Will I regret returning IEW TWSS/SWI-A?

[abrightmom]

I purchased it at convention a couple of weeks ago. I'm ready to watch it. It looks really good; organized; BIG.

 

Writing with Skill is my goal (in 1-2 years). I'm second guessing my decision to use IEW for a couple of years. My oldest can stay the course with WWE3 this year (he's a few weeks in), use Rod & Staff English 4's composition lessons, and continue with his studied dictation, written narrations, etc. It SEEMS like IEW would be overkill now that I'm looking at it. I'm also considering the fact that he'll be almost 11 when he starts 5th grade and may very well be READY to begin WWS. That's only a year away.

 

I also have Writing Strands 3. Cheap. Incremental. I think my son would like it.

 

I'm just worried that WWE and the other casual writing we do isn't really ENOUGH. It feels like so little.

 

My 8yo was going to tag along but now I think it's just more than he really really NEEDS at 8 years old. Maybe he'd love it and it would get his writing skills moving forward more quickly than his older brother's.

 

I hate writing. It really overwhelms me. I am trying REALLY hard to hang in there with SWB's plan. We don't do all of her "writing across the curriculum" stuff though and darn it if I don't seem to "get" how to implement it beyond a written narration, copywork, and dictation each week. Maybe that, coupled with the WWE summaries and Rod & Staff lessons is ENOUGH until we hit WWS.

 

Returning IEW would put a lot of $$ back in the account. I'm really really tempted.

[lillehei]

I did it and I don't think you will regret it at all. My dc have gotten just as good of an education on writing with other curriculum than doing the key word outline method. They didn't like Pudewa (nor did I) and are much happier in a different curriculum.

[Alte Veste Academy]

I also have Writing Strands 3. Cheap. Incremental. I think my son would like it.

 

I'm just worried that WWE and the other casual writing we do isn't really ENOUGH. It feels like so little.

 

Well, whenever I think WWE isn't enough (which is often, LOL), I look at my handy-dandy WWS sample and breathe a sigh of relief. Think of it this way: when you get to WWS, doing WWS and IEW will definitely be overkill. For sure. (Doing both might actually kill my kids anyway, and they like writing. :lol:) My feeling is that if you're not going to keep going with IEW, why bother starting? To me, it's not a program you pick up for a year or two and drop. It seems like a commitment to a philosophy, with a sizable learning curve to boot. I'm sick of learning curves, honestly. :tongue_smilie:

 

For now, just add more to your casual writing (why not throw in WS, since you own it and think your DS will like it?). That's what I do. We do lots of fun stuff! (I'm currently giving the hard sell on No More "I'm Done!" on another thread. :D)

 

WWE is the tortoise. I have several hares runring alongside the tortoise. True enough, sometimes they run ahead and sometimes they fall behind, but I betcha the tortoise does indeed win in the end. ;)

 

Signed,

 

Person who has almost bought IEW 1,000 times. :tongue_smilie:

Edited July 9, 2012 by Alte Veste Academy

[monalisa]

I just got IEW today in the mail with TWSS along with SWI A, and haven't used it yet, so take this for what it's worth.

 

I've done WWE 1 - 3 with dd9 and I'm going to continue probably through WWE4 because I think it teaches valuable skills. But I feel like dd needs more before and if we move on to WWS. I think she is almost bored to death with the WWE routine; I have seen results but it has gotten old for her and for me. From what I've seen/heard/read I like the keyword outline writing approach a lot and want to try it. I'm planning to slowly do SWI A with her. They have an unlimited return policy at IEW so you have nothing to lose in trying it other than your time.

 

I looked at Writing Strands 3 several times and even borrowed it from a friend and really didn't like it. It seemed much more difficult to use (to me) than IEW. However, you and your child may love it. If you feel like he's getting enough with what you're already doing, though, I can see not trying the IEW.

[atozmom]

I returned IEW without any regret, but it wasn't a good fit for our family. :)

 

I think what you really need to decide is will it be a good fit for your family? Do you need the hand-holding that IEW will provide? Is it a style that will work well for you and your children? You say you hate writing. Will it get taught with the other programs you mentioned? We bounced around with writing so much with my DD that I found myself having to cram everything in during high school. Not a good place to be in.

 

Don't let the $$$ be a factor in your decision. I know it would be a nice chunk of change to get back, but if you think it would work well for you, the benefits of keeping it and using it would well outweigh the money you would get back right now. And like the pp mentioned, even if you start using it and it isn't a good fit, you can still get a full refund. Their customer service is amazing.

 

Not to make decisions even harder, but....I have also heard good things about Essentials in Writing.

[boscopup]

Watch some of TWSS first, then make the decision. You can still return it even if you've used it.

 

I'm using IEW with an 8 year old, and it has completely turned his writing around (ie, he wouldn't write before, and now he's â€writing with easeâ€, which he really wasn't getting from WWE. I plan to use WWS in a couple years, but I needed something else inbetween. He was still terrified to put anything on paper. Now he can write a paragraph from a keyword outline, combining sentences, adding an adjectival clause (who/which), etc. Having watched much of TWSS, I think it will be a good bridge for him. I also find TWSS easy to use across the curriculum.

