ARG! So Fustrated!!!!

[MamaOfMany]

So I finally got the core of our curicculum figured out. My husband tonight however saw it and started in....

 

how do you know what they are supposed to be learning?

how do you know they wont fall behind?

how do you know they will be on the same level as the kids at school?

 

and on and on and on.....

 

I wanna bang my head against something.....

 

now he is pushing for a "boxed" curriculum. At their grade level.

 

*sigh* but I know it wont work for us.

 

I have a 1st grader who is struggling, I have two 3rd graders who one is ahead of the game and one needs a bit extra help.

Now mind you he has not looked at ANYTHING I have bought in regards to this. Maybe flipped through the catologs but has not read a book and I have TWTM, 100 top Picks and another good one but cant remeber the name lol....

 

ARG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Advice? Anyone? Please?

 

 

What I had picked:

 

History- Story of the world book 1 for everyone

Science- Real Science 4 kids for everyone

Math- Teaching textbooks for the big ones, Horizons for the young one

Spelling & Grammer- Spelling Power and Explode the code

 

toss in some various books for everything and that is the core of it.

 

The kids are debating languages greek and latin and german.

we are also looking at Piano and have kids chior already.

Oh and we volunteer at the USO

 

 

Am I missing something?

[wapiti]

writing (narration/dictation)?

 

cursive for the older ones?

 

are you set on your math choices?

 

You poor thing - you clearly need a glass of wine. Or cup of tea ;)

[boscopup]

You only listed spelling/phonics for your spelling & grammar section. I'd throw in some grammar at least for the 3rd graders. The 1st grader could do without while struggling, probably (or use something gentle like FLL1).

 

Agree with PP that you're missing composition, unless you plan to wing it with copywork/narration.

 

As for your DH's questions...

 

how do you know what they are supposed to be learning?

 

I read The Well Trained Mind (and insert other resources here).

 

how do you know they wont fall behind?

 

I'll be teaching them and staying on schedule (insert how you plan to stay on schedule). If they are struggling with a subject, I will address that subject. Because I am working directly with them and they are not in a classroom full of 20 other students, I'll know sooner if they are struggling, and I'll be able to give them the individual attention they need (or seek professional help if necessary).

 

how do you know they will be on the same level as the kids at school?

 

Kids at school are at such varying levels, that no matter where our kids are, they're likely to be at the same level as some kid at school. :D

[MamaOfMany]

Yes lol. Dang. Wine... I wish I had a bottle! I would love a glass at the moment lol

 

After I posted I went... forgot to flip the page of the notebook LOL. I am leaning towards first language lessons and writing with ease.

 

Hand writing I cant figure out *sigh*

[MamaOfMany]

Am I set on my math choice?

 

No. I am open to suggestions!

[Osaubi]

If your dh knew you were following a book or scope would that help? FE TWTM or Core Knowledge.

 

Maybe making some long term plans and the reason behind it. For example child 1 will be in algebra in this grade so we need to have these things done by this grade.

 

If you haven't already setting up a schedule for the year for the kids. That way he knows you are on track with the goals your family has set.

 

Will he sit down with you and look over the books you already have while you explain why you think these are the best choices?

 

Would including him in some of the things the kids do help? FE in STOW 1 making a monks feast and having the kids tell what they have been reading about. Or asking him to help out with a subject he would like to do?

 

Downloading a SWB lecture for him to listen to?

[MamaOfMany]

Some answers....

 

If your dh knew you were following a book or scope would that help? FE TWTM or Core Knowledge.

I will admit that I am not sure what either of those are but maybe if I was following something that said "by this point X age child should know ABC..... or be doing ABC.....

 

Maybe making some long term plans and the reason behind it. For example child 1 will be in algebra in this grade so we need to have these things done by this grade.

Since this is our first year I am working on getting a plan together for just the first year. As we get through it I will make longer term plans. Right now though I am building the yes I can do this! Foundation ;)

 

If you haven't already setting up a schedule for the year for the kids. That way he knows you are on track with the goals your family has set.

I am working on that. I am looking at who is struggling where and working on how to help them get up to speed and where everyone would like to be 6 months and 12 months after we start. Like A will at the 6 month mark have mastered her multipication tables ect....

 

Will he sit down with you and look over the books you already have while you explain why you think these are the best choices?

I think he is stuck in the must keep up with the public school/herd mentality where I am like cool they wanna learn about (greek mythology) lets do it! I dont care if they are learning about the US in the PS.

 

Would including him in some of the things the kids do help? FE in STOW 1 making a monks feast and having the kids tell what they have been reading about. Or asking him to help out with a subject he would like to do?

