For those in college, don't rely on their advisor to be helpful all the time.

[momofkhm]

DD came home last night and we were asking about classes for next semester, since she already signed up.  She changed majors already (first semester freshman).  From her point of view, the school is babying them.  Freshman don't know how to do web advisor so their departments are signing them up for classes.   And since she switched to biology, they did group advising, not one-on-one.   Somehow they signed dd up for 18.5 hours!  She already plans to drop a class. 

 

DH was trying to figure out how all the classes she took this semester for nursing were counting.  She didn't know.  Finally, I said something about a degree audit.  DD didn't know she had one.  I knew about because I tried to get in and look at it, but I don't know the right password.  So she found it and we all looked at it - dd, dh, me and older dd.  We saw where things from this semester are fitting in.  We saw that something she took at CC was counting toward a gen ed.  DD didn't know that the class from cc would count that way.  It means she doesn't need one of the classes she is signed up for.

 

The upshot is she doesn't know what she doesn't know.  She doesn't know enough to ask the right questions.  We left her with sending an email to her advisor saying she is confused about things and can they please meet.

 

I know someone else also thought this part - advising on classes - was over.  (She has a piano as her profile pic. I think.)  I guess not.

[TranquilMind]

DD came home last night and we were asking about classes for next semester, since she already signed up.  She changed majors already (first semester freshman).  From her point of view, the school is babying them.  Freshman don't know how to do web advisor so their departments are signing them up for classes.   And since she switched to biology, they did group advising, not one-on-one.   Somehow they signed dd up for 18.5 hours!  She already plans to drop a class. 

 

DH was trying to figure out how all the classes she took this semester for nursing were counting.  She didn't know.  Finally, I said something about a degree audit.  DD didn't know she had one.  I knew about because I tried to get in and look at it, but I don't know the right password.  So she found it and we all looked at it - dd, dh, me and older dd.  We saw where things from this semester are fitting in.  We saw that something she took at CC was counting toward a gen ed.  DD didn't know that the class from cc would count that way.  It means she doesn't need one of the classes she is signed up for.

 

The upshot is she doesn't know what she doesn't know.  She doesn't know enough to ask the right questions.  We left her with sending an email to her advisor saying she is confused about things and can they please meet.

 

I know someone else also thought this part - advising on classes - was over.  (She has a piano as her profile pic. I think.)  I guess not.

Yes, these are adults.  They should be doing everything themselves, or at least have full access to schedule.  It's fine to double-check with an advisor, but you have to take control of your own education. 

 

In the university one of mine is in, you sign up yourself for classes.  You are responsible to know how to meet the requirements of your major and minors.  They are there for back up questions only, not to do it all for you. 

 

I actually like that system. Very much like signing up for popular co-op classes; you hovered over your keyboard until the time began and signed up as fast as possible to get in.  First come, first served. 

[elegantlion]

Yeah, it really does help for a student to poke around and see what systems are in place to help with class selection. We have degree audits and a new registration planner and cart that is very helpful, it lets you checkout your cart on registration day and registers you for the classes all at once. 

 

My school has a very clear, easy to find major/minor form. I'm able to check off classes each semester to see clear progress and what might be electives. I poked around at a couple of other schools and had a harder time figuring out what it took for some majors. Also, if you have a crappy advisor, we have a student success center that helps walk you through all of these products. 

 

I have a really awesome advisor, but I never walk into this office unprepared. I know what I need to move on, what classes I want and how they fit into my schedule. That frees up our time to discuss other aspects of my major instead of just class selection. 

 

We also have a freshman orientation program, which I assume this is explained in more detail, not sure I didn't go and ds didn't either. 

[MerryAtHope]

Interesting, I've never heard of a school automatically signing kids up for classes! Do you mean that they selected classes for her and registered her for them automatically? I wonder if this is a "service" that she can "opt out" of. Maybe they're so large that they don't have adviser time for each student, so they do this? That would have really annoyed me! When I was in school, we selected our own subjects but an adviser had to sign off on them (I'm guessing that was because there was no automated "degree check" like they can have now.) My son's school makes students meet with an adviser the first time, but after that they can register online without meeting with one. It's easy to see which classes meet requirements and which don't on their forms though. 