 

I was originally planning to use WWE3 with IEW this year, but given the dramatic change after starting IEW, I've decided not to bother with WWE. I will continue narrations in general, but won't deal with the long dictations. My son has no trouble holding a thought in his head. He had trouble getting over his perfectionism when writing, and WWE somewhat encouraged the perfectionism by expecting perfectly spelled words, etc. In IEW, he writes in pen, asks for spelling or spells it phonetically, and we edit the spelling in the rough draft. The final copy has perfect spelling. This is what my son needs right now, since his vocabulary is so much higher than his spelling ability.

[abrightmom]

Watch some of TWSS first, then make the decision. You can still return it even if you've used it.

 

 

This is sensible. And, I'll do that this week. I just don't want to :tongue_smilie:. I don't trust myself to make a wise decision. I have had too many flops in the last year (pretty much everything about last school year flopped except math).

 

It's out and ready for me to watch. The truth is that I'm really overwhelmed with ANYTHING related to home schooling this year. It's mid July. It's bad. I have NO idea what to choose for content subjects (Bible, History, Geography, Science) and I'm sketchy on my LA line-up.

[PeterPan]

I'll just stick my wizened nose in for one minute and suggest that sometimes the answer depends on the reason(s) the things last year flopped. If they flopped last year because of issues on your end (too intimidating, not practical for your number of kids, too much prep, whatever), then that's what you have to be mindful of and solve. If they flopped because of things on your kids' end (unidentified SN, not feeling well, too busy with co-op to actually get done the things you planned, etc. etc.), then THAT'S what you have to solve. Make sure you're solving the right problem.

 

You bought IEW for a reason. You might want to say out loud to yourself what that reason was. Sometimes what skews our judgment when we get into all this is perfectionism. 4th grade (what you're hitting up on?) is an awful age. They're more independent and you're trying harder but you're busy with more kids. So you try really, really hard, right at the time when it would REALLY BE OKAY to back off, plow quietly and solidly, and have fun. Yes you have things to do, but the amount a 4th grader NEEDS to do is still SO small (compared to junior high), it's really ok to make that list, get it done in a peaceful way, and let it be good enough. Make a good enough plan, kwim? Don't try for a perfect plan. Make up a "this would be good enough if I got this done" list in your mind and then have a couple extra bonus things if there's time. Give yourself some peace. You still have years ahead to burn yourself out with stress over trying hard. This is not the year to try hard. Honest. :)

[abrightmom]

I'll just stick my wizened nose in for one minute and suggest that sometimes the answer depends on the reason(s) the things last year flopped. If they flopped last year because of issues on your end (too intimidating, not practical for your number of kids, too much prep, whatever), then that's what you have to be mindful of and solve. If they flopped because of things on your kids' end (unidentified SN, not feeling well, too busy with co-op to actually get done the things you planned, etc. etc.), then THAT'S what you have to solve. Make sure you're solving the right problem.

 

You bought IEW for a reason. You might want to say out loud to yourself what that reason was. Sometimes what skews our judgment when we get into all this is perfectionism. 4th grade (what you're hitting up on?) is an awful age. They're more independent and you're trying harder but you're busy with more kids. So you try really, really hard, right at the time when it would REALLY BE OKAY to back off, plow quietly and solidly, and have fun. Yes you have things to do, but the amount a 4th grader NEEDS to do is still SO small (compared to junior high), it's really ok to make that list, get it done in a peaceful way, and let it be good enough. Make a good enough plan, kwim? Don't try for a perfect plan. Make up a "this would be good enough if I got this done" list in your mind and then have a couple extra bonus things if there's time. Give yourself some peace. You still have years ahead to burn yourself out with stress over trying hard. This is not the year to try hard. Honest. :)

Oh Elizabeth,

 

You're so sweet and I like when you stick your wizened nose in.

 

Out Loud: IEW looks like it will FIT my boys who don't really want to write. It's straight forward with a check list. Type A me gets that. Every time I read about it I think, "That seems like it would fit us."

 

I was the problem last year. Not SN or naughty kids or anything else. Significant health issue at the start of the school year and a cruddy attitude on my part. Fear and perfectionism are biggies too. Letting go is easier said than done. :001_smile:

 

I am tentatively planning to start Ancients. My dream of using VP online died for a good cause (we'd like to buy a home and we're scraping right now). Ancients sounds meh. We've been in the OT for awhile now. For us, half of Ancients IS the OT. I want to play this year...... read a LOT of fabulous books, do a couple of unit studies (don't know what?), study geography with Beautiful Feet and Map Trek, read missionary stories, do a couple of cool Bible studies, study Pilgrim's Progress, do a lot of science related stuff. Listen to audiobooks (SOTW, Story Hour, Little Bear Wheeler) and watch a bunch of DVDs (history and science related). I want to draw with Mark Kistler. :D It seems so disorganized and haphazard. Very un-WTMish. :001_smile: I'm not very brave.

[atozmom]

I'll just stick my wizened nose in for one minute and suggest that sometimes the answer depends on the reason(s) the things last year flopped. If they flopped last year because of issues on your end (too intimidating, not practical for your number of kids, too much prep, whatever), then that's what you have to be mindful of and solve. If they flopped because of things on your kids' end (unidentified SN, not feeling well, too busy with co-op to actually get done the things you planned, etc. etc.), then THAT'S what you have to solve. Make sure you're solving the right problem.

