Is she step-by-step, or does she see patterns readily (or maybe work a concept from each perspective alternately)? Patterns My son (9 y.o. Aspie) does well with patterns, and the Michael Clay Thompson Grammar Island stuff worked well with him last year. We're using the next level this year. We take it slowly. The curriculum emphasizes patterns and relationships--you won't see the common questions often used to identify things (which one, what kind, how many, or whose for adjectives, for instance). You determine something is an adjective because it modifies a noun or a pronoun. He spends time developing the idea of what it means to modify a noun or a pronoun. You might need to make it more explicit than MCT if she is struggling and spend more time on each concept. I sometimes need to add additional information for my son. Also, MCT uses a four-level analysis to identify parts of speech, parts of the sentence, phrases, and clauses. I think each level is supposed to be completed separately in order. However, my son often sees that something is a direct object (part of the sentence) before realizing that it's a noun (part of speech). Being able to understand that each level is a different way of looking at the sentences and then moving between the levels, he can put the pieces together in any order by process of elimination (for instance, the noun at the end of the prep phrase can't be the subject because it's busy being the object of the preposition). Alternatively, you could color code a whole bunch of words with each color representing a particular part of speech, and use them like manipulatives, adding and removing words one concept at a time, moving them to other parts of the sentence to see if the sentence still works or is broken, removing helping verbs from the main verb to see what happens. You'd need to be sure you don't use ambiguous words at first that could be different parts of speech based on the context. You'd start slowly with nouns and verbs and talk about how sentences need each one. Don't introduce exceptions, like a one-word sentence where the subject is "understood" until she's really, really comfortable. Add pieces and parts, talking about whether they belong to the subject or predicate side of the sentence. Prepositions were the hardest things for my son to understand, but now that he knows all prepositional phrases follow a pattern, he spots them much more easily (preposition, optional adjective, noun). Step-by-step If she is more linear and needs things one piece at a time, in order, you might like Shurley English. My son was exposed to that in first grade (in a school setting), and you recite jingles for the parts of speech over and over as you work through a sentence until things start to click. Also, maybe a checklist/flowchart to follow for identifying everything. Either of those would start out simple and get more complicated as you introduce more concepts. You could potentially make movable flowchart labels (like manipulatives) to accommodate adding information later. You could use those on the whiteboard or on a poster. Would it help for her to have reference charts for things like To Be verbs or helping verbs? We separate grammar and mechanics for the most part (Daily Grams along with MCT). If she has a silly sense of humor, my son likes the Brian P. Cleary books from the library.

I hate fundraising too, but the pack has to operate on something, and not everyone can afford dues increases, etc. I realize not everyone has a network of willing buyers, but to have no one is unusual. If we had more than one fundraiser per year (like one for school, one for scouts, etc.), we did only one. I am not going to ask the same people over and over for money. We've found that the people who do not want to pay so much for popcorn often donate a couple of bucks, which goes 100% to the pack. Win-win. We do the same for their fundraisers unless we really want what they are selling. If people feel bad when we knock on their door, we just thank them and leave. No pressure at all. We try to skip that house the next year. We also have some houses where people are excited we've come. They want to support the scouts or love the popcorn. I think people who feel guilty about saying no or gripe about the price really don't understand how the fundraising works. You are not SELLING POPCORN. You are selling scouting. The kids who sell entertainment books for band are not selling entertainment books, they are selling the opportunity to be in band. I realize people don't have a lot of extra money. If so, they should say no nicely. Any personal guilt is their problem. Same with people knocking on the door or calling to ask us to support their favorite charity, cancer group, etc. Kids sell something so that they aren't simply begging for money. Adults who are asked to buy popcorn need to be adults and learn to say, "no thank you" instead of griping that kids sell something. I will also say that it's discouraging to make the effort to sell and then hear pack members who won't sell or volunteer at all gripe later. If you took the top 5-10 sellers in our pack in past years, you'd lose half of the popcorn sales. If you divide the total popcorn sales by the number of boys, each boy would have to sell only a piddly amount. But many families continue to sell nothing year after year. That's why many packs set minimums or make you pay outright. At the same time, I think packs should talk to families more and come up with multiple revenue sources (dues, fees, etc.) based on what the families want. Of course, families need to attend meetings and be willing to think outside the box. I've also been in meetings where people have legitimate concerns and great ideas and WILL NOT SPEAK UP or won't show up.

