ecmom45 Posted September 7, 2014 Share Posted September 7, 2014 Do you do all questions in AOPS including the challenging questions? I found it impossible to cover all in one year if we do that. What is your experience? THanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted September 7, 2014 Share Posted September 7, 2014 Which text? DD completed Intro to Algebra in one year and did, if I recall correctly, most of the problems. DS took two years, spread out over the course of three school years, with a semester detour into C&P.. It covers more than a traditional algebra 1 course, so there is no need to complete it in one year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EndOfOrdinary Posted September 7, 2014 Share Posted September 7, 2014 I normally plan two books over three years. There is no real pace for the books. They are not traditional curriculum that is designed to be paced out over a week/semester/year. The topics do not align in this way either. Algebra covers significantly more than Algebra one, but not all of Algebra two. Geometry is much the same. They are not designed to be graded on a standard system, either. They just aren't standard. Counting and Probability and Number Theory are half the size of Algebra. Intermediate Algebra is twice the size of Calculus. The books are designed to cover the topics. They are to be done in as much time as it takes to do them. You might just drive yourself crazy trying to box them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmmetler Posted September 7, 2014 Share Posted September 7, 2014 We go at whatever pace DD sets, with a plan of spending 60 minutes a day on math. Sometimes, that's a lesson and exercises, sometimes that's two lessons and exercises or more, sometimes, that's a single problem. I will also say that if she's not feeling good, or if she's overly stressed, I've been known to put AOPS aside and pull out something else, because sometimes, AOPS is more than either of us can take on a given day (DD had a frog she'd raised from an egg die Thursday, for example-and that was a reason, in my book, to let AOPS Algebra rest a bit). So far, Pre-Algebra took right at 9 months. I don't know how long Intro to Algebra will take. The only concern I have about it stretching into a 2nd year is that I'm not sure what to call it the 2nd year for benefit of transcript, since the only students who take Algebra 1 over 2 years would normally be those who fail it the first time around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wapiti Posted September 7, 2014 Share Posted September 7, 2014 (edited) . Edited September 15, 2016 by wapiti Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike in SA Posted September 7, 2014 Share Posted September 7, 2014 We go at whatever pace DD sets, with a plan of spending 60 minutes a day on math. Sometimes, that's a lesson and exercises, sometimes that's two lessons and exercises or more, sometimes, that's a single problem. I will also say that if she's not feeling good, or if she's overly stressed, I've been known to put AOPS aside and pull out something else, because sometimes, AOPS is more than either of us can take on a given day (DD had a frog she'd raised from an egg die Thursday, for example-and that was a reason, in my book, to let AOPS Algebra rest a bit). So far, Pre-Algebra took right at 9 months. I don't know how long Intro to Algebra will take. The only concern I have about it stretching into a 2nd year is that I'm not sure what to call it the 2nd year for benefit of transcript, since the only students who take Algebra 1 over 2 years would normally be those who fail it the first time around. Same here. We do all the problems, plus Alcumus. Typically, it's a section per day. Sometimes, a section takes 3-4 days. Frequently the review or challenge sections take at least 2 days each. Overall, the pace is very similar to what AoPS has for their online courses, but I wouldn't be surprised to take half that long or twice that long, depending on how the concepts are clicking, and how strong or weak the foundation is for the topic at hand. We do adjust the time commitment to DS's energy level. He decides how long he wants to work at something, provided that he at least gives his brain a workout. Sometimes we have to tell him to stop, but we are fortunate in that we rarely have to push him to go forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PinkyandtheBrains. Posted September 7, 2014 Share Posted September 7, 2014 When we do the text ourselves, and not with a live class, we do all the problems and alcumus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmmetler Posted September 7, 2014 Share Posted September 7, 2014 Colleges need not see on the high school transcript how many years it took when those years are all prior to high school. I must be missing something? (Eta, FWIW, my dd's middle school teaches algebra 1 over two years and, while not necessarily very common, not all that unusual either. As she will attend a different private high school, algebra 1 won't be on her transcript anyway.) If she doesn't go until college, yes-we'd simply have it on "courses completed before high school". But if she should decide to go for a magnet high school, I'd need to supply a middle school transcript. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted September 7, 2014 Share Posted September 7, 2014 If she doesn't go until college, yes-we'd simply have it on "courses completed before high school". But if she should decide to go for a magnet high school, I'd need to supply a middle school transcript. AoPS Intro to Algebra covers more than a traditional algebra 1 course. Give "Algebra 1" credit for chapters 1 through 13 or 14, and call the second half of the book "Intro to Algebra 2" or "Advanced topics in algebra 1" or "Algebra 2A" - or award credit for "Algebra 2" as soon as your student has completed the algebra 2 portion of Intermediate Algebra. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wapiti Posted September 7, 2014 Share Posted September 7, 2014 (edited) . Edited September 15, 2016 by wapiti Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadrunner Posted September 7, 2014 Share Posted September 7, 2014 AoPS Intro to Algebra covers more than a traditional algebra 1 course. Give "Algebra 1" credit for chapters 1 through 13 or 14, and call the second half of the book "Intro to Algebra 2" or "Advanced topics in algebra 1" or "Algebra 2A" - or award credit for "Algebra 2" as soon as your student has completed the algebra 2 portion of Intermediate Algebra. Do you know which chapters need to be completed from the Intermediate Algebra book in addition to Intro to Algebra to cover traditional Algebra 1 and 2? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted September 7, 2014 Share Posted September 7, 2014 Do you know which chapters need to be completed from the Intermediate Algebra book in addition to Intro to Algebra to cover traditional Algebra 1 and 2? Hard to say, since it varies so widely what constitutes "traditional" Algebra 2 - some programs don't even cover quadratics until algebra 2. It also depends what you plan to cover in precalculus. Algebra 2 would definitely cover polynomials, so chapters 6-9. Exponentials, logarithms and rational functions are usually covered in alg 2, but not as thoroughly. It's not something I have ever bothered giving any thought. I let my kids work through the books, cut out some chapters I consider not important for their math goals, and, for the sake of making the transcript transparent, give one credit when each book is completed. So, mine get "algebra 1" credit for Intro and "algebra 2" credit for Intermediate - even though AoPS does not line up well with traditional programs. It does not matter. Nobody who looks at the transcript will give a hoot about what topic has been covered when - as long as the student's test scores verify his math preparedness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JenneinCA Posted September 7, 2014 Share Posted September 7, 2014 My ten year old is doing AOPS pre algebra this year and we are going very slow. Right now he reading and doing the problems on one day and then doing the exercises on the next day. This takes about an hour on the first day and about half an hour on the second day. At this rate he will be in this book a long time, but that is okay with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkT Posted September 8, 2014 Share Posted September 8, 2014 Typical Algebra 1 text for comparison:Larson et al Common Core edition Chapter 1 Solving Linear Equations1.1 Solving Simple Equations1.2 Solving Multi-Step Equations1.3 Solving Equations with Variables on Both SidesExt. Solving Absolute Value Equations1.4 Rewriting Equations and Formulas Chapter 2 Graphing and Writing Linear Equations2.1 Graphing Linear Equations2.2 Slope of a LineExt. Slopes of Parallel and Perpendicular Lines2.3 Graphing Linear Equations in Slope-Intercept Form2.4 Graphing Linear Equations in Standard Form2.5 Writing Equations in Slope-Intercept Form2.6 Writing Equations in Point-Slope FormExt. Writing Equations of Parallel and Perpendicular Lines2.7 Solving Real-Life Problems Chapter 3 Solving Linear Inequalities3.1 Writing and Graphing Inequalities3.2 Solving Inequalities Using Addition or Subtraction3.3 Solving Inequalities Using Multiplication or Division3.4 Solving Multi-Step InequalitiesExt. Solving Compound Inequalities3.5 Graphing Linear Inequalities in Two Variables Chapter 4 Solving Systems of Linear Equations4.1 Solving Systems of Linear Equations by Graphing4.2 Solving Systems of Linear Equations by Substitution4.3 Solving Systems of Linear Equations by Elimination4.4 Special Systems of Linear EquationsExt. Solving Linear Equations by Graphing4.5 Systems of Linear Inequalities Chapter 5 Linear Functions5.1 Domain and Range of a FunctionExt. Relations and Functions5.2 Discrete and Continuous Domains5.3 Linear Function Patterns5.4 Function NotationExt. Special Functions5.5 Comparing Linear and Nonlinear Functions5.6 Arithmetic Sequences Chapter 6 Exponential Equations and Functions6.1 Properties of Square RootsExt. Real Number Operations6.2 Properties of Exponents6.3 Radicals and Rational Exponents6.4 Exponential FunctionsExt. Solving Exponential Equations6.5 Exponential Growth6.6 Exponential Decay6.7 Geometric SequencesExt. Recursively-Defined Sequences Chapter 7 Polynomial Equations and Factoring7.1 Polynomials7.2 Adding and Subtracting Polynomials7.3 Multiplying Polynomials7.4 Special Products of Polynomials7.5 Solving Polynomial Equations in Factored Form7.6 Factoring Polynomials Using the GCF7.7 Factoring x2 + bx + c7.8 Factoring ax2 + bx + c7.9 Factoring Special ProductsExt. Factoring Polynomials Completely Chapter 8 Graphing Quadratic Functions8.1 Graphing y = ax28.2 Focus of a Parabola8.3 Graphing y = ax2 + c8.4 Graphing y = ax2 + bx + cExt. Graphing y = a(x − h)2 + k8.5 Comparing Linear, Exponential, and Quadratic FunctionsExt. Comparing Graphs of Functions Chapter 9 Solving Quadratic Equations9.1 Solving Quadratic Equations by Graphing9.2 Solving Quadratic