 

You bought IEW for a reason. You might want to say out loud to yourself what that reason was. Sometimes what skews our judgment when we get into all this is perfectionism. 4th grade (what you're hitting up on?) is an awful age. They're more independent and you're trying harder but you're busy with more kids. So you try really, really hard, right at the time when it would REALLY BE OKAY to back off, plow quietly and solidly, and have fun. Yes you have things to do, but the amount a 4th grader NEEDS to do is still SO small (compared to junior high), it's really ok to make that list, get it done in a peaceful way, and let it be good enough. Make a good enough plan, kwim? Don't try for a perfect plan. Make up a "this would be good enough if I got this done" list in your mind and then have a couple extra bonus things if there's time. Give yourself some peace. You still have years ahead to burn yourself out with stress over trying hard. This is not the year to try hard. Honest. :)

 

Very wise and excellent advice!

[abrightmom]

Very wise and excellent advice!

 

:iagree: I'm pondering the "good enough" plan right now as I'm weighing everything.

 

And I need more coffee!

[boscopup]

This is sensible. And, I'll do that this week. I just don't want to :tongue_smilie:. I don't trust myself to make a wise decision. I have had too many flops in the last year (pretty much everything about last school year flopped except math).

 

It's out and ready for me to watch. The truth is that I'm really overwhelmed with ANYTHING related to home schooling this year. It's mid July. It's bad. I have NO idea what to choose for content subjects (Bible, History, Geography, Science) and I'm sketchy on my LA line-up.

 

:grouphug: Take it easy, and remember that content subjects will be revisited. :) Do whatever you think will get done, even if it's not "perfect". And hey, remember that you have math down pat! :lol:

 

I think TWSS will help you feel more at ease about writing... really, when you've posted about your oldest, I've seen a lot of similarities with my oldest. Go to my blog and see the picture of his paragraph he wrote last week - without complaint. LATE last year, he was freaking out over a R&S English exercise where he had to fill in a quote for: The teacher said, "____". :lol: (though he did great on the one where it was "Jesus said", because he was able to put a very short, "I am He." :D).

[atozmom]

:iagree: I'm pondering the "good enough" plan right now as I'm weighing everything.

 

And I need more coffee!

 

Anytime I seem to be going round and round about what to use/plan and I feel like my head is spinning, I take a break for a few days. I simply walk away from all planning and decisions. (and shhhh - even the boards :svengo:) I get a book (or 2 or 3) from the library. One that is easy to read, no thought involved, has a good story line, the kind a call "brain candy." I take extra time to play some games with the kids and just take it easy and think nothing about curriculum.

[abrightmom]

Thanks ladies. :001_smile:

 

I do want the head spinning to stop but I think I am at the point where I must decide. I have so much prep work plus life situations to deal with that if I don't make a decision we will never get on track. I have very little time I can devote to prepping for this school year. And, we may be living out of suitcases for a few months and away from DH/Daddy during that time. I expect a tough few months but we need a fun, interesting, structured school routine that is also portable. We will all be missing DH during that time so must be busy, busy and engaged. I also want to keep my 10yo on track. No messing around this year.

 

I am seriously considering not leaving the boxed curriculum. All this freedom I wanted has proven very troubling for my ADD self and has led to excessive worrying. HOD Preparing is sitting on my loft floor and it looks awesome for oldest DS. :001_smile:

[EmmaNadine]

I want to play this year...... read a LOT of fabulous books, do a couple of unit studies (don't know what?), study geography with Beautiful Feet and Map Trek, read missionary stories, do a couple of cool Bible studies, study Pilgrim's Progress, do a lot of science related stuff. Listen to audiobooks (SOTW, Story Hour, Little Bear Wheeler) and watch a bunch of DVDs (history and science related). I want to draw with Mark Kistler. :D It seems so disorganized and haphazard. Very un-WTMish. :001_smile: I'm not very brave.

 

This sounds like an awesome year. I know this is the WTM forum, but sometimes, WTM isn't always a fit, for either a child, a year, or a family. Taking a year off doesn't mean you don't get to come back.

 

And yes, it's scary! I'm just starting with a Ker and I'm already stressed about rigorousness and four year cycles and things, and the more I read, the more I think that any program needs to be adapted so it works for the family. It shouldn't be the other way around. Do not sacrifice your family to a teaching philosophy.

[Aludlam]

Oh Elizabeth,

 

You're so sweet and I like when you stick your wizened nose in.

 

Out Loud: IEW looks like it will FIT my boys who don't really want to write. It's straight forward with a check list. Type A me gets that. Every time I read about it I think, "That seems like it would fit us."

 

I was the problem last year. Not SN or naughty kids or anything else. Significant health issue at the start of the school year and a cruddy attitude on my part. Fear and perfectionism are biggies too. Letting go is easier said than done. :001_smile:

 

I am tentatively planning to start Ancients. My dream of using VP online died for a good cause (we'd like to buy a home and we're scraping right now). Ancients sounds meh. We've been in the OT for awhile now. For us, half of Ancients IS the OT. I want to play this year...... read a LOT of fabulous books, do a couple of unit studies (don't know what?), study geography with Beautiful Feet and Map Trek, read missionary stories, do a couple of cool Bible studies, study Pilgrim's Progress, do a lot of science related stuff. Listen to audiobooks (SOTW, Story Hour, Little Bear Wheeler) and watch a bunch of DVDs (history and science related). I want to draw with Mark Kistler. :D It seems so disorganized and haphazard. Very un-WTMish. :001_smile: I'm not very brave.

