra and the easier concepts of algebra 1 & geometry. DM 2 (now DM 8) covers the rest of algebra 1, some of algebra 2, and more geometry. DM 3 covers algebra 2, more geometry, and some trig. DM 4 covers some advanced algebra topics, probability & statistics, and reviews topics covered in earlier volumes.

 

Unfortunately, the TM for the DM series is basically just a solutions manual. I haven't had any problems so far with teaching the material in DM 1, but it remains TBD how far I'll be able to take DD. At some point, I may need to outsource. Cybershala offers tutoring using Singapore's NEM series, so that's an option. I'm taking things one year at a time.

 

 

Thanks CW. DM is the only program that's really called to me in the past when I've considered trying something other than Saxon or TT for my dd. I have read that it is a very strong program and I love that geometry is integrated since that is a major strength of my dd's. I've had trouble getting much information about it beyond that though, since it does not seem to be widely used.

 

I am concerned that there are no support materials offered other than a solutions manual and that's what's really kept me from looking into this program further. There was a time when I wouldn't have hesitated to jump in and learn the materials myself, but I have some serious short term memory issues now due to a chronic illness and I feel I am at my limit with learning Latin and Spanish with my dd at the moment.

 

That being said, do you know if there is a placement test for DM?

[Mom0012]

I have younger students that have surpassed older siblings. I personally cannot imagine allowing the self-esteem of one child inhibit the natural progression of another. I treat my children as individuals and respect them for who they are and I expect them to do the same for others.

 

If your ds was struggling with reading, would you prevent your dd from reading appropriate level books? If he was struggling with writing paragraphs, would you make your dd stay writing only sentences even if she was a strong writer? Why not the equivalent philosophy with math?

 

I guess my oldest ds and my dh's egos could take a hit because our 11th grader is taking the highest college level math they both took in earning their engineering degrees. Better that than having forced a very capable math student to churn wheels accomplishing nothing from 4th grade until 9th. Fwiw, 11 th grade ds has an 8 th grade sister who surpassed him in writing, French, and her understanding of complex literature a couple of yrs ago.

 

Everyone has their own strengths and weaknesses. That is just life. Preventing a real truth from occurring seems like two negatives that are not making a real positive for either child.

 

I'm not sure where you are getting the idea that I am holding my dd back because of my son? I have explained that I have chosen to go deeper with math, by adding in things like RS Geometry, rather than rush ahead with her because I don't want her to hit higher math too early.

 

As I've been planning this weekend, I realized that she is going to be at my son's level soon and I simply wanted advice on how to handle that. My son is well-aware that people have different strengths and weaknesses. I've already explained that. I just wanted to soften the blow for him because math is an area where he feels strong (and does well), and I don't want him to lose his confidence when dd is at or above the level he is. Sure, it's life. But while I'm not going to hold my dd back because of my son, I want to handle it in such a way that he can stay positive about his success as well. I only have two children, so comparisons in a subject like math are inevitable.

[kiana]

I would second the recommendation to look into AOPS for your dd -- if nothing else, add in the discrete math (number theory, counting and probability) texts for her between algebra 1 and 2. These subjects are tremendously fun and interesting, but there simply isn't room for them in the standard curriculum. AOPS curriculum is also very full and enriched -- it would definitely slow her down without shortchanging her education.

[Dmmetler]

Would your DD like eIMACs? http://www.elementsofmathematics.com/

 

It's a different math sequence entirely, and would avoid the "book with "Algebra" on the cover when he's only doing pre-algebra" problem, while giving her really, deep, interesting math. The foundations class is currently stretching MY brain as DD works through it ;), because so many topics are things that I never studied.

[Dmmetler]

Would your DD like eIMACs? http://www.elementsofmathematics.com/

 

It's a different math sequence entirely, and would avoid the "book with "Algebra" on the cover when he's only doing pre-algebra" problem, while giving her really, deep, interesting math. The foundations class is currently stretching MY brain as DD works through it ;), because so many topics are things that I never studied.

[kiana]

Would your DD like eIMACs? http://www.elementsofmathematics.com/

 

It's a different math sequence entirely, and would avoid the "book with "Algebra" on the cover when he's only doing pre-algebra" problem, while giving her really, deep, interesting math. The foundations class is currently stretching MY brain as DD works through it ;), because so many topics are things that I never studied.

 

 

This is another great recommendation.

[Crimson Wife]

That being said, do you know if there is a placement test for DM?

 

 

I haven't seen one, but this is the one Sonlight has for Singapore 6B and this is the one for NEM1. NEM and DM cover the same topics, so it should work. Be aware that the placement tests are designed to assess mastery of the material in named course. So you want to see >80% on 6B before starting NEM1. If the child scores >80% on NEM1, then you'd start at NEM2.

[Mom0012]

I would second the recommendation to look into AOPS for your dd -- if nothing else, add in the discrete math (number theory, counting and probability) texts for her between algebra 1 and 2. These subjects are tremendously fun and interesting, but there simply isn't room for them in the standard curriculum. AOPS curriculum is also very full and enriched -- it would definitely slow her down without shortchanging her education.

Would your DD like eIMACs? http://www.elementsofmathematics.com/ It's a different math sequence entirely, and would avoid the "book with "Algebra" on the cover when he's only doing pre-algebra" problem, while giving her really, deep, interesting math. The foundations class is currently stretching MY brain as DD works through it ;), because so many topics are things that I never studied.

 

Thanks, ladies. I will take a look at both of these this afternoon. I immediately like the idea of adding in the discrete math because of the "fun and interesting" comment. Overall, I have used very traditional math programs with her for a base, but then added in other things that I think she will enjoy and that seems to have worked well.

