"When An Adult Took Standardized Tests Forced on Kids"

[scrappyhappymama]

Interesting perspective on the standardized testing debate:

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/post/when-an-adult-took-standardized-tests-forced-on-kids/2011/12/05/gIQApTDuUO_blog.html

 

I found this quote particularly compelling: “If I’d been required to take those two tests when I was a 10th grader, my life would almost certainly have been very different. I’d have been told I wasn’t ‘college material,’ would probably have believed it, and looked for work appropriate for the level of ability that the test said I had."

[Hannah C.]

That is a very interesting article. Thanks for sharing!

[GoVanGogh]

I have several college degrees and recently took my son's 4th grade ITBS. (I took it before I gave it to him, so I could "grade" it before I sent it in for scoring.) I was surprised at how many "social studies" questions I didn't have even a vague idea what the correct answer would be. :001_huh: I would estimate a dozen were so open-ended they couldn't be answered w/o wildly guessing.

[scrappyhappymama]

I have several college degrees and recently took my son's 4th grade ITBS. (I took it before I gave it to him, so I could "grade" it before I sent it in for scoring.) I was surprised at how many "social studies" questions I didn't have even a vague idea what the correct answer would be. :001_huh: I would estimate a dozen were so open-ended they couldn't be answered w/o wildly guessing.

 

 

That is disturbing! It really seems that standardized tests should be testing general, common knowledge for the age in question.

[nancypantsgirl]

Saw this on Twitter earlier today. Awesome. Bang on.

[nancypantsgirl]

That is disturbing! It really seems that standardized tests should be testing general, common knowledge for the age in question.

 

Same with some of the questions on a practice test for the California STAR tests. Only it was a second grade test. I thought, there is no way a second grader could manage this without crumpling up and crying (or being a good sport and guessing a ton of them).

 

The one that boggled my mind was something in the realm of: "Which of the following equations does not equal less than 12?" And then it of course gave them four problems that they would have to work out and then figure out (using that wonderful negative language that 2nd graders are SO adept at understanding and making sense of after they just solved four problems for one test question). I was so unnerved when I read through the test booklet... still am. I'm just as annoyed with the other levels as well. I had the opportunity to speak with a former educator who once worked at writing state tests and after I spoke my suspicions that few of them actually worked with children but rather sat in rooms thinking about what kids should know in order to compete with China, she heartily agreed with me!

[ErinE]

Same with some of the questions on a practice test for the California STAR tests. Only it was a second grade test. I thought, there is no way a second grader could manage this without crumpling up and crying (or being a good sport and guessing a ton of them).

 

The one that boggled my mind was something in the realm of: "Which of the following equations does not equal less than 12?" And then it of course gave them four problems that they would have to work out and then figure out (using that wonderful negative language that 2nd graders are SO adept at understanding and making sense of after they just solved four problems for one test question). I was so unnerved when I read through the test booklet... still am.

 

I ran into this same problem with my ds's second grade CAT exam. He only missed three questions on the entire exam, and I could tell right away it was his lack of testing skills. The only problems he missed were the "tricky" problems. Things like: find the synonym for moist, wet or damp. Both would be correct answers; he had to find the best answer, which requires the child to go slow and read every question thoroughly.

 

I understand putting these in the SAT; children in high school schould be old enough to work through each problem by the process of elimination. But the elementary school ages? I was pretty appalled at the level of sophisticated thinking required on the standardized tests given to such a young age group.

[In The Great White North]

Things like: find the synonym for moist, wet or damp. Both would be correct answers; he had to find the best answer, which requires the child to go slow and read every question thoroughly.

 

I understand putting these in the SAT; children in high school schould be old enough to work through each problem by the process of elimination. But the elementary school ages? I was pretty appalled at the level of sophisticated thinking required on the standardized tests given to such a young age group.

 

I don't understand the point of it on the SAT either. I always believed (and still do) that the "choose the best answer" caveat was a CYA measure for test creators to cover their own mistakes (eg. including two correct choices or not having any correct choices.)

[Kathleen in VA]

Interesting perspective on the standardized testing debate:

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/post/when-an-adult-took-standardized-tests-forced-on-kids/2011/12/05/gIQApTDuUO_blog.html

 

I found this quote particularly compelling: “If I’d been required to take those two tests when I was a 10th grader, my life would almost certainly have been very different. I’d have been told I wasn’t ‘college material,’ would probably have believed it, and looked for work appropriate for the level of ability that the test said I had."