I am trying to include him in everything but he will not do his own research but doesnt want to take my word for it. Fustrating! Either help make choices or leave me alone lol

 

Downloading a SWB lecture for him to listen to?

Gonna try this!!!!

 

[PeterPan]

It's called standardized testing. You should do it no matter WHAT curriculum you're using and no matter how well-thought-out the choices are.

 

Doing curriculum straight (BJU, whatever) has some advantages and disadvantages. While you're definitely throwing all the material at them to meet the standards, it doesn't mean you're able to customize the presentation to fit their learning or thinking style. If you cover less or different material but it STICKS, that's more important. Shurley is a rather non-standard progression, but it sticks like crazy for us, like super-glue, making it better in our house than something that covers more and keeps pounding, assuming coverage is learning. On some of those subjects (science for instance), the whole point in your 10 or even 12 and under crowd is *skills* skills, skills. The content doesn't matter a lick, but the SKILLS you work on matter a lot. He obviously hasn't seen the boxed BJU science to know how pathetically little they cover in the early years or that they only do science one semester, history the other. LA and math are the focus in the early years. Or as WTM puts it, writing, learning to read, etc. It's all those SKILLS.

 

So some of that you can explain, but really some of it boils down to testing. Get the CAT from Seton or CLP and do testing at the end of the year. It will make your husband happy, not cost a ton, and even give you some helpful feedback and reassurance.

[MamaOfMany]

THANK YOU! This is some of the best advice I have gotten (though I do value ALL of the advice i have recived)

 

It's called standardized testing. You should do it no matter WHAT curriculum you're using and no matter how well-thought-out the choices are.

 

Doing curriculum straight (BJU, whatever) has some advantages and disadvantages. While you're definitely throwing all the material at them to meet the standards, it doesn't mean you're able to customize the presentation to fit their learning or thinking style. If you cover less or different material but it STICKS, that's more important. Shurley is a rather non-standard progression, but it sticks like crazy for us, like super-glue, making it better in our house than something that covers more and keeps pounding, assuming coverage is learning. On some of those subjects (science for instance), the whole point in your 10 or even 12 and under crowd is *skills* skills, skills. The content doesn't matter a lick, but the SKILLS you work on matter a lot. He obviously hasn't seen the boxed BJU science to know how pathetically little they cover in the early years or that they only do science one semester, history the other. LA and math are the focus in the early years. Or as WTM puts it, writing, learning to read, etc. It's all those SKILLS.

 

So some of that you can explain, but really some of it boils down to testing. Get the CAT from Seton or CLP and do testing at the end of the year. It will make your husband happy, not cost a ton, and even give you some helpful feedback and reassurance.

[Just Robyn]

It's called standardized testing. You should do it no matter WHAT curriculum you're using and no matter how well-thought-out the choices are.

 

Doing curriculum straight (BJU, whatever) has some advantages and disadvantages. While you're definitely throwing all the material at them to meet the standards, it doesn't mean you're able to customize the presentation to fit their learning or thinking style. If you cover less or different material but it STICKS, that's more important. Shurley is a rather non-standard progression, but it sticks like crazy for us, like super-glue, making it better in our house than something that covers more and keeps pounding, assuming coverage is learning. On some of those subjects (science for instance), the whole point in your 10 or even 12 and under crowd is *skills* skills, skills. The content doesn't matter a lick, but the SKILLS you work on matter a lot. He obviously hasn't seen the boxed BJU science to know how pathetically little they cover in the early years or that they only do science one semester, history the other. LA and math are the focus in the early years. Or as WTM puts it, writing, learning to read, etc. It's all those SKILLS.

 

So some of that you can explain, but really some of it boils down to testing. Get the CAT from Seton or CLP and do testing at the end of the year. It will make your husband happy, not cost a ton, and even give you some helpful feedback and reassurance.

 

That's the first thing I thought of. You could tell him you'll have them tested once/year, or every other year or whatever works for you and him.

[Haiku]

Now mind you he has not looked at ANYTHING I have bought in regards to this.

 

Sweetly: "Dear, I am so happy that are taking an interest in the children's education! I have always wanted to be able to share the burden of researching, deciding, scheduling, and worrying about how things are going. As you know, I have been at this for a while now. I have amassed a rather large collection of books and articles that form the basis of what I am doing. Since you've expressed your interest, I'll pull them together for you and you can read through them. Then we can discuss what you think and work together to find materials that we think will meet the goals that we work out for our children's education. Oh, I'm so looking forward to sharing all this with you!!"

