Why do I have to do math when I already did it?

[lisamarie]

That is what DD said to me this afternoon when I said it was time to do her afterschooling work. I do phonics, math and history with her and it takes a total of 30 minutes on most days to complete it all. She only goes to AM kindergarten so it's not even a full day of school.

 

So how do you justify to your children the necessity to afterschool when they already do all this stuff at school? I told her that this is what we do and that was the end of it. I admit I was caught off guard by it. But I'm sure there are better answers out there.

[EKS]

I know that this isn't what you want to hear, but I can't justify it, and that is why I homeschool my children.

[Mommyfaithe]

I know that this isn't what you want to hear, but I can't justify it, and that is why I homeschool my children.

 

Yep. That was one of the biggest reasons I brought mine home. I had to teach everything at the end of the day when they were already tired...and so was I. I figured might as well teach them during the good part of the day. So far, it has been working out. :D

Faithe

[MBM]

I reply that the school doesn't have time to teach everything, and the math that we're are doing at home is something I feel is so important that it should not be left out. I tend not to repeat the school lessons, but do go deeper on same topic or do the units the school omitted.

 

Occasionally, I'll declare it a 'math club day' and the dc will have those sugarie, calorie filled math club goodies and problem sets just as they did when the school had a math club.

 

My answer is similar to Heigh Ho's.

 

Your daugher is asking a thoughtful question for her age. I would take that as a good sign.

 

What helped us when we began a formal program (Singapore Math) in 2nd grade was to allow our son some input. That is, he got to suggest ways to make it happen. I didn't always agree, but more often than not, his recommendations were helpful. He was more likely to cooperate, and as a bonus, he's learned how to handle homework and projects without me being the taskmaster. (He's in 8th now.)

 

********

Btw, we power our math team with Cheetoh's or Pringle's -- sometimes both! I think it's the only way we can get some of the kids to join. :D

[regentrude]

That was exactly the problem we had with all attempts to formally afterschool my son.

You can be honest and say "because the school does not teach you well " - but that opens the whole can of worms of "then why do I need to go there and spend all those hours?"

My son flat out refused to be afterschooled with exactly that argument: why do even more school if he had been at school for seven hours already?

 

And honestly, I did see his point. So we ended up homeschooling - primarily because of math.

 

All afterschooling prior to that was "hidden" - i.e. no worksheets and textbooks, but lots of enrichment activities, books, field trips etc.

[sophiasapientia]

I reply that the school doesn't have time to teach everything, and the math that we're are doing at home is something I feel is so important that it should not be left out. I tend not to repeat the school lessons, but do go deeper on same topic or do the units the school omitted.

 

:iagree:Our response is along these lines as well. My kiddo's school is using Investigations for math and recently rushed through multiplication (& division) without any concern about the children having mastery of these sujects. DD understands the concepts but does not have her tables completely memorized so we are currently using Kumon workbooks and Anki flashcards to fill in the gaps. She wants to have a better grasp on her math so she doesn't complain.

 

I dislike adding more work to DD's day on top of a full day at school and her regular homework but, if we aren't going to homeschool, think it is essential at this point. We try to keep the other areas we afterschool -- foreign language, piano, lots of reading plus unit studies during longer breaks -- fun ... We may ultimately homeschool full-time but DD, who is an extroverted only child with 2 introverted parents;), loves the charter school she attends and honestly needs the opportunity to interact with other people on a daily basis so, for now, afterschooling seems like our best option.

[MBM]

That was exactly the problem we had with all attempts to formally afterschool my son.

You can be honest and say "because the school does not teach you well " - but that opens the whole can of worms of "then why do I need to go there and spend all those hours?"

My son flat out refused to be afterschooled with exactly that argument: why do even more school if he had been at school for seven hours already?

 

Yes, but Heigh Ho cleverly answered by saying the school did not have time to teach all her child needed to know. I think the trick is to not paint the school too negatively unless the school truly is deserving of it and you might homeschool at some point. You're right, though, regentrude. Mentioning the school's weakness can bring up a whole new slew of challenges.

 

Nowadays my son asks me why he can't do math all the time. Everything else is so boooring. Arg. LOL.

[regentrude]

Yes, but Heigh Ho cleverly answered by saying the school did not have time to teach all her child needed to know.

