Is this posted yet? About Oakland Elementary?

[dm379]

http://www.ktvu.com/news/26565558/detail.html

 

I literally felt sick after reading this. 2nd grade.

[Peela]

Actually, as the article itself says, sexual exploration is normal at that age. The son of a friend was caught doing the same thing at Joeys (Scouts for 7-10yos). Another person- a young woman family member - but the incident happened when she was younger- was caught doing similar stuff with male cousins years ago. We were shocked, but you know- kids actually like to explore and some are more highly sexed than others. THey need to be supervised, for sure.

I am not saying its not something we shouldn't act on as adults, especially in a school situation. We dont want our kids at risk for that sort of thing, especially if they are more innocent about such things than other kids.

BUt I dont think its necessary to blaze it across the headlines, honestly. Since it has happened to someone I know (he was the instigator, and in the other case, all of them were in it together), it must happen a fair bit around the place. Its exploratory. Its natural. It doesnt mean we dont act, or protect, but we dont have to take it out of perspective.

Kids that age should be supervised, no question about it. It doesn't make the teacher a deviot because he turned his back and it happened in his classroom, or even the kids themselves. They need supervision. But making too big a fuss can backfire and turn the whole thing into something that should be dealt with, in my opinion, in a very matter of fact way.

[lincap]

I am praying for these families. I am sure some degree of exploration occurs with kids. My guess is that first incident of kids partially undressing might have been a showing a penis or something like that. But to perform oral sex in a classroom scares me. I feel for the kids. I cannot help but have my mind wander about their little lives. Maybe some were molested, maybe some exposed to pornography or graphic pics or videos at home. And also the children who witnessed it. Not every child at that age knows about oral sex and they might have been very scared and confused.

[dm379]

The fact that the teacher didn't even know it had happened scares me the most.

[Heather in Neverland]

I remember when I was young and the little boy down the street pulled his pants down and showed me and my friend his pen*s. THAT I think is fairly normal "sexual exploration". But oral sex? I think not. A child would not know to attempt that unless they had seen it somewhere else. That teacher should be fired and I would have someone investigating the parents of the children involved.

[DawnM]

I know!

 

We had a lot of things happen in the middle and high schools where I worked, but they didn't happen IN the classroom....they happened during lunch or breaks under stairwells, etc....still sickening, but somewhat unavoidable if the manpower isn't there to watch every nook and cranny.

 

Dawn

 

The fact that the teacher didn't even know it had happened scares me the most.

[delaney]

Wow! I would be shocked if that happened in a HS classroom! 2nd grade? Not normal.

[teeleigh2000]

I remember when I was young and the little boy down the street pulled his pants down and showed me and my friend his pen*s. THAT I think is fairly normal "sexual exploration". But oral sex? I think not. A child would not know to attempt that unless they had seen it somewhere else. That teacher should be fired and I would have someone investigating the parents of the children involved.

 

:iagree:

 

(In light of other responses)

I strongly DISagree that performing s€x acts in a classroom is anywhere near the idea of "normal" curiosity of second grade children

Edited January 23, 2011 by teeleigh2000
Clarify

[Gratia271]

Wow! I would be shocked if that happened in a HS classroom! 2nd grade? Not normal.

:iagree:

[Alicia64]

Actually, as the article itself says, sexual exploration is normal at that age.

 

Personally, I don't really care what the particular writer of this article thinks is "normal at that age." I seriously doubt the reporter/writer has a child development degree of any kind. That comment was snatched out of the air.

 

"Showing me yours" is something we've all heard of through the years. But full on oral sex? No way. At least one of those kids is being molested at home and then bringing the behavior to school.

 

What is sad/scary/awful is that this particular incident was covered up for a week. It took a week for it to come out.

 

The teacher has some explaining to do.

 

Alley

[Word Nerd]

:iagree:

 

(In light of other responses)

I strongly DISagree that performing s€x acts in a classroom is anywhere near the idea of "normal" curiosity of second grade children

 

I agree. This is not something to be waved away as if it's normal kid stuff and no big deal.

[Gratia271]

Personally, I don't really care what the particular writer of this article thinks is "normal at that age." I seriously doubt the reporter/writer has a child development degree of any kind. That comment was snatched out of the air.