 

WOW, with this is almost EXACTLY the year we have planned! plus IEW

[MerryAtHope]

I purchased it at convention a couple of weeks ago. I'm ready to watch it. It looks really good; organized; BIG.

 

Writing with Skill is my goal (in 1-2 years). I'm second guessing my decision to use IEW for a couple of years. My oldest can stay the course with WWE3 this year (he's a few weeks in), use Rod & Staff English 4's composition lessons, and continue with his studied dictation, written narrations, etc. It SEEMS like IEW would be overkill now that I'm looking at it. I'm also considering the fact that he'll be almost 11 when he starts 5th grade and may very well be READY to begin WWS. That's only a year away.

 

I also have Writing Strands 3. Cheap. Incremental. I think my son would like it.

 

I'm just worried that WWE and the other casual writing we do isn't really ENOUGH. It feels like so little.

 

My 8yo was going to tag along but now I think it's just more than he really really NEEDS at 8 years old. Maybe he'd love it and it would get his writing skills moving forward more quickly than his older brother's.

 

I hate writing. It really overwhelms me. I am trying REALLY hard to hang in there with SWB's plan. We don't do all of her "writing across the curriculum" stuff though and darn it if I don't seem to "get" how to implement it beyond a written narration, copywork, and dictation each week. Maybe that, coupled with the WWE summaries and Rod & Staff lessons is ENOUGH until we hit WWS.

 

Returning IEW would put a lot of $$ back in the account. I'm really really tempted.

 

It sounds to me like he's already doing a lot of writing. You listed WWE, Rod & Staff, dictation, written narrations...If you do IEW, are you willing to drop a lot of that other stuff?

 

How much time do you want him to spend per day on LA topics? That's where I start. 60-90 minutes is usually plenty for this age, and by the time you have reading, writing, spelling, grammar etc..., it's easy to come up with more than that if you're not careful! With IEW, you can easily spend 30 minutes per day on writing. If you have your child reading for 30 minutes, that leaves you 30 minutes for spelling, maybe some grammar...I don't know that I'd add additional writing on top of it, you know? Maybe you could alternate days sometimes though (do a narration instead of an IEW assignment, use history or a reader as a source for a key word outline or a summary, etc...)

 

Another question to ask yourself: Is this the year to learn a new program? You sound overwhelmed with things going on in your life--it may or may not be time to check out IEW. I like to pull in and mainly rely on things I know I can count on when that happens. A big part of IEW is watching the teacher videos, and they are long.

 

He's 9. That may seem so old...but it's ok if you save IEW for a year too.

 

For me, IEW wasn't the structured program I thought it was going to be, and I did end up returning it. But know that IEW has a lifetime guarantee--you don't *have* to decide right now.

 

You can also return it now and decide later to purchase it if need be.

[abrightmom]

It sounds to me like he's already doing a lot of writing. You listed WWE, Rod & Staff, dictation, written narrations...If you do IEW, are you willing to drop a lot of that other stuff?

 

How much time do you want him to spend per day on LA topics? That's where I start. 60-90 minutes is usually plenty for this age, and by the time you have reading, writing, spelling, grammar etc..., it's easy to come up with more than that if you're not careful! With IEW, you can easily spend 30 minutes per day on writing. If you have your child reading for 30 minutes, that leaves you 30 minutes for spelling, maybe some grammar...I don't know that I'd add additional writing on top of it, you know? Maybe you could alternate days sometimes though (do a narration instead of an IEW assignment, use history or a reader as a source for a key word outline or a summary, etc...)

 

Another question to ask yourself: Is this the year to learn a new program? You sound overwhelmed with things going on in your life--it may or may not be time to check out IEW. I like to pull in and mainly rely on things I know I can count on when that happens. A big part of IEW is watching the teacher videos, and they are long.

 

He's 9. That may seem so old...but it's ok if you save IEW for a year too.

 

For me, IEW wasn't the structured program I thought it was going to be, and I did end up returning it. But know that IEW has a lifetime guarantee--you don't *have* to decide right now.

 

You can also return it now and decide later to purchase it if need be.

 

Merry,

 

You are a voice of reason. Your questions are good. I need to ponder them. I don't think we'd keep WWE if we move forward with IEW. I'd keep it in balance as I don't want to overwhelm my kids.

 

I guess this is why I am asking these questions. WWE works fine but I am not sure that we are learning about writing. The levels don't really fit my son. He needs to work on summary skills and we can do that orally. He uses studied dictation for spelling and we do study and then try to remember the passage after two or three readings. I think we are hitting WWE skills without overdoing the writing there.

 

Rod and Staff English 3 had very little writing. I guess I'll look carefully at 4. Maybe I'll be satisfied. Honestly, I think I could be. IEW feels safe and I think the teacher training may help me.

