Where do you find people?

[Jenny in Florida]

So, I made the mistake of asking my son to think about it and make a decision whether to homeschool again next year. I've been sort of going on auto-pilot assuming we would, but I realized I hadn't actually asked him.

 

(Note - I have no problem telling a kid he or she will homeschool if I believe it's the right approach. In this case, I just felt like asking.)

 

He says that academically he'll be better off at home, and he doesn't want to go to school because of the bite it would take out of the time he has available to do theatre and other things he loves. However, he does crave consistent time with people.

 

I knew that was the case. In fact, after his last remaining homeschooling friend jumped ship and went to high school this year, I spent weeks looking for something that would provide that kind of experience for him.

 

At first blush, it seems like a co-op would be the answer, but there are a couple of stumbling blocks for us. First, we're not Christian. Believe me when I tell you that I've looked (and looked and looked) and found that every one of the big, well-organized groups in our area is religious. And, while I might be willing to give it a try, anyway, neither my husband nor my son would be comfortable with that.

 

Also, my son is a little ahead of himself, academically. So, any co-op we joined would need to be flexible about age limits and such (which has not been our experience with most groups we've tried). One of the reasons my daughter ended up going away to the early entrance program when she was so young was that not one single group in town would let her take classes or participate in activities outside of her age range. She was bored and lonely and miserable and finally decided that going to school 800 miles away was a reasonable choice. I'd like to avoid that with my son.

 

Finally, it seems like most homeschoolers around here, especially the secular ones, send their kids to high school. So, there just don't seem to be a lot of classes or activities geared toward homeschooled high schoolers.

 

Please don't suggest starting our own group. Believe me when I tell you that's a terrible idea. I've tried. Twice. Both times were disasters that left me licking my wounds for a couple of years before venturing out into the world again. And, as I mentioned, we don't actually know any homeschooled high schoolers who aren't already involved in religious groups.

 

So, where have your kids found people?

[REv1053]

I have the same problem... though I managed to find an expensive co-op that I was willing to make the drive to.

Toastmasters? Are there an academic groups at the local high school he could join? Book club? 4H? Library classes? Does he have any interests at all, could he join an adult interest group (radio, airplanes, anything)? Community Ed classes?

Does he play any games, is there a local game shop he could hang out at?

Is it possible that he could be friends with a religious kid if it wasnt in the co-op setting? Our metro area has a teen group and while some of the children are religious, my son can find friends pretty easily in that setting.

I hope you find something.

[swimmermom3]

Sigh. This is the reason both of my boys are off to the ps high school. One is a returning student and the other has been home for 5 years.

 

Church groups, sports teams, Civil Air Patrol are all possibilities.

 

:grouphug: I would love to not have the guys going back, but they are lonely and right now, they do not like each other much.

[Jenny in Florida]

I have the same problem... though I managed to find an expensive co-op that I was willing to make the drive to.

Toastmasters? Are there an academic groups at the local high school he could join? Book club? 4H? Library classes? Does he have any interests at all, could he join an adult interest group (radio, airplanes, anything)? Community Ed classes?

Does he play any games, is there a local game shop he could hang out at?

Is it possible that he could be friends with a religious kid if it wasnt in the co-op setting? Our metro area has a teen group and while some of the children are religious, my son can find friends pretty easily in that setting.

I hope you find something.

 

He has lots of interests. He does lots of theatre, both tuition-based youth programs and community theatre. He volunteers at the science museum. He sings with a choir. He dances. He belongs to the youth group at our church and volunteers there, too. He was into model rocketry for a while, but that group kind of fell apart when they lost access to the field they had been using for launches.

 

The problem with theatre is that it's transient. Friendships are intense during rehearsals and the run of the show, but then everyone moves on. My son keeps in touch with a few kids he's met doing theatre, but without the ease of seeing each other at the next rehearsal, things inevitably cool.

 

Although he likes some of the kids in the choir, he's never really had any interest in getting to know anyone outside of rehearsals. One of his best friends also sings with the choir, and they enjoy seeing each other there, but neither has really reached out to any of the other kids.

 

One of the things he mentioned today is that he misses the social aspect of the large pre-professional school where he used to dance. The school where he takes his lessons now, which he really likes, is significantly smaller. He's one of the older students and is the only boy in his group. The girls have been nice and welcoming, but the social opportunities are limited. (Changing schools or going back to the big school are not in the cards. His special intererest is tap dancing, and this school has one of the best instructors in town, as well as connections to Broadway dancers who come in to do master classes and sometimes regular lessons.)

 

He really has nothing against kids who are religious. The choir with which he sings is based at a church, and most of the choristers are members there. He's just had some negative experiences with kids bugging or shunning him when they find out his religious beliefs are . . . different. So, he tends to be a little guarded.

 

I should emphasize that he does have friends. He's part of a fairly tight-knit group of four who've known each other for several years and hang out at church and at each other's homes fairly frequently. (We're actually having the group over next weekend.) But the teens seem to be drifting away from church activities. And with all of the others in school, things have changed.

