Scout/AHG behavior question--WWYD?

[m0mmaBuck]

I am the leader for DD's Pathfinder group (kindy girls) and we have a few BSA Lion Cubs (kindy boys) that tag along. "My" group is very respectful and well-behaved. They listen when I speak or read to them, follow the rules of games, work on the projects given to them, etc.

 

Last night my DD and I were the only ones from our group that came so I was put in with the next-aged group of girls... 1st-3rd graders. Fine. Their leader didn't come so I was put in charge. Fine. The Troopmaster gave me things to work on and away I went.

 

However.... There is a family with kids that do not listen, do not like to share, do not follow instructions, get the other kids upset, and then complain/point out shortcomings when the other kids act out in response to them. They do not listen to adults and have trouble letting others have their turn to speak or act. My DD ended up spending a large amount of the meeting in a corner (voluntarily) because she didn't want to be near the behavior. Another girl (very quiet, respectful, sweet girl) kept stating, "I am not used to this noise" and I could tell shewas not enjoying the experience at all.

 

The mom is in the room and repeatedly threatens to take the girls home but she does not. She does not have control over her kids... We've seen it many times during den and troop meetings as well as during adult committee meetings. My DD does not want to return if she is going to be in that room. The Troopmaster is aware of the issue but does not act. I do not want to be put in that room again but I also don't want the girls in there to not have a program on nights when their leader does not show.

 

WWYD?

[Samiam]

BSA Lion Cubs??? Huh....didn't know there was such a thing!

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

This is how most of my meetings are. I am a Wolf Cub leader, and I don't have an assistant leader for my den. Including my son, there are 3 kids who actually behave during meetings/events. The other 10 run around like crazy lunatics, talk and scream non-stop, never listen, aggravate each other. It's like a roomful of kids on speed or something. The parents make minimal efforts to control their kids, but most of the time, I'm screaming at the top of my lungs to be heard over the ruckus. Meetings are exhausting. I wish I had never been involved. I bring up these issues at leader meetings, but it's a pack-wide problem, and the other leaders have some of the worst behaved kids of all. Only a handful of us parents seem to have a problem with the lawlessness and insanity of the kids behavior. I don't know what to tell you, but just wanted to sympathize. I think I need to extricate myself from this mess, and find another social group for my kids.

 

In your case, I'd be glad for your group and hope you don't have to be put in that position again.

[dirty ethel rackham]

I think she means Tiger Cubs.

 

Back to the OP ... I would definitely bring it up and mention that you will not lead anything with those girls without a parent present at all times and that they will be asked to leave if they continue to be disruptive. Stand your ground. If you do not have the support of the powers that be, tell them that you WILL NOT lead any activity where they are involved. If necessary, leave the pack and find another one. I have very little patience for kids who make others miserable.

[Lily_Grace]

Huh, whaddya know, there is a lion cub pilot program going on.

 

 

I lead the Webelos here. They are wild, rowdy, and had me almost quit three weeks in. Things have turned around with strict expectations (I send children out to the hall if they need to be out of the group, parent with if they are there), we have a set routine, and most importantly, I enlisted the help of a dad. He's my enforcer and the one the boys can turn to when they need guy stuff. I'm the mommy. I teach and care and applaud. He has them do pushups if they forget their books and keeps order.

 

The most important thing is to make it clear to the parents there that you are in charge during that hour. Your room, your rules, and THEY need to abide by them.

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

Huh, whaddya know, there is a lion cub pilot program going on.

 

 

I lead the Webelos here. They are wild, rowdy, and had me almost quit three weeks in. Things have turned around with strict expectations (I send children out to the hall if they need to be out of the group, parent with if they are there), we have a set routine, and most importantly, I enlisted the help of a dad. He's my enforcer and the one the boys can turn to when they need guy stuff. I'm the mommy. I teach and care and applaud. He has them do pushups if they forget their books and keeps order.

 

The most important thing is to make it clear to the parents there that you are in charge during that hour. Your room, your rules, and THEY need to abide by them.