 

Someone I know posted this on FB. This is the same sentence that struck me as well. How many kids are taking these tests and deciding to skip college when they really are college material??? Frustrating to say the least.

[bethben]

I too would look at my son's tests before he took them (we live in a state where you are required to test each year). As he's getting older, I'm noticing more and more how teachers HAVE to teach to the test - especially the social studies and science sections (since we didn't study American Indians last year, ds didn't do as well on that section this past year for example). My favorite from 1st or 2nd grade was a question about how a woman can earn a living or some sort of nonsense like that. They had a picture of a professional woman at a desk, a hairdresser, and an obvious mom picture. The mom picture was I'm guessing the wrong choice in the testers opinion. I got irritated at what was a blatant social engineering question.

 

On a testing note, my disabled/is only 2 years old mentally 7th grade son has to take a standardized test every year. His scores and his fellow special ed. classmates help to make our district a failing school because this particular group of children can't seem to improve from year to year. Most of his class can't even talk much less work hard on improving for a standardized test! The insanity of testing!

 

Beth

[GoVanGogh]

My favorite from 1st or 2nd grade was a question about how a woman can earn a living or some sort of nonsense like that. They had a picture of a professional woman at a desk, a hairdresser, and an obvious mom picture. The mom picture was I'm guessing the wrong choice in the testers opinion. I got irritated at what was a blatant social engineering question.

When my DS took a 1st grade test several years ago, one of questions was: Which of the following would your parents hire done?

It included someone changing the oil of a car, someone painting a house, someone cleaning your house and someone building a fence.

I asked my city-born, city-bred neighbor gal and she said, "All of the above."

I asked my country-born, country-bred brother who lives on a farm and he said, "None of the above."

Really. What sort of question is that? I can't even imagine what the "correct" answer would have been. We hire someone to change our oil for us, but we have built our own fence. Sometimes we paint, sometimes we hire it done, depends on the job. I dream of hiring someone to clean my house. :lol:

And a 1st grader is suppose to know how to answer that? My son spent 10 minutes studying his options. It was awful. I can't imagine him taking that test in a formal school setting. :tongue_smilie:

[Nan in Mass]

I was talking to a special ed teacher the other day about our MCAS testing, which everyone has to take. She said that the only ray of sense in the entire process was the mother who delivered her child on test day with the instructions that they were to put the pencil in her child's hand to take the test, and when he put the pencil down, that meant he was done with the test and the test should be taken away. She said she wished they could do that with all the children.

Nan

[cathmom]

I sent this article to the faculty at my school, and my principal said that the testing companies are making a fortune on these tests. She thought it was a great article.

 

I read another article about Finland and in one place the kids' scores were slipping a bit. So they decided to give them more play time and the scores went up.

 

Sometimes I hate the US. :tongue_smilie:

[Nan in Mass]

More play time - I love that.

[Lawana]

I see two issues within this article.

 

Lack of accountability of those that design the tests. I can totally agree that that is a huge issue. When the test results are so high stake, those who write the tests end up driving what is actually taught, when teachers must teach to the test in order to protect themselves and their schools.

 

The idea put forth by the school board member that the test should reflect "real life" more than a body of knowledge that may be forgotten later. This I vehemently disagree with. If reflects a utilitarian view of education that is anti-intellectual.

[cathmom]

Here's that article about Finland:

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/susan-ochshorn/fishing-naked-in-finland-_b_1119626.html

[Dmmetler]

My DD got very frustrated over a question in Kindergarten that said something like "In Spring, leaves on trees turn ______". According to her teacher at the time, DD explained, in great detail, how trees could have red, purple or other colored leaves due to Anthocyanins and that they could still conduct photosynthesis due to chlorophyll and carotenoids. She finally just checked the answer as correct-and commented to me, later, that it was a good thing we were going to homeschool, because she could easily see DD blowing a paper/pencil test because she knew too much!:lol:

[FaithManor]

Ds, now 14 almost 15, only attended school for one year. He went to kindergarten while I taught my last year of music and science at a Lutheran School. The kindy teacher there was a real nut for testing. The principal, though it was against her better judgement, allowed the teacher to administer standardized testing at the end of the year. I told ds, who was reading at a 4th grade level at that point, that this was completely unimportant to his father and I and not to worry about the test. So, he only answered a few questions (least stressed child in the room :D) and drew in the margins. (He was quite an artist even back then.)

