Time estimate for DE courses

[silver]

My eldest's biology class professor is claiming that for the community college 4 credit biology for non-majors course (3 hours of lecture, 1 lab a week), they should expect to put in 12-18 hours of study time to get a C. That seems to imply that a student would need to put in 20-30 hours of study time outside of class to get an A or B. That seems off to need to put in so many hours for a 4 credit course, even if it is a lab science. I know the guideline of 2-3x study time per credit, 3-4x for a lab science, but this is well beyond that. 

Is this typical of this level of course? If we know our kid won't be able to put in 36 hours of classroom + study time into a single course, should we have them drop it now before it would be a W on the transcript?

 

edit: this is a full semester course, not an accelerated course.

Edited January 9 by silver

[regentrude]

The rule of thumb I am familiar with is 2 hours out of class for every hour in class. So a 4 credit course should require on the order of 12 hours.

But it is a fallacy to assume the grade to be proportional to time spent. 

[silver]

21 minutes ago, regentrude said:

The rule of thumb I am familiar with is 2 hours out of class for every hour in class. So a 4 credit course should require on the order of 12 hours.

But it is a fallacy to assume the grade to be proportional to time spent. 

So you've answered part of my question, that 8 hours outside of class is about reasonable.

But what about this situation, where the professor (whether by fallacy or experience) thinks that will not get a student a C in the course? If you were advising a student that needs an A or B, and the professor is insisting they put in twice the reasonable amount of work in order to pass, and the student doesn't have 10 extra hours a week, what would you advise? 

Edited January 9 by silver

[kokotg]

Does the professor have reviews on ratemyprofessor? My first thought is that some professors like to talk up the difficulty of the class early on to manage expectations (and perhaps to encourage less serious students to drop the class) and that the reality doesn't always match the hype. If the class IS an unreasonable amount of work (and, yes, I would definitely consider 15 hours a week outside of class for a C to be unreasonable) that should be clear if there are many reviews to look at it. 

I guess the other thing I'd ask is whether there's a reasonable alternative available to taking the class at this school from this prof? Can it happen a different semester? Can he do it somewhere else (or at home)? That answer would affect my decision.

[Lori D.]

Hard to know for sure, but I was thinking along the lines of @kokotg there -- the prof may be hyping it to get students to be serious. If that is not the case, and the prof runs an extremely hard class with a ton of work so that it will take that long to earn an A, then your options as I see it are:

1. stick it out, work hard, and hope to do well
I'd only do this option if the student is fine with whatever grade is given at the end of the semester, and if a B or a C wouldn't wreck the student's GPA for automatic scholarship $$ at the future university.

2. transfer to a different class/teacher

3. drop the class and do something else for Biology

Edited January 9 by Lori D.

[regentrude]

14 minutes ago, silver said:

So you've answered part of my question, that 8 hours outside of class is about reasonable.

But what about this situation, where the professor (whether by fallacy or experience) thinks that will not get a student a C in the course? If you were advising a student that needs an A or B, and the professor is insisting they put in twice the reasonable amount of work in order to pass, and the student doesn't have 10 extra hours a week, what would you advise? 

I would start the course and see how much time it *actually * takes to master the material.

The prof may just be trying to scare the students out of unreasonable expectations ( most students UNDERestimate how much time they need to put in).

Try for a few weeks, then decide when they have a more realistic view of the work load.

[ieta_cassiopeia]

43 minutes ago, silver said:

So you've answered part of my question, that 8 hours outside of class is about reasonable.

But what about this situation, where the professor (whether by fallacy or experience) thinks that will not get a student a C in the course? If you were advising a student that needs an A or B, and the professor is insisting they put in twice the reasonable amount of work in order to pass, and the student doesn't have 10 extra hours a week, what would you advise? 

I would advise that the lower the passing grade, the more reliable instructor time estimates tend to be - and the more use they are to the student in question.

Some people get A or B rather than C because they worked more hours. Others do so because they knew how to use their hours well, or intuitively grasped the material, so completing the course with an A/B in less time than it took the C student to get their C. A few might simply have prepared so well, that the A or B barely requires significant study. The first category often would have worked those extra hours anyway because they are teaching themselves to mastery (thus not needing the teacher's estimate). The second category will, at some point, grasp that they're learning faster than expected and be happy with their learning. The third are likely to realise the advice wasn't intended for them in the first place (since instructors have to assume some level of entry, and if the student knew they exceeded that level before starting, the student would know the time estimate was not meant for them).