 

I think what he'd really love is a co-op-type situation, where he knew he would have a place to go and the same people to see every week. He likes routine and rhythm to his life. And he craves consistent contact with people he knows. He likes to be in the center of things.

 

 

We actually tried one of two secular co-ops in our area this past fall. He did Lego robotics with the group. And it was nice, in some ways. However, the atmosphere was very casual, with people showing up once and then not for weeks, rolling in late, etc. Also, he was the oldest kid in the group, meaning that the academic stuff wasn't especially satisfying. And he was frustrated trying to accomplish things when the younger kids weren't up to focusing for any period of time.

 

 

The other secular co-op, which is farther away from home, currently has no kids of high school age.

 

Thanks for your comments and questions. Responding has helped me clarify some things for myself. And it's nice to know we're not the only ones coping with this stuff.

[regentrude]

This has been a problem for us, too. Not so much for DS; he is an introvert and a weekly playdate with his homeschool friends suffices. but DD is extremely extroverted and craves people. She, too, is academically very advanced, so that any coop with same age students does not satisfy her academic needs and ends up a waste of time.

She had one best friend from her public school days with whom she spent a lot of time. Unfortunately, they have grown apart and the friendship is now but nonexistent.

She rides horses and has friends at the barn. They are all older girls, which is a much better fit than same age ones. Last year she spent a lot of time out there.

She sings in choir and has found a friend there, and she also has a friend from her dual enrollment French class. The problem with both is the age difference; those are college students, and she is only 15. So while they do get together for fun stuff, it is not the symmetric soul-mate relationship she is craving.

She found some of her best friends on the internet and spends hours each day talking to them on skype, discussing all kinds of things, sharing creative writing etc. Currently these are her best friends with whom she shares the most. Using the internet allowed her to seek out and find like minded people, something that is much more difficult in real life where circumstances are not conducive to 15 year olds hanging out with 20somethings.

 

I see this as the largest problem about homeschooling and am constantly vigilant that she is not lonely. All talk about how wonderful homeschoolers are socialized does not really apply if you are in a small town, do not adhere to the prominent religion, and are academically extremely advanced. (Social aspects are the biggest reason why she will graduate a year early and move away to college- she needs to be with people.)

[swimmermom3]

 

I see this as the largest problem about homeschooling and am constantly vigilant that she is not lonely. All talk about how wonderful homeschoolers are socialized does not really apply if you are in a small town, do not adhere to the prominent religion, and are academically extremely advanced. (Social aspects are the biggest reason why she will graduate a year early and move away to college- she needs to be with people.)

 

Thank you for saying this. I have felt a bit alone on this issue in acknowledging. It always seemed to me that it was easier for a homeschooler who was conservative and religious to find social avenues for their kids.

[EKS]

This is the only reason my son attends a b&m school now.

 

I simply could not make it work.

[kewb]

I struggle with this as well. My oldest loves people and wants more people in his life. He does not want to go to high school because he knows academic wise he is better off at home.

 

Swim team does take up a lot of our time so that helps. He participates in the library teen group. He volunteers at an animal shelter. I have tried expanding his social circle in the past. I started a boys group in and it was a bust. The first month there was a large group. By month 3 it was the same 3 boys he was already best buds with. I have also tried signing him up for classes that are a series not just a one off class. That increases the chances of a bonding moment.

[Jenny in Florida]

All talk about how wonderful homeschoolers are socialized does not really apply if you are in a small town, do not adhere to the prominent religion, and are academically extremely advanced. (Social aspects are the biggest reason why she will graduate a year early and move away to college- she needs to be with people.)

 

I totally understand. As I said, this was the primary reason my daughter ended up going away to college so young. In her last year at home, she was simply wilting before our eyes. That's why I always get so cranky when people start telling me how they don't approve of kids going to college early. Every time someone tells me how there's always more to learn at home I want to scream. Doing college-level schoolwork at home isn't helpful when what your kid is craving is peers with whom to interact.

 

My son is a different animal. Because he does have close friends locally, he has decided not to leave town as early. He's a year or two younger than mostof his closest buddies, though. So, we just started him in "high school" at the same time they hit 9th grade. He plans to finish his high school stuff with me in three years and then do a certificate program in a field that interests him at the community college while his friends finish 12th grade. That way, he'll still be a year younger than average and with a year of college under his belt before heading to a four-year university, but he won't have to leave his friends until they are all going away to school, too.

 

We're in a decent-sized city and still can't find good options for our kids, apparently. (Who, me? Bitter?)

[Alice]

I'm in a very different place than you so this might not be at all helpful. I read the high-school boards often for inspiration and also to help a friend of mine who is starting out homeschooling a high-schooler.

 

Could you have some kind of small group that would give him consistency but not be the same as organizing a co-op? Like a book club or Lego Robotics team (if he liked that) or something to do with theater? It also wouldn't necessarily have to be a homeschool group. Maybe just something regular with some of his theater friends or the other close friends he has. If you kept it very small you might not run into all the drama of organizing an actual co-op or more official group.