My 4th grade son writes verses he's memorizing for church, lists of pronouns or other grammar items, other interesting things he needs to take note of or memorize. Last year, he kept a journal of the 50 states. He had a list of when they entered the union/ratified the constitution, their capitals, their nicknames. Then, he wrote a sentence or two about each one. It's in a composition notebook with 100 pages, so he has room in between each state to enter interesting facts he encounters going forward (we've had less success with that part, lol!). He had a template for writing about each state, a list of the dates they became states, and then a set of interesting state facts, so he could do this project completely independently. I helped him find and correct mistakes. He has dysgraphia, so he needs us to keep it very straightforward and short.

Oh, check out podcasts or online archives of the Bright Not Broken radio show on the Coffee Klatch network (special needs talk radio). It's really, really helpful! There are also segments about spectrum disorders on the other shows in that network from time-to-time.

Shot in the dark here (sbgrace had some great questions), but we are enjoying The Survival Guide for Kids with Autism Spectrum Disorders. We are also working through Growing up with A Bucket Full of Happiness (consideration for others, managing emotions, etc.). I have found anxiety in one form or another (outright panic, meltdowns, overwhelm, task avoidance, disrespect under pressure, etc.) to be the biggest thing that derails our homeschooling with our 9 y.o. Aspie. Sometimes he needs gentle understanding and a break; other times, we need to create a worst case scenario in which he's still okay at the end. An example of this might be not being allowed to play with the neighbor (his best friend) for 3 days if he won't listen to me explain the math, give a realistic attempt to work through it, and be respectful at the same time. It's amazing how he can regroup and suck it up when his most important thing is on the line. Other times, this utterly fails, and he just needs to be alone until he can gain some control of himself. If he doesn't get enough sleep, nothing works. :-( We do the bare minimum on those days, or I cut my losses and give him chores that he finds organizing and calming. I also have to keep tasks cut and dry (not every subject can be open-ended), cut all busywork, and cut down on repetition (though some kids need the repetition for sure). He's definitely a Competent Carl kind of boy if you know anything about Cathy Duffy's learner profiles. Now that he is diagnosed, we can talk about what is normal 9 y.o. angst, and what is Asperger's. We can talk about his expectations for himself too. He has dysgraphia but can write beautifully if that is his task for a couple of hours (clearly not practical). He's had to cut himself slack and mourn a bit that he can't write well easily. Once he got over it, it was freeing for him, and the pressure was off.