For an A student, hours per week are a loose guideline unless it's the sort of course where most of the time is expected to be spent in class.

Advise eldest to study the material to mastery (or as close to it as compatible with other demands on time). Also look if there are easier ways to do what is expected, and start experimenting with them early. These tend to include:

- maintaining reasonable health (with particular attention to getting enough rest, nutritious food, fresh air, exercise. time with friends and free time alone)

- sorting out small problems before they become big ones, and mitigating big ones as far as practicable

- better study methods

- working on known weak points and capitalising on strengths

- finding ways to check understanding of the conceptual course material that don't depend on waiting for the coursework to be marked

- better understanding of the expectations of whoever is marking the work (this may or may not be the lecturer)

- understanding what matters more and less within the materials

- good use of time: frontload reading the material (whether that's assigned material or wider reading), start coursework early, avoiding overthinking assignments, revise throughout the course

- savvy use of approved assistance methods like office hours and the community college library

If it's taking more than 20 hours to understand the material and complete all the work to their satisfaction in Week 1 (or any single week thereafter), to schedule office hours and/or other appropriate assistance as soon as possible. The same applies if the student is running out of time in any particular week and not fully understanding the material (even if the student had very little time to study) - incremental effort towards finals is a lot easier to postpone to next week than grasping what is to be learned.

Another possible reason: if the instructor is assuming it could be some students' first course at this institution (or the first at this level of study), the worst-case scenario for the first and last weeks may have been quoted, rather than a true average. If this is the case, it is entirely possible that 20 hours/week won't be any student's average. However, it would be plausible for a first-timer not used to the form and lacking optimal study habits for this type of course (i.e. the most likely type of student to be a C student rather than B/A) to need 20 hours a week to adjust to expectations at the beginning, and then to cram for finals/exams at the end. Given that students often hear what they want to hear, a figure that takes the worst weeks into account means students are more likely to give themselves time to learn the material. This avoids three adverse results from insufficient time at the beginning:

1) mass withdrawals from the course

2) lots of underperformances because the foundations weren't in and/or the students did too little coursework/revision too late

3) excessive unfair comments in the post-course comments that could have been solved by better allocation of time

(For scale: the module I'm currently doing at university is quoted as requiring 16-20 hours/week. However, it's also considered to be half a full-time course load and is designed to be a first course at this level. I'm a B student and I'm not spending close to that amount of time on it, but students new to this level were spending 20 hours a week at the beginning).

 

[Clemsondana]

My kid took Calc 3 and Physics with Calc I DE last semester and said that they were told that between 17-20 hours was expected for each.  Kid said that some weeks didn't take that long, but some weeks did.  Those are both challenging classes, and taking them online was brutal despite kid being a very capable student who is used to self-teaching.  Kid is taking the next physics class this semester in person so we'll see what they are told next week when classes start.  On the other hand, DE psych, lit, etc were nowhere near that many hours.  

I do wonder if instructors are having to be more explicit about the time commitment because more students are expecting to put in little work.  I've been teaching at the same homeschool co-op for over a decade and I've always had a mix of average students, overachievers, and slackers - generally lovely kids with different attitudes towards academics.  But, this year several teachers, including me, are struggling with students who seem shocked that they have to work.  I was repeatedly asked in the first few weeks if they needed to write down everything that I wrote on the board.  I've had several student comment that the class is really hard because they don't know the information after coming to class.  They don't think it's reasonable that I present the information and often provide ways to model or use the information, but the work of actually incorporating it into their memory is going to take work outside of the 2 hours that I spend with them each week.  Almost 1/2 of the class doesn't take notes, they just take pictures of the board.  They are really nice kids.  We are not in an area that had schools that were closed for an extended time.  The students have a mix of public school and homeschool background.  The kids that I had last year were not like this.  It could just be an unusual group - the group that is graduating has an inordinate number of overachievers, and this group could be equally atypical.  But, based on what my senior reports from public school kids on the ball team, this is widespread and far more common than in years past.  I could imagine that college instructors are having to shock kids into understanding that these classes are going to take a lot of work.  

Edited January 10 by Clemsondana

[Bootsie]

Did the professor perhaps mean "study" time as time focused on this class, rather than outside time in addition to the in-class portion of the class.  If 8 hours of outside time is reasonable, and 4 hours per week are in biology class, then the student is focused on, studying, biology?  