 

;)

 

Tara

[mo2]

It's called standardized testing.

 

That's the first thing I thought of. You could tell him you'll have them tested once/year, or every other year or whatever works for you and him.

 

:iagree: Standardized testing should make him feel better. If you do it once a year, you will KNOW whether or not they are on grade level. And if they aren't, then you know what to focus on the next year.

[blakereese]

:grouphug::grouphug: I know how frustrated you must feel, especially after you have taken the time to read and research.

 

I understand your husband's concerns, but I do think he should take it upon himself to read a bit about homeschooling or a philosophy that you are going to follow (possibly TWTM?). OR he should trust in you. As their mother, I am sure you have your childrens' best interest at heart and want the best for their educations. This is to be your full time job now, and you are doing the preparations for it (reading, researching, planning) and your husband should respect this. Again, if he has concerns, he should become involved and learn more about your plans. I would talk about all of this with him now...the first year of homeschooling is very hard, and he needs to be supportive instead of already doubting you. You will have enough of your own doubts in the months to come. :)

 

I'm not saying that there is anything wrong with a boxed curriculum, as long as it fits your children. The problem is that most children do not work on their exact grade level in all subjects. They may be ahead in math, right on level in grammar, and a bit slower to read....or whatever. So it can be hard to find a perfect fit when buying an all-in-one program.

 

I think you have made some great choices. Keep an eye on the sale board, you may be able to find quite a few things from your list in the coming months. It's always good to save some money!

 

And I agree...do a standardized test each year if it will put his mind at ease. :001_smile:

[Guest]

If you follow the recs in TWTM, it is essentially a 'boxed' curriculum. When one thinks about, all a box does is put all your selections in a nice package. If he is that set on it, put all your materials in a box on the front porch, ring the bell and let him open it!

 

We have used boxed in the form of The Calvert School/Verticy and Oak Meadow. We all hated Calvert both times we used it. (Oak Meadow is not classical at all and VERY different as a boxed curric. goes. My littles will be using it this year.). The advantages are it is all nicely laid out and you can say 'here is what they are learning and here is where they are going' very easily. What you give up, with Calvert, at least, is flexibility. You HAVE to follow the day's lesson with no rabbit trails. Did I mention we loathed it? My assumption is that most school in a box types are going to be the same way.

 

I agree about standardized testing. I am planning on it this year for the first time just for my curiosity.

 

For handwriting, just pick one that will be easy for you to teach. Kids all develop their own style as they grow. It is not worth losing sleep over. For us, we like Handwriting Without Tears. All you really need is the workbooks. The TMs are nice, but not essential.

Edited April 3, 2011 by Guest

[MamaOfMany]

:lol: I have all the catologs in a folder in my file on the counter..... Look hunny its a boxed curric! lol.....

 

I have a copy of TWTM that I keep skimming through. I havent had a chance to sit and digest it in its all. I need to. I did get the 100 top picks and am working through that.

 

Ahhhh men!!! lol

Edited April 3, 2011 by MamaOfMany

[justamouse]

You know what I would say? And, granted, I'm a PITA, but I'd say, "Here," hands himself a stack of books, "When you're done reading these, I'll take your concerns into consideration."

[kpnick in nc]

In catching up on my forum-reading, I noticed this thread and your previous thread. I think your husband's concerns and your feeling adrift in the big picture questions of homeschooling are connected.

 

In our house, I'm the one who has done all the researching, thinking, buying, etc, as well. My husband was on a roller coaster in his views toward homeschooling; he wanted to send DS to PS for K since we were expecting our 3rd child in December and didn't want oldest DS to "be bored" while we went through the last trimester/newborn survival mode.

 

I went to our state conference and heard a talk reminding me that we have to think about the big picture in training our children. What is our worldview? What kind of people do we want our children to grow to be? I bought the talk; DH listened and actually apologized for even considering PS!

 

I know this isn't exactly what's going on with you, but that realization helped DH see his responsibility in the homeschooling realm. We sat down and worked together through some of those big picture questions. He also read TWTM (well he made it through the grammar stage - where we are). He also helps me choose curriculum - if I'm undecided, I give him all the details and he analyzes with his global mind. He patiently listens while I go on and on about what I need to do in two years. :001_smile:

 

Wanting our children to be "on grade level" isn't a bad thing, but the more I read, the more I see how that is such a small part of the homeschooling/ child-raising journey!

[Allearia]

Tell him to read TWTM. If he doesn't want to bother to read it then why should you listen to his input?

[Lolly]

It's called standardized testing. You should do it no matter WHAT curriculum you're using and no matter how well-thought-out the choices are.

