Saxon and Engineering

[steppingstonemomma]

Am I doing a disservice to my son (alg 1- 8th grade) by using Saxon through high school Calculus if he wants to go into Aerospace Engineering at University of MD???

 

We have jumped around through the middle school years and have finally settling on Saxon. And, it's working. He understands it, likes the review, and does very well other than a few careless mistakes. I LOVE it since it has the Saxon Teacher dvd/Art Reed instructional dvd, and he is virtually independent. A necessity since I am hopeless at math.

 

BUT, I keep hearing that Saxon doesn't prepare kids for problem solving skills. He is definitely going to need them in engineering. I just want to prepare him the most thorough way possible. Any advice?

[Sunshine State Sue]

Although I am not a huge fan of Saxon, 2 people I respect have used it very successfully through high school. One is my brother-in-law, math/economics major making megabucks on Wall Street, who used it with my niece. She is graduating this year from Franklin & Marshall with some kind of scary degree in 3 different sciences a degree in Environmental Science. The other is our homeschool evaluator, who majored in math and her husband majored in some kind of engineering. She used it with her 5 sons, and all have gone on to math/science related degrees and careers.

 

Saxon is used in many, many public schools. IMO, if it is working, don't sweat it.

 

HTH!

[Brenda in MA]

I personally had a bad experience with my oldest with Saxon. That said, I also know a couple of families whose dc have done well with it.

 

I would suggest that once your son finishes Algebra 1, find some Algebra 1 problems from another publisher and see if he can do them. See if he can apply what he's learned in his math book to math in the sciences, such as Chemistry & Physics. As long as he's able to tackle a variety of Algebra problems from different sources, and he's able to apply the math in his science courses, he should be fine.

 

Brenda

[Ellie]

You'll probably hear more from the people who don't like it than from the people who do. Such is life. :-)

 

Doesn't your ds also have to have math in college? Seems to me that the college maths would make more of an impact on his career than his high school math. But I could be wrong, lol.

 

I do know that when I went to ACSI conventions (Association of Christian Schools International) with a friend who was a Saxon rep, there was a steady stream of teachers all day long, all three days, through the Saxon booth, with nothing but rave reviews of how well their students were doing since they switched to Saxon, how many more of them were taking more math in high school than they needed, how many more of them were getting better SAT scores, how many more of them were going on to college careers that were science and math oriented and excelling.

[regentrude]

Doesn't your ds also have to have math in college? Seems to me that the college maths would make more of an impact on his career than his high school math. But I could be wrong, lol.

 

 

Yes and no.

A STEM student, whose high school math is not adequate, will have to start in remedial math classes in college. Not the end of the world, but it means paying for college algebra and trigonometry (and possibly below) without having the college credit count for his engineering major, since in many engineering departments, only calc 1 and up are counted towards the degree requirements.

It also means delaying science courses which have math prerequisites.

Even for a student who places into calc,, inadequate high school math may mean that there are holes in pre-algebra and algebra which cause the student to struggle in intro sciences and underperform . I teach intro physics at an engineering school, and I see this very often. The students who struggle because of math do not struggle because of calculus, but because their algebra 1 skills are not solid.

 

To the OP: I am not saying Saxon will do this to your son - I am merely responding to the quoted statement in Ellie's post.

[kiana]

The big issue would be if he's doing well in math class, but unable to apply what he's learning with Saxon in his science classes. Some (not all, but a not insignificant percentage) people who have used Saxon have found that happened to them. Unless you notice this issue I wouldn't worry about it. If you do notice this issue it would be a good time to switch.

[1Togo]

Take a look at the Robinson family. All six children used Saxon. All six have earned doctorates in science fields or are in the process of completing their doctorates.

[HappyGrace]

And the Robinson kids used Saxon completely independently (AND with no dvds!) and even checked their own work.

 

I can't personally comment on Saxon in high school, and have no opinion of Saxon in general-I'm just expanding on what the PP said about the Robinsons by adding what I know about them.

[Teachin'Mine]

Fear not! I almost dropped Saxon because of what I was reading here, and I'm so glad I didn't. Your son is understanding it and doing well. He's obviously one for whom the Saxon method works well. There's no reason to switch when it works for the student. What I would do though, is add in some test prep type of math problems as this will stretch his problem solving skills even more. It's also a great way to prep for SAT tests. My dd used Saxon through calculus and has been excelling in college math courses - none of them "remedial". Saxon gave her a great foundation and a true love for math.

