Thinking about high school science sequence..advice?

[Halcyon]

Hi

I am thinking about our high school science sequence a bit early, as DS is ahead in math and wants to and (I think) will be able to move ahead in sciences. Here's what i am thinking

 

7th: Derek Owens Physical Science. He says most of his students have completed Pre-A before the class, and DS will be done with Algebra so I think it will work. Also, it seems to not be too intense--another plus as DS is "young" both in age and in ability to do tons of work.

 

8th: Derek Owens Physics--if he likes the Physical Science Class and feels ready.

 

9th: Earth Science using Tarbuck perhaps.

 

10th: AP Biology if he's interested enough to take the AP.

 

11th: AP Environmental Science, AP Psychology or AP Comp Sci (is this considered a science or a math..or an elective?)==depends on interests. Right now he is interested in marine science and neurology stuff, so who knows. 

 

12th: AP Chem (or will the scores be delivered too late for college admission? if so, maybe reorder)

 

Does this very tentative plan seem workable?

[Luckymama]

AP Psych is a social science---could be used to fulfill a social science credit or as an elective.

 

AP Comp Sci would be an elective.

 

(Sorry, got to run)

[regentrude]

Sounds good - but I would switch Earth Science and Physics. Earth in 8th, physics in 9th,  to make sure that physics ends on the transcript for the four years of high school. Plus, he wants to have geometry and an intro to trigonometry completed for an algebra based physics course.

[EKS]

I agree with regentrude.  You want physics on the transcript.  DO physics is the (algebra based) real thing too--not conceptual.

[chiguirre]

AP Biology is usually the second year of high school biology. Some online AP classes even require previous bio and chem courses to enroll.

[snowbeltmom]

AP Chemistry assumes that the student has taken a high school level chemistry class.  If you decide to skip the high school level course, make sure you budget extra time for the AP Chemistry class.

[Matryoshka]

AP Chemistry assumes that the student has taken a high school level chemistry class.  If you decide to skip the high school level course, make sure you budget extra time for the AP Chemistry class.

 

Just curious if anyone knows if Mr. Q Advanced Chem would be enough of a 1st Chem before AP Chem, or whether a more rigorous course should be taken first?

[Musicmom]

My two cents:

 

As mentioned above, high school level bio and chem will be needed for AP Bio, and high school chem will be needed in order to do AP Chem.  My dd did both an AP bio (Thinkwell) and AP Chem (PA homeschoolers) and found this to absolutely be true.

 

You will want to have all courses for which you want grades shown or test scores back for college applications done by the end of junior year.  Senior year is too late, since college applications need to be done in the fall of that year.  Some colleges will want to see the first semester grades of senior year before making an acceptance decision, others will only care about the senior year course lineup.  Only the college your child decides to attend will get the final transcript with grades from senior year, and AP scores from senior year (which come out in the summer) will only be useful for gaining college credit (if your child's college grants AP credit.)

 

My two kids were also ahead in math at 7th grade, and did move ahead in science as well.  Here's a potential path you might consider (similar to what my dd did):

 

7th--DO Physical Science (my dc did Rainbow at home)

8th--Biology (high school level)  **And yes, you CAN put this on your transcript and give credit; it's good to show Bio was covered.

9th--Chemistry

10th--DO Physics

11th--AP Chem (assuming you want this by college application time)

 

Then you could follow your ds's interests in 12th grade (when they'll be more defined) by doing:

 

12th--AP Bio, or AP Environmental Science, or Marine Bio, or Anatomy & Physiology, or even Earth Science (but call it "Geology" on the transcript, not Earth Science! And similar to Regentrude's suggestion, if Earth Science is important to you, I'd do it in either 8th grade or 12th, not in the prime high school years.  Otherwise, if you don't have your heart set on it, it's okay to skip it or have your ds do it for fun in the summer).

 

Anyway, just an idea!  Good luck!