 

"Showing me yours" is something we've all heard of through the years. But full on oral sex? No way. At least one of those kids is being molested at home and then bringing the behavior to school.

 

What is sad/scary/awful is that this particular incident was covered up for a week. It took a week for it to come out.

 

The teacher has some explaining to do.

 

Alley

 

I agree with everything you said except that these children are necessarily being molested at home. Sadly, I know some girls in my brother's neighborhood who have acted sexually from a young age. Like the kids in this story, they have likely seen way too much for their age, but that does not mean conclusively they have been molested. You can see practically anything on tv or the internet anymore, and some kids key in on it and explore it. It's tragic in my opinion.

[6packofun]

What's disturbing is that this isn't casual sexual exploration between 7-8 year olds, this is s*xual activity. Young children who know how babies are made would rarely, IMO, without an example to urge on their curiosity, decide on their own to put their mouths on another child's genitals. Come on, they are children--I can't imagine them NOT being icked out at the idea of doing that to the part of someone's body where pee comes out. Seriously!

 

More "sexed"? I don't even know what that's supposed to mean for an 8 year old child. Wanting to know what another gender's parts look like, maybe. Oral s*x, no.

 

What's most frightening to me, beyond the horrendous lack of supervision, is that these children thought it was socially acceptable or no big deal to do something s*xual in front of all those other children. No boundaries, no sense of morality holding them back...I'm afraid of the adults these kids are going to become and I also think their parents should have to answer some serious questions.

[Alicia64]

I agree with everything you said except that these children are necessarily being molested at home.

 

Gratia ~ Well, by "home" I meant a molestation is happening outside of school. And then the victims are bringing the behavior to school.

 

Btw, that is an adorable, fuzzy, wuzzy in your picture!

 

Alley

[Night Elf]

The article didn't state if the teacher was present in the room. As a parent, I would want to know that information. Can teachers of that age leave the kids unsupervised for any length of time? I'm an education major and I've never seen that addressed actually. And if the teacher was in the room, what on earth was he doing that was such a diversion that he didn't know what was going on, as he said? None of the classrooms I've been in have places were kids can hide from the rest of the room. What a crazy situation, period!

[kchara]

I remember when I was young and the little boy down the street pulled his pants down and showed me and my friend his pen*s. THAT I think is fairly normal "sexual exploration". But oral sex? I think not. A child would not know to attempt that unless they had seen it somewhere else. That teacher should be fired and I would have someone investigating the parents of the children involved.

 

:iagree: There's a difference between comparing different bodies (girls vs boys) and oral sex. Something's really, really wrong here, not only in the classroom, but at home.

 

ETA: Does this remind anyone else of A Brave New World?

Edited February 23, 2011 by kchara

[Tree House Academy]

I remember when I was young and the little boy down the street pulled his pants down and showed me and my friend his pen*s. THAT I think is fairly normal "sexual exploration". But oral sex? I think not. A child would not know to attempt that unless they had seen it somewhere else. That teacher should be fired and I would have someone investigating the parents of the children involved.

 

 

:iagree: Yes, this.

[MariannNOVA]

The article didn't state if the teacher was present in the room. As a parent, I would want to know that information. Can teachers of that age leave the kids unsupervised for any length of time? I'm an education major and I've never seen that addressed actually. And if the teacher was in the room, what on earth was he doing that was such a diversion that he didn't know what was going on, as he said? None of the classrooms I've been in have places were kids can hide from the rest of the room. What a crazy situation, period!

 

THIS was the first thing that crossed my mind -- as a former classroom teacher, the class was NEVER.NEVER.NEVER.NEVER (have I made that clear) to be left unattended -- EVER! If there was a qualified aide in that room, well that would be one thing, but the teacher was NEVER to leave the room without another qualified person in place. At one school where I taught, the rooms had adjoining doors, and the 6th grade teacher and I would frequently open the door between the rooms, have one class or the other go into the other classroom, and she or I would run to the ladies' room or whatever. We also all had walkie talkies - it was simple enough to call the office or anyone else for that matter if you needed someone to come in and take your place. Public schools have communication systems so that a teacher knows to call for someone to take their class if they must run out. So my question is: WHERE WAS THE TEACHER? Years ago, I was at my daughters' school on a Friday afternoon (they were in 5th and 6th grade) and a teacher left her classroom (4th grade)

to make a phone call -- the Principal walked out of her office and happened to see the teacher on the phone. The Principal asked her who was watching her class -- the teacher stammered and said that she had left them alone. The Principal fired her on the spot.