 

I'm hijacking this thread, apparently, but I posted one very similar to this a while ago. I've been trying this. But, I'd literally have to send 10/13ths of my den home every.single.time. Most of the parents don't give a rat's patootey, and will come over if I directly call them on something, but it's hard to run a meeting when you're trying to get a parent's attention every 2 minutes. I'm so sick of it. The dads in my group are no help whatesoever. I just need to decline to do this after the end of the year. I've made committees of parents to help with games, meetings, etc., but I can't figure out how to actually get them to help. I guess I'm just not a born leader.

[Ellie]

I'm hijacking this thread, apparently, but I posted one very similar to this a while ago. I've been trying this. But, I'd literally have to send 10/13ths of my den home every.single.time. Most of the parents don't give a rat's patootey, and will come over if I directly call them on something, but it's hard to run a meeting when you're trying to get a parent's attention every 2 minutes. I'm so sick of it. The dads in my group are no help whatesoever. I just need to decline to do this after the end of the year. I've made committees of parents to help with games, meetings, etc., but I can't figure out how to actually get them to help. I guess I'm just not a born leader.

 

Then you send 10/13 of the den home every.single.time until they get it, unless TPTB won't allow it, in which case, were *I* in your position, I would quit. It just isn't worth it. It isn't.

[Ellie]

I am the leader for DD's Pathfinder group (kindy girls) and we have a few BSA Lion Cubs (kindy boys) that tag along. "My" group is very respectful and well-behaved. They listen when I speak or read to them, follow the rules of games, work on the projects given to them, etc.

 

Last night my DD and I were the only ones from our group that came so I was put in with the next-aged group of girls... 1st-3rd graders. Fine. Their leader didn't come so I was put in charge. Fine. The Troopmaster gave me things to work on and away I went.

 

However.... There is a family with kids that do not listen, do not like to share, do not follow instructions, get the other kids upset, and then complain/point out shortcomings when the other kids act out in response to them. They do not listen to adults and have trouble letting others have their turn to speak or act. My DD ended up spending a large amount of the meeting in a corner (voluntarily) because she didn't want to be near the behavior. Another girl (very quiet, respectful, sweet girl) kept stating, "I am not used to this noise" and I could tell she was not enjoying the experience at all.

 

The mom is in the room and repeatedly threatens to take the girls home but she does not. She does not have control over her kids... We've seen it many times during den and troop meetings as well as during adult committee meetings. My DD does not want to return if she is going to be in that room. The Troopmaster is aware of the issue but does not act. I do not want to be put in that room again but I also don't want the girls in there to not have a program on nights when their leader does not show.

 

WWYD?

I would not tolerate it.

 

You might consider telling TPTB that you will never, ever take charge of the other group if those children are there. Perhaps if that group doesn't have a leader because of the poor behavior of those children, then TPTB will actually do something.

[Lily_Grace]

Im not really sure what to say. these are common problems when working with kids and if you aren't up for the challenge than perhaps you'd be better suited not offering.

 

One of my least favorite things is being in a group where something planned is obviously not working and no one thinks to change it to something which may work better bc they are too invested in the activity which isnt working.

 

In dealing with kids flexibility is your best friend. Over preparation is your next best. And a sense of humor isnt a friend, its a necessity.

 

If you have rowdy kids you are better off being very active.

 

If you are confronted with an situation be ready to ask for help and to tell the people exactly what you need: ie a troublesome inattentive kid who wont listen needs his own handler to keep him on task.

 

Take charge.

 

I'm sorry. I had the same thoughts in the back of my head before I became a leader. Scouts is a whole different ball game. For cub scouts I have a binder with meeting plans laid out by the BSA for two years' worth of activities. Some of the required activities are downright boring, no matter how I dress them up. And yet, the boys have to do them to advance with the coveted Arrow of Light.

