One of the images I had was of having plenty of time to take the kids to the beach, the zoo etc regularly (things that I actually love to do myself and loved to do with them). I missed them when they were at school and had a real grief that I had lost them somehow. But when we started homeschooling it turned out...I was too busy researching homeschooling, and then getting a morning routine of school happening. I became an obsessed woman. Taking a day off to go to the beach seemed frivolous! Although we did have "educational" homeschool group days at the zoo. (I took it all rather seriously). We did have more time for fun things too, but the kids wanted to play with other kids- thats the truth- more than me. So I had to accept that and find them playmates and playdates. The biggest joy for me has always been a love of sharing books with them and reading to and with them.

Well, I didn't actually know what "secular" meant till I came here. Then I discovered that is a label given to ME.

Melatonin is illegal and not available over the counter (not sure if its available on prescription or not) here in Australia. While I dont really approve of our stringent laws around nutritional substances a lot of the time- I do get that melatonin is not something to take lightly. I bought some from the U.S. once and even a small dose really messed me around. I don't think it's sensible to mess with your hormones just because you can buy something easily. And I would not give it to kids.

You know I never really thought or think of middle class as being solely about income although it is largely about it, for sure- traditionally, anyway. Here in Australia...while the classes are more blurred than they used to be- I think of the working class as the manual labourers, the people who live in certain poorer suburbs, people who have a certain working class outlook on life- which is all about hard work, really. They also tend to be straightforward, a little rough around the edges, and a sort of "typical Aussie" stereotype. The thing is, many people who were traditionally working class went into the trades and with the building boom, they are now the seriously wealthy. I know people, and have neighbours and even relatives- who have a working class type of background, education and mentality- but who are wealthy for one reason or another. To me the middle class is pretty much everyone else- anyone with an office job, a reasonable education- but also, its a different...energy. Less rough. Probably work with their head more than their hands. Probably soft hands :) There is a small upper class and i have mixed with some of them at one point in my life. Not impressed. Mega wealthy though. But they are a minority. Maybe I am out of touch. Here, many working class have made it big in certain industries- such as mining in my state- and many middle class professions such as teaching are not especially well paid. But I guess what I am trying to say is that it is not completely income based- it is also a cultural thing. And it is changing all the time- the classes were more distinct a couple of decades ago.

Wel, we just had our first rain in over 2 months, and the temperature has just dropped under 30C degrees (86F) max for the first time in many months. I think autumn has finally arrived. A year ago, we had a record breaking hail storm with hail stones between golf and tennis ball size. Tens of thousands of cars were damaged. Fortunately we were at home and our cars all tucked up in bed. The weather is weird, no doubt about it.

I light incense, play music I like, cook something nice, read a good book, garden. Things that make me happy. At least one of us can be happy- it sure doesnt help if both of us go down the chute. Of course, it can be really, really irritating being depressed around someone who is happy, so I might keep my excessive happiness to myself :)

The Farseer Trilogy by Robin Hobb. Heck, all 9 books, please.

It sounds like the welfare system in the U.S. might be a bit messy and complicated. I am not familiar with it. Who gets to decide whether one is in need or not? Here in Australia, while I am not saying its an ideal system, there are very clear guidelines as to what validates you for welfare payments, and how much. Its not easy to live on welfare any more- and there are still thousands of teenagers sleeping on the streets every night in this country, let alone adults. It used to be very easy to cheat the system but nowadays its not. But at least you can live. I think its a generous system although of course many fall through the cracks. They are however often the drug addicted, the mentally impaired etc- those who might not easily find a way to live. So its generally not left up to individuals to "judge" whether you deserve welfare payments or not. A doctor's certificate, a tax form, and oodles of paperwork and you can get it. I think that is the point of a health care system and welfare system such as we have- while some few people milk the system, all people do have equal rights to basic needs being met, regardless of social status, background etc. I think it is a compassionate system.

I guess its to do with the fact that the process of teaching/facilitating a classical education for kids is a training. You train them to think. To imitate first, to learn, think and to reason. It is training- training for life. It is a gift. It seems straightforward to me- you cannot teach the kid everything but you can train them in how to learn so that they keep educating themselves their whole lives. The Well Educated Mind seems to me- and its a long time since I read the book- a beautiful attempt to help up parents to become well educated in a broad, classical sense, by reading humanity's classic works. Different overall focus although much of WEM is covered in later parts of TWTM. Also, the WEM was written well after the WTM. They are not really different things -I suppose I like the concept of training- we train them to use the toilet, to say please and thankyou- one way or another school trains them - the child's mind is open and very trainable, and is very influenced by its environment, its parents, its educators. TWTM is a (great) attempts at using that malleability for the best purpose possible. I probably haven't answered you well- the question never occurred to me.

google but I have "stuff" on my google page, like local weather, and news headlines- at different times I have different "stuff" on my google homepage because there is a lot of "stuff" to choose from. Photographs, horoscopes, a to do list, sayings of the day, word of the day etc

Oh, go plant that flower bed! I just planted out our autumn vegie garden- its supposed to rain on Thursday- our first rain in 2 months. The dams are down to 10% capacity. Although maybe I should plan a picnic or something to make the sure the rain happens. We plant our flowers here now too because we get rain in winter.

