Merry Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 That thread was hilarious though I winced to see myself having said some of those things in the past....I've learned since then...and regretted... But I'm a bit puzzled about the leading of God part...does no one think that God leads a person at least occasionally? For instance, aren't pastors, priests, or teachers called by God? Or do you think that they just decide that they want to go into the ministry all on their own initiative? I have been thinking a lot about this issue for the past many months when two of my sons announced that they wanted to go into the ministry. They haven't said that God called them though. They enjoy that kind of work and want to make a career out of it. Is that all there is to it, do you think? Not a special kind of calling required? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 My cousin calls me all the time because God told him to tell me something... and I am so grateful. The Spirit bears witness to me that what he says is supported by God. Those who have been led by God to do something understand. Those who haven't don't. God doesn't always tell you to do the thing that will be well accepted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeacefulChaos Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 That thread was hilarious though I winced to see myself having said some of those things in the past....I've learned since then...and regretted... But I'm a bit puzzled about the leading of God part...does no one think that God leads a person at least occasionally? For instance, aren't pastors, priests, or teachers called by God? Or do you think that they just decide that they want to go into the ministry all on their own initiative? I have been thinking a lot about this issue for the past many months when two of my sons announced that they wanted to go into the ministry. They haven't said that God called them though. They enjoy that kind of work and want to make a career out of it. Is that all there is to it, do you think? Not a special kind of calling required? I absolutely believe God leads people. But I don't believe it in the instances spoken of in that thread. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QuirkyKapers Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I believe God leads too. However, I have found that if God is leading or speaking through someone to me, there will be more than just 1 confirmation. Maybe I was reading about something in my devotions and than someone mentioned that thing in a conversation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeacefulChaos Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I believe God leads too. However, I have found that if God is leading or speaking through someone to me, there will be more than just 1 confirmation. Maybe I was reading about something in my devotions and than someone mentioned that thing in a conversation. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I absolutely believe that God leads ppl. However. My experience w/my mother and MIL is that God is apparently their personal enforcer. ie, MIL told me after Tazzie was born that God told her that I wasn't to have any more children (by birth) but to adopt. She was some ticked when we got pregnant w/Princess, and repeated that God TOLD HER...I replied that I guessed He changed His mind and forgot to let her know. She was even angrier when we told her Boo was on his way. My mother brags all the time about how God talks to her, and she passes msgs along for Him. I asked why He needed *her* to interpret, and couldn't just speak directly to the person in question. She hung up on me :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elegantlion Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Absolutely I believe God leads people or put things on the heart of people, so to say. However, I've been the giver and givee in some of those inappropriate situations. Once I told a friend something I felt God had lead me to tell her. It was good news, it was something hopeful. I wrestled with the thought for several days until I had "peace" about it. Seven years later this hopeful thing I told her still hasn't happened. I felt sure God somehow revealed to me that it would have happened by now. In fact I often wonder if this statement has become a hurt for her (if she even remembers). We now longer see each other due to a move, but I've often thought about apologizing for saying it. I also believe in spiritual gifts, but I also believe in discernment. Too often I see examples like the in the other thread where prayer chains become gossip disguised, and thoughtful comments "from God" become fodder for judgment and elevation of self. Sort of an "I am better than you, so God is speaking to me on your behalf." I get tired of people using God to be busybodies and overstep boundaries. No one sees my heart but Him (or the ones in which I share my innermost feelings, and those I can count on one hand). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happi duck Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 God leads but there are people who use "God told me" to get their way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather in Neverland Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I think that God has gifted some people to be teachers and pastors and that if they are qualified according to the bible and following God's ways according to the bible then an actual "call" from God is unnecessary. Look at the qualification for elders according to the bible: 1 Timothy 3:1-7 It is a trustworthy statement: if any man aspires to the office of elder, it is a fine work he desires to do. An elder, then, must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, prudent, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, not addicted to wine or pugnacious, but gentle, peaceable, free from the love of money. He must be one who manages his own household well, keeping his children under control with all dignity (but if a man does not know how to manage his own household, how will he take care of the church of God?), and not a new convert, so that he will not become conceited and fall into the condemnation incurred by the devil. And he must have a good reputation with those outside the church, so that he will not fall into reproach and the snare of the devil It seems that it is biblically acceptable to "aspire" and "desire" to be an elder. As long as that is your particular gifting (meaning skill set) and you are qualified according to the verses above, you don't need a special "word from God" in order to move forward with it. When things go awry is when people who are not qualified or not honest with themselves about their particular skill set try to force themselves to fit that role. Or try to do it for less-than-God-honoring reasons. Yes God did "call" certain people in the bible to do certain special tasks (like calling Moses to lead the Israelites out of slavery) but I do not think that is the norm in every day life. Some people like to say they were called or not called, lead or not lead by God, etc. as a way of: 1. pawning off their bad decisions on God 2. refusing to make a decision and blaming God for it 3. appearing "more spiritual" than those who have not been "called" As christians we are ALL "called" to follow the ways of God. This book is an excellent resource: Just Do Something: How to Make a Decision Without Dreams, Visions, Fleeces, Open Doors, Random Bible Verses, Casting Lots, Liver Shivers, Writing in the Sky, etc http://www.amazon.com/Just-Do-Something-Decision-Without/dp/0802458386/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1326528381&sr=1-3 People often ask me if I was "called" to be a principal in a christian missionary school. My answer? Not really. But I felt like God would be honored if I used the skill set he gave me to honor him. I hope that is good enough. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hen Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I do think God leads people, but I also think that many people have become flippant about what this means and if they have really been led. I have seen so many friends and family decide that God is leading them into something they want (like a move or a job change) and they take the fact that God does not stop them (by making it impossible) as a sign that they have His leading to do it. I think that when God does lead or speak, it's unmistakable to the receptor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaKim Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I absolutely believe that God leads ppl. However. My experience w/my mother and MIL is that God is apparently their personal enforcer. ie, MIL told me after Tazzie was born that God told her that I wasn't to have any more children (by birth) but to adopt. She was some ticked when we got pregnant w/Princess, and repeated that God TOLD HER...I replied that I guessed He changed His mind and forgot to let her know. She was even angrier when we told her Boo was on his way. My mother brags all the time about how God talks to her, and she passes msgs along for Him. I asked why He needed *her* to interpret, and couldn't just speak directly to the person in question. She hung up on me :tongue_smilie: :lol: Yep. One of my favorite pastors tells how this guy was always bringing him messages supposedly from God. He said one day he had finally had enough, and he told him, "Well, that's funny. God told me that he doesn't talk to you." :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LND1218 Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I think that God has gifted some people to be teachers and pastors and that if they are qualified according to the bible and following God's ways according to the bible then an actual "call" from God is unnecessary. Look at the qualification for elders according to the bible: 1 Timothy 3:1-7 It is a trustworthy statement: if any man aspires to the office of elder, it is a fine work he desires to do. An elder, then, must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, prudent, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, not addicted to wine or pugnacious, but gentle, peaceable, free from the love of money. He must be one who manages his own household well, keeping his children under control with all dignity (but if a man does not know how to manage his own household, how will he take care of the church of God?), and not a new convert, so that he will not become conceited and fall into the condemnation incurred by the devil. And he must have a good reputation with those outside the church, so that he will not fall into reproach and the snare of the devil It seems that it is biblically acceptable to "aspire" and "desire" to be an elder. As long as that is your particular gifting (meaning skill set) and you are qualified according to the verses above, you don't need a special "word from God" in order to move forward with it. When things go awry is when people who are not qualified or not honest with themselves about their particular skill set try to force themselves to fit that role. Or try to do it for less-than-God-honoring reasons. Yes God did "call" certain people in the bible to do certain special tasks (like calling Moses to lead the Israelites out of slavery) but I do not think that is the norm in every day life. Some people like to say they were called or not called, lead or not lead by God, etc. as a way of: 1. pawning off their bad decisions on God 2. refusing to make a decision and blaming God for it 3. appearing "more spiritual" than those who have not been "called" As christians we are ALL "called" to follow the ways of God. This book is an excellent resource: Just Do Something: How to Make a Decision Without Dreams, Visions, Fleeces, Open Doors, Random Bible Verses, Casting Lots, Liver Shivers, Writing in the Sky, etc http://www.amazon.com/Just-Do-Something-Decision-Without/dp/0802458386/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1326528381&sr=1-3 People often ask me if I was "called" to be a principal in a christian missionary school. My answer? Not really. But I felt like God would be honored if I used the skill set he gave me to honor him. I hope that is good enough. . That's an excellent book! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
houseofkids&pets Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I do believe that God leads people. I just think that some people use this as a way to focus on their own agenda. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I do think God leads people, but I also think that many people have become flippant about what this means and if they have really been led. I have seen so many friends and family decide that God is leading them into something they want (like a move or a job change) and they take the fact that God does not stop them (by making it impossible) as a sign that they have His leading to do it. I think that when God does lead or speak, it's unmistakable to the receptor. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merry Posted January 14, 2012 Author Share Posted January 14, 2012 thank you, Heather, for for ! Timothy 3:1 - 7 passage. That's exactly what I needed. I was confused about whether a young man really needed to feel "called" into the ministry. Hen Jen, I see so many people in my church and other local churches being flippant about the "calling" thing. And yes, I'm sure you are right about God's call being unmistakable to the receptor. I'm sure it's a rare thing, though, since we do have the Bible to guide us that the disciples and apostles and church leaders lacked during the early church period. Imp, your mil sets a good example of what not to do:) And that's why I stopped going to the women's Bible studies at my church:( Thanks everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanvan Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 :iagree: With what has been said so far. I also think it is not always easy, as a Christian, to discern God's leading. Sometimes you may not even realize where God was leading you until years have passed and you can more easily see how events brought you to a place you didn't necessarily expect to be. It wasn't your plan, but God's plan for you. He worked events to lead you there. Sometimes when we 'feel' God wants us to do x, y, or z, we can mix up our own inclinations with God. As Paul wrote, we have a war within us b/t the Spirit and the flesh. It's not always easy to discern which is which. It's not hard for people to take their fleshy desires (feelings) and find some sort of Biblical justification for them. And yet, sometimes God can use a person's feelings to prompt them. That makes things even more complicated. Dr. Dobson's little book Emotions: Can You Trust Them examines this idea. I think it was written for teens, but I know some adults who could benefit from reading it. I benefited from reading it and used parts of it when I lead a Bible study a few years ago. The other book looks interesting too. The answer to the OP's question is going to vary depending on theological beliefs. We don't believe God speaks directly to people now as he did to Abraham in the OT, so I'm wary of anyone who says God told them something. That's why I posted in the other thread, that I want to know just exactly how the person heard God. If they really do mean they heard his voice then I find that pretty scary. If they didn't hear a voice, then they shouldn't be saying they did and that would incline me to think they were being somewhat dishonest and using God to support their own inclinations. Not sure how well I explained my thoughts, but I tried. I need to go get dressed and wake up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanvan Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Imp, your mil sets a good example of what not to do:) And that's why I stopped going to the women's Bible studies at my church:( Thanks everyone. These posts have validated my decision not to attend Women's Bible Study or prayer meeting. Instead, I have a few trusted friends who I will ask to pray for me or about a certain situation. None of them attend my church and they come from different social circles, so any gossiping isn't going to lead far--they aren't the gossipy types anyway. When I was a brand new Christian, people continually advised me to attend prayer meetings and Bible studies. A very mature Christian friend told me to stay away and not to ask for prayer about anything personal. I always felt a little bad assuming that these things could lead to trouble, but years down the road I've decided her advice was warranted. I don't have time anyway. I did lead a Bible study in my home once. I kept away from prayer requests and stuck to discussing the Bible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Marple Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Heather, I agree! I haven't read that book, but I'm going to buy it now. And when I'm done, I'm going to leave it around the church :) 1. pawning off their bad decisions on God 2. refusing to make a decision and blaming God for it 3. appearing "more spiritual" than those who have not been "called" I've watched so many of the teens my sons are friends with, growing up without any direction. They haven't yet "had a word from God" so they flounder. It is more spiritual to claim to be called to missions than it is to enroll at the state college and get a degree. Unfortunately, I don't see those "called to missions" doing much other than working (or not), hanging out at the church because that's more spiritual than studying, etc. One of our missionaries once said, "We need missionaries, and we need folks who can support them." If everyone claims to be "called" to missions (as we see in our youth group) who will be left holding jobs to support them? The teens who decided to move on with their education are the ones that seem to be actually doing "missions" - starting Bible studies on campus, spending breaks doing volunteer relief work, etc. But it is so easy for the other kids to sit back and claim that they aren't getting on with their lives because God has not told them what to do and they are somehow more spiritual because of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Marple Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 :iagree: Dr. Dobson's little book Emotions: Can You Trust Them examines this idea. I think it was written for teens, but I know some adults who could benefit from reading it. I benefited from reading it and used parts of it when I lead a Bible study a few years ago. The other book looks interesting too. That's why I posted in the other thread, that I want to know just exactly how the person heard God. If they really do mean they heard his voice then I find that pretty scary. If they didn't hear a voice, then they shouldn't be saying they did and that would incline me to think they were being somewhat dishonest and using God to support their own inclinations. I read Dobson's book shortly after marriage. It really helped me understand the difference in "feelings" and "truth". Totally agree with the bolded. If I heard God speak, I would be flat on my face, trembling with fear! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denisemomof4 Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 When I was a strong believer, I most definitely felt God's leading at times. Some people tend to follow their own agenda telling them it is what God wants. Others just can't get out of their own way. I don't care who says what: giving more money to an already financially blessed church, and signing a commitment letter stating you will do so for a year, then having to put all your groceries on your Visa, this is NOT God's will. This is stupid and reckless, especially when you have kids. Doing the same and having your kids go through a winter with no coats? Stupidity. God leads and God calls. You need to be wise enough to discern when it is God and when it isn't. It's not always easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I'm sure it's a rare thing, though, since we do have the Bible to guide us that the disciples and apostles and church leaders lacked during the early church period.No... all of Jesus' promises to us are still faithful, including the Holy Spirit as our Helper and that which is perfect has not yet come, so there is no reason we would not have gifts of the Spirit as well. But not all are granted the same gifts, and all of these require our belief, so perhaps more rare than they used to be. Mark 9:14-29; 1 Corinthians 13:10; Romans 12:6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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