scrapbookbuzz Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Our dishwasher has been broken for over a year. This year I told my husband he could buy me a dishwasher for our anniversary. I was serious and our anniversary was about 3 weeks ago. Still no dishwasher. I despise washing dishes so, sadly, they don't get done every day. More like every few days. I know that grosses out some of you. DEAL. :p I would love to have a new dishwasher. I'm tempted to just go buy one myself. But, since dh's paycheck is going to be much less than normal in a few days, even though we have the money, I don't want to stress him out. So I guess I'll wait. Some more. *sigh* But to answer your question, NO, I do not handwash because I want to; I do so because it's the only way the dishes will get clean! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommee & Baba Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I handwash and it's not because I love it...:lol: It's because about 5 months ago my dishwasher bit the dust! I need to replace it but I just can't stomach the cost....atleast for another month or two :lol: I can't wait to replace it with one that ACTUALLY cleans better than me! The one that puttered out was junky anyhow! I had to wash before washing them and then rinse them after they were washed :lol: I'm a BIG waste for handwashing. I literally run the water the ENTIRE time, use soap on the sponge a HUNDRED times and rinse them and put them into the drainer to air dry! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
In2why Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 Well, if you are hand washing the same dish with water (and rubbing with fingers or sponge, then rinsing well) several times per day, what is the risk, really? To me, it seems healthier than eating dishwasher soap film with every meal. It's also easier on the hands and the environment. For example, we use cereal bowls and then immediately hand wash without soap. You would have a problem eating off that bowl later? Yep, I hate to say it but I wouldn't want to eat out of a bowl that wasn't washed with soap. College Biology made me vigilant about food borne illness. Soap allows bacteria to float and get rinsed off. Same principal as handwashing. It might be slightly better if the dishes are glass and non porous, but still I can't imagine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKL Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 Yep, I hate to say it but I wouldn't want to eat out of a bowl that wasn't washed with soap. College Biology made me vigilant about food borne illness. Soap allows bacteria to float and get rinsed off. Same principal as handwashing. It might be slightly better if the dishes are glass and non porous, but still I can't imagine. But if you just ate a bowl of cereal out of the bowl and washed it a few hours ago, what could be in the bowl? Microscopic traces of milk? How is that any scarier than eating the cereal in the first place? I'm talking about family dishes, not dishes that might have been used by some contaminated person I don't know (or critter or bug), or could contain some toxin related to mass production. If my kids have an illness, we are all going to share it one way or the other. I make no efforts to avoid spreading stuff among us, as there is no point realistically. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prairiegirl Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 Our dishwasher has been broken for the last two years and there is no plan to have it fixed any time soon. I do not mind doing the dishes. Also, my kids help. They do all of the dishes for one meal and, usually, if one of them sees me doing the dishes by myself for the other two meals, they will pick up a towel and help so it does't take that much time at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassoonaroo Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 Yep, I hate to say it but I wouldn't want to eat out of a bowl that wasn't washed with soap. College Biology made me vigilant about food borne illness. Soap allows bacteria to float and get rinsed off. Same principal as handwashing. It might be slightly better if the dishes are glass and non porous, but still I can't imagine. :iagree: It's not the stuff you can see, it's the stuff you can't see. My 13yo ds is studying microbes for Science Olympiad and I went from believer in soap to firm believer in soap as I have helped him study. Soap (and detergent which is similar) is made so that it's got two ends to the molecules. One hangs on to grease, dirt, and germs and the other hangs on to water. The dirt-grease-germ ends all encapsulate the junk so they don't end up on other dishes. The water end means it's easy to rinse the soap off the plate. Soap/detergent residue is NOT a problem if things are getting rinsed. It wants to rinse off! And it does. And you asked what is still on the bowl? Or plate? Our food is not sterile, and neither are our mouths. We can handle a certain level of bacteria but germs can infect us when there are too many germs. Bacteria are what make meat go bad, make milk stink, make fruit slimy, etc. So, that clean looking bowl is probably loaded with saliva germs (including viruses that might not have made the person sick ... yet), food bacteria, fungi, molds, etc. At household levels, healthy people cope with it fine, but bacteria can double every 2 minutes! So, if you have a nice environment for bacteria to grow (room temp, damp) then those invisible milk microbes can form a biofilm in the bowl which eats the microscopic food particles left behind. It looks shiny but can be a literal petri dish. Why risk it? I mean, soap DOES rinse right off, it doesn't cost much, you won't use much, and you'd know that while your dishes are not sterile, they don't have beyond the normal level of household germs and you've denied the germs a diet of particles of milk, sugar, grains, etc. I'm sure that without soap you can probably get many things shiny and clean-looking. But it's not the appearance that worries me about this method. