Giving up, and feeling guilty

[momto2Cs]

I have tried to be the mom that is okay with child/interest-led, to be more unschooly than not, to support my kids in exploring their own interests, and so on, and so forth.

 

I give up.

 

It doesn't work.

 

Not for us, anyway. I know there are plenty of people it does work for, and I admire that. Maybe if I didn't work, and I wasn't in college... maybe. Maybe it is just that it is not the best fit for me and my kids. And I need to come to terms with that. I need very much to simplify and streamline, so that I do provide my kids with a good education, not keep finding this path, or that one, or maybe that one over there, and hey, while I'm at it, that one looks good too! I need to really think this through. Ds will be 12 soon, and dd 10. Part of the reason I homeschool is to provide them a solid education, and lately I don't feel I am doing that. They do surprise me with odd things they know that I don't realize they know, and they make some excellent connections, but at the same time I feel that we're falling behind in key areas -- math, reading, writing -- and with ds's interests and goals... science.

 

I'm not sure where I am going with all this, except that I'm overhauling our whole approach. I am absolutely dedicated to homeschooling, but eed it to work!

 

Just a lot of whining, but I've got to get it out somewhere! Thanks if you read this!

[Mommyfaithe]

If it is any consolation, willy-nilly does not work here either. I try to strike a balance....core skill subjects are non-negotiable....content can be delight directed.

[NotSoObvious]

I wanted unschooling to work for us! It doesn't. I have a kid with special needs who absolutely has to have explicit instruction and lots of review. I'm not ok with a 10 year old who can't add and that's where we'd be without drill. Her sister could definitely homeschool and be just fine though.

[swellmomma]

Nothing to feel guilty about. You can support their interests and such AFTER they complete the required by you work. I am the same as you. I finally came to decide if they went to ps they would learn what they learn there and then I would support the things they wanted to learn on their own, their hobbies, and research and projects etc that they wanted to do after school. Like you I homeschool to give them a good education, so during school time they do what I deem worthy of a good education. After schooltime I will 100% support their interests and rabbit trails and cool stuff they want to discover.

 

Unschooling properly takes a lot of work, and being "on" all the time to catch those moments. There is nothing wrong with seeing that you have a bajillion things on your plate and chosing a different method that will work for your family.

[boscopup]

I could not unschool. Too much work for me. :lol:

 

Now we have been doing basically read-library-books-on-your-own science, and honestly, I don't really care if my 3rd grader gets much science or not - he's only 3rd grade. In middle school, I'd probably want to get more formal. On a good note, high school courses start at the beginning, so I don't think you're woefully behind or anything at this point.

 

But yes, for my family, just letting the kids do their own thing won't work either. We have a weekly schedule with checkboxes (my kids and I all LOVE checkboxes!), and we try to make sure they all get checked off each week. We have interesting studies, and we can get library books for rabbit trails that the kids can do on their own, but during school, we get done what I had planned, and school gets done... kids learn lots.

 

Don't feel guilty!

[Izzy]

No guilt. :) There is no way I could put in the time and effort to unschool. I'm just not that creative.

 

You could always have set curriculum and lesson plans for the 3 R's and unschool the rest. But even if you drop unschooling altogether you are in no way a failure! I know I do best with plans and set curriculum but love having the freedom to slow down or speed up when we need to. :)

[Alte Veste Academy]

Add me to the list of people who think you should not feel guilty. :) Furthermore, I do not see it as giving up. I see it as a course correction. Take heart and be kinder to yourself, because I have never known a successful homeschooler who didn't course correct from time to time.

 

There is nothing at all wrong with structure. Attractive as the unschooling lifestyle can be (and I do see the allure), there is nothing inherently superior about it. A bad fit is a bad fit. I have seen miserable, uninspired unschoolers and bright-eyed, curious classical homeschoolers and lots in between. I have come to believe that structured vs unstructured is missing the point altogether. I think success in homeschooling is all about fit, flexibility, attitudes, and relationships. And lots and lots of patience and forgiveness...mostly for ourselves, for failing to be perfect. :D

[Chrysalis Academy]

Sounds to me like you aren't "giving up" - you are acknowledging a reality and making the adjustments your family needs to be successful at homeschooling, which you are dedicated to. This is a good thing, not a bad thing!! Good for you!

 

While I do strive to be flexible and to incorporate dd's interests and accomodate her learning style, I don't unschool by a long shot - it wouldn't be right for either of us. We were talking about this the other day, and she acknowledged that she needs me to help her know what she needs to know - she doesn't know what she needs to know, and she knows it! (got it??) She also said, "I'm a kid. If you didn't make me do schoolwork, I'd just play all day. I need you to help me know what I need to learn and to make sure I learn it."