I am very visual, and my kids are pretty visual too. I agree that too much stuff out is very distracting for us all. I like the idea of bringing stuff out while you are studying it, but not putting it on the walls. I also can't stand the idea of having to organize full-sized charts. I don't mind notebook sized charts and reference books with lots of pictures. We use those a lot. I have a few charts from Rainbow Resource or other places, and I laminate them and stick them in ring binder(s)--I have a binder with phonics charts and manipulatives, for example. The charts are laminated and hole punched. The manipulatives (laminated words and sounds that my son can mark on with wet erase markers) have sticky tack on the backs. I stick them to a piece of cardstock, and then I put them in clear sheet protector sleeves. I can flip through the whole set of manipulatives and all the charts, we can write on them, and I can put it all away easily. I am trying to do more of this kind of thing as I acquire materials. I put notes in my main books saying things like, "look at the map on page 12 of the atlas," so that I don't forget (I go through my main texts at the beginning of the year to see what we have that applies). I also have a big cupboard for homeschool stuff, a bookcase (things are grouped in to magazine holders and half boxes for browsing), and then a rolling IKEA kitchen cart that is supposed to be for pencils, etc. as well as stuff that we don't want on the table but we're not ready to put away. Then, we can see things even when they are put away or at least somewhat neat. Oh, and this makes it so that nearly all my stuff is easily portable if we are out for a day or leave town for a few days and need to bring school. And no, we are not as organized as this sounds. It's more the strategy we use than what we always achieve. My kids are hit and miss on the hands-on stuff. My one son is auditory as well as visual--he often needs to read things out loud to himself if they are tricky. I can't quite figure him out, but he has exceptionalities that skew things a bit. My other one is very visual, but he went a long time needing strong glasses, and we didn't know (he got them when he was four, and he could hit a ball that was pitched to him at 2, so we thought he could see). Then, he spent six months recently with an incorrectly made lens that blurred his vision in one eye severely. He may have auditory processing issues to boot. So, I think he has the VSL processing style, but he's still learning how to use his eyes effectively and often hears differently than we do. Neither of my kids learn very linearly, that is for certain!

These kinds of worries kept us from getting our family some help for a long time. In our case, we didn't realize he had Asperger's (he compensates really well in many ways), but we were looking for some family therapy because of the stress over our son's intensities. We found help through a word of mouth referral--a gifted specialist who was a special speaker at our local gifted enrichment program (not a school program) recommended the psychologist we see, and apparently other families in this program have seen her and benefited as well. Prior to that, I had some very bad experiences with professionals. The first counselor we sought out for help thought I was lying about my son's behaviors. She had no idea what a young gifted child was like, much less one with Asperger's. You might look into a specialist of some kind that deals with twice exceptional kids and adults to find a good fit for yourself (twice exceptional means gifted and ____ --fill in the blank with Asperger's, LD, ADHD, etc. ). We drive an hour one way to see our psychologist, and we're near two large cities. I do not think that my son would have been diagnosed with Asperger's if this psychologist wasn't really familiar with how it looks in gifted kids. Maybe that is what is happening with your son. I think it's possible that a diagnosis could help you with any areas in which you (or your loved ones) struggle with your differences. The Tony Attwood book recommended by a PP puts Asperger's in a very positive light while pointing out typical challenges. I would liken getting a diagnosis (or practical professional suggestions) to finding out what your profile is on the Meyers-Briggs. It's not a definitive test that changes who you are, but it can offer a great deal of insight into how you think vs. how the rest of the world thinks. Being one of the rare types (especially for a female), I really need information about myself and others because I feel really different from most people, and that can be draining. Maybe you could also find a local Asperger's support group or something like that. Maybe they could offer some good support as well as help you find a compatible professional (I realize this depends greatly on the focus of the group and the makeup of the individuals in the group). Even a support group for adults with ADHD might be helpful since some of the traits (like trouble with executive functioning) overlap. From the point of view of someone who lives with folks who have exceptionalities, it is nice to have some clarity and understanding to fall back on. It helps clear away some of the fog about how to approach difficulties--we can discard some possible solutions that are known to be ineffective and focus on the right solutions.

Well, we know another frugal family that spends money totally differently than we do, and yet we'd both be considered frugal. We have friends that thought we were totally freaks for using cloth diapers, so everyone has a limit, I guess. Some frugal opportunities aren't equally available to all--in some areas, thrift stores are either unavailable or very poorly stocked. If you want to loosen up a bit, I suggest spending money on things that improve your quality of life, make you smile, or free you up to do something that you think is more important, meaningful, or time efficient. If buying new underwear instead of patching them makes you smile and gives you time to do something that you feel is more meaningful, go for it. If patching your underwear doesn't bother you and you have the time to do it, find something else that will gain you more happy mileage or time to pursue something else. We have chosen to hire out some jobs because we have no outside family support that lives nearby, and we have a lot of personal craziness at home with special needs, etc. We try to balance time, money, and what we're actually good at when we make these decisions. On giving, I would put my money where your religious convictions or personal needs/interests are. We support our local church, but nearly all of our other giving goes to the missionary account for some friends who are missionaries and who truly need the support. After that, we support special projects at church or sometimes local kids raising money for their extra-curriculars (we've sold a lot of Cub Scout popcorn ourselves). We'll also sometimes support organizations that offer podcasts or radio programs that we benefit from. Congratulations on paying off your house. That is our next goal, along with some more intentional retirement planning.

