Hi CalicoKat- have you read the book yourself? Because without you both reading it, I cant see how you will be on the same page about where to get funds to pay the debt. Once you see the bigger picture, you can work together. (says me whose dh doesnt read books at all and who I havent even shared yet about DR). And yes, one is meant to withdraw funds from investments and emergency funds beyond the $1000 basics to pay off the debts. First is $1000 baby emergency fund. Then the debt snowball. Then save the 3-6 months of expenses. Then invest. So...bumping this because I am sure there are others here who must use some sort of budgeting system. I like the colored excel idea- I would have to learn how to use excel though.

Good apple cider vinegar is an alive substance with the "mother" still in it- it is made by the fermentation of apples, to the point past where it would be apple cider, to where it becomes vinegar....think yoghurt, kefir..it has acetic acid bacteria in it. It is a health food that has been used and known about for thousands of years.

I have just read Total Money Makeover and I am getting on the DR bandwagon. I haven't convinced Dh yet. That will be interesting (he just got back this evening from a week away so I havent had a chance to talk to him about it yet). But I can at least work with my end of the finances. I have taken my credit card details off Paypal, Amazon and the Book Depository. I will use my debit card..which already is making me think twice about purchases. Since so many of our bills come directly off the credit card..it will be a while before we can give it up completely, but I want to move back to mainly cash. We used to do mainly cash, then we got sucked into the credit card. I have written out our expenses...whew, no wonder we are feeling a bit overwhelmed lately, and like the ship is slowly sinking. Fortunately we have only a small amount of cc debt which I am paying off with savings this week. And we have our baby savings saved...next is 3-6 months of expenses. But we need to work on our budget, desperately, and we are going to need to work together, even though we tend to have separate income streams which we each have separate responsibilities for. My question is....what are your resources for working to a budget. Do you used the DR Gazelle program? I just found out about YNAB and many people use it with DR and prefer it to Gazelle. Do you use a simple system? An excel spreadsheet? A pen and paper and Notebook? What works for you, so that you actually record and work with a budget to get a handle on your incomings and outgoings?

I dont drink coffee very often so no, but especially not iced. Yuk. But then I dont drink cold drinks at all usually. Even in summer. They are not good for the digestion and I am a bit of a puritan in that way. :001_smile:

Your poll will be skewed because the thread subject will attract more of those who answer yes to the question. If you answer no...if you only have bio kids...you may not open the thread because it doesnt appear to apply to you. Thats how I think, anyway :) But I opened the thread just in case because I am nosy. I would have loved to adopt (its very hard to adopt in Australia) or foster, but dh has always been clear he is not interested.

I am similar. I do allow it- especially because we have a big house and really it isnt much extra trouble as the kids do their own thing and often it gives me more space....but I still dont especially enjoy having sleepoevers here. I also dont particularl enjoy the kids having sleepovers elsewhere because they end up having such late nights. The mother in your case may just be out of touch with those kind of unspoken rules that if friends come over your place a few times, its time to resiprocate in some way. Maybe she has some issue, is depressed or not coping or just plain not kind or caring. If the friendship is important to your kids, I would hang in there and strestch myself. If it isnt...I would let it go.

I dont know how your system works over there, but here in Australia, at 14.5 they can go up to Venturers, the next level up. When my son was a Patrol Leader, age 13, he was singled out and picked on by one leader especially, but all of them to some extent (there are 4), for irresponsible behaviour....even though he was one of many doing the silly things (such as throwing honkey nuts- large gumnuts- during a camp). As a PL, the adult leaders felt he should be repirmanded much more severely than the other kids and he was incredibly persecuted for at least 6 months. I did step in at one point and say "enough" because I felt they were being ridiculous and unreasonable...he could get away with nothing, while everyone aroudn him mucked around a lot. Anyway, overall...it has been a very good learning experience for ds14. We supported him...we wouldnt let him leave Scouts because we consider it part of our kids' education...and he learned to handle being "picked on" and to behave better in front of the adult leaders at least! He grew and matured through it and is now very respected and treated well. I think the whole Scout process can be messy and a bit unreasonable, but if the adult leaders are half decent, they are doing their best and the processes should be in place will deal with the situation, as much as possible. There were several meetings for my son, and he was demoted from being a PL ....which actually suited him because he wasnt ready for the responsibility. And having the leaders watch him was a good thing, even though it really did go overboard and at the time I was upset for him. So...yes, work with your son, but ultimately it is him who has to walk the path and learn to manage himself suitable in a group situation. I felt my son was immature and not used to "hiding" his behaviour from adults the way some other kids who go to school are. He hadnt learned to be tricky! Your son is copping the consequences of his behaviour and no, life is not fair at all...it wasnt to my son either....but ultimately, he was caught, so crying "its not fair" isnt really right either. I used to listen to my sons complaints every week, and actually I empthasied with him and just helped him handle it all emotionally rather than bottling it up. I let him talk- often he would pour it out for a solid 10 minutes after a Scout evening or event. But it helped, I think. I couldnt do it for him, and he learned to handle himself and the adults better. I tihnk listening just helped him express what was bottled up so he didnt get bitter. The consequences are already in place. Its whether they hit him where it hurts or not, so he learns to modify his behaviour appropriately.