[Halcyon]

Sounds good - but I would switch Earth Science and Physics. Earth in 8th, physics in 9th,  to make sure that physics ends on the transcript for the four years of high school. Plus, he wants to have geometry and an intro to trigonometry completed for an algebra based physics course.

Thanks. I wonder if Tarbucks will be too challenging for my 8th grader to get through. He disliked CPO, as did I (surprisingly). Maybe Earth Science is just not our "thing". He does enjoy biology and particularly Chem and Physics....

[Halcyon]

Plus, he wants to have geometry and an intro to trigonometry completed for an algebra based physics course.

Okay, so i am thinking geometry next year (7th), and then trig in 8th? I had originally thought Algebra 2 in 8th, but if I follow you, it would be better to do an intro to trig course in 8th, yes?

[quark]

Halcyon, if your plan is to do Derek Owens Physics, just wanted to give you a heads up that DS was able to manage it with Algebra 1 taken the previous year, then concurrent Geometry and some concurrent Algebra 1 review. His Geometry program included intro Trig that seemed enough for him to handle or self teach the Trig required for DO's Physics. He faced a wall with Physics Chapter 2 but once he got over that hurdle, the rest of the course was very smooth. My humble opinion is that DO's Physics is probably going to require less of a formal Trig program than if you were using something like Giancoli's algebra-based physics. I believe DO's program is based partially on Giancoli's and is possibly, a tad simpler.

 

Also, afaik, you won't need an entire year for Trig unless you decide to work with a book like Gelfand's. Someone please correct me if I am wrong. DS's current Algebra 2 for example includes Trig and he will cover some more Trig when he does Precalculus.

[Halcyon]

MusicMOm--great post, tahnk you! You mean Earth Science isn't "required" so to speak (i know nothing is, really, but I guess I mean to say "expected"). That's actually good to hear. As I mentioned in a pp, I don't really know if Earth Science is ds's "thing". It's certainly not mine--I mean, we both have an interest in understanding the subject generally, but he doesn't seem to gravitate that way when self-selecting science topics. It's more chemistry, physics and biology. I didn't realize I could do that subject in 8th and count it towards high school, either. Or, like you said, we can do it over a summer--that's probably a better choice.  (Can you recommend a course or text? My concern is Tarbucks is too advanced, but that's just guesswork on my part. )

 

I really like your idea of DO physical science in 7th, and bio in 8th. And conceivably, if he does DO Physics in 10th, he could CHOOSE to do AP Physics instead of AP Chem in 11th, right? If that's where his interests lie? 

[regentrude]

Okay, so i am thinking geometry next year (7th), and then trig in 8th? I had originally thought Algebra 2 in 8th, but if I follow you, it would be better to do an intro to trig course in 8th, yes?

 

No, you do NOT need a trig course. If the student had geometry, all the trig needed fro physics can be learned in one afternoon.

 

[Halcyon]

Okay, he is taking geometry with Tablet Class next year. Thanks so much. 

[Iskra]

 DS's current Algebra 2 for example includes Trig and he will cover some more Trig when he does Precalculus.

 

Quark, I was wondering why you guys are going with pre-calc, since I know your son is so strong in math.  Isn't  pre-calc to calculus, what pre-algebra is to algebra (essentially a review of all things previously learned necessary for success at the next level).  If a kid doesn't need the review, why take pre-calc? I skipped pre-calc with no subsequent issues in calculus whatsoever.  Part of the reason I am asking this, is because I'm beginning to think about/plan a formal physics sequence for my son (we haven't done any so far, just living books, and watched documentaries) and am wondering about what are the benefits of doing Calculus based physics courses vs. algebra based.  I'm thinking if a kid skips pre-calc, and does calculus early that might give them a chance to do calc based physics.   I'm sorry to derail the thread a bit.  I'll probably need to start my own thread sometime in the summer when I've thought through things a bit more, but I would love to hear any insight you can offer, as physics is not my strong suit at all, but I want it to be for my kids (I always loved the subject matter, but was never taught right, and never had the right books, my kids love the subject, and I want to make sure I get them the right books when the time comes).

