battlemaiden Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 My kids are in a particularly rough patch of fighting. Generally revolving around sports, but not limited to sports. They compete about who was up first in the morning. Kill me now. Who has the biggest scar. Who was best behaived in church. [eye roll] Who had the best form while shooting baskets. I'm about to lose my mind. This isn't how I pictured our family looking. Argh! They ball hog, they are NOT good sports. They don't see this in my husband or myself. What am I doing wrong? And what is the consequence? I feel like the speech is falling on deaf ears at this point. Thanks. Jo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barb_ Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 My kids are in a particularly rough patch of fighting. Generally revolving around sports, but not limited to sports. They compete about who was up first in the morning. Kill me now. Who has the biggest scar. Who was best behaived in church. [eye roll] Who had the best form while shooting baskets. I'm about to lose my mind. This isn't how I pictured our family looking. Argh! They ball hog, they are NOT good sports. They don't see this in my husband or myself. What am I doing wrong? And what is the consequence? I feel like the speech is falling on deaf ears at this point. Thanks. Jo There is a saying, "Sh*t rolls downhill." I notice that in our family the older kids set the tone for anyone younger. I see your oldest two are boys. Maybe what started out as normal male competition has escalated and pulled the other kids in. Interrupt the behavior you don't want to see between the two oldest and the rest will likely take care of itself in due course. Barb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternalknot Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 My vote for consequences is Mandatory Fun :) my parents used to make us play Twister together (which was interesting, given how many of us there were!) if they felt we were starting to get too nitpicky with each other. We were a big "board game family" but the only time we played Twister was as a disciplinary move. We still groan whenever someone breaks out a Twister game or reference LOL. In hindsight I think my parents' objective was to emphasize opportunities of chance (versus skill) and to bring us back "home" so to speak - back to loving and respecting each other. Some of my siblings are just competitive, though, and continue to be even in our older years. Personality quirk, I suppose. I've never done this with my kids, but my girlfriend has with hers: when they start overcompeting and comparing themselves (unhealthily) to one another, she makes them do an exercise she dubbed "Kumbaya". She makes them write a list of 5 things they love/admire/respect about the other (she only has two kids), and then they have to read their lists to each other. She's gotten some doozies, like "I admire that my brother can walk around unashamed after losing to me on the Wii" LOL but for the most part, it's one of those pause-reflect moments that is the key (rather than the final product being the key). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pamela H in Texas Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 What about "blessing" one another? Ideally, if they are looking for opportunities to do something extra kind for one another, they won't be as focused on what THEY are doing. If it is incredibly bad, the oldest ones may need to do 2 per sibling per day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Jenny Flint Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I make them have quiet alone time for a while, away from each other. But, I have two kids, it's easy to put them away from each other, and they start to miss one another desperately after, oh, I don't know, 5 minutes. When you interact appropriately, you earn the privilege of interacting more often. Sometimes, I stand there and feed them the lines they should say when they are having a particularly nasty interaction, and make them repeat them. My theory is that the neuronal connections are made just by saying the words, even though they didn't generate them themselves, and that this makes it easier for next time. Their interactions have improved greatly over time, but the graph doesn't look like a skateboard ramp- more like the Rockies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lolly Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Honestly, when blood is not being shed I try to stay out of it. I do require that they take it away from me. I don't want to listen to it. If they continue to hurt my poor ears with their bickering, there might be consequences for that; but not for being competitive with each other. :auto: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirty ethel rackham Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 ONe of my favorite books that opened my eyes is Siblings Without Rivalry by Mazlish and Faber. I saw the subtle things I was doing to foster the rivalry - things I learned in my own upbringing. I am not saying you do these things, but that it might help see how to foster loving relationships between your children. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snickerdoodle Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Honestly, when blood is not being shed I try to stay out of it. I do require that they take it away from me. I don't want to listen to it. If they continue to hurt my poor ears with their bickering, there might be consequences for that; but not for being competitive with each other. :auto: :iagree: We do at other times talk extensively about what constitutes a good sport vs. a bad sport. We also talk A LOT about being kind to one another and what that looks like and how it sounds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirty ethel rackham Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Honestly, when blood is not being shed I try to stay out of it. I do require that they take it away from me. I don't want to listen to it. If they continue to hurt my poor ears with their bickering, there might be consequences for that; but not for being competitive with each other. :auto: While I hear what you are saying, I do have one caution. This is how may parents operated. However, by not intervening, it allowed the stronger, more dominant personalities to