I would look at the course syllabus and see what the time commitment looks like?  Is there a great deal of reading?  Are there a number of assignments?  Busy work? How many exams are there?  This gives a student a better gauge, given their particular strengths and weaknesses, of what is going the time commitment is going to be.

[silver]

The plot thickens. Looking through the online platform, the syllabus, and the textbook, there's no homework. It doesn't look like it's even "Here's some suggested work, but I'm not grading it." The textbook has 12 multiple choice review questions at the end of each chapter. So it's not even like you could do practice problems on your own if you wanted to. 

The wording from the syllabus on study time: 

Quote

You will put in the minimum 12-18 hours (this is for a C) of study time a week. 

So that study time is just on reading and studying the textbook, not exercises/practice problems. According to the course schedule/outline, he usually covers about a chapter a week. Chapters look to be about 20 pages long, with lots of pictures and boxes highlighting key ideas/concepts. 

The Rate My Professor overall score is 4.6. Students are praising him for how helpful and kind he is, even those that report getting a D in the course. The overall score is based on 67 ratings. Of the 20 with written reviews, the difficulty score is 3.85. There are conflicting comments about the study guide matching the exams and the study guide questions not being even close to what the exams cover.

 

edited for clarity of the RMP score.

Edited January 10 by silver

[Farrar]

YMMV, but I wouldn't feel comfortable with a class where the grade is 100% exams. And a 3.85 isn't a stellar RMP score. It's okay, but still. Unless my kid had a lot of dual enrollment experience and felt comfortable continuing, this would be a no for us. There are other biology professors and courses in the world. And most of them give homework and more structure than "go study on your own for 18 hours a week."

[EKS]

9 minutes ago, Farrar said:

YMMV, but I wouldn't feel comfortable with a class where the grade is 100% exams.

What's interesting is that back in the day, this is how just about all classes were--a midterm and a final at that was it.

That said, for a dual enrollment class, I agree.  More structure would be helpful.

[silver]

1 hour ago, Farrar said:

YMMV, but I wouldn't feel comfortable with a class where the grade is 100% exams. And a 3.85 isn't a stellar RMP score. It's okay, but still. Unless my kid had a lot of dual enrollment experience and felt comfortable continuing, this would be a no for us. There are other biology professors and courses in the world. And most of them give homework and more structure than "go study on your own for 18 hours a week."

3.85 is the difficulty score--reviews have two scores, one for quality (he has 4.6 overall on that) and one for difficulty (3.85 for that). Also, labs and in class quizzes are part of the grade. The final is about 22% of the grade, the unit tests are about 48% of the grade, the other 30% is quizzes and labs (at about equal weight). It does seem weird to me that there is no homework, but it's not like the textbook helps him with that. 

There are seven different sections of this class available this semester. Three are completely asynchronous online (including labs), which my kid vetoed. One has in person labs but online/async lecture. Of the three on campus options, one didn't exist in early registration (it must have been added later). From reading reviews of the various bio profs and talking to classmates, my kid says that there seems to be a sizable D/F rate for this class at this school in general, regardless of professor. 

To put the 4.6 RMP rating in context, the other two in person professors have a 4.2 and a 3.5.

Edited January 10 by silver

[Farrar]

2 hours ago, EKS said:

What's interesting is that back in the day, this is how just about all classes were--a midterm and a final at that was it.

That said, for a dual enrollment class, I agree.  More structure would be helpful.

I've literally never in my entire career, high school through masters, had a course that was entirely based on two exams. That said, I'm a humanities leaning student. But even math and science courses I took in college had lab and short assignment grades, even if the exam was a much bigger part of the final grade calculation.

[EKS]

1 hour ago, Farrar said:

I've literally never in my entire career, high school through masters, had a course that was entirely based on two exams. That said, I'm a humanities leaning student.

In the humanities, it was frequently just two papers.

[Clemsondana]

2 hours ago, Farrar said:

I've literally never in my entire career, high school through masters, had a course that was entirely based on two exams. That said, I'm a humanities leaning student. But even math and science courses I took in college had lab and short assignment grades, even if the exam was a much bigger part of the final grade calculation.