 

A halfway astute child may respond by pointing out all the instances where time is wasted in school. Particularly a smart kid who is sitting there twiddling his thumbs in math class and would have all the time in the world to actually learn.

 

Btw, I NEVER wanted to homeschool. Ever. It was NOT an option. Until I saw the middle school math curriculum...

[Guest Dulcimeramy]

A halfway astute child may respond by pointing out all the instances where time is wasted in school. Particularly a smart kid who is sitting there twiddling his thumbs in math class and would have all the time in the world to actually learn.

 

Btw, I NEVER wanted to homeschool. Ever. It was NOT an option. Until I saw the middle school math curriculum...

 

:iagree:

 

When I was in ps, I wouldn't have believed that the school lacked time to teach me. I was one of the kids sitting at a desk, bored out of my mind, while the rest of the class took another 30 minutes on each assignment.

 

I think children who are allowed to read while they wait for others don't notice the wasted time as much. At my school, we were not allowed to read or study anything else. We had to just sit there.

[regentrude]

I think children who are allowed to read while they wait for others don't notice the wasted time as much. At my school, we were not allowed to read or study anything else. We had to just sit there.

 

Not necessarily. My DD spent five years at school reading fiction. Every day in every class. The teachers knew- they were happy she was quiet and did not have behavior issues. She was bored and very much noticed that she did not learn.

Her first words when I withdrew her were: "I am so glad I don't have to go to school anymore. Now I can finally learn something!"

 

(Now you'll probably ask why I did not homeschool earlier... I did not think I could homeschool and work. And she liked elementary. Well, come Middle school, all things came together - no learning, plus bullying, plus old enough be be able to work independently which would allow me to keep my job... so we jumped.

But she realized that she was in school mainly for the daycare aspect.)

[MBM]

A halfway astute child may respond by pointing out all the instances where time is wasted in school. Particularly a smart kid who is sitting there twiddling his thumbs in math class and would have all the time in the world to actually learn.

 

Btw, I NEVER wanted to homeschool. Ever. It was NOT an option. Until I saw the middle school math curriculum...

 

Well, yes, that's true. There will be instances when a child might feel that way. My son feels that all subjects other than math are a waste of time! (We're working on that perception.) It just depends on what is being taught at school and whether that matches what the parent wants.

 

In our case, however, school has not been a total wash. My son has had some excellent teachers and opportunities and has been able to work independently in certain subjects on more challenging material. We've been fortunate for the most part with our school, but this might not be the OP's case, of course, in which case homeschooling would be a good option.

[regentrude]

My 'halfway astute' child wasn't twiddling his thumbs in a whole class lesson b/c his teacher would a) differentiate the lesson or if that wasn't possible b) give him his differentiated concept lesson plus problem set before hand with permission to think about it and work on the problem set (ie the wink to ignore the lesson) while s/he was teaching the whole class lesson.

 

That sounds WONDERFUL.

We tried talking to teachers etc - all were sympathetic to DD's plight, but nothing every came of it.

 

Regentrude, are you at MUST by any chance?

 

What is MUST?

[LibraryLover]

Is it really fair for hsers to come to this board and be negative about afterschooling? "I know this is not what you want to hear, but that's why I hs?"

 

I really don't mean to be provocative, but this question was posted on the afterschooling board; to get support from others experieincing something similar.

 

Had this been posted on the main board, then I think it would apporpriate for hsers to respond in this manner.

Edited March 2, 2011 by LibraryLover

[regentrude]

Is it really fair for hsers to come to this board and be negative about afterschooling? "I know this is not what you want to hear, but that's why I hs?"

 

I really don't mean to be provocative, but this question was posted on the afterschooling board, to get support from others experieincing something similar.

 

Had this been posted on the main board, then I think it would apporpriate for hsers to respond in this manner.

 

So only success stories count? Experiences from former afterschoolers who did not succeed because of the exact issue raised are not allowed?

By the same token, would you not allow somebody who failed at homeschooling for whatever reasons to share his experiences on another board?

[LibraryLover]

So only success stories count? Experiences from former afterschoolers who did not succeed because of the exact issue raised are not allowed?

By the same token, would you not allow somebody who failed at homeschooling for whatever reasons to share his experiences on another board?

 

I would think it fine if it were on the main board, and the OP asked what past afterschoolers found. She didn't.

