ChocolateReignRemix Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 Cliven Bundy was arrested today on charges stemming from his 2014 nonsense. The FBI now has armored vehicles on site and are trying to negotiate with the last 4 holdouts, but those holdouts are totally unhinged. I will be shocked if this doesn't end in a firefight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppy Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 I hear a clip of one of them saying if they left, they'd never see the light of day. In context I think it was a reference to prison, but, the person sounded panicked. All I can think is, what did you think would happen? Like, what was the expected outcome of bringing guns to occupy a federal building? I am hoping the Feds will find a way to end it without bloodshed. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spryte Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 Yes, I'd be shocked, too. They aren't allowing themselves an out, that doesn't involve some kind of bloodbath type ending. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted February 11, 2016 Author Share Posted February 11, 2016 I hear a clip of one of them saying if they left, they'd never see the light of day. In context I think it was a reference to prison, but, the person sounded panicked. All I can think is, what did you think would happen? Like, what was the expected outcome of bringing guns to occupy a federal building? I am hoping the Feds will find a way to end it without bloodshed. I think they honestly believed that this standoff would spark a revolution, and based on what I have been reading on their social media accounts they thought there would tens of thousands of "patriots" rising to their defense. They are also pretty butthurt that these other "patriots" have not shown up to aid/protect/rescue them, and they blame the lack of assistance on FBI infiltrators. I did see on the Buddy Ranch FB page that two guys in Nebraska were willing to come join them if they could get a ride. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsquirrel Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 (edited) The FBI has been working really hard to not have it get violent. If you want to know what happened last night, read back in the twitterfeed https://twitter.com/mollykyoung This is local reporter who was livetweeting the livesteam between the militants and some supporters as they were also negotiating with the FBI. I think she was also present at the checkpoint but I am not sure. At one point I think over 25,000 people were listening in. I didn't bother, but I think it is also on youtube if you really want to hear it. Honestly, from what I read, the FBI has shown tremendous forbearance. The FBI was trying to get them out last night but allowed them to let them do it in the morning with a congresswoman and Franklin Grahm. Edited February 11, 2016 by redsquirrel 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 What was the issue with the guy who was shot?? I just saw a blurb about how some video had been released that proved the Feds set out to murder him? And his family released a statement that he was shot many more times than the government says?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southern Ivy Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 (edited) ok, can someone explain this to me? Didn't all of Bundy's issues start years ago when he was illegally grazing his cattle on land in Nevada. How did everything wind up happening in Oregon? Or am I confusing two different Bundys? (We don't have cable/antennae/satellite, so I have to rely on online news sources. Sometimes, those become tedious when trying to figure out timelines. :/ ) Edited February 11, 2016 by Southern Ivy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted February 11, 2016 Author Share Posted February 11, 2016 What was the issue with the guy who was shot?? I just saw a blurb about how some video had been released that proved the Feds set out to murder him? And his family released a statement that he was shot many more times than the government says?? The video I saw showed him exiting his vehicle that had just been pursued by the police, and then reaching inside his jacket as he was told to put his hands up. I do find it strange that the Bundy nuts are so insistent he was murdered when the nut himself repeatedly stated he would not be taken alive. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted February 11, 2016 Author Share Posted February 11, 2016 ok, can someone explain this to me? Didn't all of Bundy's issues start years ago when he was illegally grazing his cattle on land in Nevada. How did everything wind up happening in Oregon? Or am I confusing two different Bundys? (We don't have cable/antennae/satellite, so I have to rely on online news sources. Sometimes, those become tedious when trying to figure out timelines. :/ ) The standoff in 2014 occurred at the Bundy ranch in Nevada, owned by Cliven Bundy. Bundy has been seen as a leader of this "movement" since that incident, and his son, Ammon, was one of the leaders involved in the takeover of the refuge in Oregon. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southern Ivy Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 Ok, got it. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Florida. Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 The latest report is that they will turn themselves in. http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/oregon-occupiers-surrounded-fbi-say-they-ll-turn-themselves-n516336 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted February 11, 2016 Author Share Posted February 11, 2016 They are currently surrendering peacefully. And (I am not making this up - I swear!) they played a song over the live feed as a soundtrack for the surrender. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted February 11, 2016 Author Share Posted February 11, 2016 Oh man. The last one (David) is now refusing to go out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spryte Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 (edited) The link above says that Fry is now making this about abortion and conflicts in the Middle East. That's the first I've heard of those issues being part of this. This is all over the place. Edited February 11, 2016 by Spryte 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anneinco Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 He surrendered. He had said he would not go alive but he just walked out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted February 11, 2016 Author Share Posted February 11, 2016 The "Liberty activists" on the live stream were not helping. Once he talked to an FBI negotiator he calmed down and surrendered. During the live stream he rambled through every conspiracy theory you can imagine, including UFOs and 9/11. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppy Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 The link above says that Fry is now making this about abortion and conflicts in the Middle East. That's the first I've heard of those issues being part of this. This is all over the place. There are also reports that he says he is suicidal. This got sad fast. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anneinco Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 There are also reports that he says he is suicidal. This got sad fast. I was listening to the live feed and really am surprised this ended as it did. He had been saying that if they attempted to move in on him, he was prepared to take his own life. He was going to die by his hand or theirs if they did not allow him to remain there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravelingChris Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 As I was visiting a National Wildlife Refuge yesterday, I thought about this standoff. I am really happy it is over. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsquirrel Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 The "Liberty activists" on the live stream were not helping. Once he talked to an FBI negotiator he calmed down and surrendered. During the live stream he rambled through every conspiracy theory you can imagine, including UFOs and 9/11. I was following this on twitter and people were so upset by what the 'liberty activists' were saying and people were BEGGING an actual mental health professional or trained negotiator to cut them off and get involved. I guess they were saying exactly the opposite of what one is supposed to say in these situations. The woman called him a "coward' etc. I am amazed he made it out alive with friends like that. At one point he declared war on the federal gov't. He is clearly mentally unstable, and kept repeating his references to abortion and prison rape and Obamacare, and he wanted a pizza and...marijuana? A good meal and relaxing for a bit might have helped matters, actually Frightening how easy it is for someone so unstable to get so many weapons. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimm Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 So it's over? I actually know someone in real life who is on the side of these loonies. She said "This could happen to any one of us." Ummm, no, it really couldn't. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsquirrel Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 So it's over? I actually know someone in real life who is on the side of these loonies. She said "This could happen to any one of us." Ummm, no, it really couldn't. Yeah, feeling pretty confident I'm in no danger of holing myself up in a wildlife refuge with my 10,000 guns, and making a fool of myself on the national stage when I am forced to ask for a delivery of chips and hummus and toilet paper. Maybe she was referring only to people with no sense of the ironic? Because that is one thing these people seem to be seriously lacking. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swimmermom3 Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 So it's over? I actually know someone in real life who is on the side of these loonies. She said "This could happen to any one of us." Ummm, no, it really couldn't. Mimm, if I've learned anything in following this closely for the last month and a half, it's that there is a not small portion of American citizens who truly believe that it can happen to them. They really believe that if they "stand up for their rights," the government will make them disappear or will kill them. The shock jocks have polluted peoples' minds and terrified them and they've bought into it. I started out mocking the occupiers at the Refuge, but I just don't have the heart for it anymore. Some of them are so painfully sincere. I can probably still dig not too far down to mock the Bundys, but then the dubious articles that link them to ALEC have me freaked out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luuknam Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 The "Liberty activists" on the live stream were not helping. Once he talked to an FBI negotiator he calmed down and surrendered. During the live stream he rambled through every conspiracy theory you can imagine, including UFOs and 9/11. There are also reports that he says he is suicidal. This got sad fast. Well, if he's hoping to plead insanity, then UFOs and suicidality might help him make that case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimm Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 Mimm, if I've learned anything in following this closely for the last month and a half, it's that there is a not small portion of American citizens who truly believe that it can happen to them. They really believe that if they "stand up for their rights," the government will make them disappear or will kill them. The shock jocks have polluted peoples' minds and terrified them and they've bought into it. I started out mocking the occupiers at the Refuge, but I just don't have the heart for it anymore. Some of them are so painfully sincere. I can probably still dig not too far down to mock the Bundys, but then the dubious articles that link them to ALEC have me freaked out. I do find it sad and depressing. And baffling that anyone came to the conclusion that this was the best way for them to "stand up for their rights." 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myfunnybunch Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 I started out mocking the occupiers at the Refuge, but I just don't have the heart for it anymore. Some of them are so painfully sincere. I don't exactly feel sorry for them, but I can see how shocking it must be for them to have stepped out of the echo chamber and....thud. They just fell right flat on their faces. To have been so utterly wrong about the predicted results of their actions and support for their supposed uprising must be devastating. I don't imagine that it will be much of a wake-up call for anyone involved. I'm sure that the rest of us are just brainwashed sheeple, too far gone to understand what they were doing. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swimmermom3 Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 I don't exactly feel sorry for them, but I can see how shocking it must be for them to have stepped out of the echo chamber and....thud. They just fell right flat on their faces. To have been so utterly wrong about the predicted results of their actions and support for their supposed uprising must be devastating. I don't imagine that it will be much of a wake-up call for anyone involved. I'm sure that the rest of us are just brainwashed sheeple, too far gone to understand what they were doing. I was wondering if because it seemed as though Cliven Bundy got off in 2014 with no repercussions, they all thought this was going to be the same. Obviously we now know that Cliven Bundy is probably not getting off without repercussions. Sheriff Dave Ward is beyond impressive. I hope he gets some time off to be with his family and decompress. However, it's probably going to take a while for things to get back to normal in Harney County. Unfortunately, I did look up KrisAnne Hall and Gavin Seim. I could use some "ear bleach." 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsquirrel Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 I was wondering if because it seemed as though Cliven Bundy got off in 2014 with no repercussions, they all thought this was going to be the same. Obviously we now know that Cliven Bundy is probably not getting off without repercussions. Sheriff Dave Ward is beyond impressive. I hope he gets some time off to be with his family and decompress. However, it's probably going to take a while for things to get back to normal in Harney County. Unfortunately, I did look up KrisAnne Hall and Gavin Seim. I could use some "ear bleach." Bundy the elder is looking at 40 years in prison. I doubt he'll get anywhere near that much, but still, those are some serious repercussions. My personal guess is that he hasn't been off his own land much and it hasn't been worth the kerfuffle to take him into custody by force. He is always heavily armed, and he used to go around with armed body guards at all times. He came into Oregon after being on a plane, which means he had to be unarmed, and I think the family bodyguard is in jail with his sons. The FBI saw it's chance to arrest him peacefully and they and took it. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pam in CT Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 Bundy the elder is looking at 40 years in prison. I doubt he'll get anywhere near that much, but still, those are some serious repercussions. My personal guess is that he hasn't been off his own land much and it hasn't been worth the kerfuffle to take him into custody by force. He is always heavily armed, and he used to go around with armed body guards at all times. He came into Oregon after being on a plane, which means he had to be unarmed, and I think the family bodyguard is in jail with his sons. The FBI saw it's chance to arrest him peacefully and they and took it. Yes. Intercepting him as he came off a flight was the *ideal* circumstance to arrest him -- LEO knew he had no weapons, they knew he was alone, he had nowhere to go. A conspiracy theorist might even postulate that Michele Fiore entrapped him. :leaving: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Florida. Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 I started out mocking the occupiers at the Refuge, but I just don't have the heart for it anymore. Some of them are so painfully sincere. I can probably still dig not too far down to mock the Bundys, but then the dubious articles that link them to ALEC have me freaked out. I was following the twitter feed that was linked here, and I found the things that Fry was saying near the end to be just sad. I didn't actually feel sorry for him, but it was sad, if that makes sense. I don't exactly feel sorry for them, but I can see how shocking it must be for them to have stepped out of the echo chamber and....thud. They just fell right flat on their faces. To have been so utterly wrong about the predicted results of their actions and support for their supposed uprising must be devastating. Yes. ^^^^ I guess they really thought they had more support than they did. That mus have been disappointing to find out how alone they are. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swimmermom3 Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 Bundy the elder is looking at 40 years in prison. I doubt he'll get anywhere near that much, but still, those are some serious repercussions. My personal guess is that he hasn't been off his own land much and it hasn't been worth the kerfuffle to take him into custody by force. He is always heavily armed, and he used to go around with armed body guards at all times. He came into Oregon after being on a plane, which means he had to be unarmed, and I think the family bodyguard is in jail with his sons. The FBI saw it's chance to arrest him peacefully and they and took it. I believe that this is actually what the FBI stated happened? I am not sure what to think about this. It all looks good now - relatively speaking, but could it have been avoided if they had been able to charge Cliven Bundy earlier? Anyway, it's an absolutely beautiful area and I really respect my fellow Oregonians that live and work there. I hope they are able to heal the wounds this uninvited mess has caused. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimm Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 I was following the twitter feed that was linked here, and I found the things that Fry was saying near the end to be just sad. I didn't actually feel sorry for him, but it was sad, if that makes sense. Yes. ^^^^ I guess they really thought they had more support than they did. That mus have been disappointing to find out how alone they are. They get online and have tons of people saying, "Yeah, I agree with you!" But that means nothing. It costs someone nothing to agree with you online. That doesn't mean anyone is willing to drop what they're doing and occupy some building out in Oregon. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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