Common Core....

[Tanaqui]

I didn't imply that. I pointed to two different factors, which worked in tandem. I never implied or stated that every single country other than the US was affected by both factors.

 

Even if I had implied that, is that really more offensive than "they were stupid compared to us because our math education was so much better"?

 

At any rate, I am not seeing the connection between GDP and pacing guidelines.

 

How do you measure economy?

 

[Tanaqui]

At any rate, this doesn't seem to be a tangent anybody else wants to discuss, so maybe you can PM me if you want to continue it?

[vonfirmath]

Our parents?!?!? *I* love Tom Lehrer's "new Math".  And "Poisoning Pigeons In The Park", "Masochism Tango", and "We Will All Go Together As We Go", and ...  :)

 

I agree. In my high school lit mag, we listened to Tom Lehrer as we put the Literary magazine together.  Listened, danced, made memories together..

[vonfirmath]

Of course my philosophy is also that if a kid is too young to do his/her homework on their own, they're too young to have homework, but that's another story.

 

I thought this as well, before I had a student in the school.

 

It's hard enough to keep up with where my kid's strengths and weaknesses are WITH homework -- when he was not bringing anything home, I ended up feeling completely in the dark about what he was doing and if he was truly succeeding.  To the point where I was making up work on my own to test things. But not knowing what they were doing in the classroom, it did not necessarily reinforce skills.

[vonfirmath]

I agree. I attended pre-k in 1981 with all of my neighborhood friends. My mom was a SAHM and we had her to go home to but there was preschool and it was used by many.  I also might not have had Leapfrog but I watched quite a bit of Sesame Street, School House Rock, Mr. Rogers, and other educational shows of the time. My parents were also very involved in our education. Dh's were even more involved and he's four years older than me and from a different state. He also went to pre-k and pretty much watched the same shows as me.

 

I attended two years of preschool before starting 1st grade the year I should have started Kindergarten (late 70s).  I do believe this was the 3 days a week type of preschool. But it was one of the data points in favor of testing me and seeing if I was ready to start 1st grade that year, as my parents tell it.

[displace]

That's an issue with a lot of subjects. For some reason, we in the English speaking world think that by pushing skills to earlier grades, we will end up with more advanced students at the end.

I agree in the US we have sort of wacky requests of students developmentally in early childhood education. I cannot speak for other English speaking countries though I've heard in a lot of them schooling is more relaxed and delayed relative to us, with an academic push as children mature and age. As it should be.

[displace]

I'm surprised nobody has brought up the fact that for the early common core guidelines (grades K-3), there were no early elementary teachers, developmental specialists, or early education specialists to make the standards. They were made after the older education standards were developed and just filtered backwards for younger kids. Many specialists (Peds, teachers, researchers, psychologists, developmental specialists, etc) have come forward to oppose the standards.

 

Just to put into context, the national early education professionals were not involved with developing CC standards for K-3 grade. I can't comment on older grades common core standards.

[Mergath]

This happens all over my neighborhood, I don't understand it with the crazy people that are out there. I get emails when there is

a new person has been added to the list of those who moved within so many miles of my home.

 

We just moved so I'm in a new neighborhood, but kids here play outside unsupervised from four or five and up.  My six-year-old is allowed to go to the end of the next block on her scooter.  She's surviving just fine. ;)

 

I'm assuming the emails are about level three sex offenders, correct?  They've always been out there.  The police simply didn't track them and notify the public about them before.

[Mergath]

I'm surprised nobody has brought up the fact that for the early common core guidelines (grades K-3), there were no early elementary teachers, developmental specialists, or early education specialists to make the standards. They were made after the older education standards were developed and just filtered backwards for younger kids. Many specialists (Peds, teachers, researchers, psychologists, developmental specialists, etc) have come forward to oppose the standards.

 

Just to put into context, the national early education professionals were not involved with developing CC standards for K-3 grade. I can't comment on older grades common core standards.

 

Probably because people have discussed stuff like this ad nauseum in other threads.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I almost never see kids in the 6-12 age range playing unsupervised around here. I'm pretty sure there were just as many crazies in the 90s as there are now. That said, I do live in a different country now than I did then, but from what I've read kids in the US were usually given quite a lot of freedoms like that in the 50s and 60s or w/e.

 

As to why people let their kids play outside unsupervised, I imagine that it depends on the parents - some might just find it to be the easiest thing to do (although seriously, have they not heard of videogames?), but others (including me) believe that you need to gradually increase kids' independence to prep them for adulthood... you can't just supervise a kid full time until they turn 18 and expect them to know how to act like an adult.