Edited March 3, 2011 by LibraryLover

[snickelfritz]

So only success stories count? Experiences from former afterschoolers who did not succeed because of the exact issue raised are not allowed?

By the same token, would you not allow somebody who failed at homeschooling for whatever reasons to share his experiences on another board?

 

This point of view isn't really helpful and encouraging on the afterschooling board. We have taken a lot of things into account in deciding to send our oldest to school next year. It's a hard decision and I'm having separation issues, that I would probably have no matter when we sent her. I'm nervous. Things are out of my control. The school does many, many, many things right.....but they don't use Singapore. So, I opened this thread to find out how I can keep my daughter using Singapore Challenging Word Problems. Not, "This is the reason why I homeschool."

 

If someone had math issues on the homeschooling board and someone replied "This is the reason why I send mine to public school."...... I don't think the response would be appreciated.

[EKS]

Is it really fair for hsers to come to this board and be negative about afterschooling? "I know this is not what you want to hear, but that's why I hs?"

 

I really don't mean to be provocative, but this question was posted on the afterschooling board; to get support from others experieincing something similar.

 

Had this been posted on the main board, then I think it would apporpriate for hsers to respond in this manner.

 

Since I'm the one who posted the offending comment, here's my response. First, I've tried afterschooling with each of my children, and that is the conclusion I came to. Second, despite it's name, this is a public message board, and when you post on a public message board, you have to expect to get all sorts of opinions, even ones that aren't supportive.

[clarkacademy]

My daughter (who is my only kid in school) would kill me if I even joked about more work. She has ecleast 2-2half hours of homework every night. It is the same with all the kids around here I could not imagine doing more with her. Not that it is great wonderful home work more like busy work imo but she will get bad grades if it does not get turned in. She gets home from school about 445 we do dinner and everything clean up etc usually done about 6. She is doing homework ecleast till 8 then shower maybe a bit of down time, nightly call with dad at 9 then bed as she has to be up at 630. Her school gets out at 255 I would love to pick her up and get her home earlier than that darn bus but school and back is 27 mile trip there is no way I can budget that much gas. Before anyone says she should not have that much or she is not finishing it in class that is not true. I have had her teachers tell me home work gives children something to do after school and they have to make sure that all there certain topics are touched on for the tests.

[EKS]

I respectfully disagree.

 

I feel that when one posts on a support board, one should get an answer to one's direct questions, not an agenda policy statement or a beating. One should respect the board owners' intent.

 

And I apologize to the OP for threadjacking.

 

My intent with my comment was to point out that I had wrestled with that very issue and had finally come to the conclusion that I personally could not justify it. My point was that the issue is that difficult. I wouldn't call my post an agenda policy statement or a beating. Please.

Edited March 4, 2011 by EKS

[MBM]

This point of view isn't really helpful and encouraging on the afterschooling board. We have taken a lot of things into account in deciding to send our oldest to school next year. It's a hard decision and I'm having separation issues, that I would probably have no matter when we sent her. I'm nervous. Things are out of my control. The school does many, many, many things right.....but they don't use Singapore. So, I opened this thread to find out how I can keep my daughter using Singapore Challenging Word Problems. Not, "This is the reason why I homeschool."

 

To answer your question about supplementing Singapore Math, I can tell you what we did. YMMV, of course. Our youngest's school used Everyday Math, which we didn't like, so we taught about three to four lessons Friday through Sunday, sometimes one lesson on a school night and finished up in summer. This worked very well, and I credit Singapore with building the strong foundation my son has in math now. I don't know if this would work for you. Just wanted to throw it out for consideration. (We switched schools after 2nd grade and the new school allowed him to work independently under a teacher's guidance.)

 

Hope you find a good soluation. :)

[snickelfritz]

I hope you found some answers. The bottom line for my boys is that they like solving puzzles and doing 'hard things' so they are happy to afterschool both formally and informally. They miss having math club at school too as that's where they found other like-minded students.

 

I really have. I think it's helped me change my expectations. Instead of after-schooling full subjects, I'm going to make it more enrichment. I like the home math club concept, since dd loves puzzles. Maybe CWP, MEP, Right start games, etc....