[quark]

Quark, I was wondering why you guys are going with pre-calc, since I know your son is so strong in math.  Isn't  pre-calc to calculus, what pre-algebra is to algebra (essentially a review of all things previously learned necessary for success at the next level).  If a kid doesn't need the review, why take pre-calc? I skipped pre-calc with no subsequent issues in calculus whatsoever.  Part of the reason I am asking this, is because I'm beginning to think about/plan a formal physics sequence for my son (we haven't done any so far, just living books, and watched documentaries) and am wondering about what are the benefits of doing Calculus based physics courses vs. algebra based.  I'm thinking if a kid skips pre-calc, and does calculus early that might give them a chance to do calc based physics.   I'm sorry to derail the thread a bit.  I'll probably need to start my own thread sometime in the summer when I've thought through things a bit more, but I would love to hear any insight you can offer, as physics is not my strong suit at all, but I want it to be for my kids (I always loved the subject matter, but was never taught right, and never had the right books, my kids love the subject, and I want to make sure I get them the right books when the time comes).

 

I'm not a STEM mom so I'll take a stab at it from the PoV of a mom who tries to keep up with DS's interest-led learning in STEM subjects. :p I'm no good at telling you the benefits of calc-based over alg-based. Hopefully someone else can help with that.

 

Re pre-calc, DS prefers another, harder run through trig, complex numbers, and especially matrices. His alg2+trig class is already covering all this but he wants to go deeper into those three areas and will try a more challenging program next (AoPS).

 

I was comfortable skipping his pre-alg year because a lot of pre-alg is review for the math intuitive kid and we were already using other materials for developing problem solving skills. There was no AoPS pre-alg then and we didn't attend a math circle then either. I have questioned if he needs the repetition, but am confident it won't be a waste because I trust AoPS to give him a good workout. He is also used to the pattern of exposure to X math year followed by a more advanced X math year to strengthen thinking/ problem-solving skills. This also slows him down a bit. E.g. he followed up his Dolciani algebra 1 (exposure year) with AoPS algebra 1 (first half of book) and did something similar for geometry, but using Coxeter instead of AoPS. He has always enjoyed the exposure year so getting him to do one more year of the same math but at a harder level has not been a problem. He has freedom in choosing the program for the advanced year (as long as we can afford it).

 

Why did we choose alg/trig physics? DS was interested to learn physics (to go deeper than living books/ docus) that year and he wasn't interested in learning calc yet. He was 9 at the time and had already voraciously read lots of living books and watched and discussed documentaries and a teaching company physics lecture series. Based on all their discussions, DH, a physics grad, felt that DS was ready for the next level and having the alg/trig basics will be a benefit, not a waste. Plus, DO's lecture style and accessible materials were perfect for him to develop "show-your-work" skills and gave him the perfect opportunity to apply his alg 1 background. DS took 2 years to finish the honors physics track. If I remember correctly, DS took 2 (or maybe 3) 1-2 month breaks from DO's program and worked on garage physics/ backyard physics projects with DH during the time, so stretching it to 2 years prevented burn out and taught him to apply what he was learning. Thankfully, DO charges the same fee no matter how long you stretch it.

 

He probably won't stop at alg/trig level though...many signs point to DS taking calc-based physics in a few years' time (fingers crossed). I'm looking forward to him learning with a textbook and hopefully, in a more authentic lab environment (e.g. at a comm. college).

 

Now, DS has a good buddy who is a physics fiend and this boy followed a different path, touching only briefly on alg/trig physics (2 months maybe?) then taking the calc-based with AP Physics C route. As usual, I guess it depends on the motivation of each kid/ parent.

 

I hope I answered at least a part of your question!

