TianXiaXueXiao Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 What's the Hive's take on this study and its results? We don't use an online charter but I've considered it. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/answer-sheet/wp/2015/10/31/study-on-online-charter-schools-it-is-literally-as-if-the-kid-did-not-go-to-school-for-an-entire-year/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
umsami Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 Wow. Really troublesome. Lost 180 days of math? I wonder if part of the issue may be using solely online textbooks vs. hard copies? No idea if even K-12 does that for all subjects. Here in Florida where I am, the online virtual schools (associated with the PS district) tend to do as well as or better than the local schools on standardized tests. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Closeacademy Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 Well our experience was that it was a lot of time consuming busy work and she made absolutely no progress that year. She got almost all As, scored high on the practice tests at the beginning of the year but failed the state testing at the end. It was disorganized and we switched teachers part-way through and the homeroom teacher was supposed to call every other week but I talked to someone maybe three times the entire year and she belittled my concerns about the testing and my daughter's test anxiety. It was a disaster. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SparklyUnicorn Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 What I am not clear on is if they compared the students in general or if they compared the students individually. For example, could it be that the average student who enrolls in an on-line charter does so because they struggle in a traditional classroom? So if on average they are a group of struggling students then of course that will likely show a difference. I wonder how they fared individually. Was there still no improvement from year to year on an individual basis? That seems like a fairer way of measuring the effectiveness. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pamela H in Texas Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 I definitely could see how these schools could be problematic. However, I would guess a LOT depends on the individual student and family. My son used the K12 school here for 7th and half of 8th grades. He was a struggling student and made excellent progress. Now, he was READY to make that progress. And it was a good fit for us because of other things going on in our life at that time. I am glad we did it. But we worked closely with another girl who got ABSOLUTELY NOTHING out of it (mostly due to inconsistency doing it and then just going through the motions when she did). Anyway, I'm not surprised that they don't measure up to regular public schools. I am surprised they work so poorly especially when my son did so well with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmseB Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 It didn't surprise me. One has to be very self-motivated and/or have a motivated mentor to do well in online school. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmseB Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 What I am not clear on is if they compared the students in general or if they compared the students individually. For example, could it be that the average student who enrolls in an on-line charter does so because they struggle in a traditional classroom? So if on average they are a group of struggling students then of course that will likely show a difference. I wonder how they fared individually. Was there still no improvement from year to year on an individual basis? That seems like a fairer way of measuring the effectiveness. Exactly. I think one has to look at the kind of students who are enrolling in online charters in the first place, their reasons for doing so, and the kind of help they have at home when trying to complete the course work. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freesia Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 It doesn't surprise me. Ds is taking 4 online classes this year (not through a charter) and I need to be very involved. It is possible that some parents who are more likely to use charters (particularly if they pulled their dc out of school) assume they can be relatively hands off. While the online classes have been a great help around here, they are definitely NOT hands off if we want ds to excel. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plagefille Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 What I am not clear on is if they compared the students in general or if they compared the students individually. For example, could it be that the average student who enrolls in an on-line charter does so because they struggle in a traditional classroom? So if on average they are a group of struggling students then of course that will likely show a difference. I wonder how they fared individually. Was there still no improvement from year to year on an individual basis? That seems like a fairer way of measuring the effectiveness. I was wondering that too. In my state, UT, tons of the online charter students opt out of standardized testing. That can really mess up the data if they are only looking at the whole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcadia Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 What you (the student) get out is what you put in regardless whether it is online, b&m charter or public school. My kids did three years of K12 VA. Those who didn't do well in the virtual academy would have been socially promoted anyway in my local public schools. The bottom five or six of each class of over 30 in my local public school are called for parent teacher conference. The results show close to half fail the state testing in math and language arts. Education isn't in good shape and tutoring business is thriving. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maize Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 I've known a few families who chose online charters because their child was struggling and unhappy at school. In two cases there was no parent at home to supervise the school day and preteen/young teen students were expected to be entirely responsible for completing the online work. For struggling students in such circumstances I am not at all surprised that eschools have limited effectiveness. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TianXiaXueXiao Posted November 2, 2015 Author Share Posted November 2, 2015 Well our experience was that it was a lot of time consuming busy work and she made absolutely no progress that year. She got almost all As, scored high on the practice tests at the beginning of the year but failed the state testing at the end. It was disorganized and we switched teachers part-way through and the homeroom teacher was supposed to call every other week but I talked to someone maybe three times the entire year and she belittled my concerns about the testing and my daughter's test anxiety. It was a disaster. Ugh. How very frustrating. This is the kind of thing I'm afraid of. I'm also afraid of homeschooling high school but I need to remind myself that we have a community college for some classes as well as universities that offer online coursework for high schoolers. I hope your daughter has recovered from the experience! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmmetler Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 In my area, the one online charter in the state was used as something to suggest to parents of kids the school didn't want. For example, kids facing serious disciplinary action or truancy proceedings often were told that the records wouldn't follow their child if they transferred elsewhere. There were exceptions, especially the first year, but the program quickly became untenable for many, and the more active, Involved parents mostly ended up homeschooling. It didn't surprise me at all when the program had consistently low test scores. Before the online charter, there were other places the "push outs" went, but many of them had a cost involved (a couple of little private schools in churches, using ACE or similar workbook programs and the like for younger kids, dropping out and taking GED classes for high schoolers). 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 I don't understand...if online college classes don't work for the majority, why do they think that online school will work for younger students? Am I looking at it wrong?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JumpyTheFrog Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 I don't understand...if online college classes don't work for the majority, why do they think that online school will work for younger students? Am I looking at it wrong?? I don't understand it either. I am glad there are options, but I can't believe that people expect to plunk an elementary school student down in front of a computer and get the same results as actually having a person there to prod them to get to work. This sounds like the educational equivalent of the "benign neglect" form of parenting that so many boys got in the 1950s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joyofsixreboot Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 I don't discount the story but our personal experience has been good. My dd used an online charter for four years. She chose to return to brick and mortar school. She is taking dual credit botany/ zoology, AP Lit, calculus...you get the idea and getting A's in all of them. That's purely anecdotal of course. I also know many kids in her charter were there because 1) they were doing poorly and this was their parents try to improve grades, 2) had been expelled from B&M school, 3) had extensive health problems. The student body makeup could skew results. These kids might have done poorly anywhere. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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