Lol, I would love to take credit, but I think it's giving them the right materials, watering, and waiting for the sunshine to hit. I never thought we'd be here, and I know that next week I may wonder what aliens abducted them today. ;-)

Math victory with my 9 y.o. Aspie (4th grade) who is math phobic, stinks at math facts, and balks at (or can't keep track of) multi-step algorithms on a day when he's been set on "transmit" more than he's been on "receive"... My son has been doing 360 x 2 level multiplication for months. We added a fourth digit on top last week. I was trying to introduce 360 x 12 today, and my son was fairly convinced he knew how to do it. We discussed why his way would or (actually) would not work. He then suggested that he could multiply each digit of the 360 by 12. I said that would work, but he couldn't do that with a problem like 36072 x 48967 very easily. He offered his first theory again (not really realizing he was repeating himself), saying he could multiply 7 x 2, then 6 x7, and so on. We talked about why that wouldn't work. Then, he said, "I know how to do this." I said (with a big groan, sigh, and a heavy dose of skepticism), "by all means." Then, he proceeds to explain exactly the right way to do the problem! I told him to go for it. Then, he worked out 36072 x 48967 with the traditional algorithm. I asked a couple of well-placed questions (so, is the 6 on the bottom actually a 6; what is it's value?) so that he knew he needed to indent (we actually used zeros instead). I also tried to monitor him if he lost track of where he was (he ended up figuring out when he was loosing track all by himself). He also needed help lining up his numbers at the end so that he could add them (we whipped out the highlighter and made stripes), and he wasn't sure where to put his numbers when he carried (I suggested carrying at the bottom). He did add wrong at the end, and I had him fix it. Some of his multiplication might be wrong. I was interrupted a couple of times when he was in the middle of it, and I didn't want to go back to check (he was humming along). But he got every single step of the process correct all by himself (multiplying, carrying, indenting, knowing he needed to line up the columns)! He consulted his multiplication facts chart only once or twice, even though he would have cried if someone had given him these math facts on a piece of paper to do. He's still counting on his fingers (very fast, in his head) when he adds, lol! This child is going to break my brain. Somewhere in the middle of all this, my 5 y.o. DS is putting dishes away and hears his brother ask aloud, "what is 4 x 7." The 5 y.o. ponders the question, and while he's busy he wonders aloud what 7 + 7 is (he can figure it out, but he needs his math rods). So, afterwards, I ask him to figure out 4 x 7. I've never used the word "times" around him at all or even talked about multiplication with him. He whips out 4 rods that represent number 7, places them end-to-end, and then uses two ten rods and an eight rod (through some trial an error about how many ten rods, etc. he needed), and reports that 4 x 7 is 28. This is after an incident the other day where DS9 was counting out loud to figure out multiples of 3 (very slowly because he stinks at math facts). DS5 supplied one of the right answers during a pause. DS5 has never been taught to count by threes, just by 2's, 5's, and 10's. This child is going to juice my already broken brain.

It worked faster for one of my children than the other, but I think it's because one wart was more exposed, and the tape stayed on better with that wart. You might need to be sure you get a kind of tape that sticks really well as some are fairly cheap.