[ks-sunflower]

I wonder if high intelligence and a mature, sensitive nature are isolating for young people and finding compatible friends is an issue whether the person is in school or not. My daughter is very intelligent and struggled to find friends and maintain friendships, starting in about 7th grade. In an effort to address this issue, we home schooled, then put her in private school, then public school, then community college at 15. Wherever she was, it was a struggle. Community college was somewhat of a relief because she related very well to the professors and to the academic workload. Finally, now that she is in the honors program at college in a major she loves, she has found friends that she can relate to. When I look back on it, I think her extreme intelligence and unusual maturity and drive made her incompatible with many of her peers. I guess this doesn't solve your problem but maybe it will give you hope that things do eventually improve for these kids. It sounds like theater and dance are wonderful activities to stay involved in. Also, my daughter had to take the initiative in approaching new people, setting up lunch dates, etc. It was uncomfortable to do at first but it's a skill adults use all the time and important to learn when you don't have the built-in structure of school to establish friendships.

[snowbeltmom]

I wonder if high intelligence and a mature, sensitive nature are isolating for young people and finding compatible friends is an issue whether the person is in school or not.

This is exactly what I was going to post. I have more than one friend who is concerned about her child's lack of friends - all attend B&M school.

 

One of my friends was extremely relieved when her dd graduated high school and moved on to college. In college she was able to find her "tribe" and is now very happy. The high school years were miserable for my friend and her dd for the reasons bolded above.

[regentrude]

I wonder if high intelligence and a mature, sensitive nature are isolating for young people and finding compatible friends is an issue whether the person is in school or not.

 

To a certain degree, that is of course always difficult. OTOH, if you have access to more people, chances are larger that you find friends - it is more likely to find a friend in a school with a few hundred students than in a homeschool group consisting of twenty people. And if you happen to live in a large city and attend a magnet school for students of similar intellect it should be MUCH more likely that you meet kindred spirits than if you live in a small town with only one public school.

 

When I look back on it, I think her extreme intelligence and unusual maturity and drive made her incompatible with many of her peers.

Yes, that is always an issue and has been for my DD as well, but it is aggravated in a school system like in the US where everybody is supposed to march at the same beat, no child left behind means no child is allowed to move ahead, and the general atmosphere is one of mediocrity.

If I sound bitter it is because I have grown up in a different country with a different school system that grouped students of similar abilities together, and I never had to endure the miserable interactions my DD had to when she attended a US public school.

[Gwen in VA]

My kids have found some good interactions (though not necessarily friendships) through interest-based activities -- music groups, volunteer activities, debate, etc.

 

1) I had to broaden my definition of positive social interaction when my older ones homeschooled. They honestly didn't have any close friends, but they interacted with LOTS of people through their interests. Dd1 went on to form some great friendships in college, so not having close friends in high school does not necessarily foreshadow social issues in college!

 

2) My younger ones have found more friends by being active in activities that are open to public schoolers -- music groups, youth group, etc.

 

Best wishes finding a good group for your son -- homeschooling high school seems to often be a lonely business.

[Jennifer in FL]

I'm in a very different place than you so this might not be at all helpful. I read the high-school boards often for inspiration and also to help a friend of mine who is starting out homeschooling a high-schooler.

 

Could you have some kind of small group that would give him consistency but not be the same as organizing a co-op? Like a book club or Lego Robotics team (if he liked that) or something to do with theater? It also wouldn't necessarily have to be a homeschool group. Maybe just something regular with some of his theater friends or the other close friends he has. If you kept it very small you might not run into all the drama of organizing an actual co-op or more official group.

 

I agree. This year I did a "cottage Coop." After running a coop with 100 kids for 4 years, then moving, starting a new coop for 2 years, and then joining one with older kids and teaching 2 classes, I was done. Tired of dealing with kids who don't show, don't do their homework, etc. Last year I did a cottage coop for 2 other families. Next fall I am teaching a "Windows to the World" IEW class for 8-10 personally invited teens (about 4 other families) who are like-minded in their schooling.

 

BTW, even if you are a conservative Christian family, it can be rough. Esp. if you live in a town where there aren't a lot of homeschoolers. My two oldest boys have the same issues. They are always wishing for the "good old days" when we still lived in Naples and had a huge group friends who were constantly at each others' houses and sleeping over. One thing I tell my guys is that back then we had way more time to hang out. Less school. No traveling sports. No elderly grandparents to take care of. I know they don't believe me, but it really is a huge difference.

 

Hang in there.

[Nan in Mass]

Thank you for saying this. I have felt a bit alone on this issue in acknowledging. It always seemed to me that it was easier for a homeschooler who was conservative and religious to find social avenues for their kids.

 

Swimmermom3 and Regentrude - All I can say is thank goodness for cousins and a large extended family. Between that and gymnastics, mine managed. Peacewalking was more like the theatre - very close for a time but then everyone went home to all over the world.

 

Nan

[Sunshine State Sue]

I see this as the largest problem about homeschooling and am constantly vigilant that she is not lonely.