Equations Using Square Roots9.3 Solving Quadratic Equations by Completing the Square9.4 Solving Quadratic Equations Using the Quadratic FormulaExt. Choosing a Solution Method9.5 Solving Systems of Linear and Quadratic Equations Chapter 10 Square Root Functions and Geometry10.1 Graphing Square Root FunctionsExt. Rationalizing the Denominator10.2 Solving Square Root Equations10.3 The Pythagorean Theorem10.4 Using the Pythagorean Theorem Chapter 11 Rational Equations and Functions11.1 Direct and Inverse Variation11.2 Graphing Rational FunctionsExt. Inverse of a Function11.3 Simplifying Rational Expressions11.4 Multiplying and Dividing Rational Expressions11.5 Dividing Polynomials11.6 Adding and Subtracting Rational Expressions11.7 Solving Rational Equations Chapter 12 Data Analysis and Displays12.1 Measures of Central Tendency12.2 Measures of Dispersion12.3 Box-and-Whisker Plots12.4 Shapes of Distributions12.5 Scatter Plots and Lines of Fit12.6 Analyzing Lines of Fit12.7 Two-Way Tables12.8 Choosing a Data Display Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasmama Posted September 8, 2014 Share Posted September 8, 2014 Following along. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lewelma Posted September 8, 2014 Share Posted September 8, 2014 My older started off slowly and increased speed. 3 years for the intro algebra, 1.25 years for geometry, 5 months for both intro number theory and intro counting, and then 4 classes this calendar year (the NZ school year Jan-Dec)- intermediate number theory, intermediate algebra, intermediate counting, intermediate geometry (using UKMT book recommended by AoPS as they don't have intermediate geo yet) When my son was working through the books independently, he did all the challengers. Since starting the classes this year, he just does what is assigned. At least for my kid, he needed to go at a pace that was right for him. That pace changed over time. Adapt. Adapt. Adapt. Ruth in NZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasmama Posted September 8, 2014 Share Posted September 8, 2014 This thread is very helpful for me. My boys both started Intro to Algebra this year. I have one son who will likely be transitioning to a university model school next year for math and science only (his 9th grade year). He will be taking geometry using a public school text. (Holt McDougal) If I have him work through Chapter 14 of Intro to Algebra, should he be well-prepared for a traditional geometry course? The answer seems to be "yes", but I don't have room for error with this kid. Other son (ds11) will likely continue on the AoPS path at home, as he is much more suited to the program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jill Posted September 9, 2014 Share Posted September 9, 2014 My 12 yr old ds is working on Intro to Algebra. We did some of the PreAlgebra over a year ago but picked and chose because he had also done EPGY pre-algebra a couple years ago. It will likely take him about 1 to 1.5 years to complete Intro to Algebra and this is *without* doing Challenge problems. I generally let him work along at his own pace by watching the videos, reading the section and then working the exercises. The Review exercises can take a week for him, again, without the Challenge problems. I tend to supplement a bit with some other practice work when he struggles and I have found it difficult to find good supplements because AoPS is a real *thinker's* program and so many aren't. There are sometimes not enough practice problems for him to develop concepts confidence, so then I might have another week of extra practice (this week it's "Mixture Word Problems" courtesy of math-aids.com.) That's just our example of pace for an accelerated but maybe not highly gifted math student. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EndOfOrdinary Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 This thread is very helpful for me. My boys both started Intro to Algebra this year. I have one son who will likely be transitioning to a university model school next year for math and science only (his 9th grade year). He will be taking geometry using a public school text. (Holt McDougal) If I have him work through Chapter 14 of Intro to Algebra, should he be well-prepared for a traditional geometry course? The answer seems to be "yes", but I don't have room for error with this kid. Other son (ds11) will likely continue on the AoPS path at home, as he is much more suited to the program. I would think your Ds will be quite prepared. In my years of teaching high school math, geometry was always a bit rocky at first. It has nothing to do with how prepared kids were (though, those who had a good algebra foundation caught on much quicker). The entire course concepts are just so different. Since the idea is to visualize the math, the level of abstraction comes from a totally different place than the level of abstraction needed to be able to find x. The critical thinking and learning how you personally learn that comes from AoPS will mostlikely put him far and above the other kids. Moreover, proof based Algebra doesn't exist in many places anymore. The nature of AoPS should greatly help with the concepts of proof based Geometry (which he may or may not have right away, but will definitely move into if he continues with math). Understanding the idea of explaining yourself and your thoughts with math terminology was always a leap for so many kids. Your son will have been doing this already with AoPS, so he should take right