 

Doing curriculum straight (BJU, whatever) has some advantages and disadvantages. While you're definitely throwing all the material at them to meet the standards, it doesn't mean you're able to customize the presentation to fit their learning or thinking style. If you cover less or different material but it STICKS, that's more important. Shurley is a rather non-standard progression, but it sticks like crazy for us, like super-glue, making it better in our house than something that covers more and keeps pounding, assuming coverage is learning. On some of those subjects (science for instance), the whole point in your 10 or even 12 and under crowd is *skills* skills, skills. The content doesn't matter a lick, but the SKILLS you work on matter a lot. He obviously hasn't seen the boxed BJU science to know how pathetically little they cover in the early years or that they only do science one semester, history the other. LA and math are the focus in the early years. Or as WTM puts it, writing, learning to read, etc. It's all those SKILLS.

 

So some of that you can explain, but really some of it boils down to testing. Get the CAT from Seton or CLP and do testing at the end of the year. It will make your husband happy, not cost a ton, and even give you some helpful feedback and reassurance.

 

I would also suggest testing BEFORE you start. It will give you a baseline with which you can compare. Also, realize that standardized testing does have its downfalls. If your dc do not recognize the terminology for math or grammar, they can miss questions even if they know the material. (I haven't had much trouble there.) Science and history are harder to test. Often, it is just a reading comprehension test. For general knowledge questions, following something like tWTM can sometimes get you into trouble. Your kids will know plenty of history, but not necessarily what is on the test. Same goes for science when homeschooling. (My kids all missed one question because they didn't know who Juliet Lowe was. Ummm, never covered that.) I only pay attention to the math and English/grammar sections of testing. (The way they test spelling is just...stupid.)

[PeterPan]

You do notice I conveniently suggested the *CAT*, not the ITSB. Hehe... CAT covers math and LA, nothing else. No movie stars, no political trick questions, no science standards differences. It shows whether your kids are on track for the SKILLS in math and LA. You just tell him you've realized the value of standardized testing every year and are happy to do it. Don't mention there are choices. Problem averted. ;)

 

And the CAT isn't cheaping out. It still gives you valuable feedback. It just takes less days of your lives, is easier to administer (you can, no hoops to jump through), and costs a lot less money. We've done it several times and found it useful.

 

BTW, it was SWB's talk about homeschooling the 2nd time and their hindsight that pushed me toward testing. She said her mother tested a LOT. A lot in life is connected to test scores, so it's good to start now and do it so much they get used to it. That's what SWB said, and I found it to be good advice with us. I realized we had delayed unnecessarily. I had people tell me wait till they're xyz age, etc. It's just no big deal. Pay the $25, have a learning experience, and move on. And yes, I think that's extremely wise advice to have some standardized test scores from this current year to compare them to.

[MamaOfMany]

Ok I am all for testing before hand to get a small photo of where they are. However I also admit that I have no idea what the CAT is other then those two furry things running around my house some where LOL.

[TxMama]

Have you considered using a resource such as this?

 

I use "What Your Child Should Know When" with my younger.I don't test my kids until they are middle school.

 

HTH

[MamaOfMany]

That looks like it would be a great reference point! Thank you. I am going to look around and see if I can find it used and buy it. That may help ease his mind and get him off the boxed set kick!

 

Have you considered using a resource such as this?

 

I use "What Your Child Should Know When" with my younger.I don't test my kids until they are middle school.

 

HTH

[Lolly]

You do notice I conveniently suggested the *CAT*, not the ITSB. Hehe... CAT covers math and LA, nothing else. No movie stars, no political trick questions, no science standards differences. It shows whether your kids are on track for the SKILLS in math and LA. You just tell him you've realized the value of standardized testing every year and are happy to do it. Don't mention there are choices. Problem averted. ;)

 

And the CAT isn't cheaping out. It still gives you valuable feedback. It just takes less days of your lives, is easier to administer (you can, no hoops to jump through), and costs a lot less money. We've done it several times and found it useful.

 

BTW, it was SWB's talk about homeschooling the 2nd time and their hindsight that pushed me toward testing. She said her mother tested a LOT. A lot in life is connected to test scores, so it's good to start now and do it so much they get used to it. That's what SWB said, and I found it to be good advice with us. I realized we had delayed unnecessarily. I had people tell me wait till they're xyz age, etc. It's just no big deal. Pay the $25, have a learning experience, and move on. And yes, I think that's extremely wise advice to have some standardized test scores from this current year to compare them to.