[Musicmom]

MusicMOm--great post, tahnk you! You mean Earth Science isn't "required" so to speak (i know nothing is, really, but I guess I mean to say "expected"). That's actually good to hear. As I mentioned in a pp, I don't really know if Earth Science is ds's "thing". It's certainly not mine--I mean, we both have an interest in understanding the subject generally, but he doesn't seem to gravitate that way when self-selecting science topics. It's more chemistry, physics and biology. I didn't realize I could do that subject in 8th and count it towards high school, either. Or, like you said, we can do it over a summer--that's probably a better choice.  (Can you recommend a course or text? My concern is Tarbucks is too advanced, but that's just guesswork on my part. )

 

I really like your idea of DO physical science in 7th, and bio in 8th. And conceivably, if he does DO Physics in 10th, he could CHOOSE to do AP Physics instead of AP Chem in 11th, right? If that's where his interests lie? 

 

Yes, Earth Science is a typical middle school course, but not required or "expected."  Just to be clear, colleges generally do not see and are not interested in 8th grade courses, but they do expect to see the big three sciences--bio, chem and physics--on the high school transcript.  That is why you can put a high school level bio course that was done in 8th grade on the transcript, whereas you would not put an 8th grade Earth Science course on. No matter how high the level, it will look like a middle school course.  Make sense?

 

The only "earth science" we ever did was in 5th grade, using an elementary level book, so I'm sorry I don't know of another text. Tarbucks is the only one I've heard of, and if my memory is right, it's a college level text, so it might be a little advanced right now.  In 2 or 3 years, though, that might not be an issue. Kids grow and mature a lot during the middle and high school years. If you do earth science in the summer, you might consider informally exploring individual topics using books from the library, instead of going through a textbook.  That might help spark interest, too. Often regular books on a subject are much more interesting than textbooks (especially lower level textbooks.)

 

Re physics, yes, he could choose AP Physics in either 11th or 12th grade, depending on his math level and interests.  Since DO Physics is algebra-based, you might consider AP Physics C, which is calculus-based (AP Physics B is algebra-based and might be too much of a repeat.)  For that you will want your ds to either have had calculus or be taking calculus concurrently. 

 

When you get closer, i.e. sometime in 10th grade, you'll have a better idea of your ds's interests and general college direction.  Then you can determine which AP courses will serve him best, and in which grade.  (I would just be a little cautious about doing the same subject two years in a row, though... it could result in burnout/boredom.)

[snowbeltmom]

Hi

I am thinking about our high school science sequence a bit early, as DS is ahead in math and wants to and (I think) will be able to move ahead in sciences. Here's what i am thinking

 

 

Does this very tentative plan seem workable?

Imo, since your son is ahead in math, I would have him begin his high school sequence in 7th grade so he will be prepared to take the APs in high school.  Just in case you would find it useful, this is what I did with my 11th grader beginning in 7th grade: 

 

7th grade:

CTY Honors Biology online - this was an excellent class.  Most of the labs were hands-on, but a few were virtual.  This class used the Plato course and added in extras.

 

8th grade:

AP Physics B: - This was his first exposure to physics.  The only trig he had had up to this point was the basic trig found in the AoPS Geometry book and it was more than enough.  This is the only science AP I would recommend taking without having had prior exposure at the high school level.

 

Chemistry - This was an honors level class offered by ChemAdvantage.  It used the Chang textbook along with Quality Science Lab kit.

 

9th grade:

AP Chemistry -  He took this class with ChemAdvantage as well.  It used the higher level Chang textbook.

 

10th grade:

Research project

 

11th grade:

Physics C Mechanics - he is using MIT OCW and will take the AP exam

Research

 

12 grade:

Physics C E&M - he will use MIT OCW and may take the AP exam depending on what college he lands at.

Biology - using Thinkwell  He has a lot of lab experience between his research and his summer classes (which I didn't list), so I am not going to have him do a lab with this one.  He may or may not take the AP exam.