It's fascinating how different people's experiences are.  I only had 1 class that was 2 tests, but I had several that were just 3-5 tests averaged together.  Sometimes the lab would be the equivalent of one test.  I was a STEM student and almost never had homework as part of a grade. It was the same for undergrad and grad for the most part.  When I taught at a CC, I taught the bio class that nurses and other health professionals took.  As part of the transfer agreement, at least 85% of the grade had to be from closed-book assessment (tests or quizzes), although we could divide those up however we wanted (a few big tests, many small quizzes, etc).  For bio and biochem classes, we never had homework of any kind.  We took copious notes and studied a lot.  Our tests were usually a mix of recall and more complex thinking about the material.  It was hard to study for because you felt like you could never know the material well enough, as opposed to something like physics where if you could solve the homework problems then you were fine.  By sophomore year we had questions that involved interpreting data and saying what had gone wrong in the experiment.  It stretched the brain, to be sure.  Some of the professors put old tests on reserve in the library and we could work through the problems from those as part of our studying.  

[Farrar]

But two papers is totally different from two exams. Exams are timed, cold, do or die. You have so much control over how much you put into a paper or a lab report or any other such culminating project. My point wasn't so much the number of assessments, but that the style was one particular sort. I would also urge a student who struggles with writing not to do a class that was all just two papers. Lots of English courses offer other assessments.

[EKS]

2 hours ago, Clemsondana said:

Sometimes the lab would be the equivalent of one test.

At my university, labs were separate courses and were structured differently in that we had to turn in lab reports each week.  O-chem lab also had a lecture and one or two tests.

[EKS]

1 hour ago, Farrar said:

But two papers is totally different from two exams. Exams are timed, cold, do or die.

Yes.  You just learn to deal with it.

1 hour ago, Farrar said:

I would also urge a student who struggles with writing not to do a class that was all just two papers. Lots of English courses offer other assessments.

Absolutely.

And in fact, if you want to actually come up with a grade that represents a student's understanding of the material and performance in the class, it is better to have a variety of assignments that are graded (STEM or not).  More assessment (up to a point) is generally better than less.  It isn't about coddling or grade inflation if done correctly.  It's about getting a reasonable amount of evidence for the grade being assigned.

[regentrude]

5 hours ago, Farrar said:

I've literally never in my entire career, high school through masters, had a course that was entirely based on two exams. That said, I'm a humanities leaning student. But even math and science courses I took in college had lab and short assignment grades, even if the exam was a much bigger part of the final grade calculation.

I went to college in Germany. 

My transcript has three grades, based on three comprehensive oral examinations over 5 semesters of math, 8 semesters of theoretical, and 8 semesters of experimental physics.

For each class, we had one exam and one comprehensive final. No other grades. ( and again, these didn't even make the final transcript)

[Bootsie]

I had a wide range of experiences in courses.  I had some courses with a midterm and a final.  I had other courses that had a final exam and some other assignments which were maybe only 10% to 20% of the grade (so the final was 80%-90% of the grade).  The majority of my courses in undergraduate would have 3 or 4 exams;  some courses had major papers; some courses had pop quizzes.  I can't remember any class that had graded homework assignments.  

[Farrar]

3 hours ago, EKS said:

Yes.  You just learn to deal with it.

Absolutely.

And in fact, if you want to actually come up with a grade that represents a student's understanding of the material and performance in the class, it is better to have a variety of assignments that are graded (STEM or not).  More assessment (up to a point) is generally better than less.  It isn't about coddling or grade inflation if done correctly.  It's about getting a reasonable amount of evidence for the grade being assigned.

Yeah, that's basically how I see it. I've always been wary of any course with limited assessments, period. 

In choosing dual enrollment classes, I just don't see much reason to opt for a class with a single (or just two) make or break assessments of any kind. There are nearly always options and this isn't one I'd choose.

[Clemsondana]

3 hours ago, EKS said:

At my university, labs were separate courses and were structured differently in that we had to turn in lab reports each week.  O-chem lab also had a lecture and one or two tests.

Some classes had labs a separate courses. Others didn't. It was the usual setup with lab reports or lab practicals, but that grade was 20% of the course, which would be worth more credits.  It seemed to vary by department.  

[BusyMom5]

One of mine has had 2 classes that have taken that amount of time.  One was Chemistry for majors- it had hours of homework every week balancing equations,  then inputting them into the online auto-graded program.  The other was A&P- she had to spend a lot of time memorizing everything- correct spelling was graded and that's always been a struggle for her.   Depending on the week, she would spend 2-4 hours per week,  7 days a week, on these classes.  Most other classes are a small fraction of that!  

