First, he should not use confidential information he accidentally saw to ask for a higher salary. This can only backfire. Second, it is important to stop thinking of him as irreplaceable. Someone else could do his job, at least eventually. This is wrong thinking. Everyone is replaceable--even the president of the United States. I've heard people before state they are irreplaceable, and I think it gives them a false sense of their place in a company and a feeling of overconfidence. Third, it can take awhile to find a job. Please don't be discouraged if he can't find one this soon. Keep trying. Also, hopefully he's been networking with these clients he has. That is likely to be his best source of job opportunities. Fourth, is it possible his lack of college degree is keeping his salary down? Your dh sounds so capable, but a lack of degree can hold people back in certain industries. Rather than argue whether this is fair or not, it may make sense for him to finish a degree.

Not to derail... Has anyone used "bird nesting" to solve custody issues? Basically, this involves the child living in one house/apartment all the time. The parents take turns going back and forth. So, one parent is at the child's primary residence for part of the week. Then this parent moves out to allow the other parent to take over for the rest of the week. It places the burden on the parents to do the moving around rather than the child. The child remains in his/her same bed and in the same house and is not uprooted during the week. This sounds difficult for the parents but seems like it woukd provide more stability for the child. I find it an interesting solution.

Wow. This really makes sense. It sheds light on reasons why this went on for so long without being reported.

Look up Couch to 5k. Many of us here have had success using this method. I started jogging for the first time in my life at the age of 40 following this format. I've been jogging every week since.

In general, I disagree with what I see as "public parenting". Showing everyone that your child has transgressed and that you, as a parent, are dealing with it, feel totally unnecessary to me. It comes across as self-serving for the parent. "See everyone! I'm making sure I give my child consequences. See! I'm such a tough parent. Watch me as I train my child!" I think this makes the parent look worse and not better. I prefer to parent my child privately. I don't want my community seeing me parenting and seeing my child in trouble. I just find it so...strange and warped that someone would think this is a good idea. I agree that bullying is a serious problem. I'm also thinking there are many different ways a parent could handle this better.

I'm not sure that the best way to defend people who homeschool badly is to bring up public schools who educate badly. "Well, even though you didn't receive a good homeschool education, I didn't either at public school." This *never* excuses parents who take on the responsibility to education their children and don't take it seriously. What does taking this responsibility seriously mean? IMO, it means making sure they are given a solid education in the 3Rs, access to enrichment activities (field trips, well-run homeschool classes, or private lessons) and adequate social time with others. Parents can make excuses for reasons why some of the above is unnecessary or why their child doesn't need this or that (i.e. "my child is an introvert and is happy at home without friends or we can't afford a math tutor but I didn't have one either and I turned out ok..."). However, I think that if parents aren't willing to make these sacrifices to provide a well-rounded educational experience, might find their kids writing things we've just read above in a forum like this. Now that I've seen a group of homeschooled kids grow from K to young adults, I've observed one important thing. That is, when kids are smart enough, motivated, and hard working, they can overcome (mostly) an education that was deficient. We also see that in cases of public schooled kids that also had gaps in their education. There is a group of people who are just smart enough and resourceful enough to overcome these deficiencies. On the other hand, I've also seen kids who had significant gaps that weren't able to overcome. They had the desire but just weren't able to get the higher education they wanted. Or, they would've desired certain degrees but the math and science requirements were not something they could conquer due to the deficiencies, so they settled for a different, easier degree. (Science and math, in particular, are very hard to get up to speed in once behind. These are often the subjects most likely to be neglected with homeschoolers.) There's a website called Homeschoolers Anonymous that contain stories from home educated children that will curl your hair. Yikes! Many of these stories are from kids who grew up in homes with parents that seemed to have untreated mental illness. It is just heart-breaking. These kids had no escape or refuge from the craziness in their home. They had little to no opportunity to have a great education. Homeschooling can be done well. I've seen it. To have a successful story, though, it involves a solid education, a solid home life, a balanced social life, and good college/career counseling.

I don't worry about things like this either. Nor am I "horrified" at little boys wearing nail polish or pink clothing. Would I encourage my toddler or even older ds to wear nail polish? No. Would I purchase pink clothing for my young son? I wouldn't occur to me to do so. Would I purchase distinctively girl clothing for my son at any age? No. I do think some pride themselves on being progressive by allowing boys to wear dresses, frilly dress up clothes, or nail polish. It doesn't horrify me. I just think it's odd and silly. I have no desire to have my children make a statement on how open-minded and free I am. My sons naturally gravitated toward boy clothing, mannerisms, and style. They seem to fit in well with others and don't appear to feel as if their individuality has been squashed. They seem to have the ability to express themselves when they need to; they tend to use words to express themselves, though, not their appearance.