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKL Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 :iagree: It's not the stuff you can see, it's the stuff you can't see. My 13yo ds is studying microbes for Science Olympiad and I went from believer in soap to firm believer in soap as I have helped him study. Soap (and detergent which is similar) is made so that it's got two ends to the molecules. One hangs on to grease, dirt, and germs and the other hangs on to water. The dirt-grease-germ ends all encapsulate the junk so they don't end up on other dishes. The water end means it's easy to rinse the soap off the plate. Soap/detergent residue is NOT a problem if things are getting rinsed. It wants to rinse off! And it does. And you asked what is still on the bowl? Or plate? Our food is not sterile, and neither are our mouths. We can handle a certain level of bacteria but germs can infect us when there are too many germs. Bacteria are what make meat go bad, make milk stink, make fruit slimy, etc. So, that clean looking bowl is probably loaded with saliva germs (including viruses that might not have made the person sick ... yet), food bacteria, fungi, molds, etc. At household levels, healthy people cope with it fine, but bacteria can double every 2 minutes! So, if you have a nice environment for bacteria to grow (room temp, damp) then those invisible milk microbes can form a biofilm in the bowl which eats the microscopic food particles left behind. It looks shiny but can be a literal petri dish. Why risk it? I mean, soap DOES rinse right off, it doesn't cost much, you won't use much, and you'd know that while your dishes are not sterile, they don't have beyond the normal level of household germs and you've denied the germs a diet of particles of milk, sugar, grains, etc. I'm sure that without soap you can probably get many things shiny and clean-looking. But it's not the appearance that worries me about this method. Well, since I consider moderate exposure to dirt and germs to be healthy, we will have to agree to disagree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSMom2One Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 I am not totally against dishwashers, but I do consider them a luxury. Most other countries in the world do not use them. We have friends from Japan that are always very curious when visiting America and see people loading and unloading the dishwasher, and they think it's rather funny that we do this. Honestly, I think most American families have always had a dishwasher, so the mindset of today is that it is necessary - but it really isn't. Before the mid sixties in American, everyone washed dishes by hand. Really, I grew up in a home without one and didn't die. I lived in a home as an adult without one and hand washed dishes for 8 years without dying. We redid our counters last year and opted to remove the old dinosaur dishwasher until we can afford to replace with a new one. There are four of us in our home and we all take turns washing, and it works out really well. There are a number of things that our culture has taught us that we must have, and dishwashers are just one on the list. I could name a number of other things to add as well, but maybe that's better for another thread. Blessings, Lucinda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosyl Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 My dishwasher is broke, too. I wash as I go and let dry in the dishwasher. A kid empties when full. I am actually kinda enjoying it because now I am never behind on my dishes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elcmum Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 My dishwasher is broken again (4th time in 3 years), so I'm handwashing till we get things figured out. Two questions: 1. Those of you who handwash by choice just because you like to... why??? :lol: I've met a few ladies who just don't use their dishwashers b/c they just handwash. I never got that. 2. Those of you who handwash to save money on water or to save water as a resource, in general, then do you really think handwashing uses less water? Maybe I need a tutorial b/c even though I try to use little water, it feels like it is on/off/on/off/on/off a zillion times before I'm done! I do not put all the dishes in a sink full of water... is that the most efficient way to do it? Help an old lady out this Monday night! (ok, I'm not really old, I'm 36) I'm a brand new subscriber to these forums (although I was previously a frequent lurker). I grew up handwashing dishes with my brothers. Every night, we would fight about who would wash, versus dry or put away. (Drying was the worst.) I now live in a dishwasher-less house and it's almost relaxing to wash dishes with my kids. As much as possible, I try to make dish-washing part of their required chores so there isn't much for me to do. Basically, because of the way I grew up with washing dishes, we wash them in the hottest water possible with a little soap and a light rinse afterward for water conservation. (As an aside, in the late 90s I read in The Tightwad Gazette that compared to the time it took to scrape, load, and unload a dishwasher it was the same amount of time to wash dishes. Compared to the cost of running a dishwasher, it was a lot cheaper to wash by hand.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
In2why Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 But if you just ate a bowl of cereal out of the bowl and washed it a few hours ago, what could be in the bowl? Microscopic traces of milk? How is that any scarier than eating the cereal in the first place? I'm talking about family dishes, not dishes that might have been used by some contaminated person I don't know (or critter or bug), or could contain some toxin related to mass production. If my kids have an illness, we are all going to share it one way or the other. I make no efforts to avoid spreading stuff among us, as there is no point realistically. For me it wouldn't work, but that's okay we are all different. You asked and I answered, but it doesn't mean I am right and you are wrong. This is unsolicited advice so take it for what it is worth, stop defending what you are fine about. I know it is hard, but part of being a strong independent woman and mother means not looking for others for approval, and especially not people on a message board. The best thing about you mentioning how you wash is that there might be others who do the same thing and feel less alone, (and in that case you did a service) or others who are reading that might have thought about it, but now don't want to based on what others wrote. But if you know it is okay for your family, it doesn't matter what anyone thinks. Trust your choices Not trying to preach to you, but this is the first time I wrote what I think all the time. We share, we ask questions, we debate and we vent, but is this a hill to die on, and screw what others think if it works for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JessReplanted Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 How about those of us who handwash because we do not own a dishwasher but have fantasies about the sleek shiny washer that are done in 45 seconds, or that play a little tune when done. Count me in this group. 