[momofkhm]

Interesting, I've never heard of a school automatically signing kids up for classes! Do you mean that they selected classes for her and registered her for them automatically? I wonder if this is a "service" that she can "opt out" of. Maybe they're so large that they don't have adviser time for each student, so they do this? That would have really annoyed me! When I was in school, we selected our own subjects but an adviser had to sign off on them (I'm guessing that was because there was no automated "degree check" like they can have now.) My son's school makes students meet with an adviser the first time, but after that they can register online without meeting with one. It's easy to see which classes meet requirements and which don't on their forms though. 

 

 

She chose classes and sections but then someone else actually put it into the system.  And even though her chosen sections still had openings, she didn't always get them.  She asked for Botany, they put her in zoology.  (The good thing about zoology is that the lab they put her in is on M 2-5, so she is finished on Friday by 2.  Right now she has a Friday class until 4.)

 

I don't know what is normal at other schools, her assigned advisor has like 50 students.  Which to me doesn't sound like abnormally large.    

 

Supposedly after this next semester, she will be on her own to sign up.  But the problem with it all is that she doesn't know what she doesn't know.

[MerryAtHope]

She chose classes and sections but then someone else actually put it into the system.  And even though her chosen sections still had openings, she didn't always get them.  She asked for Botany, they put her in zoology.  (The good thing about zoology is that the lab they put her in is on M 2-5, so she is finished on Friday by 2.  Right now she has a Friday class until 4.)

 

I don't know what is normal at other schools, her assigned advisor has like 50 students.  Which to me doesn't sound like abnormally large.    

 

Supposedly after this next semester, she will be on her own to sign up.  But the problem with it all is that she doesn't know what she doesn't know.

 

Definitely different from how my son's college works and how the one I went to worked! We always registered in person--there were no surprise switches. I agree, 50 doesn't sound abnormally large. It sounds like they just have an odd system. 

[J-rap]

Because of some unusual family circumstances, I haven't been able to be very involved with my kids' college years until recently.  So, it was up to them with some help from advisers to figure things out.  What a disappointment that was for a couple of them!  One of them had an adviser help her year-by-year, only to find out that the classes she needed were only held in a certain order during certain semesters -- but found this out too late.  As a result, she wasn't able to be certified in her major.  So, I don't agree that students should always have to figure it all out themselves.  They really don't know what they don't know, even if they are doing everything they do know.  (If that makes sense!)

 

As a result, I've now taken a much more active role in helping our youngest navigate her course requirements and tentative schedules for her college years.  Hopefully between herself, her adviser, and me, we'll figure out what she needs to complete her degree in the most efficient way.

[Gwen in VA]

My youngest both attended colleges where students were autmoatically signed up for classes --

 

1) There was ONE major and all classes offered for your year are mandatory! In other words -- every student in the same graduating class graduates with the same set of classes.

 

2) An arts school where most classes are required. Dd is has to decide about her one elective class, but she is automatically signed up for all the others.

 

I know -- I think the business of pre-signing students up is weird, but at certain schools it makes sense.

 

I think the parenting of young adults consists of asking the "right" questions!

[TechWife]

DS' university has a four year plan for every major. They have lined everything out as far as classes required for the major go, but they don't line out the gen. ed. classes. Instead, they say "choose one from xxx gen. ed. category." Like most, he has several classes required for his major that have to be taken in sequence, beginning with his first semester. For next semester, I helped him find the classes when he was home for fall break, and he had no idea how complicated it was. He went for his advisor meeting, who put his two cents in, and he registered for a slightly different set of classes. It seems his advisor thinks one of the classes needed for his major should be offered earlier than it is, so he wanted him to take it. The problem that I have with it is that he is barely starting on his gen. ed. classes and his advisor wanted him to take more classes than we want him to take. We told ds that the might need to drop one class at the beginning of the semester. 

