How about if you were going to switch to secular textbooks?

[Guest]

I saw the other thread and most of ya'll advise religious publishers. Now, I am Christian but just wondered who ya'll would choose for secular.

 

For some reason, having religious references in our daily schoolwork (outside of scripture and prayer time) really bugs my boys.

 

I don't count Calvert as a textbook company as most of their stuff is only available in the expensive full grade level packs.

 

Any ideas?

[mama25angels]

K12, Oak Meadow are two that i've heard wonderful things about.

[Guest]

Now if only K12 wasn't so darned expensive....

[Shasta Mom]

stories are presented as fables, Real Science 4 Kids, Lively Latin, Writing Tales, SOTW - and the list goes on. We educate secularly and haven't had a problem.

[Tabrett]

Most secular texts are:

 

LA- whole language-write, write, write before a child is capable

History-teach: me-out instead of world-in

Math-New math and variable ways of doing problems with no mastery

Science- biased on evolution and having children theorize before their brain can do this

 

I think this the reason most people don't use secular text very often. They are not very good. Always changing so as to sell their latest addition to the public school.

[Robin in DFW]

Saxon math

MCP math

Singapore math

Growing with Grammar

Spelling Workout

Home Science Adventures

Story of the World

Walch Publishing products

The Wonderful World of Geography by Runkle

Steck-Vaughn products

Evan-Moor products

EPS products

Lightning Literature

Amsco products

and we use LLATL secularly, although it has religious references

 

I don't think publishers have the same requirements for individual products as they do for "textbooks". Textbooks are made for very specific, large group instruction. They are made the way they are to be the most useful in a large group setting. There are many products from textbook publishers that can easily used in a homeschool setting that are fabulous (Evan-Moor comes to mind).

 

I think religious textbook publishers have many of the same faults as secular textbook publishers...there are many products from religious publishers that are just a crummy as their secular counterparts. It's up to the individual homeschooling family to sort it out. I don't think it's fair to categorize all secular products as being substandard.

 

hth,

Robin

[LisaCA]

STOW, Saxon Math, Spelling workout or megawords, Latin Road to English Grammar, Real Science 4 kids (loved it!), Writing Strands

[Ellie]

MacMillan's English texts aren't too bad, if you can find them; and there is a subseries, if I can call it that, which is titled something like "Thinking and Writing Processes." There's still grammar, but there is more writing; it's pretty decent.

 

Modern Curriculum Press is secular (Spelling Workout, math), as is EPS (Educational Publishers Services; Wordly Wise, the Stewart English Program, et al).

 

Saxon is, of course, secular.

 

Silver Burdett's social studies books aren't bad, especially the older ones. Before BJUP published texts below high school level, some BJUP reps recommended Silver Burdett.

 

Easy Grammar and Writing Strands are secular (at least, EG's author might be a Christian, but there isn't an overt Christian influence, IYKWIM).

[EKS]

Some secular stuff we've used and liked (besides K12):

 

Hake Grammar

Sequential Spelling

Getting Started With Latin

Science Explorer

REAL Science

Saxon Math

Singapore Math

Jacobs Algebra

[Bee]

Grades 5-9 and their website says they are coming out with a collection of short stories this summer.

The Key to Math series by Key Curriculum Press

Grammar Ace by Avyx (I think the company is owned by Sonlight but it's products are secular)

Jamestown Publishers "Best ..." series.Best Nonfiction,Best Short Stories,Best Selling Chapters,Best Plays,and Best Poems.Different levels for elementary aged,middle level and high school.I bought mine from Hewitt.

 

I've had much better luck finding secular workbooks than textbooks.I simply don't like to pay for the expensive TMs that most secular publishers sell.I guess I'd rather spend my money on "real" books.

[Parrothead]

We use mostly a mostly secular curriculum. Being Catholic, a lot of Chirstian publishers don't appeal to us. So we have catechism and daily living, then secular for everthing else.

 

Currently we are using MUS, SOTW, FFL, and AAS. Reading is books that appeal to us with comprehension, story elements and genre studies using guides from published by Scholastic. Like this one http://www.amazon.com/Building-Reading-Comprehension-Habits-Grades/dp/0872075397/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1214349195&sr=1-5 I can't recommend this book. It was the first I found doing a quick search. But you get the idea of the types of books I'm using.

 

Science uses WTM as a spine. This year we are doing physics and will be using a variety of books like these:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1556525664/ref=ord_cart_shr?%5Fencoding=UTF8&m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&v=glance

 

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1402723717/ref=ord_cart_shr?%5Fencoding=UTF8&m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&v=glance

Those are actually on my shopping list.

[Carmen_and_Company]

I was going to reply to one of the previous posters, but decided not to.

 

We use 95% secular materials, and my dc never used a secular text or program that was dumbed down, yes, some may have high expectations of the student, but my dc look forward to the challenge.