Maria, thanks for the specific information. I am familiar with the Eides book but haven't gone back to it for this particular issue. Just this AM, I had to ask my son to repeat himself 3 times to understand what he was saying. Grr. Maybe I have the APD (others misunderstand him too, but I do wonder at times!). I may go through my psych to see if we can get him in for APD testing. One of the places listed in the asha search is one she knows about (but so is the one that told me they won't test, and that the SLP we saw was affiliated with). Maybe if she can actually speak to them, we can get more information.

I got on here to read about this because I think our family has low levels of magnesium, but with all the talk, I thought I would throw this information out there...have any of you heard of PANS or PANDAS? For some folks, this is the underlying cause of OCD. Since people mentioned Dianne Craft, I assume some of you are open to biological/metabolic information. A family we know IRL is dealing with this. Basically exposure to strep (or in some cases another infection--but it would be called something other than PANDAS, I think) causes a person's body to attack the brainstem, and the main symptom is OCD. You don't have to show signs of a strep infection or have ever been diagnosed with strep to have this happen. Some people make antibodies even if they are never symptomatic. It can cause ongoing problems and exacerbations anytime a person with PANDAS is exposed to strep later. I don't know tons about it, but I thought it might give you all another idea about how to cope with OCD. There are also some podcasts and archived radio programs on the Coffee Klatch Radio network that talk about PANDAS.

I would still consider seeing the doc. If you really did have a little of it left inside, it could cause big problems (even a joint infection, potentially).

We can ours, and we use them like apples in pear crisp. They are fantastic in sweet potato casserole! If you object to heavy syrups in canned fruit, you can really, really dilute the syrup you make. We use far less sugar in our pears than the lightest syrup recipe we have, and they are great. If they are ripe, my kids eat fresh ones with slice of Brie.

I learned recently that pears ripen after cold storage just in case you get some more hard, bland pears.

Singapore with IP and CWP for my older son. Miquon for my K'er. I do add Singapore's CWP for first grade to Miquon, but I don't know if that's necessary.

That's the book I was trying to think of. I haven't used it, but what sbgrace describes is exactly what I had heard about it. I'll try to get the information from my neighbor asap.

Well, he doesn't have apraxia. The SLP person said that he is fine speech-wise for his age. I believe her about the apraxia (assuming we don't find an odd outlying symptom) as that seemed too severe of a possible diagnosis. She said r is the only sound he has problems articulating, but I think if she compared him to kids who have his vocabulary, she'd find other stuff. The screening test was all pretty easy stuff. She does have more scoring to do, but not for articulation. Maybe he's a lot more lazy when he's talking to us since we understand him. Everyone notices his speech, but at this age, they think it's cute. At any rate, I am glad to have some resources to work on auditory perception. I have spent more time doing additional oral work with his phonics since thinking all of this through (making sure he can hear the same sounds that he's reading and writing when I say words out loud). So far, he's doing pretty well. I think once someone points out something like the difference between then/than, he remembers it. Or, maybe he hears it better because he knows we're doing phonics, and phonics to him means he should be listening for certain sounds.

Late, Lost, and Unprepared is a book you might check out. We aren't as far along as you--we're working on resistance to tasks that make my 9 y.o. son with Asperger's anxious, but I have tried using parts of the book, and I like it for what I've needed so far. Chores supposedly help with executive function, but it takes work to teach them and stay with it (consider Children Who Do Too Little by Patricia Sprinkle) that you might not have time for in the middle of a school challenge. They really help my son. We also let him have a lot of free time to piddle with his interests since they require planning and executing a plan (screen time doesn't count for this).

Full evaluation is really, really important. My son looked ADHD under some circumstances, but it was sensory stuff. He now has an Asperger's diagnosis. My husband worked in pediatrics, and he says that ADHD is supposed to be a last resort diagnosis, meaning that you've ruled out everything else it could be and then diagnosed ADHD. He said this rarely ever happens, unfortunately. If your child receives an ADHD diagnosis and you are comfortable with how the doctor arrived at it, I know that one respected psychologist in our area (who has ADHD himself), says that one option is meds as needed, and as needed may mean that they are taken for a specific task that the person is having trouble focusing on. For instance, a writer might take meds when they need to do a great deal of editing at once if they are struggling only during the editing process. Also, some kids do well with caffeine. Apparently, the effect is not exactly the same, but for some kids, it's effective. One book that compares and contrasts difficulties that share symptoms is The Mislabeled Child by the Brock and Fernette Eide. It takes some work to go through it, but it's very good. It has many suggestions for what ADHD can be mistaken for and what it's really like.