 

I did ask if my 8yo could use it but after previewing the materials this afternoon I don't think he is ready for SWI-A this year. :glare:

 

I am really on the fence with this. I think I'll keep the materials pristine and watch the overview DVD and the first SWI DVD tomorrow. :001_smile:

[Brooketopia]

Just wanted to let you know that I am in the exact same boat as you. I haven't watched the DVDs yet either.

 

I think the reason I was interested in IEW was that it felt like my kids would actually be writing, and when I opened it up it just looks like a bunch of summarizing. I think I'm looking for a creative writing program!

 

We've been using WWE and we're so bored with it. DD can handle it, but just groans when it comes out and both of us just grit our teeth so we can get through it and get on with our lives. I've been telling myself that we just need to be finishers instead of quitters, but it's been getting pretty bad.

 

DD used her birthday money to attend a Young Writer's Workshop in June for two weeks. She was so committed to her writing, which got me thinking about trying a new program.

 

But now I've spent $250 on something that doesn't appear to teach anything too terribly different from the program I was already using.

 

Perhaps it boils down to asking the question of "What is the point of Writing as a subject in the grammar years?" Is it just about learning to summarize information? That's so dry, and my daughter can do that already...she's been narrating, copying and dictating for science, history and literature for three years now. Do I really need to add a "writing" program on top of that? It seems like we're doing a whole lot of narration and dictation on our own, thank you very much.

 

I am sticking with FLL, though--we're actually learning new information with that program and the layout works for us.

[abrightmom]

Just wanted to let you know that I am in the exact same boat as you. I haven't watched the DVDs yet either.

 

I think the reason I was interested in IEW was that it felt like my kids would actually be writing, and when I opened it up it just looks like a bunch of summarizing. I think I'm looking for a creative writing program!

 

We've been using WWE and we're so bored with it. DD can handle it, but just groans when it comes out and both of us just grit our teeth so we can get through it and get on with our lives. I've been telling myself that we just need to be finishers instead of quitters, but it's been getting pretty bad.

 

DD used her birthday money to attend a Young Writer's Workshop in June for two weeks. She was so committed to her writing, which got me thinking about trying a new program.

 

But now I've spent $250 on something that doesn't appear to teach anything too terribly different from the program I was already using.

 

Perhaps it boils down to asking the question of "What is the point of Writing as a subject in the grammar years?" Is it just about learning to summarize information? That's so dry, and my daughter can do that already...she's been narrating, copying and dictating for science, history and literature for three years now. Do I really need to add a "writing" program on top of that? It seems like we're doing a whole lot of narration and dictation on our own, thank you very much.

 

I am sticking with FLL, though--we're actually learning new information with that program and the layout works for us.

:001_smile: THIS is so helpful! As I was reading this I was nodding my head with your thought processes. IEW looks GREAT but I concluded that my oldest is probably doing enough writing and if we stay the course with a few "tweaks" we'll be able to transition to Writing With Skill. I think I need to be satisfied in "less" as long as we are working consistently.

 

And MY 8 year old doesn't seem ready. It looks like WAY TOO MUCH for this particular boy at this time. I just don't know...

 

Writing Strands, which is loathed by many but loved by some (and recommended by SWB in TWTM), has a creative edge to it. It's also dirt cheap. I think my creative son who always has "writer's block" would really get into Writing Strands. That is my fall back and I think it would blend nicely with WWE skills without being overkill at all.

 

I am still going to watch those DVDs and see it fleshed out. I might change my tune. :lol:

[blessed3x]

 

I've done WWE 1 - 3 with dd9 and I'm going to continue probably through WWE4 because I think it teaches valuable skills. But I feel like dd needs more before and if we move on to WWS. I think she is almost bored to death with the WWE routine; I have seen results but it has gotten old for her and for me. From what I've seen/heard/read I like the keyword outline writing approach a lot and want to try it. I'm planning to slowly do SWI A with her.

 

:iagree:

This is the same with my ds10. We have IEW and are going to start it in the fall with WWE4. He HATES writing, but the slow approach to both and changing it up will hopefully work for us. (fingers crossed!);)

[Mrs Twain]

My son (3rd grade last year) particularly loved watching the SWI-A DVD's. He laughed uproariously at Andrew Pudewa's silly jokes. He didn't complain once about any writing assignment that Mr. Pudewa told him to do, which was far different than his usual reaction to receiving writing assignments. I have seen great results with IEW so far.

 

You may want to try out IEW before you return it. You may like it.

[boscopup]

My son (3rd grade last year) particularly loved watching the SWI-A DVD's. He laughed uproariously at Andrew Pudewa's silly jokes. He didn't complain once about any writing assignment that Mr. Pudewa told him to do, which was far different than his usual reaction to receiving writing assignments.

 

Exactly what happened here. My son is normally, "Oh no! Writing! Run away!" He likes the DVD though, and he just doesn't complain about writing now!

[Alte Veste Academy]

Katrina,

 

I'm wondering what you decided.

 

And I'm incredibly :blushing: :blushing: :blushing: by this...