[LanaTron]

Galore Park is good and secular.

[Peela]

Most secular texts are:

 

LA- whole language-write, write, write before a child is capable

History-teach: me-out instead of world-in

Math-New math and variable ways of doing problems with no mastery

Science- biased on evolution and having children theorize before their brain can do this

 

I think this the reason most people don't use secular text very often. They are not very good. Always changing so as to sell their latest addition to the public school.

 

Um, not true. Plenty of good secular texts out there for the homeschooling market. Story of the World can be used by most secular folk, as can many other approaches that are not me-centred ( I do know what you mean by that approach to history). Singapore maths and science products are excellent. Secular does mean evolution to most people though, but that is a separate issue to early logical thinking- Singapore does do that, but in a gentle way.

Sorry, your post just seemed quite prejudiced to me, but perhaps you haven't really looked at secular homeschooling material before and equate it only with poor quality public school curricula and approaches, but that is not a valid association.

[Robyn]

We use mostly secular material.

FLL, Getty-Dubay Italic, and Writing Tales

I have Galore Park science for the fall

We use Horizons for math, not secular, but we haven't come across any religious content in the 3rd grade, it is math after all

 

Most secular texts are:

 

LA- whole language-write, write, write before a child is capable

History-teach: me-out instead of world-in

Math-New math and variable ways of doing problems with no mastery

Science- biased on evolution and having children theorize before their brain can do this

 

I think this the reason most people don't use secular text very often. They are not very good. Always changing so as to sell their latest addition to the public school.

 

 

That is very biased and in my experience, untrue. Our math program does not use a mastery approach and it is from a Christian publisher. If you read on the high school boards, many of the mathy parents are seeking out the "new math" texts for upper levels.

What works for one family will not necessarily work for another. I am so glad that there are so many options available for both secular and religious homeschoolers.

[CoffeeBean]

Singapore math, spelling power, easy grammar, science explorer, history of US - Hakim, Kids can books (early science), reader's disgest how the earth, math, etc wroks series, TOPS science, Chicago review press series - marco polo for kids, SHalespeare for kids, Civil War for kids, etc; Foster George Washington's world series (Ceasar, Licoln, etc) Oh so many, so little time

 

Coffee Bean

[TracyR]

Hmm. Let's see .

 

We have Writing Tales

if I had to chose a secular Latin program Latin for Children

Saxon for math

Story of the World for History

not sure what for science because we have secular science book with Calvert and its boring as all get out . You take away God and it just becomes boring dull facts .

I like the Kumon books for preschool

For grammar I would use Growing with Grammar

Spelling , well you can purchase Calvert's spelling seperately and I do like their spelling .

Or Sequential Spelling

If K12 wasn't so expensive I would use their Science I guess . I've heard good things about it . and their History looks very well put together too .

[SheilaZ]

The only text that we use that isn't secular is Rod and Staff for English. And we did use Latina Christiana but I am switching to Latin Prep.

 

For math: MCP math and Singapore math

Science: Harcourt Science or PH Explorer

History: Core Knowledge, Prentice Hall texts and a program I used when I taught called FAST

Spelling: SWO

Phonics: Sing, Spell, Read, and Write, ETC, Hooked on Phonics

Handwriting without Tears

Litrature: various guides...all secular

 

My problem with public school is not with the texts they use. They actually have some very good texts.

My issue is with everything else: teachers, testing, adminstrations, school culture, school politics, and non-standard curriculum.

[DarcyM]

Yikes. I can't imagine how limited book choices would feel with the belief that secular texts "are not very good." That is a sweeping generalization.

 

I also think it's a mistruth that "most people don't use secular texts very often." Perhaps that's true in the original poster's inner circle, but again it's a sweeping generalization to say that about homeschoolers.

 

I think it can be said that both secular and Christian publishers have produced some wonderful texts. To limit oneself to only one or the other would make the world feel, to me, quite small and one-sided.

 

Secular choices that we've enjoyed (or I've purchased) and would feel confident about recommending for your research, include:

 

Singapore math, Singapore science, Growing with Grammar, Kingfisher History Encyclopedia, Story of the World (this has some cc), Explode the Code, Evan Moor, Writing Tales, Ordinary Parent's Guide to Teaching Reading, First Language Lessons, Happy Scribe (available in CC and non-CC content), Spelling Wisdom (some quotes have CC), Primary Grade Challenge Math.

 

Good luck in your research, I hope you find some sources that can be great tools in your journey.

 

Warmly,

[EKS]

:confused: Huh?

You must be confusing secular with public school. There is plenty of solid, rigorous secular resources out there.