 

Ok, so what my kid needs - following her lead - is some structure. I couldn't "unschool" this kid, and be giving her what she needs. Nothing wrong with that. Here in No Cal, it seems like the vast majority of homeschoolers I run into are unschoolers, and it can make you feel weird if you are being more structured and they are spending every afternoon at parks, rollerskating, jumpy houses, whatever . . . but you gotta do what is right for you and your dc. What *you* know is right!

 

Happy New Year!

[CupOCoffee]

Interest led learning doesn't have to mean UNschooling. As has been said by a few already, there is nothing wrong with having "Mom" requirements which must be filled first, then having studies that the child is interested in. I have one who NEEDS to be able to study things she is interested in, or school would be a disaster. She wants to study rocks and minerals; fine, M-Th she does the science that I have chosen (Earth Science, so not that far off) and on Friday, she does her own thing: reading and learning about rocks and minerals. We've got books, internet sites and her Grandfather's rock collection. She wants to study Native Americans; fine, M-Th she does Mom's history (US History) and on Friday she does study of Native Americans, using specific tools and guidelines. Guess what? She's happy and I'm happy. She is more willing to do the things that are non-negotiable since she has things that are her interests.

 

Well that's the way interest led learning works in my house anyway. No need to feel ANY guilt whatsoever in being the MOM in charge of the education; I just think that there CAN be a nice compromise, it doesn't have to be an all or nothing in either direction.

 

~coffee~

[AKshanmar]

You have gotten some great support here to do what YOU need to do for YOUR family. We were mostly classical homeschoolers when the kids were young, with a pretty strict schedule. However, I am friends with folks who are very active in the unschooling realm, and I can completely appreciate the benefit of that avenue. I watched one friend have AMAZING success with her two oldest unschooling. But then she had to completely change paths when her youngest couldn't read at all by 5th grade. Perhaps he would have decided he wanted to learn to read in 6th or 7th grade, but all aspects of his life were being affected by his inability.

 

Maybe this avenue will open up to you again, but for now, enjoy your more structured journey?

[AKshanmar]

BTW... I have no idea why there is a "?" at the end of my post. Sorry!

[duckens]

1) For some parents, unschooling is just not a good fit.

 

2) For some kids, unschooling is just not a good fit.

 

3) That doesn't mean that it may not be a good fit or under certain circumstances in the future.

 

4) You shouldn't feel any worse about changing from unschooling to something more structured than you would by recognizing, "Hey, [insert math program here] isn't working for us. I'm going to trash it and try something different."

 

5) You should be :party: because you know what direction to try next! Let me pop open the champagne for you!

[Ellie]

Oh honey girl, you shouldn't feel guilty! :grouphug: All of us reflect on how things are going and make changes that fit us better. That's all you did.

 

Your years of relaxed homeschooling were a gift to your children. They're probably ready, now, for more structure. .

 

And I suspect that your "more structured" homeschooling will have a different flavor than most "more structured" homeschooling. ::big unschooling grin::

[shinyhappypeople]

:grouphug: Cut yourself some slack and read my signature. It's there because I need to remind myself of that daily.

[HS Mom in NC]

Maybe you just need to change approaches that better fit your underlying motivations and philosophies for homeschooling. I've been working on a seminar about that, so here's what I would suggest for someone considering homeschooling or considering making a change in how they do it. I always begin with them trying to figure out what they really want (Analyzing Your Education) before they explore the different options out there (Eight Approaches to Education.) I'm open to suggestions and additions to these recommendations-feel free to speak up.

 

Analyzing Your Education

 

1. List/discuss the parts of your education that were useful and/or important to preparing your for life as an adult.

 

 

2. List/discuss the parts if your education that were not useful and/or important to preparing your for life as an adult.

 

 

3. List/discuss anything you think should have been included in your education to prepare you for life as an adult, but was not.

 

 

4. List/discuss the parts of your education that were detrimental to preparing your for life as an adult.

 

 

5. Summarize as best you can what you think an ideal education is that prepares a child for life as an adult.

 

 

Eight Different Approaches to Education in the Homeschool Community

Most homeschoolers use a combination of two or more of these approaches. None of these approaches or classifications is set in stone, so you may hear other ways of describing or classifying them. Homeschooling is inherently flexible, so these approaches can be adapted and modified in any way the parent chooses. This is a bird's eye view making very broad generalizations. Popular curricula, websites, and authors detailing these approaches are listed. Let me know of others and I will gladly add them to the lists.