Lol, I love that idea, Melissa!

It happens frequently here. I freeze grains/flours for a week or two if we are in weevil season. It kills the eggs. ALso, I am not bug phobic and weevils are a good source of protein! They also float to teh top once you put water in with teh rice- easily scooped off. They are not full of germs. Early Ausralians and I am sure other colonies as well, survived on wearily flour. Weavils are not like cockroaches which do disgust me to some extent. I guess I have become fairly immune to getting upset about weevils because at a certain time of teh year, they are everywhere. I buy sticky weevil traps (for teh moths they turn into) and freeze everything, and seal all packets thoroughly, but still they come.

Both mine want their adult freedom (but they are teens) and say things like that. The truth is, once they are teens, something kind of makes it feel ok that in teh not too distant future they will be moving out and on....no matter how much you love them! Dh and I are prepared for one or both to stay home and would love that ...but.....I am enjoying my time with dh and alone more and more. Ds14 has been trying to get a homeschooling friend from the country, his best friend, to come and stay with us for some of our winter hols. I said ok,but the friend had been grounded for some bad behaviour and to tell the truth I wasnt exactly looking forward to it....ds phoned him yesterday and the friend invited ds to his farm for the whole week. Ds came and asked me and I lit up and said of course! (he has been there for a week several times before and loves it- there are 3 boys). Ds then tells his friend "yes, mum is really happy to get rid of me for the week!". Was I that obvious? :) It works both way. I adore my kids and I adore homeschooling them and yet, when they make comments about laving as soon as they can, I also understand because I do sometimes feel teh same :) Also, because we hoemschool, we do spend a lot of time together.

I spent years estranged from my family. I still live on the other side of Australia to them all. But once I had kids, it changed my attitude toward extended family. I think family CAN give a sense of belonging that is valuable. But then, if your family is not very healthy, or you dont live near them, it can be better to have your own "family" in the form of a circle of friends. Ultimately, I wouldnt get upset with your daughter. Its not important to her at this stage, and that's her reality and ok. There are "issues" and maybe she just wants to leave the whole family thing alone right now while she builds her own "family" of friends. But I am grateful for my family, for their acceptance and love of me. I have a SIL and cousin I would consider friends rather than just family. My parents are non judgemental and tell me they think I am wonderful for homeschooling and are proud of me. It means a lot to me, even though I hardly see them. The internet is great for keeping in contact. But I wouldnt presume that everyone has the type of accepting family I have, and earlier in my life it wasn't the same at all.