I would have to agree with this. OTOH, I used to be constantly vigilant but along about the puberty years, it became less acceptable for me to arrange social activities for ds. He had to do it himself (or not as the case may be).

 

Before puberty, ds was extremely extroverted. As in, as soon as one friend would leave, he'd be on the phone calling another one to come over. Since puberty, he acts much more introverted. I wonder if this is normal. I wonder if this is a product of the large amount of rejection (for myriad reasons) that he endured when trying to find friends to play with. I wonder if it has to do with the infinite amount and appeal of online activities. I wonder if it's hereditary (he's a lot like dh). I think I'll have to start a spin-off thread about this.

 

Before 9th grade, ds wanted to homeschool for high school. He was involved in the religious weekly co-op (carefully selected classes) because the secular group had very few high schoolers. By 10th grade, he wanted to go to PS. We compromised and he started at PS and CC. We are able to dual enroll for free at CC here in 10th-12th grade. He says he likes PS better because the students are his age. He says at least the students try academically at CC. I would not say that he has met any friends at either place. Apparently, there was a girl at PS, but it fizzled before it started. I was hoping that by the end of the year, he would want to drop PS, but he doesn't. :tongue_smilie:

 

Ds has played on the PS basketball team since 7th grade. Between that, the competitive traveling team, and the trainer-led weight lifting (with local basketball and football players), that's all the "social" time he gets. We thought that things might pick up since he got his driver's license in January, but not really... He has about 2 "friends" that he rarely sees or calls. They went to the beach once or twice over spring break. Ds does not seem unhappy or depressed, neither does he seem like he is loving his high school years. I do suspect that better friendships will come in college when he is living/working/playing with the same group from the start. I think he still feels a bit like the odd man out.

 

Have you considered PS? At the very least, he could consider the PS choir and drama. Where we are, hs'ers are allowed to dual enroll in up to 3 classes and all extracurriculars. I was fairly adamant about ds not taking the core subjects due to quality issues. So, he's taking Spanish (foreign language is not a strength here) and an elective.

 

I remember back when ds was in K or 1st. A mom in our secular hs group with an active teen group (this was 2 states ago) talked about hs'ing the high school years as "character building" for the teen. One of my purposes in hs'ing has been to encourage ds to think critically and to follow his own path. In some ways, there is a backlash now, because ds is not so willing to, say, go to a HS football game because it doesn't interest him, even though it would mean hanging out with some kids his own age.

 

All I know is, that at this age, if it is a problem for ds16, it's not mine to fix. (Please do not misunderstand this statement in this online forum - I am absolutely not commenting about you)

 

:grouphug:

[cassiemc]

I wonder if you have something like we have here. It's a hybrid school that offers classes, but they also have an independent studies program. The program accredits his courses (at home or wherever) and the kids are able to do the extracurricular clubs, dances, field trips, etc.

[Mommyfaithe]

Thank you for saying this. I have felt a bit alone on this issue in acknowledging. It always seemed to me that it was easier for a homeschooler who was conservative and religious to find social avenues for their kids.

 

Well, I was quite conservative for a few years there:D...and it was still a bust....lol.

 

My kids #'s2&3 are/were extremely social and extroverted ....very like dh. They are also athletic ( unlike either of us:tongue_smilie:). Honestly, dd did very well being home schooled. We had her busy, busy, busy. I made opportunities for her to be social. Had lots of kids here...all.the.time!! Games, facials, movies, swim meet sleep overs, You name it....we did it. She volunteered, worked at a nursery school, life guarded, became a swim coach etc.

 

Now, ds.....him I should have sent to school. He NEEDED to be there.....but I didn't listen to my gut....I listened to my guilt. We did manage to make homeschooling work...and he did end up in a good place, but I think he really should have had a year or 2 at public or private school for his own head....IOW, he had big time grass is greener syndrome, which made him sullen, and very difficult to teach. I will not ever do that again!! He was not miserable, and did many social things all through high school. I put 70,000 miles on my van in 1 year for goodness sake! His personality craves people....

 

If you decide to continue homeschooling....and I think it can be a great decision:D....certain things I would consider doing for my son a bit differently.

 

1. A job. A boy needs a job. Mowing lawns, hauling groceries....washing windows....I don't care what he does, but he needs to do!!! He can start his own business if he can't get a job...advertise and work his butt off to get it off the ground. It is even better if he ends up hiring someone else too! What an experience for him in entrepenuership.

 

2. An outside class with peers or adults. Something he doesn't know a lot about yet. Photography, business principles, a new instrument, etc. In addition to the things he likes. My son was a swimmer. We were at the pool 5 nights a week and all weekend long during meet season. He loved every.single.minute! My son took classes in HVAC, became a certified oil burner tech at 17 ( took the adult class and aced it!). My other son is EPA certified to work on A/C since her was 16. He took guitar lessons, went to the gym regularly etc.

 

3. Online high school or college classes that happen in real time....with real people...preferably through skype, where they can interact. Ds LOVED these classes, and is still "friends" with many of the kids he encountered. They have even met up in NYC after they turned 18....and had a blast together!