 

I'm struck by the fact I never see kids around here period.  One day I was sitting outside on the front steps.  Just hanging out basically.  My kids were in and out.  This was during a school day.  Some woman walking by said she noticed I have kids and wanted to know how long I've lived here because she never sees kids and her kids are always looking for others to play with.  I told her I lived here about 5 years. I never saw her or her kids.  And yes we do go outside and walk around.  I think kids are either at school then after school care, and then during the summer in some sort of daycare program called "camp".  I guess being a SAHM is odd around here.

 

It's hard though.  My kids met a boy on another street.  Not sure how.  I think he was walking up and down the alley.  So he came over a few times.  Then my kids went there.  One day my son called from there and asked if he could stay late to watch a movie.  I said ok, but be home by 9 pm.  Of course the whole time I'm nervous as hell.  I don't know the parents and I was new to the area.  So 9:30 rolls around and he's not home.  I tried calling and nobody answered the phone.  So I sent my husband to go get him.  Finally they get back.  The father of the kid apologized and said they don't have a clock.  That was the end of that.  They don't have a clock?  What a crock of bull.  They have a phone and I know they have a computer.  And they have a TV.  How can they have no means on any of those things to check the time?  Why the ridiculous excuse?  Why not just say oops we lost track of time?  I can't trust people who are so ridiculous. 

 

Growing up I did play in the neighborhood, but maybe until I was 8.  Then a lot of kids moved away.  School kept us busy.  Parents worked so kids weren't home in the summer (I was).  My mother had us in organized park programs.  Even playing around in the neighborhood we were loosely supervised.  My parents had to know where I was and they had to be assured the parents were home.  I grew up and managed just fine despite rarely being unsupervised.  The only major difference I see now is kids are heavily discouraged to walk by themselves.  That seems a bit over the top to me, but I'm not originally from the area I live now so maybe it's not safe.  It's definitely dangerous for pedestrians because people don't seem to grasp the rules of crosswalks. Although I've had kids do crazy things like ask me for rides home.  I'm talking some random kid at the park.  I don't live in an area where we are all chummy around here and it's not a big deal to ask someone at the park for a ride.  It's downright nutty. 

[MotherGoose]

The engineers today who understand their jobs probably did not get to where they are by having to draw a gazillion little pictures for math in 2nd grade.

We are using Horizons, and they ask the kids to draw some pictures. However, I find doing numerous ones is a waste of time. My dd would have really hated this in k or 1...she's in 3rd now. So I do the same thing with cuisenaire rods. I realize that schools can't afford manipulatives for every child, and I imagine that they make them draw pictures instead.

[luuknam]

Yeah. I don't see a lot of kids either. For one, there just aren't as many kids (more people who are too old to have kids under 12). And NL has if I remember correctly the highest percentage of SAHM in the first world, so I grew up with almost all of my classmates having a SAHM (my mom was a SAHM as well). It's just tough. And when you feel like some random person will call CPS if you aren't supervising your 9yo or w/e, then that kid is less likely to be playing outside as many hours as well, so less likely to be outside when you're outside, etc.

 

My oldest is 7.5 and has an ASD, so that's different (although I just switched him to the regular school bus vs the short bus, so now he walks a block to the bus stop alone - would have tried that during the fall, but we get a lot of snow here... short bus is mighty convenient, lol), but I recently was talking to some mom at taekwondo who just let her 9yo and 8yo walk to the playground alone for the first time, followed them half and hour later with her other kid (she got caught up doing something; she'd planned to go there sooner), and when she got to the playground she saw 4 fire engines, 2 ambulances, and a police car. Turns out some *other* kid had fallen and broken her arm. Not sure how that degree of miscommunication happened to have 4 fire engines etc (I mean, seriously?), but she's now so freaked out that she doesn't want to let her 9yo and 8yo go to the playground alone. I don't think that'd be my conclusion from the situation... my conclusion would be that apparently it's super safe for kids to play at the playground (being in a car accident around here doesn't gather that amount of emergency response). That said, I understand that seeing all those fire trucks etc would cause your stomach to turn over and make you emotionally irrational about the situation, especially since her first thought probably was "omg my kids didn't die, did they?".

 

We live in a very safe neighborhood, fwiw. I'll go on walks alone at night without any worry, without even having a phone or w/e on me.