I would be careful here with this type of thinking. I want to say that I'm familiar with Gothard teachings. I attended his seminars before he really got off track and know several Gothard families. While Gothard has gotten stranger as the years have gone on, there are some lovely but misguided people that have followed. The ones I have known I would not characterize at all in the way you've done above. I'd also caution you to stop referring to all people that follow Gothard as belonging to a cult. I will not defend Gothard at all. However, I also think it's important to be fair and not be too heavy-handed the other way and paint all followers of his as cult members, with lying, immoral husbands and mean wives. This mindset will not help you at all as you deal with you family's situation. I think many of Gothard's followers start out as people who are fervent, black/white thinkers who want to do the right thing and desire for this to be spelled out for them. Gothard spells out say, seven ways to raise obedient children, 3 ways to have a better marriage, 7 ways to educate your children. (He likes doing things in 3s and 7s.) It is prescribed and it appears that there is almost a guarantee that you will achieve certain results if you simply follow these points. If someone desires to have that "perfect' Christian family and lacks some critical thinking, they can be drawn in. Are there abusers in this group? Sure. Are there kind people who have lost their way? Sure. It may also encourage you to know that there are lots of former-Gotharites out there. There is hope. Perhaps it would help if you viewed the people you're in conflict with as people who are caught up in legalism. They are also people that truly feel that following lists and lists of prescribed rules will create the kind of Christian family they desire. Oftentimes, isolation becomes part of that. It seems like that is what you are dealing with, and I agree that it can be cult-like. Showing grace will go a long way. Judgement is a huge part of their lives and grace can be foreign. Seeing you demonstrate grace and kindness and patience will go much farther than if they receive more harsh judgements from you about where they've gone wrong. Trust me, they get enough of that already. Just my 2 cents.

I think hospitality is a gift and that you are now practicing this gift. It isn't always easy, but I like your attitude that you like to practice hospitality "when you can." Being unselfish like that is hard. Fewer and fewer people practice hospitality. I wish more were like you. Sure, we need to have boundaries so others don't take advantage of us. But an out of town person staying one night? It is great that you cared enough to inconvenience yourself and share with others what you have been blessed with. Take comfort that your children witnessed you being thoughtful, unselfish, and generous when it would have been easier to say "no".

The one thing I would caution you on is your attempts to justify the situation and shift some of the responsibility. This is a natural thing parents do; we don't want to think of our kids and don't want others to think of our kids as simply making a mean choice. Maybe this was the other kid's idea or maybe it was your son's. It shouldn't really matter. His motive being "fun"? I'd encourage you to get a different mindset here. It was a poor choice. Period. Having said that, I think you are wise and showing good parenting by taking this seriously. I think empathy is a hard thing to teach. With some kids it is easier to teach them to to ask themselves, "Am I being kind?" Also, "is everyone having fun?" If only a few of us are laughing and others aren't, perhaps we aren't being kind. It takes time. Closer supervison (losing locker room privileges) seems appropriate.

Sprinkling pieces of your heart? I don't want to directly address this PP as she is repeating a phrase often used in current Christian culture. I would just like to explain my frustration with this phrase, in general. A Christian is supposed to guard his heart from sin, not dating. I think we're taking this verse out of context when we use it to refer to dating. I think this concept of "guarding one's heart" comes from recent evangelical culture and has been repeated often enough that people feel it is true and even possibly based in Scripture. The idea that dating = giving pieces of one's heart away is extra-Biblical teaching. I believe Josh Harris was one of the first people who popularized this idea in his book I Kissed Dating Goodbye. I just think this is concept is false teaching and that hurts much more than it helps. I think this line of thinking has done a disservice to our Christian young people and heaped load of guilt that doesn't need to be there. It has paralyzed many Christian young men from asking out girls because they don't know if this could be a relationship that might not end in marriage, thus he so careful to guard her heart that he doesn't take the leap and ask her out. Ask young adult women in Christian circles about this. It's become a weird problem creating new kinds of dysfunction by some bad teaching that has been passed and passed around. Having a boyfriend/girlfriend, even a serious one, before marriage doesn't mean that a person would have less to give their future spouse. Love is not a finite resource. It multiplies.

On the contrary...I think this should make an interesting discussion. Would it be better to do a spin-off thread so as not to derail the OP's original question?

And now, Spryte, you have opened a can of worms. This should be interesting...

But what if the kids have been neglected academically? Perhaps this step is necessary. I'm not suggesting they have been academically neglected, but I am suggesting that we don't know. Since we don't know, what is there to be outraged about? I don't understand homeschoolers that automatically support other homeschoolers whether or not they know if their kids are college-ready or illiterate. I think if we show staunch support for everyone that chooses to homeschool, whether they do a good job or not, that it will lead to increasing regulations on homeschoolers. I'm getting off topic here, but I just wanted to chime in regarding defending those whom we have incomplete information. Again, I do hope these parents are innocent of all wrong-doing and that their kids were being educated properly and then all are returned to their home.