 

Well, whenever I think WWE isn't enough (which is often, LOL), I look at my handy-dandy WWS sample and breathe a sigh of relief. Think of it this way: when you get to WWS, doing WWS and IEW will definitely be overkill. For sure. (Doing both might actually kill my kids anyway, and they like writing. :lol:) My feeling is that if you're not going to keep going with IEW, why bother starting? To me, it's not a program you pick up for a year or two and drop. It seems like a commitment to a philosophy, with a sizable learning curve to boot. I'm sick of learning curves, honestly. :tongue_smilie:

 

...because of this thread, and this post in particular:

 

I already own WWS, so I pulled it down last night after watching TWSS. I think you won't need to worry about the headbanging if you do a couple of years of IEW. It will build confidence and skill. We have done WWE for years. Ironically, I think IEW provides a much more natural progression to the skills required in WWS than WWE. I think WWS is an extremely quick ramp-up for a kid who has only done WWE. I like WWE. And I like the looks of WWS. But WWE-->IEW-->WWS appears to form a fairly seamless path, where WWE-->WWS appears to create a stepping-stone path with a pretty wide chasm to hop across to get to WWS.

 

SWB has recently said that both WWE and WWS can be three year programs with the fourth year being optional. That said, I'm thinking I will probably do IEW with DS9 in 4th and 5th (at least) and WWS with him in 6th-8th. DD can probably join him, as she has a very early birthday and could go either way. We'll see. It would certainly make my life easier. :tongue_smilie:

 

My oh my, but this crow is delicious. :closedeyes:

 

The learning curve isn't very steep, either. :leaving:

[Mynyel]

I loved..... LOVED IEW.

 

I did not have the time needed in order to implement it. I sold mine as well. It is an awesome program but I have to work full-time and I needed something else the was more open and go.

 

We use WWE and WWS now. It is easier to prepare and do.

 

ETA: It really depends on you but look through the material first and see. However here is what SWB had to say about her series

Edited September 18, 2012 by Mynyel

[Writerdaddy]

I agree with the hard sell on No More I'm Done (see link in post reply near top).

 

There are a bunch of books in that line of thinking and No More is the best start, since it has teaching philosophy but also very specific and practical week by week "how to do it," which you can sample, skip, follow at will.

 

My 8 year olds THRIVE on this approach to writing.

 

I also think it is a perfect complement to the WWE, copywork, and dictation, which we also do, although I am not convinced by the "wait and see years later" promise that the copywork and dictation approach will work out in the end-- maybe, and for some kids is probably the truth of it, but how do you know?

 

Just so you know, I teach writing in college and graduate school and I have always incorporated copywork and imitation even at the highest levels, so I am not agin'it.

[Mommamia]

There is a great post by Janice in NJ on the logic writing board that may be helpful (sorry, not sure how to link).

[justLisa]

I love IEW. My suggestion would be if you don't wnat to keep it, don't watch it ;)

 

You'll end up keeping it. It does have high resale though, so you can keep that in mind.

[Sahamamama]

Well, whenever I think WWE isn't enough (which is often, LOL), I look at my handy-dandy WWS sample and breathe a sigh of relief. Think of it this way: when you get to WWS, doing WWS and IEW will definitely be overkill. For sure. (Doing both might actually kill my kids anyway, and they like writing. :lol:) My feeling is that if you're not going to keep going with IEW, why bother starting? To me, it's not a program you pick up for a year or two and drop. It seems like a commitment to a philosophy, with a sizable learning curve to boot. I'm sick of learning curves, honestly. :tongue_smilie:

 

For now, just add more to your casual writing (why not throw in WS, since you own it and think your DS will like it?). That's what I do. We do lots of fun stuff! (I'm currently giving the hard sell on No More "I'm Done!" on another thread. :D)

 

WWE is the tortoise. I have several hares runring alongside the tortoise. True enough, sometimes they run ahead and sometimes they fall behind, but I betcha the tortoise does indeed win in the end. ;)

 

Signed,

 

Person who has almost bought IEW 1,000 times. :tongue_smilie:

Yes, this was what I thought, too, when I considered IEW. If I believe that WWE + WWS will eventually get us there (and I do), then why add-in IEW for just a few years? For me, I'd rather add-in (and have added in) a "real life" writing component -- (a) write a letter; (b) write a list; © write a poem; (d) write a story (her choice); (e) write a narration/summary of a book.

[Alte Veste Academy]

Yes, this was what I thought, too, when I considered IEW. If I believe that WWE + WWS will eventually get us there (and I do), then why add-in IEW for just a few years? For me, I'd rather add-in (and have added in) a "real life" writing component -- (a) write a letter; (b) write a list; © write a poem; (d) write a story (her choice); (e) write a narration/summary of a book.

 

:lol: Keep reading. I revived this thread this morning to post this:

 

Katrina,

 

I'm wondering what you decided.

 

And I'm incredibly :blushing: :blushing: :blushing: by this...

 

...because of this thread, and this post in particular:

 

Originally Posted by Alte Veste Academy

I already own WWS, so I pulled it down last night after watching TWSS. I think you won't need to worry about the headbanging if you do a couple of years of IEW. It will build confidence and skill. We have done WWE for years. Ironically, I think IEW provides a much more natural progression to the skills required in WWS than WWE. I think WWS is an extremely quick ramp-up for a kid who has only done WWE. I like WWE. And I like the looks of WWS. But WWE-->IEW-->WWS appears to form a fairly seamless path, where WWE-->WWS appears to create a stepping-stone path with a pretty wide chasm to hop across to get to WWS.