 

Ah, I have never used CAT. Way back when I was in school, it is what we took. It was just like the ITBS back then.:D

[Haiku]

The CAT can test for science and history. The CAT survey test that Seton sells is a stripped-down version of the complete CAT that only has 20 questions per subtopic in the math and LA topics. I just previewed it at the Cincinnati convention. It's what I plan to give my kids this year. The full battery wouldn't be useful to us because we don't follow the public school's scope and sequence.

 

Tara

[RootAnn]

I would also suggest testing BEFORE you start. It will give you a baseline with which you can compare.

:iagree:

 

Also, as you are working through Cathy Duffy's Top 100 picks, pay close attention to the goals/big picture chapters. Really stop and fill out (on a separate sheet) those questions she asks. Then have your husband do the same.

 

Seriously.

 

Then compare the lists. If all he writes is "keep up with PS kids," ask him what he really wants to see over first six months/one year. Specifically. If he can't name it, show him your list(s). This is where your note-taking & preparation pay off.

 

I don't have any recs along these lines (only because I never had to convince anyone) but I know there are some really good "why you should homeschool" books out there. Those might be good to check out from your library if they have them. Or, try to find a homeschool group and see if any of the families in it have those type of books. Borrow some. If that isn't feasible, find a nice couple whose kids are older than yours who've been down the homeschooling road for awhile. Invite them over to dinner. See if the husband of the couple will talk to your husband. The guy-guy talks work wonders where female verbal spewing forth for months doesn't.

:grouphug:

[Critterfixer]

Math. Get a boxed curriculum in Math. That should help satisfy the male need for order in a curriculum. Also, I think it is easiest to start out with. You can change later if needed based on how your children are learning the materials. By the end of the first year (sometimes in six months or so) you will be able to identify things that are helpful for one child or another. Pick a curriculum with a noted track record in Math and show him. Key words, rigorous, well-rounded, building on concepts...you get the idea. When we decided to home-school our twins I was coming into the situation having been a home-schooled child. My husband knew nothing about it at all, and having to rely only on me and my family for information was frightening to him. His family was also very nervous about it. Having a great pick in Math was useful in soothing them at the onset. We chose Saxon Math because I was schooled with Saxon, and so were my siblings. My youngest sister is an accountant, and I'm a DVM, so Saxon math has to work, right?:001_smile: So far it has. But if I find that it is not helpful in the later grades I can change it to something else.

 

The other key concern for everyone would be reading and spelling, and to a lesser extent, writing. These are important choices in curriculum. For reading, I would have him take a look at what SWB has to say on the teaching of reading in PS. Phonics is a great way to teach reading, and spelling. It also adapts itself well to one-on-one teaching, which is absolutely NOT happening in PS.

 

Writing at the younger ages is penmanship. Personally I used Zaner-Bloser but Handwriting without Tears has a lot to recommend. I use Writing With Ease for my twins to teach sentence structure paired with First Language Lessons for a gentle intro to grammar (I say that, and they know more at their age than I did when I was seven!). This gets us all the copywork we need, and I have them do narration on everything from their history and science lesson to literature, to what they did at the creek that day.

 

If that isn't feasible, find a nice couple whose kids are older than yours who've been down the homeschooling road for awhile. Invite them over to dinner. See if the husband of the couple will talk to your husband. The guy-guy talks work wonders where female verbal spewing forth for months doesn't.

 

This can help. Really. Something about guys-they can't take it coming from a woman.:glare:

[Guest]

Take a look at the PASS test Hewitt Homeschooling has. I no experience with it but someone here must. It is for homeschoolers.

 

http://www.hewitthomeschooling.com/test/tmain.asp

[readinmom]

I agree with reading TWTM. Also, a nice clothing analogy might work. Just because they are 7 doesn't mean they wear a size 7. Each child is different in their needs. Obviously you spent hours upon hours researching, debating, before you came up with your plan; and your plan was based upon your child's individual needs.

 

Good luck, and hope that it all works out!

[rafiki]

.

[MamaOfMany]

My husband likes the idea of havign them tested. I can plan and pick and do what ever. Though he did pick up the sonlight catolog and flip through it and ask me to look in to it as a possibility. He LOVES to read to the kids and the kids love to read so I told him I would be more then happy to look in to it as a possibility!

[skueppers]

My husband likes the idea of havign them tested. I can plan and pick and do what ever. Though he did pick up the sonlight catolog and flip through it and ask me to look in to it as a possibility. He LOVES to read to the kids and the kids love to read so I told him I would be more then happy to look in to it as a possibility!

 

That's great! I'm glad he's found a way to be comfortable, and that he's expressing an interest in a homeschooling method!