Research

 

 

[Iskra]

Thank you for such an insightful answer Quark.  Would you mind telling me what physics Great Courses you guys covered before your son took the DO physics class, and at what age? I think I usually add about a year or two of age to the age your son used it, when I use some of the materials you recommend and it is just the right level for my oldest:)

[Nan in Mass]

I just wanted to offer some encouragement for those thinking about skipping taking high school physics in high school and going straight to something more complicated for physics.  In 7th grade, youngest, with no previous algebra, followed along while we did Hewitt's Conceptual Physics.  Then in 12th grade he took calc-based physics at the community college concurrently with calculus.  No physics in between except what he investigated himself and the physics review my father gave him the summer before the cc class.  The review was completely out of my electronics-engineer-retired-for-25-years father's head.  No textbooks, since we were on a boat at the time and my poor father had no idea youngest was going to ask him to do this.  Youngest did not do spectacularly in the class, and the class was not really high level, but he was ok.  He was even less prepared for community college chemistry and managed.  My son is just brightish, not brilliant.  If you have one of the brilliant ones, and he is planning on doing AP or community college science in high school, and he is academically oriented to manage the work load, I wouldn't hesitate to do the initial high school sciences in middle school and then just do AP or cc classes classes in high school.  I think it depends on the child.  I also might think twice about ONLY doing bio, chem, physics, AP bio, AP chem, and AP physics for 8th-12th grade science.  That might be enough to kill anyone's love of science.  There is so much more to explore in science.

 

Nan

[quark]

Thank you for such an insightful answer Quark.  Would you mind telling me what physics Great Courses you guys covered before your son took the DO physics class, and at what age? I think I usually add about a year or two of age to the age your son used it, when I use some of the materials you recommend and it is just the right level for my oldest:)

 

You are welcome! He finished watching and discussing Impossible: Physics Beyond the Edge with DH. He watched about half, and didn't complete the entire series of Particle Physics for Non Physicists.

 

[Maureen]

Halcyon - I noticed you were a little frustrated with finding a HS Bio course.  I just wanted to throw out that my three girls are currently finishing up the second semester HS Biology course through BYU Independent Study.  They have enjoyed both semesters and have really learned a lot.  It is very straight forward.  Each semester costs about $140.  You electronically send in their chapter tests and then have to take the final through a proctor.  You can search for proctors by entering your zip code.  Some charge and others don't.  I'm even considering having one take BYU's college level Biology 100 course next year instead of AP Biology since that is where she hopes to attend college.  I think all three got a very good grounding in HS Bio.  There are "labs", but not dissection labs.  I have had my girls take dissection classes at a local wildlife museum, but you could also just order a kit or do a virtual dissection lab if you wanted to supplement that.

[mjbucks1]

There are many ways you could sequence these classes, but I agree with snowbelt mom that if your child is ready, you could go ahead and start high school classes in middle school.  Some of this depends on math, but here is what ds did (is doing):

 

7th grade: Apologia Biology; Saxon Alg II 

8th grade: Apologia Chemistry; 1st 1/2 of Saxon Advanced Mathematics book)

9th grade: AP Chem with Chemadvantage (PAHomeschoolers); 2nd 1/2 of Saxon Advanced Mathematics book

10th grade: AP Physics B (currently taking through PA Homeschoolers); Derek Owens precalculus (I thought maybe he could use the review, but he is acing this class)

11th grade:  AP Physics C (E&M and Mecahnics through PA Homeschoolers.  Same teacher as AP Physics) ; AP Calculus AB

12th grade:  AP Biology?; AP Calculus BC 

 

I think your son will have the required math to follow this sequence if he has the desire to do so.  I talked this plan over with my son numerous times, and he was in agreement (That is VERY important!)  He as loved all of his science classes he has taken with PA Homeschoolers so far!

 

 

[Halcyon]

Halcyon - I noticed you were a little frustrated with finding a HS Bio course.  I just wanted to throw out that my three girls are currently finishing up the second semester HS Biology course through BYU Independent Study.  They have enjoyed both semesters and have really learned a lot.  It is very straight forward.  Each semester costs about $140.  You electronically send in their chapter tests and then have to take the final through a proctor.  You can search for proctors by entering your zip code.  Some charge and others don't.  I'm even considering having one take BYU's college level Biology 100 course next year instead of AP Biology since that is where she hopes to attend college.  I think all three got a very good grounding in HS Bio.  There are "labs", but not dissection labs.  I have had my girls take dissection classes at a local wildlife museum, but you could also just order a kit or do a virtual dissection lab if you wanted to supplement that.