[luuknam]

We are using Horizons, and they ask the kids to draw some pictures. However, I find doing numerous ones is a waste of time. My dd would have really hated this in k or 1...she's in 3rd now. So I do the same thing with cuisenaire rods. I realize that schools can't afford manipulatives for every child, and I imagine that they make them draw pictures instead.

 

Even some schools that can afford them/have them for every child still make kids draw pictures. Some curricula are just very picture-happy.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Yeah. I don't see a lot of kids either. For one, there just aren't as many kids (more people who are too old to have kids under 12). And NL has if I remember correctly the highest percentage of SAHM in the first world, so I grew up with almost all of my classmates having a SAHM (my mom was a SAHM as well). It's just tough. And when you feel like some random person will call CPS if you aren't supervising your 9yo or w/e, then that kid is less likely to be playing outside as many hours as well, so less likely to be outside when you're outside, etc.

 

My oldest is 7.5 and has an ASD, so that's different (although I just switched him to the regular school bus vs the short bus, so now he walks a block to the bus stop alone - would have tried that during the fall, but we get a lot of snow here... short bus is mighty convenient, lol), but I recently was talking to some mom at taekwondo who just let her 9yo and 8yo walk to the playground alone for the first time, followed them half and hour later with her other kid (she got caught up doing something; she'd planned to go there sooner), and when she got to the playground she saw 4 fire engines, 2 ambulances, and a police car. Turns out some *other* kid had fallen and broken her arm. Not sure how that degree of miscommunication happened to have 4 fire engines etc (I mean, seriously?), but she's now so freaked out that she doesn't want to let her 9yo and 8yo go to the playground alone. I don't think that'd be my conclusion from the situation... my conclusion would be that apparently it's super safe for kids to play at the playground (being in a car accident around here doesn't gather that amount of emergency response). That said, I understand that seeing all those fire trucks etc would cause your stomach to turn over and make you emotionally irrational about the situation, especially since her first thought probably was "omg my kids didn't die, did they?".

 

We live in a very safe neighborhood, fwiw. I'll go on walks alone at night without any worry, without even having a phone or w/e on me.

 

I only very recently started letting the 13 year old ride his bike to the park. I don't feel it's safe though.  I figure I gotta let him, but it's not safe.  Heck, once I was at the park with him and some kid tried to steal his bike right from him.  Some people just suck.

 

Thankfully we have a street gossip who knows everyone's business and tells everyone else.  I'm sure now everyone knows we homeschool so they don't bat a lash that my kids are home during the day. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

Even some schools that can afford them/have them for every child still make kids draw pictures. Some curricula are just very picture-happy.

 

I have one kid who loves to draw.  The other one...not at all.  I guess maybe they try to reach different learning styles.  That's why I love homeschooling though.  I can just focus on what works for each kid.

 

Pretty luxurious really!

[SKL]

My neighborhood is low on kids too.  Good thing mine have each other.  We just finally had a neighbor with kids move in last year.

 

I think kids ought to be outside running around as much as possible, but I can understand why people wouldn't want their kid to be the only one / first one.  Especially with all the stories of parents being arrested for letting their school-aged kids out.  I feel sorry for our kids.

 

Maybe someone should release a study proving that free ranging gives kids an international competitive advantage when they grow up.  :P

[luuknam]

I only very recently started letting the 13 year old ride his bike to the park. I don't feel it's safe though.  I figure I gotta let him, but it's not safe.  Heck, once I was at the park with him and some kid tried to steal his bike right from him.  Some people just suck.

 

Thankfully we have a street gossip who knows everyone's business and tells everyone else.  I'm sure now everyone knows we homeschool so they don't bat a lash that my kids are home during the day. 

 

I guess the park is too far to walk? We have three playgrounds that I consider within walking distance (one of which is at an elementary school) and a safe neighborhood. Although the third one (not the one at the elementary school) is maybe too far to let a 7-8yo walk alone too (it's about a mile). When I was a kid we had more playgrounds even closer. Heck, everything was closer when I was a kid. The U.S. is so spread out (and we actually live in a pretty densely populated suburb - one of America's top 100 most dense urban areas according to Wikipedia).

 

Another thing crossed my mind: in America people are more likely to have extensive playsets in the backyards. Not just a single swing, but something similar to the structures you see at a playground. Which makes sense if you keep going to the playground and no one else is there, and you have to walk far to get there, and you don't feel safe leaving your kids unsupervised. But, then your kids aren't going to be at the playground, so the next person will end up buying their own backyard playset for the same reason, etc.