 

4. If you decide to homeschool through high school, don't keep yourself boxed in by homeschoolers. They can be an odd bunch....not like us!:D

I have found the groups around here to be so exclusionary! Both the secular and Christian groups have their own agendas....and those agendas have hurt WAY too many young people and new homeschooling parents. Enter with caution. Groups are fun when they have a real goal. Not a just let's get together because we are doing this one particular different thing. " LOOK AT US, WE ARE DIFFERENT!!!". YUCK!!!!!!! Join a book group, a running group, a biking group, a physics group, a music group, a take care of the elderly group....but run like hell from an unfocused....LOOK AT US GROUP. They tend to peck to death their own flock.

 

5. Homeschooling high school is both wonderful and awful. I will never stop questioning every book we study, every group we join, every step we take....but, if I did stop, I would not be doing a good job. I need to take the needs of MY child and somehow turn them into clear cut goals and then implement them. It is MUCH MORE DIFFICULT than plopping them on the bus....even when you think that is the best step. It would have been much easier for ME and for my ds if I would have just signed him up at the PS. The battle between us would have been over....and he would have had to deal with things himself. That is NOT necessarily a bad thing. For my one ds, it may have turned out to be the best thing. Not so much for my dds....or my 2nd ds. Each child is an individual and their needs have to be considered separately. However, don't think the school will give a flying flip over your individual child's needs. They just have too many individuals.

 

Socialization does not necessarily happen at the doors of the yellow bus. As a matter of fact, that place is often the gateway to bullying, ostracization, peer pressure, and just an unhealthy situation. Not always....but often enough. Consider where your kid resides of the food chain. Older ds is a networker, a schmoozed, a hand shaker.....he would have been BIG MAN ON CAMPUS. Ds # 2 would have been on anti-depressants first semester.

 

Oh, last bit of advice for now...if youbdecide to homeschool....make clear cut goals before you start your courses. this is what you have to do for an A, this for a B....if youbfail, this is the consequence. If you can plan an exam or an outside evaluation of some sort ( science fair, mythology or Latin exam, SAT2, CLEP exam, big family party with a presentation) it will help your child make goals and meet them. It won't seem like a bunch of senseless busywork that you are inflicting on your child for the sheer pleasure of it. Those wrap ups at the end are REALLY important! Just like dance recitals, or the play at the end of a gazillion rehearsals....some concrete way of marking progress and making a bIg to-do about it is really important.

 

Hope some of this helps someone....

Regards,

Faithe

[Jenny in Florida]

Have you considered PS? At the very least, he could consider the PS choir and drama. Where we are, hs'ers are allowed to dual enroll in up to 3 classes and all extracurriculars. I was fairly adamant about ds not taking the core subjects due to quality issues. So, he's taking Spanish (foreign language is not a strength here) and an elective.

 

We have considered public school. In fact, last spring we filled out the paperwork to have him apply to the performing arts magnet school. In between the time we submitted the application, though, and the date of the audition, he changed his mind. He decided that he doesn't want to give up the flexibility that homeschooling allows to do theatre and other stuff. He re-stated that during our conversation yesterday.

 

 

I would be very hesitant to try part-time public school, for a variety of reasons. First is the scheduling issue. But my son also doesn't do especially well being only halfway involved.

 

 

All I know is, that at this age, if it is a problem for ds16, it's not mine to fix. (Please do not misunderstand this statement in this online forum - I am absolutely not commenting about you)

 

:grouphug:

 

I agree, actually, about the not-my-problem thing. I don't feel the need to "fix" this. I'd just like to make sure my son is aware of any opportunities that are out there, after which he'd need to decide what to do with that information.

 

One of the things I'm realizing as I read over and mentally respond to everyone's comments is that he's looking for a fairly specific thing. He has close friends already. And he keeps busy with stuff outside the house all the time. What I think he feels is missing in his life is sort of regularly scheduled contact with a consistent group of people. He's a social person who likes knowing people and being known. (This is the one who, when he walks into the barber shop gets greeted like Norm from Cheers.) He loves walking into a group and working the room. He loves feeling involved and plugged into a community . . .

 

It's not that he's lacking close friends. I think what he wants is a larger circle of people to know and see regularly. And, specifically, he'd like at least some of those people to be guys. (In theatre and dance, he spends a lot of time with girls. And most weekdays are spent at home with me and his big sister.)

 

Again, thanks everyone. Talking this through is helping me define the problem more accurately.

[Jenny in Florida]

I wonder if you have something like we have here. It's a hybrid school that offers classes, but they also have an independent studies program. The program accredits his courses (at home or wherever) and the kids are able to do the extracurricular clubs, dances, field trips, etc.

 

I am not aware of anything like that here. We have co-ops run by homeschool groups, most of which are not comfortable fits for us religiously. There are some private schools or cottage schools, but I'm not aware of any that are not heavily Christian (and expensive).

 

That would be ideal, but it's not something I've ever found in our area.