I think the roots of our style of parenting can go very deep. Even if we dont feel we were ideally parented, something in our past probably helped us become the parents we are today...as well as our innate nature, our present circumstances etc. I have a gf who is a single mum and really struggles. I am not sure why she struggles as much as she does because social security here is pretty good for single mums, and I didnt struggle as much as she did when I was a single mum. But she tends to be down a fair bit. Her parenting style annoyed me for years because she would give her daughter a wishy washy boundary and then not back it up. The daughter constantly interupted adult conversation and I found it really annoying but that level of being irritated, while trying to be a loving mum, was normal to her so she didn't notice. (and to her credit she probably never yelled as much as I have, if at all- she had a high tolerance level for her daughter just interupting constantly!) Then my friend went to university to study psychology and one day she said to me she now understood so much more about parenting and how kids need good solid boundaries. She was almost apologising to me...she was saying she realised I already knew that, but she hadnt really realised it before studying developmental psychology. I think her mum was a single mum too, and you know some kids just dont need the same level of boundary enforcing that others do, so she had never experienced it. SO....since she said that I have been more empathic that people just.dont.know sometimes. It hasnt entered their consciousness that there is a better way. And if it has, they are so beat down by life that they cant lift themselves high enough to find out more and implement it. I am a reader. I have read a lot of parenting books. I honestly used to presume every parent did that. But they dont. My friend didnt. I am not sure if saying anything to my friend would have helped her until she had a context for herself and some authority and a deeper understanding of why certain parenting methods tend to produce pretty well behaved and decent kids, and others don't. So in a way I am glad I didnt say anything offhand, even though I am sure she knew I was a little annoyed. She really was doing her best. But when it comes to more serious stuff, I certinaly agree with Rosie- if you arent going back anyway, say something. I havent actually been in that situation.

I would never presume to choose my child's religion for them, ever. So, from birth they have always been free to choose. Dh and I have a life full of spirituality and the kids are exposed to many beliefs and concepts, including Christianity because of some of their friends. Neither appear to have strong religious inclinations.

:iagree: Dont get hung up on the details at least until he has changed some of the big things and headed toward a more vegetarian, plant based diet (low meat, and low dairy).

:lol::lol::lol:

Well I thought that my son was a challenge from birth, but the last couple of years have topped it all! I agree with the others...hormones. Change. Growing up. My son is now moodier, alternating with an obvious maturity kicking in sometimes which is surprising everyone (well, that probably started after he turned 14). Love him, growl at him, talk with him, play with him, get angry with him, apologise to him, love him some more...what else to do? We are only human too. I dont think its meant to be neat and peaceful. We all grow through all the rubbing against each other. Family life is messy and noisy and we are bound to get annoyed with each other.

I dont care whether the pickiness is western or not. This is the reality- we have picky kids. They are not starving and honestly probably wont, so its not part of their or our reality to compare them to starving cultures. I have a picky dh and a picky ds14. If dh werent so picky, I woudl probably be firmer on ds14, but since dh empathises so much, its hard to be hard on ds14. I have tried many things. I dont force someone to sit there and eat though- i think that is disrespectful in a way I dont feel comfortable with. I do say there is nothing else, but a while later, there is usually fruit. Or a meal one makes oneself. I dont know the answer. I try and please at least 2 or 3 our of 4 of us at each meal but it is rare I can hit all 4 of us at once. Dh is vegetarian, but is gluten intolerant and doesnt like beans/lentils or green vegetables. Ds woudl lke to live on cereal, white bread and meat, but will eat raw vegetables and most fruit, so I can kind of balance him out. Sometimes I just make what I want, and dd will usually eat it. Sometimes I go on strike when dh and ds get too whiny. SOmetiems dh and ds will eat what I make because they cant be bothered making anything themselves. I have learned to ask everyoen if they want me to cook dinner for them before I start-and i tell them what I am making- that way I am not wasting food.

Because of this board I spent an hour trying to work out how to download Dave Ramsey's Total Money Makeover onto my ipad last night and have been voraciously reading it last night and this morning. I imagine my online, out of control buying habits are in for a bit of a boot camp. My online buying habits are fairly directly linked to the amount of time I spend online, and a large part of that time is spent here.

Lol, we school the calendar year and are doing Modern presently, and will start back at Ancients next February.

Oh, I have been on a board break for the day (getting my tax done- finished, yay!) and I thought this thread had died an uneventful death yesterday. I do understand all that. I was on the old boards and I appreciated the cc- internet was slower, and many of us were still on dial up in those days, and the format was different (sigh. It had good aspects). It was a courtesy. Yes, exactly. And really, I was only making a point, as I said. I am not upset at all. I was just making a point to those Christians who may be interested in my point :001_smile:, that prayer is not an exclusively Christian phenomenon. If you want prayer, you can ask for prayer without necessarily putting cc on the subject line (especially "cc of course"). It you truly, particularly, especially want only Christian prayer then that is your prerogative and feel free to express however you feel to and ask for what you want!. You know, sometimes these things just don't ever occur to people.