 

 

Sometimes kids are just snots. There, I said it. It doesn't matter what the activity is, what the energy in the room is, they will be snots. I had 6 boys excitedly working on basic circuitry and creating Magyver flashlights. I had 1 making sure no one could work effectively. The week before, I had 4 boys putting together skeletons, first x-rays, and then giant paper ones, which was great because they were just studying that in school. I had 4 other boys kicking the x-rays and "tripping" over the working boys.

 

Weeks of sending them out has paid off. I have one who no longer comes and 6-7 happy kids each week.

[Lily_Grace]

We have years of heavy involvement in scouts and I dont agree that all the boring stuff has to be handles as a group at meetings.

 

Some kids are brats- that's just life. But deal with it or else remove yourself from the position if you can't.

 

Its natural to want to vent about things that bug you but I always hate when people bad mouth kids they barely know too.

 

Some of my most challenging kids have also been my most favorite kids over the years. Very few people under the age of 16 have no redeeming qualities. Find them and you'l all be happier.

 

Nobody is saying they don't deal with it. My way happens to be not letting them disrupt meetings at the expense of everyone else. How does the saying go? That's right - Your rights end where mine begin. There's a big difference between dealing with kids and parents at a voluntary activity and dealing with them in a required setting.

 

If you have another way of dealing with disruptions in a group setting I'd be glad to hear it. It doesn't do much for the person struggling when the only advice given is quit because you just don't know how to deal with it. It's not exactly productive and comes off as judgmental and quite rude, to be honest.

 

ETA: which groups did you lead in scouts?

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

In dealing with kids flexibility is your best friend. Over preparation is your next best. And a sense of humor isnt a friend, its a necessity.

 

I have all off these things. I have planned out all of our meetings, with options to change things up if one thing isn't working. I have lists of games ready to be played. And I usually have a great sense of humor.

 

If you have rowdy kids you are better off being very active.

I start out with something active, and alternate more sedate activities with more active activities.

 

 

If you are confronted with an situation be ready to ask for help and to tell the people exactly what you need: ie a troublesome inattentive kid who wont listen needs his own handler to keep him on task. Here's how my meeting went last night. 1. Attempted to herd the "cattle" into a group that somewhat resembled a circle. 2. Spent 3 minutes asking parents to get their kids to come and join the group. 3. Spent 2 minutes with my Scout sign in the air trying to wait for the raging din to die down so I didn't have to scream. 4. Screamed at the top of my lungs for quiet and attention. 5. Tried to explain the object of our first activity over the din since no one except the usual 3 quieted down. 6. Screamed for parents to come over and explain activity to children, since no one could hear me. 7. Did the activity (various exercises while saying what we are thankful for) with the 3 quiet kids, and made an attempt with the others, who kept running away from the group, while their respective parents said, "Darling, don't do that." 8. Gave up on that activity and decided to move on to our next activity, which was supposed to be showing and telling about their various collections. 9. Called parents, who had once again wandered away, over to help with collections. 10. Tried to get kids interested in looking at each others collections, but since most of them were talking and taking apart their collections, decided to let it be a free-for-all collection extravaganza. 11. Screamed for parents to come and gather up the collections so we could move into the gym for games. 12. Screamed at the kids to get off the stack of gym mats and stop hanging from the basketball nets (like I do every time we go in the gym. 13. Stood in the center of the gym with my Wolf sign up in the air to see if anyone would come over. 14. Screamed for everyone to come over so they could hear about the game. 15. Screamed for parents to gather the kids to hear about the game. 16. Explained rules of the game to those who bothered to get their kids to come over. 17. Played the game with the kids who listened to the rules, while the other half ran around the gym, ignoring my calling to them and ignoring their parents calling to them. 18. Gave up on the game, since only my 3 good kids were actually playing. 19. Screamed again at the kids to get off the gym mats and stop hanging off the basketball net. 20. Screamed for parents and kids to meet me on the circle in the middle of the gym. 21. Explained to the few who actually met on the circle for the 12th time how the school is kind enough to let us use the facility, and if we don't follow the rules, we will have no place for meetings. Then, I said, "Have a Happy Thanksgiving. Meeting dismissed." 22. Then the kids ran around the gym and on the mats and I screamed that it was time to go. 23. Then I went over to the group of parents who had no idea what was going on to tell them to get the kids off the mats and gather collections as the meeting was over.