 

I don't know where you live, but I agree there are places where I don't think it's safe to let younger kids go alone (and even some areas where I don't think it's safe for adults to go alone). It's just that when you're in a very safe area and people still believe it's not safe it gets to be annoying. When despite having an anxiety disorder you are more worried about random strangers calling CPS than you are about sharing a duplex with a senior CPS field agent (because he at least has some sense wrt what should be reported or not) or about something bad happening to the kids. Not that I think my kids are ready to go to the playground alone yet. But say, playing in the front yard or back yard without me constantly watching them. End rant, I guess.

[SKL]

Another thing crossed my mind: in America people are more likely to have extensive playsets in the backyards. Not just a single swing, but something similar to the structures you see at a playground. Which makes sense if you keep going to the playground and no one else is there, and you have to walk far to get there, and you don't feel safe leaving your kids unsupervised. But, then your kids aren't going to be at the playground, so the next person will end up buying their own backyard playset for the same reason, etc.

 

I wouldn't let anyone buy a swing / play set for my yard because I wanted my kids to walk to the park (1 mile) as often as they could.  They started walking there & back (with an adult) at 1.5 (they were late-ish walkers).  I sent them without an adult at 6yo, but I took a lot of heat and had people telling my kids that horrible things would happen to them if I sent them again.  :/  And no, we do not live in an unsafe neighborhood at all.  Now my kids are 8 and I plan to let them head up there when the weather gets nice.  At some point you have to cut the apron strings.  I had that much freedom when I was half their age.

[MotherGoose]

Even some schools that can afford them/have them for every child still make kids draw pictures. Some curricula are just very picture-happy.

Thank God my dd wasn't in a school like that (or any school) in K. In 3rd grade she will tolerate it, but I can only imagine the horror of having her as a tired 5 or 6 yo having to draw tons of little pictures for homework. It would have been awful. My current 5 yo would love to do it though. Yay for homeschooling!!

[Stellalarella]

So far in this thread we've covered Common Core math and its impact on untrained parents, little kids, the effectiveness of instruction, testing, GDP and economy in relationship to education, the effect of preschool on later success, the history of math instruction over the decades,  importance of  playtime, local sex offenders, learning styles and the value of kids drawing pictures to learn a concept.

 

Please, someone mention in yoga pants, shopping carts, inappropriate sugar foods for kids' parties, sexism or "Sexism" in centuries old literature and then the  Hive Stream of Conscious Thought will be complete!

 

THis thread is a really interesting ramble.

 

:)

[Tanaqui]

 

Please, someone mention in yoga pants, shopping carts, inappropriate sugar foods for kids' parties, sexism or "Sexism" in centuries old literature and then the  Hive Stream of Conscious Thought will be complete!

 

I am reading this thread while wearing my yoga pants at the grocery store. All my produce is in the top seat of the cart, and the main basket is full of jolly ranchers, peanut butter cups, and pixy stix, which I plan to give my kids at their next birthday party, after having them watch The Taming of the Shrew.

[MistyMountain]

GDP is an extremely poor measure of a country's well being and education level. We may have a high GDP but it doesn't mean much when we have higher poverty rates, a high incarceration rate and extreme inequality etc. It is just a measure of what is produced not what value it has.

 

I am mixed on the common core. I don't think it is a great solution but I also do not think it is trying to indoctrinate our children and teach them fuzzy math. A lot of the questions people are outraged over are actually not bad ways to teach concepts or that hard to understand and taken out of context You can't tell if what they are doing in the class is good. I have no problem with high standards that are appropriate but there needs to be help for kids that need it for whatever reason when they need it without labeling them. I do not like all the high stakes testing done on computers. A lot of students are falling through the cracks and do not graduate or graduate with poor skills.

 

My anecdote is that the expectations were much lower in kindergarten and 1st when I went to school in the late 80s. The cut off was later at the end of December rather the September 1st. Reading wasn't taught in kindergarten it started in 1st and multiplication was done in 3rd. We had gifted pull outs but most kids that struggled or had any special needs were put in different classes. Inclusion wasn't as common. My parents didn't help with homework. Preschool attendance was similar to now. We had more freedom in general as children. We walked to school and people were much less paranoid about children playing with other children outside with no parents around or walking to nearby stores or parks.

[Korrale]

It seems to me the real problem is with sending kids home with any homework that potentially depends on the understanding of the parents for it to get done. If there has to be homework at all, it should be things the child understands and just needs to practice or finish up.