[horsellian]

20 hours ago, regentrude said:

I went to college in Germany. 

My transcript has three grades, based on three comprehensive oral examinations over 5 semesters of math, 8 semesters of theoretical, and 8 semesters of experimental physics.

For each class, we had one exam and one comprehensive final. No other grades. ( and again, these didn't even make the final transcript)

My entire degree was determined on the basis of 8 3-hour exams (there were 9 exams in total, but you got to drop one). They were sat across a 5 day period, 2 exams each day, though I think there was a weekend in the middle?

It was fair though, because it was the same for everyone. (Though people did make jokes about the only worse exam schedule being for the Chinese Civil Service.)

[Arcadia]

On 1/9/2024 at 9:48 AM, silver said:

they should expect to put in 12-18 hours of study time to get a C. That seems to imply that a student would need to put in 20-30 hours of study time outside of class to get an A or B.

Is the biology class for pre-med/vet students or for people who are taking biology to fulfill a science requirement. At the community college my kids did dual enrollment at, there are different biology, chemistry, physics classes for people aiming for premed/vet, engineering degrees.  

I tend to get A+ for my community college classes except for the Art classes which I took for fun and still managed a B. The time it takes to meet minimum expectations (C grade) and putting more effort was like at most an hour a week for me. That said, I quit Biology in high school because I have no love for it and I wanted to go engineering where biology wasn’t required. My kid’s did not spend any extra time to get that A/A+ either, they just make more conscientious effort during those 12-18 hours (including class time) 

[kokotg]

We had a...fun experience last semester where DS took a DE sociology class with absolutely no assessments/feedback whatsoever. The prof assigned tons of reading and had them do a whole bunch of informal writing (posts on the class message board and short responses to the reading), but no grades at all. The most he got was that the prof told them they could all come ask him after class what their midterms grades were and he told DS he was "on track for an A." He stuck with it because the prof had very good reviews and it seemed like everyone who'd put in much effort had gotten an A. And he did get an A, but I'm nearly certain he did more work than almost anyone else in the class, because he actually DID almost all of the massive amount of reading assigned and the 8 million little writing assignments. This was a 3000 level sociology class in which he was the only high schooler; aside from that it was mostly criminal justice majors for whom it was a requirement. The professor spent a lot of time telling them all that the administration hated him and wanted to get rid of him because he's such a radical, but I can think of some other reasons he might not be an administration favorite. Anyway. /tangent. 

[silver]

4 hours ago, Arcadia said:

Is the biology class for pre-med/vet students or for people who are taking biology to fulfill a science requirement. At the community college my kids did dual enrollment at, there are different biology, chemistry, physics classes for people aiming for premed/vet, engineering degrees.  

It's listed as the biology class for non-biology majors. It seems to be the biology class for an AS in Nursing or EMT (required for both programs). It's also the course you get credit for if you pass the AP Bio exam. The one for bio majors has a strong recommendation that you've taken chemistry recently, this one does not. When looking at the course descriptions for the two courses, it seems that the one for bio majors requires formal lab reports (this one does not). Other than the lab reports and chemistry pre-reqs, they have a very similar course description/topic list. 

Since this is at a community college, I looked at how it would transfer to the state flagship to get an idea of what type of course it is for four-year degrees. According to transferology, both this course and the one for bio majors transfer to the state flagship as the same course. There seem to be at least three levels of "intro to biology" at the state flagship. The highest is the one for biology/biochem majors (which is not what this transfers as). Most of the engineering programs don't require biology. When they do, it seems to be the middle level one, which is supposedly what this would transfer as. I'm guessing the lowest level one is for people who want to take bio for their natural science lab requirement. 

[MagistraKennedy]

On 1/10/2024 at 5:38 PM, EKS said:

Yes.  You just learn to deal with it.

Absolutely.

And in fact, if you want to actually come up with a grade that represents a student's understanding of the material and performance in the class, it is better to have a variety of assignments that are graded (STEM or not).  More assessment (up to a point) is generally better than less.  It isn't about coddling or grade inflation if done correctly.  It's about getting a reasonable amount of evidence for the grade being assigned.

This right here --- my daughter's dual credit chemistry course was graded based on assignments, practice quizzes, lab reports, and quizzes/exams. I appreciate the balanced approach.  She knew the concepts well, did great on assignments and labs, but could have done better on quizzes. Because of the variety of ways to earn credit, it didn't kill her grade. 