 

She approached me a couple of days later, probably hoping I would discipline ds for not trying and for drawing the whole time, and made a point to let me know she was annoyed that he'd not applied himself while drawing elaborate pictures all over the test. My retort to her, "Well, out of 23 children, mine was the only six year old doing something appropriate with the paper!"

 

She didn't bring it up to me again and the principal, within earshot of the conversation, had the biggest grin on her face which really didn't help Mrs. Test Happy feel better.

 

As for the tests themselves, there is NO accountability on the part of the publishing companies for the content and grading of the tests. These are not created by educators and child developmental psychologists, but by editors of publishing companies working for FOR PROFIT organizations. Now, there is more profit to them if the child fails than if the child does well because the more children who perform poorly, the more testing services, test prep books, teacher training services, etc. they can convince the school to buy. The whole blasted mess is now a multi-billion dollar industry. Follow the money and you find out from whence the STINK originates.

 

There are couple of books that have been written by investigative journalists and insiders from the industry. It's nauseating. Sometimes the questions are tested on adults (by this I mean questions for elementary and middle school), if all of the adults can get it right, then they go back to the drawing board...they deliberately put a certain percentage of questions on the test that are designed so that the most adults would not be able to determine the correct answer much less the children. This way the scores always indicate a large number of children needing remediation (thus the purchase of more test prep materials) and then of course, hourly charges for the sales reps to come to the school and train the teachers on the new test prep. Sick!

 

Faith

[Parrothead]

Someone I know posted this on FB. This is the same sentence that struck me as well. How many kids are taking these tests and deciding to skip college when they really are college material??? Frustrating to say the least.

I think it goes beyond that. How many of these kids are taking these tests and giving up because of the results?

[Haiku]

I used to work for a textbook development company. That's a company that the big textbook companies (like McGraw-Hill, Pearson, etc.) hire to actually write their textbooks.

 

I was a free-lance editor with a degree in social work, and I wrote test questions for math, science, and social studies standardized tests. Stupid, huh?

 

Guess one of the reasons I homeschool.

 

Tara

[OLG]

My cynical self has always wondered if these tests are in place to assist social engineering. John Gato might have planted that idea in my head...

 

My ds figured out early on that these blasted things were all a game. There were and are tricks to doing well too but being able to discern that requires an education, real education a la TWTM.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

Interesting perspective on the standardized testing debate:

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/post/when-an-adult-took-standardized-tests-forced-on-kids/2011/12/05/gIQApTDuUO_blog.html

 

I found this quote particularly compelling: “If I’d been required to take those two tests when I was a 10th grader, my life would almost certainly have been very different. I’d have been told I wasn’t ‘college material,’ would probably have believed it, and looked for work appropriate for the level of ability that the test said I had."

 

I will agree that many of the test questions on the elementary level Stanford tests I've proctored seem quite shallow in the social studies and science sections (especially social studies, where knowing what civil rights figures LOOK like seems more important than knowing details of when they lived or what they did and where identifying the outside of national landmarks trumps knowing what the branch of government associated with that does).

 

However, I don't think the sample NAEP questions linked to in the article should pose much of a stumbling block to students in high school. Maybe the question about the graph might catch folks who don't know graphs or the vocabulary used. But the rest strikes me as pretty basic life skills type questions.

 

ETA: I think it's worth weighing how students score on what can be trivial of poorly written test questions with the difficulty that many students have with coping with the prerequisites of college course work. This link from a recent "math wars" thread, illustrates some of what college students aren't able to perform. This hinders their ability to do the coursework they are trying to complete. I don't think that testing items should be written with double and triple negatives or with questions that are designed to be difficult (ie, tricky not just challenging) or that are just wrong. But I do think that you ought be graduate knowing how to manipulate numbers in basic ways.

Edited December 8, 2011 by Sebastian (a lady)

[6packofun]

I ran into this same problem with my ds's second grade CAT exam.

 

We also ran into some oddball questions on the CAT (survey) test. The one that really sticks in my craw is the question on a test in AMERICA that requires the child (can't remember which grade) to know that flat means "apartment". Uh, yeah, in *Great Britain*!! I'm sure many kids out there do know that, especially if they like British t.v., LOL, but should that be a requirement? :tongue_smilie:

 

There were 2 questions in that section and the BEST 2 that they could come up with includes a word that isn't even an American term in our dictionary?? (It might be in a few dictionaries, not sure, but when we say we're going to Aunt Erica's apartment to visit, we don't interchange it with the word flat EVER. Common usage, people.)