Take charge.

How?

[Leav97]

Can you start with an email to all of the parents explaining the rules (especially in the gym) with consequences?

 

For example.

1) no playing on the mats in the gym or hanging from the basketball nets. This will result in kids being asked to sit along the wall, sent to the hallway with a parent, and/or sent home.

 

2) Please have the children quietly join the circle and help them participate in the group activities. Insert consequences here...

 

Please share these rules with your children before the next meeting.

[AK_Mom4]

Sounds frustrating, Lynne. Yuck.

 

Your problem seems to be that you have the responsibility, but no authority since the parents are standing around. And the parents don't feel empowered since you are the one in charge. Next meeting, I would probably let the hellions run wild (my kid included), while I had a group meeting with the parents for no more than 5 minutes. Tell the parents clearly that they either need to now round up their kid and get him engaged in what is going on or take him out of the meeting. And let them know that your expectation is that they work with their child to keep him engaged or they take him out.

 

If the parents are going to be there - make them specifically responsible for their child's behavior and for interacting with their child RIGHT NOW. Cubs scouts is not babysitting. Stick with it - any kid who is acting up and whose parent is not engaged - ask the parent immediately to remove said child to the hall. Call the parents on it. Nothing like a little parental embarrasment to get things moving.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

.

Edited November 22, 2011 by Tibbie Dunbar
unhelpful comment

[Murphy101]

Then you send 10/13 of the den home every.single.time until they get it, unless TPTB won't allow it, in which case, were *I* in your position, I would quit. It just isn't worth it. It isn't.

 

Yep. I agree.

 

Really, I'd be more mad at the parents.

[Mrs Mungo]

However.... There is a family with kids that do not listen, do not like to share, do not follow instructions, get the other kids upset, and then complain/point out shortcomings when the other kids act out in response to them. They do not listen to adults and have trouble letting others have their turn to speak or act.

 

Are these kids who are in the group or kids who are tagging along?

 

If they are in the group, then I would ask for some more support from leadership. When we have had larger or more rowdy groups, then we have done our work round-robin style. That allows us to split up some of the kids who play off of each other and keeps them all more busy.

 

If they are kids who are tagging along, then I would ask leadership about creating a separate space for non-attending kids or ask that they not stay in the room.

 

My DD does not want to return if she is going to be in that room. The Troopmaster is aware of the issue but does not act. I do not want to be put in that room again but I also don't want the girls in there to not have a program on nights when their leader does not show.

 

You need to ask for something specific to happen. Offer a variety of solutions, listen to alternative possibilities, if they have ideas. They may know it is rowdy, but may not have been able to pinpoint the reasons.

 

As far as your dd goes, you never know what will happen next year. I wouldn't worry about that now.

[FriedClams]

I am a Webelos 1 den leader. This is my third year in scouts, second as a leader.

 

I would suggest assigning the standing-around-parents task. Not asking, mind you. Smiling sweetly and signing them. "Tonight we are working on a craft and I need your help. When i start up in a minute, Please help me get these kids into a circle, and then you will assist kids a, c, and d and mary will help with D, k and y while I give directions. Let me get with Mary and let her know what's going on and then we I'll start."

 

Assign the worst kids to parents other than their own.

 

Be very directive. Most parents will help, but they don't because they aren't asked.

 

You can also assign the parents nights to help. "I am needing some help with meeting time. Since you are a X, could you please cover the requirements for y? Would the 9th or the 21st work better for you?" Be assertive. If they won't give you a yes, then reply, "well, I'll schedule you in for the 9th and confirm with you via email this week then."

 

I would not ever scream at the boys to get their attention. Stand with your sign. Eventually they or their parents will get it. Just stand and wait.

 

Sorry for the randomness of my reply. Hang in there. Get the help you need. It does get better as they get older.

