MamaSprout Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 I'm teaching a co-op writing class of 8th - 10th graders, but covering grammar b/c the students need it. We're using a Warriner's grade 7 book. I'm grading papers today, and some of my kids missed 75% of the assignment on basic capitalization (after I told them sloppy mistakes would result in extra work). My families who are struggling seem to have one minor crisis after the other and lots of outside activities, and they tell me they plan to go to college. If I say something, it will result in a parental panic attack. I'm not sure how to help them. I'm using a thorough, below level grammar book. Should I assume they are not really reading the book? I know they don't read to learn well, which is why I choose the below level text. I spend a lot of time trying to make the work relevant, but somehow I think there is something else missing. I don't want to assign more of the same stuff that isn't working, but what do you do with 10th graders who lack a foundation to the point they can't handle 7th grade language mechanics? Is there a MUS for English? Something like online math drills that's self grading? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlotteb Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 The most visual English that I know of is Winston Grammar. But its not online as far as I know. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theelfqueen Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 My 9th grader initially blew off the reading of his grammar work because he was sure he "knew that stuff," until I started making him redo it and do practice apps and such whenever he did poorly. I would definitely do some reinforcement ... there's lots of free download able grammar practice out there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amateur Actress Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 Easy Grammar might work. They have workbooks & TM's for each grade level. It's pretty inexpensive, too. They also have Daily Grams, review books after mastery has occurred. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted March 25, 2016 Author Share Posted March 25, 2016 My 9th grader initially blew off the reading of his grammar work because he was sure he "knew that stuff," until I started making him redo it and do practice apps and such whenever he did poorly. I would definitely do some reinforcement ... there's lots of free download able grammar practice out there. Are there specific apps you like? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted March 25, 2016 Author Share Posted March 25, 2016 Easy Grammar might work. They have workbooks & TM's for each grade level. It's pretty inexpensive, too. They also have Daily Grams, review books after mastery has occurred. I moved to Warriner's because Easy Grammar Ultimate didn't have enough explanation. I really like the series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted March 25, 2016 Author Share Posted March 25, 2016 Maybe I'll find some YouTube videos and assign more practice. I think maybe it's a combination of learning style and motivation.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellie Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 I moved to Warriner's because Easy Grammar Ultimate didn't have enough explanation. I really like the series. EG Ultimate is review, not primary instruction. These children might need the primary instruction in Easy Grammar Plus. OTOH, they might, as someone else has said, just be blowing you off because they thought they knew it all, and/or they are just blowing you off. There's no need to talk to the parents; you are the teacher. Make grammar a part of their grade (a small part, but still a part) so that they know you are serious. Also, are you discussing the grammar in class, or are they just reading the lessons and doing the assignment? Maybe there should be more class discussion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almondbutterandjelly Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 I think it's the age or something. When my dd attended private school in 8th grade, her punctuation skills seemed to evaporate. I promise you she had them. When she came back home for 9th grade, I made her do both of Remedia's Proofreading workbooks, all the way through. That seemed to clear things up. Remedia also has a Capitalization and Punctuation workbook if you need that. They are excellent. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted March 25, 2016 Author Share Posted March 25, 2016 (edited) EG Ultimate is review, not primary instruction. These children might need the primary instruction in Easy Grammar Plus. OTOH, they might, as someone else has said, just be blowing you off because they thought they knew it all, and/or they are just blowing you off. There's no need to talk to the parents; you are the teacher. Make grammar a part of their grade (a small part, but still a part) so that they know you are serious. Also, are you discussing the grammar in class, or are they just reading the lessons and doing the assignment? Maybe there should be more class discussion? Some of them have (supposedly) been through Easy Grammar Plus- that's why I chose the Ultimate book. We spend about 15 minutes in the once a week class specifically on grammar (it's a very mixed group). I then make myself available another hour during the week for one-on-one instruction, and am always available by text and email. Harder topics we spend more time on. Punctuation strikes me as more of a "you just need to do it right over and over" kind of skill. ETA- I meant capitalization, but I guess it applies to punctuation, as well. Edited March 25, 2016 by elladarcy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pen Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 The parents don't already know? If not, my own feeling is that they deserve to know. It is possible they do not know what would be typical to expect for a college bound student, and it seems like learning now when there is still time to help would be better. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted March 25, 2016 Author Share Posted March 25, 2016 I think the parents are in something of denial, to be honest. Every time I say something though, the panic starts. There does seem to be some help at home. I have families I know are counting on me to teach these co-op classes next year. They've become a terrible time drain though, and I'm not sure I'm doing any good. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lang Syne Boardie Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 I don't see how the parents' panicked reaction is your problem. In other words, the fact that they react inappropriately and ineffectively doesn't really change anything...does it? Truth is truth. The students did poorly on their lessons, and they seem to need more practice in basic skills before college. I agree with Ellie that you can keep addressing the problem in class (more instruction, incentivizing, etc.), but I also agree with Pen that the parents need to know. I presume they expect some sort of feedback from you. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pen Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 I dunno. Can you say it in some way that says to them: Here is the situation, and you need to get a plan, not a panic. Panic won't help your kids. A plan and action might. Are these parents who have the skills their children lack, or are they undereducated? Could you suggest work to be done over the summer? Are all the kids behind in basic grammar and punctuation mechanics, or are some fine? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pen Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 Another thought just occurred to me: Can the kids read? Could you be dealing with kids with unrecognized LDs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lolly Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 For next year...Can you offer to teach an English class instead? Focus on grammar in that class and include a smaller writing component. Then, if possible, offer a writing or composition class for those who can pass a grammar proficiency test? If it were me, I would have it as a single class, give proficiency test the first day, separate the students into grammar or writing groups, and teach both groups separately. I have had a little experience teaching in a multi-grade classroom which makes me more comfortable with this idea. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted March 25, 2016 Author Share Posted March 25, 2016 Another thought just occurred to me: Can the kids read? Could you be dealing with kids with unrecognized LDs? Anxiety issues are all that have been mentioned. I think there are a couple of slow readers. The worst student has been professionally tested and didn't come up with anything specific. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted March 25, 2016 Author Share Posted March 25, 2016 I dunno. Can you say it in some way that says to them: Here is the situation, and you need to get a plan, not a panic. Panic won't help your kids. A plan and action might. Are these parents who have the skills their children lack, or are they undereducated? Could you suggest work to be done over the summer? Are all the kids behind in basic grammar and punctuation mechanics, or are some fine? I think that is were the problem is- I really don't think a couple of them will be ready to graduate when they plan to be ready. So, while they know they kids are behind, the families think they can catch up. Right now my plan is to require them to work with me one-on-one during my planned study sessions for the next few weeks. At that point I may require they complete something over the summer if they want to participate with me next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shellydon Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 I would do tests and grades. Send home the grade they make. If they do not have the skills, parents need to know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ondreeuh Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 I don't want to assign more of the same stuff that isn't working, but what do you do with 10th graders who lack a foundation to the point they can't handle 7th grade language mechanics? Is there a MUS for English? Something like online math drills that's self grading? YES! http://www.englishgrammar101.com. I used it to tutor high schoolers a few years ago and loved the instant feedback. The lessons aren't video-based, but the explanations are pretty clear. This is the section on capitalization and punctuation: http://englishgrammar101.com/capitalization-and-punctuation You can use the site for free, but it won't save progress or report grades. Definitely try it out and see if it's what you're looking for. If you sign up as a teacher, the first five students are $40 per year (all together) and then it's $25 for another 25 students. So you could pay $65 for 30 students to have a year of access. The website says the membership has these benefits: Track student progress Customize scope and sequence Create assignments Advertising-free environment 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pen Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 Hit the parental panic button then. Some are in 10th grade. They don't have much time to catch up. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneStepAtATime Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 Maybe send a letter home to parents explaining what is expected at this level, where they seem to be struggling, and suggestions for some on-line or other resources for the students to use to "catch up". Also, mark the errors and ask the students to correct the mistakes before the paper will be accepted. And is there a way to provide them with a typed out checklist of things they need to check for? Like a quick reference sheet? Would something like Fix-It Grammar work to help out? Only 15 minutes tops every day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted March 26, 2016 Author Share Posted March 26, 2016 Maybe send a letter home to parents explaining what is expected at this level, where they seem to be struggling, and suggestions for some on-line or other resources for the students to use to "catch up". Also, mark the errors and ask the students to correct the mistakes before the paper will be accepted. And is there a way to provide them with a typed out checklist of things they need to check for? Like a quick reference sheet? Would something like Fix-It Grammar work to help out? Only 15 minutes tops every day. Working on the letter. I think I will hit the panic button. It will be flailing of arms, but so be it. I do make them correct and return anything with more than a few errors (although I suspect in one or two cases parent is re-doing. It just occurred to me that sick parent= really bad work.... so I may not accept any more typed assignments, or might start giving quizzes.) They have reference sheets, and a full-fledged grammar program (Warriner's). I tried Daily Grams Ultimate last year and they needed more hand holding. Probably half the students are really well-prepared in grammar, so I am trying to find a balance for those who need it vs. those who don't. I'm far beyond the scope of teaching a free co-op writing class. I'm remediating bigger issues at this point. DH wants me to drop it all together (my dc is not in the class), but I think I'm going to transition everyone out over the next year. Which I think means I'm much less concerned about being nice, and more concerned with making sure they are adequately prepared for what comes next. :o) 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneStepAtATime Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 Working on the letter. I think I will hit the panic button. It will be flailing of arms, but so be it. I do make them correct and return anything with more than a few errors (although I suspect in one or two cases parent is re-doing. It just occurred to me that sick parent= really bad work.... so I may not accept any more typed assignments, or might start giving quizzes.) They have reference sheets, and a full-fledged grammar program (Warriner's). I tried Daily Grams Ultimate last year and they needed more hand holding. Probably half the students are really well-prepared in grammar, so I am trying to find a balance for those who need it vs. those who don't. I'm far beyond the scope of teaching a free co-op writing class. I'm remediating bigger issues at this point. DH wants me to drop it all together (my dc is not in the class), but I think I'm going to transition everyone out over the next year. Which I think means I'm much less concerned about being nice, and more concerned with making sure they are adequately prepared for what comes next. :o) Understand your feelings. I would ask, though, as the parent of a child with dysgraphia, that you consider continuing to accept type written assignments if you possibly can. For some kids, that is the life line that keeps them writing... And if it is the parent that is going in and making the corrections, that is their mistake, not yours. Do what you can but really stuff like that has to be back on the kids/parents, not all on your shoulders. Good luck and best wishes... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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