[Mommyfaithe]

 

 

One of the things I'm realizing as I read over and mentally respond to everyone's comments is that he's looking for a fairly specific thing. He has close friends already. And he keeps busy with stuff outside the house all the time. What I think he feels is missing in his life is sort of regularly scheduled contact with a consistent group of people. He's a social person who likes knowing people and being known. (This is the one who, when he walks into the barber shop gets greeted like Norm from Cheers.) He loves walking into a group and working the room. He loves feeling involved and plugged into a community . . .

 

It's not that he's lacking close friends. I think what he wants is a larger circle of people to know and see regularly. And, specifically, he'd like at least some of those people to be guys. (In theatre and dance, he spends a lot of time with girls. And most weekdays are spent at home with me and his big sister.)

 

Again, thanks everyone. Talking this through is helping me define the problem more accurately.

 

This describes my son to a T. He knows how to work a room. He loves to schmooze! He NEEDS that type of interaction. Not necessarily a new best friend....but to be the center of a bigger group. I am not sure if this is a character flaw...or just his personality. Either way...it is how he is.

 

All I can say is that type is NEVER fully satisfied with their social agenda. There are not enough social outlets in the world to give them that rise, and better to figure out how to deal with it. It sounds like your ds is pretty active in outside activities. Maybe it would work to join a gym...where he could go daily...at the same time....and learn to lift, or do a class there. That would kill 2 birds with one stone. My ds is happiest at the gym. It is a very social environment....but not necessarily competitive or exclusionary.

[Beth in Mint Hill]

.... Currently these are her best friends with whom she shares the most. Using the internet allowed her to seek out and find like minded people, something that is much more difficult in real life where circumstances are not conducive to 15 year olds hanging out with 20somethings.

..... (Social aspects are the biggest reason why she will graduate a year early and move away to college- she needs to be with people.)

 

I've often thought about this issue over the years we homeschooled. When our boys were about 16-18 they really had a problem finding people to relate to. They had always been able to find someone to "play" with, but as they got older they longed for friends with whom they could have intelligent discussion!

 

Our oldest son went to a great liberal arts college and was blessed to find endless stimulating discussions and many life-long friends while there. But the liberal arts college is not for other two, so I thought --HOW can one find this sort of thing without having to go to an expensive liberal arts college. It doesn't seem to happen in youth groups at churches either. :(

 

I have an idea, but I never got a chance to develop it. It's to start a Great Books discussion club for that age. Doing it in such a creative way that it won't look too 'nerdy.' (Of course, it will inevitably nerdy, since its for nerds. ;P but you know what I mean.) We started this kind of thing for adults (homeschooling parents) and it was tremendously successful at helping us find like-minded friends. ... the idea is that its a way of flushing out the serious minded teens from the homeschool groups around town. If they have nothing to gain but good, deep discussion about Dante or Plato, it's not going to attract the average teenager!

 

Perhaps an older, mature kid (perhaps 17-18)could start it, if provided some guidelines and ideas, they might just might be able to get a good thing going. This might be hard to do in a small town, but in a city area there are enough people around to provide that tiny percentage of people interested in this sort of thing.

 

I've often thought that one of the problems with classical home schooling is that we produce young people whose *minds* are 'all dressed up with no place to go!'

Edited May 26, 2012 by Beth in Mint Hill

[Mom22ns]

In our area there are 3 private schools that do classes 2-3 days/week and the kids do the rest at home. They are about half the price of other private schools and one at least offers band, orchestra, FBLA, speech & debate and I don't know what else. My kids don't attend school there, but do go to band there as they open their extra-curricululars to homeschoolers.

 

My kids are very different and so where they have found "people" has been very different. They both have two close friends at church.

 

Dd is a competitive gymnast and spends 16-20 hours/week in the gym. Her people are at the gym. She is an extrovert and really needs regular contact with people, but this outlet proides it for her.

 

Ds is an introvert. He is autistic spectrum and doesn't need a lot of people, but he does want to have friends. After years of searching we found a small secular homeschool group (I found them on Yahoo groups), that focuses on pre-teens & teens. The kids in the group range from 10-16. He plays RPGs there (D&D, Star Wars and others) every other week. Once/month they have a teen friendly social activity. In May they went to see Avengers. It ends up we average about once/week social time with this group and ds has found his "people" there. He doesn't need daily contact, but regular contact with people who share his interests has been terrific!

 

I disagree with Sue who said she couldn't arrange social time for her teen. While I don't call for play dates anymore, all of the moms in this group do intentionally plan social time for our teens and is that really much different? They still need help learning to foster friendships and finding non-threatening ways to get together.

[Colleen in NS]

:lurk5: for Jenny's original question.

 

I am currently searching for hands-on-skills-developing volunteer opportunities that we can fit into our schedule and financial means, as we haven't done many "outside" activities due to finances and transportation difficulties (many scheduled activities are afternoons/evenings when we have no transportation). Yesterday I saw a notice for volunteer gardeners at a heritage farm - they would train novices in gardening skills - and I thought, "That's the type of thing I should be looking for."