Does being fit equal being healthy? No. You can be fit yet have many health problems that are under the surface. And you can be overweight- probably not obese though- and be relatively healthy. In fact, there are statistics which show that cancer sufferers who are a little overweight when they are diagnosed often live longer than those who are not. I think the figures for what is a healthy weight in our society are too low, and not a good gauge of overall health at all. But then I wouldn't equate healthy with not getting sick- there are many people who don't get regular colds and things, who drop dead from something like a heart attack. Getting a cold is the way the immune system and body cleans itself out. All that mucous is clearing you out. Its like having a detox- thats why afterwards you often feel better. Its a good thing to get a cold or flu ocasionally, and not a sign that your immune system is not working or that you are unhealthy- quite the contrary. Better off getting a few acute illnesses every now and then, than have underlying chronic disease. Many people are sub par healthy without even knowing it because the symptoms are not acute enough, and they just got used to them. (Of course, getting everything that is going around might well be a sign of poor health).

UHT milk definitely tastes different to even pasteurised. I find my raw milk doesnt taste particularly different from the pasturised my dh drinks, but it does taste better. I found that raw goats milk doesnt have that "goaty" taste either so I am into that at the moment.

Yes, record cold temps here in Western Australia. I kept wondering if it was just me...it just seems unusually cold, and we had many mornings of freezing temps which is normally rare....I've been told it is a record cold winter. I am in bear hibernation mode.

To some extent, yes, this is true for me. As a somewhat reformed messy person, I live in a very "lived in" looking home with various areas mildly out of order at any time. I like to keep each room within 5-15 minutes of tidy, and once or twice aweek the room will be generally tidy, but most days there will be things here and there that are not put away or finished with. It is always a work in progress, very rarely looking like a magazine photo. When I go to my MIL's place, with her white carpets and sofas, I feel unfomfortable. It is very neat and tidy all the time, but to me feels sterile. If I go to someone's home that is very tidy all the time, I presume they either dont have kids, or they are very strict about keeping things picked up. Stricter than I would be comfortable being. My own mother has my ideal type of home. Handmade and meaningful decorations (she is a weaver, basket maker etc), warm and inviting decor, yet there will always be a dish or two on the sink and magazines and her knitting next to her easy chair. Sometimes some obvious dust because her fibromyalgia makes it hard for her to clean. SHe is a great grandmother because kids feel welcome in her home- she will teach them to weave on her loom, to knit or sew, she will show them how to put bait on a hook and throw a line in, she will make sure she leaves building the yearly bonfire till they are around to enjoy the whole event. She is not messy or a slob at all- her artistic sensitivities wouldnt allow it- but her home feels relaxed and lived in. There is the other extreme. I do feel sorry for people who live in chaos and so much clutter that there are few free surfaces. I feel that is actually a bit of a mental problem- or it can be. A problem with letting go of the past, with bringing a certain basic order into one's life- and allowing fresh new energy into one's life. But, I have BTDT so I have plenty of empathy for it. I probably feel more comfortable in a messy home than an extremely clean/sterile one, but I do get this urge to do a Flylady on a messy home- I just want to go over and clean the sink for them to get them started! I have tried to keep a fairly good attitude to my kids' cleaning. They are naturally messy, especially my dd16. I will use Flylady techniques such as a 5 minute pick up, or 15 minutes together cleaning the schoolroom. In the end, nagging happens though and they don't like it. I keep my bedroom as my neat sanctuary, and everyone seems to love coming in there and piling on the bed and chatting, and its hard to get them out!

Often, when asking for prayers, people say " cc of course". I just want to make a point that prayers are not a solely Christian phenomenon, and many of us who don't identify as Christian also pray and send loving thoughts to people in need, and situations like environmental catastrophes. I love to pray and I truly doubt that the higher power that hears and responds to my prayers is different to the God that Christians pray to. I imagine its the same, actually,and we just have different perceptions of it. However we perceive God to be, is it not the same force that answers prayers? Everyone is capable of prayer and wishing for help for people in need. I understand that prayer has been proven to be effective. I think the world needs more of it.