 

Since the school is solid, I think that will be fine. Like I said before, I'm having issues giving up control.:D

[snickelfritz]

To answer your question about supplementing Singapore Math, I can tell you what we did. YMMV, of course. Our youngest's school used Everyday Math, which we didn't like, so we taught about three to four lessons Friday through Sunday, sometimes one lesson on a school night and finished up in summer. This worked very well, and I credit Singapore with building the strong foundation my son has in math now. I don't know if this would work for you. Just wanted to throw it out for consideration. (We switched schools after 2nd grade and the new school allowed him to work independently under a teacher's guidance.)

 

Luckily, our school uses Saxon. It's not MY choice, but I think it's solid. I do think it's missing the Singapore aspect. But, working in the summer and weekends is another good idea.

[Crispa]

So how do you justify to your children the necessity to afterschool when they already do all this stuff at school? I told her that this is what we do and that was the end of it. I admit I was caught off guard by it. But I'm sure there are better answers out there.

 

First, get clear in your own mind why you're doing it. If you can't really explain it to yourself (is it because I don't trust the school? no, that's not it, exactly ... well, is it because I worry she won't learn this stuff otherwise? ... is it because I want to *reinforce* the school stuff? ... because I just want to? ... or ... ?), then you won't be able to explain it to anybody else! Whether they're six years old or sixty. (I'll confess that I've found myself in this position talking about homeschooling. :) )

 

Here are some ideas:

 

"Because I like to work with you."

 

"Because there are different ways of learning math, and I want you to try the different ways."

 

"Would you rather do this at a different time, instead of right after school [or right before bed, or whenever you usually do it]?" (IOW, consider changing the process, and letting the child have some input into how it changes.)

 

 

(As a nod to other ideas offered here: Naturally, giving up the afterschooling, or giving up the "schooling" schooling :), are options. They're good ones to keep in mind as you evaluate why you choose to do whatever you're doing -- they can help you clarify what you really do and really don't want -- but of course that doesn't mean you have to actually choose either of those options.)

[MBM]

Luckily, our school uses Saxon. It's not MY choice, but I think it's solid. I do think it's missing the Singapore aspect. But, working in the summer and weekends is another good idea.

 

Saxon's pretty good! That's better than what most schools are offering. We actually started off using Saxon and then switched to Singapore.

 

ETA: Does the school have a math club? I think they are a wonderful way to squeeze in extra math and have fun at the same time. Most in our area meet once a week.

Edited March 3, 2011 by MBM

[snickelfritz]

ETA: Does the school have a math club? I think they are a wonderful way to squeeze in extra math and have fun at the same time. Most in our area meet once a week.

 

I don't know, I'll have to check.

[mich311e]

Luckily, our school uses Saxon. It's not MY choice, but I think it's solid. I do think it's missing the Singapore aspect. But, working in the summer and weekends is another good idea.

 

My son's school is using Saxon and I've been very impressed. We work 2 or 3 times a week with Singapore math. I think it's a great fit.

[Guest Daybyday]

That is what DD said to me this afternoon when I said it was time to do her afterschooling work. I do phonics, math and history with her and it takes a total of 30 minutes on most days to complete it all. She only goes to AM kindergarten so it's not even a full day of school.

 

So how do you justify to your children the necessity to afterschool when they already do all this stuff at school? I told her that this is what we do and that was the end of it. I admit I was caught off guard by it. But I'm sure there are better answers out there.

 

My kids (6th and 9th grade) know that math is very important and while we are very happy with what they learn at school its an area where additional work just makes you that much better. At the beginning the explanation was "math is a crtical skill, we want the best for you and so we supplement the great job your school is doing and you don't have a choice". After 3+ years of doing this they see the benefits and the deeper understanding they gain from the additional work. Its not that they never complain - they do - but if pushed will admit that its worth the work.

 

We are choiceful of what we afterschool - math consistently and writing when we have time. They both are heavy readers on their own. Summers/holidays we do math daily and during the school year it's just weekends plus 1-2 weekdays.

[Word Nerd]

 

All afterschooling prior to that was "hidden" - i.e. no worksheets and textbooks, but lots of enrichment activities, books, field trips etc.