It sounds like you are being well looked after! Such a difficult, complex range of issues- so many people suffering with them- but yes, they all seem to start in the gut. Good luck with healing.

We had a darkroom when I was growing up- both my parents are amateur photographers- but they did both switch to digital. My dd16 is at college studying Mass Communications which includes photography and film- she is learning to use actual film and to process it. I am sure there will always be a niche market where it is used. However, if I were you...I might just make more of an effort to use your camera, enjoy it, take your photos, and maybe learn to play with a photo editing program to really refine and play with your photos. Its creative and you end up with just the best photos- I delete everything else. I don't like clutter :) I find out of 100 photos I might keep 10 and put them in a special album. I have also learned to take my favourite photos and put them on a stick and go and get them printed out- that fulfils my need to have "real" photos. I send some to relatives who also appreciate hard copy- and we have a large white board where we pin favourite photos.

pool near trees = lots and lots of leaves in pool = lots and lots of work. DH swears we will never rent a house with a pool again. The teens don't use it much anymore. Our last house had a pool (no nearby trees) and when they were younger they did use it a lot more.

Yes, I tried it for a while and put on weight. Eating several tablespoons of coconut oil a day when trying to lose weight seems awfully counter intuitive to me, and it bore out. Yeah, I have read how coconut oil is supposed to make you lose weight and how healthy it is and all- but I have also seen part of a documentary where I tihnk it was teh South Sea Islanders were suffering obesity, diabetes and heart disease and they put it down partly to the large amounts of coconut in their diet. But, I have tried various forms of low carb several times and it just doesn't suit me. What I don't like about Eat Fat Lose Fat though is that it is pretty much, like many others, a theoretical diet. It's not how any traditional cultures actually eat in real life. It puts together some information and says "that should work" and for some people it probably does. I think it was that book where a guy was eating 3000- 4000 calories a day and still lost weight. Or maybe I just read that on the website. Steak, eggs, butter and cream, lots of..... But one of their main people dropped dead of a heart attack in his 40s a while back. I mean just because somethings good for you in moderation does NOT mean that larger quantities are better for you. I am not longer a Western Price fan. Well- not true, since the poor guy is long dead and gone and didnt great a huge business out of his ideas. I am not a Sally Fallon fan. There is some really good information mixed amongst a lot of bad science, as far as I can tell. The good information is great- going back to real food and seeing how people traditionally ate. But it seems to me they have become so defensive, so ready for a fight on any information that doesn't sit with their beliefs. They have become food fundamentalists- no longer open- just trying to fit everything into their beliefs. Excuse my rant- I was not impressed with putting on weight when I tried to follow that diet.

Our Aussie dollars is equivalent to yours now, and I have $250 for food each week for a family of 2 adults and 2 teenagers. We eat some organic (probably half our fruit and veg would be organic) but we eat mostly fresh food produce and I shop for fresh food at the Farmers Markets which are cheaper than the supermarket. We don't use paper products (napkins). I try to buy environmentally friendly/organic (but would rather buy fresh nonetheless so often just buy conventional from local farmers) and feel its more important to eat healthy than perhaps the average person, so I wont skimp on fresh, good food. But we are a mostly vegetarian household so although I ocasionalyl buy some meat or fish, its not a lot. I dont buy much processed food at all- it is falsely economical in so many ways. I think food and health is centrally important to quality of life so although I have a budget, it's sufficient for us to eat well.

Well put, Joanne.

What's there to be wrong about "I don't really know but I am curious to find out?" My dad is very atheist and has cancer- I want to tell him to send me a sign if he finds when he dies that he, in some form, is still very much "alive". But not sure how he would take it. OP, where are you coming from in asking such a question anyway? Surely Christians have doubts about their absolute beliefs that have no founding in any solid provable reality other than belief in what a particular book, that has been altered and changed over centuries to suit various parties, says? I mean, its a lot to place so much faith in one book, IMO- what if its wrong? I try and draw from many different sources to draw my hypotheses, including my own experience- just seems more scientific :) But I haven't drawn any solid conclusions.

Yup. I live a long way away. But then, dh's family have their issues too- his mother lives 15 minutes away and we see her at birthdays and special occasional only. I get on fine with her but she and dh just rub each other other wrong way. We are adults. We choose who we spend our time with and who our kids spend time with. That being said, I do miss my family and wish my kids could have spent more time with them growing up. But maybe it was best this way anyway.