abuse the more gentle, peaceloving personalities. I simply learned that I was not allowed to complain when my much bigger and much older siblings were hurting me or being ridiculously unfair. I learned that I just had to take it. It took a long time for the sibling relationships to heal from that dynamic. I think it is terribly important to teach children how to be loving and considerate to eachother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasharowan Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I tend to make the competitive ones do chores. Like "if you want to challenge each other, let's see who can clean the most." Since my competitive two are the 9 & 8 yos., this mostly leads to more cooperation rather than doing chores. I also tell them they cannot have a race without both parties consenting. They will yell clothing race and race to get dressed then try to tell the 3yo he lost when he was not racing anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris in VA Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Not sure if this will help, but...Do you and your hubby try to "be fair" with your kids? If one gets something special, the other one does, too? I don't mean generally assigning roughly the same kind of chores or being a little careful at Holiday Gift-Giving time that gifts aren't lopsided, iykwim. I mean, is there a value in your home of being extraordinarily careful of being equal with things? The reason I ask is that I have a friend with 5 kids who does NOT believe in being "fair." An example of her "unfairness" is her giving little gifts called "happies" to her kids--sometimes one kid gets it, sometimes another. By not being "equal," her kids know she treats them like individuals. They absolutely don't compete for her affections or for "stuff." I've never seen a family quite like hers, where each kid feels so unique and valued for who he/she is. I think that competitiveness can be fostered by the oft-misplaced value of "fairness." Does that make any sense--it is counter-intuitive, in a way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiCO Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I think that competitiveness can be fostered by the oft-misplaced value of "fairness." Does that make any sense--it is counter-intuitive, in a way. I have found this to be true with my girls. Nothing's "fair", everything based on each individual. When I try to be fair, they bicker more and point out everything that's not fair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dooley Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I am not trying to downplay how the OP feels, I have the same problem with my two oldest. Oh. Yes. Anyway, I have come to the conclusion that since so many, many families have sibling rivalry issues, it must be important to growing up, the Lord must have decided to let this kind of thing rear its ugly head in the family for a reason. Perhaps it gets them prepared for real life, ie, conflict resolution. After all, you cant have kick fights with your boss to get your way. I think this problem must also bring a (eventual) gift with it as well.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibraryLover Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 We've tried to make sure home is a safe haven, and have discouraged competition among sibs. I used to tell my littles that you can compete in sports with others outside our family, but sibs take care of and support each other. Home has to be a safe place, a place where you know you aren't jockeying for position. Venus and Serena Williams notwithstanding. :D They seem to have the best of both worlds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danestress Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Honestly, you have SEVEN children. You have to really fight for your right to live with some peace and calmness, and this kind of stuff can really destroy the peace in a home. I let some stuff slide and try to ignore a certain amount of banter, but I am not a "stay out of it until there is blood" kind of Mom, because honestly, I have t live in this home and I intend to live in it with some peace and kindness. I would make sure that your older children have plenty of chances to actually truly compete. Get them involved in a competitive sport. Many kids really need that - they need to prove themselves and test themselves and show that they can do it. I have my twin boys in different sports, and that has really helped. The swimmers comes to tennis matches to support his brother, the tennis player comes to the occasional swim meet to cheer for his twin. It's really helped. Nothing is sweeter than seeing them cheer for each other! But then, you have seven children, so getting them all in activities is expensive, time consuming, and maybe unrealistic. But certainly the older two really need that. I might have a meeting with the oldest children and talk about the problem and how to solve it. Maybe if you commit to letting them get into some kind of activity to blow off some of this steam, they would commit to helping the younger children do the same, informally. We have a "first will be last" rule too. If someone is being aggressively competitive, I tend to make them serve the other in some small way to drive home the point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lolly Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Honestly, you have SEVEN children. You have to really fight for your right to live with some peace and calmness, and this kind of stuff can really destroy the peace in a home. I let some stuff slide and try to ignore a certain amount of banter, but I am not a "stay out of it until there is blood" kind of Mom, because honestly, I have t live in this home and I intend to live in it with some peace and kindness. I would make sure that your older children have plenty of chances to actually truly compete. Get them involved in a competitive sport. Many kids really need that - they need to prove themselves and test themselves and show that they can do it. I have my twin boys in different sports, and that has really helped. The swimmers comes to tennis matches to support his brother, the tennis player comes to the occasional swim meet to cheer for his twin. It's really helped. Nothing is sweeter than seeing them cheer for each other! But then, you have seven children, so getting