 

I have an idea, but I never got a chance to develop it. It's to start a Great Books discussion club for that age. Doing it in such a creative way that it won't look too 'nerdy.' (Of course, it will inevitably nerdy, since its for nerds. ;P but you know what I mean.) ... the idea is that its a way of flushing out the serious minded teens from the homeschool groups around town.

 

I'd like to hear more about your idea. I don't even care if the teens are homeschooled or not, as long as they want to do this.

[Jenny in Florida]

This describes my son to a T. He knows how to work a room. He loves to schmooze! He NEEDS that type of interaction. Not necessarily a new best friend....but to be the center of a bigger group. I am not sure if this is a character flaw...or just his personality. Either way...it is how he is.

 

All I can say is that type is NEVER fully satisfied with their social agenda. There are not enough social outlets in the world to give them that rise, and better to figure out how to deal with it.

 

Thanks so much for saying this. I shared your comments with my son, who kind of shrugged and agreed that you might be right that he might just need to get used to it.

 

We're still on the look-out for new possibilities, but I think we're past the crisis.

 

Thanks again, everyone.

[kroe1]

I agree that this child will probably never be satisfied with his social life. (Maybe not many people are.) So you might as well put his gift to work. Here's some ideas off the top of my head:

 

1. The theaters need techs all year. When he's not in a show, he could be teching. The time could be used for Bright Futures volunteer hours.

 

2. Go professional. I'm not sure what part of Florida you are in, but if it's close to Miami or Orlando, you've got it made.

 

3. Get a job. His dance studio would probably love an extra helper during the 4-5p timeslot with the little kiddos.

 

4. Go to the religious co-op. No matter how we are different in life, we will meet those who want to change us. So what. The conversation has to change at some point. Theater kiddos have trouble figuring this out because the theater is so accepting and admiring of differences.

 

Give us an update in a few months.

 

:)

[Jenny in Florida]

Thank you for your thoughts.

 

1. The theaters need techs all year. When he's not in a show, he could be teching. The time could be used for Bright Futures volunteer hours.

 

Very few theatres allow 14-year-old techs. We're tried. He even has training, but they don't want him.

 

2. Go professional. I'm not sure what part of Florida you are in, but if it's close to Miami or Orlando, you've got it made.

 

Orlando, and no, we don't. He's in a very odd stage. There are virtually no roles for teenage boys, unless they are short enough and young looking enough to pass for 10. Mine, unfortunately, is 5'10" and looks two years older than he is.

 

3. Get a job. His dance studio would probably love an extra helper during the 4-5p timeslot with the little kiddos.

 

Again, not really. We've asked.

 

He does volunteer as an assistant for summer day camps at a local theatre, which he enjoys. However, that does not put him into contact with other boys his age, which would be the same issue with dance classes.

 

4. Go to the religious co-op. No matter how we are different in life, we will meet those who want to change us. So what. The conversation has to change at some point. Theater kiddos have trouble figuring this out because the theater is so accepting and admiring of differences.

 

Umm . . . it's not like he hasn't had those experiences. Remember, this is the kid who has sung for four years with an Episcopal choir. He's gone to camp and on tour with those boys, who were, shall we say, not kind to him about his differences. He's danced with religious kids (until they dropped out because their parents figured out some of the teachers and administrators are gay). He's attended homeschool events and classes with kids of all kinds of backgrounds.

 

He would have no problem joining a group that included Christian kids as well as Muslims and Jews and athiests and pagans . . . But to join a group we know in advance is made up of a bunch of people who all believe the same things, which don't happen to be what he believes? He gets it, but he has no particular desire to go into a potentially social situation under those circumstances.

 

Another problem I have with the relious co-op is the academics. At the high school age, we can't afford to take a day away from the house unless it takes the place of or at least meaningfully supplements his formal studies. The co-ops locally use curricula that would not align with what he studies here, which would mean essentially wasting, in terms of academics, whatever time he spends there and the time that would have to be devoted to homework in order to do well in those classes.

 

Again, I truly do appreciate (although it may not sound like it) your suggestions and the time you took to type them. As I've said, working through responses to everyone's idea is helping me to define the situation.

[Matryoshka]

I have an idea, but I never got a chance to develop it. It's to start a Great Books discussion club for that age. Doing it in such a creative way that it won't look too 'nerdy.' (Of course, it will inevitably nerdy, since its for nerds. ;P but you know what I mean.) We started this kind of thing for adults (homeschooling parents) and it was tremendously successful at helping us find like-minded friends. ... the idea is that its a way of flushing out the serious minded teens from the homeschool groups around town. If they have nothing to gain but good, deep discussion about Dante or Plato, it's not going to attract the average teenager!

 

I've kind of done that, but we're not quite at the Plato and Dante level. But I got together 10 girls who are willing to read mostly classic books. It's both homeschooled and public schooled kids, but a great bunch. It started out 8/2 homeschool/pubic, next year as most reach high school it'll switch to 3/7.