Edited January 13 by MagistraKennedy

[MagistraKennedy]

On 1/11/2024 at 3:03 PM, kokotg said:

We had a...fun experience last semester where DS took a DE sociology class with absolutely no assessments/feedback whatsoever. The prof assigned tons of reading and had them do a whole bunch of informal writing (posts on the class message board and short responses to the reading), but no grades at all. The most he got was that the prof told them they could all come ask him after class what their midterms grades were and he told DS he was "on track for an A." He stuck with it because the prof had very good reviews and it seemed like everyone who'd put in much effort had gotten an A. And he did get an A, but I'm nearly certain he did more work than almost anyone else in the class, because he actually DID almost all of the massive amount of reading assigned and the 8 million little writing assignments. This was a 3000 level sociology class in which he was the only high schooler; aside from that it was mostly criminal justice majors for whom it was a requirement. The professor spent a lot of time telling them all that the administration hated him and wanted to get rid of him because he's such a radical, but I can think of some other reasons he might not be an administration favorite. Anyway. /tangent. 

This would have made me utterly bananas. 🍌 Kudos to your son.

[NolanP]

On 1/9/2024 at 7:45 PM, Clemsondana said:

My kid took Calc 3 and Physics with Calc I DE last semester and said that they were told that between 17-20 hours was expected for each.  Kid said that some weeks didn't take that long, but some weeks did.  Those are both challenging classes, and taking them online was brutal despite kid being a very capable student who is used to self-teaching.  Kid is taking the next physics class this semester in person so we'll see what they are told next week when classes start.  On the other hand, DE psych, lit, etc were nowhere near that many hours.  

I do wonder if instructors are having to be more explicit about the time commitment because more students are expecting to put in little work.  I've been teaching at the same homeschool co-op for over a decade and I've always had a mix of average students, overachievers, and slackers - generally lovely kids with different attitudes towards academics.  But, this year several teachers, including me, are struggling with students who seem shocked that they have to work.  I was repeatedly asked in the first few weeks if they needed to write down everything that I wrote on the board.  I've had several student comment that the class is really hard because they don't know the information after coming to class.  They don't think it's reasonable that I present the information and often provide ways to model or use the information, but the work of actually incorporating it into their memory is going to take work outside of the 2 hours that I spend with them each week.  Almost 1/2 of the class doesn't take notes, they just take pictures of the board.  They are really nice kids.  We are not in an area that had schools that were closed for an extended time.  The students have a mix of public school and homeschool background.  The kids that I had last year were not like this.  It could just be an unusual group - the group that is graduating has an inordinate number of overachievers, and this group could be equally atypical.  But, based on what my senior reports from public school kids on the ball team, this is widespread and far more common than in years past.  I could imagine that college instructors are having to shock kids into understanding that these classes are going to take a lot of work.  

Many students expect to not have to *think* about a course when they are physically not in the class space. I've recently noticed this among the public high schoolers I visit with too. They get home from school, turn on the gaming console and zone out until dinner/bedtime, with no thought towards studies or assignments happening outside of the walls of the public school building.

Please hold the line in your bio course!

[silver]

Just an update. My kid decided to stick with the class.

For homework, they do some online work required for lab prep, read the chapter, make flashcards, and study the flashcards. It takes less than 6 hours a week, I'd say. The first of the five exams (four units exams and a final) is done, and they got a A. They also got an A on the first 2 of 10 quizzes. I'm really confused as to what the professor expects students to do for 10-15 hours outside of class (he's told the class that reading the chapter multiple times is not what they're supposed to do and won't help) and why he implies it is that hard to get a C.

[regentrude]

On 2/15/2024 at 8:43 AM, silver said:

Just an update. My kid decided to stick with the class.

For homework, they do some online work required for lab prep, read the chapter, make flashcards, and study the flashcards. It takes less than 6 hours a week, I'd say. The first of the five exams (four units exams and a final) is done, and they got a A. They also got an A on the first 2 of 10 quizzes. I'm really confused as to what the professor expects students to do for 10-15 hours outside of class (he's told the class that reading the chapter multiple times is not what they're supposed to do and won't help) and why he implies it is that hard to get a C.

He says 10-15 hours so he gets students to put in 6.

If he said 4-6, they'd do 30 minutes.