 

SWB has recently said that both WWE and WWS can be three year programs with the fourth year being optional. That said, I'm thinking I will probably do IEW with DS9 in 4th and 5th (at least) and WWS with him in 6th-8th. DD can probably join him, as she has a very early birthday and could go either way. We'll see. It would certainly make my life easier. :tongue_smilie:

My oh my, but this crow is delicious. :closedeyes:

 

The learning curve isn't very steep, either. :leaving:

 

Not ready for WWS yet, but ready for more than WWE4... Doing NMID and still loving it, even incorporating some aspects of artist's/writer's workshop as well... But still, in 4th, ready for more meat...

[Alte Veste Academy]

There is a great post by Janice in NJ on the logic writing board that may be helpful (sorry, not sure how to link).

 

Is it post #14 in this thread? I can see her points. The trouble is when you have (in my case) an elementary age child or (in other cases I can imagine) a very easily overwhelmed and/or reluctant writer who is ready for more than WWE but not yet ready for WWS. I agree that WWS treats the students as more capable and mature. But when you have kids who are capable of moving on from the copywork/narration/dictation combo but not yet mature enough for the rigor of WWS, a bridge could be quite helpful.

[boscopup]

Yes, this was what I thought, too, when I considered IEW. If I believe that WWE + WWS will eventually get us there (and I do), then why add-in IEW for just a few years? For me, I'd rather add-in (and have added in) a "real life" writing component -- (a) write a letter; (b) write a list; © write a poem; (d) write a story (her choice); (e) write a narration/summary of a book.

 

My son needed a bridge between copywork/dictation and writing from his brain. WWE wasn't quite getting him there. His oral narrations were great. He could do copywork no problem with no errors. He could do dictation beautifully. He couldn't make the leap from that to writing a SINGLE sentence of his own words. Writing a letter to someone? Ha! Not happening. Poetry? Definitely not. Writing a narration/summary of a book? If he could do that, we wouldn't have needed WWE. :D

 

I do plan to use WWS in 5th or 6th grade. In the meantime, IEW is giving us that much-needed bridge. After doing it for 9 weeks, I had my son write something about something he liked on our Disney trip a couple weeks ago. He drew a picture and then proceeded to write 3 sentences without complaint!!! I had written a few "keywords" on the board for him (not really keywords in the sense that IEW uses them, but just words that he might need to spell ;) ), and he wrote his thoughts down.

 

I'm using SWI-A right now, and we're entering unit 3 next week. Once we've finsihed SWI-A, I plan to use TWSS across the curriculum, and I'll bet we'll be able to move to writing narrations at that point also. IEW will have helped give him structure and a roadmap, and then we can work on summarizing (which he's actually pretty good at). Then when he's in 5th or 6th grade, he should be ready to tackle WWS. Let me tell you, the difference I see between my son's writing this year and the end of last year? Totally worth the money for IEW. Very much worth it.

[justLisa]

My son needed a bridge between copywork/dictation and writing from his brain. WWE wasn't quite getting him there. His oral narrations were great. He could do copywork no problem with no errors. He could do dictation beautifully. He couldn't make the leap from that to writing a SINGLE sentence of his own words. Writing a letter to someone? Ha! Not happening. Poetry? Definitely not. Writing a narration/summary of a book? If he could do that, we wouldn't have needed WWE. :D

 

I do plan to use WWS in 5th or 6th grade. In the meantime, IEW is giving us that much-needed bridge. After doing it for 9 weeks, I had my son write something about something he liked on our Disney trip a couple weeks ago. He drew a picture and then proceeded to write 3 sentences without complaint!!! I had written a few "keywords" on the board for him (not really keywords in the sense that IEW uses them, but just words that he might need to spell ;) ), and he wrote his thoughts down.

 

I'm using SWI-A right now, and we're entering unit 3 next week. Once we've finsihed SWI-A, I plan to use TWSS across the curriculum, and I'll bet we'll be able to move to writing narrations at that point also. IEW will have helped give him structure and a roadmap, and then we can work on summarizing (which he's actually pretty good at). Then when he's in 5th or 6th grade, he should be ready to tackle WWS. Let me tell you, the difference I see between my son's writing this year and the end of last year? Totally worth the money for IEW. Very much worth it.

 

The exact same story here. We could start a fan club :lol:

 

The thing about IEW is it's not JUST a "filler" for in between WWE and WWS. The foundational skills learned are going to help the rest of their writing career.

[2squared]

My son needed a bridge between copywork/dictation and writing from his brain. WWE wasn't quite getting him there. His oral narrations were great. He could do copywork no problem with no errors. He could do dictation beautifully. He couldn't make the leap from that to writing a SINGLE sentence of his own words. Writing a letter to someone? Ha! Not happening. Poetry? Definitely not. Writing a narration/summary of a book? If he could do that, we wouldn't have needed WWE. :D

 

I do plan to use WWS in 5th or 6th grade. In the meantime, IEW is giving us that much-needed bridge. .......Then when he's in 5th or 6th grade, he should be ready to tackle WWS. Let me tell you, the difference I see between my son's writing this year and the end of last year? Totally worth the money for IEW. Very much worth it.