 

One of the things I'm realizing as I read over and mentally respond to everyone's comments is that he's looking for a fairly specific thing. He has close friends already. And he keeps busy with stuff outside the house all the time. What I think he feels is missing in his life is sort of regularly scheduled contact with a consistent group of people.

To a certain degree, that is of course always difficult. OTOH, if you have access to more people, chances are larger that you find friends - it is more likely to find a friend in a school with a few hundred students than in a homeschool group consisting of twenty people. And if you happen to live in a large city and attend a magnet school for students of similar intellect it should be MUCH more likely that you meet kindred spirits than if you live in a small town with only one public school.

These are both problems we've run into. We have a great homeschooling community; the kids all have friends, many of whom they've known since they were babies. For my extrovert, it's the former that's been the issue. For the past few years we've had a weekly social group who have gotten together and sometimes had classes (non-academic), gone on hikes, or just hung out. This has been great, but seeing them once a week and book club once a month still has left my extroverted twin feeling isolated and down.

 

With my introvert, it's more the second issue. She doesn't care so much about daily contact, but she really doesn't have anyone who's her friend.

It's a small pool, and now that they're getting older and having more specific interests, it's been hard to find people that they really share those interests with.

 

That's one of the reasons we're trying the public school next year - it's large (about 400 per class), has lots of clubs, and has a very good academic reputation. For the extrovert, she'll get daily social contact; for the introvert, I'm hoping in the larger pool, and with clubs, she'll find even one or two kids who really "get" her.

 

I think it's a trade-off. Homeschooling does allow greater freedom, but you're not going to get daily social contact with a consistent group of people. Which ends up being more important depends on the individual child, family, and what schooling options are even available (if we didn't live in the town we did, public school wouldn't be on the table).

[Kim in SouthGa]

Hi Jenny-

A few suggestions, though keep in mind I haven't read all the posts yet. My son has really enjoyed becoming a part of CrossFit. I don't know if you have one, but we are in a fairly small town so you should be able to find one somewhat close. He loves the feeling of being on a team, instead of going to a regular gym where everyone has on their headphones and rarely speak to each other:D It is tough, but it has been really good for him. Secondly, don't count out the girls at dance as potential friends. My son has one or two boys that are close friends but several girls that are close friends. Maybe you could do a book club or something for them, or offer to teach a class that wouldn't be available to them at their school, like Latin or logic or a fun elective. Coop classes are great, but I have seen my kids develop the best friendships when we have made the effort to let them spend "fun" time together, like going out to the mall or for ice cream. Also, my son has really enjoyed Key Club, which is a volunteer service organization through Kiwanis Club. They do a lot of work but have a lot of fun too. Do you know if any of the local hs groups there offer a Key Club? We have many kids that just come for that, and it has led to all the social stuff like movie nights and birthday parties. It is a secular organization, I believe.

[Beth in Mint Hill]

I've often thought about this issue over the years we homeschooled. When our boys were about 16-18 they really had a problem finding people to relate to. They had always been able to find someone to "play" with, but as they got older they longed for friends with whom they could have intelligent discussion!

 

Our oldest son went to a great liberal arts college and was blessed to find endless stimulating discussions and many life-long friends while there. But the liberal arts college is not for other two, so I thought --HOW can one find this sort of thing without having to go to an expensive liberal arts college. It doesn't seem to happen in youth groups at churches either. :(

 

I have an idea, but I never got a chance to develop it. It's to start a Great Books discussion club for that age. Doing it in such a creative way that it won't look too 'nerdy.' (Of course, it will inevitably nerdy, since its for nerds. ;P but you know what I mean.) We started this kind of thing for adults (homeschooling parents) and it was tremendously successful at helping us find like-minded friends. ... the idea is that its a way of flushing out the serious minded teens from the homeschool groups around town. If they have nothing to gain but good, deep discussion about Dante or Plato, it's not going to attract the average teenager!

 

Perhaps an older, mature kid (perhaps 17-18)could start it, if provided some guidelines and ideas, they might just might be able to get a good thing going. This might be hard to do in a small town, but in a city area there are enough people around to provide that tiny percentage of people interested in this sort of thing.

 

I've often thought that one of the problems with classical home schooling is that we produce young people whose *minds* are 'all dressed up with no place to go!'

 

 

Well, as I look back at this discussion and realize what it's gotten me into--whew! My oldest son and his wife encouraged me to put something together that would help bring teens together. Don't know if we are going to be able to pull this off, but we have a website up and courses planned.

 

I've taught Latin online for years, but it is always difficult to get the kids to know one another when there is no face2face component. So, even though we are offering our courses to people around the country. There will be discussion for those teens that live near the city where each teacher lives. I'm in the Charlotte area and Jessie is in Richmond. We will hold round table discussions on literature and history, etc. At least once a semester... hopefully this will develop into something neat. :tongue_smilie:

 

Soon there will be more courses, but for now its just sort of a pilot program. And all this is inspired by our discussion here in May. It just finally pushed me off my backside!

My dil created the website, and since many of the people involved are Harvey's --it is http://www.harveycenter.org