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

Sounds frustrating, Lynne. Yuck.

 

Your problem seems to be that you have the responsibility, but no authority since the parents are standing around. And the parents don't feel empowered since you are the one in charge. Next meeting, I would probably let the hellions run wild (my kid included), while I had a group meeting with the parents for no more than 5 minutes. Tell the parents clearly that they either need to now round up their kid and get him engaged in what is going on or take him out of the meeting. And let them know that your expectation is that they work with their child to keep him engaged or they take him out.

 

If the parents are going to be there - make them specifically responsible for their child's behavior and for interacting with their child RIGHT NOW. Cubs scouts is not babysitting. Stick with it - any kid who is acting up and whose parent is not engaged - ask the parent immediately to remove said child to the hall. Call the parents on it. Nothing like a little parental embarrasment to get things moving.

 

Yep. I agree.

 

Really, I'd be more mad at the parents.

 

 

Okay. Based on last year's behavior, I did have a parent meeting at the beginning of this year to discuss behavior and expectations. The first couple of meetings were somewhat better than last year. I made a sign-up sheet to designate a parent to help with each meeting, since I don't have a co-leader. The more conscientious of these parents at least make some attempt at coralling some of the craziness, but it really is hopeless. I also got 4 parents to agree to be a "games committee", but they haven't been able to meet (in 3 months time) to come up with some games for the meetings. I do call out particular parents, e.g. "Jack's mom- will you please get Jack off the mats." "John's dad- John just said a swear word. Please come and take him away from the group and tell him he cannot speak like that at Cub Scouts." With 10 kids, who are all excellent candidates for the Supernanny show, it gets impossible to have a meeting while trying to address the individual non-stop shenannigans with each offender's parent. The year is progressing and the behavior is deteriorating. I guess I will have to do something drastic, like just sit down and stop having the meeting until someone figures out that there is a problem. I don't think I can adequately describe the level of chaos in these posts. And it's not just my den. It's the whole pack. It's like there is something in the water in this town that shuts down the parents' brains and they don't make the connection between their children's behavior and themselves. My kids have direct, immediate, and significant consequences for unacceptable behavior. That does not seem to be the norm, here. I really don't blame the kids. I probably would like some of them if they would ever stop running around and screaming. I pity the public school teachers. Except for my son and one who goes to private school, these kids are all from our local public schools.

 

 

ETA: Here's the post I made back in September about these issues.

 

OP- I'm very sorry to have hijacked your thread. Last night's meeting almost did me in, and your post just opened the floodgates! :tongue_smilie:

 

 

P.S.- When I say "screamed", I mean that I spoke in an extremely loud voice to be heard over the noise of the kids running and screaming.

Edited November 22, 2011 by thescrappyhomeschooler

[athena1277]

I am the leader for DD's Pathfinder group (kindy girls) and we have a few BSA Lion Cubs (kindy boys) that tag along. "My" group is very respectful and well-behaved. They listen when I speak or read to them, follow the rules of games, work on the projects given to them, etc.

 

Last night my DD and I were the only ones from our group that came so I was put in with the next-aged group of girls... 1st-3rd graders. Fine. Their leader didn't come so I was put in charge. Fine. The Troopmaster gave me things to work on and away I went.

 

However.... There is a family with kids that do not listen, do not like to share, do not follow instructions, get the other kids upset, and then complain/point out shortcomings when the other kids act out in response to them. They do not listen to adults and have trouble letting others have their turn to speak or act. My DD ended up spending a large amount of the meeting in a corner (voluntarily) because she didn't want to be near the behavior. Another girl (very quiet, respectful, sweet girl) kept stating, "I am not used to this noise" and I could tell shewas not enjoying the experience at all.

 

The mom is in the room and repeatedly threatens to take the girls home but she does not. She does not have control over her kids... We've seen it many times during den and troop meetings as well as during adult committee meetings. My DD does not want to return if she is going to be in that room. The Troopmaster is aware of the issue but does not act. I do not want to be put in that room again but I also don't want the girls in there to not have a program on nights when their leader does not show.