I have a Bissell Pro-heat, and I don't really have room either (no basement, attic, or garage and small bedrooms). It goes in the coat closet like someone else noted. I can use soap or just plain water and get better results than a professional cleaning (we tried that route several times). We avoided getting a cleaner for a really long time because of storage issues, and the first time I used it, I regretted waiting. I bought it on sale with a rebate from the Sunday coupons (they also have them online sometimes). It definitely cost much less than $200, but I don't remember the price ($150 or so?). No amount of rules helps our inherited nearly white carpet--the room opens to the great outdoors (we have a patio, but the surrounding yard is at the same level, so mud washes over it in the rain), and it is the only back door in the house. Our only other carpet is in the kitchen (also here when we moved in), and we are messy (and let the kids cook too). So, we have to have our own cleaner or live in filth.

I stopped reading after a while since this was so long, but I know someone who cannot eat distilled vinegar. Apple cider vinegar is okay. Most labels don't differentiate. I don't know what her symptoms are.

We put about 150,000 miles on a 1994 Buick that we purchased with 32,000 on it. It was already 8 or so years old when we bought it, I think (for much less than Blue Book price). The engine is still reliable--the transmission seems to be having fits, but I think maintenance earlier on would have fixed that. Our mechanic was good and did tune-up stuff, but I wish he would have done more long-term maintenance. It had a couple of semi-expensive "fix it now, and you won't have to do it again" repairs, but there is no way that those were more expensive than a car payment in the long run. It took our mechanic about 5 years to realize we actually meant to drive it until the wheels fell off (even though we told him so, lol), and if we had made a list of recommended maintenance at certain mileages, I know he would have done it. He just didn't quite grasp our priorities and didn't want us to put a lot of money into an "old car" in his mind. Nothing electrical inside works very well though--too much time spent parked in the sun or a carport (no garage). My first used Buick (Electra, '86, I think) lasted well past $200,000 before the transmission went out. A transmission repair man bought it to fix and resell. We are now driving a 2005 Volvo XC70. We know a specialized Volvo mechanic not loyal to any dealership to do maintenance (who loves Volvos and imports). If we do his recommended maintenance, and it doesn't rust, he said it should easily pass 500,000.

The statement above is what made me think you had a different view of Asperger's and empathy. Even an Asperger's parent (or spouse of someone with Asperger's) may know all about their own (or their spouse's) specific Asperger's traits but have kids who manifest different traits or struggle differently with them. We compared our son to kids we knew had Asperger's and figured it wasn't even on our radar. Lots of people do this without realizing it. It's sort of like comparing a white barnyard goose to a Canadian goose and concluding that since one lives with people and one is wild; one is all white, and the other is colorful and dark, then they can't both be geese. I am not saying that you are doing this, but much of what had been said on this thread would have convinced me to not seek help, and I am SO GLAD I did seek a diagnosis for my son. Best wishes finding answers. One book I like for my son is The Survival Guide for Kids with Autism Spectrum Disorders. If you don't think your son actually has Asperger's it still may have good information that you could use as well as pages you could show him. One book on my reading list that I haven't gotten to is The Explosive Child. From what I've been told, it looks at skills everyone needs for coping with life situations (including flexible thinking, etc.), and it connects deficits in these areas to why kids blow up. So, it's supposed to be broadly useful even if your child doesn't spend all day in meltdown land. It has a checklist of skills that is available online that could give you a better idea whether you want to use the book or not.