to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasmama Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I would think your Ds will be quite prepared. In my years of teaching high school math, geometry was always a bit rocky at first. It has nothing to do with how prepared kids were (though, those who had a good algebra foundation caught on much quicker). The entire course concepts are just so different. Since the idea is to visualize the math, the level of abstraction comes from a totally different place than the level of abstraction needed to be able to find x. The critical thinking and learning how you personally learn that comes from AoPS will mostlikely put him far and above the other kids. Moreover, proof based Algebra doesn't exist in many places anymore. The nature of AoPS should greatly help with the concepts of proof based Geometry (which he may or may not have right away, but will definitely move into if he continues with math). Understanding the idea of explaining yourself and your thoughts with math terminology was always a leap for so many kids. Your son will have been doing this already with AoPS, so he should take right to it. Thank you. This is reassuring. As I state over and over on this board, math is a significant weakness for me and always has been so I feel my way blind in many ways with my kids. I appreciate the mathy people on this board more than you all know. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcadia Posted September 11, 2014 Share Posted September 11, 2014 The prealgebra book took close to a year. The intro to algebra would have taken a year except we detour to the intro to geometry book and finish the first 5 chapters for summer. So now we are finishing intro to algebra. He will be taking geometry using a public school text. (Holt McDougal) If I have him work through Chapter 14 of Intro to Algebra, should he be well-prepared for a traditional geometry course?He'll be okay :) just get him some color pencils/markers/highlighters for geometry because it does comes in usual. I find having at least 3 colors useful for geometry. Holt Geometry online book so you can see it's the traditional public school textbook style. http://dragonometry.net/geometry/geometry_holt_pages.php Two of the libraries I go to has the Holt geometry book in the teens reference section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasmama Posted September 11, 2014 Share Posted September 11, 2014 The prealgebra book took close to a year. The intro to algebra would have taken a year except we detour to the intro to geometry book and finish the first 5 chapters for summer. So now we are finishing intro to algebra. He'll be okay :) just get him some color pencils/markers/highlighters for geometry because it does comes in usual. I find having at least 3 colors useful for geometry. Holt Geometry online book so you can see it's the traditional public school textbook style. http://dragonometry.net/geometry/geometry_holt_pages.php Two of the libraries I go to has the Holt geometry book in the teens reference section. Thanks for the link and the info. Due to your post, it occurs to me that it would behoove me to get my hands on a copy of this book. This is my kid who does not do change so moving into Geometry AND starting a completely different style of book could be an issue. If we decide to outsource math next year, I think I will get the book next summer and work through a chapter or two with him. Better overprepared and bored at the beginning than overwhelmed and shut down with this son. That would really raise his confidence level, too. I like it. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkT Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Holt Geometry online book so you can see it's the traditional public school textbook style. http://dragonometry.net/geometry/geometry_holt_pages.php Two of the libraries I go to has the Holt geometry book in the teens reference section. Holt McDougal now since the companies were bought out. I believe that her son may use the Common Core edition, If it is labeled Holt McDougal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasmama Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Holt McDougal now since the companies were bought out. I believe that her son may use the Common Core edition, If it is labeled Holt McDougal. Thanks, Mark! I plan to make a visit to the school sometime this fall to ask questions, and I will ask to see the specific book being used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcadia Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 I plan to make a visit to the school sometime this fall to ask questions, and I will ask to see the specific book being used. Ask if your son can loan out the school textbooks at the beginning of Summer 2015 for Fall 2015. Some high schools allow their students to borrow the textbooks from school for the summer holidays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasmama Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Ask if your son can loan out the school textbooks at the beginning of Summer 2015 for Fall 2015. Some high schools allow their students to borrow the textbooks from school for the summer holidays.Even better. Will do. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daijobu Posted September 16, 2014 Share Posted September 16, 2014 Do you do all questions in AOPS including the challenging questions? Yes. Otherwise I feel like we aren't getting our money's worth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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