 

WWYD?

 

If it was only you and the mom in the room, then by AHG rules, she can't leave. You must have the "2 deep" leadership at all times.

 

I would suggest you talk to the troopmaster about finding the other mom a different place to work within the troop. Basically, get mom out of the room. I often feel like I have better control over a disruptive group when the kids are not looking to their parents to see what they can get away with.

 

My dd's AHG troop has so many Tenderhearts (1st-3rd graders) that they have to have 6 unit leaders to maintain the proper ratios of leaders to girls. Despite the man girls, they get a lot done at their meetings. I tell you that to say that it can be done, hopefully with only a few changes. Hope it gets better and your dd can continue in AHG. My dd loves it!

[Ellie]

Im not really sure what to say. these are common problems when working with kids and if you aren't up for the challenge than perhaps you'd be better suited not offering.

 

One of my least favorite things is being in a group where something planned is obviously not working and no one thinks to change it to something which may work better bc they are too invested in the activity which isnt working.

 

In dealing with kids flexibility is your best friend. Over preparation is your next best. And a sense of humor isnt a friend, its a necessity.

 

If you have rowdy kids you are better off being very active.

 

If you are confronted with an situation be ready to ask for help and to tell the people exactly what you need: ie a troublesome inattentive kid who wont listen needs his own handler to keep him on task.

 

Take charge.

Some things are common. What the OP says is happening is not.

[m0mmaBuck]

OP Here. Thank you for all the responses. I should have mentioned that our son is active in a different Cub Scout Pack and DH and I have been leaders since he was a Tiger Cub. DSS is currently a Venture Scout and we are active leaders in that Crew as well. And we were active in his Troop until he got his Eagle and turned age 18. So I am fully versed in how to deal with the kids when there is a Code of Conduct in place, but this particular Pack and Troop does not have one nor do TPTB seem interested in adopting anything uniform to help the age-level leaders. Instead it is a rather disjointed group with loose leadership from the top. A few of the dens are squared away with consistant leadership (mine, the Tigers, the Bears) but the rest have different leaders in and out and some nights, like last night, no leader shows for groups. Last week there were only 2 den leaders (myself and the Webelos leader) out of 8. Finally, I have control of my Pathfinders/Lions but this group last night was not my usual group and I was thrust into it by the Troopmaster when their leader did not show up last night. The one parent who did stay with her girls did nothing but threaten them with leaving. She did not correct their behavior in any way or encourage them to participate, be kind to the other girls, be respectful, etc.... So it totally is a parent problem BUT I think this group needs to set some ground rules or they are going to lose more girls than they already have (as several have already stopped coming to the group due to the unruly behavior of a few) And I personally will not be put in charge of this room of girls again (think substitute teacher walking in with no lesson plan, no warning... I had planned for MY group of kindergarteners working on the "Cherish your family" accomplishments, not this group working on flag etiquette and history). Additionally, the 1-3 grade girls work from a different book than the kindergarteners and last night was the first time I had ever seen their book... It was just not a good situation all around and not one I am willing to be put in again.

 

I called the Troopmaster today and told her I thought there needed to be a standard of behavior for the group whereas kids who are disrespectful, rowdy, undisciplined, in danger of hurting themselves or others, and in general behave in a way not becoming of a Scout could be removed initially from the activity at hand for a few moments and ultimately from the meeting that evening if their behavior persisted. I sent her a copy of the one used by our Cub Scout Pack... We have all of the parents and kids read and sign it so everyone is on the same page. Anyway, I did that and I let her know that I was not comfortable being thrust into a room full of unfamiliar girls just because their Den Leader did not come. The other parents in that group need to be ready to step up and lead in that situation rather than pushing two groups with different programs and goals into one room and having the leader sink or swim. We will see what comes of the conversation.

BTW, Lion Cubs are a pilot program for Kindergarten boys where as Tiger Cubs are 1st graders.