 

Thanks Maureen. I am looking for secular, though...how religious is the BYU program?

[Halcyon]

I just wanted to offer some encouragement for those thinking about skipping taking high school physics in high school and going straight to something more complicated for physics.  In 7th grade, youngest, with no previous algebra, followed along while we did Hewitt's Conceptual Physics.  Then in 12th grade he took calc-based physics at the community college concurrently with calculus.  No physics in between except what he investigated himself and the physics review my father gave him the summer before the cc class.  The review was completely out of my electronics-engineer-retired-for-25-years father's head.  No textbooks, since we were on a boat at the time and my poor father had no idea youngest was going to ask him to do this.  Youngest did not do spectacularly in the class, and the class was not really high level, but he was ok.  He was even less prepared for community college chemistry and managed.  My son is just brightish, not brilliant.  If you have one of the brilliant ones, and he is planning on doing AP or community college science in high school, and he is academically oriented to manage the work load, I wouldn't hesitate to do the initial high school sciences in middle school and then just do AP or cc classes classes in high school.  I think it depends on the child.  I also might think twice about ONLY doing bio, chem, physics, AP bio, AP chem, and AP physics for 8th-12th grade science.  That might be enough to kill anyone's love of science.  There is so much more to explore in science.

 

Nan

 

 

My son is bright but (I don't think) on the level of Snowbeltmom's kids! I don't think he would be prepared to do AP Physics in 9th. Of course, he could surprise me. And he is interested in environmental science and "field" studies---he told me today he is planning on being a herpetologist. 

[Halcyon]

There are many ways you could sequence these classes, but I agree with snowbelt mom that if your child is ready, you could go ahead and start high school classes in middle school.  Some of this depends on math, but here is what ds did (is doing):

 

7th grade: Apologia Biology; Saxon Alg II 

8th grade: Apologia Chemistry; 1st 1/2 of Saxon Advanced Mathematics book)

9th grade: AP Chem with Chemadvantage (PAHomeschoolers); 2nd 1/2 of Saxon Advanced Mathematics book

10th grade: AP Physics B (currently taking through PA Homeschoolers); Derek Owens precalculus (I thought maybe he could use the review, but he is acing this class)

11th grade:  AP Physics C (E&M and Mecahnics through PA Homeschoolers.  Same teacher as AP Physics) ; AP Calculus AB

12th grade:  AP Biology?; AP Calculus BC 

 

I think your son will have the required math to follow this sequence if he has the desire to do so.  I talked this plan over with my son numerous times, and he was in agreement (That is VERY important!)  He as loved all of his science classes he has taken with PA Homeschoolers so far!

 

 

Thanks! I think he is ready to do some high school science. I wouldn't say AP level next year, thought. Maybe in 8th, but I doubt it. He doesn't have the maturity yet, but that could change rapidly, I realize.. I so wish the Apologia courses were secular LOL. 

 

We are strongly looking at Thinkwell Biology for 8th, which is not an official AP class but on that level. I just think he will love the videos, to be honest.  And yes, we need to see what HE wants to do. RIght now, he loves math and loves reading field biology books, but we haven't found a science class (yet!!) that he LOVES. 

[Halcyon]

Okay, just did some research-it looks like the BYU courses are not religious, so I requested a trial of their Biology. I will figure this out yet!!

[Maureen]

Halcyon - The BYU classes are completely secular. 

[Halcyon]

Thanks Maureen. They are on my short list. And the price is right!

[MamaSprout]

My two cents:

 

As mentioned above, high school level bio and chem will be needed for AP Bio, and high school chem will be needed in order to do AP Chem.  My dd did both an AP bio (Thinkwell) and AP Chem (PA homeschoolers) and found this to absolutely be true.