What I also find troubling and confusing is why many homeschoolers are *automatically* supporting these parents as fit parents as as parents that have a right to homeschool. We don't know the whole story. I hope that these are great parents caught up in a terrible misunderstanding that will soon be fixed. However, I can't assume that because large pieces of information are missing here. I think it doesn't reflect well on homeschoolers when they have the attitude that investigation of a homeschooling family and subsequent removal of children is automatically an injustice. It makes homeschoolers look a bit...irrational. Perhaps homeschoolers (and others) should wait until the facts come out and then make a decision. Those close to the family can certainly be outraged and offer their opinions on that. For people that don't know the family or the situation...I find it odd that that they are firmly on the side of a homeschooling family they don't know and whose situation is unfamiliar to them.

Please give yourself some grace. You've been through a lot. Perhaps now is a time to regroup and prioritize a few things you want changed. It's not easy. Hang in there.

I received this impression based on her post stating dd's friend was wearing OP's new shirt and then stating if she said something to dd, dd would get upset. (OP ha since followed the advice on the thread and privately confronted her dd about the shirt.)

I think your last line is wise. I believe we are called to live in community with others. By this I mean finding ways to support others around us. This could mean celebrating with them--birthdays, weddings, graduations--living and learning alongside other people and families, and giving support when trials come. I find it disconcerting when people says they don't like other people's kids or even that they don't like other people, in general. This seems like a way to live a lonely, isolated life. I think when we involve ourselves with others, we are richly rewarded. Finding guardians for one's children, particularly when no relatives are available or suitable, seems like a prime example of the benefits of developing deep relationships with others.

You know, I think it is easy for some of us posters to look at a snapshot of OP's life and offer simplistic but drastic solutions to a deep issue. I'm not sure I agree with the above advice. It seems like a disrespectful and fast way to create a huge amount of resentment. Yes, it could work in the short run. Sounds like "winning the battle but losing the war" type of strategy to me. OP is a single parent with a sometimes difficult ex trying her best to raise these kids. Teens can be hard even in the best of circumstances. It sounds like making smaller changes like mom holding her ground and confronting dd would be a better place to start.

I'd also move her out of master bedroom. If your younger dd and you are already sharing because of dd''d inconsiderate behavior, you share with younger dd, for a time, and let older dd have her own smaller bedroom. When kids have a sense of entitlement, it only gets worse while they are given more things OR if they keep getting what they are used to getting. She has too much. I'd work on gently reducing privileges and material possessions. I know some would advocate harshness, but I think that approach just backfires.

Ahh. Seems like you just found her "currency". This now means you need to confront her in front of her friend. Perhaps this will send the intended message. She's calling your bluff. She's having her friend trot around in your new stuff in front of you because you're too scared to confront her. Show her you are in charge. No need to be mean as petty, of course. "Dd, why did you give your friend my new shirt? You knew this was my birthday present. How inconsiderate!" Turn to friend and say, "I'm sure you had no way of knowing this. It's not your fault. It was dd that was thoughtless. So sorry you had to hear this." Done.

OP, please do not let them babysit for you. If you need help in a tight situation, you need to develop a support network outside of this family. I suggest you set your expectations very low. Do not expect offers of help, food, or sympathy. If they do give something to you--a gift, a meal, a favor of any kind--accept this surprise graciously. I do feel that confrontation would be futile here and only strengthen their belief that you misunderstand the correct way (their way) to raise your children and run your lives. I wouldn't bother offering explanations of any kind. I'd decline dinner invitations now, particularly while your children are young. Perhaps when your dh visits, he could take one child with him at a time. This would be easier for him to manage, and they could still see their grandchild. It seems doubtful they are going to change. Your frustration will increase if you feel that you need to find the right thing to say or the right way to act or the right way for your children to act in order for them to be pleased and pleasant. It's not going to work. You have a different philosophy and different goals for you family. You have this right and have no need to explain this in any detail to them or anyone else.

Now this is a helpful post. I think virtually all of us agree that her dh has wrong thinking here and it seems unhelpful to keep repeating that, expressing shock, and even saying how we can't imagine someone is like this. That almost seems to rub salt in the wound. OP, we are on your side. I am so sorry. I think the post above is helpful as it could help explore what is at the root of this. Do you have a minister that you and dh could speak to? Perhaps someone in this position that your husband respects would soften his stance. Your dd is lucky to have you.

Now this is a helpful post. I think virtually all of us agree that her dh has wrong thinking here and it seems unhelpful to keep repeating that, ex and even saying how we can't imagine someone insensitive this way. That almost seems to rub salt in the wound. OP, we are on your side. I am so sorry. I think the post above is helpful as it could help explore what is at the root of this. Do you have a minister that you and dh could speak to? Perhaps someone in this position that your husband respects would soften his stance. Your dd is lucky to have you.

"I am interested in receiving intelligent and insightful social and political commentary. I think I'll go see what a reality TV star has to say," said no one ever. To hear the discussion on this guy, you would think he has vast influence and power. He sounds like a narrow minded guy that was asked a question designed to make him look bad. I believe this reporter fully knew what he was doing. I can't imagine anyone is surprised that this guy actually holds these views, are they?