[m0mmaBuck]

If it was only you and the mom in the room, then by AHG rules, she can't leave. You must have the "2 deep" leadership at all times.

 

I would suggest you talk to the troopmaster about finding the other mom a different place to work within the troop. Basically, get mom out of the room. I often feel like I have better control over a disruptive group when the kids are not looking to their parents to see what they can get away with.

 

My dd's AHG troop has so many Tenderhearts (1st-3rd graders) that they have to have 6 unit leaders to maintain the proper ratios of leaders to girls. Despite the man girls, they get a lot done at their meetings. I tell you that to say that it can be done, hopefully with only a few changes. Hope it gets better and your dd can continue in AHG. My dd loves it!

 

You are right. The other mom couldn't leave BUT had she left, I would have taken my daughter and the other girl that came last night out into the main area where the Explorers were meeting and sat at an adjacent table to work with the girls. It would have been OK.

[J-rap]

Wow, that would drive me crazy too. I haven't been in organizations like that, so I'm not quite sure how they work. I attended a Girl Scouts meeting with two of my girls once, and at the first meeting, it was so loud and chaotic, we never went again. Girls were literally walking on the tables while the leader was trying to talk. We joined 4H instead and it was a night and day difference. I wonder if different organizations attract different types of kids. Just curious.

I'd definitely try and get the leadership involved. I'd try and get parents involved too. Although chances are, since those kids are so rambunctious and out of control in a "meeting," they are at home, too, meaning those parents really don't have a clue what to do in either place. But, maybe they'd be willing to learn if someone could give them some clear direction. Maybe very specific, laid-out assignments while there, or something like that??

[AK_Mom4]

The year is progressing and the behavior is deteriorating. I guess I will have to do something drastic, like just sit down and stop having the meeting until someone figures out that there is a problem.

 

Awwww.... that sounds really tough. You are right, you can't address this with individual kids. I would really hold that 5 minute meeting with the parents and put them on the line - either they personally toe up and pull their kids in line or the meeting is cancelled. Then do it. And let the leadership know what you are going to do. A couple times of cancelling the meeting 5 minutes in when they refuse to control their kids and they will probably drop out or step up. But you have to not be afraid of the confrontation.

[StephanieZ]

Wow. What a nightmare.

 

Other than sympathy, I can offer one insight into behavior . . .

 

By putting the quiet sign up, waiting patiently, failing to get their attention, and then yelling . . . You teach them that the sign is meaningless, or possibly is an advance warning signal, but that the signal to actually shut up and pay attention is your yelling.

 

I would be curious to approach the next few meetings as behavior experiments. Refuse to yell. Plan fewer, very simple, engaging activities. If permissible, involve candy. Lol. Use your quiet sign. Wait. Wait. Wait. Use whatever punishments have already been outlined in prior communications fairly and strictly to remove disruptors.

 

I would suggest that a brief, clear email prior to the meeting, and a handout to every parent upon arrival, would at least give fair warning to your new approach.

 

Behavior management is actually a very exact science, and reading a few good books on it has made me a much more effective manager of kid, employee, dog, and grownup behavior. Much of it boils down to being sure you are reinforcing the behaviors you want to reinforce, as one often accidentally reinforces the wrong behavior!

 

Specifically, I would take the entire group out of the gym immediately, and to a seated activity, if they are out of your control. I would use the quiet sign and just wait. I would find ways to positively reinforce good behavior, such as handing candy to each child as they raised their own quiet sign, with candy going to the first few, not the stragglers. Quick clear praise for good behavior is often very reinforcing. Etc. Identify the specific instant behavior you want, and reinforce it frequently. It is a process to identify the exact behaviors you want to enourage and to identify the effective motivators for the child. Public praise motivates many, but may demotivate others. Candy motivates nearly everyone, even my grown up employees, lol.

 

Nth

[StephanieZ]

P.s. Don't forget to identify behaviors and motivators for your grown ups, too. Personal thanks and recognition is likely more motivating than candy for most grown ups.