 

You will want to have all courses for which you want grades shown or test scores back for college applications done by the end of junior year.  Senior year is too late, since college applications need to be done in the fall of that year.  Some colleges will want to see the first semester grades of senior year before making an acceptance decision, others will only care about the senior year course lineup.  Only the college your child decides to attend will get the final transcript with grades from senior year, and AP scores from senior year (which come out in the summer) will only be useful for gaining college credit (if your child's college grants AP credit.)

 

My two kids were also ahead in math at 7th grade, and did move ahead in science as well.  Here's a potential path you might consider (similar to what my dd did):

 

7th--DO Physical Science (my dc did Rainbow at home)

8th--Biology (high school level)  **And yes, you CAN put this on your transcript and give credit; it's good to show Bio was covered.

9th--Chemistry

10th--DO Physics

11th--AP Chem (assuming you want this by college application time)

 

Then you could follow your ds's interests in 12th grade (when they'll be more defined) by doing:

 

12th--AP Bio, or AP Environmental Science, or Marine Bio, or Anatomy & Physiology, or even Earth Science (but call it "Geology" on the transcript, not Earth Science! And similar to Regentrude's suggestion, if Earth Science is important to you, I'd do it in either 8th grade or 12th, not in the prime high school years.  Otherwise, if you don't have your heart set on it, it's okay to skip it or have your ds do it for fun in the summer).

 

Anyway, just an idea!  Good luck!

 

Small hijack-

This is the sequence I have in the back of my mind for dd. She's doing Oak Meadow high school Environmental Science for 5th (her pick) next year. We've struggled to find appealing middle school science that isn't either full of busy work or she hasn't already done most of the hands-on for.

 

Can you (or anyone else) comment if it would it make sense to spread DO's physical science over 6th and 7th and pair it with substantial science fair projects, or should we do DO in one year in 7th and find something else for 6th? She's very strong in math.

 

Also, what math did your DC do those years (if it's okay to ask)?

 

Thanks!

 

[Musicmom]

Small hijack-

This is the sequence I have in the back of my mind for dd. She's doing Oak Meadow high school Environmental Science for 5th (her pick) next year. We've struggled to find appealing middle school science that isn't either full of busy work or she hasn't already done most of the hands-on for.

 

Can you (or anyone else) comment if it would it make sense to spread DO's physical science over 6th and 7th and pair it with substantial science fair projects, or should we do DO in one year in 7th and find something else for 6th? She's very strong in math.

 

Also, what math did your DC do those years (if it's okay to ask)?

 

Thanks!

 

 

Wow, sounds like your dd is really ahead!  :001_smile:

 

I'm not familiar with DO physical science, so I can't speak to whether or not it would work well to spread it over 2 years.  (Although if it's online and interactive, that may not be an option.)  Have you looked at Rainbow Science?  That is what my dc did in 6th and 7th.  They found it engaging.  At first glance, the reading assignments (designed for 3 days a week) don't look like much, but the fact is they are very meaty--they cover large amounts of info with very efficient wording (as opposed to texts that are wordy but don't say much, kwim?) and the author anticipates that the student will be spending a fair amount of time mentally processing the info.  The experiments, as I recall, were also well-designed, and thought-provoking.  With the 3-day/week format, if just the text info is not enough, your dd could easily use the extra time to delve deeper into the topics--or add in science fair projects, etc.

 

Anyway, in case it's helpful, here are my dc's math and science sequences:

 

Both ds and dd:

 

6th: Pre-Algebra (Singapore 6B, NEM1) / Rainbow Science Yr 1 (physics & chem)

7th: Algebra 1 (Videotext A-C, NEM2) / Rainbow Science Yr 2 (bio and ?)