2 years and 3 months without a dishwasher (and counting...) :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassoonaroo Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Well, since I consider moderate exposure to dirt and germs to be healthy, we will have to agree to disagree. Nope -- we don't disagree on that point. I also "consider exposure to dirt and germs to be healhty." Our family camps outdoors, plays with our pets, visits church and the library, and otherwise live a normal germy life. Most microbes in our life are either indifferent or downright friendly to us! Only about 1% of them are pathogenic (capable of causing disease). Those pathogens aren't what we are usually finding outside, in public, and with our pets; they are in our restrooms and kitchens. So, we do very BASIC hygiene practices such as washing our hands after toilet visits, cleaning our restrooms weekly, and (gasp!) washing our dishes with detergent. My washing dishes with detergent in no way means I disagree with your conjecture of some germs being good! It's just a normal way to protect my family and friends from the nasty germs that can make us sick! What we disagree on is not that "some germs are good," what we disagree on is "washing dishes with a squirt of dish soap is a good idea." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swellmomma Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Nope -- we don't disagree on that point. I also "consider exposure to dirt and germs to be healhty." Our family camps outdoors, plays with our pets, visits church and the library, and otherwise live a normal germy life. Most microbes in our life are either indifferent or downright friendly to us! Only about 1% of them are pathogenic (capable of causing disease). Those pathogens aren't what we are usually finding outside, in public, and with our pets; they are in our restrooms and kitchens. So, we do very BASIC hygiene practices such as washing our hands after toilet visits, cleaning our restrooms weekly, and (gasp!) washing our dishes with detergent. My washing dishes with detergent in no way means I disagree with your conjecture of some germs being good! It's just a normal way to protect my family and friends from the nasty germs that can make us sick! What we disagree on is not that "some germs are good," what we disagree on is "washing dishes with a squirt of dish soap is a good idea." :iagree:Precisely! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I had a teacher (low *many* years ago) who handwashed becasue it was family time. her kids were in there with her, and everyone helped with drying and putting away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisa in the UP of MI Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 We did not have a dishwasher until we moved into this house exactly three years ago. I used to rinse the dishes after each meal and stack them on the counter. Then after supper when dh was home to play with the kids I would spend about an hour doing the dishes. It worked so much better than trying to fit it in during the day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGHEALTHYMOM Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 By the way: does anyone have a good: cheap recipe for good dish soap for the sink???? Our dishwasher broke for good this time, and I try to get my 2 oldest to wash most of the time. I still end up cleaning out the sinks and putting most of the food into a compost bucket. I tried the Dr. Bronner's orange castile soap mixed with water and I admit we loved the way it cleaned. Alas, it was too expensive to keep buying. Maybe I should just add some borax to a bottle of store bought? Even though we use paper plates alot, we still have tons of dishes! I need to get into some bulk cooking and freezing: only problem there is that most of the organic or grass fed meat I can get is already frozen! So, I can't re -freeze it. Thanks for any advice here too! We have old and I mean old kitchen cabinets, and have to have a seperate dishwasher ( hook up to sink) and they are at least $400-500 each. I can't afford new cabinets and don't see how to install one in ours or I would get a cheaper one. :willy_nilly: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
always cookin' Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 We just got a new dishwasher after our old one finally broke. It works so much better. Everything comes out clean, and I do not pre-rinse. I should have bought a new one several years ago. I personally would not want to hand wash all of our dishes because my hands crack and bleed during the winter. It is very painful. BTW, the dishwasher we bought was not an expensive model. I just can't believe how well it works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KungFuPanda Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Well, since I consider moderate exposure to dirt and germs to be healthy, we will have to agree to disagree. I think it's great for you to decide not to use soap, but I do hope you warn your house guests. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 My dishwasher is broke, too.I wash as I go and let dry in the dishwasher. A kid empties when full. I am actually kinda enjoying it because now I am never behind on my dishes. This thread was very inspiring to me. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susan in KY Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 ...Once you've done it for years, you get a routine down and it doesn't take long.... :iagree:I decided to time myself. When I realized what I actually could accomplish in 5 or 10 minutes, I stopped being irritated by having to do it, and started enjoying a clean sink. :001_smile: I have hand-washed for years, and though I always wish I had a dishwasher on Thanksgiving, I no longer pine for one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susan in KY Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 ... BTW' date=' the dishwasher we bought was not an expensive model. I just can't believe how well it works.[/quote'] So, which did you get? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanna Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 ...I have hand-washed for years, and though I always wish I had a dishwasher on Thanksgiving, I no longer pine for one. During big holiday dinners is the only time I've really wanted a dishwasher as well. :) My kids have been "hired" for about a year now to do the breakfast and dinner dishes. I pay them about $1/week and it's been a win-win situation; they've learned about washing dishes and about money management. (Oh, and hubs helps oldest son with the dinner dishes.) :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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