Exactly. Why are parents doing their children's homework? Traditionally home work was sent home for the child as extra practice for stuff they had already learnt in class. It is not something new. A teacher can then look at the homework and see what the child is struggling with and help them. But if a child is returning perfectly done homework to school with the parents help the teachers can assume that the child understands the material.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I guess the park is too far to walk? We have three playgrounds that I consider within walking distance (one of which is at an elementary school) and a safe neighborhood. Although the third one (not the one at the elementary school) is maybe too far to let a 7-8yo walk alone too (it's about a mile). When I was a kid we had more playgrounds even closer. Heck, everything was closer when I was a kid. The U.S. is so spread out (and we actually live in a pretty densely populated suburb - one of America's top 100 most dense urban areas according to Wikipedia).

 

Another thing crossed my mind: in America people are more likely to have extensive playsets in the backyards. Not just a single swing, but something similar to the structures you see at a playground. Which makes sense if you keep going to the playground and no one else is there, and you have to walk far to get there, and you don't feel safe leaving your kids unsupervised. But, then your kids aren't going to be at the playground, so the next person will end up buying their own backyard playset for the same reason, etc.

 

I don't know where you live, but I agree there are places where I don't think it's safe to let younger kids go alone (and even some areas where I don't think it's safe for adults to go alone). It's just that when you're in a very safe area and people still believe it's not safe it gets to be annoying. When despite having an anxiety disorder you are more worried about random strangers calling CPS than you are about sharing a duplex with a senior CPS field agent (because he at least has some sense wrt what should be reported or not) or about something bad happening to the kids. Not that I think my kids are ready to go to the playground alone yet. But say, playing in the front yard or back yard without me constantly watching them. End rant, I guess.

 

No no.  It's not far at all.  It's just there are no side walks half the way and people drive like idiots.  The unsafe part is just that the park is kinda isolated from civilization.  I worry about gangs, bullies, and other jerks bothering him. 

 

We have almost no yard.  So no play sets.  I take them to the park as often as I can when the weather is nicer.  But sometimes I can't because I have to do other things.  So he sometimes he just wants to go ride around.  It took me awhile to let him, but yeah I don't like it one bit because I don't feel comfortable with it.  However, I can't keep him locked up either so I figure I have to let him. 

 

[Bluegoat]

I agree in the US we have sort of wacky requests of students developmentally in early childhood education. I cannot speak for other English speaking countries though I've heard in a lot of them schooling is more relaxed and delayed relative to us, with an academic push as children mature and age. As it should be.

 

The US may be more extreme - though there is a lot of variation nationwide - but it is pretty much the same attitude in Canada, Ireland, the UK, and (I think) Australia.  England, Scotland and Ireland have some of the youngest school-starting ages in Europe at 4 and 5. 

 

[Bluegoat]

 

 

When despite having an anxiety disorder you are more worried about random strangers calling CPS than you are about sharing a duplex with a senior CPS field agent

 

 

This is what gets me - being more worried about other parents freaking out than about anything actually happen. 

 

I think it's a control thing - people believe that they can, by doing all the right things, ensure that their children will grow up to be heathy, sucessful, religious (or irreligious as the case may be,) and so on.  If their child fails to accomplish these things, then it must be because they have failed as a parent. 

 

My mom noticed that this changed in between my two sisters being born - one in 1980 and the other in 1988.  By the time my youngest sister was born, kids didn't walk to school or friends houses, play in playgrounds without supervision, ride bikes around the neighbourhood, or any of the things I and my other sister were allowed to do.

[SparklyUnicorn]

This is what gets me - being more worried about other parents freaking out than about anything actually happen. 

 

I think it's a control thing - people believe that they can, by doing all the right things, ensure that their children will grow up to be heathy, sucessful, religious (or irreligious as the case may be,) and so on.  If their child fails to accomplish these things, then it must be because they have failed as a parent. 

 

My mom noticed that this changed in between my two sisters being born - one in 1980 and the other in 1988.  By the time my youngest sister was born, kids didn't walk to school or friends houses, play in playgrounds without supervision, ride bikes around the neighbourhood, or any of the things I and my other sister were allowed to do.

 

Yeah I get that sense too.  That I have to worry about other nosy people more than anything actually happening.

 

[Reefgazer]

No thanks. With your history of intentionally driving threads of track with minor tangents, I prefer to put you on permanent block.

 

And yes, you were offensive to other nationalities who are just as capable as the US of producing.

 

At any rate, this doesn't seem to be a tangent anybody else wants to discuss, so maybe you can PM me if you want to continue it?