 

This is how I afterschool my kids. I'm not a school-at-home afterschooler. ;)

[fairytalemama]

This is how I afterschool my kids. I'm not a school-at-home afterschooler. ;)

 

Amen, my sister. :001_smile:

[snickelfritz]

Quote:

Originally Posted by regentrude

 

All afterschooling prior to that was "hidden" - i.e. no worksheets and textbooks, but lots of enrichment activities, books, field trips etc.

This is how I afterschool my kids. I'm not a school-at-home afterschooler.

 

 

Thanks for all of the comments like this, from several of you. I'm mulling over my expectations for next year, and changing them. ( although I haven't given up on CWP, yet :D)

 

My parents were teachers/ administrators in the school system I grew up in. They were MASTERS at after schooling in the way you describe.

[Dmmetler]

Another thing to consider is what's happening at school right now. If she's in a grade that tests, they're probably doing heavy test prep, which usually means very little happens BUT math and reading-and that the math is heavy on word problems. Not CWP level, but still tiring after awhile. I know one of the older sisters I see at DD's music class, who is usually a "nose in the book" kid who LOVES learning-type activities, is spending a lot of time griping about school and was not at all interested in the cards I brought last week, which had multiple languages (which normally she'd have been thrilled with) because "I'm too tired of thinking to think".

 

You may need to afterschool in other, more interesting areas, for a month or so until this spurt passes. Or, just figure that it's time for an afterschooling break right now, and that you'll have time to pick up later, as the schoolwork winds down (If your schools are like the ones here, once the big test for the year is over, school is much more casual-and since high school has started Gateway testing earlier in the year, that's even the case in secondary), and in summer.

[TracyR]

I suggest working in the summer and on weekends. Drop the weekly work for now. I wouldn't put her through more work during the week.

School is work for kids. Learning is work and to double that up on a child is just way to much.

 

I afterschool as well and have found I can maybe get something done on the weekends with my girls. That is if my older ones don't have homework to do over the weekend either.

 

I too am coming to the conclusion that we're better off homeschooling. I'm basically paying the school so I can teach my kids at home. Everyone can throw their eggs there.

I know its not possible for everyone to homeschool, or want to homeschool , so if your going to keep her in school. Just do the work on the weekends and during the summer.

[Mama2Three]

I supplement PS math with SM. My DS would ask questions along those lines, too. My answers were:

"Math is so important, I want to make sure that you understand how it works."

"Your teacher has you all day. You can give me 20 good minutes to work on what I think is important."

 

Eventually, my DS realized that the extra practice gave him a boost in math, and it was a source of pride for him. To make the work more manageable, we do the school's homework at night, and **my** school work for my DC in the morning. I wouldn't be able to add my work at the same time I expect DS to do homework, it'd overwhelm him. IHMO, running around outside with friends after school is more important than spending a long time on homework, so that gets prioritized, too. And I agree with someone else's comment about "afterschooling" year-round. It helps me work through SM A and B levels before starting the next grade level and keeps DCs' skills fresh. I notice a difference when we take off even a short time.

 

Good luck! I'm sure you'll figure out the best way to make it work for your family!!! :001_smile:

[MilkMaid]

Haven't read the other replies so some may be saying the same.

If it's not pleasurable right now, it will only turn them against school work. Don't force this issue. Why does she NEED to do afterschool work?

She is in K, don't force these things. Make this stuff fun or leave it alone. That's how we have always done things here. My DDs are 11 & 12yo. They went to PS until last October. We HS now for various reasons, the 11yo having type 1 diabetes being the number 1 reason. It's just better for her. They were straight A students in PS & continue to be as HSers.

So unless you dd is very much behind the class, don't sweat it. Let her be a little kid while she still is. Homework will come soon enough then you will be wishing she didn't have it.:lol:

Blessings!;)

[Mabelen]

Several things have helped with my 7 yo dd. One is that I have emphasized over time the need to work diligently to become good at things. Another one that seemed to work is to tell her that I wanted her to do better than good and why. I also let her pick the program we are using, and even though it is an online fun program, I sit with her so she is not on her own doing the work. Finally it definitely helped that she has a lot of class mates and school friends that are doing Kumon and have been doing so for at least a couple of years now. She knows what Kumon entails, the format, the time commitment, and the money. She is also aware that the choices are either to work with mom in the comfort of her own home with the program she picked herself or to do Kumon and spend the money that we would otherwise use to buy and do things she likes on Kumon tuition instead.