[Mom22ns]

Ds didn't meet with his advisor at all in planning for the second semester. Instead, we worked it out together. All the information about he needs and the course descriptions are available online. As registration got close, classes schedules were posted. We took the list of classes that he needed and wanted and ran it against what was available. Some classes weren't offered in the spring and we had to put them on hold until next fall for example. It took us a little time and he was pretty clueless to start, but we came up with a schedule he was very happy with. He registered online, signing up for the exact sections of each class that he wanted.

 

Even dd's CC (dual enrollment) allowed her to do online registration this semester. She had to meet with an advisor and they signed her up in the past, but this time her advisor just told her the approval for over six hours is in the computer and she could register for any/all classes she wants. To our surprise (since she registers so late) she got into all the classes and sections she was trying for too.

[TechWife]

Ds didn't meet with his advisor at all in planning for the second semester. 

 

Interesting. DS had to get a code to use during registration from his advisor. He has to meet with him every semester for his major. Not all majors require this, though. 

[FaithManor]

Ds's adviser has not been the least bit helpful. BUT, U of MI has a good system online and they have worksheets that students can print off to keep track of what they need for GEN ED, major, minor, and electives. Every course they offer has a label after it so you know if it counts for Fine Arts (F), Humanities (H), Natural Science, etc. Anything with the appropriate label will count, and you get a message if you attempt to sign up for something that has a pre-requisite you have not taken. It also tells you if you can take the course with faculty permission without the pre-requisite and where to take the signed paper if you are allowed. They can register online. Since the adviser was not "advising" and hard to get a hold of, he and I sat down at the computer, looked at what Gen Eds he needed to get out of the way, what he needed to do next for his major and minor, and what was available so we could make a reasonable schedule.

 

I am prepared to be "Professor McGonagle" for however long it takes and will probably need to do so for the other two, but that's okay. And really, he was very much in charge, making the decisions for himself, and just asking for advice here and there. I didn't do it for him, just provided some guidance. Possibly next semester he won't even need me though he does like to run things past us, and I'm happy to have him continue to do that.

 

The online system seems to work well. The only hitch was that his second semester of German turned out to be M, T, TH when it was only listed as T/TH so the Intro to Theater class that he signed up for to finish his Fine Arts credits was conflicting. He chose to get a humanity out of the way instead and opted for Anthropology. I was a little shocked but he said he really didn't mind and it fit into his schedule well.

 

When I went to college, my parents knew nothing about it. Nothing. And they didn't help. But, it also was not as complicated at all. There was a single set of Gen Ed that just about everyone on campus had to take and a worksheet was available to tell you what order you had to take them in. Then there was a worksheet for your major. I was a piano performance major who was assigned to a psychology professor who kept giving me terrible advice. I was smart enough to tell my piano professor who chuckled and said, "Let me help you make up the right schedule." So from there on out, I worked out the schedule with her, and then took my forms to him to sign. He never even looked, just signed them and walked away. Same with ds, his adviser never even glanced at it. Oh well, he faxed the form to the registrars' office, it took no time at all to show up in the system that he was approved to register except that he had the error message about the conflict between theater and German, so he chose another class that fit, and bam, it was done.

 

He has a favorite writing professor that he is hoping he can be assigned to next year.

 I was a piano performance major who was assigned to a psychology professor who kept giving me terrible advice. I was smart enough to tell my piano professor who chuckled and said, "Let me help you make up the right schedule." So from there on out, I worked out the schedule with her, and then took my forms to him to sign. 

 

 

 

When it comes to advising, there are many ways to get vital information from informal sources.  Whether these be the friendly professor, as above, or a grad student, or department secretary, or students a year or two ahead of you in your major, it is a good idea to tell our college-bound kids to keep their eyes and ears open, and not just rely on official sources.  One of the great values of joining an academic club is to make connections with these kinds of people, to help guide decision making. 

[Dmmetler]

I'm just glad that you no longer have to sign up in person!  I remember really, really LONG lines to get your schedule put into the computer. Even in grad school, you had to sign up for classes that way (although graduate registration was before undergraduate, so at least it was ONLY the grad students. It was SO nice the one semester when Disney auditions were the week of registration and the dean did an override and registered me early.