them all in activities is expensive, time consuming, and maybe unrealistic. But certainly the older two really need that. I might have a meeting with the oldest children and talk about the problem and how to solve it. Maybe if you commit to letting them get into some kind of activity to blow off some of this steam, they would commit to helping the younger children do the same, informally. We have a "first will be last" rule too. If someone is being aggressively competitive, I tend to make them serve the other in some small way to drive home the point. Ahh, but as the "stay out of it 'til there is blood" mom, I do have peace and quiet. My kids hardly ever argue with each other. When they do, it is usually very short lived. What I have found is that most arguing by children is for the benefit of the parents. If the parents don't participate, the reason for being so vocal in the first place is gone. (Btw, til there is blood is just an expression. I don't actually literally require blood. Well, not usually. :D) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danestress Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Ahh, but as the "stay out of it 'til there is blood" mom, I do have peace and quiet. My kids hardly ever argue with each other. When they do, it is usually very short lived. Is it possible that your children are less prone to arguing than Jo's are? What she is describing sounds like children who are exceptionally prone to wanting to "one up" each other and compete. I do think a lot of that is temperment, and I do think that having a household of mostly boys will have a different feel from one of mostly girls, so while I am glad that your approach worked for you, I wonder if it would work as well for her? I'm not saying it wouldn't, maybe you are right. But I sort of doubt it. I think with boys the age of her boys, you have to take a little firmer stand on the aggressive (verbally) interactions or they tend to just get worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peela Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Honestly, when blood is not being shed I try to stay out of it. I do require that they take it away from me. I don't want to listen to it. If they continue to hurt my poor ears with their bickering, there might be consequences for that; but not for being competitive with each other. :auto: :iagree: and I think that competitiveness is not a bad thing even though we all want our kids to also love each other and be respectful. I do 2nd teh Siblings Without Rivalry book. That helped me. I do think its important to teach repsect etc, but I hate it when parents are always jumping on their kids arguments and taking sides. I personally know two mothers IRL who do that in a way that is biased although they would never think it and I am not about to tell them. They often favour the younger kids and I think the older kids get terribly bitter about it. As a parent it can be very difficult to mediate because what is happening on the surface- one kid picking on another- can be different from the underlying dynamic (the one being bullied actually being better at provoking without being seen, or simply knowing the sibling's weak point). I only have two kids but they are very close in age, as were my brother and I. Dh loves to joke that ds is the only kid he has ever met who came into the world with an unfairness wound. To him, everything is unfair until he is given special treatment :). He does seem to need a lot of patience and understanding. Dd is more easygoing. That has its own dynamics. They fight and argue and compete. They wrestle. I think it's part of life. They are also friends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barb_ Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Is it possible that your children are less prone to arguing than Jo's are? What she is describing sounds like children who are exceptionally prone to wanting to "one up" each other and compete. I do think a lot of that is temperment, and I do think that having a household of mostly boys will have a different feel from one of mostly girls, so while I am glad that your approach worked for you, I wonder if it would work as well for her? I'm not saying it wouldn't, maybe you are right. But I sort of doubt it. I think with boys the age of her boys, you have to take a little firmer stand on the aggressive (verbally) interactions or they tend to just get worse. I agree. Even though I have mostly girls, my oldest has always had the temperament and interaction style of a male. The oldest kids set the tone. So if the oldest two work things out with little intervention, the younger ones will learn to do so as well. However, in our house, my oldest needed a lot of support learning to act in a civilized manner, to think of others, and to control her impulses, and to back off on the quick agression. So all of my kids needed me to be more hands on to make sure the loud and pushy ones didn't railroad the quieter, more compliant ones. Barb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lolly Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Is it possible that your children are less prone to arguing than Jo's are? What she is describing sounds like children who are exceptionally prone to wanting to "one up" each other and compete. I do think a lot of that is temperment, and I do think that having a household of mostly boys will have a different feel from one of mostly girls, so while I am glad that your approach worked for you, I wonder if it would work as well for her? I'm not saying it wouldn't, maybe you are right. But I sort of doubt it. I think with boys the age of her boys, you have to take a little firmer stand on the aggressive (verbally) interactions or they tend to just get worse. :lol:You obviously haven't met my kids! No, everything is a competition. I do have one who is a bit more mild. More boys would probably take it to a more physical level, but I don't think it makes a difference in competitiveness. Mine have toned down the arguing as they have gotten older. They still compete over the least little thing; it just ends much faster and with less arguing. Of course, Jo's may be more so than mine. I've never met her kids. But, it doesn't sound outside the realm of fairly normal to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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