 

===Traditional School Approach ===

Typically uses prepackaged curriculum with a Scope and Sequence educational philosophy. Their daily and yearly schedules usually follow the 6 hour days of institutional settings and a 180 day school year with the summer off, but many allow their children to work at their own pace and finish early. Grading systems like those used in traditional school settings are the norm and aged grades mimic schools. Textbooks and workbooks are their primary texts. Fill in the blank and multiple choice answers are characteristic of this crowd. Children are generally taught the same information around the same age and proceed along the same path, although some may do so faster or slower.

 

Think institutional school.

 

Abeka

BJU

Alpha Omega

Apologia

Christian Liberty Press

ACE PACEs

 

=== Unschooling Approaches A and B===

This is a broad term that applies to two distinct groups.

 

Group A

 

Generally believes children are wired for learning, and their job as teachers is to avoid interfering with the learning process. Their job is also to provide access to learning (books, lab equipment, etc.) guided by the child’s interests. They do not necessarily think children need to be “taught†outside of answering a child's questions. Real life, hands-on projects and applied learning experiences are strongly preferred to other methods of instruction. Some will allow children to take classes of interest in an institutional setting-usually college.

 

Think Thomas Edison and John Holt.

 

Christian Unschooling (website)

Learning without Schooling Magazine

John Holt’s Books

Free Child Project (lots of links and resources)

 

 

Group B

 

These parents design every learning experience to answer the question, “When am I going to use this in real life?†by actually using almost exclusively real life, hands on, applied situations and projects. Only the real world here. They tend to be systematic and adult directed but are very careful to take additional time to follow a child’s interests some too.

 

No known packaged curriculum, websites, or magazines that address only this approach to homeschooling.

 

 

===Unit Study Approach ===

Typically these people integrate studies based on an era, historical event, person, character trait, technological development, or historical person. For example, if the Depression is the core of the unit study, Math (if possible), Literature, Science (if possible), History, Economics, and Writing will hinge on different elements of the Great Depression. This gives the student a multidimensional understanding. Each child in the family is given different assignments based on ability, but all study the same core theme.

 

Learning through History Magazine

Konos

Let the Author’s Speak

Timetables of History

 

===Living Books Approach ===

Only the best literature and writings on each subject are used. Think of it this way, instead of reading from a distilled over simplified textbook on the Civil War, these parents have their students read several of the books about the Civil War that an author of a textbook would read preparing to write the textbook. Now, think of doing that for Science, History, Economics, Literature, Art, etc. This crowd is also known for

nature studies, narration, and dictation.

 

Charlotte Mason

Karen Andreola

My Father’s World

Sonlight

Greenleaf Press

Let The Author’s Speak

Robinson’s Curriculum

 

 

===Classical Education===

Classical education has at least three distinct camps. They can be integrated as much as the parent prefers. They all have a strong preference for first source materials and use primarily Western Classics (Also called the Western Canon, or the Common Book of the Western World.) Some can include the study of "dead" languages (Hebrew, Classical or Biblical Greek, and Latin) although some are content with good English translations of Classic works while others opt for studies of Latin and Greek Roots in English.

 

Group A

 

Characterized by the Trivium. The 3 stages have many terms:

1. Stage 1 Grammar (facts)
    
   
2. Stage 2 Logic (cause and effect) All stages of formal Logic inductive, deductive, material, etc.
    
   
3. Stage 3 Rhetoric (application and persuasion) Formal argumentation is studied.
   

 

Formal Logic and Rhetoric are studied specifically. History is usually studied chronologically. Logic is studied formally, and Science is studied with experimentation, biographies, and original writings of the greatest minds. Classic works from masters throughout Western Civilization in all eras are studied. Some integrate History, Geography, Science and Literature into a more unit study approach.

 

Think Dorothy Sayers.

 

Tapestry of Grace

Classical Conversations

Memoria Press

Veritas Press

Teaching the Trivium

The Well Trained Mind

 

Group B

 

Characterized by the Mentor Model and sometimes called a "Statesmen" education. Morals, virtue, and character are emphasized above all.

1. In the early years children are allowed to follow their interests and learn good moral character while developing a strong work ethic.
    
   
2. The middle years are when the parent begins inspiring students by reading classic works by the best minds on the subjects and entering into apprenticeship situations with masters of certain skills.
    
   
3. The later years the students are mentored in apprenticeships in entrepreneurial situations for their future leadership roles and professional pursuits.
   

 

Think Thomas Jefferson.

 

A Thomas Jefferson education by DeMille

A Thomas Jefferson Companion

 

Group C

 

Also known as the Principle Approach. This is a method often attributed to how many of the Founders were educated.