 

 

 

I'm just glad that you no longer have to sign up in person!  

 

 

I'm old enough to have registered by walking all over campus, and yes that was a pain, and took an entire day.  Wish I had a fitbit then to measure my steps!

 

Still, I found it valuable to end up talking to a real, actual human being at the head of the line.  It wasn't in-depth advising, but it usually was a graduate student who would be TAing the class, or maybe who had taken the class, or knew the professors who would be teaching it.  I got advice like "if this isn't your major, avoid this prof", or "I know this class is full now, but if you go on the wait list, I'm pretty sure we'll be opening up more space", or once "Professor X is retiring after this year, he is great, and this is your last chance ever to take this class".  Especially if your formal adviser was a professor in your major, this might be the best way to get information about classes outside your major.

 

I think graduation requirements are more specific and confusing than they used to be, and the advent of online registration, which minimizes human interactions, only make the problem worse.

Edited November 23, 2015 by GGardner

[MerryAtHope]

I'm just glad that you no longer have to sign up in person!  I remember really, really LONG lines to get your schedule put into the computer. Even in grad school, you had to sign up for classes that way (although graduate registration was before undergraduate, so at least it was ONLY the grad students. It was SO nice the one semester when Disney auditions were the week of registration and the dean did an override and registered me early.

 

Oh, but those lines were like a rite of passage! Our campus had a huge bank of computers set up outside (at least 50 or so stations), and you listened for the next available one. Often you could overhear someone else registering for the same class you wanted and hear how many spots there were left, and hope against hope that *one* class that took forever to get in would be open and not have to rearrange your schedule! It was time-consuming, but also fun to talk to other students about the classes they were taking, compare schedules etc... 

[klmama]

The best part about the in-person registration was that after the hour-long wait, the nice ladies at the computers tried so hard to type quickly to get us into the sections we wanted before they filled.  It was like a competition for them to get "their student" into that last seat before someone else did.  I always appreciated their efforts.

[MerryAtHope]

The best part about the in-person registration was that after the hour-long wait, the nice ladies at the computers tried so hard to type quickly to get us into the sections we wanted before they filled.  It was like a competition for them to get "their student" into that last seat before someone else did.  I always appreciated their efforts.

 

Yes! the workers were awesome! 

[Sebastian (a lady)]

Long ago someone explained the Navy officer promotion system to a room of new ensigns with the comment that no one was ever going to be as interested in their promotions as they were. If there were requirements that had to be met for promotion, it was up to them to meet the requirements AND make sure it was recorded for the promotion board.

 

I was one of those ensigns. The advice stuck and I've passed it along often. I also had an advisor who wasn't very helpful. Like others, I found a trusted prof to bounce ideas off of. He helped me create my semester schedule that I would get signed off down the hall.

 

I had a printed degree plan in a folder in my advisor's office. Each course I took was noted in the slot for the requirement it met. Most of the schools I've looked at have some form of degree plan available.

 

I wish that advisors were fonts of wise counsel. But the fact that they aren't isn't new. It's the student's degree. They are the most interested party.

[hillfarm]

As I have mentioned, DD did her Jr and sr years of high school through DE at the local cc. She will have earned 60 credit hours that will transfer to the university.

 

OU has 3 tiers of classes required by the university, then each college or school at the university has their own gen ed requirements, and then finally there are the requirements for each major and minor. It is very confusing.

 

One interesting thing is that since she has so many credit hours already, she will be allowed to register for her classes when the juniors do instead of waiting to register with the rest of the first year students. If any here are looking at incredibly full classes that are difficult to get into, perhaps some DE credits could help your student get that critical priority boost come registration time. If you are trying to decide between DE at a cc or AP, perhaps you might be able to get some extra mileage out of the DE.

[Mom22ns]

Interesting. DS had to get a code to use during registration from his advisor. He has to meet with him every semester for his major. Not all majors require this, though. 

 

I actually saw this mentioned here and got really nervous and asked ds if he needed a code. He thought I'd lost my mind lol.