 

The fact that the teacher didn't even know it had happened scares me the most.

 

If the teacher had left the class unattended, that is one of the issues that must be addressed. If the teacher was in the room and didn't know it happened, well, that is a whole other issue to be addressed.

 

What is sad/scary/awful is that this particular incident was covered up for a week. It took a week for it to come out.

The teacher has some explaining to do.

 

Alley

 

THIS! And, quite a few people have explaining to do, imo.

[kwickimom]

OH MY GOSH!!

 

In no way shape or form is oral sex anywhere in the realm of "normal exploration" for a second grader. Being curious about what other parts look like is one thing, oral sex is not natural curiosity. AT ALL.

 

This is sick, and these kids must have seen or heard about this to even think about trying it at this age.

[FaithManor]

I can't imagine it happening under my nose. I can imagine that if I worked in the school district that we are zoned for, that I would put my job on the line to stop the behavior. Our school district has a zero tolerance policy for any touch initiated by the teacher to a student unless it is in the course of rendering first aid. ZERO TOLERANCE! So, if it happens in a classroom here (say the teacher has her back to the classroom and a kid sexually assaults another kid) the teacher can not physically intervene. She is to use the intercom to request the office call the school police officer and security guard (who are bonded for physically restraining minors) and send the principal or another adult to the room ASAP. Once there is another adult in the room, the teacher may physically restrain the offending student. That's it. Zero tolerance. You can't touch a student period. You are a pervert if you do it with out another adult in the room.

 

So, this scenario, played out in our local, reprehensible, mind bogglingly idiotic school district, would go like this:

 

The teacher turns around, sees another child unzipping the pants of another student and touching his privates. Teacher shouts, "Stop!" Class giggles, offender giggles, nothing stops. Teacher runs to the doorway, shouting down the hall for help. Student continues to molest other student. Teacher watches, begging kid to stop, while waiting for the other adult to get there or goes and pulls offending student off the victim and then cleans out her desk for the inevitable firing that absolutely will occur when the principal arrives and realizes that she has violated the "you can not under any circumstances except for in the course of rendering medical aid, touch or restrain any student" policy. The office would call the police even if it was 2nd graders. The whole room would be interviewed by the school psychologist. The school would not tell the parents. The nosy nellie of our local newspaper (who has an inside whistle blower in his pocket up at the high school) would find out, run an editorial about it, parents would scream and go to a school board meeting, the principal and superintendent would whine and complain about the legalities of the potential lawsuits if a teacher does touch a student even if to physically restrain one from harming another, the parents would be told to stuff it - We are the government, we can do as we d*mn well please - , and the parents would shrug their shoulders, mutter that nothing like this used to happen when they were in school, accept that this is what their children must endure, and life would go on without any more squabble.

 

That is how this type of thing would play out here. That said, if the teacher left the class unattended and it wasn't because he/she was bleeding from his/her eyeballs or barfing up a lung, then getting fired is the appropriate action. The principal should be fired for not contacting parents. The superintendent should be fired if he/she knew about it and didn't do anything, and the school psychologist - if they have one - ought to have his/her butt in a sling for not doing the right thing either!

 

Lots of firing, lots of parents pulling their kids out of that school. That's the prescription. If the teacher didn't leave the kids unattended and felt like he/she would be in even greater trouble for stopping it, well then he/she should still be fired for not informing the parents. If he/she got help as fast as possible, informed the principal, and the principal said he/she would take care of it according to school policy and then didn't or did a deliberate cover-up, then the only thing the teacher might be guilty of is not being willing to put principle, morals, and ethics ahead of employment. In which case, I'm not certain that person should be in charge of 2nd graders.

 

Faith