[Wee Pip]

Hmm...I had some thoughts on the secular textbooks debate. First, define "secular textbooks". For some reason, the first thing that popped into my head at the op's question was a complete provider of secular textbooks (like Bob Jones or Abeka, but secular, kwim?) The only guys that came to my mind was Calvert & K12. Anything else out there like that? So from that line of thinking, there doesn't appear to be much out there (or, I'm just in the dark on the options, which is entirely possible).

 

The next thing that came to mind was secular public school textbook providers, such as Scotts Foresman, Houghton-Mifflin, and a handful of others. I occasionally see their books floating around the homeschool world, but I didn't find their web sites very user-friendly for homeschoolers, and came to the conclusion that they just weren't intended for homeschoolers. Again, I could be in the dark on this one; that was just my impression. I think the poster that commented negatively about secular textbooks was probably thinking of these guys.

 

Last, as I read the answers, I realized the "piece it together" secular textbook providers that tend to only produce for one specific area. SOTW (history), Saxon (math), Explode the Code (phonics), etc. Funny, but I didn't think of the independent players when I read the op question. I think I have my own personal bias about the word "textbook", since I immediately think of some bedraggled hardcover book that has been handed down to different public school classrooms for the past 4 years. Anyhow, thought I would point out some of the ways "textbook" can be interpreted, LOL.

[gardenschooler]

I like a lot of Walch Publishing's materials.

[manylilblessings]

I'm a Christian, and I've only recently started implementing the Christian publishers into my curriculum, because IMO they've just now started reaching the academic standard I want for my kids. So, to say that secular publishers are substandard is short-sighted. Academically speaking, secular books used to be far superior, albeit teaching evolution and such. My curriculum now is a mix. I don't need my Math and Phonics books to teach a Biblical worldview. History and Science? Yes...

 

To the OP, you've gotten some good suggestions on quality secular materials. Good luck in your transition!

 

Melissa

[mchel210]

My kids prefer not to have a heavy religious book either...and they get very turned off when they work with books that have too much religion. Im not sure why...but we did abeka math and la and that was fine. I didnt see too much in either one of those. They had been very sweet...I think they have more moral teachings then religious in the math and la.

 

This year we have switched to Sonlight and that has been the perfect balance. They dont mind any of it. There are a few stories that I can see them fading on but that is mainly the missionary stories and ones like that...but they are very short and they will sit for about 2-3 pages max. Those can always be skipped. I havent found any of our readers to contain too much religion. The SOTW was a great book for us last year. The kids loved it.

 

Mine didnt like the copywork in LLATL. That was based on verses and my older one didnt like that.

 

Science was hard to find secular. My ds is using fl virtual school and my girls are using sonlight. We did apologia zoology last year and they didnt like that either. I think you would have to do something like sonlight or public school books.

 

Zaner blouser, modern curriculum press, eps books, steck vaughn, pearson...those all come to mind as great workbooks.

[Laura Corin]

Galore Park is good and secular.

 

Laura

[Tabrett]

Hmm...I had some thoughts on the secular textbooks debate. First, define "secular textbooks". For some reason, the first thing that popped into my head at the op's question was a complete provider of secular textbooks (like Bob Jones or Abeka, but secular, kwim?) The only guys that came to my mind was Calvert & K12. Anything else out there like that? So from that line of thinking, there doesn't appear to be much out there (or, I'm just in the dark on the options, which is entirely possible).

 

The next thing that came to mind was secular public school textbook providers, such as Scotts Foresman, Houghton-Mifflin, and a handful of others. I occasionally see their books floating around the homeschool world, but I didn't find their web sites very user-friendly for homeschoolers, and came to the conclusion that they just weren't intended for homeschoolers. Again, I could be in the dark on this one; that was just my impression. I think the poster that commented negatively about secular textbooks was probably thinking of these guys.

 

Last, as I read the answers, I realized the "piece it together" secular textbook providers that tend to only produce for one specific area. SOTW (history), Saxon (math), Explode the Code (phonics), etc. Funny, but I didn't think of the independent players when I read the op question. I think I have my own personal bias about the word "textbook", since I immediately think of some bedraggled hardcover book that has been handed down to different public school classrooms for the past 4 years. Anyhow, thought I would point out some of the ways "textbook" can be interpreted, LOL.

 

Thank you Wee Pip,

 

My definition of secular must be different. If it comes with a religious slant; I don't consider it secular. It doesn't have to "teach religion" to be secular, IMO. Here is what I mean: Saxon math use to be Christian, but they removed any references a long time age. SOTW, FFL, WWE and OPGTR is written by a person with a degree in theology. A lot of the "secular" text books mentioned were written by religious people. Just because it doesn't teach religion doesn't mean their opinion and values aren't apparent in their books.

 

The people who didn't like my post ignored the words most text books in my post. I never said all. And yes, I was thinking of texts used in public schools not homeschools. If the text used in public school were the ones people put on their lists, I wouldn't have to homeschool!

 

~ranting of an x-public school teacher~