1. Research the topic by looking up ideas
   

 

a. first source materials (original writings, documents, autobiographies, first hand historical accounts, etc.)

 

b. look up terms in dictionary (keeping in mind dictionaries that are specific to the era)

 

c. look up terms in your sacred writings or other sources related to your beliefs (Christians-Bible)

1. Reason through the material looking for the underlying principles.
   
2. Relate the information you have found through research and reason and apply it to your life.
   
3. Record your findings in a logical, systematic, and persuasive format.
   

 

Think James Madison.

 

www.principleapproach.org

[serendipitous journey]

oh sweetie, your title scared me, I thought you were leaving us for good! I'd miss you!!!

 

:grouphug: and no guilt. I am so excited about our spring line-up, which is all Curriculum Designed by Other Folks. With DH traveling so much, an incredibly intense Button, a tot, and my own desire to read more (and I do not mean read more board threads about how to design my own studies, I mean read books & Foreign Affairs & DH's papers -- he's a scientist) ... well, I am happier going into this spring than I've been in years.

 

One thing has made a huge change in my mindset (I mentioned this also on the what-you're-changing-thread) -- reading the book Switch (from the getting organized thread :) ). There is a chapter on bright spots -- on finding what IS working, and doing more of that in the areas that are NOT working. I suddenly realized that Button thrives on open-and-go, structured school which has a definite beginning and end and then he can go play. So we're doing that across the board.

 

more :grouphug: ...

[momto2Cs]

First off, thank you all for your thoughtful responses! I definitely feel better about this now, and the kids are actually responding really well to the idea of a more structured education, especially my ds11, who is actually the one that I think I could unschool. Dd9 would literally do nothing much all day if I didn't prod her. ;)

 

Add me to the list of people who think you should not feel guilty. :) Furthermore, I do not see it as giving up. I see it as a course correction. Take heart and be kinder to yourself, because I have never known a successful homeschooler who didn't course correct from time to time. There is nothing at all wrong with structure. Attractive as the unschooling lifestyle can be (and I do see the allure), there is nothing inherently superior about it. A bad fit is a bad fit. I have seen miserable, uninspired unschoolers and bright-eyed, curious classical homeschoolers and lots in between. I have come to believe that structured vs unstructured is missing the point altogether. I think success in homeschooling is all about fit, flexibility, attitudes, and relationships. And lots and lots of patience and forgiveness...mostly for ourselves, for failing to be perfect. :D

 

Nicely said! I am looking at it now as more of a course correction, and that helps me feel positive about the changes rather than feeling like I didn't somehow get the unschooling lifestyle right.

 

Sounds to me like you aren't "giving up" - you are acknowledging a reality and making the adjustments your family needs to be successful at homeschooling, which you are dedicated to. This is a good thing, not a bad thing!! Good for you! While I do strive to be flexible and to incorporate dd's interests and accomodate her learning style, I don't unschool by a long shot - it wouldn't be right for either of us. We were talking about this the other day, and she acknowledged that she needs me to help her know what she needs to know - she doesn't know what she needs to know, and she knows it! (got it??) She also said, "I'm a kid. If you didn't make me do schoolwork, I'd just play all day. I need you to help me know what I need to learn and to make sure I learn it." Ok, so what my kid needs - following her lead - is some structure. I couldn't "unschool" this kid, and be giving her what she needs. Nothing wrong with that. Here in No Cal, it seems like the vast majority of homeschoolers I run into are unschoolers, and it can make you feel weird if you are being more structured and they are spending every afternoon at parks, rollerskating, jumpy houses, whatever . . . but you gotta do what is right for you and your dc. What *you* know is right! Happy New Year!

 

I would definately say that living where we do has an impact because yes, I am surrounded by unschoolers. I think a couple of families I know are more schooly, but as you mentioned, around here the vast majority are unschoolers, and it does feel weird sometimes. I just need to remind myself that this is for us, not anyone else.

 

Oh honey girl, you shouldn't feel guilty! :grouphug: All of us reflect on how things are going and make changes that fit us better. That's all you did. Your years of relaxed homeschooling were a gift to your children. They're probably ready, now, for more structure. . And I suspect that your "more structured" homeschooling will have a different flavor than most "more structured" homeschooling. ::big unschooling grin::

 

Yes, I think it will have a different "flavor"!

 

I have allowed the kids a lot of input into the new plans. They'll be studying science, geography, and grammar together, but history will now be separate as they have very divergent interests. Thankfully ds11 is pretty responsible and able to do more independent work, although we will still be reading a lot of books together.

 

Thank you all again!