8th: Algebra 2 (Videotext D-F, NEM3) / Biology (Apologia)

9th: Geometry (Videotext A-D) / Chemistry (Apologia)

 

Ds (interested in physical sciences, now a Comp Sci major):

 

10th: Precalculus (EPGY) / Physics, Adv Physics (Apologia--both books)

11th: AP Calculus ABC (EPGY) / Adv Bio (MIT OCW), Adv Chem (Apologia)

12th: Mulitvariable Calc (EPGY) / AP Physics C: Mechanics (EPGY)**

 

**Which nearly frustrated ds to tears--it was all the same topics as the Apologia books covered, just using calculus instead of algebra.  Also at that time, the course was not well organized.  I think it has since been re-vamped.  Just a heads up not to overdo/redo physics in high school--esp if your dc will take it yet again in college.  There's risk of killing the interest!

 

Dd (interested in life sciences, now a Nursing major):

 

10th: Precalculus (Thinkwell) / Physics (Apologia), Adv Bio (Thinkwell's AP Bio)

11th: Calculus AB (Thinkwell) / AP Chem (PA Homeschoolers)

12th: AP Statistics (PA Homeschoolers) / Anatomy & Physiology (Apologia)

 

Hope this helps!

[MamaSprout]

Wow, sounds like your dd is really ahead!  :001_smile:

 

Oak Meadow's Syllabus is very projecty, and the Holt book is really a 7th grade reading level. I think it would be worth looking at for other science loving logic stage kids. It's kind of a mix of life and earth science. We looked at OM's fifth grade Environmental Science, but it was really basic.

 

Anyway, in case it's helpful, here are my dc's math and science sequences:

 

Very helpful! Thanks!

 

 

 

 

[happypamama]

Subbing to come back and read this more thoroughly later. I asked some questions about this a couple of weeks ago and got some great suggestions for courses.

 

My tentative plan for my DD (probably not STEM focused but allowing room for her to become such if she decides to):

7th -- finish pre-algebra, start algebra 1; earth science

8th -- algebra 1; physical science

9th -- geometry or algebra 2; biology

10th -- whichever of geometry or algebra 2 she didn't do in 9th; chemistry

11th -- trig/pre-calc; either physics or AP Bio or AP Chem (or a college class in bio or chem or both) if she's interested in a STEM field or some other science elective (astronomy, oceanography, etc.)

12th -- physics if she didn't take it in 11th or AP/college physics/chem/bio; calculus -- if she decides she's heading toward a STEM field, she can take calc at a faster rate (depending on what prospective colleges say)

[chiguirre]

Elladarcy, do you think the rest of OM's high school science would be doable in middle school for the motivated student?

[Halcyon]

Subbing to come back and read this more thoroughly later. I asked some questions about this a couple of weeks ago and got some great suggestions for courses.

 

My tentative plan for my DD (probably not STEM focused but allowing room for her to become such if she decides to):

7th -- finish pre-algebra, start algebra 1; earth science

8th -- algebra 1; physical science

9th -- geometry or algebra 2; biology

10th -- whichever of geometry or algebra 2 she didn't do in 9th; chemistry

11th -- trig/pre-calc; either physics or AP Bio or AP Chem (or a college class in bio or chem or both) if she's interested in a STEM field or some other science elective (astronomy,

12th -- physics if she didn't take it in 11th or AP/college physics/chem/bio; calculus -- if she decides she's heading toward a STEM field, she can take calc at a faster rate (depending on what prospective colleges say)

 

This looks pretty good, i am thinking of something similar but bumped around a little:

NOW: 6th: algebra; living books, wetlands ecology coop class, McHenry's The Brain, lots of videos.

7th: geometry, DO physical science

8th: algebra 2, biology--still debating: miller levine and kolbe syllabus or BYU

9th: pre-calc and chemistry or physics

10th: calculus and AP something?

11th: statistics and AP something wherever his interests lie

12th: Environmental Science or something up his alley. 

[MamaSprout]

Elladarcy, do you think the rest of OM's high school science would be doable in middle school for the motivated student?

 

To be honest, I haven't looked at the others very closely. I understand there isn't a solutions manual for the chemistry, and I think we'll go a different direction for biology and physics. For us, I think the OM course will be a good one-off for a specific need. I think the samples are representative of the materials.

 

I bought the syllabus on sale in February and with a used text book, I've got less that $40 with shipping in all of it.