[Ellie]

Yes and no.

A STEM student, whose high school math is not adequate, will have to start in remedial math classes in college. Not the end of the world, but it means paying for college algebra and trigonometry (and possibly below) without having the college credit count for his engineering major, since in many engineering departments, only calc 1 and up are counted towards the degree requirements.

It also means delaying science courses which have math prerequisites.

 

Even for a student who places into calc,, inadequate high school math may mean that there are holes in pre-algebra and algebra which cause the student to struggle in intro sciences and underperform . I teach intro physics at an engineering school, and I see this very often. The students who struggle because of math do not struggle because of calculus, but because their algebra 1 skills are not solid.

 

To the OP: I am not saying Saxon will do this to your son - I am merely responding to the quoted statement in Ellie's post.

 

 

TYVM. for 'splaining this to me. :-)

[Julie of KY]

I use AoPS, but Saxon is one of the few programs that I've seen that doesn't seem to water down the problems. I can't speak to how well it is taught and I know many don't like their style, but it looks like solid math to me.

Ultimately, the question is if you student can apply the math to new problems found in other math/science programs.

[JanetC]

A lot of "mathy" kids come to hate Saxon in the upper levels, but the time to change is when the curriculum is no longer working for you. if you are feeling really insecure about your choice, you can use quizzes from another book to make sure he is understanding and retaining the material.

[dani3boys]

My oldest ds has always used Saxon. He used Algebra I in 7th, Algebra II in 8th, Advanced Math in 9th and first half of 10th. He is currently taking Calculus I at the community college the second semester of 10th grade. He is doing very well. There were no gaps in between what he learned and the new material he started at the college. If your student is doing well with it I wouldn't change a thing.

[JuanitaL]

My oldest used Saxon all through school. He completed Saxon Physics and Calculus his senior year. He's in his 2nd year at USMA, just finishing up his first mechanical engineering class; he assures me he has felt completely mathematically prepared so far (I ask him for assurance every so often - I just need to hear that I didn't ever screw him up too badly). It worked for him.

[mschickie]

As a former high school math teacher I can tell you Saxon is an extremely solid program. It is a wonderful program for those who are planning on entering STEM professions. Many of the upper chapters are geared to the sciences and the whys of the math. A lot of the complaints on Saxon is that there are not enough "real world" problems and that is because many of the problems focus on applications of math in science. I do recommend kids taking a consumer math course along with Saxon (even if it is just 1/2 credit finance) to gain some of the every day math that is not highlighted in Saxon.

[GinaPagnato]

If your ds gets it, enjoys it, and is successful with it, why change? I agree with pp who said to transfer his skills to another program every so often by seeing how he does with problems from other curricula. If he manages those well, then he's got the right program for him.

 

I would've stayed with Saxon but ds was bored to tears with it and was losing his interest in math. We switched to AoPS and he loves it! Although sometimes he wants to throw the book out the window after working for 45 minutes on 2 problems, lol!

 

I say stick with what works and brings enjoyment.

[brownie]

Some kids are born with a problem-solving perspective; some need to be encouraged in this realm. Saxon is probably not the best way to encourage this (though I've only used through Alg 1/2) but there are also other places to encourage this...science projects, math competitions, even discussing literature and history. So if it's the one thing that's worked, I think you stick with it.

[Twigs]

… I would suggest that once your son finishes Algebra 1, find some Algebra 1 problems from another publisher and see if he can do them. See if he can apply what he's learned in his math book to math in the sciences, such as Chemistry & Physics. As long as he's able to tackle a variety of Algebra problems from different sources, and he's able to apply the math in his science courses, he should be fine. …

I don't know about Saxon, but if you need problems from other publishers, you can use InteractMath to choose problems from a variety of books. Best wishes

[steppingstonemomma]

Thanks everyone... I am feeling insecure especially since I am NOT a math person. My son wants to go into engineering and I just want to prepare him well enough. I think the main issue is that I want to be sure it is stretching his problem solving skills. BUT, this week he starts attending the First Technic Challenge group and I think that will help with strengthening that skill over the next few years.

 

I will definitely try out a few other curricula to see if the skills are transferring over to other areas. Thanks for all the help!