 

:iagree::iagree: My perfectionist, reluctant writing 5th grader is doing amazing with SWI-A this year. I NEVER thought she would get this far this quickly with IEW. IEW is clearly launching her, and I am so very, very glad I made the plunge.

 

I'm not in a hurry to get to WWS. I see posts from moms with much more proficient writers than my dd, and their children are struggling with some of the assignments. :001_huh: I can't even imagine what I would have to do to get my daughter through those with any intact self-confidence. If this year continues to go as well as it has been, she will be ready for WWS in 6th grade. If not, she'll get there in 7th.

[abrightmom]

Katrina,

 

I'm wondering what you decided.

 

 

 

:001_smile: Sweet of you to ask and to share....

 

WWS is the plan for about 6th grade with an IEW Adventure for the next 1-2 years. I don't want to get to WWS and GRIND through it. :001_smile: My hope is that we will arrive at Writing With Skill's door step with a bit more writing confidence, experience, and maturity.

 

We have not officially begun school as we endured the loss of a dearly loved family member in August. We are nearly through the business side of dealing with the loss and will begin to focus our physical efforts on getting our home school in order. I have made a lot of changes for this school year and I'm not quite ready to begin .... Life happened and so we adjust. :001_smile:

[justLisa]

:001_smile: Sweet of you to ask and to share....

 

WWS is the plan for about 6th grade with an IEW Adventure for the next 1-2 years. I don't want to get to WWS and GRIND through it. :001_smile: My hope is that we will arrive at Writing With Skill's door step with a bit more writing confidence, experience, and maturity.

 

We have not officially begun school as we endured the loss of a dearly loved family member in August. We are nearly through the business side of dealing with the loss and will begin to focus our physical efforts on getting our home school in order. I have made a lot of changes for this school year and I'm not quite ready to begin .... Life happened and so we adjust. :001_smile:

 

:grouphug:I'm sorry for your loss. Yes taking time is a very good thing. And your plan sounds great. That is about what we are doing.

[Alte Veste Academy]

:001_smile: Sweet of you to ask and to share....

 

WWS is the plan for about 6th grade with an IEW Adventure for the next 1-2 years. I don't want to get to WWS and GRIND through it. :001_smile: My hope is that we will arrive at Writing With Skill's door step with a bit more writing confidence, experience, and maturity.

 

We have not officially begun school as we endured the loss of a dearly loved family member in August. We are nearly through the business side of dealing with the loss and will begin to focus our physical efforts on getting our home school in order. I have made a lot of changes for this school year and I'm not quite ready to begin .... Life happened and so we adjust. :001_smile:

 

I'm sorry for your loss. :grouphug: I know what you mean about life happening.

 

Not wanting to grind through WWS is exactly my thought as well. To be honest, because he is not a reluctant writer, I think I could get DS9 through WWS. But I don't want to get him through it. I want him to sail through it, frankly. I think IEW will help with that. I have the same plan for now, IEW for him in 4th/5th, then adding WWS in 6th. I might also keep doing some of the IEW themes then too.

[Sahamamama]

My son needed a bridge between copywork/dictation and writing from his brain. WWE wasn't quite getting him there. His oral narrations were great. He could do copywork no problem with no errors. He could do dictation beautifully. He couldn't make the leap from that to writing a SINGLE sentence of his own words. Writing a letter to someone? Ha! Not happening. Poetry? Definitely not. Writing a narration/summary of a book? If he could do that, we wouldn't have needed WWE. :D

 

I do plan to use WWS in 5th or 6th grade. In the meantime, IEW is giving us that much-needed bridge. After doing it for 9 weeks, I had my son write something about something he liked on our Disney trip a couple weeks ago. He drew a picture and then proceeded to write 3 sentences without complaint!!! I had written a few "keywords" on the board for him (not really keywords in the sense that IEW uses them, but just words that he might need to spell ;) ), and he wrote his thoughts down.

 

I'm using SWI-A right now, and we're entering unit 3 next week. Once we've finsihed SWI-A, I plan to use TWSS across the curriculum, and I'll bet we'll be able to move to writing narrations at that point also. IEW will have helped give him structure and a roadmap, and then we can work on summarizing (which he's actually pretty good at). Then when he's in 5th or 6th grade, he should be ready to tackle WWS. Let me tell you, the difference I see between my son's writing this year and the end of last year? Totally worth the money for IEW. Very much worth it.

 

This is really good to know. I'm enjoying this thread. Meriwether (from here) loaned me her IEW for quite a while :seeya: so I was able to go through it, without actually using it. ;) Well, you know how THAT is, LOL. I don't really know IEW from the inside-out.

 

It seemed too complicated for 2nd grade, with twin K'ers, so not for this year. It also seemed like too much for me to juggle even next year, with 3rd/1st, especially since the twins will then be starting WWE 1.

 

But... I can see my oldest maxing out on WWE before we finish Level 4, KWIM? And yet perhaps not ready in some ways for WWS. And I can see her wanting to "write out of her brain." Really, she already does that. Yes, poems. Yes, letters. Yes, lists. Yes, summaries of stories she's read and "essays" of things she's done. So it's good to know what others are doing with the WWE--IEW--WWS transitional phase, if they have a younger writer who's ready for more than WWE, but not quite for WWS.