[Reefgazer]

I see this in our neighborhood, too. We actually have a lot of kids who live here, but there's hardly anyone out to play. My kids have extremely limited screen time and one things I tell them to do as an alternative is to find some way to entertain themselves by reading, finding a hobby, or going outside to play. But even with all the kids in the neighborhood, there's hardly anyone else outside; They are either on their computers/video games, at afterschool tutoring, in aftercare because both parents work, or there is some other organized activity they are doing, but people don't really go out to play anymore. It makes it very to play the casual ball game, or get exercise outside of organized sports.

 

I'm struck by the fact I never see kids around here period. One day I was sitting outside on the front steps. Just hanging out basically. My kids were in and out. This was during a school day. Some woman walking by said she noticed I have kids and wanted to know how long I've lived here because she never sees kids and her kids are always looking for others to play with. I told her I lived here about 5 years. I never saw her or her kids. And yes we do go outside and walk around. I think kids are either at school then after school care, and then during the summer in some sort of daycare program called "camp". I guess being a SAHM is odd around here.

 

It's hard though. My kids met a boy on another street. Not sure how. I think he was walking up and down the alley. So he came over a few times. Then my kids went there. One day my son called from there and asked if he could stay late to watch a movie. I said ok, but be home by 9 pm. Of course the whole time I'm nervous as hell. I don't know the parents and I was new to the area. So 9:30 rolls around and he's not home. I tried calling and nobody answered the phone. So I sent my husband to go get him. Finally they get back. The father of the kid apologized and said they don't have a clock. That was the end of that. They don't have a clock? What a crock of bull. They have a phone and I know they have a computer. And they have a TV. How can they have no means on any of those things to check the time? Why the ridiculous excuse? Why not just say oops we lost track of time? I can't trust people who are so ridiculous.

 

Growing up I did play in the neighborhood, but maybe until I was 8. Then a lot of kids moved away. School kept us busy. Parents worked so kids weren't home in the summer (I was). My mother had us in organized park programs. Even playing around in the neighborhood we were loosely supervised. My parents had to know where I was and they had to be assured the parents were home. I grew up and managed just fine despite rarely being unsupervised. The only major difference I see now is kids are heavily discouraged to walk by themselves. That seems a bit over the top to me, but I'm not originally from the area I live now so maybe it's not safe. It's definitely dangerous for pedestrians because people don't seem to grasp the rules of crosswalks. Although I've had kids do crazy things like ask me for rides home. I'm talking some random kid at the park. I don't live in an area where we are all chummy around here and it's not a big deal to ask someone at the park for a ride. It's downright nutty.

[Reefgazer]

One thing I haven't seen at all is what are states going to do with those children who fail these high-stakes tests and do not get a standard high school diploma? What exactly is the plan for their future? How will they support themselves? Or maybe the plan is that community college will be the remediation path for these kids? If that is the plan, that will cost more than just cleaning up the high school to begin with. It's interesting, I've seen no state discuss what happens to those children who fail their exit exam.

[SparklyUnicorn]

One thing I haven't seen at all is what are states going to do with those children who fail these high-stakes tests and do not get a standard high school diploma? What exactly is the plan for their future? How will they support themselves? Or maybe the plan is that community college will be the remediation path for these kids? If that is the plan, that will cost more than just cleaning up the high school to begin with. It's interesting, I've seen no state discuss what happens to those children who fail their exit exam.

 

It would be good if schools offered more paths/alternatives. 

[Reefgazer]

I completely agree that this needs to be the solution. But school districts seem to be moving away from that option, which is very troubling because the students who do not pass the high-stakes tests are going to be left with literally nothing.

 

It would be good if schools offered more paths/alternatives.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I completely agree that this needs to be the solution. But school districts seem to be moving away from that option, which is very troubling because the students who do not pass the high-stakes tests are going to be left with literally nothing.

 

 

There are other options in my state.  Our local school has several options.  If the graduation rate and safety issues weren't such a major issue, I'd gladly send my kids to school there because they have tons to offer. 

 

Although my older kid would scoff.  He does not want to go to a B&M high school.

[SKL]

That's a good point, I haven't seen anyone discuss what they are going to do for kids who fail to benefit from all the reforms.

 

In my state, the focus is on putting a lot more resources into remediating the kids who fail the tests.  But that has its limits, especially if the stuff they are testing on is irrelevant to that individual's life path.

 

Personally I'd rather have a high school diploma and be prepared for blue-collar work, than have no high school diploma because I sucked at college-prep academics.