[PeterPan]

This might sound a little crazy, but I actually think it's easier to unschool with structure (or structure that keeps the classically bent mom happy) LATER, rather than when they're young. There's a lot of high school that is more negotiable (depending on your type of student). There's tons of lit, so the specifics of what you read don't matter. History is never-ending, so they can pigeon-hole or pursue interests, with only the time spent mattering. As I think through the next few years, I'm seeing so much more potential to loosen up than I did in those earlier, foundational years. So it's just something to ponder, that it might be a stage that comes back LATER. Not saying it has to, but it might.

[Alte Veste Academy]

This might sound a little crazy, but I actually think it's easier to unschool with structure (or structure that keeps the classically bent mom happy) LATER, rather than when they're young. There's a lot of high school that is more negotiable (depending on your type of student). There's tons of lit, so the specifics of what you read don't matter. History is never-ending, so they can pigeon-hole or pursue interests, with only the time spent mattering. As I think through the next few years, I'm seeing so much more potential to loosen up than I did in those earlier, foundational years. So it's just something to ponder, that it might be a stage that comes back LATER. Not saying it has to, but it might.

 

 

Oh my word. I don't think this is crazy at all. In fact, I think it is pure genius! Seriously! I think this is one of those common sense epiphanies that is so logical it doesn't even occur to you! :lol: Loosening the reins after years of guiding them in forming good habits just at the point when they are naturally starting to crave independence and resent constantly being told exactly what to do? Brilliant!

[PeterPan]

Oh my word. I don't think this is crazy at all. In fact, I think it is pure genius! Seriously! I think this is one of those common sense epiphanies that is so logical it doesn't even occur to you! :lol: Loosening the reins after years of guiding them in forming good habits just at the point when they are naturally starting to crave independence and resent constantly being told exactly what to do? Brilliant!

 

 

You're making it sound a little more brilliant. :D Or you might take it as loosening the structure as they have the maturity to self-implement a reasonable plan.

 

I don't even know if it will work with us. It's just the kind of thing I've been tossing around and opening my mind to and seeing where it goes.

[momto2Cs]

This might sound a little crazy, but I actually think it's easier to unschool with structure (or structure that keeps the classically bent mom happy) LATER, rather than when they're young. There's a lot of high school that is more negotiable (depending on your type of student). There's tons of lit, so the specifics of what you read don't matter. History is never-ending, so they can pigeon-hole or pursue interests, with only the time spent mattering. As I think through the next few years, I'm seeing so much more potential to loosen up than I did in those earlier, foundational years. So it's just something to ponder, that it might be a stage that comes back LATER. Not saying it has to, but it might.

 

This is actually something I am considering, i.e. loosening the reins for ds when he hits 9th or 10th grade... I think at that point he'd be very much ready to direct more of his own learning. It will likely be the same for dd. It would give me a sense of coming full circle to use a more-or-less interest led path through high school!

[Kfamily]

This might sound a little crazy, but I actually think it's easier to unschool with structure (or structure that keeps the classically bent mom happy) LATER, rather than when they're young. There's a lot of high school that is more negotiable (depending on your type of student). There's tons of lit, so the specifics of what you read don't matter. History is never-ending, so they can pigeon-hole or pursue interests, with only the time spent mattering. As I think through the next few years, I'm seeing so much more potential to loosen up than I did in those earlier, foundational years. So it's just something to ponder, that it might be a stage that comes back LATER. Not saying it has to, but it might.

 

 

This is how it's working out here for us. :)

Keep a lot of great books around (you will be surprised what they will pick up and read for themselves....books I was sure my older dd would never read....but she did and then asked for more....), rent/check from the library as many documentaries and Teaching Company lectures, give them subsciptions to magazines they keep reading at the library, etc.

It took us years of dedication while the girls were younger, but we are really reaping the fruits of our labor now. There is so much they will take upon themselves to learn now. They ask me to read specific books, learn languages, take on new subjects so often that we are truly in over our heads. My feelings of being overwhelmed are most often due to the sheer number of things they want me to teach them. It's a good problem but not without its issues:) I'm trying to learn how to say no and that is so difficult for me. (In fact, I'm failing at it right now. How do you say no to your children's desire to learn more?)

 

My greatest struggle used to be how to manage our schedule, then it was what to teach, then it was how to teach specific subjects, and now its how to teach all they want to learn in the best way possible in the limited amount of time we have. My new problem is like all three problems combined. :)

 

Momto2Cs, I think you're doing a great job teaching your children. Changes are almost inevitable in homeschooling. We have to learn who we are too...in the process...and then our children are full of changes as they grow. Changes are just what we have to do in order to keep up with all of this. Your children are so lucky to have you as their teacher.