[Mom0012]

 

I haven't seen one, but this is the one Sonlight has for Singapore 6B and this is the one for NEM1. NEM and DM cover the same topics, so it should work. Be aware that the placement tests are designed to assess mastery of the material in named course. So you want to see >80% on 6B before starting NEM1. If the child scores >80% on NEM1, then you'd start at NEM2.

 

 

Thank you!

[Mom0012]

UPDATE:

 

So, I spoke with my son this afternoon and told him that if he really wanted to do algebra next year, he could, but he'd have to get through CLE 8 first. If he's truly motivated, he could easily do this since he should finish CLE 7 by the beginning of March. It means he'd have to do a lesson on the days he takes quizzes and he'd also have to do lessons on the weekend. He's thinking about it. :tongue_smilie:

 

I let him know that it was okay if he wanted to just continue as we have been and do algebra in 9th grade, but that his sister would likely be doing it at the same time. He's weighing the horrors of additional work against having his sister catch up with him. :001_smile:

 

Then, I took a look at the diagnostic test at the beginning of Lial's BCM and I can't believe he won't pass it with flying colors, so maybe he is already prepared for algebra? I'm going to have him take that test this week, and if he does well, we might hit the review sections of BCM to prep for algebra in 8th.

 

At any rate, I can see that it's all going to be good, whatever happens. I think even if he surprises me and doesn't do well with the Lial's diagnostic test, I've at least given him some options.

 

Thanks for all the help. I'll probably spend the afternoon looking at programs for my dd so I can figure out what direction I want to take with her.

[HS Mom in NC]

My older two daughters, now 17 and 15, are 22 mos. apart. The younger of the two passed the older one in math years ago. The older one learned to read fluently by age 5 the younger started learning to read at almost age 8. Our philosophy has always been that everyone should be doing what they can, when they can. Everyone's different. So we didn't change anything, we just kept them going at their own pace with what's working.

 

The whole, "someone younger is doing a higher level than me" is a problem created by grade levels. That's why we don't do the grade level thing-we never have. It's probably the hardest thing for parents who have had a child in institutional settings to let go of. In the adult world no such artificial structure exists. It's a way for people to measure themselves against someone else using a stick of little practical value. He should just get used to it now in preparation for the adult world. There will always be someone smarter, faster, better looking, more professionally successful, etc. etc. etc.

 

I'd focus on the attitude problem more than the math program if it were me because it will have a bigger impact on his life as a whole. You never have to feel bad about about what you've accomplished when someone else accomplishes more. Success is yours when you earn it and no one else's success takes away from what you've accomplished unless you believe the lie that it does and you choose to denigrate your own success. If it's a blow then he believes a lie. Tell him the truth. He's doing well and has worked hard and should be proud of that. She's doing well and has worked hard and should be proud of that. They should be glad for each other no matter what the other is doing at any age. The only thing anyone should feel bad about is sitting around doing nothing at all when they're perfectly capable of doing something.

[kiwik]

It sounds like you have it in hand. Hope it all works out. One thing though my mother still feels guilty that things came easily to her when her older brother really struggled.

[dereksurfs]

Great update Pastel! I'm glad you've included your son in the decision making process and that he will have some skin in the game. ;) If you do decide to use CLE 8 next I've heard that some parents will allow their child to skim or skip certain portions since the consumer math sections are more extracurricular so to speak. They are more of a nice to have vs. gotta have in preparation for Algebra 1. In this way CLE 8 can be accelerated.

[Mom0012]

It sounds like you have it in hand. Hope it all works out. One thing though my mother still feels guilty that things came easily to her when her older brother really struggled.

Great update Pastel! I'm glad you've included your son in the decision making process and that he will have some skin in the game. ;) If you do decide to use CLE 8 next I've heard that some parents will allow their child to skim or skip certain portions since the consumer math sections are more extracurricular so to speak. They are more of a nice to have vs. gotta have in preparation for Algebra 1. In this way CLE 8 can be accelerated.

 

Thank you!

[melmichigan]

UPDATE:

 

So, I spoke with my son this afternoon and told him that if he really wanted to do algebra next year, he could, but he'd have to get through CLE 8 first. If he's truly motivated, he could easily do this since he should finish CLE 7 by the beginning of March. It means he'd have to do a lesson on the days he takes quizzes and he'd also have to do lessons on the weekend. He's thinking about it. :tongue_smilie:

 

I let him know that it was okay if he wanted to just continue as we have been and do algebra in 9th grade, but that his sister would likely be doing it at the same time. He's weighing the horrors of additional work against having his sister catch up with him. :001_smile:

 

Then, I took a look at the diagnostic test at the beginning of Lial's BCM and I can't believe he won't pass it with flying colors, so maybe he is already prepared for algebra? I'm going to have him take that test this week, and if he does well, we might hit the review sections of BCM to prep for algebra in 8th.

 

At any rate, I can see that it's all going to be good, whatever happens. I think even if he surprises me and doesn't do well with the Lial's diagnostic test, I've at least given him some options.

 

Thanks for all the help. I'll probably spend the afternoon looking at programs for my dd so I can figure out what direction I want to take with her.

 

The only problem you may have with this is that it is possible that your DD may continue to accelerate and still pass DS in this subject in the coming years, he will need to be prepared for that. He may only be delaying the inevitable. My DS7 has passed my DD10's and is closing in on DD13, who is already using "honors" programs. It's just the way his brain works, it's also why he has a tutor. ;)