Oooh, Negin, he repiled- here it is: (Hi John- I have been reading your 3 season diet book and I love it and am following it. I have though a friend who lives in Grenada in the tropics and she wants to lose weight and is interested in the book, but thinks it may not be relevant to her at all because the seasons are not very distinguishable there- and its always hot. I suggested she contact you but I am also very curious so I am asking myself- would one perhaps just follow the summer diet all the time, taking note of what is locally in season? thanks, Susan) Hi Susan, Yes the seasons also change there but with less intensity so the 3Season Diet is also applicable there. I would also suggest my new book The Colorado Cleanse which is a great weight loss program that has helps 1000s lose significant weight. Be well Dr John

I dont care who started homeschooling- Im not going there- and Im sure whoever started it doesn't want to own it, either. But what I am really happy about is that, like many other movements going on in the world at the moment, it is leaderless- in the sense that it empowers us as individuals to take leadership and responsibility- of our own families, away from institutions. There is no governing body, no single overarching leader or committee. It is a grass roots movement that throws bureaucracy and hierarchy out the window in favour of empowered individual thinking and action. We are united by our individuality, our independence from group thinking, from wanting to be told what to do by government or institutions- how to bring up our children. We are not united by a single belief, by religious conviction, or any number of other qualities that many of us might identify with. We all homeschool for different reasons. So how can any one of the various factions or sub groups possibly own the whole of the movement? Its just silly. Its diversity is its strength. Once homeschooling becomes institutionalised under a single banner, a single purpose, a single definable vision, we just become another type of institution- instead of something very unique and free and useful.

Yeah, Im not so sure its such a relevant reason, myself. My kids have lots of opposite sex friends and they are even all fairly physically affectionate with each other- lots of hugging, sprawling across each other while watching tv, that sort of thing. I guess ..well, dd16 has sworn off boys for the forseeable future because of "getting to know them". She got to know them...and decided they are (all) better as friends :) Ds15- I guess it has held water for him- he has taken being a "boyfriend" very seriously and makes sure he visits his gf every weekend - he doesn't have a part time job on Sundays because he needs to visit his gf- I guess he is learning that relationships are hard work? :) I suppose he feels its worth it though. They are curious I suppose and they have explored kissing and such. It's demystified :) But we allow dating just because it seems natural and we don't have any compelling moral reason not to. As I said in another thread, we havent presumed problems, and there havent really been any. It all just unfolds- but my kids have pretty good self esteem and a good relationship with their parents- I think it provides some immunity from the worst possibilities of the dating game where everyone sells out their emotions and sexuality to get love.

:grouphug: I love your sense of humour and your love for your family shines through it all :) I live a long, long way away from my family. My mum is very sick with fibromyalgia and other things- most days can do very little- but manages to take care of and regularly visit and be power of attorney to both her parents (who are not together, and both now in their 90s) one of whom has end stages of Alzheimer's and spent years (in early stages of Alzheimers) abusing Mum FOR trying to take care of her before she killed herself with a fire or something. The stress nearly killed mum. Mum's sister thinks that it's fine not to have her own home but to live with all her relatives for weeks and months at a time, without asking- just turn up and presume- with her very loud talking new husband. This sister travels all over the place- they just stayed with husband's relatives in England for 6 months, poor relatives- and comes back to mum's place regularly to check that mum isn't stealing her inheritance! Its awful. When mum clearead our grandma's home when she was moving granma into a nursing home- her sister came and took all the good stuff- the jewellery, the expensive china etc- leaving mum the more worthless stuff. Yuk. (But mum could do with learning to stand up for herself!) But....I live away from it all and just get the emails. We all live a way away- all of mum's nieces and nephews, and my brother and I- we all live well away from our parents. The other side of the family are all peas in a pod, some still live WITH their parents in their 30s, with their family! other extreme. Dh and I made our own family and surround ourselves with people we love and want to spend time with. Family time is minimal for us.

F0r me I do it when I realise that my response is adding nothing constructive to the conversation, when I am just telling my own story without it necessarily being especially relevant or useful to the OP's question, or when I feel the OP has received her answer with other posters and I really didn't need to say anything. Not that I always delete those responses, but when I do delete them, that is usually why :)

Schedule chores in just like other lessons. We always had the kids- and still have them- do their chores before school starts. And don't expect them to just do it without supervision and being checked on. Give lots of praise even for chores not done to your perfection. The thing I like about Flylady is the forming of routines. When a routine is a routine, and not something you have to consciously make a big effort about each and every day- it then actually becomes effortless in a way, because the "thinking about it" part is eliminated. You just do it. There were days when we would just clean the house until it was done, and then get done whatever school we could for the rest of the day- but the house came first because it was bugging me too much.